S5 EP06 How Clinic Owners Get The Best Out Of A Practice Manager Without Micromanaging

Season 5: Clinic Systems, Processes, and Operations

Welcome

Hello listeners, welcome back to the Treat Your Business Podcast. I am super excited you are here because today we are talking about something that can completely change how your clinic runs and how you feel about running it. If you have ever said things like “it is just quicker if I do it myself” or “I cannot find anybody who does it like me” or “I have tried and they do not get it right so I have taken the job back” then this episode is for you. I am joined by our COO in Thrive, Nichola, and we are diving into how to get the best out of your practice manager or business manager without micromanaging them.

Episode Summary

In this episode, Nichola and I unpack what a great practice manager actually does and how that role should sit alongside you as the CEO. We talk about the difference between a practice manager and an administrator, what you should never delegate as the owner and what you absolutely must let go of. We explore why so many clinic owners become the bottleneck, constantly firefighting and feeling exhausted, and how unclear roles and poor communication turn your practice manager into a reactive doer instead of a strategic partner. We also talk honestly about trust, identity, perfectionism and control, and why you have to be willing to hire people who are better than you in their area if you want the clinic and your life to grow.

Key Takeaways

• Your job as CEO is vision, leadership, culture and big financial decisions, not doing all the things
• A strong practice manager owns day to day operations, systems, team communication, tech and data
• If every decision has to go through you, you have already waited too long to hire for this role
• Trust, clear outcomes, a weekly meeting rhythm and simple KPIs stop micromanagement for both of you

Resources & Links

Today’s episode is sponsored by Jane, clinic management software and EMR. Jane’s online bookings and secure client portal help you reclaim your evenings and weekends by taking admin off your plate. To see how Jane can support your clinic, head to the link in the show notes to book a personalised demo. If you are ready to get started, use the code Thrive one mo at the time of sign up for a one month grace period on your new account.

Treat Your Business podcast is proudly sponsored by Klatch:
Results-driven marketing built for healthcare companies. Unlock sustainable growth and maximise ROI with data-driven digital marketing tailored to your business, backed by patient tracking software from search to revenue.

Find out more at https://www.klatch.co.uk

Resources & Links:

Subscribe to our Channel on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@thrivebizcoach?sub_confirmation=1

Website: https://Thrive-businesscoaching.com  

Free Resources: https://treatyourbusiness.com 

Transcript

Treat Your Business EP156

[00:00:00] Katie Bell: Hello listeners, welcome back to the Treat Your Business Podcast. Super excited to have you all here. Today we're gonna be talking about something that I think completely changes the way that your clinic runs and the way you feel about running it. So if you've ever caught yourself saying things like, it's just quicker if I do it myself or.

[00:00:21] I can't find anybody who does it like me or I've tried and they don't get it right. So I'm just taking that job back. Then this episode is for you. I'm joined this week by our COO in Thrive, Nicola, and we are diving in to how to get the best out of your practice manager, your business manager, maybe your ops manager, whatever you call them, without micro managing them

[00:00:41] Today's episode is sponsored by Jane, a clinic management software and EMR. The Jane team knows that when your workday is spent providing care to your patients or your clients, it can feel like there aren't enough hours in the day for the rest of your admin tasks. This can mean scheduling appointments become.

[00:01:00] The hours tasks turning what should be restful evenings into extra long work days. That's why Jane has designed user-friendly online bookings. You can give your patients freedom to book their appointments at their own convenience. Patients can also manage their appointments, fill out intake forms, and enable SMS and email reminders.

[00:01:18] From their secure online portal, which saves you from having to do it manually to see how Jane can help you reclaim your evenings and weekends. Head to the link in the show notes to book a personalized demo. Or if you're ready to get started, you can use the code Thrive one mo at the time of sign up for a one month grace period.

[00:01:35] Apply to your new account.

[00:01:39] Speaker: welcome to the Treat Your Business podcast, the show for clinic owners who want real, honest advice and tried and tested ways of doing things. I'm Katie Bell, and this is the new era of bigger insights and bolder conversations to help you grow a clinic and a life you love. Let's dive in.

[00:01:57] Katie Bell: So Nichola, a huge welcome to the podcast this week.

