From Heartbreak To Healing: Lindy Brown's Story (Part 1)

Bright skies at the ranch set a sharp contrast to the truth we explore with guest Lindy Brown: the weight a first responder carries doesn’t stay at work. Lindy is the widow of an Iowa State Trooper who died by suicide. She shares why she felt called to speak, how a five-year slow burn of trauma changed her husband, and what families see long before reports or discipline ever show up. We talk openly about the nights that never end, the way alcohol masks pain, and the moment a prom night scuffle became a desperate signal that no one knew how to read.

I open up about my own spiral—pain pills, vodka, suicidal plans—and the lie that strength means silence. Together we break down what hypervigilance looks like at home, why small conflicts can spark explosive reactions, and how culture can unintentionally punish honesty. We dig into leadership responses, the hollow comfort of “leave it at the door,” and the reality that counseling offered without trust is counseling refused. Lindy explains how one horrific call—collecting the remains of a man struck by a semi in a storm—etched itself into Jeff’s mind. No academy prepares you for a five-gallon bucket and picking up human body parts.

This conversation isn’t about blame; it’s about building something better.  If you’re a first responder, a spouse, or a leader, you’ll hear practical insight, lived experience, and a clear path toward safer, braver conversations. Hit play, share it with someone who needs to hear it, and if this resonates, subscribe and leave a review so more families can find real help.

If you or someone you know is in crisis and at risk of self-harm, please call or text 988, the suicide and crisis lifeline. 

To contact us directly send an email to  Dan@10-42project.org  or call 515-350-6274
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Transcript

Welcome At The Ranch

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Welcome back to another episode of the Shared Voices Podcast. Thanks for joining us. We're back out at the ranch. Gentry's out here today. What's up, Gentry?

SPEAKER_01 0:08

Not much, boss, man.

Introducing Lindy And The Mission

SPEAKER_04 0:09

What a beautiful day. Man. The ranch, it's uh, what is it, 70 degrees, sunny? You gotta love this time of year. But we came back out to the ranch because we have a special interview today. Uh Gentry lined this up. Gentry's is is running and then gonna be in charge of the podcast stuff and setting up interviews and all that. Um, so she set this interview up and I'm really excited about it. Today we have on Lindy Brown. And she's coming on to talk about something that you've heard us talk about on this podcast several times. Um, when we talk about depression and suicide. Um, we have a special guest here today who is the wife of an Iowa State trooper who took his life, and she wants to come on here today and tell her story, and with the impact of our listeners to be able to hear hear her side of it. I mean, not her side of it, to hear what the wisdom that she's learned through this and the road she's gone through because it's been a it's been a long hard road. But she wants to be able to share that, especially for first responders that may be dealing with this in the future, whose spouses may be going through it, and we are just so proud of her for showing up. She drove two hours to get here. She could have done it online, but she chose to drive two hours because she wanted to do it in person. So we're blessed to have her here. So, Lindy, thank you for driving all the way here.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 1:28

By the Cedar Rapids area. Yep. So I just met you. We had a really great conversation, and I'm so glad you're here. And if I can be honest with you, I don't normally get like a little nervous when I record, but this one's really it's I'm not nervous, but we're gonna go deep here for a little bit and talk about um talk about some things that we need to talk about. Absolutely. I don't know if you know much of my story, but I was only in law enforcement for 14 years. And by the 14th year, I was alcoholic, addicted to pain pills, suicidal. Um, asked my wife for a divorce, started shedding my family because I was trying to kill myself. Uh I'd get off of work and just go up to my my bathroom and sit inside the the bathtub with clothes on, with no water in it, um, just to contain the blood for my suicide because I didn't want to make a mess. So I'd sit there and sit inside the tub with my bottle of hydrocodone pills, popping as many pills as I could, drinking vodka, uh, playing with my service weapon, putting it in my mouth, trying to kill myself. Um led to a lot of dark days like that. My body would vomit up the pills and I'd pick them up, put them back in, my whole thing. I just want to die, even though I was a father of three. I didn't want to live, I didn't feel worthy. I went down that I went down that road and it's a miracle I'm here. I don't know. I mean, I guess I do know why I'm here. Um because God turns pain into purpose, and I think that's why you're here today. Yes, he does. So why don't you tell us a little bit about why you're here today and why uh why you think it's important to be able to use your voice. This is called the Shared Voices Podcast. Why it's important to use your voice.

