Kate Santucci | Artist

In this episode of Rodney Veal’s Inspired By, Rodney down with encaustic and mixed-media artist Kate Santucci to trace her creative journey from theater costuming and ballet tutus to stone and wood sculpture, and ultimately to her luminous, layered encaustic paintings.

Learn more about Kate online: www.katehusersantucci.com

Follow Kate on Instagram: @katesantucciart

Transcript

SPEAKERS

Ad, Kate Santucci, Rodney Veal

Rodney Veal  00:11

Hello everyone. My name is Rodney Veal and welcome to Rodney Veal's Inspired By podcast. Today I get to talk. It's like, just like a gentle hug with a lovely, charming, talented person, individual who is just making some of the most compelling, hauntingly beautiful art and changing it all up, and is on a really masterful artistic journey. Miss Kate Santucci, So Kate, welcome to the podcast. Hello.

Kate Santucci  00:42

Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here and talk to you. It's always a, just a total joy to talk to you so and that was so, that was so kind.

Rodney Veal  00:54

You know, I never introduce people unless I really genuinely feel that way. I just like, I try to stay in the lane of honesty about your work, and I think you're just a lovely person. You really, really are, and so, and it was telling someone at lunch today, I said, I'm talking to K Santucci. And I said, we've known each other for a while, yeah, different circumstances, which I'm sure will come up in the podcast. But what I love is the fact that, you know, I get to kind of, I full disclosure, folks, Kate's studio is right next to where we film the art show, the broadcast episodes of the art show at Front Street Art Gallery studios, art studios. And Kate is a wonderful neighbor, which is great I can say I'm talking about so, So Kate, I am super excited to talk about where it all began. We need to go. We're going way back because, just out of curiosity, way back because, you know, being an artist, and, you know, being an artist myself, and you know, it starts, you know, starts young, and people really understand that. And I think every person we've talked to, let's talk about this. So when did you discover at the young, ripe age, when you were a young girl, Kate, about what did you did you did? Do you envision being an artist? Was it like, what hooked you?

Kate Santucci  02:17

Um, I mean, yes, that was, it was pretty much always on my radio when I was really young. I thought I wanted to be an interior designer, but I had, like this, this fashion plate toy. And, you know, I mean, it was like, always doing things like that, like just totally creative into coloring, all the things that kids do. And I think that I want to say, like I was maybe 12. I was I was 11. I was 11 because I was in the sixth grade, and I got put into one of those, like classes for the bright kids classes. And so, like, one day a week, I got taken out of my classroom, and I went to this classroom with all these other kids, and they were like, so intimidating. They were like, we were 11, and they're, they're doing these projects on the binary system, and, you know, just like all of these, all of these math things and science things that are awesome, but I was just like, so out of my place. I was so stressed out and so anxious about it that I spent my entire time color like drawing on they had these huge blackboards, and that the teacher who taught that class stored all of his art stuff there, and I made, I made a mural across the entire the entire Blackboard, and then later discovered I made it with oil pastels. So it was a huge problem, chalkboard, oil pastels on the chalkboard. But I remember that the instructor like talking to my mom and and dad and being like, can we just kind of an anxious child? But she's definitely an artist. She's like, artist smart. We're okay, you know. But I, I didn't fit in with the smart kids class in the way that they were the smart kids. I was definitely always on that, like, art path and painting. And he just let me. He was like, I have such fond memories of this guy, because he he was like, You are here to do what, what you need to do. And he let me all day, just like, fill this entire and he knew it was oil pastel, like he just let me do it and, and I spent an entire year just making things in that class.

Rodney Veal  04:38

So wow, that's the start of the, yeah, wow. And it really, because, you know, thing is, you know that first moment just does impact you and such. And it always, I love the fact that it was a teacher who said, I see where her gifts lie exactly. Just let her explore and be.

Kate Santucci  04:56

How fortunate to have that experience. Because I think a lot of kids don't. Don't, it's just, you know, maybe that's their inclination, but it's kind of tamped down, and I always have felt supported in that way. So, like, this teacher was amazing. My parents were great. They like, they had no idea. They were like, whatever, you know. And I went to, I went to school, I started as in theater, as a costume design major, and spent two years in a theater program at Wright State, actually,

Rodney Veal  05:22

really, I didn't know. I honestly did not know that. I really did, yeah,

Kate Santucci  05:26

that's my background. It's in costume design. I worked for the Dayton ballet right after college for two years a year and a half. I don't It was right before I had my kids, so that's why I left.

Rodney Veal  05:39

So that would have been. What year would that have been? Let's

Kate Santucci  05:43

see. I They were born in 97 so it was like 9596

Rodney Veal  05:47

Oh, my goodness, yeah. Oh, my God. Who would have thought that our lives would intersect ballet? Because that's where I started dancing in the second right, many moons ago before that?

Kate Santucci  06:01

Yeah, I was there. I worked in the shop and building, building tutus.

Rodney Veal  06:09

Let me tell you, people, that is a thing. There's a very, there's a very specific way to build a tutu. Oh, yes, and I watched and observed. I mean, I never men don't wear tutus. We wear tunics with the jackets. But it was as I always watch. And I was like, Yeah, it's like, how to to make that work is and, I mean, did you kind of come in with that skill, or did they train you up for it? Because I'm kind of curious. It seems like that's passed down, like by,

Kate Santucci  06:38

I mean, I learned how to make dance wear at Dayton ballet like I had never really done that, although I'd made stuff for theater department. Like I was, I learned how to sew. I learned how to tailor. I was the first two years in theater in the design tech program at right state for costuming was very hands on technical so, like, I sew really well I can, you know, I and then I moved, yeah, I like, I learned that hard skill there. And then at the Dayton ballet, I learned how to, you know, the specifics of making dance wear, which I hadn't done a lot of at right state. So, yeah, that's my background. Is fiber arts. For what, first art, fiber arts. And then I left the design tech theater program after two years at Wright State and transferred to fine art. I just felt like, I felt like what I loved about the program was the creating and the thinking of the things. And I didn't love, sorry, I didn't love work, the actual work, which, yeah, theater is very different than what the work of being on stage, like the backstage, I

