Look Me In The Eye

People don’t always mean harm, but harm still happens. One of the most common moments is painfully ordinary: you ask a disabled person a question, yet your eyes drift to their friend like they’re the translator. We name that reflex, where it comes from, and what respect looks like when you slow down, make eye contact, and speak to the person who actually owns the answer.

From there we go somewhere many listeners will recognize: church. Why are disabled people so often missing from the room, or quietly pushed to the side once they arrive? We talk about disability inclusion and accessibility beyond ramps and seating. We get into the social barriers, the “separate room” mindset, and the kind of performative inclusion that looks good on the surface but feels demeaning up close. Jenny also shares why public “healing” moments can land as pity, pressure, or a spiritual performance, and what better prayer sounds like when you care about the whole person, not just a condition.

The conversation turns to faith when healing doesn’t happen. Jenny opens up about years of being told she would walk again, the grief and confusion that followed, and the slow shift toward purpose, humility, and a faith that isn’t built on getting everything you want. We also dig into a refreshing approach to Bible study: pick a topic like peace, study what Scripture says across passages, and let honest discussion replace personality-driven recaps. We finish by challenging church credential gatekeeping and asking what it would look like to be led by the Holy Spirit and by example again.

If this hits home, subscribe for more honest conversations, share this with a friend who cares about disability and faith, and leave a review so more people can find it.

Transcript

Swaggy Intro And A Hard Question

SPEAKER_01 0:01

I am the governor of swag. What that means is I love to teach people to be common in New York. So enjoy me on my journey. Because today I never know what I get into. But always become in New York. I hope you enjoy this episode.

Why People Ask The Wrong Person

SPEAKER_00 0:32

I have a question I want to ask you, and you promised me you would always tell me the truth, even if it hurt. Yeah. Okay. So sometimes I find myself wanting to ask you a question. And I asked Sarah a question. I'm looking at Sarah asking Sarah the question, but you're the one that's going to provide the answer. I I noticed I'm not the only one. So have you caught me doing it? Feel free telling me if you have. And why why am I doing that? What's causing that?

SPEAKER_01 1:11

Yeah, I caught you doing it a couple of times. I uh I just um, you know, uh you notice there don't Sarah don't speak up on me during those times because that happens way more than you think. A lot of people are scared at the person with a disability the question. And that goes back to what people are generally taught. So it's more of a natural instinct, and people don't realize they're doing it. Example, um, you know, have you ever seen a kid? Probably not, but this happens to me at least. You would have a kid be interested with my own manner as well chair and be like give you that look and be like, what's the issue? Give it a call and then the parent would be like, come on, let's start. You know, and that sets the mindset of uh we gotta be scared of those people with the unchant with the unshared aspect. Oh so what that does basically make the child more scared to ask a question, naturally, and I get it not every not every time you have the time to be like the reason I'm gonna wish is because blah blah blah is, you know. But I feel like we did a better job again bringing everybody together, you know, answer these questions, be more open-minded on the disabil disability side as well, then um I think those will slowly go away, but yeah, I think it's more humanly natural and it shouldn't it should not be that way, but I think it's because of the society norms that the disability communities trying to change. Though a lot of years you talk about different cultures and different languages, and you know, some of them I do like, some of them I don't. Some of them are disability worldwide, some of them are just my personal preference. But again, that goes back into what the society portrays people with disability as you know, and it's it's sad in some ways, but some ways it's just we gotta try to change the culture, you know.

SPEAKER_00 4:17

Well, feel free to call me out if I go, hey, do you want tea or Pepsi or Coke or whatever it is? And I'm not looking at you. So, Jenny, look at me. Look at me, ask me the question, and I don't know why. I so thank you for telling me I've done that before. So now on the now that I'm kind of getting more comfortable asking you more loaded questions.

Why Churches Feel Unwelcoming

SPEAKER_00 4:39

So all the churches I've attended over the years. Let me see, let me you want me to adjust it?

SPEAKER_01 4:45

Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 4:46

So all the churches I've attended over the years, I really don't see very many people with disabilities in there with me. Why is it?

SPEAKER_01 4:56

Well, I can tell you right now, some churches I don't like what I have to say, but I'm gonna say it anyway. Because again, the church isolates people with disability and puts them in the room. And no matter if they are older, younger, if you have a disability, they're gonna pretend like you're a kid and put you in an and put you in a rush. All because they think it's gonna be just distracting and blah blah and they bring me to this. And it's gonna make a lot of people mad, but I'm not who I am if I don't say this. I hate when big churches try to try to be inclusive, but they're really not. Meaning they're tape, they're tape even. I'll give you an example. Everybody knows this church, and I'll gladly call them out because I don't give a damn what they what their policy is or the past is gonna come out and target me, but I'll get okay, so like for example, I try to join elevations, what they call e-group Bible study, which is not really a Bible study, and I'm okay saying that, but um it's more like okay, what did Pastor Stephen Party talk about? And I'm like, okay, why are we focused on the pastor so much and not God himself?

