Taking Back Teaching: Navigating Trauma-Informed Practices and Educator Burnout with Lara Merchant

Lara Merchant's experiences as an early childhood special educator reveal the systemic issues within special education, from unsupportive environments to the undue pressures of implementing inappropriate strategies. We discuss the far-reaching impact of Adverse Childhood Experiences (ACEs) on learning and the necessity for specialized training to help educators manage these challenges. The conversation touches on the harsh realities faced by teachers and the emotional toll of advocating for children with intensive needs amidst systemic obstacles.

Hope is not lost, however. We share practical strategies for self-care in the face of burnout, emphasizing the importance of setting boundaries and prioritizing mental well-being. The episode underscores the value of awareness and advocacy for better support systems for educators, and highlights the positive influence of fresh perspectives brought in by new staff. Together, we aim to foster a shift towards more supportive and transparent educational environments, offering both a reality check and a glimmer of hope for those dedicated to making a difference in their students' lives.

Want to know about Lara? Visit her LinkedIn and get connected!
https://www.linkedin.com/in/laramerchant/

Check out this resource that Lara mentioned:
Psychology Today

Chapters

• 0:07 Educator Burnout and Trauma-Informed Practices
• 6:32 Challenges in Special Education & Trauma
• 13:11 Adverse Childhood Events and Education
• 18:39 Special Educator Burnout and Hope
• 23:44 Self-Care Strategies for Educators

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:07

I would say in the last two years my caseload averaged around 25 children, which is impossible, and about seven to nine of those kids had really intensive needs. So not only do I have 25 kids but then I have, you know, seven to nine children who really need intensive programming, which I just was not equipped to do with the caseload and time that I had. And so me, being an educator that feels strongly, has a strong work ethic, really want to make children progress. It felt awful, very self-defeating, because I knew I couldn't do my job well. I couldn't do the paperwork. I knew I couldn't do my job well. I couldn't do the paperwork well, I couldn't do the services well.

Speaker 2: 1:13

And that's a heavy thing my time as an educator. It is called Taught and the story was partially inspired out of anger and frustration fueled by burnout. Okay, actually, it was more than partially inspired by anger and frustration fueled by burnout Okay, actually, it was more than partially inspired by anger and frustration. But taught has also become a vehicle for me to tell what I thought at the time and in some ways continue to think was and is the real story of teaching. I now realize that my perspective is not everyone's perspective, but there are some pieces of taught that resonated with many educators perspective, but there are some pieces of taught that resonated with many educators. This podcast is an extension of that story and I, a former teacher, will interview other educators, asking them to share how they really feel about the current state of education. Why are so many teachers burnout? Why are so many like me leaving the field? We likely won't solve any problems or come up with any solutions, but we can create a community of voices that maybe begin the conversation around how educators can take back teaching. I'm Melissa LaFleur. Welcome to Ta educated, but I'm so frustrated.

Speaker 2: 2:30

When I wrote my book, one of the topics that I wanted to highlight was the fact that the education system is peppered with folks who have survived or are in the process of surviving trauma events, as we've talked about. Trauma is a response to having your fight, flight, freeze or fawn mechanism kicked in, and educators are not immune to experiencing this, nor are the students we serve or their families. And when you think about it that way, the American classroom is likely touched by trauma multiple times each day. At the end of the month, everybody's favorite therapist, melissa Anthony, will be back to give more tips on how to recognize this and cope with it. But today's guest is Laura Merchant, and she is here to share her story, a story, you might say, that's rooted in trauma.

Speaker 2: 3:24

Laura is an early childhood special educator who was inspired to return to college and earn her master's in education with a certification in trauma-informed practices and resiliency. She made this decision based on the sheer number of students and families that she was seeing year after year that were directly and indirectly affected by trauma. Now she's going to share how trauma-informed systems can help all of us with the burn of burnout. Laura is currently serving in a school as an early childhood special educator for students aged three to five, when she is not working her day job or building her consulting business to implement trauma-informed systems change for organizations. Laura is busy spending time with friends and family, exercising working on self-care, attending trauma-related conferences and courses, as well as being a pup mom to her two chihuahuas. Laura, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and we have to know the names of the pups. We're an animal loving podcast.