Rodney Veal  07:54

that is, yeah, lean stuff backstage. I don't think people stand that. And because you kind of touch on, like, as a performer, you do kind of touch on it a bit. So you just kind of know you're standing there a long time while someone's fitting you. Yeah, come back and they're going to refit you. They're going to come back and they're going to refit you. It's a and then I know that you spent the hours and hours, because it has to be, it has to be durable enough to last dancing. And so you kind of put a lot of extra work into that, that process. I get it,

Kate Santucci  08:27

yeah, I mean, it is, though, I did love working actual shows, because being backstage and being part of that magic is, like, that's very cool, that's really cool, that's that's really fun. But yeah, the hours and hours and last minute panic and being at the shop until two in the morning to finish the thing, I was like, You know what? I don't love it.

Rodney Veal  08:48

Can only imagine. So you do that switch over so you stayed at right state for the art. Yeah, people. I every time I talk to people, because I've talked to quite a few people who've gone through right state performing through the performing arts and also visual arts. That is, that's a strong program.

Kate Santucci  09:07

It is, yeah, so let's see. I started in theater in 89 and then I transferred in 91 and I graduated. I spent an extra year there. I graduated from right state in 94 and when I went, when I transferred over, my concentration was in sculpture, because I was still very much in that, like, three dimensional building. So, yeah, when I graduated, I was doing stone and wood carvings like,

Rodney Veal  09:38

I mean, oh, I love this. I love about my job. I get to find out and discover things. How do I like? I'll see you. What? Cars, yeah, oh my gosh. So, yeah, so you, so, you just kind of dove into that. And so, you know, obviously, with Dayton ballet, it's a job. It pays a bill, right? Yeah, purpose. You got kids. I. You totally get

Kate Santucci  10:01

that, right? Yeah, I had to, I had to bow out when I had twins. And I was like, I Yeah, Max, I can't have him with me yet.

Rodney Veal  10:09

This is see folks. This is the interaction that I was talking about, because I taught Max and Leo and I choreographed for them at Sinclair Community College, where they were they were students, so it's kind of like a full circle. So we saw each other. It was really kind of funny. That's the funny. There's Rodney, there's Kate, who knew that in 2026 we'd be sitting down for a podcast to talk about your art.

Kate Santucci  10:32

I know it's kind of crazy. It's just, you know, and when my kids came home from school talking about their dance class, and they're not, they're not dancers, they are actors. And I, you know, I think they're great but, but they loved it. They were like, oh, Rodney, so great. Multiple times

Rodney Veal  10:51

you've heard all about me. I'm like, my reputation preceded me. I was like, I do admit that, at least I made the classes fun, because you did what I know. This is not the easiest art form, and you're asking people who are not native to it to kind of do it. I'm like, and I never really understood I understood it theoretically for theater, man, that's gotta play like, there's nothing worse than all of a sudden. So it pushes the button, and they go, 5678, and you're like, that's an awkward moment. So, so, so you were like, so, the thing is, I love the fact that we had that intersection and, but then it was like, you know, so, but then, you know, Max and Leo graduated, and, but then I would see the art scene, because it was like, so did you kind of, like, how did you transition into kind of one? From three dimensional with sculpting and creating pieces, and what was exciting? Well, first, let me ask question, what was exciting about sculpting and creating? Because I I'm not a 3d person. I, you know, this is hard, but I have 3d elements to my work, and I kind of always skirt around it. And I'm always curious as to why people kind of gravitate towards three dimensional.

Kate Santucci  12:03

I, for me, there was very much a I'm very process oriented. So having something like physical in my hands that I can manipulate feels very like I just very natural to me. So like moving from the, you know, fiber arts, like building costumes and sewing and doing that, and then thinking about, you know, how you're, you're, you're making, you're making art. But this, this, that was art somebody could wear. And then this is, like, something that gives you the opportunity. It's like, nobody's going to wear it. I don't have to worry about the the little like it being functional, I guess. But it was just, I don't know, it was like a process, a process of seeing something come out of it. And it was not, it was it was interesting, because it was difficult for me. I have a hard time thinking about three dimensional things. Like when had to take a graph drafting class in theater, and we were asked to it was like way back before CAD court day, right hand, hand drawing projections. And we had to do this little exercise where you had this weird, like cube thing, with things sticking out of it at weird angles. And you had to draw it from without having it. It wasn't a real thing that you had to draw, like, from the top down, from the side, from the back. And mine were always just wrong, just wrong. I, like, couldn't picture it. So, like, the transition from like, visual, like, my brain to reality is I have a hard time thinking about it, but I don't have a hard time making it. And I it's hard to explain why. So, like, when I have the thing in my hands and I'm turning physically, turning

Rodney Veal  13:57

it just it's not because I don't want to abuse the word organic, because it's not organic, but it's just an intuitive you just kind of okay, because now it's like, it's, it is manifest and real as material, but not necessarily its final

Kate Santucci  14:14

form, right?

Rodney Veal  14:17

I get you i But that's, that's where I skirt around it, because I'm like, Oh, well, yeah,

Kate Santucci  14:23

I it's, it's hard to explain. I, I feel like, I mean, I was very attracted to the subtractive method, like I was carving stone and carving wood, so I was taking chunks out of these, like big pieces of soapstone and Alabaster and things like that. And you can't put them back once you've taken a job. So it is. It's kind of of the moment. It's very like that, very process oriented. But watching something come out of this solid block of wood or or stone is is magical. It's like. Yeah, so you're

Rodney Veal  15:01

not, so you're not, you weren't, like, visualizing, like, I see the block and I go, I see the shape within the block. You just, I usually just

Kate Santucci  15:09

had to start. I mean, I had an idea. And that's kind of always the way I work. I just, I have to get something, I have to get something on, on the on the canvas, on the like, a chunk out of the stone. It's like, where are we going? And, you know, because of the process of sculpture, there was definitely, I was looking at the thing itself, because there's flaws, and there's chips, and there's swirls of color in the stone and and it's like, well, what, what is that saying about like that needs to come out of there? So most of, most of my work, in that was, was always abstract. I was never trying to do any kind of like figurative work.

