Episode 25: Unraveling Self-Care: From Spa Days to Tattoos & Everything in Between

Ready to redefine your understanding of self-care? This enlightening conversation challenges the misconception that self-care equates to indulgence, as we explore the evolution of this once-taboo topic. We take a deep-dive into the multifaceted dimensions of self-care, emphasizing how it can be as simple as spending quality time with loved ones or reserving five precious minutes for yourself. 

Dive deeper into the episode as we expose the intersection of self-care and positive self-expression. Whether it's through creative projects, tattoos or piercings, we illuminate how self-care serves as a platform for expressing our unique identities. Rediscover the power of tattoos as a medium for self-care and positive self-expression, and how it can offer a sense of home, identity, and therapeutic benefits. 

Join us in this captivating discussion as we delve into numerous ways self-care can be seamlessly incorporated into our daily lives. Be it yoga, prayer, maintaining gratitude journals or adopting healthy eating habits, we highlight how such acts can significantly enhance our well-being. Listen as we stress the importance of caring for our bodies to ensure a vibrant and active lifestyle in the future. So, tune in and embark on a transformative journey as we unravel the world of self-care.  Need help taking the leap - email us at dumpsterdivejj@gmail.com for help!

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:07

video is on your screen. Which do you woman?

Speaker 2: 0:25

Go and Jane and we are some witchy women today. Yeah, we are. It's just good, it felt good I like it.

Speaker 1: 0:37

You never know what songs we're going to hit you right and that was the one.

Speaker 2: 0:40

Yeah, I love it.

Speaker 1: 0:42

I love it.

Speaker 2: 0:43

I'm going to play list, so you know, be prepared.

Speaker 1: 0:46

Everyone I love that I love how much you you I mean I love music, but you clearly like Music is a way you express yourself, right? And so yeah, I love that you have that ongoing playlist and you're like today, we're going to be bitchy. I mean, which he that's?

Speaker 2: 1:04

it, I love it, I love it.

Speaker 1: 1:06

It is All right. So it is early October and we are, um, we're doing like back to back recordings, man, we're trying really hard, right, so, like, build a library for you guys, um and uh, you know, spend a lot of time with each other and, obviously, with this growing audience. So so today I love this chain we decided I feel like we've all well, I feel like all along since the beginning, we said it and we need to talk about self care. We need to talk about self care and we don't. We haven't really had an episode focused on it, although I think we talk about it a lot, right, like we talk about all the different ways we're doing things.

Speaker 1: 1:41

So I love that today we're going to bring everybody an episode that's really kind of about like all the ways. And here's the thing there's a lot on social media now about self care. There's a lot in the news, like our world right now is honed in on this idea of self care. However, it has not always been this way. So I think what we're going to do right is like back up first, kind of talk about what we mean when we say it little of the history, et cetera, um, and then take it from the area.

Speaker 2: 2:06

Yeah, yeah, exactly Because you're, you're a hundred percent right. You know, go back to when we were early twenties or teens and stuff like that. I mean, I don't even remember the term self care.

Speaker 2: 2:18

I mean it didn't exist, it really didn't. And so, you know, there's a lot of us in our age range, um, out there in the world, out there in the ether, the men and women of the world, um, and everybody in between, that it's. It's, you know, being having self care is, is taboo, you know, it's like a sign of weakness or, oh, what do you have to do that? And even even getting a massage is like, oh, that's a hippie kind of thing to do, you know. And so we, we have that bias kind of hanging over our head and it I think it's taken us, us, our generation, longer to embrace self care than it has our, the younger generations, because it's so prominent with the younger generations.

Speaker 1: 3:00

Oh, it is. And now that you say that, it's funny because I even, you know, with some of our older daughters, I remember when they were, you know, you know, middle school age, right, and they're on YouTube and they're like finding all of the makeup tutorials and all the things and all of that can be considered self care, right, in terms of, like, the ways that you incorporate that stuff to make you feel better about yourself, to make you give yourself a certain look that you want to portray whatever it is. And so, yeah, I think you're right, like our daughters will always know a world where this idea of self care was lifted up as a plus, right, whereas I think our generation early on, and certainly our mothers, and it's this isn't only about women everybody, but obviously we tend to be the ones who really ignore ourselves. But now I feel like hopefully we'll be the last generation that faces that idea that self care is selfish, right, right.

Speaker 2: 3:54

And you know another thing that I used to think of self care, you know, when I started becoming aware of different social classes and stuff like that, like only rich people could afford to take care of themselves, like going to the spa, getting a massage, getting their nails done, getting their toenails done, you know, putting their hair done by somebody Even that is a form of self care, because you're taking the labor out of it and having somebody else with an expertise take care of you and make you feel beautiful.

Speaker 2: 4:21

You know or or whatever feeling you're trying to get out of it, you know, and to enhance that self care aspect or that mental health aspect.

Speaker 1: 4:31

And I think that's so important that idea that it used to be perceived as a class issue.

Speaker 2: 4:36

Yeah, yeah, and that's I mean.