Speaker 1: 4:35

Hi, melissa, thanks for having me. Yeah, so my two chihuahuas are Rona, who we adopted during the pandemic. She came with the name and we thought it was very appropriate and then, a year later, we decided she really needed a playmate. So we adopted a second dog and another chihuahua mix, and her name is Cora. So the two of them together are Cora, rona. I love that. I love it.

Speaker 2: 5:05

So, laura, do you want to tell us just a little bit about you and kind of your story? Our podcast is about burnout, but just let us kind of get to know you and, if you don't mind, share your burnout story with us.

Speaker 1: 5:22

Sure. So, as you mentioned, I'm an early childhood special educator and I have a lot of families that I've worked with who have experienced all kinds of traumatic events, which is what sparked me to go into my continued learning. For trauma, and I had one little girl she was three who had experienced seven ACEs by the time she was three and I just thought, yeah, we got to do something different here. She was coming to school unable to do anything. She was crying all the time in pain because she was hungry. But it turned out there were a whole host of other issues going on behind the scenes we didn't even know about until it made the news. So we as schools just really have to do something different to address these kids. They're coming to us unable to learn, so you know, feeding them is important, as well as just knowing how to connect with them and make sure we're not re-traumatizing them. So that's kind of where my process started in this field. But for burnout, I surely have a story.

Speaker 1: 6:32

I've been in this one school system for about 15 years and I was working with well, my supervisor was just really micromanaging me. She was telling me to put things into the IEPs that just were not developmentally appropriate, create lessons that were not developmentally appropriate for the kids I was working with. And I think one of the hardest things was whenever teams made certain decisions which included the parents. I was then told to go back to the team and say, oh sorry, but we actually can't do this and we would have to go against the decision the team made, even though in the state regulations it says, you know, these decisions are made by the team and I had to be the one to give the news. So also, any mistake I made I felt like was just harped on and then I was made an example of it. Like was just harped on and then I was made an example of it. It just was a pretty toxic situation. And in the meantime, you know, I was asking for supervision. I was asking for learning how to supervise the paraeducators that I worked with, because I was never given that training. I was advocating for the kids that I worked with and nothing was heard, nothing. I just felt like every request I had was ignored, you know.

Speaker 1: 7:49

And then you think about our population of kids who, when they come to us, many are not safe with their bodies, many can't sustain attention. We have lots of children who are nonverbal and they use like an AAC device to help them communicate. They come in with a host of medical conditions and diagnoses and many of them are facing adversity and toxic stress and traumatic events. So when we talk about ACEs, I think most of your audience probably knows what those are, but a lot of the kids that I work with have them. So that would be like poverty, homelessness, food insecurity. We've had a lot of parents OD. We've had some parents die from ODing, parents are being arrested, kids are witnessing this. There's sometimes physical abuse, sexual abuse, neglect, emotional abuse, and then, of course, there's the trauma of the kids who are removed from the only home they know and the only family they know. But because they're not being taken care of properly, they're removed rightfully so and put into a foster home with people they have no idea who they are.

Speaker 1: 8:58

And you think about how traumatic that event alone is. Alone is so given. You know all this stress that is coming to school with our students and and then while, on top of it all, our community also suffered three floods in the last two years, so that wiped out the entire town and more and more families became homeless. It was devastating and we were out of school for a while because of it, because families couldn't get there. So each year, in addition to all of this already, I was getting more and more students with needs and more and more students with intensive needs coming onto my caseload, and that's been the trend really since 2009,. Since I started working here, we've just seen it grow and grow and I would say in the last two years my caseload averaged around 25 children, which is impossible, and about seven to nine of those kids had really intensive needs. So not only do I have 25 kids, but then I have, you know, seven to nine children who really need intensive programming, which I just was not equipped to do with the caseload and time that I had.

