Wellness In Every Season

Episode 142: 9 Keys to Deep Vitality

• Autumn Carter/ Deborah Zucker • Season 1 • Episode 142

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What if vitality isn’t another checklist, but a way of moving through life that feels like sunlight finally breaking through morning fog? In this episode, Autumn sits down with Dr. Deborah Zucker—naturopathic physician, mental health counselor, health coach, and award-winning author of The Vitality Map—to explore the 9 Keys to Deep Vitality and how they can help you return to yourself when burnout, confusion, or chronic stress have pulled you off course.

Deborah shares the story behind Vital Medicine and the healing journey that shaped her work, then walks us through core practices like honoring your one precious life, facing and integrating shadow parts, strengthening self-awareness, cultivating resilience, aligning with your authentic yes (and courageous no), experimenting with playful curiosity, discovering easeful discipline, inviting support and connection, and ultimately living like you matter. Together, we talk about nervous system regulation, the difference between externally driven goals and inner alignment, and the quiet power of pruning your life so energy can flow back into what actually bears fruit.

If this conversation resonates, you can find Deborah at vitalmedicine.com and follow her on social at @deborahzucker. She’s offering podcast listeners a free 9 Keys worksheet plus a limited 15% discount on her programs—see the episode notes for the special page. You can also explore The Vitality Map and its new companion, The Vitality Journal.


For more wellness tips and exclusive content, join my newsletter! Sign up now at https://wellness-in-every-season.kit.com/5-days-to-mastering-mornings-and-evenings receive a free 5-day guide called "Awaken and Unwind: 5 Days to Mastering Life's Mornings and Evenings."

Episode 142: 9 Keys to Vitality

[00:00:00] Introduction to Wellness In Every Season

[00:00:00] Autumn Carter: This is episode 142. We are going to be talking about vitality, so let's dig in together.

[00:00:10] Welcome to Wellness In Every Season, the podcast where we explore the rich tapestry of wellness in all of its forms. I'm your host, autumn Carter, a certified life coach, turn wellness coach, as well as a certified parenting coach dedicated to empowering others to rediscover their identity in their current season of life.

[00:00:29] My goal is to help you thrive, both as an individual and as a parent.

[00:00:33] Today I have with me Deborah Zucker from Vital Medicine and she is talking about the steps to vitality and we're gonna be talking about her own journey and she has quite a journey to get here.

[00:00:47] She is a doctor, so it'll be very interesting to see how this all plays together. I've been interviewing a lot of doctors lately and it's very interesting to hear about. The burnout, the health [00:01:00] challenges related to that. So I'm very excited. Thank you so much for being on and for talking about something that is near and dear to my heart.

[00:01:10] Vitality, wellness. It all goes together, so thank you. 

[00:01:14] Meet Dr. Deborah Zucker: A Journey to Vitality

[00:01:22] Autumn Carter: And can we get started by giving listeners a background of who you are? Give that authority so they wanna listen to you, that they're paying attention. 

[00:01:22] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. Thanks so much, autumn, for having me here. Hi everyone. I am Dr. Debra Zucker. I am a naturopathic physician, a therapist, coach, and author, and I live in Bellingham, Washington with my husband and almost 5-year-old daughter.

[00:01:37] Just to give a little background of how I've ended up here talking to you all, I'm 50 now and in my early twenties I spiral down into a deep chronic fatigue and depression and lots of other symptoms that journey of healing. Has informed my life since then. It, began as a very physical orientation of trying to figure [00:02:00] out, get, diagnoses, what's going on, and then dropped into more of a mental emotional exploration.

[00:02:05] I was really feeling like the answers I was getting from the doctors didn't feel like they were really speaking to. The depth of what I was actually experiencing. Then that dropped into a deeper, more spiritual journey. The intersection of all of those led me to a calling in my life to become a doctor, to become a therapist and coach.

[00:02:29] My own healing journey has paralleled all those trainings that I've had. It's been. A process of self-discovery, of exploring what am I learning for myself that really has had the biggest impacts on my own vitality and wellbeing, and what am I seeing is really missing from the conversation.