Speaker 2: 4:37

that's honestly how I thought of it, you know we don't do those things we do in ourselves because we can't afford it. You know we just did it ourselves. So I, you know I come from that, from that mindset. But you know, even now I have a friend that does my hair. Could I do my hair Absolutely, but I don't want to. I really spend the time doing it. I enjoy our companionship, our friendship. Yeah, it's a, it's a sense of therapy for her and me. Through me, I've lived vicariously, through her, with their store, with our stories, and we have that common ground and it's fun. You know I don't trauma dump, we just talk about life and have fun with it. You know so. But that's part of it, that connection, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 5:19

I love that. That's again you're. Now, you're brought into all kinds of things, right. Self-care can be two people spending time Heck, you can even be doing your own nails together, right, but the idea is that it's the interconnection with that person, as well as what you're doing to your physical self right To take care of yourself, and I think that you're right. Like it's no, I think that the way we take care of ourselves are so vast and it's certainly not class specific. Like you said, it can look very different because it can be as simple, as you know, taking a bubble bath and and as complex as going and paying for a massage, right, or even like, honestly, I probably would say to you that if there is one way I engage in self-care, that is probably my favorite and I give up things for it. Right, it's not a, it's well, I give up things for it. It's the fact that every two weeks, I have somebody who you know, some folks who come and help clean our house, right. So you, right, you would think that that's like, oh, that's different, but it really isn't, because then you said it.

Speaker 1: 6:19

This is what made me think of it, jane is time right, that you know.

Speaker 1: 6:24

You know for years, like Joe and I, right, every Saturday we carve out five or six hours and we would clean the house top to bottom together.

Speaker 1: 6:30

And we know, in a lot of places that's not that partnership doesn't even exist. For a lot of people, the woman usually, or the guy, like one person, is doing all that and taking on that burden. But but then we finally got to a point where we were like, okay, not having this time for each other, for our own selves or whatever is way, you know, it's way more taxing on us, right, like spending that time. And so, yeah, we finally were like, okay, let's look at the budget and see what can we cut in order to create the, you know, the opportunity or the ability to do that. But that is the thing that, if you said, you know what's the thing your lease like to give up, for me it's that because my sense of well-being and like calm and all the things is so reset every two weeks, right, because I know that's done and I don't have to like be worried about it.

Speaker 2: 7:15

Yeah, and that's awesome and and for some people that's not, you know, affordable or whatever. You went through your budget and you made room for it because it's worth the time, exactly, and having that. So let's get into some of the some of the things that are out there about self-care and then we can talk about, you know, the whole purpose of we're we're talking self-care anyway, but then you know it's October, so we like to creep people out and and you know we're talking taboo self-care. But what I was, we were doing a little research and what I found is this article and I thought it was so funny was, and it's titled self-care can be seen as taboo and there's three main reasons. And I love this because it was like oh my gosh, this is our generation's mindset.

Speaker 1: 8:06

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 8:06

The number one thing is the femininity of self-care. You know it's a girl thing, you know, but the the fact of the matter is is that everyone needs self-care in whatever shape or form. That is right, Cause we just talked about 10 different ways you could, you know, show yourself some self-love and self-care, but it's it's. It's more about the time the time to be able to enjoy time versus Not, that's right and enjoy cleaning your house for five or six hours, Even though you were doing it with your husband and all of those things, but you could be enjoying time with friends or walking on the beach or doing something different, right? So it's not just female. Take a bubble bath, go get a massage, ladi-dadi, it's the men going out to play golf or Work in there, work in their garage and work on their car and do something that they actually enjoy and that fills their bucket, right? Okay?

Speaker 1: 8:56

that is such a. I love that point so much, jane, because so often the femininity of it, right. We often think about self-care and we think about women and and the perception in the past has been you need it because you're weak, right? And yet we've never thought about the fact that, like you said, when the guy goes off to play golf or he's working on something and is, you know he's a carp, you know working on some carpentry project over here or whatever, that's all the version of self-care that you get in your own kind of space and a long time and yet resetting in your own way. And we've never looked at that way. Those are manly things. Right, working on your car and garage, oh, that makes you more manly.

Speaker 2: 9:32

It's so interesting, the dynamic right, but the in the thing that we need to remember as their spouses and or Sisters or whatever the female part of their world is that that is their self-care.

Speaker 2: 9:43

Yeah, that way, he's always out in the garage working on stuff and mara mara, well, yeah, he could be avoiding a lot of things, sure, or that person could be avoiding a lot of things. However, if they're doing it in a, in a moderation, and it's a healthy thing, and they're producing something out of it and not just out, they're banging around and drinking beer and and being, you know, okay, man, you know, look at that, look at that, you know, but maybe that's their self-care. They want to be a caveman, I don't know, but you know, are they producing something? Are they creating something for for your life together? Are they doing something fun for a friend or for themselves? Right, that kind of stuff that we really need to stop and and get out of our own head and go oh, wow, they're really putting time and effort into something for someone. Yeah, somebody else, you know exactly.

Speaker 1: 10:28

Well, and, like you said, even if it is for themselves, and that's okay, right, and I think that may be the the Kind of muddy water part where people start to get frustrated with each other. It's that's where it comes, when, like, one person in a relationship is constantly over here doing something and without them, right, no matter what that is. So let's get into like, um, well, here, let's, let's do the other two real quick.

