Cocoa Pods
Podcast - Cocoa Pods Series: A feature of the Birth Center Foundation.
We discuss all things' women, all things' pregnancy, all things' after. Reasons why women fall very sick ( morbidity) or die (mortality) before pregnancy (adolescent girls and young adults),during pregnancy and after are discussed in this maternal morbidity and mortality reduction academy; especially with an emphasis on minority women, all over the world; and ways for all involved in care to work together collaboratively and mitigate and or eliminate risks in women’s health.
Cocoa Pods
Rekindling Connections Amid Spiritual Battles and Heartache
When love morphs into a battlefield, where do we turn for reinforcements? Our latest conversation with Lillian plunges into the heart of marital strife, offering a lifeline of communication strategies and the healing balm of apologies. With empathy and wisdom, this episode peels back the curtain on the intimate dance of knowing your partner's inner storms—from the thunder of anger to the quiet despair of loss. As we uncover the significance of regular check-ins and date nights, Lillian's heartfelt narrative reminds us that reaching out for counseling is an act of bravery, a beacon for those navigating the rocky terrains of togetherness.
Darkness often tries to sneak into the sacred spaces between two people, but we stand vigilant, armed with prayer and forgiveness. Hear the gripping accounts of women who have faced the shadows in their homes and relationships, waging war against more than just the tangible. Our discussion with Lillian reveals the crucial role of identifying these spiritual adversaries and the strength found in accountability and perseverance. Through the power of prayer, she shares how forgiveness began to transform not only her situation but her heart, offering a testament to the tenacity required to reclaim love from the grasp of darkness.
Navigating the intricate web of soul ties and therapy can be as complex as the human heart itself. In this episode, we distinguish the bonds that tie souls together and compare them with the mystical connections of twin flames. Addressing the cultural hesitations toward therapy, especially within the Black community, we discuss how faith can amplify the counseling process, guiding us toward healthier relationships. As Lillian shares her wisdom, she becomes a beacon of hope, encouraging us all to harness the power of partnership and faith on this journey towards relationship fulfillment.
You don't even know how this person act when they're angry. You don't know how they act when they lose money, when they don't have money, when they're dealing with grief. We just know, like I knew oh, he's a good provider. I can't tell you how he acted if someone he lost a family member, or if he doesn't get his way, or things like that.
Dr Sogade:Hello and welcome back to CocoaPods podcast. My name is Dr Bola Sogade, I'm a women's health specialist and I'm your host. We've been talking with Lillian that's her pseudonym and she's been sharing her life experiences, her marital experiences, the difficulties that she's gone through and the triumphs that she's had the triumphs that they have had as a couple. So we continue in these conversations about difficult relationships. In our upcoming episodes, lillian's husband will be sharing his own lived experience with marital conflicts, triumphs and tribulations and successes. So please keep listening to Hukupods podcast. Thank you, lillian. I just want to thank you so very much for coming to Hukupods podcast. You're going to be helping a lot of women by sharing your lived experience and just being honest, truthful. You know telling us everything. I want you to number one, just if you can give me a summary of your life, your married life as of now?
Dr Sogade:and what can women that are either going through a difficult relationship whether we're married or not, but mostly they're married going through a difficult relationship, at the verge of separation or divorce, and or wanting to fight for this relationship, and with and without children? What advice, in summary, would you give them? So, first of all, please summarize your relationship issues so far and advice to our listeners.
Lillian:My relationship issues so far is that we are. We are at a great place. We learn how to talk to each other respectfully. We learn how to have time out, as we call it. It's just we do check-ins.
Dr Sogade:How often do you do the check-in we?
Lillian:do that every night before bed Check-in hey, how are you doing? Is anything? Like you know, let's talk, and then we just talk about our day, we just talk about what, and we give each other affirmations and we just like you know, I like when you did that today, you know, I really appreciate you for helping me out today. We make sure we encourage each other daily, we make sure we show more love and affection than ever and we also just spend time with each other at a place that you know. Fridays is both of our days off. So we make that a date night.