Speaker 1: 10:12

And so me, being an educator that feels strongly, has a strong work ethic, really want to make children progress, it felt awful, very self-defeating, because I knew I couldn't do my job well, I couldn't do the paperwork well, I couldn't do the services well, and that's a heavy thing to carry as an educator. And so you know, and then during COVID, with short staffing, ever since we've needed to sub, which is just, I think, inappropriate. But we're short staffed. What do you do Right. So they would pull in the special educator to be a sub for a one-on-one paraeducator. Well, when that happens, that means none of the 24 other kids that I have on my caseload don't get services. Parents didn't even know this was happening because the school was not sharing it.

Speaker 1: 11:01

So I really advocated for well, not being able to not subbing anymore, but also just saying like, hey, these are all the kids who are not getting their services and these are how many hours that they have lost. So, no matter how many times I reached out or I called them out on not being transparent, again, I just felt like I was ignored. So, to summarize everything with the burnout incredible stress, not feeling heard, not feeling valued, not feeling respected, not having that transparency, and just the stress level was just so all-consuming, like I wasn't sleeping well, I wasn't eating well because I just needed to take things on the fly and it was mostly not healthy food. Um, there was no time to exercise and um, again, just feeling like I couldn't do any part of my job. Well, it's just really devastating to feel that way.

Speaker 1: 11:58

So I really did want to leave the job. Um, I wasn't able to, just because, given that I do have dogs. I'm kind of constrict, you know, restricted to a certain radius of where I can work, and there just weren't any jobs available that fit what I wanted to do. So I just thought, well, I'll stick it out.

Speaker 2: 12:19

So the dogs being so you can go home and let them out and stuff while you while you work. Yeah, you know, if I commute one hour away, I'm gone for 1011 hours a day, dogs being so you can go home and let them out and stuff while you work. Sure, yeah.

Speaker 1: 12:25

Sure, you know, if I commute an hour away, I'm gone for 10, 11 hours a day.

Speaker 2: 12:30

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm going to take us back just a little bit, because you mentioned ACEs, which are adverse childhood events. Can you just give us a little idea, because I don't know that everybody listening has had the training around ACEs? It's so important, but why is it important to know how many ACEs a student has?

Speaker 1: 12:56

Right. So those ACEs are some of those things I listed earlier and it's important. I don't know all the statistics or the numbers and percentages, but it's important. I don't know all the statistics but it or the numbers and percentages, but it's important because the more ACEs you have, the more. The greater risk you're, the greater at risk you are for really horrible health outcomes later on in life. So things like cancer, diabetes, hypertension pretty much almost everything can be traced back to trauma, because it really impacts you in the body, not just in your brain, but in the body, way down to the cellular level, and so it's really, really detrimental, which is also why therapy needs to be body-based therapy to work it out of your body. So you know, we can't prevent ACEs from happening, especially in the school, but we can do our best to not make it worse. We can do our best to just really support kids when they're there and give them what they need while they're in school with us.

Speaker 2: 14:05

And when those little brains are in that state of going through one of those adverse challenges, they're not at that place we need them to be for learning, and it does take a lot of work on our part as educators to kind of level that playing field for them, because they're coming in at a disadvantage for sure, a disadvantage for sure, trying to fit into these systems that are not created for those kinds of things. Yet we see more and more year after year, and we had a whole generation of students go through the pandemic and online learning, which is an adverse childhood event in and of itself, added to other ones that are happening.

Speaker 1: 14:50

Yeah, absolutely, and you brought up a really good point, because when a child is triggered, we most likely won't know what that trigger is.

