The UnlearnT Podcast
The UnlearnT Podcast is designed to help you gain the courage to change your mind about things you never thought you would change your mind about. Our hope is that you will begin to move towards a life of freedom after hearing stories from individuals who have chosen to unlearn some things in their lives.
The UnlearnT Podcast
Unlearning Parenting: Divorce Made Me A Single Parent... Now What?
Juanita shares her journey as a single mother parenting her now 18-year-old daughter from age four, offering wisdom on co-parenting, building resilience, and evolving from teacher to coach.
• Transitioning from a two-parent household to single parenting requires choosing trust with both the co-parent and eventually the child
• The shift from teaching to coaching should happen earlier than most parents realize—around 8-9 years old in today's digital world
• Technology management requires open communication rather than excessive monitoring or restrictions
• Children need to experience hard things to build resilience—protecting them from struggle prevents growth
• Parents must recognize the difference between protecting from harm versus protecting from challenge
• Our children often reflect our own behaviors, offering opportunities for personal growth and self-reflection
• Allow your co-parent to parent in their own way—different doesn't mean wrong
Share this episode with someone who might benefit from these insights and subscribe to continue unlearning together toward more freedom.
hello everybody and welcome once again to the unlearned podcast. I'm your host with abigail aka ra, and this is the podcast that is helping you gain the courage to change your mind so that you can experience more freedom. And I have a special guest in the building today, uh, and I am so grateful that she chose to do this. It's her first podcast, y'all, so be kind, okay, be nice, don't give it too hard of a time. Uh, juanita, how you doing?
Speaker 2:hey, hey, hey, I am doing well fighting some allergies and it's a little warmer than I'd like for it to be, this atmosphere at this time of the year, but I'm good yes.
Speaker 1:I'm good. I'm good. This is fun. We haven't actually seen each other in years.
Speaker 2:This is true. That's crazy, this is true.
Speaker 1:But you're all, you're adulting, listen, but I'm doing the best I can. I'm doing the best I can. That's that's got to be it. And it's weird. Sometimes I'm like who, let us be adults?
Speaker 1:I'm not really sure why that was a good idea. But, um, when I met when I was in college, we attended the same church. Uh, while I was in school in Greenville for several years got to know each other and then have seen each other on and off over the last few years. So a lot of this is going to be even me just catching up with you, man For sure.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Let's catch up. The little girl that you knew, that little girl with the big puffy cheeks. You know she's around the age that you were, wow.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know, my God, okay. So obviously you guys, you know we're in the series called Unlearning Parenting, and so we're talking about parenting from different perspectives and I'm really excited about this conversation. I think it's going to help a lot of people. So you have um, tell us how many children you have, how old is she, and um, just a little bit about you and your background, some of the things that you think would be interesting to know about you all right.
Speaker 2:Well, um, I guess, as it relates to you know the subject at hand in the context of what we're going to be talking about. I am a single mother and I became a single mother very early on. I have a daughter who is 18 years old.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, I remember when Jaquita told me Jaquita's y'all know Jaquita, so this is when Jaquita's great friends, and so she was saying something. She was like, yeah, christine, yeah, she was saying, yeah, she was saying something about her driving or something. Yeah, and I was like who Driving? Who? Like, who are you talking about? That can't possibly be right. Oh yeah, that's crazy 18. So she's graduating this year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she no. No, she's not in her first year. I can't. Oh, she's in her, I know it. I know it. We have to. We have to get older. I'm sorry, but I got older than you. Like all things into perspective. I understand I understand. So yeah, she is 18. She is in her first. She's like I'm really at home and to me it's like who are you Right, and and so fun it's fun.
Speaker 2:It's fun and I say a little bit of me, because you know it's not all me. So, um, I am a college instructor. Um, I teach all things foundational, um, as it relates to um being your best self, um as a college student, um and then transitioning into your career and, um, hopefully, as a person thriving in society and oh how great society is these days and so I get to deal with this generation.
Speaker 1:Oh man, Yep, oh man.
Speaker 2:So it's fun? Yeah, it's fun, but that's where I am. That's amazing. That's my life right now. That's fun, yeah, it's fun, but that's where I am.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. That's my life right now. That's amazing. So you're parenting this generation and you're teaching them. So you have a. This is a very interesting role you have. So you became a single mother, all right, so you have not always been a single mother.
Speaker 2:Yes, but Christina was four and I don't mind mentioning her name.
Speaker 1:She was four and I don't mind mentioning her name, she was four. So very early on, yeah, yeah, very, very early on. Yeah, I'll be honest with you, I didn't realize it'd been that long. It's just been a long time. I just you know what you may have gotten older. I obviously have not, so let's change that.
Speaker 2:Better. Come on, you know, because people might look at this and think that you know we're around the same age. I'm good with that.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, I mean, aren't we so? Absolutely so, all right, so she was four and uh, so you and your husband ended up getting a divorce, right, and so you were parenting, and with the two parent, what some would call a traditional household, right, yeah, and then that shifted. Here's the here's. This is interesting, and I'd love to just start here, cause I feel like this is going to be very relatable. I'll be honest, I know several, you know, friends, colleagues that have gotten divorces recently or, uh, possibly could be headed that direction, right, um, and so a lot of there.
Speaker 1:There are a lot of people, I think, that are going to be dealing with this transition, right, and if the statistics are correct and I think they are, last time I looked 50% of marriages end in divorce, and that is, for our context. That's not just people that aren't in church, that's people that are also in church. They're the same right, and so that is a reality that one of two people are likely going to face. So, if you have children, one of two people will go from a two-parent household to now a one-parent household. I'd love for you to just reflect on and talk about your experience parenting in a two parent household and then having to make that pivot. What was that like and what were some of the fears you had that may even have been confirmed and what are some things that the fears you had that you actually shouldn't have been a fear.