Speaker 2: 10:49

Oh, that's right, I forgot that was only the first one. Go ahead. So self-care is anything that soothes you. Well, yes, it could be soothing, but it's more about clearing your mental mind, you know, and and reconnecting with your own self and your mind and your body. You know, being able to like write reflective notes about your work can be difficult, but to clear your mind for the weekend, you may need to write that whatever frustrated you last week, to get it out, you know, or whatever it is. And then Number three is people. You self-care because there's something wrong with them. That's what, guys? We all have something wrong with us? None of us, you know. And and the simple fact is is that there's always something to work on. Not one of us in this entire world has nothing to work on.

Speaker 1: 11:35

That's right. Yep, no, I think that all of those things. So that's. I love that you're taking that right out of the gate and then Encountering right those arguments about how self-care is selfish. So let's get into Some of the other things. I mean, we have so much of our own life experience around this. What are some of the other things that you brought to the table? I know you mentioned Like seven pillars of self-care.

Speaker 2: 11:58

Yeah, so I found that there's. So I was looking up. Okay, like for the people that are beginners, you know, like, what are some of some nice steps that we can lay out? Yeah, but it's also what are the seven pillars of self-care fits into. So each method of self-care fits into one of these seven pillars. So the first one is mental. Okay, we covered that. Emotional, that's huge. We all need time to grieve and or, or, you know, decompressed from the day or whatever it is manage stress.

Speaker 1: 12:30

Yeah that's that those are all mental in my mind.

Speaker 2: 12:32

Yeah, exactly physical, yeah, I mean, your body needs to be exercised, you know. So there is there's different ways to do that. Environmental some people's environments can be very overwhelming and stuff like that. So, cleaning up a space, creating the your own for yourself, you know doing things like that, making it conducive to your lifestyle. Spiritual, you know what? Whatever, if that's organized religion, you know. Being connected to the earth and nature, you know any of those things. Recreational, having a hobby, you know, I think, something that where you can produce something or achieve something or set a goal for yourself. And then, finally, social, there's definitely social self self care, where interacting with other individuals or being by yourself, you know, and, and being able to separate yourself from social status and be able to, you know Recenter and and find who you are without that, Well, you said two things on a previous episode and so if, for the people who listen to it, they'll know this, it was this the kind of ghost and scary episode we did a fire attack.

Speaker 1: 13:39

You talked about two ways that you do that right. One was that, like when you get home at the end of the day after the long drive, etc. Like you go either to your bedroom or to your backyard, to your garden, and you just need like 30 to 60 minutes Just on your own just to like decompress, right. I remember that was one of the things that you said in that episode in terms of like the way. And I will say, like For me, one of the ways that I do it is I don't drive a lot. I work remotely now, but when I do, just having time in the car with nothing, sometimes I need there's certain music I want to listen to.

Speaker 2: 14:12

Sometimes there's, you know, podcasts and that kind of stuff, but there are times where I'm just driving in silence and that's a part of how I reset, right, because it's just quiet, yeah yeah, yeah, exactly, and and you know, and I really do, I I like to reconnect with nature because, you know, when I'm at work, I'm in a concrete building and I'm in the city and and there's all the noises and not a lot of. You know nature, you know it's very man.

Speaker 2: 14:37

Yeah, when I get out to my neighborhood where it's a lot more nature and I sit in my little backyard with my plants and the hummingbirds flying around and the squirrels jumping around and stuff like that, it's just so nice to just I sit and watch the animals. You know, even though little. I just sit and watch them and their little life and how, how simple it is. I know it's very complicated for them, but you know how, how?

Speaker 2: 15:00

just you know I'm just eating and I'm sleeping you know and that's what I'm doing, and I'm basking in the sun, you know, and I just yeah, I love that.

Speaker 1: 15:10

Well, and so, as you kind of went through those seven, there were different examples that are in my mind. We've already kind of shared and we're gonna continue to say a lot of them as we go. But you know, I feel like one of the really important things to think about because so often you know, like you've said before, in addition to being an educator and all the things that I do with my professional persona, I'm a wellness coach On the side, so to speak, and I also do parent coaching and those kinds of things and in both of those realms, when we talk about self-care, you know we do have to lift it up and the big thing is just saying to folks you have to carve out the time, right, like we are, again, as women, but, in general speaking, right, many of us can can relate to this, regardless of gender, but we often are the people who are least likely to engage in self-care, are also typically the people who are Taking on the problems of the world, right, the people who are constantly there to solve problems. You're the person who somebody else is always calling when something is happening in their world. You're the person the kids come to, the person that you know you're relative, and so Oftentimes, even though I feel like we live in a world now where this idea of self-care is not considered selfish anymore we are least likely to carve out the time right.

Speaker 1: 16:24

So, as a wellness coach, over and over and over again, what I have to remind people of is if you don't take care of yourself, then you cannot be the resource you aspire to be for other people. Right, told her a conversation, then you know you can't be everything to all people, but in the context of a world where you're trying to be, you have to carve out time for yourself because otherwise, at some point You're just gonna crumble right. And so self-care really is you could argue a very selfless act in terms of I'm trying to take care of me so that I can, in turn, support you.

Speaker 2: 16:53

Right, yeah, there's a song lyric that I absolutely love and it's and it was how can I bring anything to the table when I'm the table? Oh, and I Kanye West. I was like that is one of the best lyrics I've ever heard, and it's so true you can't serve when you're at the table, yeah, and so if you're not learning how to let the table be the table and be able to bring things to the table and accept the things that other people bring into the table, you'll never not be the table. That's the self-care.