Rodney Veal  15:54

But you But even in the abstraction, you weren't sketching, or you weren't like, no, oh, you know, it warms my heart because I was, I was like, I'm like, the worst artist who doesn't sketch. I just couldn't, yeah. It's like, I just, I don't, yeah, it's like, sometimes just intuitive of materials. You just kind of touch it. You go, this. Will do this. I'm like, Okay, well, let's see, right? And you follow it, yeah,

Kate Santucci  16:20

you just kind of need to let it flow through you. I think Mark making is and like making, making art, for me is that process of you, it's like, I just need to start and let it lead me. And there's kind of a back and forth, you know, it's like I might see something start to emerge. It's like I'm going down that, that path now, and let it, you know, become, become whatever it's becoming, man, it feels like, when I talk with talk about stuff in this way, like she's like, what?

Rodney Veal  16:49

But it's not. But the thing is, I that's why I love talking about art on the podcast, because I want people, because a lot of people are listening to podcasts, are not artists like we did. So they kind of, I want to demystify, so they understand, like, no people, how you think artists create is not what you it's not cookie cutter, because we're all different. I mean, all right, absolutely. It's like, you know we're that, but, but also too, like, when we talk about it, you saw me moving my hands with you, like, yeah, I understand it. I mean, I'm like, okay, that makes sense, and you just kind of validate it. Thank God about not sketching, because I just feel, I just feel like people go, you sketch work like No, no, and I just like I should be but then I realized, nah, I don't.

Kate Santucci  17:36

I'm much more likely to scribble little snippets of thoughts and words down, sometimes even on the board or something, before I start than I am to make a sketch like I do sketch, but not the pieces I'm working on. I don't think I like I sketch in a sketchbook, because I feel like it's a skill I would like to

Rodney Veal  17:57

kind of continue to Yeah, yeah, and I try to do it, but it just, it's not for the end product, like the end result journey, like the entry point to making the work, yeah.

Kate Santucci  18:09

And I guess I should say, like, in the last few years, since I started exploring some figurative work, those, that's kind of a two part thing. So it's like, whatever it's, my backgrounds and everything are very intuitive and very not thought out. And then the figurative part I do so play more planning for than I had in the past with other stuff.

Rodney Veal  18:35

So that's like, is a good, kind of really great segue into this conversation about transitioning from three dimensional work to the so did you? Did you have a period when you went from that and you transition into the work that, that I've come to know you for? Yeah, well, there's a different kind of was it? Was it just the paintings and the surfaces?

Kate Santucci  18:59

Yeah, it was a pretty it was kind of a sudden transition, in a way, because I was home with my kids for a long time, and I wasn't carving stone. I wasn't carving what, you know, because I was making, like, large pieces. I didn't have anywhere to do that. It didn't have a studio. I didn't have the spoons mentally to do anything else. And so my, my, I don't want to say that my world got smaller. It just got more focused and concentrated. I was, I was, like, parenting, and I was, you know, like, pretty house oriented, and I it was fine. It was a period of time that I went through. And then, as my kids got older, I started doing little things that I could have with me, so like tiny drawings and sketches. And then I found this material. I can't even remember what it's called. It makes a total mess, but you can, like, scratch into it to make carvings. And I was making these little bas reliefs because I could stick them in my bag when we were out somewhere doing something. And I would, um, gosh, what is that stuff

Rodney Veal  20:02

called? I don't, I can see it, and I can't,

Kate Santucci  20:05

like, it's like, this orange color, foamy

Rodney Veal  20:08

stuff, right? And you can, you scoop things,

Kate Santucci  20:11

you can carve it, right? So I could

Rodney Veal  20:14

script, yeah, yeah. So malleable, right?

Kate Santucci  20:17

I can, I made this little series of bar relief carvings, and did some stuff like that. And then I'm trying to remember how long ago it was now. I don't remember the year, at least 12 years ago, I went to a workshop in Michigan at the krasl Arts Center in Saint Joe's, Michigan. They had this weekend encaustic workshop. And I was like, You know what would be super fun. I'm just gonna go, because I had a really close friend who was the director of the krasl. And I was like, Hey, I'm gonna come stay with you and take this workshop. I need a break. So I did. And in fact, I took my studio, made Alicia Franz went with me, and it was years it was years ago. We've been friends for years. And I was like, Hey, let's go up to Michigan and do this workshop. And it's one of those things where, like, we had a great time. She had fun. I had fun. But for me, it like, clicked. The medium was just like, Oh, I love this. I loved everything about it. I loved the process. I loved the materials themselves. I loved the smell of it. I loved it like the way that it was sort of a combination of sculpture and two dimensional media, because it's very it can be very textural, and you can carve into it, and you can layer it, you can build it up and or you can do it really smooth and Painterly. There's like a million things you can do within caustic. And it just really spoke to me. It spoke to me as a medium. And so I came home and I set up, like, cleaned out a space in my I have this walk up attic. I live in this old house, and I cleaned out a space, and I'm like, I am working at beer and built a little a little studio. Was making little tiny pieces as I figured out what I was doing and, like, spend a bunch of money, although, I have to say, as a getting started sort of a thing you can, you can do it without spending an insane amount of money. It was like, but that was and, yeah, yeah,

Rodney Veal  22:19

but there was but that's, but that's, you know, sometimes we we live and learn when we do. But it was really interesting, like, what in costume? Because for a longest time, you know, I never really understood encaustic until I saw your work, and then I saw Landon. Landon Crow, oh, yeah, yeah, okay, you know. And it was like, oh. It was like, the two of you literally opened my eyes to Oh. And so for and I want people to understand why, what my was like, the, you know, the material. Because a lot of people don't know what encaustic is. They think they don't know. Explain to them what the base material of encaustic is.