SPEAKER_00 3:12

Well, about two and a half years ago, I felt called to use my voice. Um, because I believe that God puts us in situations and has us go through difficult times so that we can share those experiences of how he helped us overcome it so that we can help heal other people and give them hope and show God's love to them.

SPEAKER_04 3:34

Yeah. Well, that's uh I couldn't imagine being able to sit down right now and to be able to do this interview. You lost your husband.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

I did.

Host’s Battle With Addiction And Suicide

SPEAKER_04 3:44

You lost your husband to suicide, and he was a he was an Iowa state trooper.

SPEAKER_00 3:49

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 3:50

And so if you don't mind, let's just let's kind of talk about that a little bit. Because so many of our spouses, when they walk out that door, they don't know if their spouse is coming home. Right. And they worry about it, and then time after time the spouse comes home, but then there's a day um where they don't come home or they come home and they're just not the same. Um yeah. So how long did Jeff have on? So tell us a little bit about Jeff. Tell us about this this amazing man that you were married to.

SPEAKER_00 4:16

Right. So Jeff um had always wanted to serve and he served in on military. He also served in law enforcement and had a drive to just be there for people and take care of people. Um he started with Iowa Department of Publix Public Safety in the um DCI. And then he moved over to troopers. Um, he was in uh with the troopers for a while, a long time. So um yeah, but talking about like what you're saying is you know, looking back. Um and when I did uh the document information for the PSOB, I can see because you have to do a statement of like a personal statement for it, and um documenting the situations that he shared with me during the five years leading up to him passing. Just was like uh just a snowball of things. Um so we had moved out onto uh Acreage and um things were going really great. Girls were in a new school and um just getting things around as far as you know, building a life out there together. And he moved to State Patrol and he loved it. Um it was exactly what like you see, like the pride and just being able to support the other troopers, and it was definitely it's definitely a brotherhood. And it's amazing the brotherhood that's there, how they take care of each other. So um, you know, things don't happen overnight.

Jeff’s Service And The Slow Burn

SPEAKER_04 6:03

Yeah, you said five years, so can we let's go back to that if you don't mind because you know it was in 2020 when I uh the last time I went to kill myself and when God put this whole mission of starting 1042 on on um on my heart. Um at the time there was just really nothing. Um I'm losing my train of thought. I knew this is gonna happen. I'm gonna get emotional so much during this stuff, so it's all good. I know. Um, what was I saying?

SPEAKER_01 6:32

The five years that you're talking about. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 6:34

Go ahead. You go ahead, start off.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

No, I was just gonna say, when did you you start to notice like a shift?

SPEAKER_04 6:41

Yeah, like was it like a he so he went to work one day and came home different? Or it's a slow I always tell people it's a slow burn.