Speaker 1: 17:25

Yeah, so the first assessment of your status is determined Are you or are you not at the table? Table Now, the other thing I think is really important too is and we've kind of already gotten to this, but I'll say it out loud specifically is the idea that it's not one size fits all. Right, everybody's self-care looks different depending on who they are, where they are in life, etc. Right, there are things I do now that I couldn't have done 10 years ago. Right, and also, that they don't have to be complicated and it doesn't have to be expensive. Right, it can be as simple as yoga in your home.

Speaker 1: 18:01

For some people, prayer is their self-care. Right, like, for some people, just the act of praying is their self-care. And I really, like you know, I'm a big fan of the power of gratitude on our well-being, and so I'm a real big fan of gratitude journals. Right, like taking five minutes at the start of the day or the end of the day, especially if you've had a hard day. Right, and just making, forcing your brain to put out, to put away all the things that have caused you stress, anxiety, all the things, and only focus on one or two things that actually brought you joy or for which you're grateful. It's amazing the impact that can have on our body. So so this act of self-care can be very simple, and I oftentimes again in that wellness community when I focus us on five minutes, right, just five minutes. That's all I'm saying, and obviously the ideal is that you build from there, but as a starting point, everybody can give themselves five minutes, right, right, yeah.

Speaker 2: 18:54

And it's as easy as drinking more water. It's as easy as treating your body better. You know, treating your body better, treating your body better, will make you feel better. And then, if you feel better, then you can say oh, I can make five minutes for myself, and then you do the journal, and then you can, and you build off of that. It's Rome wasn't built in a day. We all know that, you know, and so it's creating little habits and ways to make for it.

Speaker 1: 19:22

I love thinking about it like that and I've referenced the book Atomic Habits many times on this show. I'll say it one more time it's another great resource to go to in terms of thinking how you start to build those habits. But I love what you're describing in terms of scaffolding right, like start with something little and doable, that like you hear it and you roll your eyes like well, anybody could do that. Start with that right and then, after you've done that, build on it. Let that be the gateway to the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing. I really think that's smart, so smart.

Speaker 2: 19:51

Well, you know, one of the things I say to my clients all the time is how do you eat an apple? Yeah, one bite at a time. You shove that thing all in your mouth at once. One, it's going to be terrible, it's going to hurt, you're going to choke and you're not going to enjoy it. You know, and doing self-care is something enjoyable, not a chore. You know that's what it's about and building that time for yourself and honestly.

Speaker 1: 20:15

The other piece, too, is you know if for no other reason, right, if you can't, if you hear all these things and you're still like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I don't have time consider what you're modeling for your children, right, if you have children, consider what you're modeling for your children, and I feel like that's such a great barometer for people, I think. And it's oftentimes when in coaching sessions I see people kind of kind of like your apple thing, right, Kind of all of a sudden get the light in their eyes, I'm like oh crap, like okay, even if I'm not going to do it for myself, right, I don't do it, then what I'm modeling to my kids is that the way I'm operating right now, where I never take care of myself, is the way to live, and I don't want my kids to think that. So sometimes, even thinking about it like that, yeah, One.

Speaker 2: 21:00

The how I get, how I make time for myself, is is I think about and this is terrible, but I think about the misery my mother is in and how angry she is and how all of those things, and I don't want to be that way. So if I take care of myself now, yeah, still be able to take care of myself then, and I won't be that version of an older person when I get older. I don't want my body to be broken down. So I'm doing the stretching and the physical therapy that I needed you now. I'm not completely crippled with my shoulder and everything else In my late fifties or early sixties.

Speaker 2: 21:40

I want to have an active lifestyle, I want to have all those things, and if I don't start working on that now, I'm going to be repairing my body in order to maybe have that. Instead, I keep it going and, and you know, take care of myself now to where I can just continue to do so when I'm older, and that's what keeps me going, because I don't want to be hurting all the time. And and self care is mental, you know, and mentally you know my mother is mentally disabled in that aspect. You know. She's caught in her own stuff. So you know not that I'm in the mental status that she is by any means, but we have to work on it now, that's right. Oh, it can wait. It can wait until I'm retired. No, because by then you're going to be broken down and and angry with yourself. We're not doing it before, so do it now.

Speaker 1: 22:28

Well then it's and I love that you're focusing on the physical too, jane, because it is like you know, it's a myth that, oh, we had a certain age and we just have to accept that certain things are going to happen with our bodies. And it's a myth, right, and so I you mentioned a minute ago, you know food, right, choosing that healthy piece, right, and so you know I'll, I'll lift that idea up, because I do feel like it's interesting how I write your guess if we were to take a poll, right, and we said to folks you know how do you? You know, when you are stressed and anxious, and you know all the things, how do you engage with food? Right, and for many of us we grew up with examples of food is for comfort, right, and so, because of that, though, though you know, the higher our stress and anxiety and all the things levels are, the more we're likely to choose that thing.