Kate Santucci  23:04

So encaustic is basically painting with beeswax. So it is a mixture of beeswax and a little bit of an ingredient called Damar, which is a natural tree resin. So these two things are combined. It's like 85% beeswax generally, and the rest is tomorrow, which is a hardener, and it kind of raises the melting point so that it's not as delicate with as just beeswax. And you you mix it together, and you melt it, and you add pigment to it, and that is your paint. So it is, it is used molten. So I have, like, basically, like, big griddles in my studio. You can buy really expensive, like, encaustic griddles. But why? You know, I mean, I for $30 you can buy a griddle, right,

Rodney Veal  23:57

right? And thrift stores are the best,

Kate Santucci  23:59

right, right? Oh yeah, totally. I have a couple from the thrift store and little metal tins. And I my paint is in there, and it's, you use it at around 200 degrees, so it gets put on a wood, generally, a wooden substrate, like a panel.

Rodney Veal  24:16

Do you primes? You prime the wood panel. You There are

Kate Santucci  24:19

encaustic primers. But I usually don't prime the panel because that first couple layers of medium that you put on there, of the encaustic medium has no pigment in it. It's just clear. And you brush it on there, and then you fuse it with a torch so it like sinks in. I know the process is like, so yummy torch. Hands, yeah. So you, you, you brush it on, and then you melt it, and few with a torch in those first few layers, sort of like sink into the wood panel and form a bond with bond.

Rodney Veal  24:57

So give you it almost it gives you a chemical. Just. Uh, right, like a surface, like it's, yes, the it's almost like you primed it. Now you can really go in

Kate Santucci  25:07

and you can, you can use there are, there is an encaustic primer, and it's just like a very porous um primer, because you need that wax to go into whatever you are painting. So you cannot use acrylic with um encaustic at all because it's plastic. It's a barrier. It won't, it won't like to it, it won't, right?

Rodney Veal  25:27

There's no teeth to the there's no teeth, right? You

Kate Santucci  25:30

have to have that porous material. So, and also, you're fusing with a torch. So if you've got an encod, if you've got encaustic over acrylic, then you're going to basically be burning plastic under your wax. It's just that

Rodney Veal  25:46

that's, does it sound healthy? Doesn't sound healthy?

Kate Santucci  25:50

Toxic and nasty? And yeah, so yes. Like, one of the things I just love about encaustic is that that natural materials my studio smells like honey and pine. When I'm making paint, it's so lovely.

Rodney Veal  26:04

Yeah, that is, I did. I did notice that I did?

Kate Santucci  26:07

Yeah, when I have

Rodney Veal  26:09

those on, smells good. I was like, that's gonna and so you're working small in your attic, and I remember the smaller works, what like? What was it like? And they were beautiful. They're beautiful. They were they were beautiful works. She's in her she's in her thing. But then you would, then you went big. Well, what was that transition like? Was it? Was it going big because you ended up in a studio space that wasn't your house? Or were you did you started in the attic?

Kate Santucci  26:40

I did. I started it in the attic, and it was because I decided on a whim to submit to the reimagining Works program through the Dayton Metro library, where they bought all that art, and I got one. So I have pieces at the southeast branch, and they're like, there's 333, foot by four foot paintings in there that are like these constructions of they're very sculptural, so it's hard to describe, but like, so there are many paintings like, mounted to larger paintings at different depths, with panels and everything. And I got that, I got that commission, and that was really, really exciting and really terrifying, because here I am in my 110 year old house with a blow torch in my attic, and I'm like, yeah, maybe this isn't ever so

Rodney Veal  27:38

that always kind of sets it up, doesn't it? Like, yeah. Church of my house. So you that's what started.

Kate Santucci  27:44

That's what started it. So towards the end of my finishing those commissions, I moved into a studio space at the Davis Linden building,

Rodney Veal  27:53

same building. You were in a building with us. Yeah, we were, I think we're there at the time, same time.

Kate Santucci  27:59

I think so, because it was, it was where Elisha and I were before we moved into the front street space.

Rodney Veal  28:07

So, so that was, like, that commission was really the kind of,

Kate Santucci  28:11

yes, you're on your way. Then moving into a studio space outside of my house really gave me the the leeway, and this just the space, the physical space to do larger work. So I built, built a giant table, and I, you know, I had wall space, like my attic. I didn't even have any flat walls. It was all awful.

Rodney Veal  28:36

Yeah, yeah, it's really hard. It's like, oh, and that's the other thing is, too, is like, because I always think about that, I always think about the artist space, like I would the people don't understand artists need to be able to step back from the work, yeah, because I'm huge, to be able to because, because you're a lot of times you're like, you're so up close to it, and as you're making that, you need to step back and really see it's total like, am I, yeah, and make these changes. And so you need space. And I think that that's, you know, for our non artists out there. This is why artists need space. You're right. I try to be an advocate for more art spaces, more space for artists, always, to make this, to make the work. And I, you know, and I love the fact that was the commission at the library, yeah, who was your because it's based upon, wasn't that based upon an interpretation of a work of the Dayton Art Institute, kind of, so he was your artists that you were inspired

Kate Santucci  29:41

by for that, gosh, now I'm going to have to, I'm like, totally blanking on one of their names. So it was Georgia, O'Keeffe. Was one of them with a purple, purple oak leaves. There's this beautiful little painting at the GI that. And so that was, that was one of them. And then the other one, oh my gosh. I'm trying to remember. It's like, therm, therm and thermo. I'm, I can describe the piece. It was like all these plexiglass panels that were sculptural and popped out, like, like, plexiglass boxes, glass,

Rodney Veal  30:13

oh, yo. So that, yes, it is in the yeah, as you enter into, as you enter into the gallery space on the bottom floor.

