.jpg)
The Catawba Chronicles
The Catawba Chronicles
Preserving Catawba's Heritage: Balancing Tradition and Progress with Local Historian Insights
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Ever wondered how the influx of new residents and businesses from nearby Charlotte has changed the landscape of Catawba County? Discover the delicate balance between progress and preserving the old community spirit as we share personal memories like childhood trips to the iconic Terrell Country Store for a scoop of ice cream. Our special guest, a dedicated local historian, joins us to discuss their mission of safeguarding Catawba's rich heritage through oral storytelling, ensuring these treasured memories are passed down to future generations.
Explore Catawba County's efforts to make new residents feel at home by integrating contemporary artifacts into the local museum. Learn how the Catawba County Historical Association is bridging the gap between the old and new, highlighting the unique blend of urban and rural life that defines the area. From significant historical sites to the charm of local farmer's markets, we invite newcomers to connect with the vibrant history of Catawba County and discover the accessible aspects of local agriculture.
Get ready for captivating tales, including the story of Heinrich Weidner's bond with the local Catawba tribe, the tragic loss of the Matthias Barringer cabin, and the intriguing narratives behind museum artifacts. Celebrate the 150th anniversary of Murray's Mill and its restoration, and join us on guided tours of the Harper House filled with fascinating anecdotes. Finally, uncover the continuous research needed to preserve historic cemeteries and the valuable stories they hold. This episode is a heartfelt tribute to Catawba County's history and the unexpected stories that enrich our connection to this beloved community.
Catawba Chronicles
Speaker 1Welcome to the Catawba Chronicles, where we connect you to amazing people and businesses from Catawba County past and present. Whether you're new or have been here for what feels like forever, this podcast is for you. We hope this podcast will help you get to know our community better and make you feel more comfortable joining in on the conversation. So find a comfy chair and grab a cup and get ready to hear some great stories about our little corner of North Carolina.
Speaker 2Hi, hey.
Speaker 3Jennifer, how are you?
Speaker 2I'm doing all right. How are you?
Speaker 3I'm good, you sound great.
Speaker 2Oh, good Thank you.
Speaker 3You know, growing up here, being around these places, being from Catawba, and seeing you, know kind of how it's changed. It's I don't want to say it's disheartening, that's probably the wrong word.
Speaker 2No, it is, that's the wrong word.
Speaker 3I mean, I think a lot of people feel that way, right. So you know, I've seen a transition and I don't know, if you're familiar, where are my family's insurance offices? Behind the boat rack on the corner of Highway 150 and Slanning Bridge.
Speaker 2Oh yeah, I know where you are.
Speaker 3OK, yeah, so my father started this business in 1999. He started the agency out of the old Terrell Country store it was where the old post office was, on the side there and I remember as a kid like going through the old cotton gin there and like seeing all the old buildings for what they used to be before, even before the demo or before some of the people who just did retail out of them, you know, before all that happened, running around the country store getting ice cream. After, you know, we got out at Sheryl's Florida elementary. As kids We'd always stop there and get ice cream, um, and. And then we moved into this little white farmhouse here behind the boat rack, um, what I saw and what drew me back here, I think, were the people and and the the feeling you get from being part of Catawba County, the community, the people coming in sitting in this corner. You know they used to come in. I really feel like because of the people here, because of what it was, and it was that hidden gem you know everybody talks about and still having access to the lake, but it not being Charlotte or Huntersville or Cornelius, and it really was this place in this community that I think people attracted people. And then, um, you know, people started coming. That was great, everything that. Then the business came, charlotte started traveling up and over you know one 50.
Speaker 3Um, and then you, you know, you start seeing people move here for that, for for its association to the city, and, um, it just, it started to change, uh, and and I, it was sad in a way for me because I, uh, I remember, you know, talking to the old timers let's call them that would come in and talk about how things used to be. Or you know, um, uh, the old bait bait shop here, um, next to the Connor house, uh, you know, walking in and then people were, people were talking, um, and, and so in that change, I felt bad because we were losing some of that community that drew people here, some of what made this special. Um, not that it can't be in the future, or that I'm I'm upset with some of what made this special, Not that it can't be in the future, or that I'm upset with some of the changes. I, for one, embrace change. It's just sometimes that's progress, unfortunately, but there is part of that that will forever be missed, and so I felt like, okay, well, there's the Catawbans series.
Speaker 3There's a lot of written stuff, but I didn't know of anything that was really oral. I mean, I think there's some things that come out of Hickory that are done, but those conversations that we used to have here in the office with people from the community will forever be forgotten, I think. And I thought, well, if I'm going to sit here and I'm going to talk to people, then why not record some of it? Yeah, so that's kind of where this started. It was an idea of I like podcasts. I think I retain and comprehend better listening to things, and and so I looked for something that belonged to Catawba County, and there there wasn't.
Speaker 3Um, there's a lot of Lake Norman stuff, there's a lot of Charlotte stuff, uh, but specifically Catawba County, and what I was looking for wasn't there. And I said, okay, well then, what does it take? And let's give it a shot. Uh, so here we are on season two. I don't know um, how, uh, ms Emily talked you into coming on, but I will forever be grateful, because I'm just a guy sitting here in Sheryl's Ford, um, and it seems like you are way more important to the County I might ever be. So thank you for your time.
Speaker 2I say, well, thank you for thinking that of us. I mean, we'd like to think that we're important to the county. I feel like it's our job to keep a hold of this stuff that's disappearing, so that we remember it. Whether we remember it in audio or video, or papers, or objects or stories, you know that it's remembered so that someday somebody can find it.
Speaker 3Yeah.
Speaker 2Um, like the Terrell country store, rest in peace, rest in pieces.