[00:02:50] What's missing from the trainings that I've had? What's missing in the bigger conversation around health and wellness? That has guided my own [00:03:00] business, vital Medicine, all the programs that I offer and the books that I've written. 

[00:03:05] Autumn Carter: I almost interrupted and said, that's all you do. I know. That's it. It's such a small amount. Wow. You do a lot of different things. Yeah, and what I love about everybody that I've had on my podcast has had some kind of journey, and it's while they're healing themselves, that they turn around and heal other people, which I think is so cool. And if you guys have not seen a picture of her or are not watching through YouTube, you need to look at her.

[00:03:33] I'm, I look older than she does, and she's older than me. So that should right there tell you when you're living the right lifestyle for you is how I really should say it. And you feel in alignment and you're really taking care of yourself. You have that youthful glow. And it makes a huge difference.

[00:03:55] So you said, this is where it sounds like this is a [00:04:00] cumulation of decades of experience for you. This book that is coming out and that's what we're going to be talking about today. It's amazing. There's so many times where you hear about people who are overnight successes, and I'm saying this in quotes, if you're not watching.

[00:04:20] Because it really is a lifetime of experience that has led to this moment where people are now noticing. And that's very much for you. 

[00:04:31] The Nine Keys to Deep Vitality

[00:04:31] Autumn Carter: Let's go ahead and dive in to your nine keys here and what are they, and give us that, that little behind the curtains view from what your book is going to be talking about.

[00:04:47] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. The nine Keys to Deep Vitality, so I actually, I have two books. One that came out in 2016, the Vitality Map, and that goes into depth into My Journey and the nine Keys and the journeys of [00:05:00] various clients that I've worked with over the years. That's the, fuller, more comprehensive orientation to these nine keys that I'll introduce.

[00:05:09] What I have coming out in September is The Vitality Journal, which is a companion book to that which allows a very personal deep dive with prompts and practices to get right into your own journey with the nine. So these nine keys came, like I said, from my own journey. Distilling out what are the missing pieces like, and I really look at these as the foundational place, the deeper orientation to our relationship with ourself and how we guide and care for our own wellbeing.

[00:05:42] Key 1: Honoring Your Unique Life

[00:05:42] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: And it starts with key number one, honoring your unique life. And this key is really about. Being in direct relationship with our own mortality, with the preciousness of life, like waking up to realizing like [00:06:00] none of us have any idea how many days, weeks, years we have left in this body. And to shift our orientation of care for ourself to that remembrance, that recognition that.

[00:06:14] Wow. Like I have the opportunity to be alive in this body in this lifetime, and I want to really take ownership of that and steward this body in being as best I'm able for this life. 'cause no one here but me is here to do that. And, to bring that into more of a front and center awareness to our everyday living,

[00:06:39] whether it's a loved one dies, or we have a near death experience or in an accident and everything goes flashing before us. And we remember how precious it all is. And how much our life matters. And then that might stay [00:07:00] present for us for a couple weeks or a month, and then it drops away again.

[00:07:04] And so this key is about how do we really bring that back every single day to remember and to have root, our relationship with self-care there. And that can take a deeper foundational shift to live from that place. 

[00:07:20] Autumn Carter: Us a sample of what we can add to our daily practice to help us get there?

[00:07:25] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. I had a practice years ago that each and every day I would ask myself the question, if I were to die today, would I feel complete? And it just that question just brought it right there yeah, I could die today.

[00:07:44] And, what it evoked for me was. As a remembrance oh, I don't wanna wait. I don't wanna wait to tell the people. I love them. I don't want to put off the things that matter most. I don't want to just be going through the motions of life. I wanna really [00:08:00] be here and be present. So that's just, that's one example.

[00:08:05] And there's lots of other meditation practices and things that we can do, but simply put a post-it note on your bathroom mirror that you see when you wake up. Hey, this is my one precious life. Just whatever it is that helps to spark that remembrance, but have it be front and center and, really cultivate that awareness.

[00:08:29] Autumn Carter: Yeah, it's not totally what you're saying, but it's reminding me of my braces that if you're watching, you get to see. I did not need it for superficial reasons. I did it because my molars, so you'd never see it. I was smiling, but my molars in the back were caved in on one side.