Kate Santucci  30:22

Yes. So

Rodney Veal  30:26

people go to the day artists to do if you're digging, how many

Kate Santucci  30:30

times did I type that name? And now it's just like, gone.

Rodney Veal  30:34

But it's okay, though it's okay. So that's really interesting, that those were the inspiration and library space, and it's like, and I did you feel like that? That was the moment of saying, I can go big. I can, yeah, really immerse myself into this world. Yeah, was that the moment?

Kate Santucci  30:53

It was because it was a commitment to somebody else, first of all. And I, I struggle with like, I need, I need some deadlines people. I need some like, I am a like, horrible procrastinator, very distracted by all

Rodney Veal  31:09

the things, all the time, time, everything, everywhere, all at once. Which is, which is, I know you're, you're a kindred spirit. I think every artist I've talked to, we're like we are. Just tell us when you want it done. It compels us nothing, nothing better than a gallery show that forced you to get the work done.

Kate Santucci  31:27

Oh my gosh, yeah, right. Because trying to find a show without a body of work being done, and, you know, you have to, it's like, I really, I really need somebody to be like, yes, we're going to commit to giving you this space, giving you this show, otherwise, I will never actually totally finally complete whatever it is like I have. I have to a deadline.

Ad  31:50

I gotta have a deadline. We all do. I'm Bonnie miles, membership coordinator of CET. Thank you for listening to Rodney veal's Inspired by this podcast is a production of cet and think TV, two local PBS stations as PBS stations, the work we do online, on air and in the community is supported by listeners like you. If you're enjoying the show and would like to support our work, please consider becoming a member at CET, connect.org or think TV, dot O, R, G, plus, when you sign up to donate at least $5 a month, you'll get access to special members only streaming videos on the PBS app through passport. Learn more at CET connect.org or think TV dot O, R G if

Rodney Veal  32:34

you're enjoying this conversation, the art show, also hosted by Rodney veal, is available to stream anytime from anywhere on YouTube or the PBS app. And so I love the fact that that's what led to the big I think that that's kind of itch. And the thing is, you know, this whole notion of the caustic work, which, like I said, is so beautifully the scale of your encaustics and the haunting beauty of it. I mean, there's a hunt, there's a there's a very literal to me, underpinning to that haunted distance. So were you a voracious reader as a kid? Oh yeah, I could totally tell by your work. She reads a lot.

Kate Santucci  33:18

She's right, yes, yeah, I would, oh my gosh. I think that I spent, like a huge portion of my childhood immersed in Madeline, langle books, all of the Wrinkle in Time, this childhood site like science fiction, like, yeah, ethereal sort of Yeah, like thinking about weird stuff, yeah.

Rodney Veal  33:40

But, but it was, but it kind of, I love the fact that it infuses itself into your work, into your work, and it shows up, and I can tell, but I never, but I never, had just asked you about it. I find it so weird. We never that. We never talk as artists about who we are, and that's why the that's why I wanted to do the podcast, yeah, the reading,

Kate Santucci  34:08

oh, yeah, I see that's huge, and that that does like I feel like written and spoken word, if you works itself into my work, like way more like I've always, I always feel a little guilty because I feel like I don't have the time, or take the time to go and just immerse myself in museum settings and look at at I do, but not often enough. But I'm constantly like, if listening to a book, fiction, nonfiction, whatever, or, because sometimes I listen to books when I work, and sometimes

Rodney Veal  34:42

those are the voices I hear next door. Okay, I think she's she's over there, just having a party. Why was I not invited?

Kate Santucci  34:52

I, like, often I'm listening to something, and then I'll stop it. And, like. The paper that's on my table or on the wall or whatever I'm like scribbling down a sentence I heard. And sometimes those get written on into my pieces, just those little snippets of thoughts that like, what if or something that really strikes me and will, I know, give direction to my work all, all the time. Okay, so yeah, it's, yeah, it's part of my process, honestly, to write on my on my pieces, and I'm right, like, you're not necessarily going to be able to see what it said. Or I do it like, in a way, like I'll write with my non dominant hand, with my left hand, or I'll write, like scribble backwards or just make it totally illegible.

Rodney Veal  35:46

So the essence of thought and a word and

Kate Santucci  35:49

right language, it's like i It's the reason I don't generally gesso my encaustic panels first is because that one, I like the wood grain, and two, I almost always start a new piece with just a graphite pencil and writing directly on the wood on the board, and then that gets waxed over. And so sometimes, because you can layer those clear like do clear layer, like layers of medium, can't talk in between colors, or whatever it builds up this, this actual depth. And so there are pieces there where you can see, like, underneath the pencil lines that were initially on the the raw wood, and which that is. The other thing that, like grabbed me about this medium was that depth and being able to make those layers, and it gets, like, really soft and sort of luscious. And, you know, it's like, yeah, so you can build, you can build on that, and you can, I can let peak parts peek through, and some So, yeah, you can often see all the way down to what was written on the bare wood underneath, in the backgrounds, even in my like, figurative pieces, I make sure that that's,

Rodney Veal  37:02

yeah, yeah, oh, absolutely. And it's like, oh, that just explains so much. Because, you know, I mean, it just well in a beautiful way, because, just like the depth of layers and the language and kind of switching it up, not being obvious about but it's there. It's just it speaks to kind of like a snapshot of the moment, versus it being rooted in the past, rooted in the future. It's rooted in the present. And so yeah, gives it a timeless quality.