Speaker 1: 15:00

That may make it hard to prevent it in the future. But when a child is triggered like, say, even by a smell or something that reminds them of something scary or traumatic at home or some event that happened to them, they go into fight, flight or freeze and what that is is like that's the lower part of your brain, where your prefrontal cortex is offline completely. That's your logical and thinking part of your brain. So if you go up to the kid when they're triggered and having this either outburst of dysregulation or they're frozen, they're withdrawing. That is about the time to try to rationalize with them to get them out of it, because that's not going to work, because they're not in their rational brain and so people who don't understand ACEs and trauma might not understand how to approach a child appropriately who's going through that. So yes, absolutely. They cannot learn if they can't even have a conversation about how to calm my body down, you know.

Speaker 2: 15:57

Well, and as you're saying that, I'm sitting here thinking about everything that you just listed off that is going on in the area that you're living in, in the schools, and so it does take a special kind of training to help students with these unique issues, as well as anyone who has a cognitive or intellectual disability. This is not something that just somebody off the streets can come in and say, oh well, they're being triggered right now and deal with. I mean, we need people who have been trained and are professionals. And gosh, laura, one of the things that I hear on the podcast over and over and I saw it myself when I was in the classroom that special education teachers are being brought in to. So we have and for anybody that doesn't know, any student on an IEP has a certain number of minutes that the special education team is supposed to be meeting for their unique learning needs. Additionally, some of those minutes are for pull-out supervision and that is usually done by a paraeducator who has been given specific training and things to work on with that student. The special education teacher generally pulls students in to work with them one-on-one on their learning goals. So when Laura says that she's being pulled from her job as a special education teacher to go in and work one-on-one with a student that a teacher doesn't have the ability to work with one-on-one because they have a classroom full of students. All the students that would be attending their pull-out groups don't get to go to those groups.

Speaker 2: 17:49

So there's multiple levels of this. First of all, that a law is being broken because that IEP is a legally binding document saying it's a trust contract between the school district and the family and the student, saying that those services are going to be provided. And this isn't just in your school that this is happening. It's happening all over where special education teachers sometimes, laura, it's an entire class because you're a certified teacher they're in there for second grade all day long because they have a high need student in there.

Speaker 2: 18:24

So now you're expected to teach content that you're not familiar with, as well as supervise all of these students that you don't have a relationship with and attend to the learning needs of the student who is on the IEP. And it is so frustrating to me and I just want to keep shouting it out from the building tops because it's not fair and I don't have a solution for this, but I do think there needs to be an awareness of it, because it is crushing special educators. It is crushing them and we're going to lose them and I don't know what we're going to do. So when you're saying that about they're not in the right thinking brain and they need somebody with the training to be there, I think how that is becoming like a you know, a unicorn. We can't. It's rare, right.

Speaker 1: 19:14

Yeah, yeah, unfortunately, and yeah, you just shared a whole bunch of stuff you know hits home and I'm just so sorry to hear that that's a theme for you. That that's. You're hearing that from so many educators from different walks of life and from all over the place. I just and I don't know the answer to to the short staffing piece I don't know what we can do about that, except for somehow put in the budgets that we need to pay people more, um, and treat them better, which is also a part of the trauma informed care that I talk about. So I think there's a school crisis right now across the country, and it's not just the school being short staffed, but just what you said too, like being pulled in so many different directions or having so much more being placed on you, bigger expectations of things that one person just simply cannot do on you bigger expectations of things that one person just simply cannot do?

Speaker 2: 20:20

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, I saw in your notes and this is another theme that we go into the school year and at the beginning of the year and I'm going to say the last three years of my teaching career for sure we had people come in and tell us how important self-care was going to be for us. If we don't have time to go to the bathroom during the school day, we sure as hell don't have time for self-care. And again, I'm repeating myself for people who listen to my podcast all the time, but I'm, like you know, a PTO. Coming in and bringing me snacks once a week is not self-care. Actually, it's doing the opposite, if you're me, because you can't stay out of them. So it's creating heartburn and all kinds of things like weight gain, high blood pressure adding to that.

