Exclusive interview with Bird Vet Extraordinaire, Dr. G!

When do you need to take your pet parrot to see an avian vet? On this week's episode, we interview Dr. G, "Bird Vet Extraordinaire!" She gives us insights into what it takes to ensure our beloved feathered kids live long healthy lives!
Check out the video version on the Busy Beak YouTube Channel to see the intake and exam of Miss Pepper Jalapeno: "the Spiciest Parrot in the World"
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Transcript

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Do you want your parrot to have a long, happy, healthy life? I suspect you do. Like most of us pet parents, if that's the case, then you need to have a relationship with a certified avian veterinary and find one in your area. And today, as a special treat, will be interviewing Dr. Jan Poulos. She is the head veterinarian at Feathers and Fur Animal Hospital here in San Diego County, and she specializes in avian medicine companion parrots specifically. So in this interview, we'll be discussing topics of avian medicine with Dr. G. And then also, if you're viewing this podcast on our YouTube channel, you can see shorts of her examination and intake process for Miss Pepper. How Filipino the spiciest pair in the world. Hope you enjoy. You're listening to the Busy Bee podcast, where we talk about all things bird from parrots to chickens and everything in between. I'm your host, Cristian Diaz. Follow us on social media at the Busy Bee. Hi, I'm Dr. Gianopulos from Feathers and for Animal Hospital, and I'm a bird veterinarian here in San Diego. I'm also a general practitioner for dogs and cats, and I do do some basic stuff with small exotic mammals like rabbits and guinea pigs and rats and ferrets and chinchillas. And the list goes on. I don't do reptiles or fish, but birds are actually my specialty. And I've been here in San Diego for about two years, but I started my own mobile clinic, Fresno for Animal Hospital about a year ago, and I am mobile for now, but I am looking for a brick and mortar practice eventually because what I really want to do, my end goal is to be able to hospitalized birds and to have a place where I could where birds can be boarded with medications, boarded with training, ported with diet conversion, and actually have all these crazy ideas in my head. And I'm from the Bay Area originally, and I am residency trained in avian medicine from the medical Center for Birds, which is a bird only hospital in the Bay Area. And I know it sounds really crazy to be bird only hospital, but even crazier, there are five full time that's there. And it was it is it was a pretty crazy couple of years because there were no fewer than 30 birds at any given time in the hospital. And that's just like hospitalized side. The boarding side was always between 20 and 40 parrots. It was huge. It was it's wild. Yes. I love you. I love you. But I've always been a bird person. I've had birds since I was a little girl. They're like my heart of hearts. You know? I love you so much. Some people would say that I am an Amazon on the inside, those people being me and people who know me very well. But and specifically, probably a yellow name, too, like Mr. Pepper. Jalapeno here. Yes. He's just waking up from sedation, so don't mind him. He's just like, come in, come in, come into his senses. Here. But yeah, that's me. And my goal is to take care of the birds in San Diego. I can't do it all myself. Okay, But I sure can try. So for for bird owners, one of the like, the big things for them is when to take your bird. Oh, really? Good question. Thank you for asking that. But I think when you first get a bird taking them to the vet and having kind of an intake exam, if it hasn't been done beforehand, is always a good idea, especially to establish care for this bird. So that way you have an open channel of communication, very much like you and Mr. Pepper Jalapeno here, because even though you know, after we leave today, it doesn't mean that our relationship ends or our relationship ends. You know, I'm always here if questions or concerns pop up as well. So definitely when you first get a bird and especially if you're due to birds, it's it's good to get a good foundational understanding of where your bird is medically speaking, but also in terms of their lifestyle for companion parrots, the absolute most important thing for their health and wellness long term is their husbandry, meaning how you take care of them, how you feed them, their environment, their enrichment, both socially and physically, and also with like foraging opportunities and things like that. It is very important to their long term health. And in fact, I would say the security of the diseases, problems, trauma, things that, you know, I see from birds in a clinic setting are mostly preventable with a proper diet and husbandry and all that stuff. So it's very, very important to get all those foundations in order first, definitely annual exams. So when you first get a bird annual exams and then of course, any time a bird is they ain't doing right or act an offer in some way annual exams. You know, I, I preach that not only for dogs and cats, but especially for birds and exotics, because parrot are prey species, unless you're a killer. But they are, for the most part, prey species. And so by their very nature in evolutionary biology, they are designed to hide their illnesses. And so you have to be very, very, very take initiative and be almost like aggressively on top of their health and wellness to catch things before they snowball out of control