[00:01:59] Nichola Page: Hello. Hello. Good morning. How you doing?

[00:02:03] Katie Bell: So what? Do you and, and I want you to talk, Nic, from a place of our relationship as a, we call ourselves the CEO and the COO but you've also had experience of being a practice manager within a clinic.

[00:02:19] Within my clinic in particular when you were helping, when my practice manager was on maternity leave. Yeah. What do you think makes the role of a great practice manager in a clinic?

[00:02:31] Nichola Page: The practice manager's responsibility is to deal with more of the day-to-day operations, so some, anything that's really team related or something that's repeatable.

[00:02:45] Comes under the umbrella of the practice manager. And when I say repeatable, like overseeing systems, communications, managing team recording data to see how the practice is performing. Is it on track, is it not on track? So that's how I see the role of the practice manager.

[00:03:08] Katie Bell: Yeah. Okay. And so do you.

[00:03:12] Think from experience? From, I guess from experience. What, 'cause because we teach, we not only coach the integrators and the business managers in our Ascend program, but we also a lot of them come to some of our live days. What are some of the signs that you see that the owner, so the CEO hasn't clearly defined the role.

[00:03:33] Nichola Page: It is important to be very clear between the two of you, so the practice manager, the business owner, exactly what your roles are as you grow the business and, and that there's gonna be some typical things a practice manager will do and typical things a business owner will do. But that's in it is entirely up to you how you see that, but it's crucial that you have clarity.

[00:03:56] For example, in, in your clinic, Katie, yours was very much the vision, the big picture. Making sure that the visibility was out there, that the, everything about the clinic was visible on all different social media platforms, not the doing of it. Just the strategy of it or developing partnerships, collaborations, that kind of thing.

[00:04:19] So that was very clear in back then what your role was. And that might be the same for you as you are listening to this, whereas your then your, the clarity for your business manager is manager what, or your practice manager is, what are they now responsible for? And it's usually what you don't want to do.

[00:04:40] Or, and in fact not where your, not even that is where your strengths don't necessarily lie, nor should they. I guess it's for me is what should you delegate and what shouldn't you delegate as the business owner? Yeah. So let's if we can, let's start with that.

[00:04:54] What, for me, what I think where the business owner should sit is you are responsible for the vision. Having clarity of that vision, not the doing of it, just the picture of it leading the values within your business and the clear direction of where you want it to go. So that comes under vision, obviously.

[00:05:17] Yeah. You are responsible for, as a business owner for the bigger financial decisions. Not the day to day operational financial decisions, but the bigger picture ones, the maybe more of the pricing decisions, or you might do that together, but you are definitely the one that should be leading when it comes to the culture of the business, the tone of the business, so where it's headed.

[00:05:47] So you definitely don't wanna be delegating that. That's, that to me is what you should take ownership of. And then what your practice manager would do is more of making sure the processes are right, the systems are right, that so any tech that you are using, that you've got the right team in place, that the communication to the your client's, patients members is right, that the communication within the team is right.

[00:06:18] So that is more where a practice manager will then look at all of that and make sure that's operationally efficient.

[00:06:26] Katie Bell: And do you think that at what I see is when, if I'm unclear with you or if I'm unclear with my business manager in my clinic you can become and this is not a negative on you, this is me.

[00:06:38] You can just become reactive. So we end up feeling like we're just constantly firefighting. Instead of leading. And I think when you have an understanding of giving ownership of the outcomes not just the actions. So I think sometimes we think as business owners we're so freaking tired and we're so busy and overwhelmed and I don't wanna do all of this stuff 'cause I'm not wired to do it.

[00:07:02] I'm just gonna throw the task over the wall and I hope it's gonna stick. And actually that. That isn't helpful because if that's not done with clarity with accountability, with empowering you to be able to take ownership of the outcome, not just, oh, I'm going to now go and action it and put it all into place.

[00:07:23] I think that's where we. Find the relationship can fall down. Would you agree?

[00:07:29] Nichola Page: Yeah, totally. You've got, 

[00:07:30] it's your responsibility as the owner to select, to set the clear expectations. Yeah. And by that's what are the key outcomes that you, that the business wants and needs? And why so also, 

[00:07:47] yeah, 

[00:07:47] the so someone like myself, I, I would want to know, okay, what's your expectation and why is that important?