Lillian:Date night is important because I'm not the same person. I was three months ago, a year, three years ago. He's surely not the same man. So we have to get to know the new us. As we say, we date. Dating is always necessary and we just date each other now Cause back then we wouldn't date each other.
Lillian:I was too hateful, mean, holding on to grudges, and he was out in the streets, so we didn't date. So now we date each other and we getting to know each other. You know what he don't, what he likes, what he don't like, and he gets to know me, me personally. It's like up close and personal some that we should have checked off the box before we got married. So many people rushing to marriage now without checking out the box. You know, you don't even know how this person act when they're angry. You don't know how they act when they lose money, when they don't have money, when they dealing with grief. We just know, like I knew, oh, he's a good provider. I can't tell you how he acted, if someone he lost a family member, or if he doesn't get his way or things like that. I just know he provides good, so I didn't check my box off. So now I'm just we're taking step back and just learning to appreciate respect, love each other like we both deserve to be loved, and also we pray more together and with the boys, but more together.
Lillian:So in a constant fight and battle, and even if we get in these spats when we argue with stuff, we never go to bed angry. So what we do is we talk about it Like I need time. I'm angry at you right now. I need time. I didn't like what you do. I need time before we go to bed. We're going to talk about this. We're not going to go a day without talking because to me, not talking build up stuff builds on top of each other, cause you now you want to talk about now. I forgot to talk about that last week. You did this a week before Now it's stuff built on top of each other so it don't happen all the time, but when we do have that time we'll talk and we have those talks. I didn't like the way you did that. Well, I was angry at you because you did this and we always apologize. You know, I didn't know that it makes you feel that way.
Lillian:I also want to encourage counseling to people. My mother age group they didn't believe in counseling. They believe Jesus was the counselor. Age group they didn't believe in counseling. They believe Jesus was the counselor. I'm not saying he's not. I'm saying that outside counseling is needed. It's okay. It's okay. It's okay to also pray to Jesus and go to counseling at the same time, because that's what God appointed them for, that's what he gave them that gift for. Go to a Christian counseling. I would advise go to somebody that been through something. Also, don't go to anyone that doesn't know about marriage, that doesn't know about nothing. Just go to someone that can also give you the tools and also can encourage you to say, hey, you can overcome this, it's going to be okay. Counseling is needed Also. Kids that are listening go to counseling. Parents take the go to counseling. Parents take the kids to counseling.
Lillian:Because I grew up in this toxicity household and I saw mom and dad argue all day and I thought it was normal to do that. When I got married and I did that in front of my kids and as a kid I needed counseling because I carry what I saw onto my marriage and look in there as a result and now I have my kids seeing the same thing. So counseling is needed for the kids. And arguing, no, sometimes we can't help but to argue. Sometimes it comes out. But we have to learn how to control our thoughts and tongue and control our behavior and control our temper. We are grown folks having temper tantrum because we don't like our way or someone did something to us. It's okay to hold it in and say I will talk to you later, not in front of the kids or whatever, because they don't need to see that, because they will mimic what they see. And unfortunately I did that. I mimicked what I saw and I thought that's how marriage supposed to have been, but counseling is needed. Go to counseling. If you how marriage supposed to have been, you know, but counseling is needed. Go to counseling.
Lillian:If you don't want to go together, if your spouse don't want to go with you, go by yourself, because you will find out things about yourself. You'll be like, oh, I didn't even know this about me. Oh, I didn't know I'm this way. I found out in counseling I was a manipulator. I found out I hold grudges and I didn't know. But then I went to speak to my mother about this and she said, oh yeah, I do that too. Didn't know, because that's what I saw. I grew up on what I saw. You know I wanted the ideal huxable family. You know my idea of marriage was the huxables family, not what I saw growing up, but I infiltrated and put that out on my kids, what I saw. And in reality they saw the damage that was done to me and their boys and that's not good because they can grow up men seeing that toxicity, you know, spearing on their wives or whoever, girlfriends and things like that. So counseling is needed.