Speaker 3Um, yeah, and it's funny you say that because, um, you know, mr Eads uh was on season one. It wasn't like the longest episode and I'd never spoken to him and he came and sat in my office. But he's got a lot of those pieces in storage, um, and and so you know, I agree with you a hundred percent.
Speaker 2I mean, I don't know how much. Well, I don't. I don't know how much the current folks in the county feel connected to it, like all the people who have recently moved in by recently, I mean in the last 20 years.
Speaker 2Oh interesting Because that includes me too. I'm not from here, I'm from Alexandria, virginia. I grew up in the suburbs of DC and I came down here to go to school. I stayed for the sweet tea, but I also stayed because I really enjoyed the small town America. You know, the people all knew each other and nobody knew me. That's OK. But like, I liked the camaraderie, I liked the and granted, some of it's being in the South versus being in the Mid-Atlantic. But people, you know, smile at each other on the street, they say hi, they don't just run into you, right, even if they don't know you. And I really like that.
Speaker 2And now, in the 15 years, I've been out at Murray's Mill, you know I'm seeing the things that are popping up around Catawba.
Catawba County Historical Association Overview
Speaker 3Is that a nice way to say it? Yeah, absolutely I. Uh. It's interesting that you say 20 years, um, because I've never thought about that. I guess you know. For me, I see most of what is happening recently and I think six months, 12 months, you know, maybe 24 months, but then again, you know, I've got a two-year-old and a five-year-old and another one on the way, so time seems to have gotten away from me at some point. So you're probably right. But that's interesting because you know, like you said, you're included in that, but yet you have such a strong position as part of the historical association and there's gotta be something there that's different from the last, the people that have come in the last couple of years.
Speaker 2And I think that they don't necessarily need to see you know the original Catawba County story as their own and embrace it. But I think they need to see that, now that they're here, they're a part of it.
Speaker 3Right. A hundred percent agree with you.
Speaker 2And the museum tries to collect, you know, not just our old stuff that's been here since 1873, but you know we want to collect some of the newer stuff from some of our newer folks who have moved in because, again, they're still now part of the Catawba County story, because again, they're still now part of the Catawba County story.
Speaker 3A hundred percent, yes, absolutely, and I think that connection is kind of what I was looking for as well as like, hey, if they could hear us talk, if they could hear some people that have been here talk, people that have positioned themselves in the County like you have, and they just had some little bit of awareness. And I know you're not going to reach everyone, life is busy but if you just, you know, reach a couple people and that made a little bit of a difference, then I feel like we've done our part to try, because, whether they like it or not, like you said, you're part of this community now and this community it's something bigger than just its connection to Charlotte.
Speaker 2Yes.
Speaker 3And another question that I had for you the history museum it's in Newton, correct?
Speaker 2Yes.
Speaker 3A lot of what Catawba County is and I don't know if this is part of the problem. So I'm really looking for your opinion. But a lot of the change that is happening now more so than in the past, is happening on this little corner where we are Sheryl's, ford, the Lake Norman corner and most of what I feel has been done of significance. Somebody's probably going to get upset at me, I'm sure. Significant, uh, somebody is probably going to get upset at me, I'm sure.
Speaker 3But but you know you look at the weight, uh of Catawba County and most of it is up towards Newton and it's not that far. You know I'm from here, so you know it seems like a far place for me. I'm still living in my little, you know, eight year old, 10 year old life here, like, oh, we're going way up there, um, but but you think about like, everything being in Hickory museums and and and things being in Newton, um, and nobody's going that way. Well, a lot of most people are going Charlotte, because that's the growth that we are seeing. I feel like, uh, where it's coming from? Do you feel like there's any problem in making that connection harder because of the logistics in where associations like you are housed?
Speaker 2Well, we have four different locations around the county. So I mean we're not just in Newton in the courthouse and like that's us. Like I mean we have the covered bridge in Claremont, murray's Mill in Catawba and the Harper house in Hickory, and so we're located in the different sections of the county and one of the things that I loved about Catawba County is that each section while part of the whole is unique on its own. So Hickory is the quote big city.
Speaker 3Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2Okay, newton is the county seat, so you have the courthouse and all the county offices and that kind of stuff, and then out in Catawba and Claremont you have more of the rural agrarian stuff. So you have the farms and you have the smaller towns, which I really liked.
Speaker 2My cousin has lived in DC and outside DC his whole life and he was so excited that he got, or he joined, a farm share and every week he had this box delivered to his house where he got all this fresh fruit from the farm and I'm like I just go visit the farmer and get it out of the ground.
Speaker 3That's right.
Speaker 2But talking with him about that made me realize I live in an area where I can do that. I can live in the city but yet I can go out to the farm and pick the zucchini off the vine.
Speaker 3Yeah, that's a very good point.
Speaker 3And for anyone listening because I think this is all too good of a conversation not to include Jennifer, and I hope you don't mind For anyone listening the association has a great website that I'm looking at, catawbahistoryorg, and there is a map, so the few places that she has mentioned here and their representation as it sits geographically are marked very well. So kudos to whoever's doing this website, cause it's very good and so you can see the different places and where they're located and and in conjunction to where you are, if you're in the county and I do urge you to go to these places, because the ones that I've seen and been are really amazing pieces of history that people are working very hard to represent. But you're also right in the fact that we do take I think a lot of us, and the people coming in especially, take for granted our ability to be so connected with the agricultural side, and you don't have to go very far. A lot of people are like, oh well, that's great, you guys have been here a while. Just go to your local Facebook group and ask someone and they will tell you where to pick up whatever you want. Because, you're right, there's a lot of people that still do this for a living, and I don't know how much longer, as a lot of these places are getting swallowed up by progress, but it's there.