[00:07:57] Yeah. Because if I know the why and I know what your expectation is, then I can deliver on that. And I think sometimes it you can make the mistake of just talking about activities or a actions. We're gonna do this thing and we're gonna do that thing. Let's try this and let's do you, like you say, just chucking stuff at the wall and seeing if it sticks without going, okay, what do we want out of this thing?

[00:08:22] What's the ideal result that we want? And why is that important? So coming from the owner. Certainly to start with, you would need to be clear on the why, where we are headed, why we are heading there, and what you expect to see as a result of that. So the outcomes. 

[00:08:43] Katie Bell: Yeah. And why do you think it's hard for, and maybe I'm interested to hear your view in this and how we work together, Nic, but why do you think it's hard for clinic owners or for business owners, CEOs to let go?

[00:08:58] I think from my perspective it can often be an identity thing. You know that well, surely I should have all the answers because I own the company and therefore I should be telling everybody else what they should be doing. Perhaps it's perfectionism. We've got a lot of high achievers and very competitive people that listen to this podcast, so it's the fear of it.

[00:09:19] If I pass over that job or that task or the outcome, they're not gonna do it how I want it to be done. And I'm fearful they're gonna make mistakes. What do you see a reason that lots of clinic owners struggle to let go, 

[00:09:31] It's your baby, isn't it? 

[00:09:33] Nichola Page: Yeah, you built that up from the start, and so there is going to be a reluctance to let go.

[00:09:40] Maybe you've had a role that was like that in the past, and you, maybe you, so you're basing things on previous experiences yourself, where it wasn't handled very well. There are a whole host of things, but, and equally, the another thing is you've never been taught how to do that, so why would you find it easy to do?

[00:10:01] Everybody's different. There are different personalities. If you are naturally tend to be a control enthusiast, as Philippa would say, not a control freak as I would say. But if you naturally tend to be that way, it's gonna be harder for you to let go. And it's a big thing if you are, if you're putting your trust, certainly when it comes down to finances and the direction of the business as you're starting to take back that, that takes trust.

[00:10:27] To do that. So I think it's a gradual thing to do. 

[00:10:31] Katie Bell: Yeah. Do and do you, I always find this a challenging one to answer, I guess because I trust from the beginning that trust strengthens as you work together more and you get to know each other more, and you have a, have a, a, you know, a deeper relationship.

[00:10:49] I think from the beginning, if you've hired if you've followed a great process our 12 step process, I just like to say indeed then you are gonna have a great fit person for this seat in your business. Great fit in terms of values, attitude, skills, knowledge, all of those kind of things.

[00:11:06] So therefore you, I think you have to trust from day one and let that trust deepen as you get to know each other. But a lot of clinic owners that we hear. Say, but I don't fully trust them yet, or I don't, I just don't know if they're the right person for this, and that is a big red flag for me.

[00:11:25] What do you feel about that? 

[00:11:26] Nichola Page: Absolutely. If you've got that part in your gut feeling, oh, I'm not sure, then why have you got them in that role? 

[00:11:34] Katie Bell: Yeah, 

[00:11:34] Nichola Page: The, there, there's something about the, either what's happened in, maybe they've been in your team for a while and you are looking to bring them up to speed and let them grow into this role.

[00:11:44] But if there's an element of you're not sure if you trust them or there's something about them, then they shouldn't be in that role. I feel that's quite black and white and there's probably a thousand shades of gray in there, but you have to trust your gut. If there's something that's telling you, I'm not sure about this.

[00:12:02] I guess it's do a sense check on yourself. Are you like that with everybody or is this just something niggling away at you saying, I'm not sure because that's something Niggling is usually quite right. I agree. And you have to be, I think you have to be open and vulnerable with the person in this seat.

[00:12:22] If you are. Wanting a practice manager in your business and you are trying to hide information from them, or you don't want to be fully transparent with them about where the finances are, for example, then they can't do their job. They can't do it when they're partially blind to it. So it does require you to be a little bit vulnerable.

