Ted Lasso | S3 Ep11 Part4 "Mom City"

The Tedcast is a deep dive podcast exploring the masterpiece that is Ted Lasso on Apple TV+.

Sponsored by Pajiba and The Antagonist, join Boss Emily Chambers and Coaches Bishop and Castleton as they ruminate on all things AFC Richmond.

Boss Emily Chambers
Coach Bishop
Coach Castleton

NOTE: HERE'S THE LINK FOR NEXT EPISODE'S HOMEWORK!  WAYNE ON YOUTUBE.

Chapters

• 0:22 Ted Lasso Season 3 Episode 11
• 8:45 Sleeping Arrangement Dilemma and Family Dynamics
• 19:33 Varied Rules and Inconsistencies
• 23:43 Analysis of Ted's Approach and Relationships
• 37:10 Toxic Relationships and Setting Boundaries
• 47:03 Trojan War Lessons and Personal Growth
• 55:14 Exploring Boundaries and Personal Growth
• 1:09:53 Coexisting and Discussing Personal Impact
• 1:23:04 Diverse Conversations and Anecdotes
• 1:29:19 Nate's Role and Personal Fulfillment
• 1:35:48 Discussion on Identity and Status
• 1:45:43 Ted Lasso and Future Plans Discussion
• 1:51:55 Passion, Community, and Support

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:22

Welcome to our Ted Lasso talk, the Tedcast. Welcome all Greyhound fans, welcome all you sinners from the dog track and all the AFC Richmond fans around the world. It's the lasso way around these parts with Coach, coach and Boss, without further ado, coach Castleton.

Speaker 3: 0:39

Okay, welcome back everyone, happy to have you here with us today as we discuss season three, episode 11, mom City. This is part four in our continuing saga to bring you all the finest minutia from the Ted Lasso series. I am your host, coach Castleton. With me, as always, is Coach Bishop. What's going on, coach? Hey, coach, coach, you seem to be having some, some technical glitches, and so I want to just inform everybody that you know, mostly people tune in to hear you. That's that's number one reason, coach Bishop, that is number one. One of our friends tweeted at us last night about starting a Fannie's football podcast and I said you know, we have to work out the glitches and by that I mean coaches, terrible personality and we have to figure out how to work around that Well, listen.

Speaker 1: 1:37

if people listen to me, that makes this the upside down in my life. So let's do it.

Speaker 3: 1:42

Right, exactly, it's unbelievable, the things you can't teach your kids to do. But coach, you're going to go in and out, most likely. And so, folks, if you, if you coach will will, hopefully, hopefully, this will work. It's not going to wood, but if, for some reason, the internet, gods forsake us, coach will pop in and out as he, as he can. With coach and myself, we have the illustrious, the one and only our boss.

Speaker 2: 2:16

I feel like you're setting me up for failure with that.

Speaker 2: 2:18

You're hyping me up too much especially because I need to start this podcast with an apology, another apology for talking shit about another place. I talked shit about Alabama and Montgomery set me straight. And I talked shit about St Paul, Minneapolis and how they had to hold hands and I said a lot of derogatory things and Buttercup Janna emailed to say, hey, dipshit, follow a guy you don't actually like to a city in the middle of winter when it is in Minnesota and expect you're going to find the best it has to offer. I am sure if I went back now it would be wonderful and I would be proven wrong, like many things in my life. So I apologies around for that. I should not have talked shit about Prince's homeland. That was wrong of me. It is a wonderful place.

Speaker 3: 3:07

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 3:09

If nothing else.

Speaker 3: 3:11

I respect, just for Prince.

Speaker 1: 3:14

The fact that a Buttercup stepped up to get that all straightened out. I mean this, like this is becoming the only world I really want to exist in. Listen, the police will pull me over and I'll be like what?

Speaker 3: 3:27

are you king of the Buttercups? Get out of here the Buttercups are amazing, and that is not atypical.

Speaker 3: 3:35

We have been communicating with so many Buttercups and it is wonderful. We urge everyone to join the Buttercups because it's a better place. It's a better place. And, boss, I just want to say that I really appreciate you. You're always willing to just just just reevaluate your positions on things, not always, but in many cases where you haven't like drawn a very hard line, like your attraction to Pablo Shriver or David Allen Greer I can't remember his name. What's his name?

Speaker 1: 4:09

David Allen Greer, that is very specific. I threw out David Allen.

Speaker 3: 4:14

Greer, because I think your dude has Jeremy Allen.

Speaker 2: 4:16

Yes, Jeremy Allen White. What's his name?

Speaker 3: 4:20

I heard I had a middle name right and I have now decided that you're in love with David Allen Greer. So, yeah, obviously, that's how cousin names work. Yeah, no, that's true.

Speaker 2: 4:30

But you can. Actually it's not a mnemonic device, but his name on shameless was Lip and his initials in real life are jaw. So just everything about the man's mouth should tell you what they've named him to either jaw or lip.

Speaker 3: 4:50

So crazy. What I was getting at, though, was that's so crazy. Yeah, that's just crazy. Yeah, that's crazy. I was getting at a boss. I just really appreciate you being a terrorist and not judgmental. We saved that for buttercups like Janna, who, as we've said before, from another buttercup, elizabeth, who informed us buttercups, while beautiful, are also poisonous, and so I really love the duality of that, and I appreciate you just sort of owning. We look at this and we say, oh, I followed a man to another city. Now, 20 years later, watch me shit on the city and not realize I'm just projecting my all of my mistakes on some other.

Speaker 3: 5:40

Oh yeah, and I look at you and I see you're so what's the word? You're so. My God, I'm dying over here, I am dying over here.

Speaker 2: 5:57

I just I need everyone to know because we haven't been able to record like visually record podcasts yet. But poor Castleton is in the middle trying so hard to be nice and to come up with the words, and coach and I are not coming to his rescue, Like we are just sitting at all Expectedly.

Speaker 1: 6:14

Just like come on.

Speaker 2: 6:15

What's the word? What are you?

Speaker 1: 6:17

looking for.

Speaker 2: 6:18

What are you? How are you trying to compliment?

Speaker 1: 6:19

me right now.

Speaker 2: 6:20

You tell me.

Speaker 1: 6:24

That's how you got yourself turd around. I was entirely too long of a stretch of complimenting the boss, like, first of all, you sort of all the way into my lane on that one and you didn't even know what you got there. You're like what the hell do I do from here? I'm saying nice things, but I'm talking to the boss.

Speaker 2: 6:44

What's happening? I think what you're getting at is I've got no principles. I think is what you're looking for.

Speaker 3: 6:53

That's what it is. Yeah, yeah, no, thank you. I was just going to say, just morally.

Speaker 2: 7:00

I was dedicated to hating on the entire state of Minnesota for 20 solid years and then one time, one person, rightly was, like you, sure about that and completely changed my mind. Now I'm finished. I like that. I like that. You're suggestible.

Speaker 3: 7:18

It's really good quality to have, especially as we try to be flexible and as we are. We're very slowly approaching the finish line of Ted Lasso season three. Where we left off last time was Ted is hiding at the pinball machine the Wizard of Oz pinball machine at the crown and anchor. It's that moment where, oh, I didn't know, you were almost the drummer in Coldplay. So we know, okay, based on the stories that Doddy is telling, which was, oh, he danced on stage with Bruce Springsteen is what she told everyone. And then we found that it was. He did something at someone's bar mitzvah, right? He's saying Bruce Springsteen or something, right? So you know, I didn't know you're almost a drummer in Coldplay. The truth is probably he once heard Coldplay or something.

Speaker 1: 8:13

Yes, right, absolutely.

Speaker 3: 8:16

And Doddy says it's true, and Ted doesn't even bother to, he doesn't like valid, he just toasts with his beer and goes back with a really pained expression. The type of strenuous, uncomfortable expression people usually save for visits to the restroom is what Ted has on. That's the countenance. Yeah, that's fair. And then we all said then we finished the night and now we're with Ted in his apartment. It starts with I can't take your bed, teddy Boss, will you start walking us through this please?

Speaker 2: 8:51

Yeah, absolutely. This is the same way that she said oh, I can't go to practice and I can't all the other things she can't do. Oh, I can, I'm just going to stay in the hospital, it'll be fine. I can't take your bed, teddy Mom. It's okay, all right, I'll just sleep on the couch. No, I'll sleep on the couch. Well then, I'm going to sleep on the floor next to you on the couch, and neither of us is going to use the bed, please. Thank you, okay. This is one of those things where you are familiar enough with the person that you will sleep in the same place, that you will give them your bed, that you are not uncomfortable with that person putting their body on the sheets that your body touched, but it is uncomfortable enough that you are going to have this dance where you pretend that you aren't going to take the bed from them, like it's a weird juxtaposition of being extremely close so you can't be as close as you would like to be.

Speaker 3: 9:46

Does this seem familiar? Very, if you insist, yes.

Speaker 2: 9:50

I mean familiar in the technical sense of the word, as in with family members.

Speaker 3: 9:58

See, I don't think anyone's ever liked me enough to offer me a good bed, in any version of what that might entail, including any lascivious version. I'm just trying to think like Best fodder. I'm just trying to think like, okay, you know we touched on the good boy element of this and I'll tell you like there's an element here that I'm tuning into, coach, and you can see if you can back me up on this or if you or maybe it's different for you, maybe it's presenting a little differently, but it's like I can't take your bed, teddy, and it's like almost exasperating. It's like I will never, ever take that bed while you're here. Like right.

Speaker 1: 10:37

Not only were you the one that instilled this.

Speaker 3: 10:39

Right, what are we talking about? I don't even want to have this conversation. Like, if I have to threaten to sleep on the floor next to the couch, that's what I'll do, like the one thing that'll never happen, due to the way I was raised and the values that I have.

Speaker 1: 10:54

You right by you.

Speaker 3: 10:56

I will never, ever do that. It's utterly unthinkable. Why are we having this conversation? Is that that ring true to?

Speaker 1: 11:04

you it does and actually as will happen. On.

Speaker 3: 11:09

Are you texting somebody, coach? I am actually not. Now I'm going to stick it to you, like when I throw it to you and you're looking down, look, look, look.

Speaker 1: 11:20

Yeah, this is. I'm going to tell you exactly what I was doing, sir. I was doing a Google search for some lyrics that came to mind, but I didn't want to do it on my temperamental fucking computer here because it's being a total asshole. So I will now share with the audience, and not with you, but with boss Boss you can let him know when I'm done.

Speaker 1: 11:43

You can let him know when I'm done making this point, because this point, you know what you get? None of this point, none, you get none. This is only for boss and the buttercups. You are excluded, sir. No, but I? It made me think of Alanis Morissette. Perfect and when it's.

Speaker 1: 12:06

I just kept hearing. Be a good girl Like I, just as you were describing that whole scene, that moment in the song. Be a good girl, try a little harder. Those of you who are unfamiliar with the Lanis Morissette perfect, it's on that jagged little pill album. I'm embarrassed to say that, as much as I absolutely adored that album, I am woefully ignorant of her other music and that's a hundred percent my bad. But that album was genius and the feeling there is in the scene with Ted, it feels like this. It's the frustration that's built into it too Like is this inconvenient? Yeah, it's fucking inconvenient. You could have let me know you were coming. I could have set things up, I could have figured out what was going on.

Speaker 1: 12:57

But you came here. You slept in a fucking hospital. You show up on the bench my way to work. There's a whole God there, just when you get in the bed and knock it off and that's like and so even though he's being a good boy, he's doing it stamping his feet. Because this is, you know, the frustration of having had this pressure on him constantly, of being a good boy, of pretending it's all okay, he cannot for a moment express to his mother at all that this is frustrating, which of course it fucking is.