Speaker 2:Okay, so let's start with the fear, come on, because that fear was not as evident for me at the beginning and I think, if I think about that, the reason for that is because it was so early on is because it was so early on, like, although we did experience doing this thing together, like you know, it was right at the beginning, that's yeah, so it wasn't as pronounced as it became, you know, like when she started school and those different components. So at the very beginning, the focus there was more so of how it would affect her as a person. Yeah, and I did not know what that would look like because she was four. Yeah, how it would affect her as a person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I did not know what that would look like because she was four. Yeah, right, yeah, so just wondering that. And then the fear of how Her dad would take care of her when she was with her dad. Yeah, that's real. But I don't necessarily know if that component comes from being not in the same household, because I have experience where mothers tend to have the feeling of I can do it better. That's real.
Speaker 2:And you know, because you're the mother right, you carry the child, you're the nurturer, you know we think about a whole lot more um, so to speak. Yeah, sure, and you know, we, we got all the I's and cross all the T's. So I, you know I don't really know if that necessarily has to do with us not being in the same household or not, but it was more pronounced um, of course when you know we weren't together and then you know she had her moments where she was with her dad. You know we weren't together and then you know she had her moments where she was with her dad. You know, is he going to do what I do? Is he going to think about the things that I think about?
Speaker 2:That, I believe, was the biggest component. Yeah, but I had to be reassured and I was reassured by, you know, several people that you have to remember that he loves her, he's not going to do anything to hurt her intentionally. Yes, sure, and neither am I. But I mean, do I, did I already know how to raise a child? No, no, I didn't. Yeah, but you know, something turns on and we think that we know it all.
Speaker 1:That's real yeah, that's real, I mean, I think I think that's that is. I think that's a fair fear, like you know. Is he gonna do what I do? Is he gonna, you know, is he going to do what I do? Is he going, you know, is he going to think about what I think about? I think women in general have that real fear about men, like you know hey, you don't you know X, y, z. When did that? When was that dispelled? Like? When did you feel? Like, okay, I don't need to worry about that as much as I thought I did is oh girl, um, I think, um it.
Speaker 2:It came and went, as in waves, that's fair oh, that's good. You know, in waves, um, there were moments where I was like okay, and then there'd be moments where I'd be like so, but in waves I think maturity connects with that perspective as well. Um, and at this stage, um like and I think that also too has to be with the age that she is, Um, at this stage I have more confidence in it. And again, that does not necessarily speak to who he is, by no means. But there's an additional dynamic she's older.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yes, like there are some things that she, you know, can conceptualize her own on her own and discern on her own and decisions on her own, and so we are just accompanying that and coaching her through that process, whereas when she was younger we had to have a lot more hands on, and so the feelings of that was more prominent, that fear of whether or not you know it's going to be done a certain way or that sort of thing.
Speaker 2:I think establishing trust is essential there and we don't always do that well. And I mean, I can honestly say that I am a person who is very hands on, and so whether or not I made a choice to trust um was a a big factor. Um, and then you have to allow um because again, again, there's that um component of who made me the guru.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, um, but for some strange reason, you know, um, you know, some of us, you know, think that you know, we know, we know how to do it better than the next person. But you know, we have to learn just like, just like they do, and, and the perspective of that, and that that comes with maturity as well, and I did obtain that maturity. Did I always get that right?
Speaker 1:No, no, are you human?
Speaker 2:No, Right, yeah, Right Um did I always, you know. Keep my mouth shut. Uh, no, I didn't. But there were times where, um you know, the Lord would say you know, let him do it. Don't say anything, um, because you know, with us not being the same household, he had to grow and learn how to maneuver the relationship, just like me.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's right so, yeah, that's right, no, that's good. I I I think you said a couple of things I just want to dive deeper into. Sure, you said it earlier, one of the fears was like how is this going to affect her? And of course you were like, cause she was four, you wouldn't have known. How did you handle questions that came up why is not? Why? Why, why aren't we living with daddy anymore? Why are we? You know why? Why don't y'all? Why aren't you in the same place? Why do I have to go to a different house? Those kind of things. What happened? That kind of how did you handle that and what did that? What did that process look like? And how can you encourage people who may be just coming into that journey to have those conversations with their children, especially as they get older, because I would imagine the questions change as they get more mature?
Speaker 2:Facts. So if I have to really think about that, I think that that is really going to be based on on the child and the personality of the child, what that child needs, because Christina didn't ask any questions for a while, we didn't really navigate and, honestly, never have navigate in a way where you know she saw any tension between us. The only thing that you know was clearly evident was that we weren't in the same house.
Speaker 1:Sure, yeah, that we weren't in the same house, sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she did ask gosh, maybe the latter part of elementary school, Okay, and I have to be honest with you, I probably didn't handle that the best way Because you know, when you don't get the question, when you think you're going to get the question, you just kind of forget that there may be a question and then you get the question, you know just one random day, so mommy, one random day.
Speaker 2:So, mommy, you're like oh you know, why didn't I think about how I was going to answer this question? I've never thought about how I was going to answer this question, um. And so the first time, um, I answered that question, it was extremely vague. Um, I answered that question. It was extremely vague, um, and it was more on the basis of um, we just decided that it was best that we not be together. Um, what I did not say to her was that we didn't like each other, right, right, that sort of thing, right, um. Now, when she got older, you know, she wanted to know more details.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, um, and honesty on the table again. Um, I did not share those details with her. I think that, depending on what those details are, that you have to determine how much of that you're going to expose and who's going to share that. Is this the appropriate time, or is my child at the maturity level to really understand that All the things? And so, yeah, my response then was more so. I think that once you get a little bit older, that would probably be a conversation that you and your dad can have. Yeah, okay, but I, I'd always reassured her and and she saw it.
Speaker 2:Now you know whether or not we had some, we we did have disagreements and you know she knew those disagreements were there, cause they were, um, you know, stemmed around her. Yeah, sure, um, but you know she never saw any. She never saw, you know, any of that. Um, and honestly, we never really had, you know, a whole lot of knockdown drag outs. Yeah, we never really had, you know, a whole lot of knockdown drag outs, um, because that's just the, the dynamic of, um, our relationship, which people on the outside, you know, sometimes think it's really weird. Um, you know, we always are there together at every doctor's appointment. You know all the things and you know they would say you know, ask the questions about your household, or y'all being married and we're like we're not together, yeah, and so now they're, they're uncomfortable and we're like it's fine.
