The UnlearnT Podcast
The UnlearnT Podcast is designed to help you gain the courage to change your mind about things you never thought you would change your mind about. Our hope is that you will begin to move towards a life of freedom after hearing stories from individuals who have chosen to unlearn some things in their lives.
The UnlearnT Podcast
Unlearning Toy Story
We explore leadership lessons from Pixar's Toy Story in this episode of our Summer Movies series, examining how disruption and change affect team dynamics and leadership development.
• Teams typically go through four developmental stages: forming, storming, norming, and performing
• Disruption (like Buzz arriving) moves teams from norming back to storming - a necessary part of growth
• Leaders must avoid seeing talented newcomers as threats rather than assets
• The developmental leader framework shows four stages: enthusiastic beginner, disillusioned learner, capable but cautious performer, and self-reliant achiever
• Leadership development is cyclical - we go through these stages repeatedly with different skills and challenges
• Middle adults should consider if they've neglected personal growth while focusing on career development
• Being willing to become a beginner again in some area of life can foster growth and joy
• True leadership influence comes when focused on building others up, not just delivering "truth"
• The journey from potential to greatness often leads back to potential in new areas
Like, share, and subscribe to be part of our community and invite others who are growth-minded leaders seeking more freedom in their lives and leadership.
hello everybody and welcome once again to the unlearned podcast. I'm your host, ruth abigail aka ra. What's up, friends? It's your girl, jaquita and this is the podcast that's helping you gain the courage to change your mind so that you yes, you can experience more for freedom. And we are in our summer series, Summer movies. Do your song Summer summer summertime, summertime, summertime. That's become my little thing. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2:And it's also not my song. It was written by the Fresh Prince.
Speaker 1:Sure got it.
Speaker 2:I think, sure. Ruth Abigail, did you not know that? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. That sure, that sure sounded unsteady. It sounded girl. Y'all, please excuse her.
Speaker 1:Here's what I did know. I did know you didn't write it. I knew that.
Speaker 2:Girl, how do you not know Summertime? It is the epic Summertime song.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry I've disappointed you in that. I'm so disappointed. That is been our little mini theme song for this particular series, where we've been looking at movies from our childhood and seeing what we can unlearn about leadership and growth and freedom. Yay, all right. So yeah, we're gonna, we're done we're sorry what I do okay, all right, uh.
Speaker 1:So before we get started, as always, we would love for you to like share share, subscribe, um, we want you to be a part of this community and invite others to be a part. Um. If you know people who are growth minded, who are leaders, who want to um find more freedom in their life and their leadership, this is the place for them. Guys, this is the place, and so we want you then to be a part. We want you to be a part, want you to share it, and yeah, so don't keep it to yourself.
Speaker 2:Share it, give it away. Give it away.
Speaker 1:Okay, you can't hold it Be generous, you can't hold it Be open-handed.
Speaker 2:If it's doing something for you, it can do something for somebody else too. Come on, okay, go ahead and share it.
Speaker 1:Go ahead and share it. Go ahead and share it. Okay, so today is, I believe, a fan favorite. It is a classic.
Speaker 2:Classic, classic, and we're back in animated land we are.
Speaker 1:We're back in animated land we foray there with Lion King.
Speaker 2:Yes, okay, which, okay, which is the ultimate animated classic like it rivals Aladdin for me but okay, ooh, aladdin was my favorite, but I think Lion King was like. I mean that Lion King is like, that's like the grandfather of them all that's actually true, I agree yeah, you know, and Aladdin was like that new thing. It was like yeah, you know it had know, and Aladdin was like that new thing. It was like, yeah, you know it had upbeat songs and he was running. You know I was like this is fun.
Speaker 1:We love this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, aladdin was fun, lion King was simba.
Speaker 1:Yes, but this one is pretty cool because this one was like it wasn't just, it just not just classic because of the story and the popularity, but because of the timing and the creativity of it, because this is really our first venture into pixar yeah, you know, you know, pixar gave us a different vibe, totally different, totally different vibe.
Speaker 2:Pixar was like. Pixar took us into the land of what, if, like, what if your toys were talking? You know, like what, if you know, I'm thinking like inside out what if there were little things inside your mind controlling your emotions? Right right up wasn't up pixar, up was pixar, oh man beautiful, beautiful, beautiful love that we were this close. We were this close if we were had a couple of more leadership. Things love up. Oh, I love it so much up today.
Speaker 1:Yes, but you know this, but the very first pixar movie, this was the very first one. And the and also just think I mean we went from not just the land of what if? But the land of 3d, like you were, this was, you know, I'm saying like animation, excuse me you're on a whole nother level, like it was like real people in animation. It was weird. Yeah, it was very cool um and so, if you haven't figured it out, guys, we are talking about the great toy story, one and only one story friends one and only listen, going back and re-watching this has been.
Speaker 2:It was it was it was, was it hit in the gut? Cause you know we've now we're now have four Toy Story movies and they've all been fantastic. That fourth one threw us a little bit, cause at first I wasn't with it, cause they took the little spork and was trying, was it a spork or a fork? And it was a spork. I'll be honest.
Speaker 1:And they was trying. I may or may not have seen it.
Speaker 2:I mean it looks very corny and they're trying to convince us that the sport could be a toy, but in the end it still got to the old heartstrings. That third one, though top tier. The third one was when they brought out Lotso.
Speaker 1:The bear, the little scary bear. I'll be honest. Yeah, I've got to make a confession. I have not seen three or four've only seen one and two. I understand how that's offensive to some of you and I apologize. All right, guys.
Speaker 2:I want y'all to join. I want y'all to join me next time. Uh, I'll be doing the shows, the show reviews, by myself, because I cannot keep I'm so sorry partnering with Ruth Abigail and her shenanigans. First, you don't know Summertime, then you didn't watch Toy Story 3? I didn't. All right, everybody, on behalf of our audience and all those who listen and all those that love you, your assignment before the end of the next month is to watch Toy Story 3. Because what are you doing? Okay, what are you doing? Yeah?
Speaker 1:Anywho guys, Sorry.
Speaker 2:I don't know what Ruth Abigail got going on, but we are talking about Toy Story, the first movie, and it's so like going back because those of us who have watched all the movies like we know where the characters are now. But yo, woody, listen, and it's really told kind of following Woody's, like his, his, the conflict, his inner conflict as it, as the movie is kind of Woody against Woody as he's dealing with this huge shift in the dynamics of his team and of his world. Right, it wasn't because, you know, woody, they don't clock out. You know they toys all day. You know, all day we work for Andy. They got Andy's name on the bottom of their foot, like how we work for the Lord all day. Now you ought to write the Lord's name on the bottom of your foot, say I belong to Jesus. Okay, somebody look on the bottom of your foot, say I belong to Jesus. Somebody look on the bottom right there. Move on, that's who I work for. We're moving on.