Kate Santucci  37:35

Yeah, yeah. I'm

Rodney Veal  37:41

looking at your work. Maybe I'm looking at your work like i did

Kate Santucci  37:45

i and, you know, it sets an intention to for me, because it's that whole like, staring at a brand new blank piece of wood, even if I just take a pencil and start, like drawing this, like inscribing this line down it and then, like, write things on it. It just did that. That's it. It's no longer a big old blank thing. It's like and words that I put in there very are they do tend to be specific and set a path for the work. So if I'm thinking about that, that thing that I scribbled on the board that definitely informs my mark making, even if I'm not, like, I'm not making a piece that is visually going to say, Oh yes, this was a quote from, you know, this particular author and this, but it's like, it just it sets an intention For me so that I can then sort of fall into that process of intuitive mark making and building and, like, manipulating color and and so, yeah, like all my works have an under painting of some sort in that way.

Rodney Veal  38:56

All right, see, oh, folks, when you go you see name to work, go listen to this podcast, and then go back. Because it just because it just goes well. That just helps. I mean, I just like, think it's, it's, it's beautiful work. Basically, it's visually captivating. So it draws you in. So now I know now why it draws me in. Oh, my God, layers. Oh, lots of layers. I believe in that. I'm like, I just don't, it just can't be surface. You're not a surface. It has to be the depth of investigation. Yeah. So, yeah. So I had a question because, but because, the thing is, because this is something that happened to you recently, and this is the reason why I was like, I gotta get Kate on the podcast, because I saw the work you. You went on an artist residence. You did, yeah, okay, you talk about it, because it's okay special, because I thought that was incredible and special. And I saw the work afterwards, because it was hanging at the Dayton Society of artists. And I. Mm, hmm,

Kate Santucci  40:01

oh, thank you. Yeah. It's, it was a departure for me, for sure, like, as far as the the work that came back from, from France. But I went to, I went to France. I went to artist residency at Chateau do so it's orcavo, France. It's like up in the north east quadrant of France, about halfway between Paris and, like that border of Germany, you know, Strasbourg was about halfway between. So out in the countryside, it was at an old chateau. It was 25 artists, and we all had our own studios. We all had our own rooms. It's just, it was just kind of a an amazing experience. If I could go back in a heart, I would just do it in a heartbeat. It was transformative. I mean, just because you're like, life is so busy, and my life in the last year has been kind of nuts. And I just like, that was two weeks. It was two weeks in September. I went from the first to the 14th of September, 2025 and just total immersion. I did not have to feed myself. I did not have to think about anything. I got up in the morning, went to the Chateau kitchen and had this amazing breakfast. I came home and was like, where's my croissant? Your morning? So, like, just an amazing experience. And then I went up to the studio and and stayed all day. I just, like, totally, like, listened to music. Didn't I didn't have to do it like I would sometimes go for go for walks around in the area, around the village, but my studio windows opened up to the scene from like a fairy tale, like you. I looked out and there was over this lake and this little French village and the church with the steeple in the background and cows out that. I mean, it was, it was hard to like this can't be real. How am I here?

Rodney Veal  42:13

Because I'm kind of curious, like, what possessed like for the change, like, what made you apply?

Kate Santucci  42:19

I was just a whim. Honestly, I There are at least three other people from the area who have gone to this particular residency, other artists that I know. So, yeah, I was like, Okay, well, this is real. It's I it's not a scam. You know, you see things on Instagram. You're like, I don't know, this seems like sketchy. This looks sketchy, right? There was no fee to apply, so I just and they sent my work, and I got back this. This letter was like, Hey, welcome. You're in, and I just remember sitting there being stunned and like, Well, okay, and you know, as as a woman, and I'm in my 50s, and I've never done anything like that before. At the time that I applied, I had never been to Europe, and so I was just kind of like, stunned, and also kind of terrified. And I'm like, Oh my gosh, am I, am I gonna? Am I gonna do this? This is like, this is scary. And, you know, I was like, I had to commit because one way or the other, because you have to put a down payment down for the residency fee. And I looked at my husband, I'm like, I think I want to do this. And he's, he's awesome. He's, like, my biggest cheerleader. He was like, you are absolutely gonna do this, absolutely, like, pay the Go, go. So we made it happen. And, and, you know, I, I spent, it was about a year and a half preparation, two years almost before I between when I applied and when I actually went. And in between that time I did, in fact, go to Europe with a group of girlfriends, we went to Spain. So it was which was great. It was a good experience. How travel to Europe, right?

Rodney Veal  44:22

I people, which is so much fun.

Kate Santucci  44:25

Yeah, in September, end of August, I packed up my stuff by myself and all my art supplies, and I just went. I figured it out so it was, it was both terrifying and gratifying, and I got there, and it was one of the most worthwhile experiences of my

Rodney Veal  44:42

life, and showed in the work. And, I mean, because the work was so I just felt like I was like, Oh, this is a free

Kate Santucci  44:50

Kate, yes, yeah.

Rodney Veal  44:54

Oh, those pants, like the multiple panels, the vertical tower. Oh. Oh, so what inspired those, those image, the imagery? Well, not like the imagery. I saw elements of your old, of your practice, but then I saw something completely different, right?