Speaker 2I mean we have a wonderful farmer's market in Hickory. I know there's one in Conover. I work every Saturday morning so I don't get to visit these, but from what people tell me, I mean, there's wonderful places that you can go. And then there's various websites that talk about local farms. I know that the extension office used to do a farm tour weekend where they highlighted all the different local farms and agricultural establishments like Murray's Mill, um, who are part of it, so that you could go and visit these folks and just see what they had and what they did.
Speaker 3Um, uh, yeah, and, and a lot. I mean, if you don't, if you have no idea where to go, um, and you can't find any of this, please reach out to us. There's many different ways to contact me personally, and even on the website, which you'll get a link to from any podcast platform that you may be listening, and then I'll point you in the right direction because, as Jennifer says, they're all over the place. But I don't want to go on and on about those things. We probably could talk all day on this. I want to highlight a lot of what the association is doing and get into the things that are important to you, and I know that you can speak maybe on behalf of a lot of things, but you yourself are a small part of that. So what do you think is important in that?
Speaker 2Oh boy, in what it is we do in general, or what it is we've done.
Speaker 3Well, I mean, if I'm coming in and I don't know the historical association of Catawba County, give me some sort of elevator pitch on what you guys do, the sites, you manage all the things.
Speaker 2So we've been around since 1936. We were founded under the Widener Oak Tree, which has a big historic significance in Catawba County. Let's see which we can go into if you really want to. Well, I mean, we're historians and so you know, while people say historians are always looking back, that's not 100%. I mean. That's true, but we're using the stories of where we have been to sort of story of partnership between two local groups.
Speaker 2So Heinrich Widener was a settler from Pennsylvania who came down to Catawba County and at that point it was all trees, there was nobody here except the Native Americans, and he became friends with the local Catawba tribe. Well, the Catawba tribe were not friends with the Cherokee, and occasionally the Cherokee would come down and wreak havoc in the neighborhood, and so the Catawbas did not want anything to happen to Heinrich and his family. So if the Cherokees were in town they would paint a red ring around this oak tree in his front yard and Heinrich would know it was time to, you know, to get his family somewhere safe. And then, once the Cherokee had left, the Catawba would paint a white ring around the tree. So Heinrich would send scouts out occasionally to check the tree, and when he knew it was safe, he would bring his family back.
Speaker 2So this was 1755 to 1765. So a long time ago, so in 1780, our soldiers mustered under the Widener Oak tree before joining the over-mountain men to go to the Battle of King's Mountain during the American Revolution. Catawba County itself was chartered under the Widener Oak tree in 1842, and then they went to Raleigh and made it legal, and so then we were chartered under the Oak tree on June 27th 1936. And then, unfortunately, our beloved Widener Oak was struck by lightning and it ended up falling in 1939. But I mean that oak was a major symbol for the original folks in Catawba County and it was still important up until the time it fell.
Speaker 3Yeah, I would say it's still important today. I mean like this is, and these are things that I I remember being taught certain things of certain aspects of this story. Even you know in middle school that that there was an Indian tribe, the Catawba Indians, and I don't know I could be wrong. It's been a long time I've slept since then, but I don't know how much of that is taught today.
Speaker 2I don't either, because I don't have children in elementary school. Yeah, I don't either because I don't have children in elementary school. But the schools do bring their children to the museum so that they can see our representation of the Widener Oak, and then we do tell the story. Also, we have different programs that go to the classrooms, one of which talks about the founding of Catawba County and the Widener Oak.
Speaker 3Very cool.
Speaker 2So, yeah, so we've been around since 1936. Our original goal was to collect the history and stories of the county and to write a book, because there was a big push in the 30s, 40s and 50s on local history to get something published that people would have access. Yeah, so we started working on that in 1939, but we didn't actually get it finished until 1953. We didn't actually get it finished until 1953. And that's what we refer to as the blue book, but it's called A History of Catawba County and it was edited by Jay Yates Killian, who was our director at the time, or, excuse me, the president of our board at the time.
Speaker 3Can you still get copies of that book?
Speaker 2Yep, we do have copies for sale at the museum. Very cool.
Speaker 2So like that's sort of the predecessor to the Catawban set that you mentioned earlier. Yeah, I'll need to get a copy of that. That being said, we didn't get our first actual museum until 1946. It was located in the loft of the Matthias Barringer cabin. Matthias Barringer was also one of the original founders of, or settlers and founders of, Catawba County and his log cabin was the first courthouse. So he allowed our county officials to meet there before they actually built a real courthouse, so they would meet in his front room around this big oak table.
Speaker 2So when the museum well, when we were looking for a museum and the county was looking for a library, the Matthias Berenger cabin was basically a no-brainer. We have this wonderful piece of Catawba County history. Let's move it to the center of town. They moved it to where the rec center is in Newton now on South Brady. That was the war memorial site, and so they put the cabin there for the museum, the library. I mean it was perfect. Unfortunately, the building was lost to a fire on February 25th 1952. They believe the fire started in the furnace room very early in the morning and by the time the fire department was able to get there it was too late for the building. So the library lost all of its books except for what was in circulation, and we lost all of our collections except for a little one gallon cast iron kettle that was on loan at the time and the plaque on the front of the building. Everything else was gone but we do have both of those items. They are currently in our museum collection for our two little survivors.
Speaker 3And this is so I am. I can't say this enough. I'm so glad you're here, because this is stuff that brings back. We'll have the kids say core memories these days. Like you, you, you said it. There are kids that you, um, you know. Like you, you, you said it, uh, there are kids that you, you have programs for children. They come to the museum, uh, on field trips and and everything, and these are things that I've learned, but I think they're so important to relearn, to rehear, um, for those of us that may have have learned and forgotten, and I'm really hoping that after this episode, um, there are people that will go up to the museum to see these things. This is just absolutely fascinating.