and become a big problem and kind of blow up in our face later, so to speak. So and when you first get them annual exams and then any time a bird is just off, the kind of classic signs of illness are very often very nonspecific. IFIC on And sometimes the signs that they will give you will be subtle. So maybe, you know, over five or six months, maybe they'll lose 15 or 20% of their body weight. And unless you are like weighing them every so often, you know, every week, every two weeks of once a month, any anything is better than nothing. You know, you may not be able to kind of catch something like that. Sometimes just being kind of fluffed or quieter than normal is a sign of illness. And, you know, any abnormal changes in their droppings on poop health is is health for people and for birds and for all animals, honestly. So monitoring their poops and their droppings, which includes feces, urine and your aids monitoring, the amount, the quality, the, you know, the texture or the colors, things like that kind of the character of it is also very important. If there's anything off with that, definitely would indicate taking your bird to have that as well. Definitely emergency, red flag, emergency. If they're on the bottom of their cage, they're not responsive to like, Yo, Mr. Pepper Hall Pena. And he's just like, can't barely even open his eyes or she's like, sink, you know, if they're just like, sunken in and fluffed in on the back of the cage, that's an emergency you need to go to birds lost as AP, I say, or maybe not too obviously, but in general I think every bird really needs an annual exam possibly. Could you talk about blood tests that we need to do with our birds? Yeah, I'd be. Yeah. Really, really Good question. So for younger birds and that, like how young is young depends on what species like sponges don't necessarily live 30 years. But you know, someone like Mr. Pepper Jalapeno. If with any luck and good health here, you know you're probably going to have them for another 67 years. You know? I hope so. And especially because of all the good things that you are changing and his lifestyle and diet. But in general, when they're younger, I think doing blood work every couple of years, like maybe every 2 to 3 years, both a complete blood count called a CBC, and that looks at red blood cells, white blood cells, platelets, but also a chemistry panel which looks at liver values, kidney values, electrolytes, proteins, cholesterol, that kind of thing. Both of those pieces of information are very, very insightful. So and even in good health, some people might say, well, if his physical exam was normal and this bird is acting normal and this is just like an annual wellness and my parrot is only five years old, why should I do bloodwork? Good question. I certainly don't have to You don't have to do anything. But it's very important, I think, to establish a baseline, especially for an individual. From my perspective as a veterinarian, you know, do I have reference books to like look up a yellow nape Amazon and see what you know, what should their, you know, bile acids be or their white blood cell count. Sure I have those numbers to compare to, but there is always individual variation and changes within one particular individual over time is more significant than, you know, one time piece of he never got blood work in his life and then all of a sudden he's 30 and he's sick and I do blood work and I look at these numbers and I'm like, I wonder, you know, how I interpret them is informed and influenced by baseline blood work when he's healthy, actually, you know, is that white blood cell count, especially if it's in the gray area? You know, could it mean actual like infection, inflammation, or is it just a stress response? I don't really know. Let's see where he was at when he was healthy. So that's really, really important. Also, doing bloodwork regularly every 2 to 3 years when they're younger, it really establishes like a pattern. So it's it's very, very, very insightful and helpful. But also so you can catch problems before they become like too big of a problem, but then when they're older. So I would say, and that really varies a lot too, because it depends. I mean, some Amazons, even by the time they're 30, they will have all these like old bird diseases. They will be physically and medically like geriatric, like because they've had, you know, poor diet, no exercise and that kind of thing. And and their bodies will succumb to geriatric diseases a lot sooner. So sometimes even like a yellow nape, I would consider geriatric by the time they're 30, depending on what the past 30 years have looked like for that bird. So it really just depends. But when they do get to be a little bit geriatric or if you want to pay a little bit closer attention to them than doing bloodwork every single year is is recommended. That's what I do for for all night birth. All my birds are over 30 and half. More than half of them are disabled. So so they all get bloodwork every year. Actually, a lot of they do more than once a year. But yeah, that I think those things are very, very important. Of course there's also in certain infectious disease testing as well. Oops sorry Garrity means the boy which is important I think on intake, if certain boarding facilities require it or in cases where the you know, certain infectious diseases are suspected of the bus. So what are some of the the most common things that you see birds being brought in for in terms of emergencies? Really good question. If they are older and have a history of poor diet, egg laying or if they're one of the like top three species to get atherosclerosis and heart disease, sorry to tell you, Amazons are one of those in that category. Amazon's cocktails and gray parrots. And the most common problem I see, which very often presents as an emergency, is heart disease and stroke events secondary to heart disease. And sometimes strokes can precipitate seizures. So sometimes, like you'll see a seizure and they're like, oh, you know, is it lead poisoning or having metal poisoning? I mean, it depends, of course, but very often not so much getting into things they're not supposed to do. So chewing on zippers, chewing on picture frames, chewing on Hello, Lord. It literally could be anything but the analysis. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I once had a lovebird that was just nonstop seizing because she ate pieces of mini blinds that happened to be made like in the sixties. And they had led and it turned out on. So, yes, trauma, foreign body ingestion, but opiate trauma, trauma for sure. So if people are just not being careful about their environment, like they're boiling a pot of hot water and they have a fully flighted, you know, cognac or something in the water like glands in the pot of water. Woops. Okay. Or like a candle. Not only so many problems there, but like flying into it, getting wax and burns, gall and all this stuff. Multispecies households where even just different species of birds that them going along, you're not properly supervising them in war, separating them, or like managing their environment in a way that works for them. They can get in trouble with each other. Definitely seeing that a lot or like dog and cat attacks on birds, for example. And even I once had an Amazon present for being attacked by a raccoon and I was like, okay, first of all, what are you doing? Keeping your bird outside? Guess what? The bird was on outside the bird, live the bird and have a cage she lived on just like a freestanding perch in the living room. And there was like a doggie door that the owner was suppose to lock every single night and and then forgot to. One night raccoon came in and attacked the bird. Okay. Anyway, things like this self trauma, attacks from other species either in the household or if they are housed outside, not properly reinforcing their aviary or whatever their environment is outside, that kind of thing. And foreign body ingestion is also extremely, extremely, extremely common. Those are the things that turn into that look like emergencies. Non-emergency, very common problems are obesity problem with me from a poor diet and and things like that. But those are more easily correctable over time and have a good prognosis. Awesome. Yeah. Could you talk a bit more about the importance on forging and enrichment? Oh my gosh, we need to do that for birds. Yeah, really good question. I'm really glad you brought that up. Actually. So I am a firm believer that birds are less likely to do dumb stuff like eat pieces of wood or zippers or rhinestones off of your, you know, picture frames or carpet if they are provided with more appropriate opportunities to shred, tear, destroy, because guess what? That's what they do in the wild. So even though a lot of parrot owners will complain about their birds being messy, it's a good thing that they're messy. That is how they are. That's their natural state. That's what they do in the wild. They make a hot mess. And you know what? They're drop and stuff and throw in food everywhere and people complain about it. You know what I complain about? I vacuum twice a day. You're kidding me. This is nuts. But the thing is, is that in the wild they are, you know, seeding the next season of like trees and vegetation for the rainforests and things like that. But in a home captive environment, foraging is extremely important to to to implement in your own home because that's what they do in the wild. They spend the majority of their time searching for food. If you teach your bird how to forage and it really is teach because it really is a skill that they can and will develop over time if you are intentional about it. So there's everything from like lazy foragers. I call them lazy foragers, like a lazy forager would be like a dog, slow feeder bull or something like that. You know, it looks like a little plastic labyrinth or whatever, You know, you put some food in there, some treats or something, and then throw some shredded paper or, you know, whatever little wood blocks or whatever on top of it. And then they just have to like throw it off, you know, to like, get to the food of bottom. You know, that's what I call, like kindergarten foraging. So you have that kind of foraging and then you have like all of your pellets, literally every calorie you eat is in a forager. And they have to, like, work for it somehow and go to all these different places on their perch stand or in their cage or on top of their kid in and outside of it, on the ceiling, on the bottom, in a corner over here, over there. And that's like college level foraging, I call it. And that, you know, not everybody is able to get to the right, just like not everybody goes to college. But but if they can get to that, then they they love that. And there are actually a couple of actually you should totally look into this and you ask if you remind me to if you remind me later, like email me later, I can totally get these papers to you. But there are some avian behavioral research papers that were published some years ago showing that if provided the opportunity for a parrot in a captive environment, if they had food like