Speaker 1: 13:32

This is insane. The whole thing is like it's chaos. You're a chaos agent.

Speaker 3: 13:39

His life right now, but he can't express any of it. That is exactly right. Chaos.

Speaker 1: 13:44

No, no, no, Not. Yes, I told you I'm not speaking on this point.

Speaker 3: 13:49

I will go back to penalty box and feel shame.

Speaker 2: 13:54

No, but yeah, I actually love so much that you said you show up on the bench because she was doing that in a way so that she wouldn't be a big issue. So that she's just going to be in his neighborhood and if she runs into them they can hang out. Oh, fancy me.

Speaker 2: 14:08

I don't want to put you out. So I don't want to ask if I could stay your place. I'm just going to be around and inconvenient you in other ways, like the fact that you said he could have gotten things set up. I, as established, I'm a planner. One time a buddy of mine was flying through O'Hare, his connecting flight was canceled and so we were going to go out to dinner and he gave me as much warning as he could. But he's going to be in my apartment and I was like I need to clean everything that's ever existed. Like six hours of panic, sweating, because I'm like, holy shit, what are you doing to your baseboards that they're like this and why have you not corrected it before? And that's not your parent, that's not somebody that you're like trying to make sure thinks the best of you. So, yeah, I would have. If somebody showed up out of nowhere and they were like I'm just going to come into your house now, I would jump out the back window Like I absolutely could not do that with them.

Speaker 1: 15:05

I get it. I get it. I like that feeling too of like. There's also a piece of like how I want to present. So it's a little bit interestingly. I wouldn't have connected these ideas, but since we've been to Nate's childhood bedroom and sort of watch mom, you know, bring him food and poke in her head, and dad just show up over his shoulder, it's a little bit like your parents, like walking in on you, changing after you're just too old to that shit.

Speaker 1: 15:37

Right, Like it's like hold on, Like this is my apartment, Like now he's like totally on deep. He's like whoa, whoa, like whatever I might have around, like I'm a grown man, this is my space. I might need a minute to just get shit together here Like this is what's intended to be a space here with my mom right now. So yeah, I think there's. Yeah. I like that energy of like now I've got to clean and I don't have an opportunity to clean.

Speaker 3: 16:03

I am allowed to talk Pretty sparse, okay, yeah, I am allowed to talk coach.

Speaker 1: 16:10

All right, you're out of the penalty box, which I understand because of you. Thank you.

Speaker 3: 16:15

I do love that. I would say that I love what you're saying. Everything you're saying is 100 percent right. And here's the thing, the dynamic. Okay, I'll give an example.

Speaker 3: 16:25

I have one of my sons on the spectrum, developmentally delayed, so he tends to go through things emotionally at a rate that is more consistent with a younger child. So if he's 11, he'll go through things the way a six or seven-year-old would. Now he's 19, he's going through things in certain ways, not everything in his life, but certain things where he's 13 or 14. And I've always told him I don't want you to rubber stamp what I say to you. Like if I say, if you say what's your opinion on this, I have actually stopped telling my opinion on things because he will then parrot it and I'm like no, no, you're going to. You have to realize I'm an idiot.

Speaker 3: 17:03

Like there's a line from Bull Durham Miles quote where, when I was young enough to not understand it, it was Crash Davis behind the mound, sorry, crash Davis behind the home plate. And he runs up and he sees Nukleleush, the pitcher, who is like really tense, and he says what's wrong? What's going on? This Nukes a great pitcher and he's got him like pitching well, he's ah, my dad's here, don't look and crash, of course. Turns and looks and sees the dad with one of those video cameras that used to go on the shoulder Fantastic and he waves, crash, waves and he goes. What do you mean? Hey, he goes.

Speaker 3: 17:38

Listen man, he's your old man.

Speaker 3: 17:41

He's as full of shit as anyone and I know I think I talked about this season one for those who are long-term listeners he's as full of shit as anyone. When you're little and you can't process it, you're like, don't fucking talk about my own. I can say my dad's full of shit, which I never will because I'm too young to realize it but you can't say that those are fighting words at some point until you either realize he says full of shit as anyone or you become a dad and you know you're as full of shit as anyone. So, rather than I try to not have my kids suffer this and hear all these terrible parenting stories like, oh, dad's bragging about all their victories and stuff, and I always love to tell them all my defeats and all my things where I totally blew it, because I want them to not be afraid of mistakes in life, and so there's this thing where, like I go back, getting back to my son, I say you know, I want you to think on your own, I want you to come up with something.

Speaker 3: 18:38

I want you to say no, dad I actually don't agree with that, because my whole job, I want you to be smarter than me. I want you to train me. I don't you know what I mean. I've given you everything I know and at some point it is very natural biologically you are supposed to disagree with me. That is biologically programmed so that it forces you to leave the home and go out. You're like I don't want to live under this idiot's rules anymore and I'm like I want you to have that because that is biologically appropriate, right, like it's also true. You know what I mean. Like I want you to be better and smarter and more advanced than I am. I'm just doing the best I can. I'm as full of shit as anyone, and so you know.

Speaker 3: 19:17

This moment, with Ted and Doddy in the room, what's hard about it for me is I'm not going to say it's like you trained me a certain way. Now you're sort of playing with. Like in this flat, I am the law and the law that I'm enacting is the law. You taught me that after many, many he's been on his own for a while, he's got his own wife and family. He's been able to either use her rules or the rules of his family, as he grew up with or not. He could have changed them and said no, in this house we all wear our shoes in the house. He could have changed them to whatever rules he wants and he has settled on the fact that if your mom is in the house, then she gets the bed, which is like a rule that she would agree with and then he, but it takes him to say please.

Speaker 3: 20:00

He has to say neither of us can use that and he goes please, okay, he has to beg her to stop. And then she goes, thank you. And he says okay. And you feel like, okay, finally, like we have some, we have some agreement. Okay, this is your house, I'll respect your rules. Thank you, ted. And then he goes to swing her bag onto the bed and what does she say? Boss, not on the bed. And he just pulls it right back. So now it's not his rules anymore. And I'm like, oh my God, that's the thing that kills me. It's like it has to be your rules, or you know. I mean like it's this variability thing where that kills people because it's exhaust, you don't know where you stand and then subconsciously it just feels frenetic and sort of laid with self-doubt.

Speaker 1: 20:46

Whatever, whatever you like, we're not fat.

Speaker 2: 20:49

Yes.

Speaker 1: 20:50

Whatever you like, we're not fat. And also this.

Speaker 2: 20:53

This is another one of the flags that I would like to plant when we get to the end of the episode and there's discussion to be had, because this is probably the second time at least second where we've seen Dottie say something and then do exactly the thing that she was just criticizing In the bar when she said you know how Ted is never taken anything for himself and always given for other people and then immediately was like oh, you don't need to do that for me. And in this case it was oh, no, no, no, like definitely I don't get to make the rules. And then immediately, oh wait, I get to make the rules. Like immediately, going back on her word yes, that's the whole.

Speaker 3: 21:30

That's the whole. You know what? To close the anecdote I went to visit my son at college last year and he had been living on his own for you know, six months, or not even four and a half months, something like that. And then I had set something up in his room when I left him, when I moved him in and I was in August, and then he I don't know something got moved. So I started like just tidying up a little bit and I moved something like this clock or something, and he's like what? He's like what are you doing?

Speaker 3: 21:53

He gave me a little attitude. He's like I'd like it there. And then, and I was like so I had this moment and then he, he saw me, he goes, ah, shit. And he saw me get this huge smile on my face. I was like, yeah, I love it. Then that's where it'll go. You know what I mean If you like it there. And I like chest bumped him and he is laughing and he's like get away. You're weird. I'm like I love it, I'm something really wrong with you. But I'm like that's, that's you have. You want to get to that point where, yes, I respect your space and I'd love that you have a position on it. And this again, this variability that we see with Dottie is oh my.

Speaker 3: 22:30

God, it is exhausting. So, boss, keep us rolling here please. Hey, I brought you something.

Speaker 2: 22:38

Hey, I brought you what on the off chance we'd bump into each other, and she said, no, it's Clippen's from back home. She said, oh. He says oh, I thought you'd want those because it seemed really funny to me. Have I mentioned the story about David Cideris getting accommodation in rural France? I want to say, like in Normandy, it's so funny.

Speaker 2: 23:03

He is a New York Times bestselling author with a number of published books and is very famous and is doing a show in Chicago in the next couple of weeks that I can't get tickets to, unfortunately, where he and Henry Rollins interview each other and it's going to be fucking amazing. He is a famous author. He has had some of his stories turned into movies and TV shows and then on podcasts, and a small town in France where he lives with his husband gave him accommodation because when he would go on his extremely long walks in the French countryside he would pick up the trash and they were like hey, we want to recognize your good work and it's similar to me, to that. Ted is on TV in England and his mom is like here we are, from the Kansas City Herald. I have this little clip for you. It's so like, even though I know that she has a problem. So cute and nice that she does this, wait, wait wait, I hadn't.

Speaker 3: 24:00

Sorry guys, no, no, no, no. I think it is possibly cute and nice, but the article on the top.

Speaker 2: 24:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that is true.

Speaker 3: 24:09

The article on the top is it feels like when you have somebody like this. Remember, I said everything is like a Sun Tzu, like role play thing, with people who feel like they have to, where everything's got an angle. Oh yes, you know, and Ted is no different, ted's, I don't think Ted is very different than this.

Speaker 3: 24:28

No, no, he does the same thing, but he does it for good, like he's, like he does it in the name of good, and daddy probably doesn't name neutral. I don't think she's evil, but like we're talking about an alignment grid, like Ted knows the push to get people where he needs to get him, but the goal is to get them where he needs to get them, because he knows the plan.

Speaker 1: 24:49

But I think, yes, yes, and I think everything you just said, I think daddy does it in the name of what she'd prefer. Now, what she'd prefer is perhaps nice, good fun, family embracing, whatever, but is what she'd prefer? I actually do think in some way that Ted has trained himself whatever to do it in the name of, as far as I can see, what's best for you. So like if you needed to sell me out to the newspaper, obviously that's some shit you needed to do. I'm not quite sure how we got there, but I'm going to let you walk around through my office, be in the Diamond Dogs meetings, whatever, till you figure out, until we figure out what the hell's going on here, but it's because you're obviously in this moment of growth or whatever it is. That's about you there. I think he does. I think, and sometimes in a way that I find unhealthy, as somebody who I'll share this piece because I've been such a veiled and secretive person to this point, but seriously, recently in my own therapy, I'll share this that we have been working on how do you center your needs, which seems simple enough. I'm old as shit. You would think I'd figure that out a while back, but I haven't. And so there are moments I look at Ted and there are some ways in which I connect to Ted that I'm like Ted.

Speaker 1: 26:38

I got a guy you could call if at some point Doc is busy with our new team, because he's pretty good at this part and he needs to be able. He's as indirect as she is. What do you mean? On the off chance we bump into each other, that is an angry fucking life. Yes, we can throw it away as like a funny little quip, but that is as much F you as something we're going to see in a while. And on the off chance that I was going to see you. That is an angry, angry line. And he is also not able to be direct with her because what he needs to say is the shit he needs to say to her, but he can't because he's being a good boy. So we're back to the land is.

Speaker 2: 27:29

Yeah, and I like how much you're making this point and the way that you are. My only thing that I'm going to push back a little bit is I think we see later in this episode an instance where Ted pushes somebody in a way, not because he is waiting for them to figure it out, but because Ted thinks this is what you're supposed to be doing. So I'm just going to push you into what you're doing.