Speaker 2Thank you. One of the things I learned out of the fire story because I mean, really the only way to research it are we've got some photos, we've got a bunch of newspaper clippings and stuff was like on the same front page of the paper where they have the picture of the building on fire, there's an article next to it that says and I forget the exact title, but it's um, like county pushes for a new fireproof building. Like they were ready that day of the fire to start raising money and figure out how they could build a new library, a new museum that wouldn't have this problem yeah I mean, we've always been a.
Speaker 2We, beingawba County, have always been a group of, you know, ingenious folks who were willing to work hard together to solve whatever problem it is.
Speaker 3Yeah, I would agree.
Speaker 2I say you can look at different natural disasters and other disasters in our history where folks just banded together and did what needed to be done. So the fire was 1952. We didn't actually get our new museum until 1960.
Speaker 3And is that the one that sits there today?
Speaker 2No, it was actually located in the Whitener House, which is in the neighborhood in South Newton. Actually, it's two houses off of where Highway 10 crosses, so about three blocks from where the museum is now. But at the time we had just basically stored our items in the basement of the courthouse until we had a place to put, because we were still collecting. We couldn't collect a lot because we didn't really have a place to put it, but people were still giving us things, and so we had to figure out how to keep them safe before we had a good place to display them.
Speaker 3Yeah, and you had mentioned that there were some, you know things that really might interest people, some some cool stuff, maybe some British clothing or some other things that belong to individuals.
Speaker 2Yep. Well, one of the most famous items in our collection is our British red coat. It's actually an American Tory coat, so so the British red coats came from the British soldiers who came here to fight. An American Tory coat belonged to the Americans who were on the British side, and so after the war was over, you know, they lost, and so anybody who had a Tory coat was either going to quickly burn it, bury it or pretend it never happened, because you know now you're on the losing side.
Speaker 3Yeah.
Speaker 2So we are lucky in that our coat managed to survive long enough for it to be given to us?
Speaker 3Do we have any idea how many other exist or where it came from?
Speaker 2I want to say it came from Pennsylvania. I want to say that. That's really cool it was given to us by a gentleman who was a general, and his name escapes me at the. That's why I used to go to the museum. Normally I can rattle this stuff off, but it's just well and and and that you know.
Speaker 3So, in in looking at everything that that, uh, the association does and that you do, I mean, cause you know there's so many things there's no way we're going to be able to cover in depth Everything uh, it probably could be many episodes Heck, it probably could be a whole season with the things that I've been told you do and the association does and knows Just a brief overview of all of this so that people get to Newton, just to get to these sites. There are so many people coming in. I mean, I think somebody said that just our little corner down here was supposed to be bigger, after it's all said and done, than Davidson or Lincolnton, and to think that that's going to happen here in Catawba County and not necessarily Hickory or the places that have seen that in the past, just blows my mind.
Speaker 2Yeah, I mean there's going to be a whole new story coming out of your little corner to be added to the rest of it.
Speaker 3And I'm just glad that people like you exist and do what you do, so that we can try to connect.
Speaker 2Yes, I mean. Everybody who moves here should eventually feel connected to what is here.
Exploring Attachments to Local Artifacts
Speaker 3Absolutely.
Speaker 2Even if it's just the little things that they have been involved, I guess I don't see the point of living somewhere that you don't care about. Yeah, is that a good way to put?
Speaker 3it. No, that's a great way to put it, and I've thought about that too, because that would be super strange for me. But then I think, is that just us, or I mean surely not. Surely everybody's got that in them. But is there a group of people that move to a place? And there probably is, but it's a shame.
Speaker 2Yeah, especially if they stay there a long time, like if you move somewhere and you're there for six months and then you get transferred somewhere else and you're there for six months like, okay, maybe I can see that it's not that you don't care about the place, it's that you're not there long enough to develop an attachment.
Speaker 3Good point.
Speaker 2But you know, if you move somewhere and then you end up living there for three or five or 10 years, you know how do you not develop an attachment?
Speaker 3Yeah, Then what? So? What if an attachment? Yeah, so if that's what most people think is one of the coolest things, what's your favorite thing in the museum?
Speaker 2Oh boy, my actual favorite thing is we have this beautiful green vase that when I was hired. The story that goes with it is that it was given to some local folks who had been in Egypt when King Tut's tomb was discovered and that was where they had acquired this vase. Okay, so I love Egypt, I love the whole 18th dynasty, so I would love to see this thing. Okay, so when I first set eyes on this beautiful green vase, my first reaction to it was it's not Egyptian. Like the style is just not.
Speaker 3Egyptian Right.
Speaker 2And so it's like okay. So I started doing research on this beautiful vase and it turns out it's from syria, around 200 ad. So it was not around at the time of king tut, so it's newer, and that it was probably a funerary vase. It was probably used in in funerals and probably could have come out of a tomb somewhere, just not in Egypt. Now, I'm not saying our donors didn't get it in Egypt, because that's I mean they probably did Things get traveled around. But when I looked at the vase I realized that I don't want to say I didn't love it as much, but my opinion of the vase changed. But nothing had happened. It wasn't the vase's fault, nothing had happened to the vase. But it was interesting that a little bit of research completely changed the story on the vase.
Speaker 2We have another item in our collection that belonged to Johann Arndt, who was a circuit preacher in early Catawba County and we were told by the family it was his pulpit Bible. Okay, so the whole thing is in German and we were working on an exhibit on churches and cemeteries and we wanted to display the Bible and one of my coworkers said why don't we translate the first page? Oh, ok, I can do that. So I sat down, worked on the translation of the first page. When I got it done, I realized it wasn't a Bible. It's a book called True Christianity by the original Johann Arndt, who was a reformer around the time of Martin Luther. So while this may have been our Johann Arndt's pulpit Bible like he may have actually used it for that it's not actually a Bible.