Kate Santucci  45:14

What was the inspiration for that? Part of it was the actual physicality of the medium. I could not do encaustic in Europe. I didn't want to figure out materials and torches and hot plates like that was just not going to happen. I wasn't going to ship that stuff there. And also that just felt like, like a pain, like a move my studio just halfway across the world. Instead, I was like, I'm just going to take this opportunity to do something completely different. I'm going to work in a medium that I don't work in. I'm going to work on material with materials I don't often use like so I was, I was like, it's going to be canvas and paper and acrylic based media and mixed media. So part of that was like, just, I need to work something different. And if I'm going to do that and immerse myself, pardon me, then I'm going to take that time to just do whatever pops into my mind. So I brought a whole bunch of Canvas. I brought large pieces of canvas I stapled into the wall when I got there, and I just was like, I'm I still, I feel like, have a tendency to work in those layers and stuff. So I was using, like acrylic washes, and I still started with, like pencil on the surface. And excuse me, I'm going to cough here. Sorry weather, yeah, take a drink of water. So yeah. So I was still like working in that way where I was starting with mark making on the raw material and then building up layers. But I was doing it with, like, acrylic washes and and then I had this canvas. I'm like, what if I I made these small pieces? What if I stitched them together? And I had brought this weird assortment of stuff with me. So my encroastic work, I sometimes include these little wax droplets like that are in the work themselves. I have some sculptural and caustic pieces that have these, like wax, wax linen threads with like drop droplets. I dip them basically like candles, and I made this huge bundle of them and took them with me, because I'm like, Who knows, maybe I want those. And I had this wax linen thread with me, so I stitched all these pieces together and started, like, thinking like, well, what if I had this big, long piece that started at the ceiling and trailed across the floor, which I still envision it kind of that way, but it wasn't practical to hang it that way at the Dayton Art Institute or even in the studio that I was in in France. So I started playing with like, sort of tacking it up in sort of waves, and letting things flow. So that was all like, based on materials itself. And then I feel like that work that I was doing there, because I had the size canvas and the space on the wall like that, to work freely. I was really kind of working with as much physical movement as I could. So, like the big, big arches and stuff, was about like, I can move my entire my entire arm from one side to the other. And to, like, to really sort of create that yes, and then, yeah, yeah. I wanted that movement and motion in there. And I was also, have, you know, it's just like it seems like for everyone in the last five, six years, just we've all had a lot going on and carrying a lot. And so I was just working through stuff that happened. And so I'd been thinking a lot about tangling and untangling process and thoughts. And so what started coming out of this were these marks that were like these knotted sort of line work that and on the piece that I had stitched together, they all connect to one another. So like, if, if you could, at the bottom, pull that string, maybe it would. I'm not maybe it would be this one giant snow right in the middle. But like, I wanted those images of the knots to sort of like lead from one to the other. So I feel like those pieces are all about sort of untangling all sorts of things also process emotion. I you know, like I lost, like both my my brother in law and father in law within three weeks of each other in 2022 Know, and it was, it was just dark, right? It was bad. It was a bad time. So we spent a few years like, dealing with that. And life goes on. You've got to like, you've got to just keep going. And that, being in that that space, gave me the time to really start to like, process some of that that was going on.

Rodney Veal  50:20

Because, right, you can't. I was thinking, when you see we were talking about that, I was thinking about something I said to someone, you can't have the light without

Kate Santucci  50:30

the dark Exactly, yeah, yeah.

Rodney Veal  50:33

And so I will. I'm, I'm a little mistrustful of anyone who's walking around rainbows and Sunshines all the time. People accuse me of that, I'm like, Oh no, there's a dark side. Don't worry, don't worry, there's purpose.

Kate Santucci  50:45

Yeah, I struggle to not always have my art be a little dark, but like, that is my tendency to start us sort of, like, go over to that side, you know, and like, dark in color and darken. So, yeah, I don't know. I um, what's this? Yeah, physical space to do to work that out. Like I had stuff all over the floor and my music on and a glass of glass of wine, and I was just like, have my little paint and cry. No one's gonna bother me.

Rodney Veal  51:19

I'm gonna work this out. The doors closed, like, hey, Kei, what's going on? What's happening? No, no,

Kate Santucci  51:23

yeah, can't right now I'm like, too busy pain and crying, but, but I kind of feel like that that is really important. Like, it is my experience that when I have pieces that you really, truly pour yourself into, like you really are feeling a lot of whatever it is, and you were, you're working on that piece, like people, people see that. They can tell

Rodney Veal  51:48

it's like they can sense it. You did

Kate Santucci  51:50

not phone that in, right? It's like you, you really were in it. And so had that opportunity, while I was there for two weeks, to really be in it. Whole time, I feel like really informed, informed, the the work that, and my color palette, which was sort of place based, because I was in France, I'm like, I'm going to go with looking around, what with the color of what's around me. And so it had a little bit of a landscape vibe, I

Rodney Veal  52:22

imagine. Thank you. That's why,

Kate Santucci  52:25

okay, I don't consider myself. I'm not a landscape artist.

Rodney Veal  52:28

No, no, by any means. It wasn't literal landscaping, but it was right, landscape esque. Yes, it was formed. Landscaper formed,

Kate Santucci  52:39

yeah, and so actually called that show when I hung it landscape adjacent,

Rodney Veal  52:43

that was the title, yeah, yes. There you go. Yeah, yeah.

Kate Santucci  52:47

Like, I was in this new landscape, and I was like, I wanted those the colors that I was I used, like, I had a very limited palette. I was like, I'm going to use this particular green and paint, like, cooker screen and Hanes gray and ochre, and I just kept it like to a pretty specific palette.

Rodney Veal  53:06

Yeah, disturb is kind of like this moment. And in many ways it serves as that all the work from that period serves as this kind of capsule it encapsulates. And so I just thought it was like I was brilliant. I love the fact that the DSA showed it.

Kate Santucci  53:26

I was so grateful and and it was, you know, for me, like I got it. I got a grant to help fund that. So I got one of the Montgomery County Arts and Culture district culture works grants. And so that was part of my agreement, was that I get I gave an artist talk about the trip and about the residency experience and and about the work, and then I got to hang my shelf and leave it there. It was up for a couple of months, which was great. And now that it's down, I I'm actually continuing to do like, that series of work. So those large canvas panelists, I just don't feel, I just don't feel done with that yet. I'm still, I mean, I'm still working in encaustic. I will, Oh, absolutely. I love it, but, but I'm, I'm kind of continuing. I'm continuing this. I don't feel like, I don't feel finished yet with this panels and that, that thing. So I'm just building a body of work in Canvas on as large as I can manage to get

Rodney Veal  54:31

it, large as I could get it. I'm just as a fanboy. I'm going to say to you, yay. That was one of my questions. I'm like, is this gonna lead to kind of exploring more in this way? Because, like I said, Your caustics are fabulous. They're phenomenal. There's a sublime that I love about him. And so now you've got this other pathway and and so I. I just find it really amazing that you do. You'd never been to Europe. You did chances like that. I mean, are you not are you? I mean, what I like? I said it's like, you know this, this taking a chance just kind of frees you up. And I'm just kind of curious what we use say to people who may let this kind of thing hold them back, like, like, help people. Like, I may. I'm all in. I'm all in on an adventure.