[00:12:46] And so it might be that, that's. Uncomfortable. That's making you think, I'm not sure if I trust that person. Is it that or is it you're just feeling, oh, I'm not comfortable with necessarily sharing this information 'cause I've never done it before. Maybe it's not where I want it to be. So I'm a little bit embarrassed about that.

[00:13:05] Or I don't even know what it is that I want, so how could I share it? So there's a lot, there could be a lot of things going on. 

[00:13:13] Katie Bell: Yeah. So this is, I guess what I'm hearing here is it's so important to hire Well Yep. To, To make sure you've got the right person in the right seat that you do trust.

[00:13:26] And you allow that trust to deepen and strengthen as you work together more. But you have to have a level of it to start with because otherwise you're gonna be holding things back. You are not gonna be giving them the information they need when they need it to allow you Katie, my business manager, to really lean into her role and and perform.

[00:13:46] Nichola Page: Yeah, you are right, that has to be there from the start. There might, of course, when you're just hiring someone new, there's gonna be that. If it's not a luck or there's something not quite right about this person, that's a definite red flag. But if it's, you are a little bit nervous about it because you've never done it before, then you just need to make sure that in there.

[00:14:07] First three months of working with you, for example, you are not just letting them run free. There needs to be an element of checking in and supporting and guiding an open and honest conversation. And if you've got that in place, you will quickly know whether actually this person isn't the right person.

[00:14:26] It's not what I thought it was gonna be. But if you just let them run free, then you are. You could just potentially open yourself up if you've hired. It's highly unlikely, but it's your responsibility to onboard them correctly and absolutely build that trust in the first months 

[00:14:44] Katie Bell: and set you up for success because I think as visionaries we.

[00:14:49] Not always, but we tend to be very quick thinkers. Slightly lower in detail than perhaps you'd really like Nicola. What's really important from the get go is that you have a clear meeting rhythm because then it removes the need for can I just check in that you've done that or can I just check in that's happened because that message actually drives everybody mad and it disempowers.

[00:15:13] You, it would disempower Katie if I was constantly micromanaging. So do you wanna share for you and me what our meeting rhythm is and why it works for us? 

[00:15:23] Nichola Page: We have a weekly meeting. We have a 90 minute meeting each week. And that is where we go through it. We will do we'll always start it with some good news.

[00:15:35] 'cause to set the scene you have to do that. Good news, personal, professional. But we, the, without going through it in micro detail, the longest short of it is we are measuring. We are looking at the KPIs that we would've set. We've set, so whether you are looking at your new patient conversion or your retention, whatever that is we are looking at that and seeing if we're on track or off track.

[00:15:56] And wherever anything is off track, it's a case of, okay, what do we need to discuss that, is there an issue around that we now need to focus in on? In this meeting to solve it rather than leaving it. But these are, they're bigger key issues. So you need to be able to, in that meeting, have some data that you are going to look at.

[00:16:16] Now it's my responsibility to make sure I've got the accurate data that's presented to you and for me to identify whether it's on or off track. And for us to decide, okay, do we need to discuss this or not? And then what is the solution that we come up with? So that's very much our rhythm every week.

[00:16:38] And it, it can be the data in terms of as I said, for example, it might be the number of new patients coming in on the new patient conversions, retention through to are there any issues with team? Do we need to discuss? Anything with them? Are they performing, are they not? So we are just analyzing where the business is at and then talking around bigger issues that are coming up or key decisions that need to be made.

[00:17:06] And having that rhythm every week. It means that I can leave you alone in between, that you can leave me alone in between that, because we know we're gonna meet at that time, that day. Yeah. And we can discuss everything that needs to be discussed in 90 minutes and get on with it. Yeah. 

[00:17:25] Katie Bell: We then have a to-do list, don't we, Nic, off the back of those.

[00:17:27] So we have, our agenda is we talk about our measurables. We then talk about our the issues that. We've got to discuss, we will rate those from one to five. So we get to the key issue first, and then if we have time, we work through the rest of them. Off the back of that, we create a to-dos. So at the end of that 90 minutes, we're very clear about what the actual issue is and what the solution is and who is responsible for the solution.

[00:17:52] So when we meet. Next, the next Monday. It's a quick check of, yeah, did that, done that? And we can see that working to do all the time. So there's no kind of micromanagement going on. 