Speaker 3Interesting.
Speaker 2So again, our opinion of the object changed, but nothing changed about the object.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2So now I'm curious, like how many other things like that do we have in our collection, where where the new story is almost as good as the old story?
Speaker 3Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2It's just something completely different to share with people, because now we share both stories.
Speaker 3Right, that's, that's really cool, and so, and jumping from the museum, let's. Let's talk about some of these other places so that we can get a brief overview, Because one of the closest and near and dear to my heart happens to be Murray's Mill. I remember going out there. I credit it to my love of nature. Some of the courses that we had in high school took us out there. You know, some of the courses that we had in high school took us out there. One in particular was an environmental studies course that you know we went through. We would spend, I remember going, you know, getting waders and equipment and getting down into the water and looking and learning about the biodiversity, water quality, what it all meant, put it all together. And so this place and that's just a small part, right, that has nothing to do with the historical part, but I really enjoy being out there and I think others would too. So what can you tell us more about that location?
Speaker 2So Murray's Mill actually turned 150 years old last year. As far as the site goes, there's nothing on the site that's 150, except for the rocks. The buildings are all a little bit newer than that, though, but we we being CCHA acquired it in 1982. Well, we started working on it in 1980. Mr Murray was 102 years old at the time and just wasn't up to taking care of it anymore. And there was a developer who wanted to buy the land, bulldoze the mill and build big, expensive houses around the pond and Mr Murray just wasn't into that.
Speaker 2So he sold his farmland to Promise View Acres Farms, incorporated, and they still farm it, so we have the same look that Mr Murray had. And then we got the mill, the store and the wheat house, which are the three main buildings down at the bottom of the driveway. The sale didn't actually go through until February 11th 1982, which was the day after Mr Murray's 105th birthday. Sadly he passed away a month before that. So while he did not live to legally see it become a historic site, we were already working. So hopefully that was heartening to him.
Speaker 2But it took us eight years and $2 million to restore the property. So we opened up to the public on April 30th 1988. We had a big party. The mill ran for the first time in. I should know that almost 20 years. Over 20 years Governor James G Martin was there, along with descendants of the Murray family and hundreds of other people. It was a lot of fun. Um, and since then we have added 21 other buildings to the property and we have a little over seven acres of land of the Murray's original 750 plus uh, most of which was farmland.
Speaker 3Sure.
Speaker 2But we do our best to keep an eye on all of our buildings. We are good neighbors with our farmer, and so he lets us use part of the field that is his, even though it's not ours. He doesn't mind, we're just good neighbors like that.
Speaker 3Yeah.
Speaker 2So we do tours of the mill, itself self-guided and guided. The general store is open for business. We try to carry a collection of things just like a real antique general store would.
Speaker 3So clothes and food, trinkets, ice cream, we try to get stuff, which is sorry to interrupt, but that, that concept to me, that um, and it makes sense how you explain it, but I didn't realize that was strange, like to to have the have an access to like a general store and what that meant. You know, people bring uh people in town that are visiting and they're like what, what is the general store like? Well, uh, let's go we'll find out.
Speaker 2I mean, we just store, sell general items, things that you need, things that you probably don't need, but they're gonna be anyway. Um, we try to keep it as local as possible. So you know, we sell our pickles. Um, the pickle man lives down the street in cheryl's ford. The jams and jellies come from hamptonville, our miller does the honey, our neighbors do the molasses, the coffee barbecue sauce comes from raleigh. Like you know, we try to keep it as close to home. Yeah, we also sell items from different local craftspeople, uh, folks who mostly just do this as a hobby, not as a business. But you know, it gives a chance to keep the money in the community, support local artists and it gives us unique offerings in the store that you're not going to find anywhere else do you have any idea about how many people visit this location um on at any given time?
Speaker 2We see about 24,000 people a year. Wow, and that doesn't include the people that we don't see. So the folks who come after hours or before hours, our grounds are open anytime during daylight hours and you are welcome to walk anything on a leash that you are willing to clean up after.
Speaker 3Yeah, so if you want more information, like I said, katabahistoryorg great website, they've got access to links for Murray's Mill location, as well as some of the others we may touch on, and it'll kind of give you the rundown of each location. It's very well written. So if you're looking for a good place to walk your dog, like you said, on a leash, and you're willing to clean up, it's very nice. And there's the road doesn't go through there like it used to. You kind of have to go and cut back in, right, yes, um, so it's. It's a little tricky in that regard, depending on which way you're coming from, um, but it's usually very quiet and very open and very peaceful. Uh, and I will note, because of my environmental background uh, no fishing or kayaking allowed, please. You're welcome, um, and so I, with you know, respect of your time, because I know you're an incredibly busy woman. Um, let's touch on some of the other places. Where do you want to go next?
Speaker 2Uh, let's go to the bunker Hill cover bridge, because I would say 95% of the folks who go to the mill have either been there or are headed there.
Speaker 3And a tip for anyone looking I went and actually tried to Google Bunker Hill Covered Bridge and that's not what you want to do. You want to go to thekatabahistoryorg I can't say this enough to get the right one. It's way easier that way.
Speaker 2Well, it comes up for me on Google, but my Google, I guess, knows me. But the Bunker Hill Covered Bridge is outside Claremont on Highway 70. And it is one of two remaining original covered bridges in the state and it's the only one on its original roadbed. Back in 1795, that section of the old Island Ford Road was a busy section. You had farm traffic going through wagons, you didn't have cars, but I mean that was the main way to get from here to there across there.