Speaker 2:It's fine, right, um, but allowing her to determine, you know, when to have that conversation, um with her, with her dad, and then um watching her response, um, because oftentimes we, we miss it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Um, watching her response, making sure that it's not affecting her, you know, in a certain way, because I didn't answer the question, yeah, yeah, maybe she wanted it to be answered and I'm always, you know, very full of communication with her, but with that I, you know, I want it to be really really, really sensitive. But honestly, ruth, I think that that is going to depend on, it has to depend on the child. You got to know your child and know what's appropriate, how it's going to affect them, how it's going to touch them and when you have that conversation, what to include in that conversation to make sure that they understand what you're saying to them. And then, after that, paying attention to the response.
Speaker 1:That's really good and I think it leads into the next thing I wanted to just kind of touch deeper on. You said you have to choose to trust and, and particularly, you know you're not, you aren't living together, you don't know everything that's going on, right? All those things you have to choose to trust. That's, and even in what you're talking about, one of the things on a previous or episode we just recorded that'll actually come out after this one was the idea of you have to parent children individually, right? So we're talking about you know, you all have one child, but you know, for those who have multiple children, to your point, you have to understand who they are. So those conversations actually could be different per child, because every child is different, right?
Speaker 1:Um, and with you know, with you all situation, um, both of you are different and you're going to communicate differently, and so you choosing to trust is that's such a, it's a, it's a profound um understanding, because you really don't know how he's answering the question, right, and how that conversation goes, or about that or anything else, right, there's a million questions she could ask him and vice versa, questions she could ask you. That he's not gonna know, that's right. But you all have to find a way to best parent her without the full knowledge and understanding of the individual relationships with each parent. How do you choose to trust, especially when trust has been broken enough on some level that you all are no longer together? How do you still choose to trust in this very, um, very important situation of raising a child Like how did you get there?
Speaker 2:yes, I am, I am not perfect by by no means um at this point, um it at this point, and then I'm gonna start here and then I'm gonna go back. Okay, um, but at this point, um, with me being the primary household, meaning that she, you know, she lives with me, she gets a whole lot from me because she's in the house with me and I am the parent who does a lot of talking.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So you talked about us being different. Right, I'm the one that does all the talking.
Speaker 1:And typically you know the woman is the one that does most, we're very verbal. We're very verbal.
Speaker 2:Yes, but I am being a teacher, but I have always been a teacher.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Um and so if, if Christina were here, she'd say mommy, everything is not a teachable moment.
Speaker 1:Oh, man Period. Oh man, we just literally the one, I just had the one recording, I just did. We talked about that because, and I can say my mom, every moment was a teaching moment for her, every single moment.
Speaker 2:Every one, every one. And I tell her, I'm like oh too shy Every moment is a teaching moment, it kind of is. It kind of is it really is, but with me she's 18. So 18 years of me being that person and her having that on the inside of her. She's 18. Now she's discerning herself. She's making decisions on her own. Now I'm at a place of coaching. She's discerning herself. She's making decisions on her own. Now I'm at a place of coaching. That's good yeah.
Speaker 2:And so you know, the trust is not just with her dad, it's also with her.
Speaker 1:That's good. Oh, that's good, juanita, I like that.
Speaker 2:It's also with her. Yes, oh, that's good, juanita, I like that it's also with her. So, you know, we have a very open and direct you know communication line. I've always told her that, listen, I understand that things you know, in life come with emotions, and so I've never, you know, told her that she's had to suppress those emotions, and so I've never, um, you know, told her that she's had to suppress those emotions. Um, but what I have told her is that I need you to be respectful within them. Sure, okay, you know, I express your anger, express your frustration, um, but you know, don't ever find yourself talking at me. I understand if you're angry and you're speaking from that emotion. I know that's not directed towards me.
Speaker 2:When you start directing it towards me, then we have a problem. So her being able to acknowledge those things, express those things, know how she feels in regards to what's going on with her dad, being able to express those things with him, um, at this stage in her life, um, so the trust is now just not with with him, but with her, and so it's easier. Um, we've had some conversations where you know she's had some frustrations with her dad. You know, every now and then, or whatever. She is a daddy's girl with her dad. You know, every now and then, or whatever. She is a daddy's girl. Though she loves her dad, yes, and rightfully so. He's great with her and I've never, never, ever said anything different to her about him, wonderful with her, and so.
Speaker 2:But now let's go back you know when you know I'm still learning this thing and you know, trying to do this trust thing, god and so, and that honestly, um, and that honestly, if I be honest with myself, that had to'm like, but that is not all the time, right, it's not all the time. You can't take one thing and say, oh you, you, you can't be a successful parent.
Speaker 2:Now that has nothing to do with that person. Now, that has nothing to do with that person. That's me, wow, um, and just just recognizing that. Um, and I'm a person who will always look at myself. Um, and again, I'm not perfect, I'm not saying that, um, I've got even gotten that right every time, but I will look at myself, um, and so me just allowing him to parent and learn how to parent, um, now, what I will say about him and that I will applaud, even in his frustration. Um, if you know he have challenges with her.
Speaker 2:You know he'll call times where you know there were things that you know were challenging him about her, and I'm sure that he saw me, I'm sure that he saw me, and so you know that that's a, that's another component that he has, you know, would have to deal with. But you know I would, you know, talk him through those things. Yeah, you know there were times that I'd be like I told you, yeah, uh, huh, but he's a teacher also, um, and he's been a teacher all of his um career, yeah, um, and so you know, teaching and and teaching high school students, yeah, and so you know his thought was you know, I'll just ignore her, like I know my kids and I'm like those kids are not your child.
Speaker 1:It's funny.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah and so he, he, he had to learn that, Um, but he would consult with me, um, in his frustrations and I would, I would talk to him about that. So that's one of the things that um I say was, you know, was good, um, he knew who to consult with. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, in regards to that, and I think that that also to help with the trust component, that helped with the trust component.