[00:18:04] Nichola Page: Yeah, exactly. And the to-dos are the key things that will move the business forward. 'cause it's also very easy to get bogged down with all the day-to-day stuff.

[00:18:17] And I'm, I am not saying that the day-to-day stuff is not important, but. We have to remember what our jobs are. You as the owner, me as the practice manager, the job is to move the business forward to achieve the targets it needs to achieve. So those meetings help you to look at the bigger, more juicier to-dos that need to be done.

[00:18:36] Otherwise, we'd gonna 

[00:18:37] Katie Bell: stay where we're at. I'm interested to hear, Nic, from your perspective as the person that as the COO, as the, business manager, ops manager, practice manager seat, if you were to, if we were to skip that rhythm because we allowed other things to take priority or, whatever it was, what impact does that have on you and your energy and your performance?

[00:19:03] Nichola Page: It's huge because you just end up getting drawn back into stuff that you don't need to be drawn back into. And let's be honest, this has happened. There have been times when we are not perfect. We're almost there. We sometimes. Sometimes life happens and you can't keep that rhythm.

[00:19:24] We, we intend to do it, but sometimes you can't. And that has happened recently where it's not been possible to do. And you, for me personally, I will then quite easily get drawn back into other things that don't, I don't really need to be doing. So I think that it is crucial that those things happen.

[00:19:46] Yeah. Somebody that's in a practice manager position is gonna be. More likely detailed, more likely to be have want to just get on and do stuff so the follow through is gonna be there. Whereas the owner, like yourself is very much creative, bigger picture thinking. So your very nature will be to not get drawn into day-to-day stuff because your.

[00:20:12] You just wanna deal with a bigger picture. Whereas somebody like myself could very easily get drawn into it because my nature is I become a complete finisher. I want it done. I want it done now. So if that weekly stuff rhythm is not there, I can get drawn back into all of that stuff when actually I've lost sight sometimes at the bigger picture.

[00:20:38] Does that make sense? 

[00:20:40] Katie Bell: It makes to, this is like we are talking from experience. Can we from 

[00:20:44] Nichola Page: experience here, it has happened. 

[00:20:46] Katie Bell: Yeah, off on maternity leave. And so I'm out of any day-to-day stuff really only in delivery mode for what we need to do for our listeners and our clients.

[00:20:56] But we had a day out, didn't we, together on an annual, a quarterly strategy day. And I was having to zoom in from home and juggle. And you actually went to London 'cause you were like, I've gotta get out, I've gotta sit with our implementer who we work with very closely. And you absolutely loved that day because it really elevated you, your role.

[00:21:14] Yeah. Gave you clarity, gave you fresh perspective. And I possibly hadn't realised the impact that us not connecting and communicating could have until you explained that to me. 

[00:21:28] Nichola Page: Yeah. I didn't even, to be fair, I didn't know the extent of the impact until I was then back out of it going okay. This is, I've just allowed myself to get drawn back in.

[00:21:41] We always talk about taking somebody else's monkey. If someone comes to you with a problem talk, we refer to it as they're trying to give you their monkey. I think I'd, I think this whole office of mine had a gazillion trillion monkeys in it because my very nature is, oh, I'll just do it. Let me do that or, and I do it.

[00:21:59] And actually I was doing. Too much. And it wasn't until then you step out of that, that you go, actually no, this is, it is got to be, come back to it being what are the key things that are gonna drive the business forward, not just what needs to be done today or this week. So your focus needs to stay there.

[00:22:19] And that takes practice, but that also takes, that's what I'm saying earlier on, if you just let the business manager, practice manager run with it. With no checking on it. If they're not wired to be creative and they're not that visionary kind of brain, which they probably won't be, nor should they be, but the blend of the two of you together is where the magic happens.

[00:22:45] Yeah. So that is important that you can both consistently check in and be vulnerable and honest, and open with each other. Pretty much everything, otherwise it won't work. 

[00:22:57] Katie Bell: Yeah, absolutely. And I guess Nic, that leans into then the difference between a practice manager and an administrator. 

