Podcasting 2.0, from PodEngine and Google NotebookLM

PodEngine pulled in a bunch of podcasts talking about Podcasting 2.0, and wrote a report on it all.

Kevin Bae put that report into Google's NotebookLM to make a podcast to summarise it.

This is that podcast.

We're sponsored by Buzzsprout. Start Podcasting. Keep Podcasting.

Transcript

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Google voice 1: 0:12

Hey, everyone. Welcome back. Today, we're going to do a deep dive into something that's a well, it's pretty revolutionary for the world of podcasts. We're talking podcasting 2.0.

Google voice 2: 0:23

My casting 2.0.

Google voice 1: 0:24

We've got a ton of sources, articles, interviews, you name it. Oh, cool. And yeah, we're going to break down what this whole movement means for creators, listeners, everyone.

Google voice 2: 0:35

You know, when I first heard the term podcasting 2.0, I have to admit I was a little skeptical.

Google voice 1: 0:40

Really? Yeah.

Google voice 2: 0:41

It sounded kind of. Well, I don't know, like just a bunch of tech jargon, you know?

Google voice 1: 0:46

Right, Right.

Google voice 2: 0:46

But the more I dug into it, the more I realized that it's actually a really big deal. It's not just about fancy new features.

Google voice 1: 0:52

Okay, So if it's not about the tech, what is it about?

Google voice 2: 0:55

It's about well, it's about power shifting the power dynamics in the podcasting world.

Google voice 1: 1:01

Hmm. Interesting. In what way?

Google voice 2: 1:03

Well, it's about giving creators more control over their work, more ways to monetize, more ways to connect with their audience.

Google voice 1: 1:09

And I imagine it's got to have some perks for listeners, too, right?

Google voice 2: 1:12

Oh, absolutely. You know, think of it like this. Remember back in the day when we all had those clunky flip phones?

Google voice 1: 1:18

Oh, yeah. I had that indestructible Nokia.

Google voice 2: 1:20

Right. And then, bam, smartphones hit the scene, changed everything. Exactly. Podcasting 2.0 is kind of like that. It's like taking podcasting from those old flip phones to the smartphone era.

Google voice 1: 1:32

So we're talking like, way more possible.

Google voice 2: 1:34

A whole universe of them. Mm hmm. And just like smartphones gave us tons of cool new features. Podcasting 2.0 has a bunch of its own.

Google voice 1: 1:42

Okay, I'm hooked. Give me some examples. What kind of features are we talking?

Google voice 2: 1:45

All right, well, let's say you're listening to a podcast, and there's this one specific part you absolutely love. You know that one golden nugget of wisdom that you want to go back to later?

Google voice 1: 1:54

Oh, yeah, I know that feeling. And then you spend like 10 minutes trying to scrub through the episode to find it again.

Google voice 2: 1:59

Oh, it's the worst. Well, with podcasting 2.0, we have chapters now.

Google voice 1: 2:04

Chapters like in a book.

Google voice 2: 2:05

Exactly. You can jump straight to different sections of an episode. No more endless scrubbing.

Google voice 1: 2:09

Okay. That alone is worth the price of admission. What else?

Google voice 2: 2:13

All right. How about this? Have you ever wished you could find podcasts on, like, super specific topics, like, so niche that you thought, No way. There's a podcast about this.

Google voice 1: 2:23

Oh, all the time. I'm always on the hunt for those hidden gems.

Google voice 2: 2:26

Well, with podcasting 2.0, we have something called tags. These are like super detailed keywords that help listeners find the exact content they're looking for.

Google voice 1: 2:34

Wow. So it's like a search engine, but just for podcasts?

Google voice 2: 2:37

Pretty much. Yeah.

Google voice 1: 2:38

This is amazing. But let's talk about the elephant in the room. Money creators deserve to get paid for their hard work. How does podcasting 2.0 handle that?

Google voice 2: 2:48

That is a fantastic question, and it leads us to one of the coolest things about this whole movement. Value for value.