Lillian:Listen to each other, always listen, communicate, fight, fight, fight, fight.
Lillian:And I would never stop saying fight, fight for each other, fight daily for each other. No, marriage don't supposed to be hard, but sometimes it is hard when you're dealing with a difficult person. You know marriage is not as hard as people think it is. It's a constant fight. But if you're dealing with a stubborn, difficult person and don't forget, if you love God and you believe in God, we're not dealing with this person. We're dealing with spirits that's passed down from generation to generation. That's been in them, that you know stubbornness and all this. You know ego, you know the ego or whatever. You know men supposed to do this and women. These are stuff that you know we're battling with and you think, like this is so hard and they won't give in, keep praying, keep praying, keep fighting. And if you know, if it don't work for you, don't work for you, but it works for some people. And if the fight is in, you, keep fighting, keep fighting the good fight and let it be well with your soul, wow, wow.
Dr Sogade:One thing you talked about gosh. I'm choking because you're just touching on so many things. You talked about something to the effect that if you're a Christian, that this is not just that person that there's a spiritual underlay.
Lillian:Yeah, it's a spiritual battle they're fighting because we're not wrestling against flesh and blood, we're wrestling against principalities. So you got to understand these are spirits that we're fighting. My husband looked at me, that the entities was in my house and I I'm a Christian now but I didn't believe my eyes, what I was believing, and for him to say they coming off of me. I believed him and then those dreams that I was having those entities in my dreams that was telling me I cannot have my husband, I have him. You know, this was the enemy, this is the devil telling me this. Because I woke up, breathing. I will wake up, grabbing, holding the Bible. I wouldn't even wipe the crust out of my eyes because I was so much in prayer for my husband. Because when those dreams start coming, god said all I heard was pray and I was like God, I want to pray for him. What do you mean? Pray for this man, this man, this, this man? And all I heard was pray. So I started praying. So every night I used to send him text messages I forgive you, even if even I, I, did not forgive that man. But it started with just saying I forgive you and by me, keep saying I forgive him. It started making me believe like maybe I really do forgive him, maybe maybe I can forgive him, you know, but I started doing that every night. He never responded to no text messages. He never responded in those dreams kept coming. They're kept coming. So that's why that's how I know, and I'm a true believer, that I was not battling my husband. I was battling spirits and remember I told you about the dreams, about the snakes and everything. It was so many of them and my husband was in so many activities that I didn't even know he was in. And how do you not know? That's your husband? Because I was a homebody, I was naive, I was tending to the kids. I trust him. Even if I knew the truth, I still trusted him because I was tending to the kids. I trust him. Even if I knew the truth, I still trusted him because I was so naive and I was young and I didn't keep up with him. I was the homegirl, he was the club person. So I trusted him and and and I was battling spirits and I remember when I reminded him of stuff he used to say, he said I didn't say that. I was like yes, you did, you're lying to me. He said I don't remember telling you that and they don't remember. Sometimes You're like, oh, they're lying. No, they don't remember because that's not really them. That's not really them.
Lillian:My husband came to me, as crazy as it sounds now, he said he was laying in the bed with the other woman and he said and this is when we got to a good place, we can just talk about what he was doing. You know, he said he was laying in bed with the other woman. He remember dozing off into a sleep and he remember someone was in the car. It looks like a familiar face. And he said but the familiar face told him I got you right where you want to be, this is where you want to be and you're not going nowhere.
Lillian:And he said he knew then it was the enemy and he had to leave. And I was like you're looking at him, crazy, no-transcript. He said that's when I had to make a change in my life, like what am I doing? I need to go back home. You know, he said, but it was a fight, a struggle to come back because of the soul tie, of course, when you have intimacy. That's why God don't let us to have sex before marriage. Because before marriage, because we get you know those intimacies into someone you're getting, you're swapping all that stuff, that fluid and all that that's intimacy, that's all that stuff that God didn't want us to do before we get married. Because this is the consequences you know, the soul ties and all that. But, yeah, you're fighting enemies, you're fighting spirits.