Healing Culture And Better Prayer

SPEAKER_01 6:43

All right, and then you got people that want to heal you because they feel bad for your condition. Now, this is a subject in the display community and in the church by itself. Um you also have you know people that put on the show and I like they can hear you out there. I can leave their Jesus. You know what I mean? Yeah. So that gives a bad rap. And I'm I'm cautious that somebody play for me because I don't want it to be one for two reasons. I don't want them to start for me, I don't want them to feel like I live a poor, um, poor life because I don't know. And this breaking me the sort of subject is because they focus on the physical appearance, not the emotional scars you're going through. And I I would give advice to somebody that wants to pray for somebody with a disability. Don't pray for their condition, not just by itself, pray for them, the challenges that they're going through. Have the conversation of are you going through lonely loneliness? Are you going through a despair, you know, because not many people are willing to admit their loneliness, their despair because not many people want you to feel sorry for their condition. I mean, I had about 30 people when I was kid said I would walk again. And it took me a while to realize okay, you say I'm gonna walk again, that's happening. What's going on? And I had to say that journey myself and realize, oh, maybe God doesn't want me to walk again, maybe God wants me to be a romano for people with my condition.

SPEAKER_00 9:15

Hmm. Hang on a second. Yeah, I don't want to miss this one. Keep going.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

And it took me a while to realize that, but it also took me upon my faith a little bit. And you know, I don't know exactly exactly where at, but in the Bible it says, I gave you this to show my glory and my my um to show my glory and my personality. It was no fault to your parents or whoever it was. I'm not I know I'm not quoting exact exact scripture, but that was in the Bible. And I I wrestled with Jesus didn't heal them because he felt sorry for him. He healed them to show people that he can care about them. And I would say a lot of churches not meaning to frame disability as feeling sorry for somebody, and that's the wrong way to do it. And not many churches hear the disability voice. They would rather put it in a room or put it put it in a deep hole. But with elevation, I I signed the paper like I did the background check, but when it all came down to the final tissue, they act like I didn't do any of that. And I got I got proof that I did it about two or three two or three times in a row. And now I'm to the point where I'm just like, oh, forget you. I'm glad I'm still a part of the I'm still a part of elevation. And people might ask why, but I'm not a part of the elevation as like a a full-on member or anything like that. And what's ironic is I don't really join a church as a pool member because it took me a while to realize this too, is people think you should easily join one church, one congregation. Oh my god, does God really say that? And when you do your own research, you're like, no, what is what is the we are the church, we are the congregation comes from. Notice I didn't use Catholic or any of that stuff. One, we should focus on what the Bible says. We might have different opinions, but honestly, that's where people come to I have two questions on that.

SPEAKER_00 12:32

Let me get your head, let me move your headphones back. You at least have two questions. But wow, I'm just sitting you could you could tell that my is that about right?

SPEAKER_01 12:41

Yeah. All right.

Faith Without Getting Everything

SPEAKER_00 12:45

Okay, so you said a bunch of so many things in there that would have questions on but one was you said why doesn't the Lord let me walk? Which is hard for me to even say that. But you said why doesn't the Lord let you walk? And you said maybe because he wants to be a role, maybe because he wants me to be a role model. Did I hear that right? Um Okay. Um it's a little bit hard to process sometimes because you we want to go, but but he can do anything, he can heal, he can do anything, you know, anything's possible, but your thing would be well, but he wants you to play a particular role. He created you in a way that to play a particular role in bringing people closer to him. Am I hearing that right?

SPEAKER_01 13:40

Yeah, let me tell you this. If God gave us whatever we wanted, where would faith come in? If God gave us whatever we wanted, where would the faith come in by itself?

SPEAKER_00 14:01

Okay, you're gonna have to go, you're gonna have to explain that one a little bit. If he gave us everything we wanted, where would faith come in? Faith is seems to be longing for things. Explain that, okay. You're gonna have to go a little bit further into that for me to get it.

SPEAKER_01 14:16

Okay. So God gave me the ability to walk, and God gave me the ability for finances and stuff like that. It would turn into a want and need and not faith journey. What I mean by that is if God gave us everything we wanted, well, we would be eventually needing him. I don't think we would need him if we gave everything we wanted. So it comes to God knows what's best for me and you. And where faith comes in is at the end of the day we're gonna win the battle. But if God gives everything we wanted, we would end up being entitled people, not being able to be humble and recognize what we do have. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

You ought to preach sermons. You tried that have you done that yet?

SPEAKER_01 15:26

Well, yeah, but I have not had the freedom to talk about what I want to talk about.

SPEAKER_00 15:33

Oh not yet. Is that coming? Is that coming in later episodes down the road somewhere?

SPEAKER_01 15:40

Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:43

Um I love the way he says it.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

Well and people uh want to help me achieve that dream, and you know.

SPEAKER_00 15:52

Is it go along these lines? Because here's a question I had to. You want me to move it back? Yeah.

A Bible Study Built On Scripture

SPEAKER_00 15:58

Is you're in a Bible study, right? You're in a Bible study. What's the so I'm not I'm I don't know anything about your Bible study, but say that say that you could form your own Bible study and you can do any structure you wanted. And I mean you did it any way you thought you wanted the best way to do it. How would you structure a Bible study?