Speaker 1:Um, that's good um, let's talk about uh technology. So what year? What year was it when she was four? She's 18, so what? The year you guys got divorced was when? I don't know I'm trying to do what is this.
Speaker 2:She was born in 2006, so okay, so all right 2010 2010 yeah, 11, okay, cool.
Speaker 1:So, um, I just want to make sure that my comments were going to make sense, so that, yeah, they, they are. So, so we're, we're, we're in the rise of the social media age, in that, in that age, right, we're the rise of the, the phones you know, um, and device age that we're all in now, um, a comment that I've heard recently was one of the things that we, as parents, is important for us to unlearn is that, um, that the phone can't out parent you, um, so that that is something we have to unlearn and then attack that, right, because that's, if we're honest, uh, that we don't. I think a lot of a lot of parents who parent children in that in that age range, yeah, can lend over teaching and parenting to a device and not really realize it, right, um, and I'll, and, and, adding on to that, when you are parenting by yourself, you don't have the help every day. That's got to even be more of a temptation, and I've seen it right, I don't know how that was for you, but what was your experience and trying to negotiate that kind of like, like, how do I parent my child with this technology that is available? What is my, how do I manage and handle that rhythm, that tension?
Speaker 1:You know, when she was younger probably wasn't as much as when she was getting a little older middle school. God help them. In middle school, middle schoolers are just the strangest beings on earth. They're just so strange, and so, you know, when you get to that, to that age, and kids are having phones and that's, you know they got Instagram accounts and they got all this stuff and you know the world is is in their hands. At 10, 11, 12, 13 years old, whether you, whether what you know, whatever.
Speaker 1:However, wherever you were on the spectrum, how did you make those decisions? How did you handle that? And then how did you manage, uh, manage that with being a single parent and keeping up with it and knowing what she was watching? I think that is something that even as more people as we continue to parent in these newer, in these years, upcoming years I mean, technology isn't going anywhere. The busyness of a parent is real, for sure, and it's like I don't. I don't have time to sit there and watch you all the time, right? So what has that been like? What has that journey been like for you?
Speaker 2:Well, christina didn't. She didn't even get a phone until like later. She was like I'm the only person that doesn't get a phone until like later she was like I'm the only person that doesn't have a phone and she did. She also did not have a TV in her room for quite some time because my I don't know. My logic was you know, I did not. I didn't know. My logic was you know, I did not. I didn't want her to be ever going to sleep with the.
Speaker 2:TV on because of you know just a lot of spiritual components to that. But you know, I also want her to realize that you know the bedroom is for sleeping.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and and um. I did not have a TV in my bedroom either. Um, and to each his own. Um. Not judging anybody who does Um, but I just did not want my bedroom to become, um, the place where I was always.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:That's good.
Speaker 2:No that's good Um, and so she didn't have um a TV in her room for quite some time, um. But when she um got a phone, um, honestly I was just, I was kind of green with that Um, just to be honest um as um out here and exposed as as I, as I am and as I was um, because, like I said, I have not always um taught literal in the classroom, but I've managed our school time programs and supervised those leads and all of that. So I've always been around students at all ages. And so it's not like I didn't know it, didn't see it, didn't you know ages? And so it's not like I didn't know it, didn't see it, didn't you know. But when it was in my house I was kind of green and not really sure how I wanted to navigate that and if I wanted to put all the blocks on and all of those things. But if I can think about it, I will say, because I talked to her a lot, knowing and understanding what we were talking about and what was coming out in the conversation kind of gave me an idea of what she was being exposed to.
Speaker 2:Yep became, would I say, the middle-aged, transitioning over into the teenager when they start to withhold a little bit Yep, Yep, and I could tell because I'm so in tune with her, because, again, we talk a lot, and then I could tell when she started to you know, I'm not telling mommy everything, right, you know. So that's when that became started to become a little bit more challenging for me. So then I just beefed up, beefed up my conversation. So what are we doing? What are we talking about? You know what's going on up my conversation, what are we doing? What are we talking about? You know what's going on. You know Um and um, just really trying to, to pull it in in that direction. Now, at this day and age, um, I'm, I'm, I'm a little, you know, I'm depending on prayer.
Speaker 1:Yeah Amen, Amen. That's real I'm. I'm depending on prayer. Yeah amen, Amen.
Speaker 2:That's real. I'm depending on prayer and the Holy Spirit to reveal things with us for her to feel like, you know, my mom gives me a little bit, but trust you me, you don't have full reign, um, and you know just when she feels like, you know, you don't let me do anything. Um, there are those moments where it's evident that, oh, I do let you do some things, but there are some limitations. So that that's what that dynamic looks like. I honestly, ruth, I have not been the one that put all the blocks on and the restrictions, and I'm not the one that says let me see your phone.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but she knows me enough to know that if I want to know, you can find out. I'm going to know, baby, and I've let her know in enough instances where oh, she's for real. The Holy Spirit do is a tattletale yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, and that's true, and I think you know, you said something earlier about allowing you some things. You just have to allow to happen and you can't try to, you know, put barriers around every single thing, because that's not realistic, you're not going to be able to manage all that and we do have to rely on the unseen power that gives us revelation, insight, and then manage it accordingly, because you can't know everything. I mean like you said, I mean, like you said, she's 18. Like she is, she's out there and you know, and so it's like, okay, just out there living the best she outside, she outside, she outside.
Speaker 2:Right now, with the besties hanging out at the school. You know, and I put, and I sprinkled a little prayer on oh, that's, that's all I can do.
Speaker 1:You know I, there's a, so so this was a. This would have been a couple episodes ago, which is a great episode where they we talk about.
Speaker 1:I have a couple friend of mine. They have five adult children and she one of the things that that she said was real parenting doesn't start until they turn 18. And I said you have to unpack that and she was basically like you have to know, like you aren't. Real parenting is really seeing what stuck. And now you have to watch it right right now, you know what you really did.
Speaker 2:I have listened, I am. I am just like I'm barely on the surface of that, but oh my gosh it was such a profound thought.