Speaker 1: 23:15

That only actually adds to all of it, because it's not helping our bodies, right? No, which doesn't mean that, you know, you can't enjoy the food, and it doesn't mean that food can't be a comfort, but when we're in that cycle of, we turn to choices that we know aren't good for our bodies. Because it makes us feel better emotionally. Right, that's a cycle that we can break with self care. Right, and you alluded to this, right. This idea that, like, when we actually focus more on whole foods, our body feels better, and when our body feels better, our mind feels better. Right, our emotional, mental well-being comes along with it, and so you know, again, we're not going to go too far down that road. That's what I do in the wellness role, but really thinking about you know, when you go to reach for whatever it is, our relationship with it.

Speaker 2: 24:04

Yeah, yes.

Speaker 1: 24:05

Right, and what you hope it's going to do for you. Just as a starting point, like you said, as a baby step to just thinking about it.

Speaker 2: 24:13

Yeah, and just making a journal about that. I'm actually doing a class, a six week class, and I created an image for the class and it was. It's this young lady with headphones on and she's like dancing and it and I'm just slowing them down to say what is your relationship with them, with your favorite music? What emotions does it bring up and why? You know?

Speaker 1: 24:35

right.

Speaker 2: 24:36

And it's not like anything with food or somebody that has an addiction problem, like, yeah, what is it that you're trying to achieve with this and why? And how does this make you feel? How does it interact? And you know, and we can say that to self care too, which brings us to, you know, the segue of the taboo aspect of it, because we were talking about tattoos and piercings and stuff like that and I said, well, that's my form of self care. And you were like what? And so we started talking about it. I would love to have you segue into that, and then we can we can talk about that too, because there's some, you know, interesting self care ways.

Speaker 1: 25:13

Well, it's this idea of, like, the intersection of self care and positive self expression and I say positive self expression because we know there are ways that people express themselves that aren't good for them or dangerous for them or could cause them harm. So, the intersection of self care and positive self expression and kind of building off of the seven pillars you shared with us earlier today, what I'll hone in on is ways that we engage creatively right, with the world, and sometimes that's writing or painting or dancing or, you know, like you said, with your your course, like music and the why behind the ways that it makes you feel. Sometimes it's different forms of physical. You could obviously dancing as a part of that. You know those are ways that we express ourselves that also have the side effect of being a part of our self care, and then social and intellectual kind of come along with that as well. Right, the idea of, like, carving out time to do the things that bring you joy with the people who bring you joy, right, because, again, oftentimes you know, we're so caught up in dealing with the people in our world who bring us angst, because they're in our faces, that the people who bring us joy are left on the sidelines and so actually being intentional about saying so. That's a way of kind of expressing yourself socially by being intentional about that, by putting out boundaries and saying so. Those kinds of self expression are where I saw it intersect with self care, and again it can be. And the other thing I really loved about thinking through this a little bit is because we were using the word taboo, but this is not a particularly taboo concept, except that it's not something that we all do all the time, and that's the idea of volunteering.

Speaker 1: 26:53

The idea of volunteering as a form of self care and self expression kind of makes you go what? But at the end of the day, it actually is exactly that right when you we know there's research that supports that when you do for others in a way like that, it brings you joy in a way that then boosts your own mental health. Right, and I was just having this conversation with our 16 year old the other day because she's thinking about her college resume, which it's an unfortunate way to think about volunteering, but because of it it is driving her to realize okay, there are people in the world who have far less than I do, who have bigger challenges than I do. How can I serve in a way, but that was how I was trying to drive her was. I know that you're talking about this because you're trying to figure out how to build your college resume. I'm thinking about it for you in terms of how do you expose yourself to people who have different experiences so that you understand the world better, and volunteering in different capacities is a way to do that.

Speaker 1: 27:50

But when we say taboo, yes, that tends to get us into the realm of some of the things that people do. You're right when you said this. When we were chatting about this episode a few weeks ago, I was like I have never thought about those kinds of self-expressions like tattoos and body art in general and piercings, etc. Being a way of creating self-care. I have traditional piercings and I have a couple of tattoos. You obviously have really embraced those ways. I'm sure you have other examples that you'll share with us, but talk to us a little bit about some of your experiences with those more what we're calling taboo type of self-care expressions.

Speaker 2: 28:35

Well, it's multi-layered for me and I'm sure as a lot of people that have extensive body artwork, but I feel like where mine comes from is a couple different places. But it's grown over the years because now I'm 75 percent covered in body artwork. I think I've talked about this before and I might have mentioned this about my tattoos is it was something that couldn't be taken away from me. I just thought it was so cool that, no matter what, I would always have it with me.

Speaker 1: 29:14

Can you talk about that a little bit more in depth, because I don't know if we've actually recorded a conversation about that, maybe not?

Speaker 2: 29:22

Well, yeah, so as a child we moved every six months. I think we mentioned that last night on our fireside chat, which you guys will hear before this episode. But we moved around every six months, it seemed like, and we were in different schools all the time. And as we got older junior high school age we spent some time in California and it was the first time we didn't move in five years and I mean that was a long time for us. Yeah, so that was one of the happier times for my mom, and so we got into 4-H and we were doing all those things and we were winning trophies and I had grand champion chickens and sheep and all these things.