Speaker 2And the Island Ford Road nowadays is what we know as Balls Creek Road. So that's the old Island Ford Road and it went up. And actually when you cross the river into Iredell County it's still the Island Ford Road which is further up from the covered bridge, but it's still the same thing on the other side. So the bridge was built in 1895. It was covered around 1910 to keep the boards from rotting. That is the main reason they put a roof on it, which also gives travelers protection from the rain. It keeps horses from freaking out as they walk across the bridge, because horses don't like to cross things where they can see down.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2Like where the bottom is further than they are. They're not into that, so it made it easier for that. The bridge is a. It is the only Haupt truss in wood. Herman Haupt was a military bridge designer during the Civil War and he did a lot of research on stress on a bridge and tried to find the best way to basically divert the stress to the side, and so what he came up with is what we have Now. When I heard that it was the only one in wood, I was curious to know oh so does that mean there's some out there in metal? And I was able to find reference to two of them, but I couldn't actually substantiate that the bridges were there.
Speaker 3Well.
Speaker 3So you are a plethora of knowledge and, out of all of the people that I've spoken to, the amount of information that you were able to plug in, like your reference to horses and crossing, which I very much appreciate, thank you and the detail that you insert in your stories, and it's a testament to who you are.
Speaker 3And I'm looking at this and visually, if you want, again on the website, the link. You've said it enough, but there is a diagram between the difference in trusses of covered bridges and what you are referring to, and it does almost resemble like I can see where they're putting the support to the sides. It almost resembles what you would see on a modern day bridge, like if you were crossing a bridge out near the coast, where you can actually see the um, the ties coming down from the top. Again, I'm not an engineer or anything, so don't hold me to these uh, unofficial terms, um, but you can see them spreading out from a almost a central, what would be a central location, branching out towards the sides or or to the middle and to the side. It's very interesting.
Speaker 2But what's also kind of interesting is that the front half of the property that we now own was called Connor Park. We still call it Connor Park, but that was a rest area on Highway 70. So we think of rest areas on I-40 where you pull off, you use the bathroom, you might get a vending machine and then off you go. Well, this was a rest area on Highway 70 where you would pull off, pull out your picnic, sit at a picnic table and then head on your way.
Speaker 2And then the bridge happened to be, you know, at the back, about a quarter of a mile down, so if you wanted to go, wander back and look at it. But you know, for the most part, like I don't know, I just find it interesting that there were rest areas on small side roads, or what we now call small side roads.
Speaker 3Yeah, yeah, you wouldn't think that they need one out there now, but that is, you know, a very interesting point and I didn't know that.
Speaker 2Yeah, One point that was the middle of nowhere. That's cool. So I mean, the bridge has been damaged various times over the years. There was a bad storm in I think it was 1992 that did a lot of damage to the bridge, and so we had to repair that. And then the 2013 flood did a lot of damage to the bank underneath the bridge. So that is our most recent repairs. Um, we still have a little bit more to do as far as cleanup goes out there, but Thankfully to our friend Arnold Brayton and company from New Hampshire who has worked on the bridge both times, the bridge is solid, the bridge is sound and, Lord willing, it will be there for another hundred and some odd years.
Speaker 3That's awesome.
Speaker 2Do you want to hit another property or do you want to know more about the bridge?
Speaker 3No, sure it's up to you. I mean, like I said, it's pretty laid back and I edit anything out that may be long pause or random conversation. Okay good, no pressure, believe me, I'm just the guy from Sheryl's Ford who thought this was a good idea and it turns out that a lot of other people listen. We have people all over the country that listen. We have people all over the world that ping in. I'm sure some of it's probably a random bouncing of Wi-Fi signal or some sort of security, but it's interesting the people that reach out to me and the guests that they seem to enjoy Because, to your point, not everyone grew up with this, not everyone appreciated the history of where they were, and I think a lot of people regret that and I hope some of the people coming in they find this, whether that's now, whether that's later, I mean, this is going to live on, um, well past us.
Speaker 3I don't know who's going to do what with it, but, um, if it's out there and somebody listens to it, I think it will give them a much deeper appreciation for where they're at hopefully what's next?
Speaker 2all right, let's say, let's talk about our well, I don't want to say our newest property, but one of our newer properties, the Harper House in Hickory. Let me find the right spot in my notes. So the Harper House is an 1887 Queen Anne Victorian and one of the coolest things about the house is it has all of its most of its original details. A lot of your old Victorian houses over time would get carved up into apartments and so I mean, cause they've got lots of rooms, the rooms are little, there's varying stairwells, so, yeah, somebody buys this old house, they carve it up into three different apartments and then they rent it out and so you end up losing a lot of the fancy details. So you lose the stained glass windows, you lose the really cool new post in the front hallway, like you lose a lot of that stuff.
Speaker 2But our house was. It was in the same family from 1924 up until 2001. And they didn't do that to it and so we still have all of the original. They even saved any of the original stuff that they took out. They even saved it. They just wrapped it up and stored it in the basement of the attic. So we were able to get it out, clean it up and put it back where it goes.
Speaker 3It's a beautiful property.
Speaker 2It really is. It was actually built by Daniel Webster Shuler, who was a banker from Michigan. He came down here in the 1880s because he heard he could make a lot of money in the new booming railroad town of Hickory. So he opened one of the first banks and he built his big, beautiful house on a hill outside of town where everybody could see it. However, the story goes is that he managed to lose everybody's money, Everyone who invested in his bank. He managed to lose all of their money and then he committed suicide.
Speaker 3Not so smart man.
Speaker 2No, and it's one of those where, like, there's a couple of different stories that go with it, because the papers actually say he died of melancholy.
Speaker 3Really.
Speaker 2Which is the Victorian way of saying he committed suicide.
Speaker 3That's super interesting and so, if I show up, are these the things that you learn while you're there? Is there some sort of tour that will teach you all these things? Are we getting some back-end information?
Speaker 2No, Most of this is from the guided tour. Harper is just a guided tour Because of the nature of the house. It's not something that we will let you wander through on your own.