Google voice 1: 2:54

Value for value. That sounds intriguing.

Google voice 2: 2:56

It's basically a way for listeners to directly support the creators they love. Like, imagine being able to send a small tip to a podcaster whose work really resonates with you.

Google voice 1: 3:06

Wait, so you can actually pay podcasters directly, like right from your podcast?

Google voice 2: 3:11

You got it. It's called micropayments. Mm hmm. Usually using bitcoin, but it could be any crypto.

Google voice 1: 3:15

No way. So it's not just about relying on ads or sponsors anymore?

Google voice 2: 3:19

Not necessarily with value for value. Creators have a whole new revenue stream and it can really make a difference, especially for independent creators who are just starting out.

Google voice 1: 3:29

Wow. That could be game changing. But what's in it for the listeners? Besides the warm, fuzzy feeling of supporting their faves?

Google voice 2: 3:36

Well, think about it. If creators aren't relying solely on ad revenue, they have more freedom to create the content they're truly passionate about, even if it's niche or experimental, which means more diverse and interesting podcasts for everyone.

Google voice 1: 3:51

Okay, so we're talking more variety, more creativity.

Google voice 2: 3:54

Exactly. It's a win win for both creators and listeners. We even found a source who said they were able to pay for a coffee with earnings from their podcast app.

Google voice 1: 4:02

Whoa. That's a powerful image. Now, we've been talking a lot about this open ecosystem and empowering creators. But what about the big players? You know, the Spotify of the world? Where do they fit into all of this?

Google voice 2: 4:14

That's where things get, well, a little complicated. So the podcasting 2.0 is all about open standards. It's about creating a level playing field where anyone can participate.

Google voice 1: 4:25

Right. A bit like the early days of the Internet, right before the big corporations took over.

Google voice 2: 4:29

You got it. But these big platforms, they have their own way of doing things, their own interest, their own business models.

Google voice 1: 4:36

So it's kind of like podcasting. 2.0 is pushing for this open and decentralized world, and the big guys are maybe a little more hesitant to embrace that fully.

Google voice 2: 4:45

Right. And this tension, this clash of philosophies, it's going to have a huge impact on the future of podcasting.

Google voice 1: 4:52

That makes sense. So what are we looking at here? Is it going to be like David versus Goliath situation?

Google voice 2: 4:57

It very well could be. One of our sources said, look, I'm all for the open advocacy of podcasting 2.0. But I also understand that from a corporate point of view, a company like Spotify couldn't just jump ahead of the curve while waiting for the community to come up with the tags and standards.

Google voice 1: 5:13

So it sounds like there's this kind of push and pull happening like everyone sees the potential of podcasting 2.0, but figuring out how to actually make it work, especially with the big players involved. That's the tricky.

Google voice 2: 5:24

Part. Absolutely. And as listeners, it's important for us to understand these dynamics because ultimately they're going to shape what kind of podcasts we get to listen to in the future.

Google voice 1: 5:33

Totally. So the stakes are pretty high here. But even with all this talk about the open versus closed debate and the big companies, I'm still feeling really optimistic about the potential of podcasting to point out.

Google voice 2: 5:45

Me too. Me too. There's a real sense of excitement and possibility in the air. And the more we understand about it, the more we can all contribute to shaping its future.

Google voice 1: 5:54

Absolutely. And that's what we're all about here, right? Exploring new ideas. Diving deep into the stuff that matters and hopefully helping to create a better future for podcasting.

Google voice 2: 6:03

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Google voice 1: 6:05

It's really cool to see how this whole podcasting 2.0 thing is shaking things up, you know?

Google voice 2: 6:09

Yeah, it's definitely challenging the status quo.

Google voice 1: 6:12

Like it's really pushing for a more, I don't know, a more democratic way of doing things.

Google voice 2: 6:17

Exactly. It's about giving power back to the creators. Yeah, and to the listeners, too.