Speaker 2: 30:02

And they lost it all in storage, they let it go and they auctioned off our storage and so I don't even have pictures of me as a child Like I have to get them from uncles and aunts that kind of spent time with us and they're just scattered and we have nothing from our childhood. And so I became very interested in tattoos because I liked the artwork but I was like, wow, that's something that I could always have and I never made that connection until I was older. But I think I spoke to my soul and because we lost everything and then things were always taken away from us all the time, and so I think that's kind of my subconscious aspect of that's my self-care. It's something that I love and nobody can take away from me. But also as last night I was thinking about this morning being an empath and having a hard time identifying with any type of group of people has always been hard. For me. It's not been hard, I'm more of a chameleon, but I never had my own identity or one group that I could say yeah, I'm a part of this group Like everybody else, but I'm really solid in this and the tattoo industry and tattoo world. I felt that sense of home for me Because I am taboo, I am unusual, I am queer, I am all of those things. I am not normal and not in the way that I think, not in the way that I feel, not in the way that all those things, and I'm very much so an individual and I felt like the tattoo industry was a sense of family, but you could still be an individual and have a sense of style that you like or put whatever you want on your body and nobody's going to care. You could have eyebrows tattooed on that are Celtic knots or flames and nobody is going to judge you for it. And so it was like I finally found my people in that aspect.

Speaker 2: 32:03

But it wasn't necessarily the people, but it was the mindset. You know, loved, it was a creative and build yourself up and make you feel good. It was. You know, I feel good after I get tattooed. But then I realized so I feel good, I look good with tattoos, you know, like they fit me, it's all of that. But then I realized that there was a point of release while getting a tattoo of like.

Speaker 2: 32:32

I felt almost euphoric afterwards, like I was being negative energy or whatever during that, because I focused so much on mind over matter with the pain that I got really good at it. Now I can sleep through a tattoo and it's a sense of therapy for me. So I call it pain therapy. I need some pain therapy, but it's not because I enjoy the pain, it's because I can mentally block it out and feel like totally different during that time and for a while afterwards it's about six months Like I can shake off what it was.

Speaker 2: 33:10

And the last time I got tattooed was when I was going through my separation and stuff like that, and I needed like, I was like I need a reset and I wouldn't got my palm tattooed and it hurt like a mofo. But I meditated through the whole thing, didn't move a millimeter during the whole thing and everybody was like you're a badass and I'm like I know, and that's why I got this, and I'm like you know, like no, but it's for me it is definitely a negative energy release and I get to the point where I'm like I need to get a tattoo. Even if it's a small one, I just need to get a tattoo and it's whatever, something about it that just does it for me. You know So-.

Speaker 1: 33:57

That is so interesting and I really appreciate that you clarified that it's not a pain seeking endeavor. It's the opposite, it's almost like a mind over matter. You know, endeavor for you, right To be able to show that I can do this and actually not feel the pain. And I'm sure, like again, neither one of us are therapists or counselors or certified in any of those things. But my amateur therapy brain thinks, yeah, there's a control there, right. Like being able to exercise that kind of ultimate control right, is very euphoric, Like there's definitely a level of euphoria that comes with that.

Speaker 2: 34:34

And I love that you use the word control, because I'm definitely not a control freak but when I feel out of control, that helps me re-center and feel in control, because I can't control myself. I can do this, I can do all of those things and I can make it happen and have a really cool little piece of artwork. You know, like every time now I'm getting my legs filled in with bugs and slugs.

Speaker 2: 34:55

you know we're like doing cool little things you know like it's and to me now at this point, I'm not like I have tons of big pieces and they all connect. It's not for the, it's for the artwork. I definitely love good artwork, but it's more for the experience and that meditation and that level of meditation.

Speaker 1: 35:14

And that again, that's such a great, I think, insight for our listeners, because oftentimes you you know I'm gonna draw some stereotypes right, well, yeah, you're saying no, well, that too, yes, that too. But also like or you see somebody and you think you know the classic, you know the girl at the beach tramp stamp, right, and that's a big right. People go, oh, look at that tramp stamp which, and the implication there is that she just got it or he just got it whatever, just to get attention. Basically, right, like it's not meaningful. First is like, if you get one and it's meaningful, then that's okay. Right, like that's all. But what you're describing is like whether you get it for that reason or because it's mean something, or but there's an additional layer, which is that it is a way that you engage in taking care of yourself.

Speaker 1: 36:03

That's a whole different level of understanding and, honestly again, I'm still what's the word I'm looking for. I'm still kind of carrying out a potential myth or assumption, but I will think I will wonder that now, moving forward, when I see somebody like you who has so much of their body covered, I will begin I will wonder, like okay, so, but now what it does is make me wonder why, right, like so, I only have two tattoos. The first one I got because my niece backwards, who was graduating high school, was helping on getting a tattoo and I really want to hurt a weight. I really, you know this is probably really small minded of me, but I was like, just let your brain fully develop before you actually start putting permanent ink on your body. And so I just said, how about this? If you wait until you graduate college, that will be my college gift to you and I'll go with you and do get one myself.

Speaker 1: 36:50

And that's what we did and you know it means something. It's my, the letters of two of my kids you know names and a little heart, right. And then the second one I got. That was that way that one's like 20 years old. The second one I got I got just recently and it too it was an expression thing, and so we have, you know, there's a you know a long story of like the when I was an East Coast girl and the Outer Banks of North Carolina it was kind of where we spent a lot of time. And so some of the family still on the East Coast said, hey, let's get Outer Banks tattoos. And I was like that's amazing, I'm in, I love that idea, it ties us together, it ties us to a place we love, et cetera.