SPEAKER_01 16:21

Well, one I wouldn't I would take the Bible, and I would be like, okay, what did the Bible study say about this scenario and this scenario? And if you read the Bible for what it what it is, don't bring opinion and do research, then I think people will more likely grow in the in the paper. Understand why God does what he does a little bit more. Yes, we don't know all the answers, but if we dig deeper into what the Bible truly says, then I feel like our faith would grow a little more. Yes, we're gonna have trials, we're gonna have tribulations because the Bible says that, but you know, I think when you add when you add like what I call people beliefs on top of what the Bible really means is a lot of people's what it really says around so my go yeah, go ahead. Yep. My goal is to um hopefully one day be able to get people together and a support system where I could just not talk about my disability, I could talk about why I I do what I do. Every speech that I've done in church, all they wanted to hear is my my dis my disability and my faith, you know.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

So um okay, so let me let me pause. That was a little blip on the screen you saw. I was trying to some software.

SPEAKER_01 18:20

Yeah, that's why I'm paused.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

Let me let me that was a good place because you good place to pause because I'm gonna ask you this question. So you let me summarize this. So your Bible study, I love the way it sounds. You would pick a topic and say peace. Right? Say we're gonna talk about peace. So I want you to study. So rather than do a book, you would say, we're gonna talk about peace today or next week. And I want you to research all the the verses on peace, and then you would just kind of open the floor and say, Let's have a discussion on peace, right? Something like that. Yep. And then you also just said right there before my computer glitched and got you distracted, was uh rather than focus on questions, focus on questions about your disability, you would focus on what his word says about particular topics.

SPEAKER_02 19:10

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

Wow. Okay. I'm looking forward to that Bible study group one day.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

Well, hopefully I can find the right people to be in one of that and build a team one day.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Yeah.

Certificates Versus The Holy Spirit

SPEAKER_00 19:27

Build a team one day. It sounds like he's pre-selling already, pre-selling me. I mean, not even pre-selling. I mean, that's a beautiful way to do a Bible study.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

And you know, what bothers me is a lot of these churches once you get the Bible scholarship before you even do a Bible study. I'm like, they gotta do that, no. People got together because of faith alone, not because it's so difficult, but because of the 12 disciples. People think you need a certificate. I'm like, no, what God did was show people how to live, be a role model, and like go spread the word, go tell your story. There was no certificate in that. And what bothers me into this day is a lot of churches, Presbyterian, Catholics, whatever you want to, whatever you know, denomination you want to call out, is we got so caught up into okay, you need to go to this school or you need to go to this class before you can be a preacher. I look at the Rob the Robertsons as a you know as a role model, and that they they didn't, you know, Bill Robertson didn't have a certificate or didn't have a Bible Bible teaching class or whatever. He just talked about his paper. Now his sons did that to um, you know, comply, you know, so they could speak wherever they wanted to, but it goes back to this point. Why do we need a class or go to school after a couple years to talk about God? We don't need that. Why is why is that more a requirement? No, because that was not even a part of the Bible. But people make it and people not are making it as such.

SPEAKER_00 21:46

Seems to me, and I know you'll correct me, I'm off. No doubt. Seemed to me that Jesus said something very simple follow me, which implies watch me. Watch what I do. Watch me live this out. That's that's the essence of it. Right. Follow me. Let me show you. Right. He picked these guys that were fishermen and a tax collector and said, follow me. And yeah. What else to add to that?

SPEAKER_02 22:24

Follow me.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

Show you.

SPEAKER_01 22:28

He didn't say be a part of my school. Yeah, you have to go through four years of college before you can preach the gospel. He said what the Holy Spirit will guide you, the Holy Spirit will lead you. And it's funny to me how people are using the Bible history as an as an excuse to not go back, uh not talk about God, and it's a pain me in the man. I'm like, where does the Holy Spirit come in? We lost the Holy Spirit positivity. You know, you know, it's like, okay, I have to go to this class to speak at a preparation church. I have to go to this class to speak at, you know, a Catholic church. I'm like, and now people get something that you have to go non-denominational. I'm like, forget all that. Where did this come from? If you do your research, it came from human brain. Scrap all scrap all the denominations, and we need to get back to the real root cause of what God intended it to be, which is lead by the Holy Spirit and lead by example.

SPEAKER_00 24:03

You know, so that is terrif that's terrific.

Closing Message And How To Reach Us

SPEAKER_01 24:08

Thank you for listening to Bears Regular Podcast. I hope this message today inspires you a little more to be confident in who you are and don't be ashamed of who you are, and always carry that inspire about you. Thank you for listening, uh, and I hope you email me on this episode. My email is B-E-A-R-E-T-S.com, or you can follow me on my social medias, Facebook and Instagram. Just my remember it's barely two Ts and two hours. Not my email. My email has one T and that's the only the only thing that's jumping. Thank you and have a great most fabulous swaggy life day.