Speaker 2:Anyways. But they don't clock out right, and so his entire world is consumed with being Andy's toy. And so when something and not only being Andy's toy, but being Andy's favorite toy right and also being the leader of the toys, and so when something comes to disrupt that, it doesn't just shift his leadership, it shifts his understanding of his identity, that's it. And I think that's the narrative that we're following throughout this movie, and so we're going to talk about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're going to talk about it, and we're going to talk about it in the terms of a couple of, really, I think, great leadership frameworks and team frameworks, or a leadership framework and a team framework. Okay, because, like Queda was saying, you kind of have these two dynamics that play with each other. You have the dynamics of leaders or potential leaders who are coming up or finding up, um, or find their own journey, finding their own journey, and then you have the dynamic of a team that does have to go through a shift and what that looks like Right.
Speaker 1:And so, for those of you that are leaders and, um, uh, leaders in different areas, uh, for anything, transition, uh, shifts, things that come at you, that you can't control, disruption All of those themes are in here, and I think this is where we can, what we can learn, and how, what we can unlearn from how it is we might normally behave, um, versus what's the best thing to do. So, um, as you're, as we're going through this, just like having my what's a, what's a recent disruption you've had in your, in your, in your space, Right, yeah, and, and how did you, how are you or how did you manage that and where can you find yourself in this? And I think that's a good place to just be kind of thinking. And where can you?
Speaker 1:find yourself in this, and I think that's a good place to just be kind of thinking.
Speaker 2:And, you know, I think something that we don't always recognize is when a disruption has happened. Right, because a lot of times, a lot of times, you know, for in this movie, it was the addition of a new toy, and not just a new toy, but a new toy that was galaxy minded, whereas they were room minded. They were like our entire world and the scope of our understanding exists in this room. And then Buzz Lightyear comes in and he says I'm here to defend the galaxy. You know, I go from planet to planet, you know. And so his mind is like this room is just another place, you know, even you know we can talk about him being programmed and all that jazz, but his mindset is this room is a place I've come to do one task and I'm and I'm onto the next, you know.
Speaker 2:And so when you have something that that is, uh, that does not fit in your world, right, that does not fit in your world, right, that does not fit in the realm of your understanding or in the realm of your team's normal operating functions and the normal atmosphere of your team, right, and the normal, you know, people talk about. You know, our team is like a family. Well, what happens when somebody that doesn't look like your family comes in Right, or somebody that doesn't look like or act like you Right. Those are all disruptors.
Speaker 1:Which, by the way, if I could put a little plug in, I think team as family is a very toxic mindset, toxic. I do not recommend you thinking about your team as a family.
Speaker 2:That is not what you are.
Speaker 1:You are a team and you are working towards a goal and a mission and everything else is not important.
Speaker 2:That is not the case with the family, the team, as a family mentality, which, of course, they all lived in the same room, so it's hard not to be a family. Sure, you know, they ain't even you know.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think they were a family, you know, they didn't even. You know they were a family, you know yeah.
Speaker 2:But I think I think the reason that the team as a family kind of mentality is so dangerous is because it does not allow you to turn the team off Right and then, and so like you're going home and now people want and so like you're going home and now people want. So my one of my previous jobs like we we never really said the team as family mentality, but it was very present and we had one person that we hired who was like I just want to make it clear I'm not doing this. No, I'm not going to your house for no shindig. No, I don't want to hang out with y'all, I don't want to kick it with you. What movie is that? I don't want to hang with you, I don't want nothing. Ruth don't know, but anyways, she was just very clear.
Speaker 2:I like y'all, I'm good being a part of this team, I enjoy y'all. We can do stuff at the job, but stop trying to make this personal, because I got a life Right and and I think that as a uh, not just as a leader, but just any team that you enter into my life has been better because I have better boundaries. I've been able to build a lot, not only build a life, but build myself, because my identity is not dependent on a team anymore. It's not dependent on what the team thinks about me. It's not depending on how a team is moving or operating Right. I get to be me Right Despite what everybody else is doing. I get to be me right Despite what everybody else is doing, and I really enjoy that autonomy and it allows us to be better contributors when you set healthy boundaries.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So let's talk about this team framework that we have, and some of you may have heard it before, but it is a kind of a description of what all teams really go through, right, and you kind of go through it and then you probably just hit different points along the way. It's not like you just go through it once and then you start to soar. It's a circle, it's a consistent cycle, like you're always. You're always in one of these places and in in the movie you find them in one space and then they move to another one because of a disruption. So the first, this is the forming, storming, norming, performing framework, and some of you may have heard of that.
Speaker 1:So we'll just go through them real quick, which each one are, so that you know what they are, and then we'll talk about how the movie frames these things right. So forming is essentially when the group members are kind of getting acquainted, they're getting to know each other, their roles and responsibilities aren't quite clear and the leader typically takes the dominant role to guide the team. All right, the leader here would be Woody. All right, he's the one that he that.
Speaker 2:Andy, thank you.
Speaker 1:Andy I couldn't think of the dude's name that Andy plays with the child, the child Calling. Andy, a dude is crazy yeah, yeah right, he's the one that he plays with listen, stop, okay, whatever. So so he's the one that he plays with. He's the one that plays with the most, he's the most popular toy, so he just kind of naturally rises as the leader. All right, and so that that would be an example of what forming is. Uh OK. So Queda, what's storming?
Speaker 2:OK, storming is when that conflict comes up, all right, where that that disruptor arrives in, all right. And so it's usually centered around ideas, around roles who has what role, who gets to do what thing? Power, how power dynamics are shifting, are being challenged within an organization and personalities. Right, thinking about, is everybody on this team still maintaining the same culture? Or did someone come in and say, no, I don't do it that way, right? And so there's been a challenge of authority, and usually there is somebody on the team that has shifted, kind of where influence lies. Yep, and so, really, for Toy Story, it's when, as soon as Buzz lands on the bed, right, that's Woody's spot.
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 2:And everybody knew that. Everybody knew Woody. Yeah, not only knew that, everybody knew Woody, not only did he land on the bed and he took Woody's spot Woody now done slid under the bed and got to crawl his way out. And I think it was such a moment, because the toys that go under the bed are the forgotten toys, and so Woody crawls out from under the bed and they're like yo, woody's under the bed, and they're like yo, woody's under the bed, and they're like you know. And immediately it is like oh snap, the storm is here.
Speaker 2:Right the storm is here.
Speaker 1:Yep, ok. So norming is where you have kind of an established order and cohesion. Everybody understands each other's roles, that's clear, and you shift from just the individual focus to kind of the team goals, and so I think that we kind of find them in this stage. When we meet the room, like when we meet the toys, he's running a meeting that he runs right. So he's like this is not the first. He's running a meeting that he runs Right. So he's like this is not the first. He calls it a staff meeting. This is staff meeting. We do this, we know we do this.
Speaker 1:He calls out different people for thanking them for doing things. So it's clear that there is some. You know the the T and also there there's a clear agenda of what they're meeting about. This is not abnormal, I think. The other thing that makes it clear is they're preparing for his birthday party. They have a process.
Speaker 2:They know what we're doing right.