Speaker 1: 37:26

But then when I actually went to get it, I didn't like the options that we were looking at because I wanted an ankle bracelet. And so I the guy you know, the artist and I, as we were chatting about it, he's like, well, you're here now, and I was like, well, yeah, and he's like so, tell me about the relationship that you have with Southern California. So long story short. Now. It's a combination of both of those right. So, cal OBX, my point is and so it was thoughtful and intentional I love the artwork of it, but for me it was. Those were both driven by meaning, not by necessarily my love of art or the things that you're describing in terms of the ways you're taking care of yourself, and so I don't see myself having a million tattoos right, because it's a different. Why behind it?

Speaker 2: 38:09

right.

Speaker 1: 38:09

But now, forever, now I'm gonna ask somebody, not what is your tattoo or even what does it mean. I'm gonna ask so why do you? I gotta figure out a way to ask that. So it doesn't sound mean, but like I'm curious about the why. Like what's the why behind, why these are important for you?

Speaker 2: 38:26

Yeah, what attracted you to this? That might be a good question. This style, because it is a lifestyle, it's not just a thing. I mean for people that are heavily tattooed, talking about the person with the ankle and stuff like that. I mean, that's where you're going, great, but and people change. Like I got my first tattoo when I was 18. I knew when I was 18, I wanted to be covered in tattoos and I wanted cool artwork and I just thought and I thought I also thought it was a social aspect too. Like for me it was. It looked sexy on a woman, you know, and I saw that and I was like that's, I like that you know I want to look like that.

Speaker 2: 39:07

And so yeah, you know, and I'm getting there. I mean, one day I'll have my butt, cheeks tattooed.

Speaker 1: 39:12

I mean and I never want to see that for the record. I just wanna go on record.

Speaker 2: 39:18

It'll be so beautiful you won't even know it's beautiful.

Speaker 1: 39:20

I'm sure, I'm sure, I'm sure it's my butt. All right, everybody. That'll be the true test 10 years from now, when we do start 10th anniversary episode, we will check in on whether or not Jane has a butt tattoo and whether or not it looks like her butt.

Speaker 2: 39:34

So make sure you hold us to that 10 years from now, that's my butt, on my butt.

Speaker 1: 39:38

That I would look at. It looks like your butt that I would look at. Okay, that's the one, that's the one. All right, let's shift really quickly, before we wrap up, to similar to the tattoos. Are the piercings right? Same thing. Like you, are someone who can kind of represent the voice of folks who get I'm gonna call them the more like less traditional, you know ear-, Like ear lobes and stuff like that.

Speaker 2: 40:01

Yeah, I mean, I've had a bazillion piercings. Piercings were. Piercings are something different, for sure, because they take longer to heal. You know, tattoos take roughly around two weeks and to a full month to heal, like fully, fully, but they stop hurting after you know they shed and stuff like that. Piercings they can get infected and inflamed and bumped and all of those things. And they were a lot more maintenance than and painful Like, because you get your cartilage pierced, you can get a migraine and I'm very sensitive, my ears are very sensitive, and stuff like that. So I would do different piercings and end up taking them out within a couple of weeks just because I couldn't sleep or whatever. Oh, wow, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 40:50

And at the time I also had an issue with cystic acne and so anytime I got a piercing I would develop a cyst underneath it and it was just, yeah, it was just bad. That point in my life had a lot of hormones going on. I just had chase when I was getting these piercings and so I've had several but I've stuck with a couple and these are more for like. Yeah, I mean the pain's quick, Like with the piercing, the pain, they're just sore a lot longer and they talk a lot more maintenance. But there's certain things that I like the way it looks, so more for me. Piercings are more of an aesthetic for me and I like them. So because I've tried out so many different ones and I just I like the ones that I've sat with. But there's a lot of people out there that kind of for the same reason as I do, or for that meditation aspect or whatever, they get piercings.

Speaker 2: 41:43

You know, yeah, I've lived through, I worked in the industry. I've seen a lot of body modification stuff that is for shock effect or for whatever, like splitting the tongue and you know, and I've stretched my earlobes, a big, big earlobe, you know, I've seen implants being done and branding being done and all of that stuff, all of the types of body modification you can think of, and they weren't for me, you know, I don't. I think burning your skin, you know, like I couldn't do the branding, you know, and stuff like that. That's a whole another level of different type of pain. But it's a social thing too, you know. So, without really asking the person or whatever, I mean, they could be getting tattoos for social. They could be getting tattoos for the same reasons that I'm getting tattoos, you know, because the enjoyment of the art and the creativity and all of that, but also the proving to yourself that you can get covered in tattoos and live through it.

Speaker 1: 42:45

So I was going to say so, is it? I guess the point here in the larger conversation, of this conversation around self care and all of that and is that we can consider the link between self care and self expression. And so when we see people expressing themselves in certain ways, I mean the fact of the matter is, for some folks it is just because I thought it was cool, it's a legit thing. Okay, Exactly, that's legit. And but for some folks like you're, like you're describing right, For some of it it's very intentional and it is about how you know, expressing to the world who we are, how we are, etc. In ways that ultimately then serve to contribute to our mental health positively, because we know this expression is out there, right and it's something that everybody can see and know.