Speaker 3Understandable.
Speaker 2But we have wonderful tour guides who will give you all kinds of wonderful good stories of the different families who lived in the house. There are juicy stories that go along with the good stories.
Speaker 3Oh, how cool is that.
Speaker 2We like to throw those in too, because that's what makes it interesting. Interesting, I mean, with all of our properties and the stories that we tell you. We want to give you the sense that these were real people, who lived here, worked here, did silly things, did stupid things, did cool things. But we just want you to understand that there were real people here and to feel a connection to them and, through them, the items that they interacted with.
Exploring Historic Cemeteries in Catawba
Speaker 3Yeah, and so if this is something that you've done in the past and me speaking from experience and just being younger I know there's a necessity to go back and revisit them, clearly from what you recall or what period of time or maturity you were in in that time. But I'm getting a sense that, from what you're telling me, these stories are ever evolving. You were constantly learning new things about the places and people and items, and so if it's something that you've not done recently, it's probably a good idea that, if you enjoyed it somewhat the first time, to go back and revisit them and brush up on some of these things.
Speaker 2Yes, definitely, because I mean even when, like, we have our basic tours down for all the properties but we don't sit there and rest on our laurels, like we're always doing research into the places, the people, the stories. Some of it happens on purpose, some of it you stumble upon when you're looking for something else. I've actually found that's the best way to find what, to not find what you're looking for is to go looking for something else and then all of a sudden, you're like oh well, there it is. I've been looking for that for two years.
Speaker 3That's a common thread in my life is don't worry, it'll turn up later.
Speaker 2If it's not in the three places it's supposed to be, just stop looking.
Speaker 3Oh well, we've got one more, so we might as well touch on that. I don't want to leave it hanging and that is no wait. No, this is the last one, Cause we did the other. We did that, we started with the history museum, Got it.
Speaker 2Yeah, well, let me stick a plug in for the three other things that we take care of. We do keep an eye on three historic cemeteries. Okay, so the Haas family center the Haas was actually called the old Haas cemetery um is down in Maiden off of prison camp road, and its claim to fame is that it is the final resting place of Isaac Wise. Isaac Wise was the first person hanged in Catawba County for being a patriot. Really, he was 16 years old and he was the son of a tory.
Speaker 2So the folks who sided with the british oh my god um, and so a local band of tories hung him from a tree for being a patriot, and so his body was taken down by simon haas, who was the farmer who owned the land, and buried in what is now the cemetery how cool is, is that?
Speaker 3I mean not what happened but the part of the historical part. Sorry, I better clarify that Terrible, terrible thing. But the fact that there are people like you and organizations like the Historical Association, that I mean for whatever it's worth, probably we wouldn't have any record of this.
Speaker 2Yeah, yeah, because I mean they were just stones in the field, so like Simon Haas is buried right next to him and his marker is just a little rock with a rough inscription that says SH 1779. So if you didn't know that, that was Simon Haas's resting place and the story that goes with it. Like it's just a rock.
Speaker 3So how do we know? Somebody's sitting there saying somebody's listening to this, and they're saying, well, yeah, yeah, okay, jennifer, yeah, but how do we know this?
Speaker 2This is one of those where the story is passed down through the family and through the neighbors and the people who continue to go and take care of the grave and pay homage to Simon and Mr Haas and everybody else who's out there. And the cemetery was actually still being used as a cemetery, I think, up until the 1920s.
Speaker 3I mean, this is so, this is like. This might even be the most gold that we've talked about all season, just because there are people that travel far and wide for some sort of historical location or marking or story and to know that you are part of an area that was so involved. Now, did you say and this is strictly just for my own did you say he was one of the first patriots in the country, or just in this area?
Speaker 2Just in this area.
Speaker 3Okay, all right.
Speaker 2Yes, to our knowledge, he was the first person in Catawba County which wasn't called Catawba County at that time to be hanged for being a patriot.
Speaker 3That's wild. And he was 16. He was 16. Holy smokes.
Speaker 2Let's see Our second cemetery that we take care of. Let's see where it is. In my notes is the Michael Weidner Weidner Weidner, depending on how you know him cemetery. The Weidner is the original German and then it's been anglicized into Weidner or Weidner. So yeah, they're all the same. Sure, but Michael was also a Revolutionary War patriot and his cemetery is off of shucks. What's the name of that road? It's off. If you take highway 10 west, you make a right on. It's a church.
Speaker 1I can't think of the name of it um, but it's.
Speaker 2It's hard to find because it's in the front yard of somebody's house behind a big row of trees and it's just a little bitty thing like it's probably about the twice the size of your kitchen table, like I mean, it's a little cemetery, but we take care of that because Michael and his family are there and he deserves to be remembered and cared for. Now, that being said, we're not interested in acquiring every cemetery out there, because everybody in the cemetery deserves to be remembered and cared for.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2There are lots of little family cemeteries sprinkled here and there in the woods that you don't even know are there. Yeah, there are lots of little family cemeteries sprinkled here and there in the woods that you don't even know were there Because historically, when folks in your family passed away, you just buried them up the hill in the backyard in your little family plot.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2Unless you lived in town, then you went to either a church cemetery or your local town cemetery. But out in the country, yeah. And then our newest cemetery we've been taking care of it, or helped take care of it, for a long time, but we didn't actually acquire it till last year, and that is the Sherrill Family Cemetery, and it's down your way on a bluff overlooking Lake Norman, and it is the final resting place of Adam Sherrill, who was the first white man to cross the Catawba River.
Speaker 3Hence Sherrill's Ford.
Speaker 2Hence Sherrill's Ford.
Speaker 3Hence.