Google voice 1: 6:22

And that's something I think a lot of people can get behind, right?

Google voice 2: 6:25

Absolutely. But there are definitely some hurdles, some challenges that this movement is going to have to overcome.

Google voice 1: 6:32

Oh, yeah, for sure. Like what?

Google voice 2: 6:34

Well, I think one of the biggest challenges is simply awareness.

Google voice 1: 6:37

Awareness?

Google voice 2: 6:38

Yeah. A lot of people just don't even know about podcasting 2.0 yet.

Google voice 1: 6:41

That's true. It's still kind of under the radar, isn't it?

Google voice 2: 6:44

It is. And even for those who have heard about it, there's often this like, hesitation.

Google voice 1: 6:49

Hesitation? Like, what do you mean?

Google voice 2: 6:51

Well, you know, some people might think, okay, this all sounds great, but is it complicated? Right.

Google voice 1: 6:55

Right.

Google voice 2: 6:56

Like, do I need to be some kind of tech wizard to figure this out?

Google voice 1: 6:58

I think that's a valid concern. I mean, not everyone's comfortable with all the technical stuff.

Google voice 2: 7:02

Exactly. And that's something the podcasting 2.0 community is really aware of.

Google voice 1: 7:06

So what are they doing about it?

Google voice 2: 7:08

Well, they're working hard to make it as user friendly as possible.

Google voice 1: 7:11

That's good to hear.

Google voice 2: 7:12

Yeah. One of our sources actually said we need to make podcasting 2.0 understandable and easy on the front end, just like YouTube. Hide the wallets, don't make it front and center. That's the only way to win.

Google voice 1: 7:24

Mm hmm. Hide the wallets. I like that. It's like, make it so simple that anyone can use it without having to understand all the complicated stuff behind the scenes.

Google voice 2: 7:32

Exactly. But making it user friendly, that's just one piece of the puzzle. All right, what else? Another big challenge is getting buy in from those big platforms we were talking about earlier, the.

Google voice 1: 7:41

Spotify, the Apple Podcasts, all those guys.

Google voice 2: 7:44

Right. And, well, convincing them to embrace the whole open ecosystem thing. It's not always.

Google voice 1: 7:50

Easy because they have their own priorities, their own way of doing things.

Google voice 2: 7:53

Exactly. It's like you know, trying to turn a giant ship around. It takes time and a lot of effort.

Google voice 1: 7:58

And sometimes those big ships, they don't want to change course.

Google voice 2: 8:01

That's true. But I'm still hopeful.

Google voice 1: 8:03

Hopeful. But what makes you optimistic?

Google voice 2: 8:06

Well, we are seeing some progress. More and more podcasting apps and hosting platforms are starting to incorporate those podcasting 2.0 features.

Google voice 1: 8:15

Oh, really? Like what?

Google voice 2: 8:17

Well, there's a bunch of cool apps out there like Fountain Pod Verse, Cast, Illmatic. They're all built around this idea of an open podcasting ecosystem.

Google voice 1: 8:26

Hmm. I've heard of some of those. So just by switching to a different app, listeners can actually experience those podcasting 2.0 features.

Google voice 2: 8:34

Yep. That's one way to do it.

Google voice 1: 8:35

Like what kind of features are we talking about here? Well, a.

Google voice 2: 8:37

Lot of these apps have something called Boost two grams.

Google voice 1: 8:40

Boost two grams. Okay, that's a new one.

Google voice 2: 8:42

Yeah, it's really cool. It's basically a way to send a little tip like a micropayment to a podcast episode that you really enjoyed.

Google voice 1: 8:48

Oh, I see. So it's kind of like giving a virtual high five.

Google voice 2: 8:51

Exactly. It's a way to show your appreciation and support directly to the creator.

Google voice 1: 8:56

Okay. I can definitely see the appeal of that.

Google voice 2: 8:58

And a lot of these apps also have better chapter support and transcripts.

Google voice 1: 9:01

So all those things we were talking about earlier.