Speaker 1: 27:53

Yes, and when we get there we should discuss it. I think that's an interesting, at least potential distinction. But yeah, I see what you're saying. I think generally that's his driver.

Speaker 3: 28:07

I agree. I would agree with both of you. I think throughout the show we see Ted being completely you centric and this is what they say about oh, dottie says this to. Oh, he helps everybody else and they'll worry about, which is what Dottie seems to be as well, but it doesn't. It's like that has a as a universal people pleaser, that there's a shelf life on that man. Eventually, you start to get real, build a little resentment Instead of being like, really like I'm trying to model this behavior, like why isn't anyone matching me as well? Because you're not demanding, you know, like I fully own my. You know we joke about how even my I said oh, I have a fantasy that you guys host the tonight show together and I'm pissed off and you know, watching a TV at home and I get fired and coaches, like even your fucking fantasies are with you, getting screwed. It's like, yeah, yeah, that's right.

Speaker 1: 28:58

Like I had all of that.

Speaker 3: 29:00

I mean we, yeah, we talk about how, in every environment I'm in, people love nothing better work environments, family, like then seeing me, like you know, making fun of me and joking around and like if I lose we play. We all go play darts. And I lose at darts Everyone's going to be thrilled, it'll be fun. Coach was just with me recently at our fantasy football draft and they announced right before they start how many years it's been since I've won. Like they don't say it about everybody else, they just say it about me.

Speaker 2: 29:31

Two twists a night.

Speaker 3: 29:32

So I go okay, that's, that's a, it's, it's a. You know, there's a couple of ways to approach things like that. You can say I'll put yourself in victimization and you say, oh, why is everybody? You know the world's out to get me, but it's like no, you have a part. I clearly have a part in that. I am clearly designing some narrative where I am placing myself in a martyr role. Or, oh, look at me, I can be so wonderful to everybody else and I don't demand anything else. That's horseshit. It's horseshit. And and it's so easy to be in that horseshit and not know that you're the one shoveling the horseshit and you know what I mean, Coach, you hear me nodding size one.

Speaker 1: 30:11

I say cosine, cosine, cosine, cosine.

Speaker 3: 30:15

Yeah, Everything you just said, and it's all over this. It's all over this relation, it's all over Ted's life, it's all over this relationship. It's all over how each one of them treat everyone else and and why there's this sort of gorge of it's not mistrust, because that's not the right word, it's gorge of it's. It's like they can't be honest. Yes, it's not dishonesty, but it's the inability to get too honesty. Somehow they can't break right. What. What is it, boss? Do you have a word?

Speaker 1: 30:46

for it. Yeah, go, go ahead, boss.

Speaker 2: 30:49

I don't have a word, I'm sorry, I don't have the word either, but what I was actually thinking is one of the things that I want to discuss at length later is this idea that one of Ted's methods for getting people and not to follow the last away, but his implementation of it is he doesn't have any boundaries. He eventually wears down the people around him so that they have as few boundaries as he does. If everybody's being nice to each other, that could work as an ecosystem. Like none of us are going to have any boundaries, we're going to do all for everybody all the time, and because everybody is doing for each other, that kind of works, the problem is outside of that ecosystem. It doesn't work and you don't have any defenses then for people who will continually take as long as you're giving Like and I actually I am not a people pleaser, but I do a similar thing in a lot of my relationships where I'm like if you need it, I will show up, like I don't care, if it is possible, I will do it.

Speaker 2: 31:50

I don't, that's fine, you don't need to do anything back, but someday I will come to you and I will ask you for something, and if you cannot give me that thing that I need. At that point we are done being friends, like if I continually give to you and I ask you for something back and you say no, then we're done, and I try not to do that anymore.

Speaker 3: 32:09

Yeah, yeah, I'm so terrified. So, coach, like she's saying this and I'm like that was so, don Corleone.

Speaker 2: 32:16

That I was like yes, no, I know God and I know that I do it and that's why I try to not do it, and it's also why I try to address it with people where I'm like I have this habit, where, like, I get pissed off and then I decide I'm done with this friendship because you didn't show up for me. It's not, that's not good. I think a better boundary is I am giving you as much as I feel comfortable giving you and I will not ask you for anything in return, because I feel okay with this. This is not a barter system.

Speaker 1: 32:43

It's interesting because the similarity. There are differences in what we're each describing and certainly in what coach and I are describing. Compared to what you're describing, boss, I am actually much more struck by the similarities and there's actually I'm going to use a word that's probably it feels a little more negative or evil than what I actually mean, but I'm not finding it. There's a bit of manipulation to it, right? Or maybe more than a bit right, which is like okay for me, I'll speak for myself. The world's big and scary and chaotic. I know people do really mean and hurtful shit. So here's what I'll do world. I'll do a bunch of nice shit and then you all do a bunch of nice shit, and then I won't get hurt, right. But it does mean that some part of my doing has the built in desire or expectation or pressure, right? So if, in a way, to sort of mirror what you were saying, if I show up for you, am I on some level setting up that, that, that that debt, right? Like, oh, you now, you now, you now. Oh, I need you to do a thing and I did a thing. So you know the fact that you think you can't do it, that's your fucking problem, like I already, I already did my thing, so you're fucked, but it's kind of like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What are we doing here? And it's a real, it's a real thing.

Speaker 1: 34:27

I do think that. I do think that, and God, we're going to get to the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the you were pointing us toward, and I think it really comes up there because, just because I decide to do a magnanimous thing, like we coach mentioned the, the fantasy draft, which we've only mentioned, I don't know 185 times. And so, for those of you who missed it, there was a fantasy for four draft and but one guy who's relatively new to the group he's a little younger than the rest of us, so like, like, I find myself saying I like that kid, which is absolutely ridiculous. He's a grown man and I shouldn't say that, but that's like kind of the vibe a little bit with him, and and he brought gifts. He brought these like baseball cards to everybody and I assume those weren't there to get there.

Speaker 3: 35:19

So whatever, I don't know like customized customized Like you're from this area, so I think you might like this. This like player and intentionally thought about it.

Speaker 1: 35:29

It was un, fucking believe and not in, like the ones that are like in the case. Okay, like whatever. And you know, first of all, I don't even know how, how this kid knows, see, I don't even know how he knows that my family's from Panama, really, because it's not something gets discussed in the group. He got me I'm a New York Yankees fan and he got me a Mariano Rivera card Like one of the greatest Yankees ever, like a legend in Yankee history, is fucking Panamanian. And this guy shows up, hell yes, with that card. Right, that's amazing.

Speaker 1: 36:10

But I did not experience in any way and I don't think it's the case that he would expect. Like when he shows up next year, like he's going to be rubbing his hands together, like let's see what these fucking guys got me. Like I think he just wanted to say I love being a part of this group and here's how I'm expressing that. And I wonder if too many times a little part of me has been like can't wait to see what I get next draft, even if not a little bit.

Speaker 2: 36:35

I totally get that. And so there was one of the lines that you said reminded me so much of Nick Miller from you New Girl talking to his roommate and best friend, schmidt Schmidt has been bringing him a cookie from the bakery every time he goes, and so one time he gets called on it, nick has to do something in return and shows up with us an identical cookie and then says you gave me cookie, I got you cookie. You gave me cookie, I got you cook. And shouts it for five minutes straight because he can't understand. You gave me a cookie.

Speaker 1: 37:06

And I gave you a cookie and we're good, we're fine. Now we're done, we're all set.

Speaker 2: 37:10

But it does set up like, as much as it isn't a great philosophy to have, especially with close friends, I do think that there it's somehow related to an inherent fairness about your friends taking care of you as much as you take care of them and making sure that you're not feeling overwhelmed or unsupported in a relationship Like it isn't necessarily a bad foundation. You do want to make sure that people are. Viola Davis said something about pouring into you as much as you're pouring out into them. So a little bit. But also that if it's like a tit for tat type thing, it gets really messy and weird. Like one of my very close friends who I love so much, she and I have an agreement that if there is a present that we want to get for the other one, we will get it. But we are not going to get a present just to get a present for Christmas or birthdays or whatever else.

Speaker 2: 38:04

When John Oliver wanted to raise money for Ukraine and he made little potato dolls she loves potatoes and she loves John Oliver and I bought it for her and I gave it to her and I was like this is yours now. You don't need to get me anything back for it. This is because it's a John Oliver potato. Like who else would I give it to? So like there are different layers of this and I think we're seeing something really toxic and hard with Dottie and Ted. I don't know if his approach to it is the best way of doing things, like resolving this tension between them.

Speaker 1: 38:45

I mean, for a good part of my life I've tried to get next to a tit. So a tat was a small price to pay.

Speaker 3: 38:57

But I, I, I love what those faces did.

Speaker 1: 39:02

I love it. The coach is so angry. I sat here and I was like, don't interrupt, don't interrupt, just hold it, just hold it. I'm like, okay, she's done with her. Totally legitimate joke. Now you can be a 10 year old Go.

Speaker 3: 39:18

Oh, my God, that's like welcome to the blue room with the holiday in. Thanks. Glad you can spend this Thanksgiving with me, Boy. A little tit for tat and like that kind of lounge-y Boy, you're my arms tired.

Speaker 1: 39:31

No, it's absolutely. Yeah, yeah, murder me. No, 100%, but it's over now. It's over now. God, I did that, I. I, I brought you that as a gift, thank you coach. Now you have to you have to give me a pun.

Speaker 3: 39:43

That's it. Now we have to. I gave you cookie. Um, yeah, no, I there was. So, god, this is such a great conversation and really what we just discussed is part and parcel of so many things. The tendrils of what we just talked about have gone through this entire series of Ted Lasso it's. We keep referring to it in so many different ways, even the basics of friendship. I've talked so many times about how I grew up with with a mom who had strings attached everything. I remember it was funny. Um, uh, jillian was laughing about the first time I met. She's got this huge Italian family, uh, in Rochester, new York, the best people in the world. I love them. But the first time I met them, coming from a family where everything was strings attached, like literally I'm not exaggerating Like my mom's like, uh, I was like hey, can you hand me that water over there? She's like okay, and then now you owe her. Just, I'm serious, I'm just telling you that's what it was, right, right right, it might be a little thing.

Speaker 3: 40:36

It might be like it won't be spoken for sure, but it's like now you got to go a little further to go get her. So it was just a really not a great way to live. But I went to this, uh, first time I met this big Italian family. I'm sitting there, uh, at the table, like for this, for you know big meal that they have, and all these aunts are coming up. You know women I had just met and they're like oh, can we get you this? Can you get? Like people putting you know bread on my plate. I'm like well, you know like, oh, can I get you a soda? Can I get you some soda? It appears, water appears. I'm like, ah, because I'm like, oh, I can't.

Speaker 1: 41:08

How many people I'm going to owe. Oh, it's meal.

Speaker 3: 41:11

It was like traumatic, Like get away from me. I'm like freaking out.

Speaker 1: 41:16

It's a trap. It's a trap Seriously.

Speaker 3: 41:18

I'm like a bridge troll, uh like freaking out that I have no idea. I'm like what? Oh, it's terrible, but um, but then you realize, oh my God, there's no strings attached. What people live like this Is that. Is that humanly possible? So, anyway, it's a better way to be. Clearly, it's something that a bridge of communication that Ted and his mom haven't, uh, haven't sort of crossed yet. Um, boss, uh, keep rolling with this.

Speaker 2: 41:45

Oh well, to get all the way back to the clippings. Um, the clipping on top says lasso suffering panic attack on side of pitch, which of course, that would be the clipping that he would want to see at the top. And of course this means that she wants to talk about his panic attacks but doesn't know how to address it directly, so it's going to put it in here and then force the issue. Yes, yes, I've seen it.