Speaker 1: 21:10

So yeah, yeah, we hear that all the time. Oh, I know, you know, this has been really tough year. You really just need to start taking care of yourself and okay, but what are you doing to help that? You're really just making it worse. You're making it worse and giving me less and less time to be able to do that.

Speaker 2: 21:26

So well, and I have have a friend who I tried to get her come on the podcast. I'm like, oh, you got to do this. And she's like, no, I'm not doing it, I don't want to get fired. But she said she messaged me and said you are not going to believe this After everything we've talked about. I actually went to an in service today and they told us that the path to self care finding, remembering what your hobbies are, finding them again and going back to them and she said I forgot what my hobbies are and I don't have time to do anything include sit down and try to remember what they were. I was like preach it girl, preach it All right. So I don't know, did you move out of burnout, do you feel like you're still in that space or have you found some things that work for you, that kind of help you cope?

Speaker 1: 22:32

found some things that have been helpful. I would say last year I started the school year with this whole mindset of I can only do what I can do. I'm one person and maybe things won't get done and that's going to have to be okay and I'm going to just have to do the best that I can and not stress about it, because I'm being asked to do things that are not humanly possible for one person and so I just can't let that stress eat me alive, like it had been the prior years. So that helped a lot with last year. It didn't change anything in terms of my caseload or the paperwork or anything, but it helped with my mentality and my mindset a little bit. But this year I entered it with yet even more kind of advice for myself and I can certainly give it to other people. But that aside, I just want to say I think things are also shifting for us. So I feel really hopeful. In my school there's some new blood coming in, so people are kind of shifting to a different direction of support and transparency. So I think that's going to be a game changer for a lot of people. But in terms of the individual teacher or educator, what you can do or at least what I've done that's been helpful is yes, I have those mantras right. Like I am only one person, I can only do my best, um, and I just have to let the rest go because I can't. Obsessing over it's not going to change anything. Worrying about it Won't change anything. So the other things that, um, I would definitely recommend is know your contract, know what your contract is and what your rights are in terms of what you're being asked to do, just to make sure it does fall within that. And if it does not, then go contact your union rep and talk with them about it and just say you know, is this something that's really okay or are they really asking something way beyond? And if so, then help me figure out the next steps.

Speaker 1: 24:27

Learning to set boundaries super important. So at the start of this year, I just went in and I informed my team. I said listen, during my paperwork time, I'm going to put a note on my door and that's going to be a do not disturb time. I have to get it done in those times, so you can't interrupt me unless you know there's a huge crisis, but otherwise, do not interrupt me.

Speaker 1: 24:48

Setting those boundaries, really knowing that you can say no, which I've learned to do. I've been asked to sub again and I actually said no. I said I'm not going to do it because it's not my job and I need to serve my kids on my caseload, and nobody said anything about it, just let it happen and figured something else out. So, knowing what you can say no to, or even being daring to say no, and you know what you can tolerate saying yes to without sacrificing yourself, I highly recommend stopping checking work emails when you're home. That's something I used to do all the time and I got sucked in. And then, you know, one thing led to another and all of a sudden you're doing more work. So once yeah, can you?

Speaker 2: 25:35

relate I can. Well, I have a friend that says I have never saved a life by checking my email at home. That's a great, and that hit me. I was like, yeah, we're not saving lives by checking our emails here, and there's never anything that can't be solved the next day.

Speaker 1: 25:58

So Exactly, exactly. So, yeah, shut off that computer, don't check, don't have it on your phone, don't let it ping. Yes, yes, and I know this is really hard for teachers and there is some expectations that you know we will take work home with us. That's kind of part of the job. However, you know, to the extent that I was taking work home was just insane. It was like every single night, all the weekends I was staying up till about 11 o'clock doing paperwork because I couldn't fit it into my workday and that's just not acceptable because that's really sacrificing my well-being and my ability to do anything that's good for me, let alone be with family. So I would say, as much as you can, leave the work at the door, do not walk out of the school building with it, if you can help it goal building with it, if you can help it.