[00:08:45] I plan on having these teeth for the rest of my life and I plan on living for a very long time and I wanna be able to chew from all sides of my mouth so I can afford this now. I'm taking care of this now. And it's also affording it time-wise with four [00:09:00] kids, right? Where I now have a little more of that time where I could be going regularly to the orthodontist.

[00:09:07] But it was that idea too of, okay, my intention is to live. As close to 100 as possible. I don't think I wanna get over that threshold. I wanna be mentally here for my whole life. Yeah. So what do I need to do for that? And then you never mentioned it, but just the word using unique is, it's my life and it should be aligned to what lights me up and feels right for me.

[00:09:34] It's not my child's life. It's not this person who I am looking at with the fear of missing out or any of those ways that we. Minimize ourselves, or we control our children. So that really came to mind for me. And when I have asked my question, do I feel complete? I never do because I wanna help more [00:10:00] people.

[00:10:00] I wanna reach more people. So it's that, okay, I need to be doing more for this. So I really like that. What's next? 

[00:10:08] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. There's so much more I could say about what you just said too,

[00:10:11] Autumn Carter: for it. 

[00:10:15] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Just, quickly about the uniqueness, 'cause I didn't mention that. So that really is an acknowledgement that there's never been or will ever be another you or me to really recognize you're not here by accident.

[00:10:27] You are an expression of life that matters. And we'll circle back to that with key number nine, but, 

[00:10:30] Autumn Carter: that, I like that because. For me, it was when I was 21 and I'm very good at organizing and I was around somebody else who's even better, and that was my identity at that time.

[00:10:40] Like one of my identities, we always have several going on, so it was, wait, I'm not as unique anymore. So I like that because we do come across people that think of ourselves as that Venn diagram with the things that we're good at or interests, everything else, how they overlap. If we come across somebody else who has a very similar Venn [00:11:00] diagram of who they are, it's remembering that we are still unique.

[00:11:04] We are not exactly like them. So I really like that, especially if we've grown up in a family where you're always told, you're exactly like this person. No you're not. 

[00:11:14] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: No, no, one. We're all unique. 

[00:11:18] Key 2: Facing and Embracing Your Shadows

[00:11:18] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: So key number two just to keep moving on is facing and embracing your shadows.

[00:11:24] And this one I have it as key number two 'cause it's absolutely essential and it's missing from the conversation so often. So if you have had in your journey of self care a feeling of, shame or self-judgment because it just seems like you keep tripping yourself up or you have all these intentions and you just can't actually manifest them or catalyze them or make them happen, or you only last a few days and then you stop.

[00:11:55] Just those kinds of patterns, the sabotage, the judgment. [00:12:00] It comes from our shadows, and what I mean by shadows are parts of ourselves that are not fully conscious. So they're living in our unconscious, but they're running the show and they're born from. Traumas, woundings, what was modeled for us, even intergenerationally, that things get passed onto us and we're operating from them and not even realizing that we're operating from them.

[00:12:28] And so having the courage, 'cause it does take courage to turn towards these parts to get some support and learn how to see. And then lovingly and with kindness, embrace and integrate those parts of ourselves that have been disowned, that have been shoved down into the deep, dark basement that we haven't wanted to see about ourselves or really acknowledge and own them as part of our humanity, as part of who we are

[00:12:58] the mix and the [00:13:00] complexity of being human. And, when we do that, it frees us up to actually be able to move forward with the intentions, with the desires and visions we have for ourselves. And it's not like you do it and then you're done. This is a lifelong practice of getting to know those parts and, weaving them in.

[00:13:23] I cannot emphasize enough like how essential and powerful that is. And I'm so grateful that these days there's more and more talk about this and more and more resources, whether it's with a therapist, with a coach, like a lot of people are getting trained to do parts work, to begin to integrate these parts that are unconscious.

[00:13:49] Autumn Carter: I. Reached a plateau in my own healing journey. Yeah. I was doing EMDR with a therapist and I was just not getting further, and [00:14:00] I became friends with somebody who is a somatics coach and she took me on and all of those walls that were up, they were gone. It made a huge difference.