Speaker 1: 42:10

But does she want to talk about it, or does she want to bring it up, and what I mean by that? Well, I'll let you keep going, but it's, it's, it's sort of interesting because it's like but do you want to talk about it? Um, I'm going to let you finish. Yeah, I'm going to let you finish this right.

Speaker 2: 42:26

I don't know that we could get that far into this point right now, but I totally get what you're saying, especially when somebody wants credit for saying I tried to talk about it, even though they didn't really want to talk about it. Like well I, I opened the door wide open when I passive, aggressively gave you that newspaper clipping that addressed the thing that I don't want to say out loud. What more do you want from me?

Speaker 1: 42:47

Right, right Also, where I clipped this uh, this uh headline um there are these things called phones.

Speaker 2: 42:57

This, it's also mail.

Speaker 1: 42:59

And so all this others, yeah, I mean so just how old is Dottie?

Speaker 3: 43:05

Uh, the actress is like uh, maybe a little older, like Dottie Dottie Lassel, not not really actress. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 43:12

I would think. I would think mid sixties to maybe early seventies, depending on timing stuff. But given the story, I would think something.

Speaker 3: 43:19

The reason I say it is because what you say about the phone, or oh, she wants to bring it up, she doesn't know discussing, or you know, her idea of seeing her son is to go sit near where he lives on a bench. Like, how many other days did she spend on benches before she found the right bench, I'm like. So what I'm saying is and I say this all the time, but I want to, I want to reiterate it for the listeners and for the buttercups and for the people who are coming to us out of the blue Um, where do you learn this if you don't come from a good family? You know what I'm saying. Like, if you haven't had an instruction, I'll tell you.

Speaker 3: 43:52

I'll tell you that, uh, 70 to 80 percent of the true lessons in my life I did not learn from my family. I learned from emulating good people I was friends with in school. I learned, I learned the vast majority after the age of 35, when I met Juliana and saw how her family functions and said, oh my God, this is a, this is a model for me to rethink my parenting. You know what I mean. Like, how do you know if you don't know it's crazy and I guarantee there are people out there I'm talking to certain listeners who I know have reached out who said listen, I didn't even know. People thought this way, you know until I heard your podcast.

Speaker 3: 44:32

So some people are just finding it right now Like, and that's the, and if that's the methodology, if that's the, the place where you hear something that sounds right or familiar or something that sort of validates what you've been suspecting, then good, wherever you get it, that's great, because you know the. Hopefully, the goal is for everyone to be in a healthier place and do the work of thinking about. You know how these things apply in our, in our day to day lives, and it can be as simple as I bought you a cookie and what. What ramifications does that have? I have a. I have a Republican friend who it's it my oldest friend in the world. I went to, went to school with him. He is a. He's a very nice person. I grew up with a hardcore conservative dad. Just got a real job, you know like, went to, went to school in the medical field and, you know, makes good money and, you know, just did everything the right way and very, very vanilla, but very appropriate.

Speaker 3: 45:34

Or, you know, has a, you know, as a golden retriever and has a, there's two kids and has a pretty wife and has a place on Nantucket, you know, like whatever, and I love him. He's one of my oldest friends in the world. We don't see eye to eye on anything, but he's one of those guys that studied. It reminds me of Tom Cruise and Cocktail, where Tom Cruise's character always had a self-help book behind the bar. I don't know if anyone who watched that movie remember it.

Speaker 3: 46:01

I remember it well, he always had like yeah, it was like some people just read that type of book, like that's what they oh, how to make money or how to do this or how you know. So my friend is like a student of like he watched a shark tank and he's like how do people sell their products, you know, like all that kind of stuff? And I remember him telling me one time he said the fastest way to get somebody to give you something or open themselves up is to give them a present. And I was like, oh yeah, okay, so like, but it doesn't come from the place like where I would give a present.

Speaker 3: 46:33

You know what I mean, the way he goes about. It has a, there is a. It's not artifice but it's, I guess it's. It's not even performative because he does give you the present, you know, but it's like there's something tethered to it that doesn't feel like, oh, just the goodness, altruistic goodness in my heart, kind of like boss, giving a potato, you know thing, to a friend and not expecting a potato in return. So it's and these are like just basic, daily things that we all do. The Trojan War, the entire sort of sort of lasting lesson from the Trojan War, was beware of Greeks bearing gifts.

Speaker 2: 47:12

You don't even need that last one.

Speaker 3: 47:14

Watch out for Greeks, you know, full story.

Speaker 3: 47:20

You damn right. Yeah, for those listening for the first time, I'm half Greek, from a fully Greek mother, from the homeland, from from Greece itself, and so this, that was a shot across the bow. But anyway, all I'm saying is these are applicable to our daily life, and who teaches it? They don't. You don't learn in school. You could have a teacher that is totally messed up and has completely different priorities and, yeah, they operate inside the realm of like what's acceptable in a student, a student environment, but they could be manipulative and they could be hurtful. They could say things to destroy yourself, esteem Like. You know what I mean. There's like, like there's just. Where do you learn these lessons If you don't, if you're not receptive enough to pick them up along the way and continuously be in a state of improvement, which I know is something our listener community, like really resonates with. That's something that really resonates with them. It's something that, when I talk about the journey that we're all on and the things that we're all searching for, I know that's a big part of that.

Speaker 1: 48:20

I think, well, there's a story piece and then, off of off of what you just said, I think, two, what ends up making the world? One of the things that ends up making the world quite complicated is, I think, especially in the context of Ted Lasso, there's definitely, there are definitely some messages being sent about the way right, I mean even the lasso way, the Richmond way, the way right, the way, the way, the way, the way, the way. So when you say the way, there's a right, there's a wrong, there's a better and there's a worse, and I and I would put forth that, in a way, your friend out on Nantucket, with other folks who have made similar choices and are living similar lives, is not doing a bad or a lesser thing. Actually, I might, because in that ecosystem that's how the world functions. It works. I think what often makes the world a complicated place is when some are, when some are putting bread on your plate because we feed everybody and you look hungry just because you're human and I just assume every human.

Speaker 1: 49:39

I've been, I've spent, I'm not of Italian descent. Those of you who can't see me have no reason to be not surprised by that. But those of you who can't see me, are just, and so, no, I have spent a lot of time around Italian families and friends just where I went to school and, just an amazing part, actually have grown up and I was stunned by the level of energy and enthusiasm that went into feeding people and talking about feeding people. I went back to my old high school to speak once, and the way my old coach talked about the sandwiches he sent out for me that we're going to get the sandwiches from blah blah, blah, blah, and do you want this or do you want that?

Speaker 1: 50:26

This whole production, and it was like I understood. That was his way of saying welcome home, welcome home, if nothing else happens, while you are here, believe me, you are going to eat, you will be nourished and I guess a real thing. So I think, if I understand that, then I figure out well, what's a way I can, or whatever, show a similar amount of love. So, in terms of my presentation to the school, I infused it there. That's a way I can do it. I can bring these words that I think will impact me. That's a great point, but we were on the same page, so it worked.

Speaker 3: 51:06

You're talking about. I think sometimes it's not working. No, yeah, I love it, coach, I love it. Sorry, were you finished?

Speaker 1: 51:12

No, no, no. That was the basic point, but it's not when they're misaligned, when we're not speaking the same language. I thought of the scene of Nate going on and on about not getting his credit. You guys ever wish you were the boss and having Roy and Beard look at him like fuck, this guy talking about me and Roy saying that's the job, and then having Beard explain what we've learned about how trees operate. They are not competing for the resources, they are not competing for the sunlight, and that's what makes the whole thing work. And he might as well have told Nate that the sky was made of marshmallows. It was the craziest shit.

Speaker 1: 51:59

On a fundamental fucking level, nate was like what are you talking about? I have presented good ideas and I want to be fucking heralded Like trees and who gets the sun? And I don't need more sun. What are you talking about? And I think that's where a lot of times you've run into these problems. Because he expected oh, when I get there, then I'm going to be giving all this sunlight. And they were like no, the sunlight goes to whichever trees need it. And that was unfathomable to him. He really couldn't put it together that. That's how this, not the world, but that's how this world works.

Speaker 3: 52:40

Are you going to say something, boss? Because I love it.

Speaker 2: 52:42

No, I love it too, I think you know. Just going back to everything we know about Nate, when you believe it, when you feel that you are lacking in one particular resource, it always feels scarce. So having anybody else say like obviously there is enough sunlight, what are you talking about? And you're like I'm getting fucking no sun. And that is more about Nate recognizing what he needs in place of sunlight and why it isn't working, and anything else. But I like so much what you're saying about making sure that everything is aligned in that way, Because what I was going to say in terms of how do you learn to become a better person if you weren't taught it at home, if your parents didn't teach you?

Speaker 2: 53:25

Because my answer is always you should be an asshole. And I say that not because I think being mean to other people is necessarily always the right thing. Sometimes it's the right thing, Sometimes they deserve it and I need to do it and I think that happens. But a lot of the time it is more the lack of ego associated with thinking of yourself as a person who will continually fuck up, Not like negative self-esteem, not feeling badly about yourself, but if you go into any situation thinking I'm probably going to fuck something up, so I need to know what I'm going to do when I do fuck that up. Then, when you fuck it up, instead of being like oh shit, I fucked up, you're like, ah all right, I fucked that up. So how do we fix it now?

Speaker 2: 54:08

And what I've often cited is Matt Damon and Ben Affleck, and I always think that Matt Damon thinks of himself as being a really good guy and he might even he might even actually be a pretty decent guy. I've seen him say a lot of shit about teachers, unions and standing up for his mom and other actors and stuff. I'm sure that he is a good guy in many ways. I think also, he's a little bit of an asshole and doesn't recognize it, and that's why that led to that shit that he said on Project Greenlight about diversity in front of the camera, not diversity behind the camera. He was wrong about that.

Speaker 2: 54:38

Lord have mercy Ben Affleck on the other hand, is an asshole and he fucking knows it. And so when you're like, hey, ben, you're a real dick, he's like, oh shit, all right, let me grab some coffee. All right, let's go, let me get a dunk in. We'll go talk about it, because I think that knowing that about yourself makes you easier to deal with the fallout of it, if you're not taking it so personally, because it's not part of your identity that you're a good guy.

Speaker 1: 55:05

Ooh, that's really that, is very, very interesting.

Speaker 3: 55:11

Castle finish. No, it isn't Castle finish.

Speaker 1: 55:14

You jump in there, get in there, coach. Get in there, coach, get in there.

Speaker 3: 55:18

Are you calling me an asshole boss? Is that what I'm saying? No, I'm not. Is that what I'm saying? Oh, you think you're a good guy, but really you're a little bit of an asshole.

Speaker 2: 55:28

No, actually, because one of the things that you were just saying about with your son at college and like he's going to put the clock here now when you love that, is that you think other people should not necessarily listen to me because I am always right. But I can give people a lot of guidance because I have fucked things up before and I know how to do this in a way that they don't need to feel as attached to it.

Speaker 3: 55:53

I think coach could vouch for the fact that no one on the planet has fucked up more than I have. I mean in every direction. I mean I am a master of the fuck up.

Speaker 2: 56:07

We started this podcast talking about how I followed a man to Minnesota in January and you're going to come at me with nobody's fucked up, more than you.

Speaker 3: 56:19

No, I love it. I always talk about friendship and what Vonna calls caress, and I always talk about when you're in the same wavelength as people. I just love when I tend to find friends where we're kind of all broken. In the same way, I always think everybody's broken. I maintain that as a rule, whether they know it or not, everybody's broken.