Speaker 1:The little army men go down and they check to see what toys, because they want to see what toys are coming in in case anybody's going to be replaced. They all are aware of that. They know this is part of the game.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think it's important to note that the challenges that they're experiencing are not the storm, the birthday party and the fact that they're moving. Those are normal things that team have to operate in so you know you saying, man, we got this thing we have to do.
Speaker 2:That's not the storm. That's not the storm, right? That's called work, right, yeah, yeah, that's hey everybody, we gotta do what we gotta do. That's just called right, you know. But and a lot of but, a lot of times we treat the work like the storm Would you talk about it, jaquita?
Speaker 1:Because, oh my gosh, this drives me crazy.
Speaker 2:They say hey, we want the team to do this new thing. We want y'all to build a new program. That's not a storm, it's not a storm.
Speaker 2:Right, that is forward movement and direction. You know that is, you know, they about to move to a bigger house, they going to have a yard. You know what I'm saying? Right, right. They're going to have the ability to, you know, be together, like no, that's not, that's not the storm. The storm is the thing that came to disrupt, it shifted, it shook something, right, it shook the foundation of who they identified themselves as a team, right, and so I just wanted, I just felt like that was needed to be cleared up.
Speaker 1:I agree, right, you doing a new task is not a storm.
Speaker 2:It's not a storm you having to learn a new skill is not a storm. That's right. Right, it's growth.
Speaker 1:It's professional development. This is what. This is something that's very important to unlearn. I'm so glad you brought that up. Um, okay, so for performing, this is, uh, when we have high performance activity, uh, from a team, right it team, the team operates efficiently towards a shared goal. High trust, autonomy, um, constructive communication. This is what that looks like. So you, you cannot perform if you don't go through a storm, didn't?
Speaker 1:mean for that to sound as corny as it did, but it's true, okay. So high performing teams I do not believe you can be a high performing team without having gone through a storm, and so these teams are very because they've gone through storms and because they've established and storms. Let's make that clear. You don't go through a storm. You will go through multiple storms and have to come back to your norm and grow to perform over and over and over again. This is not a one-time situation. This is a cycle and you're going to be hitting different points of the cycle all the time.
Speaker 1:So you're constantly growing and every time you experience a storm, you have an opportunity to up your performance as a team, right, and so, for this group, their performance as a whole, like that disruptor, is a very important part of them becoming a high performing team, if you will, of toys. You have to know what it's like, right, to have somebody disrupt your norm in order for you to know how to perform. So this is where we see this at the end, after all, the conflict has happened, but they do turn into a high-performing team who can now embrace the newness that's been brought into their atmosphere. Right and so that's, I think. So those are the. Those are the four stages that we're. We're highlighted today through the development of a team forming, storming, norming and performing. All right, yeah, so that's the team. But in this, in this movie, obviously there are two main characters. You have woody, and, and so they have their own journeys. So we want to kind of unpack what those are like, right, um, and kind of what their development looks like.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So how we want to do that.
Speaker 2:All right. So we were talking about this kind of like in our pre-show talk.
Speaker 1:Let me go back Hold on real sick because I think, at the risk of, you know, kind of lean on this for a little too long, I just think it might be good for us to share some personal experiences with this forming, storming, norming thing, because I'm thinking about it just occurred to me.
Speaker 1:it's like I'm thinking about my experience as a leader and becoming going from the forming stage to the storming stage, and in one hand, the storming stage and in one hand the storming stage, the storm one, and on the other hand, we moved into a norm. Right, I've experienced both, and so yeah sometimes the storm wins, guys, I ain't gonna lie to you.
Speaker 2:Sometimes it just wins you know I'm saying I don't think I, I don't know that I would ever I would say it like that. I don't know that I would say it like that. I don't know that the storm ever wins. I do think that the storm will eventually always do what it was intended to do. It is just when we I mean any movie you watch when the character hits kind of that storm moment where life has been disrupted, things are not going as it should, things are not going as as anticipated and their life is kind of turned upside down. The you stay, the you will stay in the storm as long as you are unwilling to address what needs to change.
Speaker 1:Well, that's fair. I can see that.
Speaker 2:When we modify, adapt and allow ourselves to be influenced and the team allows itself to be influenced and changed and shift, then we can come. You know, the storm didn't win. The storm wins when we refuse to shift and change. Well, you know what I appreciate that perspective. I take it back the storm didn't win.
Speaker 1:The storm wins when we refuse to shift and change. Well, you know what I appreciate that perspective. I take it back. Okay, storm didn't win. Sometimes it feels like it did.
Speaker 2:I ain't gonna lie, my God, he always wins.
Speaker 1:Now, the Lord won, I ain't gonna lie, he used the storm for sure. Ruth said the Lord won, but I didn't. Sometimes this is how I feel. It's like Jacob in the wrestling, you know, but but I think like no, that's, that's real, like I'll be feeling like that.
Speaker 1:But I think, for me, when I experienced kind of um, my, my personal kind of leadership crisis, um, we, we were forming, and for me, I think I played the role of the disruptor of the team. I was the new one that came in to a team who had a norm. I was the first disruptor, covid was the second one, and so forgot about COVID, forgot about it. I was the first disruptor, covid was the second one, and so Forgot about COVID. Oh yeah, right, forgot about it, right, so, so I, I've been it's.
Speaker 1:It's interesting, as I'm just kind of thinking about this, my, I didn't realize how much my presence disrupted until maybe a year or so later, and I didn't understand how important it was for me to develop as a leader, like Buzz had to develop as a leader, right, I didn't understand the importance of that as much as I was thinking the thing that I came here to do, I need to get it done and that was my initial mentality, as opposed to you need to develop into a leader and I was. I was coming, I'm coming in and I said, cool, I'm ready to do what I came here to do.
Speaker 1:Right, and that was my mentality for for a while and I realized that because my position was a leadership position but my mindset was not leader, my mindset was performer, let me do what I do, and I didn't take the team into mindset, to be kind of focused on.
Speaker 2:Like that's a good perspective. The word that keeps coming up in my mind is retroactively, but that's not like, like reflection, hindsight, Right, right right, that's not like reflection hindsight.
Speaker 2:Right, right, right, because I think sometimes it is easy to point the finger, but I think as a leader, that finger should always be at yourself. Correct disruption and felt like you know, both myself and my team were going through a storm. I had a, an employee, I had someone on my team. You know that he was not, he was not with it, he was not with the culture, he was not with my authority. It was being not only was it being questioned, but he was going to another leader on the team and asking all his questions and getting advice Like he trusted that other leader over me and it led to division. It led to there being a culture shift because he was disrupting at every turn.
Speaker 2:I think one of the hardest moments and the moment that kind of like, you know, where he kind of made like kind of one of his biggest errors was my boss gave him a directive, like my boss, me and him in a meeting, and we said, hey, this is. I had already told him this is what you need to do. He ain't want to hear me, so I had to bring my boss in. My boss tells him this is what we need you to do, and he went and did what he wanted to do. And when it was found out, that was what you know what I'm saying and it was challenging one, because I had this vision of this big, happy team I was building. Right, right, I had this vision of oh, you know, I'm going to say I'm going to encourage y'all, y'all going to go out and do your thing. I got your back, you know, and we're all going to. You know, we're not going to be like these other teams. We're going to be cohesive. You know we're going to be, you know, collaborative and da, da, dah, dah, dah, dah. But I, it's, it's like I, I kept having, you know, I'm having closed door conversations, you know, all the time about how am I going to. You know, how do I? I manage this, um, and it was the one of the most challenging things I've encountered as a leader, but it is also the thing that helped me to grow the most, which is what I think ultimately happened to woody.