Lillian:And I had to meet him realize early on that the true enemy was the devil. First of all, it was ourselves. So once we acknowledge and took accountability, we also acknowledge that, okay, now we're fighting a spirit, now we find a spirit of lust, now we find a spirit of selfishness. And now, what can we do to overcome that? And once my husband said he realized that in the first step is for recognition. This is what it is. And once you recognize it, the second step is what you're going to do for it. Take accountability, of course, but what are you going to do to make these steps effective, that it would never happen again? And he was taking those proper steps. And once he started taking those proper steps and once he started taking, those proper steps.
Dr Sogade:I started taking those proper steps as learning how to be his wife and just forgiving myself on my part. You know this spirit thing that you talked about. You know I see a lot of women every day and I remember two recounts. Number one a woman told me that you know she. Number one a woman told me that you know she. She wasn't fighting with her husband but he had called and he was angry and the voice sounded like it was different, like a devil's voice, and it was something like I think they were going out of town together and he was like you know something like I called your phone, you didn't pick up. What are you doing to me? I'm so mad. And she was like what?
Dr Sogade:That is not my husband and that he, that voice, sounded so angry. They were not fighting when they left the house and the other woman told me that there was a time they were both on the bed and the husband was. They were both asleep and the husband woke up from sleep and grabbed her and pressed on her eyes with his thumbs and pressed down and she jumped up like what is going on? What is going on? And he was like, oh my God, what am I doing? What am I doing? And I mean, I found that so strange.
Lillian:It's real. I remember when my husband came back to the house and we were sleeping in the bed and I heard knocking at the windows and I jumped up and I said, oh, somebody, you didn't got the people at my house. And I look at the cameras. There was no one there. It was banging Boom boom, boom, boom, boom. And we both jumped up and we looking at the cameras. No one was on the cameras.
Lillian:I remember when we was laying in the bed and we started praying together, he used to like, turn and like he's just hurting him when I was praying with him and he'll fall asleep every time we pray together. He did that for a couple of months and I remember just like looking at him, like you're so, oh my God, you know, but it wasn't him, it was the spirits making him sleepy. They didn't want him to hear the word. They was, you know, blocking his ears so he can receive what God is trying to say to him. And he, you know. And so once he started to fight back, he started to fight back, he started to recognize it and that's when he overcame that.
Dr Sogade:Now let's take a quick break here before we go back to Lillian. She mentioned soul ties. Now let's talk about soul ties. Soul ties represent deep spiritual bonds formed with another individual that go beyond the usual closeness found in relationships. They evoke intense feelings of attachment, making it difficult to envision life without that person. The formation of soul ties is a process that occurs spontaneously and unpredictably. It represents the emergence of an intense bond between two individuals. This connection may arise instantly upon their initial encounter or develop gradually over time. Crucially for a soul tie to materialize, both individuals must mutually sense the profound significance of their relationship.
Dr Sogade:While soul ties and twin flames are frequently conflated, they actually represent distinct kinds of connections. A soul tie denotes a profound and intimate bond that can occur multiple times throughout one's life. Conversely, a twin flame signifies an exceptionally intense relationship, often thought to be orchestrated by a higher power as the complementary half of an individual soul. In other words, a twin flame connection is often described as a deep soul level relationship where both individuals feel an instant and profound sense of recognition and belonging with each other. It's like finding your other half or your perfect match. This connection is believed to be incredibly intense and can involve strong emotions, spiritual growth and personal transformation. Twin flames are thought to complement each other in a unique way and often have a powerful impact on each other's lives.