[00:14:11] I'm a huge advocate for because of it. And now I use that with my clients I sprinkle it in. A little bit. It makes a huge difference. 

[00:14:19] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. 

[00:14:20] Autumn Carter: Yeah. 

[00:14:21] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. So that's a little taste of key two. There's a lot more to it, but yeah. 

[00:14:25] Key 3: Strengthening Your Self-Awareness Muscles

[00:14:25] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Just to give a more of an overview today key number three is strengthening your self-awareness muscles.

[00:14:34] And you know this, you know all of what I'm talking about feel like it belongs in the category of basic life skills that most of us were never taught. Things that weren't modeled for us, that weren't normalized. And this one, to me feels like that, that we didn't grow up. Most of us learning to become more aware of the feedback that's in our body and being all the time

[00:14:59] that's pointing [00:15:00] towards what brings us alive, what brings us more vitality, how to thrive and what does not. And so it's like a language we haven't learned. And so this key is about learning that language, becoming more curious and intimate with what's actually going on and through. Experimentation through just a deeper listening and wondering and curiosity.

[00:15:27] We can come to feel more empowered and, really own that. Each of us is our own best health guide because no one else is living in this body and being 24 7, like we're the ones, and yes, we need to seek out professional support and guidance and expertise, but we're the ones who have the data to provide, like we're the ones who are living with this.

[00:15:53] And we can then filter the guidance we receive from others through our own self knowing as we cultivate and [00:16:00] strengthen the self-awareness. Like when we haven't really developed that self-awareness, we might get into a pattern of feeling really tired during the day, and so we interpret that feedback, oh, I need to do something to boost my energy.

[00:16:16] So we drink caffeine. And then we get in this cycle of needing the caffeine to get through the day, not realizing that our sleep is really disrupted because we're sensitive to caffeine. That's just like one example. But when we really hone that awareness, we can get more to the root of what's going on and discern that for ourselves so that we can guide ourselves towards our thriving with more skillfulness and self knowing.

[00:16:49] Autumn Carter: I like that there are so many different ways that we perpetuate that cycle, 

[00:16:55] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. So many ways, and again, it's like a language we haven't learned, so we [00:17:00] just do what we've been taught. We take a painkiller for, a headache, not realizing that there's something that we've been doing to contribute to that headache that we, if we bring awareness to it, we can shift that, behavior or that pattern.

[00:17:17] Autumn Carter: That's very western way of thinking of let's not look at the root cause, but we're just gonna quickly cover that up. Bandaid. 

[00:17:28] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. Keep going. I love it. 

[00:17:31] Key 4: Cultivating Resilience

[00:17:31] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: So key four is cultivating resilience. And this one first I just wanna acknowledge what resilience is and why it's so important.

[00:17:44] There is no such thing as a stress-free or predictable life, like just the nature of life is that it's constantly changing. Like we may get our act together and feel like, oh, we've dialed it in, like we're doing really well, we're feeling really [00:18:00] live, and then something happens in our life and it's like the rug gets pulled out from underneath us and we fall flat on our face.

[00:18:07] And that's just life, right? That's just gonna keep happening. So to let go of any ideal or myth that we're gonna get to some point where that's no longer gonna happen. That's not the case. Like life is just like that. And so resilience is developing the capacity to move with life in that way. To move with the stress, to find our way back to center, find our way back to a more vital, alive place in the midst of whatever's going on in life.

[00:18:39] And that I feel like that's, especially, it's more and more true today with just things amping up and getting seeming crazier and crazier in the world we're living in. Stress. It's an overwhelm. It's just there. So how do we regulate ourselves? How do we learn the skills to bring our nervous system back to a calmer, [00:19:00] grounded place?

[00:19:01] How do we learn the skills to nourish our bodies with what actually is a good fit for this unique body and being, how do we learn, what the best types of movement or alignment or practitioners to seek out is for us. It's not about creating a long to-do list of all the things we're supposed to learn or do, but fundamentally it's about really taking that self-awareness that we've been cultivating and taking ownership of being in charge.

[00:19:32] Okay, like I wanna learn more capacities and skills to be able to guide myself. To be able to find my feet again when the rug gets pulled out, to calm myself in the midst of chaos I think being able to regulate our nervous system is one of the most important skills of resilience that I think there is.