Google voice 2: 9:03

Yup. All designed to make the listening experience better and more interactive.

Google voice 1: 9:07

This is really cool. Now for creators who want to get on board with this whole podcasting 2.0 thing. What do they need to do?

Google voice 2: 9:14

Well, the first step is to check their hosting.

Google voice 1: 9:17

Platform to see if it supports those new features.

Google voice 2: 9:19

Exactly. A lot of platforms are starting to integrate stuff like chapter markers and support for booster grabs.

Google voice 1: 9:25

So creators don't necessarily have to like, completely overhaul their setup to start using those features.

Google voice 2: 9:31

Not necessarily. And the cool thing about podcasting 2.0 is that it's constantly evolving.

Google voice 1: 9:36

So it's getting easier and easier for people to jump on board.

Google voice 2: 9:39

Exactly. More creators, more platforms, more listeners. It's all growing together.

Google voice 1: 9:44

This is so exciting. But, you know, whenever there's new technology, there's always a risk of, I don't know, unintended consequences. Oh, for.

Google voice 2: 9:52

Sure. It's important to be aware of those potential downsides, too.

Google voice 1: 9:55

Like, what kind of things should we be thinking about?

Google voice 2: 9:57

Well, one concern that often comes up is the complexity issue.

Google voice 1: 10:01

Right. We talked about that earlier. Not everyone's a tech wiz.

Google voice 2: 10:03

Exactly. And there's a risk that podcasting 2.0 could end up excluding those who aren't as tech savvy.

Google voice 1: 10:10

Yeah, we don't want to create this digital divide where some people have access to all the cool new stuff and others get left behind.

Google voice 2: 10:18

Absolutely. And that's something that the podcasting 2.0 community needs to be really mindful of. You know, make sure things are accessible to everyone, regardless of their technical skills.

Google voice 1: 10:27

It's like we need to make sure that this whole movement doesn't become this exclusive club.

Google voice 2: 10:32

It should be open and welcoming to everyone.

Google voice 1: 10:34

Are there any other potential downsides that we should be aware of?

Google voice 2: 10:39

Well, another concern is that this whole emphasis on micropayments and direct monetization, it could lead to a more fragmented podcasting landscape.

Google voice 1: 10:47

Fragmented? What do you.

Google voice 2: 10:49

Mean? Well, imagine a scenario where listeners have to subscribe to like a dozen different micropayment channels just to support all their favorite shows.

Google voice 1: 10:58

Oh, I see what you mean.

Google voice 2: 10:59

You could get really confusing an overwhelming.

Google voice 1: 11:01

Yeah. And who wants to juggle like a million different apps and services just to listen to podcasts?

Google voice 2: 11:06

Exactly. And it could also disadvantage those smaller independent podcasts because.

Google voice 1: 11:10

They might get lost in the shuffle.

Google voice 2: 11:12

Right. So it's like a double edged sword.

Google voice 1: 11:14

On the one hand, you have this potential for creators to earn more money directly from their listeners.

Google voice 2: 11:21

But on the other hand, you have this risk of creating a more complex and maybe less accessible listening experience.

Google voice 1: 11:27

It's a balancing act, for sure.

Google voice 2: 11:29

It is, and it highlights the need for careful consideration as this whole podcasting 2.0 thing continues to develop.

Google voice 1: 11:35

Yeah, it's like we need to find that sweet spot where everyone benefits both creators and listeners.

Google voice 2: 11:41

Absolutely. And that's going to require open communication and collaboration from everyone involved.

Google voice 1: 11:46

Yeah, it's not just about the technology. It's about building a better future for podcasting as a whole.

Google voice 2: 11:51

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Google voice 1: 11:53

Man, it's wild to think how much the podcasting world could change.

Google voice 2: 11:57

You know, it really is. I mean, we've covered a lot of ground here.

Google voice 1: 11:59

Yeah, like we talked about the philosophy behind it, the tech, even some of the potential problems, right?