Dr Sogade:So what are the different kinds of soul ties? Each soul tie is unique, reflecting the individual nature of connections between people. Some categorize soul ties based on distinctive traits and relationship dynamics. These ties can span from romantic to platonic, extending among family members or unrelated individuals, and can vary widely in their healthiness and stability. The four categories of soul ties physical. Number one these ties involve a physical connection often characterized by sexual chemistry. Number two emotional. Emotional ties signify strong feelings of closeness and attachment. Number three mental. Mental ties are rooted in shared interests, intellectual pursuits and a profound sense of kinship. Number four spiritual. Spiritual ties are linked to mutual religious or spiritual beliefs, fostering a deeper connection on a spiritual level. How do soul ties form? Soul ties can emerge suddenly or gradually, representing the manifestation of a profound bond between two individuals. This connection may develop immediately upon meeting or evolve over time. So both parties must feel the depth of the relationship for a soul tie to form.
Dr Sogade:Identifying a soul tie involves recognizing its distinctiveness from other relationships. That is, this relationship is distinctly different from the others. When you encounter a soul tie, you often feel an intense connection and understanding, as if you've been waiting for this person your whole life. There's a profound desire to learn more about them, accompanied by an urgency. Indications of a healthy soul tie encompass feeling energized after spending time together and experiencing a deep sense of security in their presence. You may also find yourself wanting to open up and be vulnerable around them, feeling protective of their well-being and being your authentic self around them. Mutual empathy, respect and a desire to nurture the relationship further characterize a healthy soul tie. Relationship further characterize a healthy soul tie.
Dr Sogade:On the other hand, signs of an unhealthy soul tie may include experiencing separation, anxiety when apart, jealousy towards their other relationships or relying solely on them for emotional support. Other indicators may involve excessively monitoring their activities, feeling drained or judged after interactions and sacrificing personal interests or connections for the sake of the relationship. Unhealthy soul ties resembling codependent or abusive relationships often involve a disproportionate level of emotional attachment and dependency. In such cases, individuals may feel emotionally trapped, finding it challenging to break free from the bond, despite recognizing its detrimental effects. This sense of entrapment can breed feelings of resentment towards the other person or oneself for being unable to disengage from the unhealthy connection. Moreover, staying in such dynamics can inflict significant distress on one's emotional well-being. Individuals may experience heightened levels of anxiety, depression or even trauma symptoms due to the toxic nature of the relationship. These emotional challenges can spill over into other areas of life, impacting personal relationships, work or academic performance and overall satisfaction with life. Furthermore, unhealthy soul ties can impede one's ability to engage in self-care practices effectively. Individuals may neglect their own needs, prioritize the needs of the other person above their own, or even engage in self-destructive behaviors to maintain the connection. This neglect of self-care can make emotional distress worse and hinder the individual's ability to cope with the challenges posed by the unhealthy relationship. Overall, recognizing and addressing the dangers of unhealthy soul ties is crucial for safeguarding one's emotional well-being and promoting healthier relationships and lifestyles. This may involve seeking support from trusted friends, family members or mental health professionals to navigate the process of disentanglement and prioritize self-care and personal growth. And prioritize self-care and personal growth and, as I guess was talking about in a biblical context, soul ties are often interpreted as deep spiritual connections formed between individuals rooted in shared beliefs, values and experiences.
Dr Sogade:While the term quote-unquote soul tie itself is not explicitly mentioned in the Bible. Some believers draw parallels to biblical principles regarding relationships, particularly in the context of marriage, family and spiritual kingship. Many Christians view soul ties as reflective of the interconnectedness of souls, emphasizing the spiritual bond between individuals that goes beyond physical or emotional connections. This perspective is often influenced by passages in the Bible that speak of unity, such as in Genesis 2, verse 24, which describes the union between husband and wife as becoming one flesh, quote unquote.