Speaker 3: 56:39

The world is too difficult for modern humanity. You can shield it, you can lie to yourself about it. Everyone's got some chink in the armor and whether or not it's like apparent to you or if it just comes out through your subconscious, I maintain that that's a general fact. There are some notable exceptions, but generally everybody has places in their life where they can approve. But yeah, no, no, I think there's so much here to I really do. I don't understand. So for me, I just, I guess I would.

Speaker 3: 57:15

I, one of the thrills about working with you, boss, is to see through the eyes of someone this is true, I think, being genuine for the first time ever where I say, like you know, I do really appreciate when you say being asshole and do that, because I don't have that gear, I don't know what it is. I would feel like I told you like. Even when I set a boundary, I feel guilty. Setting a boundary that feels like mean so, to even get to the level of asshole, that feels like, oh, I'd have to level up so far past being mean for setting a boundary that I don't even know what you're talking about. It feels like a mythical beast.

Speaker 1: 57:53

I'm not kidding, I'm serious.

Speaker 3: 57:55

That's funny. You know what you know. When Beard says Trent starts conversation and he goes, where are you from? He goes. None of your business. That is a dream goal for me to just be like you know what eat? A bag of shit. I'm not talking to you. I've never done that. I've never, ever, in my entire life done that. I wouldn't even know what part of my brain to even use.

Speaker 1: 58:23

I think this is well. I'm finding this whole conversation fascinating. One of the reasons I'm finding it fascinating, though, is I think we all like it's again in the, in the in memory of Ranny Dojas we all contain that is true, that is very true and I think there's something.

Speaker 1: 58:44

I think there's something at least potentially unhealthy and unhelpful about conducting ourselves as if no, no, everyone else contains multitudes, but I'm only this thing right. So we've seen different versions of that. It's the the I don't give a shit about anything. Person who you're like, get the fuck out of here. Like I'm sure there's some somewhere, there's a rosebud in your, in your past that if I bring that blanky or whatever the fuck it is out here you're gonna start balling like an infant right. And the person like I'm just always chipper and happy and everything's always fine with me. And I think not. Whether it's when we are talking about others or whether we're looking at ourselves, when we don't grant the full humanity of that and complexity of containing those multitudes, we get ourselves in the trouble.

Speaker 1: 59:50

Interestingly, with the conversation you two just had, my problem in life has often been I'm gonna be a nice guy, this shit happens, alright, I'm be a nice guy, this shit happens, alright, I'm be a nice guy then. Like the 17th thing happens or the 31st, like you're just. It's like like so they used to have those things and the sitcoms all the time. Like you're the moving shopper. Like you would just be the millionth person who pissed me off and you would get it for everybody who came before you, which is total bullshit.

Speaker 1: 1:00:23

Like it wasn't bullshit that what you did was fucking infuriating and that I'm angry at you, but it is bullshit that you are now catching the hell of the last 612, 1824 months of my life because I fucking had like that's not right, like it's just not fucking right and it's me. It was, in a way, it was me and I've done all who I don't know. This is like notes for my therapist today, but I've done a lot of work on this of like no, no, I don't like this thing and I'm gonna acknowledge this thing. I don't like right fucking now because, as much as it may seem to you like, oh my god, why are you bringing up this thing? That's not so big. I could tell you now or I could tell you later. If I tell you later, whoo right but that might not be pretty.

Speaker 3: 1:01:14

I love that coach, but it's also that's experience, because I'll speak as someone. It boss always jokes around coach once. Everybody just become a coach and I want everyone to have ADHD correct.

Speaker 3: 1:01:26

But I'll tell you as someone with ADHD, accurate part of it is you go through life and you don't always see the things coming down the pike and you don't always see it ahead of time. So now, when you get some veteran experience, it feels like you don't want to hang in over your head. You can see it. You can now. You can see it. You have the experience and you know what. I'm gonna address this upfront, because I've been down this road before, but but again, without that experience, how do you know? If you haven't had that experience, it's, it's really hard to, it's really hard to know and it's a sign of maturity, and again, hard one, just sort of veteran experience, which there's no, there's no replacing it.

Speaker 1: 1:02:05

The youth is wasted on the young because, boy, if I knew what I knew now, then please you know, like I feel like I'm getting to an age where I'm really appreciating those kinds of like, sentiments and sayings on a much more fundamental level, like when people are. If I knew, then I'm like, oh my god, like that isn't just like, hey, invest in Apple, which, yeah, but also like the things we're talking about and like what matters and what you should be spending energy on and what you know, what you should bother to even give a moment of your energy, or what you should be giving way more of your attention, like there's so much of that. That is that. You know, I feel like I see as this, as this beard goes completely white. Yeah, I just sort of go.

Speaker 3: 1:03:00

Oh yeah, but we're we're creatives coach, we've been creative people as long as we've known each other, and I know you all have it. We didn't have any fucking money to invest in Apple when we could have. You know, I mean, oh, I wish I had bought land in Canada with what a fucking home. I wrote a haiku, I don't you know.

Speaker 2: 1:03:17

I mean like I don't haiku, it's so great whatever you know, I mean I wish, I wish we could have.

Speaker 3: 1:03:25

We're gonna go back to Ted Lasso. I want to say that you described earlier. You were describing people being aligned and you basically describe traffic like why traffic happens. If it's 75 speed limit right, but everybody just universally decides to go 25, there's no traffic. The traffic happens when one person, all it takes is one person, is outside the flow. By the way, the same friend that I said, you know like I don't like. When I describe my friend, the Republican, who is a very good person, and his way of operating with gifts, it feels a little more transactional than then what I feel accustomed to or whatever his. He also has a theory about flow and especially pulling into traffic and he's like there's a natural flow to the way people drive and he his thing.

Speaker 3: 1:04:13

That it makes him crazy is when you pull out and somebody has to slow down to accommodate you entering the flow pulled out yeah, yeah, like, if you want to enter the flow, fine, enter the flow at the appropriate speed at the appropriate time so that you're not harsh in someone else's gig. But anyway, a lot of a lot of my friend featured today.

Speaker 1: 1:04:32

Boss, let's we, oh god, coach, yeah no, because I think it will matter in this scene and it is kind of a swing back to the. You know, ted Lasso, sensibly what we're discussing, but imagine speaking of ecosystems and the flow of traffic and whatever. Imagine a home where the, where this was the way of being, where you're supposed to do and do for others and care not for yourself, and not really have any fucking feelings, right, like like part of what daddy saying when she says oh, that's Ted taking care. Very well, it's not like he takes care of himself last. He takes care of himself not at all and probably doesn't even think of the ways in which he needs to be taken care of.

Speaker 1: 1:05:27

Right, imagine being in that home and having the process someone dying by suicide, like you, like that's that is driving the wrong way on the 405 at a hundred miles a fucking hour. That is like when you watch this, like you can see how, like, in a way like daddy, what exactly does it seem? What are we seeing? A daddies toolkit right now. That makes us go. Oh yeah, she could have totally fucking handled helping a teenage boy through that moment. What?

Speaker 2: 1:06:12

forget the joke I was gonna make about how, if you drive anything slower than 80 in the fast lane, you're a fascist, because what I want to talk about is what you just said about not just that everything in Ted's toolkit to deal with suicide, but like his lack of having those tools because of the way that the family says you do nothing for yourself and you do everything for everybody else one. He doesn't have the skills to deal with this because of that. But to his toolbox, his skill set tells you that what his dad did was the worst thing you could possibly do, because he did for himself quote, unquote instead of making sure to take care of everybody else because he really pain rather than suffer forever, because that would have made it better for everyone else a hundred percent and I think it's worth.

Speaker 1: 1:07:01

Yeah, like looking at you know what that means in context right, it's a capital, yeah, literally a capital crime in this case yeah, seriously, and that's the way, and that is the way he just gave up to dr Sharon. When he finally says he gave up and what he did, what your father did, what he did to me and my mother, so now he did a thing he didn't. He didn't die by suicide. He's so excited.

Speaker 2: 1:07:30

Yes no, that, and I should also say that we haven't gotten to the suicide discussion yet, but that is an incredibly common reaction to a close relatives, especially somebody who is in a parental role, when they it isn't something that they do to themselves, it is something that they did to you is how you internalize it, and he hasn't unpacked any of that shit and you've obviously, and I you know.

Speaker 1: 1:07:58

It's like when I say something like you, you joke around so much. You say shit and then people will think you're joking around. I'm not joking around. You obviously know way more about this than I know, it's not some dark, fucked up joke. But what I would add to that is but I'm a man, so let me right exactly. So let me let me explain you how you should feel no, but seriously.

Speaker 1: 1:08:20

But I, but I think that it's, it's, it's, I don't know, I don't, I've, I don't have the tools to deal with like I know that, like I know, like I know that there there's one, this kid and a kid I'd coached and I think I've told this before and I'm telling you my overriding emotion the morning, you know, the school parents met and what deal, my overriding emotion was anger to the tenth degree and I literally said, in a meeting of other adults, I wish he was here right now so I could punch you in the face. Yeah, I said that, I mean, and I meant that shit, I like I don't say that with pride, I say that with, like, look at yourself with clear eyes. So, yeah, I think you know how, like, what are those tools? What would we need to be able to process that better? What would we need to be able to respect that as much as we are interconnected?

Speaker 1: 1:09:25

I'm not, I'm not now advocating oh no, every man actually is an island at the same time. You do get to be your now. I'm gonna like fuck up this and now, but you do get to be your own nation, landmass, whatever you want to call it right, and and and somehow I have to respect that and yeah, no, how do you do that?

Speaker 2: 1:09:46

I'm, I'm not saying that was all of my therapy basically like legitimately. That is exactly what you need to figure out. How do you coexist in this idea that somebody could do something that could impact you so profoundly and actually acknowledge that, that that is something that they did because of who they are and that the impact is not a reflection is? What it comes down to is separating those two things? Yes, yes, I know, fucking, it's it.

Speaker 3: 1:10:15

Yeah whoa, that's impressive, especially because you don't seem like someone's done a lot of work.

Speaker 1: 1:10:20

I know that's really, really coached. Wow, that is commitment to the bit man, wow.

Speaker 3: 1:10:40

Jesus, never, never take you every single one we need it.

Speaker 1: 1:10:44

That was amazing. Yeah, boss finish this fucking scene the love of sweet baby. One more thing.

Speaker 2: 1:10:51

No, I'm kidding boss all right, what's the plan for tomorrow? Yeah, you want to come with us to Manchester. Come to Manchester with us. And she says I don't know. I mean, coming all the way to England not seeing a soccer match is kind of like going to Rome not going to a church or getting your pocket picked. She said, oh well, thank you, but I'll just stay here. I didn't get much sleep last week with all that noisy sex from not me, the Australian, the Australians again it's. He didn't know you were here. You're making this his problem, even though he had no way of fixing it. That's fine.

Speaker 3: 1:11:27

He says yeah, no, exactly and now he makes a great and he makes a great face here. He's like a, I guess, runs that he like looks side-eye and he's like it's yeah, just I how would I fix that I didn't know you were.

Speaker 2: 1:11:42

I didn't know you're here yeah yeah you just hung out around my place. I know I don't not sure if we mentioned it, but one of the same catchphrases in our family is there's no bubble come ice cream. From a time when my sister was taking a child that she was working with as a patient to the ice cream store. The kid was like I want bubblegum ice cream. He's like, well, there is no bubble gum ice cream, so like, what are we gonna do instead? And he couldn't get past it. He was like, wait, but it, but there's, I need bubble gum ice cream. And so this is kind of a thing. What's being reflected here is he couldn't give her the bubble gum ice cream. Hey, dottie, I didn't have any bubble gum ice cream. You weren't in my apartment. I couldn't help you with that.