Speaker 2Sheryl's Ford Yep, named after him and his family. But it's a beautiful spot at the end of that neighborhood. It sits up on a bluff, there's trees, it's got a stone wall around it and then the hillside goes down to the lake. It's beautiful.
Speaker 3And you talk about these places and them being smaller. Do you encourage people to visit these or are they still very much private areas where, of course, you know in visiting any cemetery, please be courteous and kind? I hope that goes without saying. But at the same time, you know these places do hold a little bit of weight, or a lot of weight, in their historical significance. Is it encouraged that people because I don't really see these things listed on the website to the extent of the other locations Are we working towards that or is this something that you know that you don't encourage people to really go out?
Speaker 2Well, we encourage people to be respectful and so and there's a lot of people who are creeped out by cemetery, so they're not going to go visit, no matter who's buried there.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2Because they just find it creepy. There are other people who love cemeteries, who love to go quote, meet new people and pay their respects to, to folks that are there, right? So I mean we do encourage people to go visit. We have people who call us looking for their family and it's you know, I'm part of the Haas family, I'm part of the Han family. I you have these cemetery records I'd like to go visit, but I don't know where they are and it's not in something that's easily available like findagravecom or some of those others.
Speaker 3Right.
Speaker 2Um, so we are happy to to to see if it's in our records of where you can go find them. I'd almost say like it's a niche group of people who are interested, but that's probably true for any part of history or any historic topic. It's a niche group of people who are into whatever that thing is Right. So I mean, as far as I'm concerned, if you're going to be respectful, please go say hello. You never know the last time somebody had a visitor and you never know about the person you're going to visit. There is a gentleman buried in Providence Memorial Cemetery, which is on Highway 10, not far from Murray's Mill. His name is Drew Hamilton and his backstory is absolutely amazing and I'm not going to tell you that when you're going to have to look it up.
Speaker 3All right, there we go.
Speaker 2We got homework I love it, but had I not dropped by the cemetery to visit somebody else, I never would have stumbled across him and just be like, oh, I wonder who that guy is. And wow, look who that guy was.
Speaker 3Yeah, I mean that's really cool and um, uh, some of this stuff you're going to have, like you said, um, jennifer, you're going to have to show up, you're going to have to go tour and really listen to what the are they volunteers that lead these tours?
Speaker 2Our staff does it.
Speaker 3Okay, so there is staff. I was going to because I was going to jump into that. Next, If this is something that really interests you, there are tons of opportunities with the association. It looks like from sponsorship opportunities, like from sponsorship opportunities. I'm sure that they are always looking for donations or help. There's volunteer. It looks like there's volunteer forms that you could fill out and if you're just on the educational side, you know, signing up a group of individuals to go to one of these tours. There's a lot going on here, and so you know, I think this is such a small piece and I would love to have you or anyone else back to maybe do deep dives into each one of these if you feel like people might get something out of that not just the people of Catawba County that could show up, but it might be a good way to reach people outside of the county that are local enough and they're just looking for something else to you know, because some of this stuff is of regional significance.
Speaker 2I would argue um, there's a lot here yes, I say yes, I mean a lot of it is local significance, but as far as, like, the regional and we even have a few national things, with our biggest regional slash national story being the 1944 polio hospital in hickory it was known as the miracle of hickory and it happened during world war ii so it, as far as the national story goes, it got a little over well, it got overshadowed by that. Um. However, I mean we made or the story itself made time magazine. It was on newsreels at the movie theaters, like it really was a big thing, and I mean it's not something you hear about unless you read the books or read the book when you're here, you know, in elementary school or you stumble upon the storm, but it was a big thing.
Speaker 3Yeah, well, uh, probably about wraps us up. What do you think?
Speaker 2Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 3We covered a lot and, and um think so rich heritage of Catawba County and its role in the development of the Western Piedmont of North Carolina. Jennifer, I can't thank you enough. I'm sure there are a lot of other individuals as part of this organization that are as knowledgeable as you are. We have been extremely lucky and I'll say it again after speaking to you hearing what you all do for the county, which is way more than someone like me, I think, could ever dream about doing. This podcast probably belongs more to your organization, and so there is an open invitation for anyone as part of that to assist or to come on and tell different stories. The amount of knowledge and dedication and care that is put into what you people do, I don't think will ever be properly appreciated, but, if I may, I for one do appreciate that. So thank you.
Speaker 2You're welcome. Thank you for having me, and I will talk to the others and see if anybody else wants to come and join you.
Speaker 3Yeah, please. Well, I think, if anybody wants to get in touch with you, jennifer, is that something that can they reach out to you? Is your information anywhere?
Speaker 2uh, yes, um, I believe I'm listed under the staff directory on katabahistoryorg. Um, you can find me at murray's mill five days a week oh, very nice we're open seven, but I'm only there five. Good um so yeah feel free to reach out. I'm happy to answer questions. Point you in the right direction. Share all kinds of random tidbits of knowledge and yeah perfect.
Speaker 3Um, well, that's a wrap, and, and, jennifer, I do appreciate it again. Um, outside of everything that I said, I uh this wouldn't exist without people like you, you know, telling their story. I think in the first season, you know, last year, I ran through a lot of people local, some of the people that I've talked to, people that have been around a long time, but there are people like you that are doing a lot of work, um, you know, and and have been doing it a long time. So we uh, whether we know it or not, we owe you gratitude.
Speaker 1Thank you.
Speaker 3You're welcome.
Speaker 1Thanks so much for tuning in to this episode of the Catawba Chronicles. If you're enjoying this show, please feel free to rate, subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to your podcasts. That helps others find the show and we greatly appreciate it. Once again, we really appreciate you taking the time to listen and getting more acquainted with all of the wonderful things Catawba County has to offer. We hope you'll join us again in the next episode of the Catawba Chronicles.