Dr Sogade:Additionally, some biblical scholars and Christian teachings caution against forming unhealthy soul ties, particularly those rooted in immoral or idolatrous behavior. This perspective draws from biblical admonitions against sexual immorality, as in 1 Corinthians 6, verses 16 to 18. And it warns believers against becoming unequally yoked with unbelievers, and that is in 2 Corinthians 6, 14. Overall, the biblical spiritual connotation of soul ties underscores the importance of cultivating healthy, underscores the importance of cultivating healthy, god-honoring relationships characterized by mutual love, respect and spiritual alignment. It encourages believers to prioritize spiritual discernment and seek guidance from the scripture and prayer in navigating their relationships and connections with others. Yeah, so you know? You know. Thank you so much for talking about therapy, and I know you know in your mothers, because about how old is your mom?
Lillian:Mom is 58.
Dr Sogade:Yeah, I guess then in her time therapy was not a thing as much as it is now. No, so number one do black people go for therapy a lot?
Lillian:Yeah. So you know, when growing up in what I grew up in my community, you know black people did not believe in therapy. Therapy was Jesus and that's just black. And if we have other sisters out there there's other colors and cultures that's just what in our culture and I'm quite sure you probably experiencing your culture as well but in our ethnic group that was not a thing. We always hush, hush or you don't want nobody in your business. You know Jesus is going to make it work. You're not praying hard enough. You're depressed. Go wash dishes, go clean your house. You know this is just things that happen and that systematic thing that we used to, you know, embarked on well, got depressed on and pressed down into us and passed down from generation. It is not true. Go to therapy because younger people now in their 20s, 18s, 30 and younger are in therapy because of mothers in their 58s, you know, and 60, and what they passed down onto their children, because that's what their mother passed down onto them. And now you see a bunch of younger kids in therapy because of this traumatized situation happened or, with their mother, should have went to therapy for, However, they saw what they saw, you know. So therapy is a must.
Lillian:Please, black people, go to therapy. Don't dismiss therapy. Go to therapy. Go to you know your girlfriends is okay, but go to someone that's professional. They can give you tools, it's okay. They're not wanted. They don't want to know your business. They want to help you. They want to help you. They want to guide you. They want to give you the tools to help you in life. So, please, please, go. Don't be scared. If you have the money, go, and there's resources out there. Find the resource. Go to therapy. And if you're married you don't want to go together, go for yourself. And if you can go together, go together. But I also recommend go for yourself, because sometimes you don't want to discuss the things in your marriage together, and sometimes it's. You need to be worked on, you know, because we don't want to blame ourself or take accountability, but it starts with you. Work on yourself first and then work on the marriage.
Lillian:Well thank you very much. Thank you, yeah, yeah. So thank you so much for having us. Thank you, yeah, yeah. So thank you so much for having us and I will want to bring my husband back next time so he can tell his side of the story.
Lillian:So men out there men out there as well as women hear these things coming from a man of why, why and the reasons or what do they think? And it's so much clearer if you want to hear it from a man perspective, of why they do the things they do, cause I know we all have those same. So like why you know, and women is not. You don't blame yourself, don't say oh, you know, it's me, I didn't, don't, it's not you.
Lillian:If you do not want to stay in a broken relationship it could be a job, a marriage, a friendship, whatever it is go. I'm not encouraging nobody to stay, but if you got some fight in you and I'm saying the fight as in, both of you guys are fighting, not just one person, both of you guys are fighting, both of you guys are praying because, like I said, it's not the, it's not that person, it's the enemy. And if you both can come together, because God said, when two become together, he will be in the midst. Let God be in the midst because both of y'all are fighting. Now guess what? God has to step in and the victory will be won and it is all well, and it will be well with you guys' souls. So keep fighting and let you both fight together, and in the end, the battle was already won.
Dr Sogade:Lillian, thank you so very much for coming to CocoaPods podcast. You know we're going to find a way to have you again. Thank you for encouraging women. You know children, families, and you know, thank God, that your marriage, your relationship, is on this. I mean, I look at you, you're a beautiful woman, thank you. You are too, thank you, and this is just a success story and I know you guys keep fighting to work at it, so thank you very much for coming. Thank you, take care.