Home Life, Alcohol, And Disconnection

The Prom Night Incident And Red Flags

Traumatic Calls And Sleepless Nights

SPEAKER_00 6:47

It is a slow, painful burn. Yes. And so what I saw, like he would come home after a shift and have a really hard night. Um, he started using alcohol more um as a coping mechanism when he got off work. Um, but it wasn't always that, it was sometimes just being not present at home. Yeah. Either not present at home when he was there or not present, period. Like he would go and help other people, like to take his mind out of that space from his work. And and it's interesting because looking back, I can see how he was trying to protect me and our daughters from what was going on in him, in his head. Um and plus just family life and the regular things that would happen in a family were with what was going on at work and him not having the coping skills to take care of the higher cortisol levels in his head and the mental wellness checks um that needed to happen daily um were would cause him to then be angry and uh very difficult to live with at home because the stresses of just normal life felt like they were so threatening to him. So threatening. Everything was so threatening. Yeah. So even like COVID happened, right? For everybody, shutdown happened and um they were the guys had to be on the road still, even though you know there was the threat of like sharing COVID and all the stuff, right? They're still making traffic stops. So there was that ingrained fear in society, right? We're just gonna put it that way. Um, but then he would come home and the girls would have had to mask up for school, and um, they then closed school down. So my oldest daughter was in her uh senior year, and um they it was before prom happened that they closed school. So we chose to have um several parents and I chose to have prom out at our farm. And so collaboratively we got together and somebody brought a DJ equipment, somebody brought a tent, right? And somebody brought photography. It was amazing. And during that time, which should have been super celebratory. Um Jeff had been going through so much with work, and I had seen the change in him, and I'm kind of getting ahead of myself and my story because this is um just seven months before he passed. Um, he came in when I was doing the girls' hair, and he was just acting very strange, like he wanted my attention. Um, but at that point, I was like, I need to focus on the girls. This is their day. We should be excited for them, right? My youngest wasn't old enough to be in high school, but she got invited to go to the senior prom, right? And so both of them, it was just like this excitement, but he had a drink and he's like, I'm taking off. And he um, I believe that he had to work, it was the next day or that night. But he took off and he had a hard alcohol drink he took with him. And um I don't know where he went. And frankly, I was in a mindset that I was like, just go. Right, just go. This isn't about you today, just go. And um, because sometimes the energy that's brought with that is um it just takes the life out of everything, and it affects the entire family and the kids. And so I was go. And so he came back, it was probably an hour. He came back and he stood in the doorway to the bathroom, and he um I looked over at him and he had blood off of his lip and he was he looked beat up. Like he didn't have bruising, but he looked beat up. And I just looked at him and I'm like, what have you been doing? What's going on? And he goes, Well, I went and I went and got the shit kick it kicked out of me and I deserved it. And I was like, what? He goes, I went looking for a fight and I deserved it. And I just I could not believe what was going on. It's like what what in the world is going on? Because that's not your husband right now. No, yeah, that's not your husband. It was totally different person. It was so weird. And um, I was I just looked at him like okay, well, you don't have a concussion. You're gonna have to hold on a minute. I was getting ready to take the girls to the neighbors because they were gonna have the dinner. And so I left and he goes, Well, just so you know. And he all of a sudden switched into very logical brain, just boom. And he goes, just so you know, there's gonna be police here, I'm pretty sure when you get back. And I said, Okay, why what? And he goes, Well, there were several young men involved in this situation, and I'm pretty sure that they called the police and they're gonna come and get a statement from me. And I I left, I went and I was like, okay, whatever you need to deal with. I'm like, I just want you to know you're you're putting your job at risk, and I don't understand what's going on right now. So I came back and yep, there were officers in my house. And I walked in and Jeff was writing out a report, like, not unlike I've ever seen him write a report, right? I mean, he just writes the report like he needs to write a report, like it was a regular day. And um, they took him out on the outside the house and they took pictures because the people that he got in a fight with um got him on the ground and they actually, you know, broke a bottle over the back of his head. And um a good Samaritan came through this backwoods like waterway where they were at, because these people go down there and party and stuff. And a good Samaritan happened to come through, which I know God sent them and stopped the fight and got Jeff up. Um he doesn't know who it was, and I know that's that's who it was. So um, anyway, they took the report and I introduced myself to them. And Jeff was like, This is my wife, Lindy, and they took the report, and I just was standing in the kitchen going, somebody just asked me one question. How often, and how normal is it really? I'm gonna get a little sarcastic because I've been around officers and my husband was an officer for a long time. And how normal is it that you have to go get a statement from someone that is in in law enforcement that went out and got in a fight? Yeah, and it's not normal. There's nothing normal about it. And no one asked a question. And I was just in the kitchen, like somebody, I'm just like in their presence, like somebody just asked me one thing. I just wanna I wanna ask a question. I don't care what kind of difficulties it's gonna cause in my marriage, I just say it. Nobody said anything, and so it that's what happened then. Um, and I have more to talk about with that later on, about the effects of that um with how it was handled in in within his uh department. So that's in for another part of the conversation, but there were so many times that he would come home and share with me um something that happened uh when he was on duty. Um and it became more that he wasn't able to sleep well. Um he was trying to medicate with alcohol. Um I started asking him when it first started, and it didn't feel like he was getting answers um like with his within himself and his people that he was hanging out with. I started asking him if he would go to a counselor. And he told me no, he couldn't. He couldn't go because it would affect his job. And I couldn't understand that because my work, which was also uh a company that I worked for, was very pro-wellness. And he told me that he could lose his job. Um, if not lose his job, he would lose his credibility because they would say that he wasn't fit to work because he was not able to handle situations, which as things happened over the next couple of years, just the the logic of that was so uh paramount for me because um a couple times. So let me tell you about one of the situations. Um so he responded to a call. Uh there was another trooper already there, but he responded to a call that there was a uh man versus semi uh suicide, and it was uh a thunderstorm that was on one of the interstates, and uh the man had parked his vehicle on the other side of the road and walked across the media and knelt in front of a semi. Well, the semi-driver couldn't see him because of all the rain and uh it eviscerated the man and uh Jeff shared with me that uh this is at like three o'clock in the morning because he usually got off shift and came home and went to bed about one. But when he came to bed that night, he wasn't able to sleep and he didn't wake me up. I could feel him, I could feel the stress and the disquiet in him. And it woke me up and I'm like, hey, are you okay? And he said, No, I'm really not okay. And I had a really bad night, and I'm like, you want to talk about it? And that's when he shared that with me. He shared with me that uh he was responsible for uh walking the interstate and picking up little pieces of that human, that person that no longer is with us and putting them and he said, and he goes picking them up and collecting it, and I said, Okay, so and I'm trying to get him to talk about it, but I don't know what to say. And I'm like, so did you have like a body bag or something? Like like something that 'cause I know he he was so respectful of like he truly loved people stopped and got really angry and he said no. I had to put him in a five gallon bucket. That was Yeah, that was really there was so much about that that just uh, you know, broke him.