Speaker 2: 43:33

Totally and and I really want to I mean, this is our platform, right, our dumpster diving with Janice and Jane is our platform to inform people of other opinions and different ways to think of things. And this is huge because, you know, being being a heavily tattooed person, I'm seen differently by a lot of people. You know, I've had little old ladies clutch their purse as I walk by, you know, and I am not a very threatening looking person, right, right, right. Well, I'm usually well dressed and they still, because of the tattoos, are like oh, she's a criminal or a drug addict, and you know. But the people that are from the industry or or are you know part of it and that social status, they know how much money goes into this and that stuff like that.

Speaker 1: 44:17

But also Wait, wait, wait, I'm sorry. So you're saying that everybody doesn't get their tattoos free in jail? No, sorry, I just wow.

Speaker 2: 44:25

Easy Mine blown, Okay, I have a funny story before we close out that I will tell you about that. But I had a certain I was going towards, for this is like crushing the stereotype of just a dirt bag, because they have all these tattoos and that you know they actually might have something awesome to say and don't judge a book by its cover, but also it doesn't. Also, it also doesn't mean that I'm an exhibitionist. You know that, in that I I owe the public my, my answers to why I got tattooed, why I got certain tattoos, what I was thinking and all of those things. They're for me and and when I get molested by by general public.

Speaker 2: 45:13

I mean, I worked at a retail store one time where we wore aprons and I was wearing a V neck T shirt and an old man walked up to me with his wife standing right there and pulled my shirt down to see if I had any tattoos lower than what he could see. Oh, my God, and I was, and I pushed his hand away. I said, excuse me, he's like well, I mean, don't you have them there for everybody to see? And so here's another misconception. Wow, you know and I had a neighbor, an older gentleman, that I shouldn't even use that term very loosely an older man, you know, like so, do you go out in your backyard naked? Are you an exhibitionist? I mean, he straight up asked me and I was like what Well, you have all those tattoos. I figured that you'd want to show them off to everybody. That doesn't mean that I want to show them off to everybody. Oh my gosh, so yeah.

Speaker 1: 46:01

So they're for you, right, like that's the misconception they're for you.

Speaker 2: 46:05

They're for no one else but me. So, anyways, yeah, I wanted to bring that up real quick because I've had those inappropriate moments with people, people I don't even know. I'm like here, let's, let's, let's talk about this and never grab tattoos. You never know when it could be fresh, and that that happened to in the grocery store.

Speaker 1: 46:23

All right, so we're going to end on your story when I do Okay, had to use in jail, which I love that you have a story of course, oh my gosh.

Speaker 2: 46:30

Well, it's a cute story because it involves Chase. So she was probably like seven, six or seven, and by now I'm already covered in tattoos Like I've her whole life. She's known me being covered in tattoos. We're sitting in traffic and there was a truck next to us and it was a construction worker and he had his sleeve up so you could see his arm and you could see his arm tattoos. But he was wearing this orange shirt.

Speaker 2: 46:56

And she looked over and she was like, oh my gosh, that guy has been in jail. And I go how do you know that she does all of the tattoos? And I looked at her and I looked at her and I looked at me and I'm like so is that? What you tell all your friends is that I've been to jail, not new mom, but that guy? Yes, I'm like, no, he hasn't. Oh my gosh, I'm like I'm even my own kid. Because of social and all the other crowds right in here from other people, she thought that this man over here probably spent tons of time in jail getting tattoos, because that's what people think, you know.

Speaker 1: 47:34

So, my gosh, oh my gosh Well, and I think we're definitely in a world where, you know, picking up from the tattoos, kind of bringing us all the way back then to the broader topic of self care, like where those myths are being busted right. You know, I don't know how long it's been true, but like once upon a time you couldn't be in the military if you had a tattoo Right Once a month. So so I think that whole idea of this being I don't want to call it accepted, because nobody should have to wait for other people to accept it, but an understood, a better understood, I think, way of life is definitely becoming more prominent. So, backing all the way up, then, folks, you know, our point today was really to add to the conversation around the how critical it is for us to carve out time to do the things that bring us joy or contribute to our our mental and physical and spiritual and social and environmental well well being in positive ways.

Speaker 1: 48:28

And again, we started this episode by saying listen, lots of like this is constant. You can't go on Instagram or Tik Tok or any of those things these days without seeing something about self care, and all you know is you can hear it over and, over and over again and still ignore it. And so this is your sign this episode today, in this moment when you're listening to it. If you have not already begun to carve out five minutes today for yourself, this is your sign that it's time to do that, and we've given you lots of ways. As always, you you feel free to reach out to us, either DMS or email us at dumpster dive JJ at gmailcom. I feel like I know I need to and I can't, and you just don't have anybody in your world who can help push you over the edge. We're always there to push you over the edge. Doesn't that sound sweet? We will always be the push you over the edge.

Speaker 2: 49:14

We are ready, we have our little kicks on, ready to just kick you right over.

Speaker 1: 49:19

So this is your moment. You guys, as always, like subscribe, share, keep those downloads, keep those clicks coming. Thank you for listening forward to more fun after after this. Thanks for listening, yeah.