Google voice 2: 12:05

Exactly. But I think it's important to remember, you know, like why this whole podcasting 2.0 thing is even happening, right?

Google voice 1: 12:12

Like, what's driving this movement?

Google voice 2: 12:14

Yeah, It's easy to get caught up in all the detail, the.

Google voice 1: 12:16

Tech stuff, the debates.

Google voice 2: 12:18

Exactly. But at the end of the day, podcasting 2.0 is about something bigger.

Google voice 1: 12:23

Okay, so what is it about? At its core.

Google voice 2: 12:27

It's about creating a better future for podcasting, for both creators and listeners.

Google voice 1: 12:32

Hmm. Yeah, I can get behind that. So as we're wrapping up this deep dive, what are some of the key takeaways?

Google voice 2: 12:39

Well, first of all, I think it's important to remember that podcasting 2.0 is not like a finished product. You know, it's still evolving. Exactly. It's a movement. Yeah. And what it looks like today might be totally different from what it looks like in a few years.

Google voice 1: 12:52

So it's like we're all kind of figuring it out as we go, right?

Google voice 2: 12:55

And we all have a role to play in shaping its future.

Google voice 1: 12:57

Oh, yeah, for sure. Like, what can listeners do? Well, for.

Google voice 2: 13:01

Starters, just be aware of it. You know, explore those new podcasting apps, support creators who are embracing podcasting to point out.

Google voice 1: 13:08

Yeah, vote with your ears.

Google voice 2: 13:09

Right, Exactly. And don't be afraid to, like, dive in and experiment.

Google voice 1: 13:13

Yeah. Try new things, see what works.

Google voice 2: 13:15

Totally. It's like a big experiment, and we're all part of it.

Google voice 1: 13:18

Cool. But before we get too carried away with all the exciting stuff, let's talk about those concerns we brought up earlier.

Google voice 2: 13:24

Oh, yeah. Those are important, too.

Google voice 1: 13:26

Like what are some things we need to be mindful of as this whole thing keeps developing?

Google voice 2: 13:31

Well, I think one of the biggest things is making sure it's accessible to everyone, right?

Google voice 1: 13:35

Regardless of their technical skills.

Google voice 2: 13:37

Yeah, exactly. We don't want it to become like this exclusive club, you know?

Google voice 1: 13:41

No, it should be open to everyone.

Google voice 2: 13:42

And another thing is, you know, finding that balance between direct monetization and keeping the listening experience simple.

Google voice 1: 13:51

Right. Because we don't want it to become too fragmented where you have to jump between a million different apps.

Google voice 2: 13:56

Right, Exactly. It's all about finding that sweet spot.

Google voice 1: 13:59

Yeah. Where creators can get paid fairly, but listeners don't feel overwhelmed.

Google voice 2: 14:03

It's a balancing act, for sure.

Google voice 1: 14:05

It is. But I think if we all keep those things in mind, you know, those potential challenges, we can really make this whole podcasting 2.0 thing work.

Google voice 2: 14:13

I agree. And I think the key is communication. Like, we need to keep talking about it, sharing ideas, figuring out solutions together.

Google voice 1: 14:21

Yeah, it's a collaborative effort.

Google voice 2: 14:23

Absolutely. So as we wrap up, is there like one main thing you want to leave our listeners with?

Google voice 1: 14:28

Yeah, Good question. Hmm. I guess it would be to, you know, just keep an open mind. Don't be afraid to explore the possibilities of podcasting 2.0.

Google voice 2: 14:38

I like that. Embrace the change, you know?

Google voice 1: 14:40

Exactly. Because who knows? This could be the start of something truly amazing.

Google voice 2: 14:44

It could be.

Google voice 1: 14:46

Well, that's about all the time we have for today. Thanks for joining us on this deep dive into podcasting 2.0. We hope you learn something new and maybe even got a little inspired. Until next time, keep exploring, keep listening, and most importantly, keep podcasting.

Google voice 2: 14:59

See ya.