Speaker 2:I think, you know, like, yeah, like, coming out of that one, I became, you know, I, because I could, I could have gone one or two ways with it, because he was, you know, talking junk about me behind my bag. He, you know, he had all the stuff, but I, I set him down. I I told him, I was like hey, let me tell you something, I'm the person that hired you. When I had, when I did uh, my uh hiring process and I interviewed all these people, I hired you. Therefore, consider me your biggest advocate. I'm the one who has your back, I'm the one who's going to fight for you. Do not bite me in the behind, because I'm the one that has your back. Yeah, I'm the one that's going to fight for you. You know, and so, but it helped me to learn.
Speaker 2:I had to stand up in that, you know. I had to stand up in who I was. I had to stand up in being a confident leader. I had to stand up and really knowing that, you know, someone who didn't believe in me couldn't shake me. But I also had to double down and say, jaquita, you got to be on your P's and Q's, you know, because sometimes we believe in ourselves too much. It's not that I believe in myself, it's that I believe that everyone knows my true heart intent, right, but I had to be more intentional about displaying it and and honoring my team, um and so, yeah, yeah, that was the moment yeah, and I think this, this, that kind of it does, kind of is so it's funny.
Speaker 1:We were talking before and what we, what we're gonna do, is represent like each character and um, I'm supposed to represent buzz and his development, and quita supposed to represent woody and at the time we were like it's funny because I feel like that's we're actually kind of the opposite. But with those stories though, honestly, that's about right, maybe not maybe, maybe not, I think, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I think, personality wise, and just like how we show up in spaces, like I definitely think that you give more Woody vibes, like all right, everybody gather around, team, yeah, yeah, you know like, hey, you know, want to make sure everybody got your batteries, make sure you got your things together. All right, we're going on a trip, right, um, where, whereas I'm more like Buzz Lightyear, you know I'm, I'm from the future, you know, I know like I'm a little, I'm a little bit more shiny, not in like a way that's better than woody, because woody is more like traditional and solid. Buzz lightyear was not solid. He was unconcerned about these people. He was like what is this?
Speaker 1:life form. Yeah, Hold on, because did y'all hear that? No, no, no, no, no, no, no no.
Speaker 2:Did y'all hear that? Did y'all hear that? See, when I tell you about the disrespect that I endure, okay, when I tell you about how she's constantly coming for me, I want you to know that y'all are seeing it happen in real time, don't y'all agree? Though he was no, he was not, he was whatever Okay.
Speaker 2:He was not, he was not delusional. He was he believed in in his mission. Delusional he was he believed in in his mission and I don't necessarily think that his mission changed, like who he was and what he represented, did not change his function and and becoming less of an individual and more of a of a servant and a team player, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1:I love how you're standing up for Buzz. I'm not trying to put him down, I just-. No, yes, you were yes you were.
Speaker 2:No, I wasn't, no, I wasn't. How is delusional not putting somebody down.
Speaker 1:But he thought he was something. He wasn't. He was like you know all these things but he was just not in the way that he thought he was.
Speaker 2:That was part of his growth. Like he had to believe in himself again and learn how to do it a different way.
Speaker 1:That's true. Now, okay, that's true. I will say that he did have to. He had to come to believe in who he really was.
Speaker 2:I hope y'all watching YouTube so y'all can see my faces.
Speaker 1:And not believe in what. Okay, so let's go through it, right? So this framework is called the developmental leader framework and it's four levels of a uh of development of a leader, all right, and so we're going to go through each one of these levels and you, you know, you have buzz, who really we see his leadership like journey of, like we. He didn't start off as a leader. He wasn't a leader, right, he was just somebody who came showed up to the team.
Speaker 2:He was a talented individual.
Speaker 1:With all this? Yeah, he was. He was talented, popular, interesting, different, and he showed up and so then he became a leader at at by the end of um, he was in that vein he was. He wasn't a leader proper, but he was on his way, right, yeah?
Speaker 2:So question for you, because you know people. I think people define what a leader is in different ways. Yeah, how do you identify who the leader is, or who a leader is like what? What to you make someone stand out as a leader?
Speaker 1:It's a good question. I, I think a leader is in a very in the, in the simplest, simplest of terms, requires followers. In other words, they it requires people, it requires influence with people on some level.
Speaker 1:If you don't, if there's, if that's not there, then you can't say you're a leader. You, you might be a very gifted, talented individual, but you're not leading anyone, right? A leader, it requires people to be influenced by you. That's a very basic term and that's why I think it's important that we understand that leadership is not a position, it's a, it's a role that could exist in different ways. They're family leadership, community leadership, faith leaders. You know, friendship, friend leaders, in a sense like different, I am the leader of this friendship. Okay, all right, I really walked right into that and we're going to move on.
Speaker 1:Um, you know organizational leadership. Um, you know, you have all these different types of all these different, uh, places in which leadership exists, and but it's not positional, it's not a title, right, it's not. It has nothing to do with that. There are leaders that have titles with no influence and to me, that's that's just a position, it's just a title that you're not really leading, um, and you have people that don't have titles, that have tons of influence. When they call people come, they're leaders're leaders. So that's how I would define it. How about you?
Speaker 2:I think leaders, more so than followers I'm tracking with you, though I think leaders are people who can influence. You know, I don't think that you necessarily have to have like people that you supervise or manage, but you have to have people that trust in your influence, and so you have to. But you have to be having an impact somewhere, like you, and you have to be having not just an impact like oh yeah, I performed this task, but an impact in the way that things are done Like. You have to be able, you have to be able to, like in the forming, storming, norming, performing, you have to be able to form something Like. You have to be able to bring something into fruition that that allows other people to follow your example in some way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, no, I agree. And so, yeah, I'm glad you asked that question, because this development stage, it, it, it shows up at all of those different arenas, like it's not just um, kind of your traditional um company framework, like it shows up everywhere. And so when you have um, you have this. These four developments. The first one is what we call an enthusiastic beginner. Okay, this one is characterized as somebody who has high commitment and low competence. They are very committed to the cause. Like they're like I am here, I am ready.
Speaker 1:I heard somebody explain it from the perspective of somebody who's on a baseball team and they've never played baseball before and so they're super excited to be on the team. Like I cannot wait. This is my first game. I'm here, put me in, coach. They've never swung a bet. They don't know how to. They don't really know a lot of the rules. They don't know how to you know, they don't know what position they're playing out. And then they play and they swing and they hit right Beginner's luck, this idea of like beginner's luck and they hit the ball. They're like I am awesome, am that's?
Speaker 2:like, uh, that's like buzz, when he said he could try to fly. Yeah, yeah, I can I can fly.