Speaker 2: 26:49

And let's let's be honest, anything I took home I typically didn't do anyway, I was just carrying that back and forth, you know I mean why carry it, why even take it there?

Speaker 1: 27:06

Well, sure, there are times I've done that too, but there are times. It's like, you know, the past couple of years I just had no choice because stuff wasn't going to get done. But I'm not going to do that anymore because I'm starting to realize that I'm more important because if I, as we all know, when you take care of yourself, you can better take care of others, Right, so I have to take care of me first. Um, the other thing I think is super important, which, again, we don't really give ourselves time for, we may not feel like we have time for try to give yourself some breaks throughout the day, even if it's like one minute, to just center yourself. You know, do some deep breathing. If you have five minutes, even better, you can do like a quick five minute meditation. There are apps that help you do that. Take a quick walk, One of the things I started incorporating, which sounds a little silly, but anytime I have to go to the bathroom, I will walk to the farthest bathroom in the school just to get in some steps and some movement and to have a breather, Because otherwise I'm just literally going right into that bathroom back in the classroom, so it gives me a little opportunity for a break. And then the self-care, of course. You know we have to really make that a priority in our, in our off time. So whatever that looks like for any individual, make sure you're doing that.

Speaker 1: 28:18

So another big thing actually exercise. And I know it's not for everybody, but I know it's so good for our bodies, it's so good for our bodies, it's so good for our brains. Um, and I would say also well for me. I knew that I would never exercise after work. So, um, cause that's really hard, you come home, you're exhausted and you have stuff to do. So I actually started for the first time this year implementing um, my exercise classes in the morning, which I thought I'm never going to be able to do. This Cause I like my sleep. I want to sleep right up to my alarm, but I set it an hour earlier and I go to the gym and my class is from like six to six 45,. Come home, shower, do my stuff and go to work. And it's, it's been really helpful because I'm sticking to it and I'm doing it a few times a week, not every day, but it makes such a difference in how I feel, and even gives me a lot of opportunity to focus better during the day, just having moved my body and taking in that fresh well, not fresh air unless you're outside, but just being able to really get oxygen into your brain and to move your body before you have to either sit for long periods of time.

Speaker 1: 29:30

And the other thing is, if you're making any positive change with anything in life, that you don't want to do a whole bunch of things at once because the likelihood of us following through with those successfully probably won't happen. So just do one tiny change at a time. So even if that means, okay, I'm going to walk to the fireless bathroom, that'll be my thing for the next few weeks. Okay, Maybe at home I'm going to start making sure I go to bed at this time, you know, just implementing tiny, tiny increments at a time. Therapy has been a game changer for me. So I know that. You know, just a lot of people have their own traumas too and their own adversities from childhood and from adulthood, and so, for me, going to therapy and learning how to do some body and breath work helps me with my own trauma and learning some coping strategies that I can implement during the day 100%.

Speaker 2: 30:26

So I'm going to go backwards here a little bit because I think you have touched on some really amazing things, ending there with the therapy piece, because I mean it's one thing for our colleagues and the people who are trying to help us out with these in-services and trainings and stuff. It's one thing for them to tell us you need to do these things. It's another thing to have someone sit down with you and say here are some strategies to take care of you when you're in this situation that are unique for you, right? Because most of the time we get that stuff in these big kind of vague pieces of advice. You know, this year, make sure you're taking time for yourself. Well, what does that mean? That probably means something different for me than it does you, and a therapist will really help you parcel some of that out and see what the big pieces you really need are. So I think that's such a huge piece. I also like what you said about getting exercise, and I've shared this on the podcast before, but it's certainly worth sharing again.