SPEAKER_04 18:38

No human is meant to face that to deal with that much drama.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

And I have to share that, that um that's something I've been saying for a long time, Daniel. No one, no matter what kind of training you go through in the academy as a law enforcement officer, and you do your duty, you stop people, you have those conversations, you take care of all these difficult situations. No one can ever be trained to handle that kind of situation.

SPEAKER_04 19:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:13

No one.

SPEAKER_04 19:14

No one and then but we act like we're supposed to be able to handle it.

SPEAKER_00 19:19

Everyone that isn't doesn't know what it the job is about believes that they don't even know. But they do they believe what they they don't know what they don't know, right? That's it. And so it's like, oh yeah, they're taking care of their job, they're doing the amazing things, go, go, go, right. And it's like all this adrenaline and go, and uh, and truly there's all these other things that are going on that affect people so deeply. And um, but it is part of the job, and it's uh it's real.

SPEAKER_04 19:53

It is, and you can ignore it. That's the thing. Gentry is when we try to when we we're dealing with like like for me, I just kept silent for all those years. And it just led to addictions, and that's why that's like what our organization does, there's power and community, there's power and talking like we're doing right now.

SPEAKER_01 20:09

Yes, there is.

SPEAKER_04 20:10

I mean, it matters.

SPEAKER_01 20:12

One question I have is um that incident that you're just talking about, how long did between the time that he committed suicide and that, how much time was there in between?

Anger, PTSD Triggers, And Family Impact

SPEAKER_00 20:23

I'm not sure. I think that was a that was within that five-year time frame. It was a couple years before. But when we look back at the report, the reports that were pulled of the just the situations that he told me about. Because unfortunately, the system that's used for the reports is very archaic. Like there's not a really good way to pull incidences because someone may have been involved in an incident, but there's no way to pull it because someone else wrote the report. Um, you would have to know specifically where it happened and that to actually mine that data out. So I'm just so thankful to God that he allowed me to hear those situations to use my voice this way because uh it wasn't something that he talked about to anybody. Like that incident, he only told to his very close, two of his close friends about it. Yeah. Or three. So um yeah, but there when looking at the reports, there were it was uh multitudes, like just monthly of not just regular traffic stops or but but ones that are trauma that are identified by the federal government as traumatic cases. Right, it wasn't just multiple deaths and things like that. So um, yeah, reporting like he um responded to a girl that was um that had um attempted suicide um off of the in an over over overpass. Um she was my girls' age. And so it was very hard. I mean it's hard anyway, but it's like hits differently because it's very close to what's going on in his life. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:20

Um so uh when Jeff passed, how old were the how old were the girls?