[00:19:53] And there's so many things that we can do that are really simple and weave them throughout the day. It doesn't need to [00:20:00] be like carving out a big chunk of time to set aside to deal and attend to these things. The key is finding the things that work for us throughout our full lives.

[00:20:11] Autumn Carter: For me, I've been thinking a lot about how there times where this thing works and times where that thing just does not work to fit my, need to feel balanced and in alignment, sometimes meditation is amazing. But when I have too much going on in my head, that's not what I need.

[00:20:30] What I need is a body scan or different things. So I really like what you're talking about, finding where you feel calmly alive, and how it can look different and how. When we are taking care of ourselves, we can more easily go with the flow and things change because that is the thing in life.

[00:20:51] Things change. We're all evolving, we're all changing our outlook on life. We're growing, developing, [00:21:00] aging. So things are constantly in that motion. And when we're taking care of ourselves, we can better go with the motion. 

[00:21:08] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Our lives are not static. Our world is not static. 

[00:21:11] Autumn Carter: That would not be a show I'd watch. 

[00:21:13] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: No. Yeah. And, like you said, things might work really well for, a certain time in our life, or even last week, it might work well and this week it might not and so just, yeah, really not getting stuck and thinking things need to look a certain way and opening up to that resilience of flexibility and adaptability.

[00:21:36] Autumn Carter: Yeah, we've all had people in our lives, family members in particular, 'cause we tend to be closer with them where they are just stuck and this is the way it is, this is the way you have to behave around me, everything else. It's like a bur in the gears. It just doesn't flow well, it doesn't move well, however you'd say it.

[00:21:56] Those cogs don't. Move correctly is I think the best [00:22:00] way to say that. And when we're not remembering that we're allowed to grow and change and so is somebody else. That makes a big difference either direction, whether you're doing it or not doing it. 

[00:22:12] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. Aligning with the nature of life. 

[00:22:16] Autumn Carter: Okay. 

[00:22:16] Key 5: Aligning with Your Yes

[00:22:16] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Aligning with your Yes. 

[00:22:19] Autumn Carter: Ooh. 

[00:22:19] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. And this one was, really huge for me in my own healing journey. And, again, just was one of those missing pieces that I discovered, like none of the practitioners I was going to was really bringing attention to how vital it is that my life energy.

[00:22:38] Was really being invested where I was getting returns and, this, I see this all the time and it's like right now even epidemic of depression, anxiety. And I think this piece is, can be a big part of that for folks where yeah, just our lives, if we're not devoting our lives. To what is actually [00:23:00] truly aligned for our unique self.

[00:23:03] Then it's like we're pouring our life energy down a hole in a bucket and we're losing it. Whereas if we actually align with what really brings us alive it's, like we get to fill our own well as we're serving, as we're giving our energy, as we're devoting ourself to what we're attending to in our lives and.

[00:23:25] And this goes to the little things every day and to the big pursuits, the big investments in our life. And, and right there with the yes is the no. Aligning with your Yes is also about really being clear about your authentic nos. And I like to, bring forward the analogy of pruning for this.

[00:23:50] If you, think of a fruit tree, if you never pruned it, it wouldn't produce fruit and it would put all its energy into these sucker branches that go straight [00:24:00] up and don't produce any fruit. But they can get really big and tall and same for us, if we don't prune our own life. If we don't have the courage to do the little snips or the bigger cuts and our life energy is going out into these branches that it's not actually producing any fruit, it's not allowing us to flourish and thrive.

[00:24:23] Yeah. Then our tree it's not gonna be thriving. Pruning. Yeah. Saying no. Finding that authentic. No. Along with your authentic, yes, absolutely Vital for, our wellbeing. 

[00:24:40] Autumn Carter: That made me think about how many times we are just so busy, but we're not doing the things that actually matter to us.

[00:24:47] Yeah. Right there and then I've been on this. Soapbox myself recently and in my personal life, just [00:25:00] really thinking about it before I really present it to my audience, but how much taking care of ourselves helps increase our wealth. Yeah. What are your thoughts related to our are, how we feel about money and money in our bank account versus how we're taking care of ourselves?