Speaker 1:I'd never thought about it like that. And she's like that's what. That's what we are, you know. We just watching to see what stuck, and and I think I think it also is is a great opportunity for those of us who are parenting younger children to release some of the pressure of feeling like I got to get it right today. You just won't know what you got right, what you want. You don't know that you want and you can't and you can't stress yourself out.
Speaker 2:Now, if it works for you, have your way, honey. Put all the blocks on, make all the bells and whistles pop off. If that works for you, then great, yes. But I'm telling you you are not going to know everything. Nope, you're. I mean it honestly, I don't. I don't even think you can know everything. When they're younger, I mean like she's, she's 18. Like when they're younger, I mean like she's, she's 18. Like when they're 10, you got 12, like you're not. You're not with them every day, all day, 24, seven. Nope, you don't know what that conversation was like with her and her friend and how it affected um, her emotions and and how. Now that's gonna affect how she maneuvers on tomorrow, correct? You? Don't? You, don't you?
Speaker 1:don't know, you don't know, you don't know.
Speaker 2:And then you know, you put all the blocks and the bells and the whistles on and something gets through. God dog it. Now what?
Speaker 1:Because these kids smarter than us. They smarter.
Speaker 2:They can figure things out.
Speaker 1:And I don't think there's no teenager that doesn't desire to rebel at some point. Right how that happens per kid, but it happens and so you know there are plenty of things my parents still don't know. They don't know. You know, like you don't know, we talk about stuff, and I mean today, you know we'll be talking about dinner and you know now you just talk Cause you know we all grown, we don't be thinking about it.
Speaker 1:You're like oh, you didn't know that. I didn't know that. It's the first time I'm hearing that. Well, it happened, right, you know. And so just that this unlearning of you can control everything with your children and what your children are exposed to. Because you make a great point when you get to a point where your parents stop being your main influencers and your peers start and that's just that happens for every kid and when, more influential a lot of times than your parents are, you realize that it's your, also your peers parents, that are influential, because whatever they got, they got from their parents come somebody, you, you said something there, so it's like yo, like you your hands, unless you homeschooling your child, doing church with home, with your child, let's y'all shout at home 24 7.
Speaker 1:What with you? You can't know.
Speaker 2:And bless their heart, cause they gotta go outside, they gotta go, they gotta go out there.
Speaker 1:You want them to go. You don't want to be with you all the time. You know they wants that. So, like you got to release it. And yeah, I think, I think, and so I this is a principle, and I'd love for you to unpack how you have, um, how you have, how you understand the difference and how you approaching you know, Christina, Now you said there's a difference between that. You went from teaching to coaching and you being a natural teacher. My mom was a natural teacher coaching. My father's a natural coach. He's a teacher, but he also he, he, the coaching thing, he, he, let's say he got it a little faster than my mama did, Um, and so she just can't resist an opportunity to teach, right? She just can't resist it even today.
Speaker 1:So but that, but I think that's such an important switch for parents to understand at some point. It's a coaching. How would you define the difference between teaching and coaching?
Speaker 2:They listen and then we want them to do. That's the teaching. There's no other side. Yes, okay, uh-huh. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Coaching is hmm. So tell me, you know, what did you think about that? What did you learn from that? Do you think you'll do something different? Like it's? It's a back and forth. Um, it allows them to be able to actually think through their own stuff.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And I think that it conditions them to do it without you. That's good yeah, is that?
Speaker 2:easy to do. Sometimes it is yeah, but in other times that it just switches and you want to be like you should do blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and this is what's da, da, da, da, da, da. And then you know, at a certain stage they're like don't you do that, because now you're getting ready to get this whole wall and y'all can't even conversate about something that you want them to really be open with you, um, about. So there are times where I literally have to pause and make sure that I'm getting ready to present myself in a way where we can still have the conversation.
Speaker 2:Yes, that's good and I can get some feedback, some feedback, um. I won't say that. You know she is always open. You know cause the dialogue can get to a place to where you know she really didn't want to hear that. Um, but I can tell it was still received. Yes, yes, um, and and and that's, that's the. That's the difference.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that is and it's, it's a. I think what I heard in that and I, I uh, coaching is something that I realized, I, I found some I find so much value in and I've really been leaning into it in all aspects of my life. A lot of um in the last, I would say, about five years, yeah, but um, asking great questions and being very curious, like you know, replacing your certainty with curiosity because you don't know. That's good. You know, which is hard for parents. I can't. I know you, You're mine, Right, Right, that's hard.
Speaker 1:And and so, even if you might know, they don't always have to know that you know, that you know, let me let you find out that I know I ain't gotta tell you, right, just let me let you. You can find out through our conversation. Um, and that idea of slowing down, you know, and not, um, not presuming, not getting back into how you were when you were five, like no, like you know, and I think it it just takes.
Speaker 1:It takes practice, and I um, I work with teenagers and so I, I, I get you know, I, my parenting journey started three years ago.
Speaker 1:My husband, um, my, my, I had a package deal um, come on, adulting, come on adulting baby, so so, uh, I've been, you know, kind of in that role, um, for for about two years now two but officially two years. But you know, started when we were dating and so I have I've been working with teenagers for 15 years. I've been doing this, the work that I do for 15 years with kids, so I'm used to, to working with young people, uh, raising one is totally different. I realized that very quickly, like, oh, this is a totally different thing. And I also realized that my relationships with the parents that I have for my young people begin to shift because I begin to understand them better being a parent.
Speaker 1:Right and I also I realized that a lot of them cause we were starting to have more candid conversations and I realized that so many of them just did not know how to handle their teenager.
Speaker 1:It's just like I don't know how to do this. She's getting on my nerves, she won't listen and I found myself helping by saying, instead of trying to teach and tell, coach, ask questions. Here's some questions you can ask and just let them talk, because a lot of the times they just want to talk like a lot and you know they may not, they may already actually know the answers that you hope that they know, but they just want to talk.
Speaker 1:Um and if you, if you kind of begin to give yourself, grow yourself right and so you know, grow yourself as a parent, as a, as a person, and and and go on that journey of maturity yourself, Absolutely It'll help, Right? I just think that's so profound, that teaching and coaching dynamic. You got to make the switch at some point, Otherwise they do their walls go straight up.