SPEAKER_00 22:26

Um my oldest was 18 and my youngest was 15.

SPEAKER_04 22:32

So was that incident with the with the fight? Was that the first time you realized or was that the first big event where you're like, whoa, like this is not my husband.

SPEAKER_00 22:41

So that was yeah, that was a really big, um, huge anger was my what in the world. But he actually had started becoming very angry, uh, very volatile about the this minuscule family things that are just for me as a as a mom, it's like, okay, that could just be a teaching opportunity. Um, but going from zero to you know 360 in a matter of just like a second, just boom, it would just flip. And like he would be in a great mood, and everybody's getting along in the house, and all of a sudden the energy would change, and it could just be a word, it could just be a look that somebody had, and just it would flip that uh PTSD switch, and um yeah.

Speaking Up, Real Help, And Culture

SPEAKER_04 23:29

And it does, it comes out of nowhere. Sometimes it comes like when you think you're doing the best, or sometimes it comes after you think you're doing good, and then all of a sudden, man, it just comes out of nowhere. Yeah, anger, like I think I said this before, but road rage was a big thing for me. When I literally, when I was off duty, like somebody would cut in front of me. I would I'd go, I'd drive an hour if I had to to find to follow them to their house and confront them and try to get like a here. I am a growing man trying to fight somebody over a road rage thing, and I'm supposed to be the pillar of the community. And it's like, but it was just anger. I don't even know what it was. It was like my whole world was out of control. I had control over this, and I was gonna make this dude pay for it. And it's just what and then like when I would leave that. Luckily they never called the cops or anything, but when I'd leave there, then I would like snap out of it, like, what in the world did I just do? Like, that's not who I am. But man, the enemy, man, he just comes in and it as soon as you think think you're feeling well, it's just like he just takes you out at the knees, especially when you're going through it silently and you're not telling anybody, um, because that's where the devil likes us in monologue, where we're keeping things inside of our own mind where he can and you know he can influence it. But as soon as we start talking out loud and we talk in dialogue, now we're talking, and so I then I would start to notice things I'd be saying out loud, like, you know, I need to kill myself because I'm not a good enough dad. Like when we say those things out loud, you hear yourself saying it and you're like, okay, like that's not that's not true, right? That's why it's important to talk out loud with somebody, and and for me, that's when I was able to to to open up because I was going through, I went for I was 40 years old until I opened before I opened up, that was six years ago. But once I started to open up and because I thought I was the only one going through it, and I'm sure Jeff did too. I'm sure he thought he was the only one going through it, because I thought I was the only one going through it, and I'm sure Jin True thought she was the only one going through it. Because you really do, but then when you start to talk to other to other actual other first responders, you realize that we actually do connect through our weaknesses and vulnerabilities, it's not through our strengths. And so many times as police officers, we put on our fake toughness, our fake face. Like we go to work, like when I go to work, I was fine at work because I could put on my fake face, I could put on my tough guy stuff. It was for me when I went off duty, when I went 1042, that was the code we used to go off duty. That's when everything came flooding in, and that's when I ran to the vices like alcohol. That's when I walked in and walked right by my my kids and my wife and went and got vodka and went upstairs. And that's not who I was because when I had my just like when Jeff had his badge pinned on him, I'm sure you probably remember that. I guarantee you, just like just like Jeff, just like me, when I had that badge pinned on, it was a great day in my life. I never thought in 14 years, I hope I'm addicted to hydrocotone pills, I hope I'm an alcoholic, I hope I'm going through a divorce, I hope I'm homeless living out of my truck. That wasn't my dream. But this job changes you and it slowly changes you. And when it starts to change you, when you're a first responder, it's hard to know where you can go to get help. And I could imagine Jeff dealt with that. Is where do I go?

SPEAKER_00 26:40

He didn't feel like he had anywhere to go.