Speaker 1:And here he go, flying, using all the toys and jumping off a ball, but he was like yo, like he was even, I think he was even a little surprised, but he didn't act like it, like this is me, and everybody was like very uh, um, impressed right I'm sorry, I just gotta fast forward to the I.
Speaker 2:The movie was so petty because in the commercial where he kind of realizes there's a toy, it literally said at the bottom this is not a flying toy cannot fly like I was like that's so petty.
Speaker 1:I love it. That's hilarious yeah, to me hilarious, uh, but yeah, so what he was I mean not what he buzz was like that. He was this enthusiastic beginner high commitment, low competence, and he walks in the room and kind of like all eyes on him, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So what was Woody doing at this moment?
Speaker 2:But it's so interesting because Woody's response to that when you see somebody, that's like having someone who's gifted with no experience, that's right, you know. So you see this person walk in that has all this potential, Right, and and they have kind of that magnetic thing that makes people draw to them, Right, and instead of Woody, you know, and I understand Woody, Woody's going through kind of like you know, he just crawled from up under the bed. You know, like you know as a leader, that that can knock you out sometimes.
Speaker 1:Right, that's right.
Speaker 2:Cause you, you like, I wait a minute, I, I can't compete with that. Yeah, because my position on the team has already been defined and is already kind of written as this administrative, you know, I take charge and I I'm responsible for us. You know like when, when woody found out about, you know, the birthday party, he's all right, gather the gather the people. I got a staff meeting. I'm gonna let them know and then I'm gonna reassure them and then I'm gonna, I'm gonna protect and ensure our safety. You like, his role is already written out. Here comes this cool new toy with lasers and wings, and you know talking about a galaxy. You know like what was he? A space trooper, or?
Speaker 2:something Space Ranger, space Ranger you know like, and he's talking about stuff that Woody doesn't even, has never heard of or experienced Right.
Speaker 2:And instead of him saying, okay, how can I, how can this be an addition to the team, woody makes the decision that this man does not fit on my team Because not because he couldn't add a great deal of value, but because he's threatening me. I feel threatened, and so Woody moves out of the space of being team focused to being self-focused. Right, because he never never in the movie does he say what good does he do for the team? Woody made the decision. This man is threatening my spot, and everything he talked about from the time Buzz came to the time that Woody shifted was about how he was being impacted.
Speaker 2:He lost sight of the team and I think, as leaders, you have to be really careful because we're quick to notice it happening in other people. But unless you have again you know, I emphasize this consistently through almost every episode Unless you have people who are mentoring and coaching you, who can point out to you hey, yo bruh you a little off. Your mindset ain't right. You know what I'm saying. You're not seeing this right. Nobody in that room could challenge him.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you get what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:That's why the movie happened, that's why the movie's so long, because Woody had to go on a personal journey. I mean this could have quickly been one little, one little coaching session. You're right, could?
Speaker 1:have got Woody together. That's you ain't lying, but, but to your point, though, there was nobody on the team who, who would, who was developed enough to even do that. Like you know, you look at that, and I think that is such a. It's a gift as a leader to have somebody on your team who can do that for you and who you trust enough to do that, and I like there there is somebody that.
Speaker 2:I. It doesn't have to be someone superior.
Speaker 1:Exactly. It doesn't even have to be somebody who's on your same level, you don't even have to be a peer. It could be somebody who you, who technically, and the you know, supervise, but it's somebody you trust and it's somebody that that is competent in what they do, to the point to where you can, you can manage up right, you have people that can manage up. And if you are, if you're that, if you're that kind of when you invite that kind of accountability as a leader, not from everyone, because everyone's not equipped to hold you accountable and not all the time, right, yeah, but when it's time and from the right people, it is a gift.
Speaker 1:You need that because we have blind spots and you have to have people to point those things out. So you have to make room for that and I feel like Bo the little, yeah, yeah, she almost could have been that almost almost almost she was about to get to the point of helping him to reflect yeah, but you know she just she.
Speaker 2:You know she was because she's she's on the team, but she wasn't fully like you know, her and woody had this something on the side yeah, like we teammates, but you know, we trying to build something, yeah correct. We're trying to you know, I'm saying yeah what she said.
Speaker 1:I'm just a couple of blocks away. I don't know what that gets me every time actually that's.
Speaker 2:She went behind the block the blocks.
Speaker 1:That was hilarious to me hilarious um, uh, so okay, so we have what's where buzz was and that's how Woody responded to Buzz's beginner enthusiasm, right, and then, uh, queen alluded to it before, uh, before Buzz has this, when they're in Sid's room and he, he catches on the TV the commercial for his toy and he's seeing for the first time who he really is.
Speaker 1:And it, just it. It crushes him, um, and so this brings us to the next uh, uh developmental phase is a disillusioned learner. So in the, in the, in the, in the baseball analogy, you know your first up to bat, you swing it, you hit a home run, everybody's cheering, you're really excited. Then you go up to bat again and you and you strike out. And then you go up to bat again and you strike out. And then you go up to bat again and you strike out. And you go up to bat again and you strike out. And what that does is it decreases your commitment, right? So this development is characterized by low commitment and low competence. You have the false sense of security because you got a win, but you actually don't know how you got the wins. You can't repeat the win because you don't know what you did.
Speaker 1:So now you go back up to bat and you're like I'm doing it again and you don't, and your crisis gets shot. So you know, or your, I'm sorry, your, yeah, your, uh, your, your confidence gets, gets, gets shot. And so, yeah, he did the flying thing, impressed everybody. And then he saw that and he tried to fly again and he couldn't fly. And it's like that's, and now you realize, oh shoot, I'm not as good as I thought, I'm not as competent as I thought and I have to battle this new reality of like this is, I'm seeing me. And so Buzz had to do that. And as a leader, as somebody who's developing because it's a journey, you have to hit that moment where you realize I need more training, I need more help.
Speaker 2:Yo yo, I think the best point when me and Ruth Abigail because we kind of hit these, these leadership spots at the same time it was the moment when we were on the phone one night it was like, hey, listen, I'm going through. Like you know, I'm my whole real, my whole understanding of myself as a leader is shot. I'm not the leader. I thought.
Speaker 2:I was I thought I was going to roll in here and really I thought I was going to just win everyone over with my amazing personality and my great ideas and it was going to be game on from there. But when that didn't happen, I was like I need some more. I started reading books.
Speaker 1:I was like or when it doesn't happen again.
Speaker 2:When it doesn't happen again. Because my first leadership experience I was leading students, so they're like 18 to 22. Right, and I was. I was more a mentor, you know, and I was guiding and you know you have fun and you're doing the things. Yeah, when I started leading and mentoring uh early, uh early career professionals, you know 25 to like 30 year olds, and they started bucking back or they had challenges. Uh, I started noticing like my respect dwindling or I started noticing that I wasn't getting the results that I wanted. Like immediately those were shots, but to my confidence and to my understanding of of who I was and how I showed up in a space, you know, I remember when I first started working at the institution that I worked for, um know, you know. But when I first started working there, I felt so out of pocket. I used to just sit there and I was like I don't feel important.