Kate Santucci  55:32

Yeah, I, I would say that, you know, it's like, don't, don't wait. Like, I was afraid I was going to be the oldest person there, and that I was like, like, oh my gosh, I'm going to be like this, the grandma and this group of 20 year olds and and I wasn't at all, first of all, like these, like, the total diversity of age range backgrounds, like all over and so. And it was fantastic. So don't, don't worry about that. And then I would also say, just like you've, I feel like you've, you've got to just take this, this step forward. It was terrifying. I am an anxious traveler. Period. I had never, you know, like I had to get to Paris and figure out the metro system and figure out all my stuff and everything. And it was, it was scary, but you just, you just do it. I wanted the experience more than I was afraid of the experience, right? So it was like, if I needed, I just, I felt like, if I, if I had this opportunity on the table, it was offered to me, and I didn't take it that I would spend the rest of my life going like, Well, why? Why didn't I ever do that? And why, you know, why didn't I take this when it was offered to me? And, yeah, so I don't know. It was like, in retrospect, people were like, Oh my gosh, you were so brave to do that. And I was like, Well, I guess I was, I don't know, I was just like, I decided I committed, and then I committed, and I once I have money down, it's over. I'm going, that's just

Rodney Veal  57:09

hard cash. Currency has gone into this.

Kate Santucci  57:13

Yeah, yeah. I was just like, I have. I am going to follow through, and even if it is really scary to do the travel part of it. And you know, it was all trains, planes and automobiles, things. I did it. I traveled and I went. I actually went early and ended and stayed longer. So I was gone for an entire month. I went. I went for my two week residency, and then I got on the train and just kept going east and went to visit friends in Venice and Murano and then Croatia, and then it came up. And then I came up. If I was going to go, I was going to take advantage of everything that I could while I was there. So I got to travel and see a lot of art, and in in Murano and Venice, I my friends. I was there. She's a glass artist, and we were there during Murano glass week. So that was, like, just insane. It was beautiful. And and then, you know, we went back to to their place in they live in modovan Croatia, and I did a little workshop with her in her glass studio. I'm terrible at it. By the way, glass works really hard. Yeah, the learning curve is really steep. Oh my gosh. I was like, in awe, but, yeah, so it was, I mean, it was just such an amazing opportunity. And I think that, I really do think that as an artist, if you can, like it doesn't have to be out of the country, but if you can apply for a residency anywhere, even if it's just like a short one, like it is such a gift to yourself, that freedom of time and space, that freedom to shut the door and paint and cry if you need to or just and to work outside of your your normal you know, space, because it's like, when you're in a new place, new ideas do occur. And, and I gave myself total permission to follow the what ifs, you know, to be like, well, what if I tried this, or what if I did this? And like, I don't know, it feels like a more freeing space to give yourself permission to make, make bad art, you know, like, I think we're awfully hard on ourselves about like, and I tend to be like, perfectionist, anxious. It's like, well, this isn't good enough. And you I don't want anybody to see this. And it's like, no, just you have to keep making the art. And it doesn't matter if it's good or bad or whatever. And so that's a great environment to do that. Like, I, I if, if, like, someone was gonna say, Well, you know, should I take this time to continue working on this body of work I've started at home. I'd encourage you to, like, not just to go and work on something completely, completely different. Yeah, because when else you're going to get that time and space to do that?

Rodney Veal  1:00:05

That's the best advice I could think anyone could. I was. It's my personal philosophy as well. It's like, you know, there's, there's it, just it, just it does something to you that you didn't have the time to unpack what it's done to you. And so I think that's what's going to be to me. That's what's personally exciting about this effect, and knowing that you're going to continue going down that pathway. So like the acoustics. But did I get to see where they bleed, bleed together? Yeah, did I see where they break apart? You just the liberation of Kate. I just, that's what, that's what it feels like from an outsider's perspective.

Kate Santucci  1:00:46

It feels like that to me too, I mean, and that's just, it is freeing because you start to think of yourself as, oh, I'm a whatever this box is. I'm an encaustic Artist. I am a sculptor. I am a, you know, it's like, well, you're an artist, so like, I do see the value in having a consistent body of work. Like, if you have a gallerist or whatever, it's like, it should, it should look like your work. But I do think it looks like my work. It just looks like, this is my these are my canvas pieces. These are my, you know, I don't know. That's just my two cents.

Rodney Veal  1:01:22

It was a perfectly valid two cents. Oh, it is just, it's, I'm so delighted that we got to share this time together.

Kate Santucci  1:01:34

This has been so fun. And I, yeah, I like, love getting to chat with you. And I, I was thinking about that like, you know, that opportunity to, like you were talking about, to chat with other artists and talk about our process, that there just needs to be, like some salons, like some formal, like some parties where or gathers, where we get together.

Rodney Veal  1:01:58

Just don't, yeah, just, just let it go

Kate Santucci  1:02:02

talk about art and our I'm like, Yeah, I love hearing that when I hear it talk to other artists and and especially when you're talking about like you have different, different artists, like you have visual artists and you have dancers and photographers like writers and, yeah, we need salons in Dayton. Somebody happened.

Rodney Veal  1:02:24

Hopefully, someone else, someone will listen to this and they'll make them yeah, yes, yeah.