[00:23:04] Nichola Page: Yeah, 

[00:23:04] Katie Bell: because whatever you wanna call 'em, we call ours client care administrators, practice administrators, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:23:11] We have an ops assistant, but what can happen is if. The leadership from the top down is not clear and is not consistent. That the practice manager, business manager, COO, could be drawn back into the day-to-day. And then we've got a lot of people doing a lot of stuff, which is all really important and necessary, and not one job is better or worse than the other.

[00:23:35] It's all important, but we stopped tonight. We have conversations. It because your abilities, your potential, the reason that you are sat in that role is because you have a brain for strategy for bigger things. For the big picture finances the operational efficiency, the profitability. That isn't what your client care administrators are there to do.

[00:23:57] They're there to get the job done. But I think a lot of practice managers, what I see is that they are. Trying to be everything in that role. So they're trying to. Manage the business and do all the stuff as well. And I don't think that works. 

[00:24:13] Nichola Page: No. It doesn't. And there probably, so if you've, particularly if you've come from, let's say you was more administrative in your role within a clinic and then you've been promoted up to practice manager, which would be a natural progression.

[00:24:29] You the tendency is that you probably can think, oh, I'll just do this myself. It's gonna be quicker. I know how to do it, rather than how am I supposed to, I'm thinking I haven't even got the time to explain all of this to somebody else, so I might as well just do it myself. That, and I know that from bitter experience, that's what we tend to do.

[00:24:50] But that doesn't work for you long term. 'cause all that happens then is everybody then just passes you more stuff and you just take on more stuff to do that you shouldn't be doing and you're not empowering your team to do it. So there is a fine line and it takes practice. It takes the focus and we, this is where having an accountability chart within your business of clear roles that each person has in the seat that they are in.

[00:25:16] What are they ultimately responsible for? What is a practice manager ultimately responsible for as? As opposed to what is the clinic practice admin responsible for? So you can see who should be taking what and when you should be delegating and passing things back out. But it is very easy 

[00:25:36] Katie Bell: to cross.

[00:25:37] A lot of our listeners feel exhausted, they feel burnt out, they feel overwhelmed, and it's because they're trying to be everything to everybody. And essentially be the jack of all trades. I always think. They wait too long to get the right person in this seat. When do you think Nic is the right time for a clinic owner to start considering that they need somebody in a seat like this, whether it's fractional part-time or whether it's a full-time, 

[00:26:11] Nichola Page: if you are being the bottle.

[00:26:13] If you are the bottle neck of the business, if every decision is having to go through you, if the team are all waiting for your approval, but you are so busy because you're doing a gazillion at one things and they're like, I still haven't got that decision from you, I still need to have that from you. You probably at that point, you've already gone too far.

[00:26:33] You've waited too long. 

[00:26:33] Katie Bell: Yeah. 

[00:26:34] Nichola Page: So if you are already. Feeling a bit drained from, oh, why is everybody keep, why is it always me that has to make the decision? That could be when you need it. That's your practice manager's job. As long as they, you've got that relationship. They understand the vision, your vision, and the why and what the outcomes are, they can make the decision.

[00:26:57] Katie Bell: So it's almost for I'm gonna, I'm gonna put this out there, Nic, but if you're listening to this, you probably already six months too late because the reason that you're listening to this is because you're tired, you're burnt out. You need some advice, you need guidance, you need coaching, you need support.

[00:27:10] And it's a big decision to make. And a lot of clinic owners will make the decision purely based on cost. And they will look at their numbers and they will say I can't afford to do it. And actually, you can't afford not to because, something will have to give ultimately and eventually.

[00:27:25] But how can they reframe that, Nic, in terms of if they are gonna make the investment of bringing in a practice manager, whether that's part-time or full-time, how can they reframe the decision of whether they can afford it or not? 

[00:27:38] Nichola Page: The right person is going to increase your revenue. They're gonna come up with solutions to increase their revenue, reduce your costs, and therefore increase the profit.

[00:27:47] So they should be paying for themselves. Obviously won't be necessarily immediately, but that's the whole point of having somebody in that role. How does this business become more profitable and still and achieve the vision? Is wanting to be, but the bottom line is a business needs to make a profit.