Speaker 2: 31:45

One of my pieces on my journey as far as burnout was that my anxiety level was just off the charts and that ended up kind of pushing me into a place of apathy and depression. And I really feel that exercise and I'm going to keep saying it over and over doesn't have to be going to the gym. That was not my jam back in the beginning, it was just going for a walk. But I could not miss my walk. I really needed that every day, just to get out, get some fresh air and get some movement. And it took a while but eventually it kind of helped bring that anxiety level and depression. It made it manageable for me but it took a while for it to kick in. But I do think that that was just a huge, huge piece and I really love there were many of these. I think that could have been put into the boundary category that you said all super important.

Speaker 2: 32:52

One of the hardest parts for me as an educator was setting those boundaries. And we have a profession here of nurturers. I mean, we're mamas, you know we are going to take care of our babies. We're mama bears. We're also mama who's going to give you a snuggle when you need it, give you a hug. You know. Mama who's going to make you do what needs to be done.

Speaker 2: 33:18

And we feel just this connection with these kids and families year after year. And that is what makes it hard, because we know the work that we're doing is vital and important. And if anybody doesn't know that, just revisit the pandemic years, just look at what those kids went through when they didn't have that extra set of mamas and I don't want to miss out on my guys here mamas and dads, they needed us, parents needed us, society needed us, and you didn't have us for about a year and we see the results of that. But it puts a huge burden of responsibility on our backs because we do feel the need to take care of these kids and families and that I think.

Speaker 2: 34:04

You can disagree with me if you want to, but I think that's what makes setting these boundaries so hard. It has this high, this feeling of that it's high risk if we aren't responsive immediately or if we're not going the extra mile, you begin to think that something really bad is going to happen to these kids or families and we forget that it's a job. So those boundaries are crucial for us and I just want to thank you so much for laying it out there, because it was all just boom, boom, boom as you were going through. I loved it.

Speaker 1: 34:42

Yeah, I actually just wanted to make a comment about something that you said. You know, thinking about the pandemic which caused a whole host of issues for our students. You know the lack of being with other people, like more and more phone, smartphone usage and social media, which we know the negative impacts of that, and just not having regular schedules and for some kids, not even having food right, because we even we feed kids and we feed them in my school we feed them breakfast, we feed them lunch and they get to take home food. It's really, really critical to me.

Speaker 1: 35:32

So how do you think the numbers went in terms of, like, department of Children and Families reporting calls went during the pandemic and I was like, oh my gosh, it must have gone way up. And he said, well, no, because nobody was seeing the kids, they were all home, so nobody saw or heard what was happening. So the number of reports went way down. And so even for their safety you know not that anybody likes making a report and of course we all really want those relationships with the families and we want to be able to have that nice trusting relationship with them. Even when mandated reporters, we have to report what we hear and what we see, so even just keeping them safe. But, yes, the level of commitment that we all have as educators um, you're right, it makes those boundaries hard.

Speaker 2: 36:14

But they're so necessary because if we're not healthy then we're not showing up well for them anyway. So, and we've I really think that you know I I've labeled the last few episodes taking back teaching, because this is ours Educators, we made this system and without us there isn't one. So we've got to take it back and we've got to kind of set those parameters up in a better way that's more sustainable for all of us, absolutely. This concludes part one of a two-part interview. Please join us next week for part two. Thanks.

Speaker 2: 37:02

Today's episode was produced and edited by me. The theme music is by Otis McDonald featuring Joni Enoz. If you know someone who might enjoy these conversations, please share the podcast episodes as much and as often as you can. It's as simple as copying the link you use to access today's episode and sending it in a message or sharing it on social media. I'm a small, independent operation and your shares broaden our audience. Perhaps you or someone you know will be inspired to talk about teacher burnout. If you would like to get your voice on my podcast, contact me via the link on my webpage taughtbuzzsproutcom. Coach speaker and author Rashid Ogunlaro said it may take many voices for people to hear the same message. Join me in being one of the many voices rising up to get the message out around educator burnout. This is Melissa LaFleur. Thank you for listening to TAUT the podcast.

Speaker 2: 38:07

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Speaker 1: 39:01

Thank, you for tuning in.