ad lib or free choice, like just sitting in a bowl, kind of like being off a silver platter, or if they had to forage for their food, what would be their preference? And the majority of parrots chose foraging because they actually like to forage. So it's an inherently reinforcing behavior. It keeps them out of trouble, I say, because if you can keep their beaks busy with appropriate things, then you can avoid their beaks getting busy either on themselves or on things they're not supposed to do. So it's a really foraging is hugely important for so many things. It prevents eating out of boredom. It can help with behavioral issues. I once had a parrot who of course, it was an Amazon, a Christmas flipper in an Amazon who screamed so much every single day because she was super jealous and left the room or super jealous. If I like paid attention to another bird, which I did every single day on and this is a very common problem. And she was so loud and obnoxious that my neighbors called animal Control on me every day for four months. And then I taught her how to forage for literally every crumb and calorie of food, including fresh stuff. And I went to the problem 100% of all resolved, but it like 80 to 90% resolved. And it was much, much, much better. And I would just yeah, I would make a bunch of foragers on a Sunday. I don't have a lot of time work in a lot, you know. Is it This is actually when I was a bird resident and I would make a bunch of actually Dixie Cup orders. So she had like three Harrisons pellets, double wrapped a newspaper stuffed in two or three layer thick of sticks of the wax paper, Dixie Cups taped with a tiny piece of paint, the blue painter's tape and then, like stuck in between the cage bars, like in different areas in her cage. And that kept her quiet when I left the room and when I paid attention to adverts, that was very, very, very helpful. So it's good for behavioral issues. It's good for their, like actual physical health and wellness as well, as well as they're like mental stimulation as well. You know, they spend, you know, anywhere from 60 to 70% of their time in the wild foraging. And what do they do in a cage? You know, if we can mimic that for them in their home captive environment, then the more naturally healthy they will be, Because even though we keep these birds in cages or sometimes restarting them on perches, but you're not supposed to know. But even though we keep them in our homes, they're not truly domesticated. They are still very much wild by nature. You know, they're you know, it's not like people have been owning birds for thousands of years, like we have dogs also. So if somebody wanted to book an appointment with you to have their their bird, see, how could they reach you? And if they don't live in the San Diego area, how can they find an avian veterinarian? Oh, that's a really good questions. Yeah. So if someone at say, Diego would like a concealed pass for a bird, you can reach out to us on Instagram at Feathers and find Spittle. Heather's in for Animal Hospital or via email info, feathers and fur. A H is an animal hospital dot com or a phone number, which I don't have memorized, but I probably should. 61966635760. Thank you so much. There's Kathy and I have nothing with nurses, by the way. Okay. Vets tend to get a lot of the credit and attention and but listen, nurses are the Rip Dale, seriously. So you can get contact with us that way or find me on Instagram as well. Me personally, a Dr. G. G bird vet. Although I am not as active on social media as I'd like to be, so just too busy these days. But if someone outside of San Diego area, because I do often get this question from other people in parts of the in other parts of the country and the world, how do I find a bird vet? The best way I think to find a bird veterinarian is to go to a V Dawg, which is the Web site for the Association of Avian Veterinarians and they have a find a vet tab. So you just click on that and type in your zip code, your state or country, whatever, and you can search within like, you know, five, ten, 50 miles. Other veterinarians who are registered with this association as well, they include people, veterinarians all over the map, not only literally geographically, but map members of this organization. So there are people who are bird veterinarians who are residency trained like me, who are not yet board certified on that website. There are also board certified avian vets on that Web site, although fun fact, not all board certified, even vets are even on that website. So that's very ironic. But anyway, that's another story. But people who at least care enough to be a part of this organization hopefully means that they also care enough to stay up to date with the information and the continuing education opportunities that the association that the Association of Avian Veterinarians puts on every year. So it's great. Thank you. Soon Yeah, I would too much information now that was great. That was great. Ball friends. That concludes our interview with Dr. Gee, bird vet extraordinaire. If you're watching on our YouTube channel, you got to see some clips of pepper, jalapenos, intake exam, bloodwork and microchipping. That was done by Dr. G and since that video was filmed, we learned that through DNA testing that Pepper is actually female instead of male. So now she is Ms.. Pepper Jalapeno. The spiciest in the world. But I told Pepper that she can be whatever she identifies as and I will still love her anyway. Tune in next week for a special guest that I think you guys are really going to enjoy. So until next time by.