[00:28:07] And it's, and that's absolutely okay for it to make a profit and somebody in that seat that one of their key things is to look at where are we spending too much money? How could we be more efficient with that? How can we get a better return on the money we are spending? For example, in marketing, how do we get the team's KPIs up so they are converting more, retaining more.

[00:28:30] So all of those little things that they're gonna look at, decisions they're gonna make and work with the team on are gonna start to give you a return in increase in revenue, and most importantly, an increase in profit. 

[00:28:43] Katie Bell: Yeah. Great. Great answer. Yeah. And Nic, if you were to, if you were to bake a cake and the cake has to have certain ingredients in for what makes a great relationship between a CEO and a COO, like what ingredients do you think we need to put in there?

[00:28:58] Or what ingredients do we have that you think make us work really well? 

[00:29:02] Nichola Page: You gotta have trust. And yeah, trust from the off, but that will build over time. 

[00:29:08] Katie Bell: Yeah. 

[00:29:09] Nichola Page: Complete openness and vulnerability with each other. And you have to come at things, be united with the decisions. What you can't have is someone in that seat where, let's say you had made a decision about a direction we were gonna go in Katie, and I'm going, okay.

[00:29:26] Yeah. Yeah, but then to the team, I'm going, I dunno why she's doing that. What's this all about? Here she goes again, you can't have that 'cause that's toxic. And I've seen that before. We have seen that before. When somebody's got somebody in that, almost in that second seat, who is who? Like from the team's perspective, they need to see that you are both saying exactly the same thing in complete alignment and that's what makes the relationship work and therefore the business work.

[00:29:57] Katie Bell: Absolutely. And I think as leaders, as CEOs, we don't have all the answers, nor should we have all the answers and the quicker that you realise, your route to success is gonna be dictated by the people that you've got around you. Means that if you're not where you wanna be, it's because you've not got the right people around you yet.

[00:30:19] And you are not leaning into on them or into stepping into that leadership role. You're still trying to be the manager and manage everything and keep everything. And I think then we see this whole. Tired, burnt out, exhausted, feel like they're just firefighting all the time, doing the same things over and over again, and expecting something to change when it's never going to.

[00:30:40] So I think as CEOs listening to this, as visionaries, as clinic owners, you have to play a massive part of in this as well. You need to uplevel how you behave, how and develop yourself like personally. 

[00:30:54] Nichola Page: Yeah. 

[00:30:54] Katie Bell: Because that means that it's easier than to really work with your COO and make sure that relationship's, gonna be one that thrives and allows the clinic or the business to grow and grow it together.

[00:31:06] Nichola Page: Yeah it's a, it is a joint thing and then a separate thing. You, so you've got to come together and be united and also challenge each other. There are times when I'll see something from a completely different perspective to you, vice versa, but, and agree on, okay, when it comes to that decision.

[00:31:26] The buck stocks with you, Katie, you'll make the ultimate decision on that. 'cause that's where your skills and your uniqueness lies. And there's other things that be, if it was operational, it might be, okay, we're gonna make that decision. 'cause that's how I feel really strongly about it. Yeah.

[00:31:41] So we think you have to come together, you have to have your, you have to be okay with your differences as the clinic owner. You need to put your ego aside. Not that you ever. This is not something you ever do, but I'm just, I have seen it before where people just think, okay I, or feel threatened by bringing somebody in they think is better than them, that they think, oh, you know that I should be better at this because I am the owner.

[00:32:11] Whether it's consciously or subconsciously, they'll, if they're feel, oh, I dunno if that person's a bit too good for me. That's the wrong decision to make. 'cause you want somebody who is better than you at this stuff that you actually don't really wanna do anyway, because that frees you up to do what you are great at.

[00:32:35] Katie Bell: Yeah. So yeah, so we're are, we're encouraging clinic owners who. are invested in their growth. If you are listening to this and you are happy with where you are right now in terms of the amount of money that you take home each month and that is consistent and you are paid first and it allows you to live the life that you wanna live and you have all the time that you want to spend with your family and your friends then by all means, you do not need you do not need this person in your business, but I'm guessing that you are here because you want. More from your life and you deserve more from your life. Whether that's time or income, freedom, whatever it is that you, what success as being that you've gotta stop trying to do it all. And your role is vision and leadership. It's not about the micromanagement. And the quicker that you recognize that you need exceptional people around you and that you absolutely must hire people who are better than you because otherwise there's no point hiring them.