Speaker 3: 1:12:22

That is outside the realm of impossibilities, you're just this is, this is your family vernacular, as a way of saying not just tough shit, but also like let's problem solve, like what else are we gonna do? There is no.

Speaker 2: 1:12:36

Oh, there's no but also there is a little bit of disdain involved like there's a little bit of mockery, if we have to say there's no bubble gum ice cream, you are past the point where we have already explained to you that that is not a possibility and we need to move on. So there's no bubble gum ice cream. What are we doing instead? Oh god, yes right, right.

Speaker 3: 1:12:59

When you get to that point, you're it's got to like an explanation.

Speaker 2: 1:13:01

There's no bubble gum.

Speaker 3: 1:13:02

Ice got it having met your sister, I can't imagine you guys getting the point no us, we are, we put the fun and dysfunctional.

Speaker 2: 1:13:13

We're great, it's cool.

Speaker 1: 1:13:15

I would 100% live stream your holiday, no question.

Speaker 3: 1:13:21

I would just sit and watch, right, just go. There would be so much yelling the sound only chambers holiday special also.

Speaker 2: 1:13:30

I need to very quickly call out have we talked about yeah, no and no? Yeah, I did not realize that this was only a Midwestern thing.

Speaker 3: 1:13:40

I don't think so.

Speaker 2: 1:13:41

I hear it all the time because, yeah, my sister's group in Chicago but yeah, no means no, and no yeah means yes, yeah, no, yeah, no, we're not going, we're not doing that. Yeah, no, absolutely not. But no yeah, you can definitely come with. That's not a problem. I've, and this is how we talk to each other all the time fucking the Midwest. I don't understand it anyway.

Speaker 2: 1:14:04

So he says yeah yeah, no, I remember, because he is true blue Midwestern. And she said you know how nervous I get when I'm watching your games, so I'll just think I'll just stay put and let you go beat the pants off of those Manchesterians, manchurians man canians man canians.

Speaker 3: 1:14:27

I just love that. No, no, I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 1:14:29

I'm saying with Ted, says he goes man canians.

Speaker 2: 1:14:32

So he, just like he, corrects it to himself and I'm like you didn't know, wednesday, sheffield Wednesday baby, look at you now, man canians, like really he found his place you know, and then I'll have a home cooked meal for you waiting for you when you get back. It's been too long, and he says yeah, no, that'll be nice again. Yeah, no, I think maybe his mom being around is bringing out the Midwestern, which seems yeah, yeah that makes sense. I'll see you in the morning hey, um, are you still having those episodes? Direct into the point is always, daddy, great job. I know you've missed them for you.

Speaker 3: 1:15:09

You know the panic attacks that's the best to when you when you're heading out like right before bad, let's chat about that and so it brings up a big.

Speaker 3: 1:15:17

My kids, I, my kids, know I'm like after for the love of good. Well, you know, like the kitchen's closed after after 930. If you want food, you cook it, because I just can't and I'll always bend the goddamn rules because it's me. But like generally, whatever, my kids have a thing where they want, they want to climb in bed at 1130 and line actually input their head initial. My kids are great, they're great with that stuff, with cuddling and being super close and whatever, whatever I really lucked out because it's really wonderful. But they really want to have all the biggest, most hardcore existential conversations at like 1135. I'm like dude, I am wiped, I cannot, you know, I mean, and you don't want to let them down right, so I'll do like just but just one, just one more, just one

Speaker 2: 1:16:07

more just do you think heaven exists?

Speaker 1: 1:16:12

that's really what it's like that's, I swear to God, so funny are you gonna die daddy did you tell him that you're never gonna die?

Speaker 2: 1:16:18

did you? Did you knit, cage him? I just whatever movie that is there's the next or the knowing, or a bunch of movies where you made basically the same movie three times in a row, but not national treasure, not sequels, just three very different movies. I'm gonna post the correct article, don't worry he does. In one of them, tell his kid I'm never gonna die, not like I'm not gonna doubt die now, but just in general. I am never gonna die. It's the greatest line in cinema.

Speaker 3: 1:16:44

Yeah, yeah, that's amazing, jesus Christ.

Speaker 1: 1:16:48

So you get why you, you a hundred percent get why someone would in a moment choose that easy escape hatch and also you go. That is some of the worst parent it like I 100% understand. And also, oh my god, what have you just done?

Speaker 2: 1:17:09

but exactly.

Speaker 3: 1:17:15

So you're still having those episodes. All right, I'm still doing this.

Speaker 2: 1:17:17

So you're still having those episodes, those panic attacks? And he says, no, not recently, you know, I've been talking to a therapist and she says, oh, let me guess it's all my fault.

Speaker 1: 1:17:31

Whoop, whoop. Which like what? Why you fucking bring it up then?

Speaker 3: 1:17:34

What? This is what I actually got mad. Yes, yes, coach, I was mad. I was like hey, listen.

Speaker 1: 1:17:40

I didn't fly you fucking here. I didn't tell you to bring some newspaper clipping about my anxiety attacks and I certainly didn't ask you to ask me on my way to fucking bed if I'm having these episodes. And all I have to do is mention that I talked to a therapist about it. No, how's that going? Is that? Do you think that's what's making the difference? None of that, but uh-oh, I better make sure I don't get blamed. I would that made. I got like it wasn't watching a TV show angry. I was like yes, I kind of felt like personally affronted and offended. That that was the response.

Speaker 3: 1:18:19

That was the first thing that went from passive aggressive to aggressive.

Speaker 1: 1:18:22

To yeah that, yeah, that's like, oh, let me guess.

Speaker 3: 1:18:25

That was like almost the mask slipped a little bit.

Speaker 1: 1:18:28

But let me guess it was dismissive, like first of all Nobody was even talking about you. Yeah, like first of all, I'm going to a therapist.

Speaker 3: 1:18:38

It's just I don't know it was yeah, and your lack of understanding about what therapy entails immediately puts you on like this weird aggressive defensive, and you know where you're like. You know. I don't know, is it aggressive defensive, even a thing, it's just like you're on defense but it's different than passive, aggressive.

Speaker 1: 1:18:56

But I know what you mean. You know what I mean.

Speaker 3: 1:18:57

Like you're on the defensive but you're nasty about it when you're like oh, let me get.

Speaker 1: 1:19:00

like lady, if you know what therapy is.

Speaker 3: 1:19:04

that is nothing to do with anything. It's not like part of it may be my reaction to my upbringing, but like yeah Uh uh, uh.

Speaker 1: 1:19:13

Well, also, as we've watched Ted, you know, basically go from a guy who can be, you know, in the middle of getting dressed to an 80s hit, to being completely incapacitated, to someone who can stand here and have this conversation. It's like and I'll tell you something else about therapy, dottie, you might've wanted to look into it, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:19:35

Well, and-.

Speaker 1: 1:19:37

A lot of shit that's going on in this room right now has a lot to do with your choice not to get some therapy Right, so I think there was that added to it for me.

Speaker 2: 1:19:45

Well, no, just like the. I think the meaning behind this, the reason that she does it, is because she needs to control the outcome of whatever she is bringing up Like. She wants to ask him about it and there is a part of her that wants to know does it have anything to do with me? But also she wants the answer to be no, it isn't about you. So she's going to phrase it in this way, so that he has to say no, mom, it's not about you, of course not. You didn't do it, it's not your fault, because that's the only conversation she wants to have around it.

Speaker 1: 1:20:17

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:20:19

But yeah, that's good. Do you want to finish boss or do you want to attack me for trying to feature I always I can do both.

Speaker 2: 1:20:29

I can take multitudes. We just talked about that.

Speaker 1: 1:20:32

Don't attack me.

Speaker 2: 1:20:34

Come on, what he says almost exactly is no, mom, no, of course not. No, but I mean it's really helped. And she says oh good, good, good, good, good, good good good, good, good good.

Speaker 3: 1:20:47

Oh, I think, hold on a second. I think it's really helped. Is yes Is brave.

Speaker 1: 1:20:52

Yeah, agreed, agreed Is brave.

Speaker 3: 1:20:54

He's like no, don't dismiss it.

Speaker 1: 1:20:56

I'm not going to now be sheepish about it. I believe in this.

Speaker 3: 1:20:59

That's reestablishing a family boundary or something like that. Where you go, you know what. Actually, you know, I kind of like the mutt that we brought.

Speaker 2: 1:21:10

I don't want to get rid of that dog.

Speaker 3: 1:21:11

You know, whatever it is like everyone. Oh, we all think this way. We all think therapy is crazy. I grew up in a family just like that. I was still to this day. If I went to my own, oh, you know, I've done some therapy. And she said what? That's an excuse, that's a way for people to skip work, who don't know oh, my God, that's hilarious. Worst analogies.

Speaker 1: 1:21:34

Worst analogies.

Speaker 2: 1:21:35

Jesus, what work are you doing? Oh, come on, all right, fine, fine, fine, fine, yeah. He says it's really helped, which is very brave, which she also does not want to address, because what she could say was oh, I'm so glad to hear that, I'm glad you're doing better. What she says is good, good, good, good, good, good, good, because she's glitching out a little bit. I know it's only about a time before it comes back to me, I'm sure, because of what I know about her.

Speaker 2: 1:22:01

Well, what she says is have you ever thought about talking to someone? He is more direct about it. Do you think that would be good for you? And she said, oh no.

Speaker 3: 1:22:09

Also brave, also brave.

Speaker 2: 1:22:12

That's not my cup of tea, and you know I love my tea.

Speaker 3: 1:22:19

My head split open.

Speaker 1: 1:22:22

And every good memory of this show and everyone. It's just brave.

Speaker 2: 1:22:27

Yeah, I think wait what did she just say, which leads me to believe that Ted has in fact tried tea before? Or the other option is that actually drinking the tea in Rebecca's office was a much huger step for him than we could have possibly imagined.

Speaker 3: 1:22:46

Yeah, yeah, yes, he's like stick with me and you know. I love my tea. He grew up going.

Speaker 2: 1:22:51

He's not in Kansas anymore. He's going to fucking do it.

Speaker 3: 1:22:54

He's going to try it. Fuck tea and fuck tea people.

Speaker 1: 1:22:59

Yeah, yeah, really.

Speaker 2: 1:23:03

Yeah, and you know, I love my cup of tea, holy shit. Good night, mom, night, sweetheart, and thank you for the bed, as if you had a choice.

Speaker 3: 1:23:12

Yeah, you're welcome. You're welcome. Well, great job, boss. Thank you for doing that. I'm sorry for all the interruptions. You just literally cannot stop, coach, I know, I think he just the rest of it everybody here sitting saying nothing.

Speaker 2: 1:23:28

We're not talkers.

Speaker 3: 1:23:29

Yeah, we're like a couple of mutants and it's just the boss. Come on Blah, blah, blah blah. I want to be a better person. Just a chip. I don't remember saying that. Oh, OK, ok. So, coach, why don't you pick it up from the next scene here? Hey, hot dog, y'all joining us today?

Speaker 1: 1:23:54

Well, we're all in this together, ted. Yeah, so right away, the energy here is so different than what we just left and I mean as a writer, you know when you're doing that so I thought it added to sort of the shock of all this energy that we had come from, this intense quiet moment. So I just want to highlight that.

Speaker 3: 1:24:17

Oh, there's no question. Yeah, and we really needed it. That was a heavy bass scene.