Speaker 2:They do. You know, and you got to know, and you got to know when and I and I'll say when it may be appropriate for you to start making that switch, because some parents might say, oh, then they're teenagers. You for sure you need to make that switch. Some parents might say, oh, then they're teenagers, you for sure you need to make that switch. No, baby. No, in this day and age we talking about eight. When I tell you, nine years old, you better be switching, you better switch, you're going to be clueless when you better switch.
Speaker 1:He's 10. Our son is 10. And I find myself having more conversations, but my parents didn't ever talk to me like this. No, 10 years old, are you crazy? The only question is my mom would ask me is how old are you? I say, how old am I? How old am I? I live more life than you, but now it is like a full on conversation conversation. You know well how are you. Well, why do you think that? What, what is, what's, what is the thing that you're thinking about right now? Um, why, why are you upset? You know that, like I bet, you have to start earlier because they're they're different and they're they're exposed to so much more.
Speaker 2:They are and they help you parent them when we get aside, when we get off this high horse. Wow, that we know it all wow start having those conversations. They help you parent them. It's almost like they're like let me help you parent me.
Speaker 1:If you would shut up and let me help you parent me. Wow God, that's so profound and I don't like that. There's something about that. I'm like. I don't like that because I didn't get to help my parents parent me. I don't like it at all. I don't like it at all Because I didn't get to help my parents parent me. Okay, I don't like it at all. I don't like it at all what you mean. No, I think that's good. So let's kind of shift to this, because, with that in mind, what are you seeing with? You know, from a parent's perspective, but also a teacher's perspective, the difference in the, in the level of resilience in kids today what are you seeing?
Speaker 2:I have to say that my child is different because she lives with me. Right, right, that's right. And you know, oftentimes I actually I use her as an example in class. I teach college skills, and no, it's not the college skills where you know, you learn how to, you know properly, write an email, talk to your instructor, be advised. It's a, it's a very rigorous course and it's a whole lot deeper than that. I've had students, I have, I've had students say that um, feels like group counseling and I'm like um, but um, student, the to ruth, I'm almost nervous to even to even, you know, dig into it. It's a lot, it's a lot, it's a lot. There's, there's so many excuses that are presented that I didn't get an opportunity to make, or or that I did. I even know that that was a thing. And do I have to now cater to to this thing? Um, and, and I, and I say that and I want to be sensitive, so I don't want to start popping off all the titles. Right, right. You know what I'm talking about I do.
Speaker 2:Okay, all right, I want to be sensitive to that, because some of them are legit For sure. No 100%. Some of them are legit, but for what it's worth, honey. I could have wore a t-shirt with a whole bunch of things on it when.
Speaker 2:I was growing up, but I didn't get that opportunity. I think there's a lot more hand-holding that is demanded, like they demand it. You must do this for me, not this one. No, I'm not, no, I'm not. Um, and so I think that if the the things are not there that they they, they would not survive because those things allow for the handholding to happen.
Speaker 1:Yes, yep.
Speaker 2:Yep, for sure, because they have something to require it. They have something to require it. Yes, and I know that sounds so vague, but for those of you who will listen to this, I hope that you know exactly what I'm saying without saying it.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, I'll say it that way, you don't have to, okay, so. So I think identity is so important and there's a, there's a therapist. That's that I've been, that's just kind of been popping up on my feed lately. Um, who has, I think, has, a very strong voice of um how would I put it? Very practical, uh, therapy, not, not, it's, it's, it's, it's very, it's real, but it's, it's what I think, what she would call a capacity building, and not just going, not just healing, but capacity building.
Speaker 1:One of the things that I like about how she, she, she talks about is, if you aren't, if your capacity to handle hard isn't built through your healing process, you're not really healing. And so when, um, when young people are diagnosed with certain things um, have, you know, and there's medication involved, there's counseling involved, there's therapy involved a lot of times what happens is we, we, uh, sometimes unknowingly, encourage it is they become that thing, they become it, you become your diagnosis. So when you become that, you have a reason to say no, I am this, therefore, I need this. And then it sounds like people are not supporting you because they're not supporting who you are. But the difference is you don't, you aren't anything. You are experiencing this right now. Right now. If you choose to continue to experiencing it, you can do that, but there are ways to minimize the experience you may not be able to get rid of it, and that's real and that's part of capacity building, right?
Speaker 1:But there is a way to minimize it and so I think you know, and those labels are arranged from all kinds of things, all the diagnoses you could think of, right? I mean, that's, it's all of it. And I think that, when it comes to parenting, the thing that I have learned and and I think I I one of the things I've had to unlearn I love your thoughts on this is that kids don't need to struggle. You know, struggle is a part of building capacity and I found you know what I'm saying Like I found myself sometimes because it looks too hard for him to handle taking away the hard. But recently, I would say recently, I think you know, for a while, both of us have kind of had to lay back on that and I think, because of our generation, we just we're part of that. You know, we kind of what is it? Work harder, work smarter, not harder. Like I don't want to do things. If I don't have to do the hard thing, I'm going to find another way.
Speaker 1:And our generation really kind of I think, is pioneering. Pioneering that, and but that's not a healthy way to go. And so, particularly when it comes to children who are, you know, young four, five, six, seven, eight you know they don't need to be shielded from hard things. You know one of his chores is to take out the trash. Sometimes the trash gets stuck. You know One of his chores is to take out the trash. Sometimes the trash gets stuck you know it's heavy and it gets stuck.
Speaker 1:He calls me Miss Abby. He says Miss Abby, can you help me? No, I'm not going to figure out how to get that out the trash. Like you know, now it's allowing him and he figures it out. Like I know, it's not too hard for you, you actually don't need my help, you just you tried, for, you know, 0.5 seconds and now you're tired and you want somebody else to do it for you, and so I've stopped helping him. Do small things like that, right. Or you know he has guinea pigs which I wish he didn't, but he has them and um, and so he's got to clean that cage. Well, that's, that's a. It's like, hey, you know he and his dad would do it. He don't need his dad, no more, go clean the cage. You know that kind of thing and it's, they're small, but it's like how do you raise? Raise a resilient child. You don't take struggle away from them. Like he like eat hard, things, things hard. Let them work through it, right facts.