Speaker 1:Like, I don't feel like I can impact these people because I was on a.
Speaker 2:Not only was I on a very well old team, I was one sitting under a great leader, which I had sat under great leaders before, but not leaders who understood leadership. I had sat under leaders who understood their roles and responsibilities. I had not sat under a leader who was so well versed in developing and strengthening other leaders. And it immediately it put me back in the place of being a student again and I accepted that. But it was also like a really thought I knew what I was doing, yep, and now I gotta, I gotta deal with the fact that I don't. I don't know who I am in this space. I don't know how to be myself here, um, but I think it's interesting because, you know, buzz is having this realization that I am a toy. I don't think he would have responded the same way to that television commercial if he did not have woody's uh voice in his ear the whole time reminding him that he was just a toy yeah, you know, woody.
Speaker 2:Woody, that was woody's shot at buzz. You're nobody special. Yeah, you're. No, you're no different than us, right? Right, that's just a light on your arm, it's not a laser, right? Your? Your wings are made of plastic, not steel, right, like? And woody had, woody had picked at him and and through that, buzz had been able to maintain his belief in himself.
Speaker 2:But it was when it was when it was confirmed when what someone says about you is confirmed by an external source, yeah, and who you think you are is no longer able to stand in the room, yeah, right. I think that that is such a that is a critical point that I think we all go through, and I think we all have to deal with the voices of what has who. Has somebody said that I'm not? What if somebody told me that I'm not good enough to do that? I'm not, that I don't have the capacity for that, I'm not going to ever be good at what is? What is the thing? That is is that I'm that I'm running away from, and eventually I felt I feel like it caught up with me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah Right. And I think those are kind of the existential moments where we have to sit down and really consider how we're going to move forward from those moments. And I think Buzz, when he, you know, got, when he got caught and you know, by the, by Sid's sister, and she was like you're now going to be, what was the name? Mrs?
Speaker 1:Mrs, mrs Mrs.
Speaker 2:Nesbitt and I'm putting a hat on you and you're going to sit here and sip tea. He was like who am I anyway? And then that's when you start accepting whatever somebody tells you you're supposed to be. And I think this is such a critical stage that we go through as leaders where we we put down what we thought were our gifts and talents, because we got to a point where we felt like it wasn't good enough or that, or that we weren't really gifted, and we put that down and we just take on whatever identity somebody gives us.
Speaker 2:Yes that's right gives us yes, that's right, and that's. And the fight. The real fight is how do I get back to being to, to, to going in the course that I was designed to be in versus the one that I was placed in?
Speaker 1:So this is um I, my personal struggle with this it. You know there was a point in um struggle with this it. You know there was a point in um my role, where, you know, I was a part of a, of a leadership team, and so I did have a role, but I wasn't the only. We were kind of all had our, our leadership areas, and so I had a little bit more space, um, in my, my, my, my like, more energy, Um, and it was coming out of COVID, so we weren't in full force, and so there was another organization. So I but I I knew that there was a lot of tension in the way that I was, I didn't, I didn't, in hindsight it was just not the best situation, right, and I wasn't doing the best job as a leader. But this other organization needed something and they really kind of leaned into what they felt like I was able to give, and so I spent some time kind of in a helping role for them. It was in the same space and so it wasn't really a big deal. And so it wasn't really a big deal.
Speaker 1:And I realized and and my, my, uh, one, uh, my, the person on my leadership, jill, had to snap me out of some stuff. But I was, uh, I found myself being pulled like buzz to be identified in a way that I felt useful. I felt like I could, I could win, or I felt like I could. I at least wasn't losing. And if I wasn't, if I, if I didn't have somebody to snap me out of it, then I could have lost my path right Into my development, into the leader I would eventually become and continue to become right I'm becoming every day. But like I think it is so important to your point like don't, if you find yourself in a space where you're a little you realize you have a lot to learn and you're a little disillusioned by it because you realize you're not as ready to do this as you thought, don't let yourself be re-identified by another source who seems to need what you have, because you're still not ready.
Speaker 2:That is so good. Don't allow yourself to be re-identified. And the ways that we get re-identified is because people who have vision, who have uh, we have something that they are in, that they're building, they will easily see what, who you are and what you have, and plug and play, they will plug you into their vision and you will get stuck in a cycle of being kind, of being kind of the assistant, you know or, yes, assistant, or being pulled into a position that you're still not ready for.
Speaker 1:So like if, if. If you are, I think people see things and can easily pull on what's there, but it's still not developed, like you can't run away from this stage of development. You know what I mean?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, no, I know what you mean, I think. I think the point that I think is important, though, is that because I I'm sorry, I'm thinking, I'm thinking about specific instances in my head, right, but I also think sometimes those spaces can be used for your development. Sometimes somebody pulling you and saying, and you're at that low point and you feel like you don't know who you are or what you're supposed to be doing and somebody pulling you and saying, hey, come work for me. Sometimes those are God appointed spaces for you, those are safe spaces for you to become. But I think you also have to.
Speaker 2:You also have to be mindful of what happens when you outgrow something, and I think sometimes we stay too long. Sometimes we stay because we can't imagine ourselves being at full capacity. We can't imagine you know, like you have helped, for so long you have helped other people do their things that you can't imagine yourself doing your own thing. You know, for so long you have been the person that you know has, uh, has helped in, uh, build another person's vision, you forgot that you were the galaxy man. You were the space man. You're not the room man. You forgot who you were and you didn't realize. I think Buzz had to. In order to come out of that, you got to say maybe this light wasn't supposed to be a laser, but maybe it was a light to point the way forward. You know, maybe my wings are made of plastic, but maybe there's a way that I can use them to propel growth in an organization. You have to get to the point where you can imagine how you fit in the room, versus being told how you're supposed to fit in there. And I think for leaders who were once that enthusiastic beginner and you kind of came in green, right, and then somebody took you under their wings, or you got involved in an organization, right, and then you started questioning yourself and you started, and then you have got to get to the point where you can self-identify and say you know what.
Speaker 2:I've been through enough processing and I'm talking to middle adults right now, because I think a lot of us are in that space where we're like I don't know what's next, because I don't know how I fit into a bigger thing and I don't know how I contribute.
Speaker 2:You have got to get to the point where you can step back and you can write down the list of who you are, what it is that you have, and how you have seen those things be effective and impactful, and then start thinking about what can I build? Because we're at a building space right now. We are the ones that are going to build the corporations that these new generations will be able to find their place in. We're not the enthusiastic beginner anymore. We are at the place where we should be making space for the beginners to have room to play in and to learn themselves in, and so I think that's a process. But I do think a lot of us got pulled somewhere in our life because somebody saw something in you and said I know what to do with that, and then you went down that path and now you have to find yourself in a space where you can create.