Speaker 1: 1:24:21

Yeah, I mean whew, and I also received. So this is Rebecca. I also received a strongly worded text from Nora demanding I stop using my private jet. Why? The environment, the environment, and then the resignation, the environment. Oh yeah, the God Higgins. The goddamn environment. Like all I wanted to do is travel in style. And now the fucking environment.

Speaker 3: 1:24:47

Yeah Well, look who showed up. It made me the fucking environment. Yeah, the fucking environment.

Speaker 2: 1:24:56

I have to admit that this is the Gen X joke that will not be passed along. This is the Walter in the Big Lebowski pulling the gun. That we thought was hilarious because of the overreaction to the boys and kids now are like what the fuck? And so I'm guessing like 10 years from now when our cities are burning, kids are going to be like oh yeah, no, funny rag on the environment. Great job, boomer.

Speaker 1: 1:25:24

Really appreciate that Big fucking sack. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Big fucking sacrifice. Somebody pass me my mask, thanks.

Speaker 3: 1:25:37

I love these underground cities.

Speaker 1: 1:25:39

This is great, so yeah, so, yeah, all right, they go on their way. Hi, yeah, so we go to. Now we've got Roy and Keely. Hi, hey, how's he doing? We have our shutter clicks and basically Jamie is so out of it. He is unrecognizable, if my memory serves, because my notes might be off, he is asked for a picture and he takes a picture of the fan and hands the phone back, which I was like sweet, he's at the Jesus, yeah he's over at the barrier.

Speaker 3: 1:26:19

That's exactly right. He's at the barrier. There's a husband and wife. They're like, oh, can we get a picture? And usually when you hand your phone to, this is universal, and my daughter is a huge soccer fan, does this. All the time goes up to the thing. You hand them your phone, they do the selfie, they stand right in front of you yeah and then right, but Jamie just stands back and takes a picture of the couple. They're looking at him like he's crazy and then there's a guy with his hand out like oh, that's high five.

Speaker 3: 1:26:49

And what does Jamie do? Coach Jamie?

Speaker 1: 1:26:52

just walks his face into the guy's hand Like he's so out, like he's just completely disconnected from our universe. So he does that fucking hell.

Speaker 3: 1:27:07

Yeah, there's a reaction shot from Roy and Keely watching this, which is like I don't know.

Speaker 1: 1:27:13

It's worse than we thought.

Speaker 3: 1:27:14

Yeah right.

Speaker 1: 1:27:15

This is the worst one yet. And then I'll talk to him, the Psy right. Ladies and gentlemen, let our journey commence. Will there be toad venom? You have to wait and see. Everybody's cheering, everybody's fired up. Look at Ken Boy. He cleans up, nice, donnie, to which the response is you should see him. Do drag Really.

Speaker 3: 1:27:41

Yeah, you should see him in drag. So beard says you should see him in drag Really.

Speaker 1: 1:27:46

And it's like, yeah, they do it for me, I know for some I love that they continually bang the drum of. There is an entire universe here of which you are seeing parts, and to me this was that Like somehow beard did get to see it. Like that's also part of the story. It's not just that he does drag or dresses in drag or whatever, but how does beard know that, like what? So I just those jokes.

Speaker 2: 1:28:21

I feel like beard would be very big into the British, specifically the London drag scene. I feel like that would that fits yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:28:30

Oh Well, yeah no no, I think it works. We are never going to see it, but I totally buy it.

Speaker 3: 1:28:35

Well you have.

Speaker 1: 1:28:35

I wasn't. I didn't question it.

Speaker 3: 1:28:37

Yeah, I don't know why you keep casting as persons on beer which got wide. Why don't you like beard? No, no, yeah, you get, it's funny because you get. You get 10, 10 beard going in an environment right, and you would, right away they would like split up. You would know like the weirdos would approach beard and he would like know how to speak their language, you know whatever. So there's that nice, that nice thing.

Speaker 3: 1:29:00

Now we cut to Taste of Athens. Nate is waiting on the table. Take your time and what I want you to do snack on some nuts and I'll be back with you drinks. You got a very pleasant smile. Nick Muhammad's got like 11 different smiles on the show. This is his pleasant waiter smile. They're all great, All right, thank you. In swoops, the best character on in history of television, Derek, Taste of Athens. Oh, you know what this is your son. Like your son, Rando. Like what are you doing, Right? No, our waiter, bloody hell. You two are right pair. No, I mean, you know who he was. They're like what I don't know, Only the manager of West Ham United. Oh, right, you're the wonder kid. Yeah, that's it I said. I said wonder kid. Nate says this man right here went from kit man to assistant coach, to manager at the top of the league and now he's my head waiter, to which the gentleman at the table responds what coach?

Speaker 1: 1:30:01

I'm so sorry, yeah, and Derek is like so Derek can't Mike, and Dolan's is like oh shit.

Speaker 3: 1:30:09

Derek doesn't know, like he's not the top of the great pyramid of Giza. Like you know, this is the trajectory. Every person wants West Ham United is straight to Derek's head waiter.

Speaker 1: 1:30:21

But not only that, but it's like the level of, because there are actually, for me, layers of awareness that are missing. Like, even if this were true and he hadn't been, who wants this introduction? Do the customers want this? Does Nate want? Like, what are we doing? It's very, that's weird. And then, yeah, why wouldn't you read the situation? Like, what about you makes you incapable of reading? Like, let's say, for a minute, he did blow it all on hookers and blow Again. Do you think that's a conversation anybody wants to have right now? So it was just a. Anyway, he's fantastic in his absolute, just social.

Speaker 2: 1:31:10

Yeah, the dedication to misreading the room, to not understanding what it was about Nate being the head coach. That made it special. That now that he is no longer, that means he is no longer that special thing, like he didn't retire.

Speaker 1: 1:31:26

He wasn't like it's not like.

Speaker 2: 1:31:27

Dick going out and being like and now I'm going to sell knockoff stakes or whatever Exactly?

Speaker 1: 1:31:33

Run a stakeout.

Speaker 2: 1:31:33

This is like I was doing that and then I quit at my prime and now I'm a waiter Like unless you are like that one musician that released a single album that everybody and fucking loves and then disappear forever, intentionally. Like that, there's a god damn it.

Speaker 2: 1:31:53

Oh, juliette Naked. A different Nick Horned B-Book where that is basically the entire plot that a musician does this in the early 90s and then disappears, and then people spend 20 years on websites talking about how fucking phenomenal it is. That is not this. You are at Taste of Athens Also it turned a bone to me out.

Speaker 1: 1:32:12

Right.

Speaker 2: 1:32:13

I have my issues with Nate's character development. He seems genuinely happy and good at his job and feeling competent when he's saying here are the nuts, I'm going to grab your drinks and be back Like just let him be a fucking waiter man. He's fine, derek.

Speaker 1: 1:32:28

I think that's worth discussing and I wouldn't say not just for Derek Like the assumption by everyone and I get it, we live in the world, we live it but the assumption by truly everyone that this is beneath you and you shouldn't be doing it. He's like I am enjoying myself, I am doing a thing well, and I am spending time around my girlfriend Life's fucking great and everyone, including his girlfriend is like nope.

Speaker 2: 1:32:59

So one of my favorite fucking things, especially about white people, the white people that are in my neighborhood, because it's kind of I am listening who are the people in my neighborhood Boojee assholes.

Speaker 2: 1:33:13

Well, not assholes, they're just boojee sons of bitches. I live in the cheap apartment near a nicer neighborhood, so I get to fly right under the radar and not have to pay for an expensive house. These boojee assholes, if they won the lottery tomorrow, the first thing that they would do is quit their jobs and open a coffee shop, and they would work in that coffee shop, probably with their spouse hanging out and not doing anything. And if I, a person who has not won the lottery and does not own a home quit my job tomorrow to work in a coffee shop, they'd be like what happened, what went wrong? Your dream in one situation is something that you look down on people in another situation.

Speaker 3: 1:33:56

Yes.

Speaker 2: 1:33:57

Just like.

Speaker 1: 1:34:01

I told yes to what you've just described and to everything that it points to, and I think it is worth looking at. And I'll say something also. One of the things Derek says stuck out to me. I think I shared with you that my son, now 18, and kind of looking at the world he's on my other child has been sort of set on a course since the age of three and that's not hyperbole and they've always been very different, and one of the ways they're different is he's not quite sure where he wants his life to go, which hello, you're 18. Ok, but anyway, he was sort of Slacker, I know right, but he was obviously at one point toiling over this and sort of feeling like oh shit, man, I haven't figured it out and I'm screwing this up, this life thing is getting away from me. And I texted him later and said I think you'd be best served to worry less about what you're going to be and to think more in terms of who you want to be, and I love your advice.

Speaker 3: 1:35:12

Sensei.

Speaker 1: 1:35:13

You like that one?

Speaker 3: 1:35:15

That is such the. These are my idols from Kung Fu Panda, who I'm like. I wish I was that guy. That is my son. Listen to me, don't fight back, fight forward Like every once in a while you get.

Speaker 1: 1:35:30

You get a moment You're like, oh my God, that came out right, it was great. I didn't scream it by mistake Like holy shit man, I stuck the fucking landing. I was a father. Like four days in my life I've been a good father. I'm a father. Exactly right, exactly.

Speaker 1: 1:35:48

So when he says do you know who this is? He means he is the former West Ham manager. He doesn't mean he's Nate the Great. He doesn't mean he's Nathan who's now in a relationship with Jade that blah, blah, blah. He doesn't mean he's a guy who, instead of basically walking around and being a jerk sitting at my bar and growling at people because life didn't break his way, is actually making my business run better. No, no, no, no. He's this thing you'll recognize. That gives him status and, by extension, the fact that he now works for me. I think we can all agree he gives me that and I was like isn't this fascinating? And I think it matters in the context of what we're describing, because in the last old world that's not how it is. And when Ted met the kit man, as far as he was concerned, he's Nate the Great and he might be over there kicking shit, but he knows soccer.

Speaker 1: 1:36:58

He knows football Like who he is is Nate the Great. He's the person who kept the grass perfect. He's the person who made sure the towels were exactly where they needed to be when they needed to be there.

Speaker 2: 1:37:12

He made it, so it is a different way of looking at it. He made a good sports drink and he knew it shouldn't have pineapple juice.

Speaker 1: 1:37:19

That's it. You know what I'm saying and I think there's something to that, because this is an advanced version of but this is absolutely Nate the Great, because nobody asked him to give anybody any peanuts but he was like, hmm, how can we sell these people more drinks? But be nice, like I might just shove it. It's not push the fish, push the fish nuts. Hey, would you like some nuts? Bet you thirsty, would you like a drink? Right, it's a different and he's being that, but it's not really appreciated, even by Jade, like she says that his commitment to being good at that job is weird. Why?

Speaker 1: 1:38:09

Yeah no, no, no no.

Speaker 3: 1:38:10

But yeah, that's it. But because it's not, it's not looked upon as like an avenue to anything, it's, it's a dead end and it's not not a desirable, you know, profession in her eyes or whatever it is. But yes, this is, this is a the latent result of capitalism run amok, where people can't just be happy doing what people do.

Speaker 1: 1:38:31

It's got to be attached to the finances of it. I crochet doilies. Oh, you should. You should definitely sell those online. Why, why can't you just make your fucking doilies and stack them up next to you and make the next one, if that's what you like to do?

Speaker 3: 1:38:45

Yeah thanks. I appreciate that because I'm I don't think my dollars are really professional.

Speaker 2: 1:38:50

Well, are you able to sell them? That's the only only question.