Speaker 2:Now let's talk, let's dig into that, because I'm gonna tell you, give me the hat with the helicopter. You know I wore the t-shirt and you know I, I, you know honestly, you know I'm I'm cutting off the sleeves and you know I've made it a midriff. Is it completely off?
Speaker 2:It's not that I think that um, and you know, of course, if you look that up helicopter parent, if you look at it, you know there's a definition and the symptoms and what it all looks like and and and all of that Um, but it is a um, if I would define it. You know, in my, in my words, it's a protective tool. Sure, and you know all parents, you know, if you love your kids, you want to protect them Absolutely. But you know there comes a time where you need to determine okay, am I enabling them, because you know they may come across a situation where you're not there. Yes To you know, pull them out of that. And then, ok, let's go back to the whole coaching thing.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:OK, when you're coaching and you're having that dialogue now, they can talk through that thing by themselves. Yes. Yes, which is another reason why switching over to that side of parenting is best you know, so you can feel more comfortable with them being able to make those decisions on their own.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, that whole protective thing is is is something and um, I could, you know, I could break down and cry oh my gosh, she's going, she's driving an hour, she's gonna be gone always. Like this is what I'm experiencing, like right now, in this present moment, I don't want to go hang out with my friends at school. You know she's, she's here, she's going to one of the technical schools here and she's got some friends that went away. Yep, there you go, and so you know she wants to hang out. I'm a college student. Yes, you are. I guess I got to.
Speaker 2:I guess you know. First couple of times it was no, yeah, no. That's why I'm a college student, if I wasn't here, you wouldn't even know yeah.
Speaker 2:Right, and you know I have to take these blows that she throws at me we have these conversations, and so I have cultivated this type of dialogue, and so we're at a place where, you know, although she says some things that I don't like, I have to ingest them and you know I'm like. You're right, you know, just, you know, make sure don't forget who you are, watch your back, be aware of your surroundings. You know, make sure don't forget who you are, watch your back, be aware of your surroundings. You know, all these things I throw out there so I can make sure that they're at the forefront of her mind, and then I let her go, and then I send out the APB to everybody. Hey, pray, pray pray.
Speaker 1:She going out of town. We're just an hour away, child. She ain't there, it's okay. That is hour away to ask you if it's okay. That is, that's real. Oh, yeah, that's real. But you know, I think there's a difference between protecting from harm and then protecting from something that's hard why? You know what I mean? Yeah, that's different, that's different. I mean we should be protecting them from harm, like well, no, if I feel like something's gonna be dangerous for you, I'm not gonna let you do that.
Speaker 1:You know, now if I feel like it's gonna be hard and I'll think a lot of times like the um, and and I, and let me say this I think the the the thing that frustrates me about younger, the younger generation is sometimes they don't see the difference in harm and hard. It's like, yeah, you know what I'm saying. Hard is not harmful and, for whatever reason, that narrative has been in people's, in a lot of their brains.
Speaker 1:It's like if it's hard it's going to hurt me and and, and that's just not true. It's just not true. And um, and so I, I think it's really, I think it's so important, but I see, you know the importance and I'm grateful for my parents and and, and then they took no heart away from us. I mean that hard was expected. Right, it was like quit we don't say the word quit, we don't say the word can't. That's just what we grew up with, right, like that's. We don't do that. So, um, figure it out and that, and so watch, like the intentionality of parenting a younger child now, when that's not the norm for a lot of kids. Right, it's tough. You said you use her as an example, so that that that must mean that she's different than what you see.
Speaker 2:Absolutely she is, and I'm grateful for that.
Speaker 2:But again, you know she has had me, she's had her experiences, you know she's got her speak to. You know what um. You know what my students have um, you know at home. But you know I do know that still that you know they're growing up in this day and age that maybe you know the people, the village that they have around them. Um is not saying, hey, that doesn't have to be you, you don't have to evolve into that, you don't have to melt into that mold. Um, you know you can be this and you can be that, and, and that's what you know, my class is all about Um, and so you know we do a lot of you know my class is all about, and so you know we do.
Speaker 2:a lot of you know debunking and dispelling myths and you know having dialogue. How can you, how would you? Now that you know this, this is what you need to do. Let's throw these nuggets out here. You know, and it's the same thing that I do at home, so, yes, I can use her as an example for those, for those instances.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's good. I'd like to end on this because I think it's just an interesting question. We kind of you know you said it your child could often teach you how to parent them, which is such a humbling God. That's such a humbling idea, oh God like you got to be kidding. Um, but it's true, you know, uh, and so what else has your, has your child? Has Christina taught you about either life, love yourself, that you didn't see coming?
Speaker 2:that, uh, that I would have to, um, learn some things about myself that I needed to fix, because she would exude those things. She was doing those things, wow, and God would say that's you, oh, oh, yeah. And you hear people around you say your kids will show you you, oh, they're going to show you you. You know, you don't really realize that you know, and then people think you know, that's you know, that's the cutesy little stuff like how they walk or how they smile. You know not your attitude and, uh, your stubbornness and, um, you know those sorts of things, um, but that that that's what stands out the most Um, out the most Um, and me being receptive, uh, didn't come quickly, you know, I would recognize. Ooh, that's me, wow, and just, you know, move past this, move on, yeah, um, but now I'm like, ooh, I ain't fix that.
Speaker 2:You know that's not necessarily a good trait to have yeah yeah and she, you know, at times will say well, mommy, you want me to do XYZ, but you do, and I do not say, well, I'm the parent, right, so that doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:I only say that when she's being disrespectful and her tone or she's talking at me, I'm like wait a minute, yeah right, you don't get to talk to me that way, yep, but I don't ever tell her that it's okay for me to me that way, yep, but I don't ever tell her that it's okay for me to do that, mm and you. But you can't, I don't do that, whew. Now I might. I might all of a sudden turn into a kid and be like well, I meant something different, uh-huh, and. And she'll be like but it's the same, mommy, but it's, but it's the same. And I legit respect that, because, guess what, that's the lord talking to me that's right.