Leadership, Trust, And “Leave It At The Door”

SPEAKER_04 26:42

Yeah. Because you feel like you're gonna lose your whole life if you speak up. Yeah, and that's a hope, that's a hopeless and a scary place to be in. It is, and for our listeners, I please reach out. You don't have to go through this alone. You don't. I went through it alone for all those years. It's a scary place to be. Please reach out if you are struggling. There is reaching out for help, it's not a sign of of weakness, it's a sign of wisdom. And you don't have to go through this by yourself. And what I mean is there's people in our organization, ambassadors, other people who have been through the things you're thinking that you're thinking inside your head. They've been through that and they've gotten some help and and they want to walk alongside you. And there's power in being able to mentor somebody that's that's going through that. Because that would have helped me, and imagine that would have helped your husband if he would have just had an organization or another first responder who you know was outside the organization. Just throw your arm around him, Jeff, and say, Hey, I see you're struggling, buddy. You don't have to go through this alone. Why don't you and I go? You know, we so often, gentry, we run to alcohol when we get together. That's why is that so accepted? We run to alcohol when we do that, but when you can remove the alcohol away from and actually sit down with somebody who gets it. Because if Jeff and I could have sat down, we don't have to inherently we don't have to explain the the gross stuff and all that stuff. We can inherently understand each other of like we can skip all that and be like, How are you doing? Like, how are you really doing? Because it's the fear of losing the job, it's the fear of you know, you struggle of as a of being enough. And especially as as a guy, when you're struggling at work and you don't feel enough that you're enough at work, you start to feel then you start to feel like you're not enough at home as a dad and as a husband, and when you don't feel like you're enough in those three categories, you're a man with no purpose, and it's pretty scary. Um did Jeff reach out, did he try um reaching out as far as did he try counseling? Did he try any of that, or was he kind of like me and just kept it to himself?

SPEAKER_00 28:44

And so I'm listening to the things you're sharing, Daniel, and there's so many things that are resonate in the in Jeff and my story. And um, but Jeff, he never reached out for counseling um because he, like I said, he didn't feel like he was supported in that, that he would lose his job, he would lose credibility as a law enforcement. Um and um I can tell you that after the incident that I shared, that he went and um got in got in a fight um because he felt that that's what he needed. Um I know he was crying out for help with that. Um he told me that he would get called in by his leadership and uh he might lose his job because of it, though he was off duty. It's a reflection of the badge, right? I mean, you're to be that person on and off duty, and um and it's not okay to go beat people up or get beat up either, right? I mean, there's other there's something else that needed to happen, but I'm talking about this one situation, right? So um His leadership did call him in and they did have a conversation with him. And I can tell you when he came home, the things he said to me about that conversation, that he was told uh they went over what the report was, um, how it was written, what was said, the things that Jeff had put in the report, which obviously were very cleaned up um law enforcement speak report, right?

SPEAKER_04 30:28

I mean threat, adjust, yeah, like yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:32

Very tactical, describe you know, drove at a higher rate of speed than normal. I mean, things like that. Um, I read it and I just shook my head when I read it because he he was telling the truth, but he wasn't telling everything, right? So um because he didn't I don't know, I believe that he was crying out for help, but didn't know how to do that. And so anyway, when he was he came home, he told me that uh his leadership had shared with him that they got the report, they went over it with him, that he was off duty, but that it reflects on the law enforcement agency. Um and he's like, uh, yeah, so I might just lose my job. And he didn't just say my job. Um he said, uh, they want me to leave this the shit at the door.

SPEAKER_04 31:26

There, I hit the B button. A little too late.

SPEAKER_00 31:32

A little late, good job. Um, but leave it at the door. Um, leave it at the door of home when you go home. You leave it at the door.

SPEAKER_04 31:42

Yeah, it's that easy.

Peer Support Limits And Better Options

SPEAKER_00 31:43

And you leave the shit at the door when you go to work and you put your badge on. You that's what you do.

SPEAKER_04 31:50

Like we have switches.

SPEAKER_00 31:51

Pull your pants on and just man up. And that's what he got told. Can can I ask a question? They also let him know that there's counseling available.

SPEAKER_02 32:00

Oh, yeah. Just so you know. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:02

I mean, it was it was put on the table, and but the culture and gentry, and we've talked about this a little bit. There is a need for culture change, and it's not everybody, but there are pockets of leaders that it's very apparent that that culture is is uh traumatic to individuals. It has to change it has to change. It has to change.