Speaker 3: 1:38:55

That's, that's it. That's a measure of success. Yeah, no, I don't. I do not. Doily, I beach I. I was going to say that it's amazing that we gave any time to Derek. I just think he's generally got awful and his superpower is completely not so. He has no self-awareness, so that he doesn't know what he's doing. He's playing, he's like role playing. Anyway, nice talking to you, and then he and he dips and he leaves. Please try the fish. We've got a ton of it out back. All right, fish, fish, fish. I'm like, oh my God.

Speaker 1: 1:39:31

That's that in front of the customers. Do you want any of that fish?

Speaker 3: 1:39:34

No, there's no. The all I did was make sure they are definitely not. We got a ton of it out back. I got. I got to sell this fish. Was it drugs? I done drugs. I get it. No, no, no, I just like working here and that's my girlfriend Again. Anyway, enjoy the nuts. I'll go get your drinks. Okay, definitely drugs.

Speaker 1: 1:39:53

Oh yeah definitely. But which ones? I really appreciated, but which ones? Yes, the joke of it. But also we do tend as long as we're talking about class and status and whatever. There's definitely the like if you get caught with crack. Yes, it'd be this. But if you get caught with Coke, it'd be this. And I thought it was important for them to say hey look, he was a West Ham manager. He had access to probably all kinds of drugs.

Speaker 2: 1:40:26

Rich people have drugs.

Speaker 1: 1:40:28

I'm, sure rich people have drugs?

Speaker 2: 1:40:29

we've never even heard of which is you know. To go back to the coffee, shop thing they're saying there was a thread on Twitter for a while about what's something cool to do if you're rich but is bad if you're poor. And it's shit like doing drugs, not having a job, having three names for some reason, which made me laugh really fucking hard.

Speaker 1: 1:40:50

Had to really find it.

Speaker 2: 1:40:52

Because either it's like that's great Day down. Exactly. I'm guessing that that has to be money Dude. That's come on.

Speaker 3: 1:41:03

That's great. All right, we're going to leave it there for today. This is a really really quick episode for us.

Speaker 1: 1:41:11

Barely.

Speaker 3: 1:41:13

Yeah, look at that, not even approaching.

Speaker 2: 1:41:16

What am I going to do with the next eight hours?

Speaker 1: 1:41:19

Enjoy the interstitial folks.

Speaker 3: 1:41:21

Yeah, no, it's really nuts. And I noticed in certain cases the length of our episodes is going down and I think that's because I'm finding it less and less desirable to hang out with you.

Speaker 2: 1:41:34

That makes sense, that's really funny, you just spent last weekend virtually with a coach, and you would not stop bothering me the entire time. I don't understand.

Speaker 3: 1:41:48

That is true.

Speaker 2: 1:41:48

You were with him. You couldn't stop thinking about me.

Speaker 3: 1:41:53

Side note what are you doing after half of this? Just you and me. What?

Speaker 2: 1:41:55

are you you want to?

Speaker 3: 1:41:57

hang.

Speaker 2: 1:41:59

You want to do another podcast, maybe? Yeah, I want to. Let's do that, let's do another podcast together.

Speaker 3: 1:42:06

Boss, if I could never ask, I want to set up our next episode, which is this is an episode where, okay, it's a little. You know we do these very special episodes. The next episode is I want to give people a heads up because they have to do a little homework before the episode. In the next episode we are going to take a tiny tiny break from Ted Lasso. Not that we're leaving Ted Lasso, but it's always good to just sort of traipse through the tulips from time to time In the interest of sort of exposing people to things that we find really great. I have informed coach and boss that we are going to be watching a little show I like to call Wayne, and next episode you guys are going to see episode one. Coach and boss have not seen it yet. They know this is on the, they know it's on the docket and they know that we're going to do this and then we're going to talk about it and it's going to be off the cuff, because it's really hard to get coach to do anything unless you put him like in, you know, coach Castleton jail and watch him do it. Yeah, man, I'll do it. Yeah, all right, I'll hit you back at that man Like so I'm going to force him to hang out with me and do this. So next episode, a little homework for you guys. It is, the show is called Wayne. It is on YouTube. We will post a link in the show description and then one in the in the description when the show airs.

Speaker 3: 1:43:52

It's just a pilot episode. It's like 30 minutes or something. It's a little easy breezy and I think you guys will love it. It's very different from Ted Lasso in many ways and very, very similar in others, and it's of that same sort of excellence in in sort of an auteur, sort of giving you a perspective. So I'm putting that on one's radar because it's a little bit of a departure.

Speaker 3: 1:44:19

But I want people to have time to to knock out 30 minutes and blast through this and that's it. That's it for right now. I have other. I have other things I want to share, but I'm going to do it after that episode. I want people to have a little time to sort of enjoy that and just take a little break. Because Ted Lasso, it's just really amazing, because it stopped Got, it was three full months ago, when it's when the when the last episode aired, the finale aired and it's still the number three show on on Apple. And it's only three, because other shows recently launched and those will immediately fall off and it'll go right back up to number one. So it's just kind of amazing. Yeah, so, coach, what do you got?

Speaker 1: 1:45:04

I mean I don't want to sell what's sold. I think you know, at the very least any anyone who is listening at this moment is on some level interested in Ted Lasso. I do think today's conversation, today's episode, points to why it could be number three after three months. I mean that scene with Dottie and Ted coming home by itself. I mean there is. I mean I don't think either of you would disagree. If we wanted to, we could go back to that scene right now and do another hour and not touch anything we said in that first. I mean we. It's just there's so much in here and I know and I've, I've definitely there have been moments where I thought that um boss's head was going to pop right off her shoulders.

Speaker 2: 1:45:55

I do have a very thin neck.

Speaker 1: 1:45:57

And I've said, oh, and I have, I've been. I mean, as I'm watching I'm like, oh, boss, ain't going to like that job, oh, but, but there's so much here. It is one of the most, you know, we talk about meals that are nutrient dense. I feel like Ted Lasso, maybe the most nutrient dense show I've personally ever watched. That I that I, honestly I am still. I have started my notes for those who think I'm like bullshitting about this color thing. I have started going back through and just watching for the use of color and I feel like that is a perfectly reasonable use of my time, seriously, because that is at the level of depth to the show.

Speaker 1: 1:46:43

So anyway one, one, one more love note from more from a coach Bishop to uh, to Ted Lasso but yeah, and deservedly so, deservedly, deservedly so.

Speaker 3: 1:46:53

And you know, listen, we again, like you said, we can, we can touch on all of this. You remember Spielberg? I'm sure this is a when you were in film school. I'm sure they talked about Spielberg's um idea around uh, don't show the monster till two thirds of the way through the film, or whatever you know like. Hide the monster. In many ways we have seen the entire lead up of Ted Lasso and meeting Dottie is meeting it.

Speaker 3: 1:47:18

Not that I'm calling her a monster, but you get the here's. This is the reason. Here's the MacGuffin. You see, what was the root of everything? And it was like it's like a big reveal when the magician, like, pulls the, pulls the, uh, the cloth off. And you know it's no different than that, because you go oh, oh, oh, oh. Now.

Speaker 1: 1:47:33

Oh yeah, no, no, they had to go face their quote monster and as charming as Dottie is, it would be easy to miss it if you're not paying attention that that's exactly what's going on here and I think some of the moments of courage you highlight as we get through the end of this episode we're going to see a real progression in Ted and and how he is mom you know, is that you sitting there on that bench, or high teddy, to where we are by the time we're done with this episode. It is a re. I mean as much as we've watched arcs here and within seasons and within episodes and over the whole show and blah, blah, blah. There's an arc in this episode that's pretty elegant.

Speaker 3: 1:48:18

I would say no doubt, no doubt, Couldn't have said it better myself. Which, um? Where do people find if they want to find you?

Speaker 1: 1:48:26

I'm stuck AF. We'll be hitting you with season four. I am proudly we're really turning this whole business into a business. It's kind of it's kind of crazy folks, but it's happening. And so I'm very excited about season four, not just because the great guests will have, but because my nephew who in many ways has been like a son to me and we've had a very important relationship, I think in both our lives he is now going to be basically the producer of the show. So we are actually going over everything and he's going to own post and he's going to own it whatever, and we're going to go over what I want and he's doing it and I'm actually paying him. I might cash in on all the times I took him to McDonald's because we're trying to live in an egalitarian ecosystem here. So, uh, yeah, I'm pretty, I'm pretty fired up about that part on top of the actual podcast, which I'm very proud of. I'm stuck AF wherever you get your podcast and, uh, you're trying to make the world a better place for real.

Speaker 3: 1:49:33

Oh sure, You're definitely trying to do that. I mean, every day, day in, day out. It's exciting to hear about um, about your nephew. That's very cool, that's awesome, that's a good luck. Good luck to you, Um. And and if anybody can navigate working with a family member and not having it blow up in their face and lead to a nightmare of whatever you know, you hear that and you go oh shit, oh boy, I know, Look at this, he's been great.

Speaker 1: 1:50:00

So you know like, yeah, we kind of built, we kind of built to it. So I I wouldn't say confident confident may be a little too chest out, but I feel like, all right, we've, we've, we've progressed, we've progressed.

Speaker 3: 1:50:09

Well, yeah, that's what I'm saying In general. I would normally have that reaction. I would say like, oh God, like. But has he thought about this? But has he thought about what, with you and your and your nephew, um, who I don't know, but I've heard about for years and years and years and years, Um, I think, I think it's going to be, it'll be, a really good match, Um, uh, boss, I was trying to make a bad joke about bad matches, but, boss, uh, where can people match with you?

Speaker 2: 1:50:36

Oh, that's a that's a weird way to say it. I'm going to come out and say that that was weird. Uh, you could find me doing a few different things. Number one still completely bribing my nieces and nephews with McDonald's money Absolutely, no question, I feel fine about that. Uh, but also still on Twitter, um, posting random nonsense. And uh, making fun of people for making fun of Chicago. Uh, both at Twitter and at blue sky, it is dumbly underscore chambers. Um, please feel free to message, I will respond. I will be nice. Um, also, uh, god bless it. I promise writing. I promise something. I remember how to write words and put them together in a coherent way, and I need to do that with a picture, and then it will be a post, and that would be. Uh at the antagonist, which is antagonist, blogcom. As soon as I could put that all together, Thank you, boss, appreciate that.

Speaker 3: 1:51:31

Uh, thank you everyone for listening. Thanks for taking this, uh, this long, long journey with us through the Ted Lasso world. It's a remarkable show and you are all remarkable people for joining us. Uh, as we just try to unpack the whole thing Sometimes, I can look forward to unpacking that with you.

Speaker 3: 1:51:47

Um, and for some of you I know you've been here since day one, or you started somewhere in the middle and went back and caught up and and, uh, we just really appreciate it. It is, it is why we do it. Um, we are paid in produce, so every once in a while we'll get a cucumber from uh, for, yeah, whatever, maybe I had a cabbage. Sometimes they're ripe, yeah, so, yeah, hell, sometimes they're even right, um, but we do it for the love of the game and we do it because we love each other and when we love the community that that has been built here, um, thank you for for being so supportive. Thank you for all the new buttercups.

Speaker 3: 1:52:21

Um, I, nothing makes my day more than when I see someone jumps in and becomes part of the community because it's special and, um, it's only going to get better. Uh, we have all these, these wonderful things going on and I tell you every time I tease like oh, I'm dying to say stuff, but I just want to make sure I get everything squared away perfectly before I make any announcements. Um, but this is the time, jump in, uh, dive into the pool with us and and uh, we can continue this journey together. Um, please support, uh, the written word, your local libraries, the writers and actors who are on strike, and um, until next time, we are been till.

Speaker 1: 1:52:59

We do we uh, try the fish folks. We got a ton of it out back, yeah.