Speaker 1:Because that disillusioned learner. The key to that is growing your competency right and to your point. That can happen. That might need to happen in a different space and under coaching and leadership that can help you, or it can happen through trial and error. You just have to learn right, and so once you do that, though, you go to this space of you, are gaining more competence, and the next stage is capable, but cautious, right performer. So this is that high competency, low commitment space where you actually are getting better, but you don't believe it yet. You're getting better, but you don't believe it yet because you're still kind of, you're still tainted by your failures and so but you really are ready, but you're, you're holding your own self back speak to someone on today, ruth Abigail, somebody needs it you're ready, but you're holding you back because of what happened.
Speaker 1:Maybe somebody is me. You tried to fly, you fell and now you're ready to fly, but you won't.
Speaker 2:My Lord.
Speaker 1:I'm going to just let that sink, my Lord. I mean, how many of us stay there Like we stay there for a while and you're sitting over here and you have everything you need, you got everything you need, but you won't jump no more. No, I ain't finna do that. I ain't finna jump, I ain't finna jump. And so you know, Buzz gets to that point where it's like he's like he actually is ready, but he still needs Woody to like, hey, we can do this and this, like you can do it. We have to do it because we got to get back home Like you are more than what you think you are and I need you to believe that so we can both move.
Speaker 2:Ooh wee have you ever felt like that Jaquita Girl.
Speaker 2:You know, as we're talking about this, I'm like, Lord, this is my life, this is. You know what I'm saying. This is my life, this is, I feel like, honestly, I feel like this is where I currently am. You know like I'm in some regards. You know like, uh, I'm in in some regards. You know like, cause I've. You know, I'm at a space where I have a new job that I've been in for about nine months, um, and I've had to learn a lot, um, but I'm also focusing on so many different areas of my life and I feel like, you know, like I'm like on a track and some, and I'm, I'm, I'm in the, I'm in the ready position, right, like my feet are in the blocks and I am, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm got my hands on the line and I'm getting ready to explode out of these blocks and I'm getting ready to run for it. And all of my training and all of my experiences and everything that I've done before is has prepared me for this moment. But it's like my mind is thinking what if you fall? Yeah, or what if somebody trusts you with something and you're not able to carry it, you're not able to follow through or you're not able to live up to the expectations that the people around you have placed on you because of how gifted and how driven and how amazing they thought you were, based off of your performance and based off of your gift. What if it falls through? You know, and I am being challenged by the Lord to do it anyway Yep, you know what I'm saying To do it anyway, to write the books anyway, to take the speaking engagement anyway, to build whatever he's calling me to build anyway. But it is because, as middle adults, we're so experienced, you know, and we've seen the ups and downs of things. Not only have we seen our own ups and downs, we've seen the ups and downs of other leaders around us. We have hundreds of examples of it working and hundreds of examples of it not. That's right. And you, I don't think it's about trusting your own capabilities, right, because I think, ultimately, buzz had to learn. It's about being empowered by who's around me and by what is also investing in me.
Speaker 2:Buzz had to learn how to become a part of something. Right, because for so long he had been a solo flyer. You know, he had his little spaceship, right, you know, and he had his mission. You know, I'm a space ranger. I work alone, you know, but that's not vision. You know like he had to become. He had to learn how to be one of those joints that supplies and how to fit into something that was greater than him. But he had to go through that point where he was like, okay, maybe it's not what I thought it was, but I'm still capable of being great Like I'm. I'm. I'm still that guy and I think in all the other movies we see him. Uh, you know being allowed to be that guy. Um, because you know in, in, you know I I don't know what you've seen or not seen the. You know you said you saw two, but you know I saw two.
Speaker 1:I did. It was a while back, know, I saw two. I did. It was a while back, but I saw.
Speaker 2:Chad, but you know, like we see him in the other movies, able to flourish as that guy. But there is that moment where you have to.
Speaker 1:You have to do it scared yeah, you have to, and Woody, I think, was very influential in helping him do that a little bit because of necessity. Yeah, no, that's exactly what I was gonna you know, I'm saying like he needed they. He needed him. Like I have to get out of here and I can't do this without you, you know. And so he pushed him, pulled up like hey van had pulled up like hey, bro, hey, and now it's Woody.
Speaker 2:Like the same voice. Ooh, child. The same voice that told you that you couldn't is now the voice telling you that you can't. Correct Child.
Speaker 1:That's good and that happens, and so I think that something that we?
Speaker 2:I think that is a great unlearning point. Like you, you know, and, but also the voice has to learn.
Speaker 1:The voice had to grow.
Speaker 2:The voice had to shift, because it's not, I'm just trying didn't shift as an influencer until he realized that he needed Buzz that's right, and not that Buzz needed him yeah, are that are that. And Woody had also realized I need the team and not just the team needs me, team needs me, right. It wasn't until he got to that space that his voice and his influence became constructive. And I think, a lot of times as leaders, if you are one of those, keep it real, tell it like it is 100, straight to the point. You know, if you're one of those people, you have to be mindful that you don't get in a space where you're telling people. Telling people I was going to say the truth, but sometimes it's just your opinions and your insights is not always the full truth, right, you have got to get out of a space of telling people. Telling people, telling people things for the sake of telling them. And in your mind you're making it. You're trying to make it seem like, but I make you better. You know I'm adding value to your life, one, you adding value to someone's life and they're not being.
Speaker 2:Any mutuality is not going to last long. Nobody is going to be able to stay in a situation where they're not able to return anything to you. You get what I'm saying. You're not going to be able to maintain that. Two. You are not telling people the truth for the sake of them having the truth. You are telling people.
Speaker 2:You can't just be a truth teller. You have to be a builder of momentum for them. You're not going to be able to increase their confidence. That's internal work. You're not going to be able to increase their belief. That's internal work. But you have to be somebody that fosters an environment that people can grow in. Yeah, and that should be your shift, not just I told you the truth and you ain't do nothing with it. Did you foster an environment where the truth could produce something positive in my life? Yeah, or did you just unload a bunch of your wisdom and knowledge and insight, like? You have to be mindful, and I think that I have been that person too. I have been the person that's like hey, I got to tell him I was that person with you?
Speaker 2:You were. I think that those were some of our hardest moments in our friendships was when I was just like I need to tell her because somebody got to tell her and I'm going to tell her because I can't hold it and I did it in a way that wasn't loving Ruth got. Ruth got the harshest version of me.
Speaker 1:I would say, and, I, and, and, and. Well, we'll see, I don't know, uh, but no, I, I am better for it. But I also didn't listen to you like yeah, that's also true, that's also very true.
Speaker 2:So it just kind of like yeah, that's why we had a couple of weeks off from our friendship.
Speaker 1:I mean, we did, we didn't take some weeks off from each other. We did um, but yeah, no, I think that. I think I think what you're saying is absolutely true. Like you, when you, when you're sharing truth with somebody, it has to be to build them up, not just to tell them something like, like you said, because you trying to get it off your chest, it's not about you and and so you feel burdened by what you know about them.