[00:33:34] When you get yourself over that first hurdle, I'm gonna say that you are six months too late to the party. So act now start making some decisions about, whether it's that you are going to define the seat, define what that. Role needs to look like in your business and your role that you need to really sit in.

[00:33:54] Should you have the time and the ability to sit in that, then this is what you really want to be doing. We talked about Nic communicating outcomes, not just tasks, not just giving them a load of. As one of our fabulous cl clients would say squirrels don't just give them all that shit and see what sticks, but communicate clearly those outcomes.

[00:34:13] Build trust through clarity, consistency, a good meeting rhythm because you both benefit from it so much and empower your manager, your COO to manage their own lane. I think that's really, those are the key takeaways for me. Nic, have you got anything else that you want listeners to really get from this episode?

[00:34:34] Nichola Page: I think if you are where, whether you've already got someone in or you're thinking about getting them in or you're listening, going, oh, I really should get someone in there. Were just, I guess I wanna give you some practical tools that you could put into your business. Now, this is. This is not down to you to have all of this before that person comes in.

[00:34:54] Just give you that caveat because you can do this together. You, as the owner, do not have to have all the answers. That right person that comes in will create. A lot of this stuff because they're naturally gonna be wired to do it, then enjoy doing it where you may not. So things like together, you could create the, what we call the accountability chart.

[00:35:15] So together you could define clearly what's the owner's role, what's the practice manager's role. You don't have to have had this amazing thing done before they come in. You can start. So first, first thing we need to do is define what your roles are, what my roles are. Let's do that together based on your strengths and what you are naturally wired to do.

[00:35:35] So an accountability chart is a tool that will help you both and will also help the whole team to see who do I go to? For X, who I do, who do I go to for Y, do I go to the owner? Do I go to the practice manager? That is something, a tool that is gonna help you also having a scorecard. The measure, the measurables, like the KPIs.

[00:35:58] What, and again, you don't, if you haven't got them in your business, if you haven't got targets for new patient conversions or retention or whatever it might be, this person can help you create those. So you can decide together what are we measuring on a weekly, monthly, quarterly basis. So you need that.

[00:36:19] You need to have your meeting rhythm, so you as the owner, need to be okay with giving up as you do 90 minutes of your time each week. It feels like it's a lot to start with, but it saves so much more time. 

[00:36:34] Katie Bell: Yeah. 

[00:36:35] Nichola Page: And I think those are the tools that you need. So accountability chart, a scorecard or KPIs and have this meeting rhythm.

[00:36:43] But again, don't wait for it to all be in place before you get that person in. Create it together when they're there, and you will also get a lot more buy-in from that person because they are there helping you create that. So that would be my part in. Piece of wisdom. 

[00:37:04] Katie Bell: Absolutely. And I think that's the, it's to not allow perfectionism and the need to have all this in place before they actually start the hiring process.

[00:37:13] Because hiring takes a long time and it should take a long time because you should be doing it slowly, doing it with. High levels of diligence and making sure that you are gonna get this right person. 'cause we only wanna recruit them in once, it's a big role. Yeah. And you wanna get it right.

[00:37:27] Just take some action and move forwards. And I'm. I'm gonna say that for any of you that have sat on the fence, the answer is you actually, you need to do it. In nine times out of 10, they need this person around them. Whether you are a huge clinic or a medium sized or a small size clinic, there is a place for this role in everybody's business, in my opinion.

[00:37:48] Nichola Page: Yeah, agreed. Agreed. 

[00:37:50] Katie Bell: Nic thank you for giving up your, I know, very valuable time because I think it's really useful for them to hear how it really works in practice but also just gives them a, another voice to tune into and listen to. So a huge thanks for me to you, for everything that you do in Thrive for me.

[00:38:10] You're welcome. And please come back again soon. I will, I better get it off now and do all of my all my jobs. 

[00:38:17] Thanks for listening to the Treat Your Business podcast. Hit subscribe now and keep joining me for bigger insights, bolder conversations to help you build a clinic and a life you love.