Speaker 1:That, that's right, that's right.
Speaker 2:Um, and if and if you're open to that, um, then you receive that rebuke. Um yeah, and you know that I don't always say you're right, no, I don't always say you're right, but I but I do go and reflect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's, and that's beautiful because it is the Lord talking, and it's also a reflection of what you've put in her talking, because the fact that she has that kind of understanding and can respond in that way and say and it's a reflection of your relationship, and that's something you instilled in her Right Like, and that's so, that that's something you instilled in her right like, and that's so that that's that's really interesting. Um, golly, that's uh, it, that's yep it's heavy.
Speaker 1:It's heavy, that's heavy, that's heavy especially when you you're looking, you're looking at someone who you've raised and you're you're seeing how your dysfunction has now. You're watching it and it's like, oh, you know, and now it's now you have a decision, what am I going to do? Because I don't know. You see how that can play out. You know, I would imagine it's a reflection. You kind of reflect and you're like I see how that dysfunction has played out in my life. I don't want it to play out in hers, right, right. And so the only way I can, the best way, let me say the only the best way for us to address this, is not just for me to tell her not to do it, but for me to change.
Speaker 2:Yep, for me to change. There have even been moments, ruth, where I want to protect her in situations or scenarios where I have to, like, really like, mute myself, like to not say to her hey, don't do this, hey, don't you know, because I am now projecting onto her my experience and I don't know what her experience is going to be. And again, that's the protecting part. Yes, but that can be damaging. Yes, if I'm projecting something that's not that I don't even know, is there? Yes, now I'm making her think about stuff that she probably wasn't even thinking about Yep Wow.
Speaker 2:Wow. So, but it takes for you to have to think those, those. And when I say think it doesn't take, it doesn't take a long time. You know, you think that it's going to take you five or 10 minutes to do that. No, I'm talking about just not having knee jerk reactions. Yes, yes.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Just don't have a knee jerk reaction. Just stop, Wait a minute and think about I'm not going to say anything. Have a good one. Be, safe. Wow, now I may pray. You know, lord lord, please don't let her have, you know, the same experience that I have had, or help her to be able to deal with it better than I did. Um, you know that sort of thing um, but I don't. I try my best not to project um my experiences um to her that's good, um, all right.
Speaker 1:So is there anything else that you would encourage? You know what's one other thing you would encourage that we haven't talked about, or something that's come to your mind, or anything you want to double down on, for, um, parents that you feel like have experienced parents in the way you have need to unlearn um, this may be a double down and it may just be based on what I just said, um, and kind of tying in some other things.
Speaker 2:But, um, and this would be for those who, um are, are, like you know, deep into you know, single parenthood, or, or just just now coming into it, um, that, um, I would say and this might be a hard pill to swallow, but always keeping at the forefront of your mind that you did not write the book on parenting and you do not know it all and, and, if their other, the other parent is in their life, allow them to parent. They love them, they love their children.
Speaker 2:It may not look like what you want their parenting to look like, but allow them to parent. You know, I mean, like I said, I didn't, I didn't always get it right and you know there's not a whole lot of that particular component happening now because again, she's older, Um, but there are moments where I may, you know, not get it right now, but allow them to learn just like you are, wow, wow.
Speaker 1:I think a lot of people might need to hear that, because that's tough.
Speaker 2:It is and it's hard. I mean, I'm not saying that that's easy because it was hard as crap to do that and that's easy because it was hard as crap to do that. But beyond a shadow of a doubt, that man loves his daughter, yeah, and I know that he would never do anything to intentionally hurt her. You know ups and downs, his quorums, his idiosyncrasies, all of his flaws, whatever. Whatever Guess what. I got some too. I have some too, and my crap can mess her up just like his.
Speaker 1:Just like his. Come on, that's real, yep.
Speaker 2:That's it, so I'm not any better.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, allow the other one to parent. You know, bite your tongue every now and then watch them work. Yeah, yeah, you might. You might end up respecting how they handled that situation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I, and just just just to make it even more universal, even when you're in, you're married and doing it, you gotta do the same thing, because, lord knows, sometimes I'll be like what are you doing? And he got to be like let me work. And it is humbling. It's like I wouldn't do it like that. Why are you doing it like that? It's like, yeah, because I'm different.
Speaker 2:That starts when they're infants. Believe it or not, that starts when they're infants. I would not let that child cry herself to sleep. And he was like, let her cry, I don't want to let her cry, I don't want to let her cry, and I wish I had of. I wish I had of, because guess what the result of that was? See, once she was able to get up out of her bed, instead of crying she would get up out of her bed and she would come into our room and we decided that we were not going to allow her to lay in her bed until she went to sleep. Do you know how crazy we were, lack of sleep, and if I would have just yielded to that and just suffered through it because he could deal with it, and I just didn't want to do it because that's the baby, you know, that's the baby. And that's just a small example, but, um, a good one, I think.
Speaker 1:Absolutely no. I love that. That. That helps me, even like um man, thank you, Thank you, thank you for coming. This was so much fun I love.
Speaker 1:Thank you for being transparent, thank you for your honesty, for your wisdom, and I really hope that it helps the people that needs to help, and this is great. So, y'all, if you thought this was valuable don't keep it to yourself, share it. Make sure to subscribe. Comment um, let us know what, what you're thinking, let us know what you're learning, uh, and unlearning, and we're trying to grow the community, so we want more people like you, uh, so, so help us, help us reach them. Um, all right, so let's keep on learning together, folks, folks, so that we can experience more freedom, and we will see y'all next time. Peace. Thank you once again for listening to the Unlearned Podcast. We would love to hear your comments and your feedback about the episode. Feel free to follow us on Facebook and Instagram and to let us know what you think. We're looking forward to the next time when we are able to unlearn together to move forward towards freedom. See you then.
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