SPEAKER_04 32:26

That's it has to change. We will speak from the mountaintop until it does this can't keep happening. Go ahead, gentry.

SPEAKER_01 32:31

The the one question I had was that meeting that he had that you and I talked about. And at any point, did any of the supervisors or anybody look at him just like dead in the eye and be like, Are you okay? Like, do you want to talk? Do you want to have a cup of coffee? Like, are you okay?

SPEAKER_00 32:50

So that's a really good question, Gentry. And I can't answer that because I wasn't there. Um, he never shared that with me, but I also knew my husband really well. And he would think that was a bunch of bullshit. He wouldn't have believed it. Oh no. I don't, yeah, I don't blame him. He knew he would tell me he he he shared with me the people that he knew were truly um coming from their heart when they would when they would support and everything. Um, but he couldn't trust it. Right. And at that point, his the PTSD was so complex that there was no trust in any of that. And then he would see things like from that conversation he had with his leadership and then with other people that he saw. And when you see things like that, how it makes it really difficult to trust the organization and what they're actually saying. Um, it's all it's very important to have trust in an organization, right?

SPEAKER_04 33:46

Yeah, and it's it's I mean, you heard me say this before. I truly believe that in-house help is fake help. I think in-house peer support is fake help. I know it's helped some people, um, but I think it's a it's something that the administrations we we they have it so they can tell the public that they have it. Um most in-house peer supports aren't working because you can't go in there and say, hey, I have a you can't be real, you can't be real.

SPEAKER_00 34:10

And I yeah, I gotta say that you know there's some of that, Daniel, that I see. And I've talked to several people since Jeff passed and different groups, and there are groups that it's actually it really is real. And but that's great. I can tell you that they're making steps here in Iowa with the organization that we're a part of. Um, however, it's got a ways to go, and there's a lot of trust and change that has to happen.

SPEAKER_04 34:37

Yeah, and we're not trying to throw anybody under the bus. We're not naming names. We are not saying that whatsoever. Like we're not, this is not a bash against the state or the administration. We're just saying this has got to change because we we eat our own. We are so hard on each other. We just one person struggles and we just we we boycott them, we act like we don't know who they are, and uh it's I think too with with the in-house peer support stuff, like because he he felt when so many people feel like they're gonna lose their jobs and stuff if they they speak out and ask for help.

Building Resilience And Part Two Tease

SPEAKER_01 35:09

And I think that the the in-house stuff, the in-house peer support organizations are so it's just so hard because you don't that's where that feeling comes from. Like you feel like you're not it's not gonna be left there. Like you leave there, your supervisors are all gonna know what you're going through, everything.

SPEAKER_04 35:25

And so it just well, because you know it everybody just talks, you know, and it's different when you're and I I I encourage people to go to your in-house peer support. It helps people, but I'm just saying that what I tell people is if that's if that's the only one thing, if you're only gonna reach out one time and it and you reach out and it's it's in-house peer support, please don't let that be the last time you reach out. If that doesn't work, that's okay, and it's kind of normal. Um but there's other organizations like ours that have we're outside peer support organization where when we talk it's you know 100% confidential and it's nobody is in the room that's trying to get promoted over you or anything like that. So it can be tough.

SPEAKER_00 36:03

And it's so important to have more than just a peer support though in a program. You have to have you have to have the ability to build resilience and have that wellness physically an outlet for all that to get those, and I talked about it before, cortisol levels into a healthy range. Yeah. Because otherwise it's causes scarring and it is harder and harder to get back.

SPEAKER_04 36:26

It is. It's ugly. So let's go ahead and close out this episode and we're gonna do another episode with Lindy and we're gonna talk about um your husband's death and we'll kind of go over that because we need I wanna I just want to we need to be able to have this conversation because I know that there's a lot you want to share from your journey and and um the scary dark time that um luckily you had God through, it sounds like I did, and uh so we'll jump into that a little bit on the next episode. Um but thanks for tuning in, guys. Um we're gonna stay out here at the ranch and record another one, so next week will be the part two of this episode. So thanks for tuning in, and we'll see you next week.