Speaker 2:Like, get out of my face. That has nothing to do. It has nothing to do with you. I really need to erase that from my vocabulary. I say it way too much. What the get out my face? That's like my thing right now and I really I get it.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, I get it. Okay. So the last, the last developmental stage is the self-reliant achiever. Stage is the self-reliant achiever. So this is where you have high competency and high, high, uh, commitment, okay. And so when you have those things, you know who you are, you know what you can do and you may be able to move independently, and so I think that we get there right. Buzz. Buzz doesn't necessarily have a chance to get there in this movie, but in the um, in the second movie, he kind of emerges as a clear part of the team, has having a clear um role and and and and kind of stepping into his own as as a leader and as somebody who is able to influence the toys. But but he had to go through that journey Like, so you, I think this is we a lot of times we want to jump from beginning to end, from the enthusiastic I am pumped and I'm going to go, from I'm pumped and ready to I'm I'm killing it and it's like that is just not the journey, that's not real, it's not real.
Speaker 1:It's just not real. You're going to have to go through those those that, that valley and that slow climb back up. And here's the thing this chart doesn't describe a person. It really describes a person's relationship with a task. So this is not saying you, as a person, go through this one time and become self-reliant leader. This all depends on the level of comfort you have with the particular task you're doing.
Speaker 1:So you could start all over with a new task. You can start all over in a new environment, in a new role, with a new situation, and all of a sudden you were self-reliant achiever over here, but you're an enthusiastic beginner over here and you have to understand how to navigate those journeys within the different realms that you're, that you're leading in, and allow yourself to develop over and over and over again. Right, continue to go through that journey. And so I think that is something that we it's really critical to unlearn that you don't go from this you know very enthusiastic person who's really excited to lead and excited to do their thing you don't go from that to the proficient um expert. You have to get, you have to. It is a rollercoaster there and then, when you get there, it's a rollercoaster to the next thing and a rollercoaster to the next thing and a rollercoaster to the next thing. This is a um. This is a consistent development process.
Speaker 1:This is not a one time thing, uh, and so that that that is. That is something I know. I've had to unlearn a lot because there are different elements of my leadership that I'm getting acquainted with. There are some elements I'm I'm very I feel like I'm a self-reliant achiever in, and then there are some that I'm like I am probably in between disillusioned learner and cautious performer, like I'm. You know, I'm a little.
Speaker 1:And there are some where I'm enthusiastic beginner, like this is gonna be great, I can't wait, right, and I just have to be prepared to be like it ain't gonna go to what you think it's gonna go. You might get a win here. You know I'm. There's a project we're doing right now that I feel that when we got a big win and now it's kind of doing that right, not in a bad way, but it's just we're, we're it's declining because we have to learn some stuff. There are things I don't know and I got to slow down and learn it. So just, I think that's. And so we see that with Buzz, at the end he goes through this journey and gets himself prepared to be that self-reliant leader.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think there is. When I do, I have a wonderful dreams and goals workshop. Okay, if anybody wants me to come out and do it with your team, okay, I've done it a lot, so I'm very willing and available to do that. But in that I talk about kind of the journey from potential to greatness and I kind of have this chart that shows how you kind of make steps through potential and how and how you kind of have to cross over this line of comfort to get to greatness. But what I also emphasize is that what you will find when you get to greatness is that you're right back at potential, right Like because a lot of times we have this, we have these, these end goals of, of of greatness right Like, you know, like especially college students. They're like I'm going to be a lawyer. Then you get to be a lawyer and you're right back at potential, absolutely Right Like you.
Speaker 2:You made it to the point that you had in your mind was your destination, but destiny is going to require that you continue to. You continue to build on who you are and your capacities and your skills sets, and it's a constant state of becoming right. It's a constant state of who am I, how do I fit in this space, how can I be better? What do I need to do next? It's constant, and I will say also for our middle adults.
Speaker 2:Some of us and I'm just speaking from my own personal experience, I want to share this with you Some of us and I'm just speaking from my own personal experience, I want to share this with you, some of us are at points where your career is no longer the focal point of your life and you need to start focusing on other areas that you have neglected.
Speaker 2:And I think that it is going to be necessary for us, especially as we get closer to these forties and some of us already over that forties hump. All right, fellow middle adults right, if you have, you know, because we were taught to go after, to make all of our life pursuits surround like this idea of career and money and aspiration, and and now hit the gym and now financial responsibility, you know. And now family, and now friendships, and now identity. You know, and so do, what you have to do in the season to take care of yourself. Most, some of us, most of us, a lot of us have done the work to become the things in our workplaces. Take care of you, that's good.
Speaker 1:I think that's so good and, like we kind of said, let yourself go through these stages with you.
Speaker 2:Yes, you know what I'm saying, because the first person you lead is yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:The first person you lead is yourself.
Speaker 1:Get a hobby right, get a hobby, do something yourself. Yeah, the first person you lead is yourself. Get a hobby Right, get a hobby, do something. Do something fun yeah, for no reason. Do something that has that. Where you're not goal-oriented, there's no goal, there's no goal. Scrap the goal, you're just experiencing it.
Speaker 2:Go be a beginner in something again Go be a beginner.
Speaker 1:That that has honestly been one of the joys of my middle adulthood is being a beginner in something Like this podcast. I ain't never done this before. I was a beginner. It was really fun. You have to, you know, and I look back at my first one. It was like, ooh, that was rough, but you learn. And it's like I decided not to go look back at our. I think ours was okay. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2:The ones I was.
Speaker 1:It was rough. I mean, my whole situation was just whole, so very different, right. But you learn and you grow and you come to enjoy it. But it's fun to be a beginner, right. Go find a class that you have no experience in at all.
Speaker 2:And just enjoy right.
Speaker 1:So I think like, allow yourself to go through this process with yourself um, and and and, and live in this development like, and, and you'll find yourself um becoming right again take a break, take, take a break, a break, take a break, let's go away, let's go upstate shout out to hamilton all right, so um, uh, yeah.
Speaker 1:So yeah, take a break, man. Like like, take a break. I love what you said, like, yes, amen, um, all right, um, all right, y'all, thank you. This was I feel like. I feel like this. This feels like um very uh, I don't know. I like I love this. I love this episode, like I'm. I enjoyed this. I enjoyed this. This was good I feel healed.
Speaker 2:Um, like I feel like you know, like, like, uh, like I got some stuff that like I was like man, yeah, like I've been thinking through all of that, but I haven't been able to to formulate my thoughts around it.
Speaker 1:So yeah, yeah, this was good stuff, these stuff, um, all right y'all. So there you go, toy story, and we have, um, I think we have, uh, a couple more here in the series. So just be on the lookout and we're really excited, like us. Like we said, like share, subscribe. This was helpful to you. Send it to somebody who's an emerging leader.
Speaker 1:Send it to somebody who is a developing leader Send it to another middle adult, send it to another middle adult, send it to somebody who you think could have this could be valuable for them, and bring them to the family. All right, so until then, folks, we're going to keep unlearning together so that we can experience more freedom, peace. Thank you once again for listening to the Unlearned Podcast. We would love to hear your comments and your feedback about the episode. Feel free to follow us on Facebook and Instagram and to let us know what you think. We're looking forward to the next time when we are able to unlearn together to move forward towards freedom. See you then.
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