[00:25:22] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Money 

[00:25:23] Autumn Carter: part. 

[00:25:24] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. I choose one. 

[00:25:26] Autumn Carter: I don't care. 

[00:25:27] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah I guess what comes up for me first and foremost, I'll speak to the money part in a sec, but just it, brings me back to what we talked about with key number one, like this is your one life.

[00:25:43] This is a precious life. Have the courage, get the support to really align with what brings you alive. Live the life you're here to live. And to me, like the money side of it it's like that's [00:26:00] an energy expression. If we're really aligned with who we're here to be and we're saying yes part of that Yes is saying yes, that we receive the supports.

[00:26:14] The material things we need to really shine and be alive. That's part of thriving in life is that we receive what we need to be able to be the fullest self that we're here to be. And that's not about a certain number money wise. Wealth looks very different for different people.

[00:26:35] But it is about saying yes to living your fullest life and having that material and wealth support to allow for that. 

[00:26:48] Autumn Carter: I've coached people, I've had family members that are so busy chasing that dollar that they're not taking care of themself. And it's [00:27:00] easy to forget when we're younger or when we're so stressed out.

[00:27:02] We're not thinking, we have those blinders on that when we aren't taking care of ourselves. We are taking out a debt against our own health. And eventually we're gonna fall flat on our face or flat on our back in bed. And we really need to take care of ourselves so that we can get out there, be aligned, and when we are living our purpose, especially if it's our calling related to a vocation.

[00:27:31] Sometimes it's a side hustle that turns into. A full-time thing or the, main paying thing. When that happens, that money comes more easily. We are taking care of our health at the same time as gaining more money. So that's one thing that I was thinking about and it sounds like that's what happened for you.

[00:27:51] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. Thank you for expressing it like that. 

[00:27:53] Flipping the Focus: Internal Alignment

[00:27:53] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: And it's flipping it around, it's I think in our culture there can be such a focus on the external and getting, and you need to work in a certain way to get, but actually if you flip it around and come from starting here inside of what's really aligned, what brings us alive and.

[00:28:18] Working from that place. Then it's like they both get to grow together and burnout, depression, anxiety, chronic fatigue. Those are just rampant these days because there is this sort of externalization of going after something without, having it really be rooted in that own commitment to our wellbeing.

[00:28:42] To be filling our well as we go. 

[00:28:44] Autumn Carter: Yeah. 

[00:28:45] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. So 

[00:28:46] Autumn Carter: next? 

[00:28:47] Key Six: Experimenting with Playful Curiosity

[00:28:47] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Key six is experimenting with playful curiosity. 

[00:28:51] Autumn Carter: Ooh, I like this one. 

[00:28:52] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. I love, 

[00:28:53] Autumn Carter: sign me up. 

[00:28:54] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: See, that response often when I say this one it's almost like I can visually see like the [00:29:00] burden being lifted, the weight being coming off and, a little playfulness or giggle.

[00:29:05] 'cause yeah this one is about. Taking the seriousness out of health and self-care, taking the burden away, taking the rule book out 'cause I think part of what can happen that keeps people stuck is that they think it needs to look a certain way and, they have the long list of all the things that they're supposed to be doing to take care of themselves, which creates this sense of burden and then ignites.

[00:29:30] Those parts of ourselves that can get really mean, critical self judgmental yeah, they're not doing it right. You're not doing it well enough, and the shame that goes along with that. So this key, again, it gets back to what we were talking about a bit before of the nature of life of constantly changing and being dynamic and that we're all evolving as we grow.

[00:29:59] This [00:30:00] key aligns with that by saying, let's experiment. Let's learn as we go. Let's try things out, see what happens and, then steer from there. So we learn from it. So we create an experiment for a couple of weeks, doing yoga every morning. Right after you get up do some sun salutations, do something as part of the rhythm.

[00:30:27] So you set this intention, you set some parameters around it, and you try it out for two weeks, and then you notice like, how do I feel when I do that? How do I feel when I don't do that? How did that fit into the flow of my day? Was I able to do it every day or not? What got in the way, and then you learn from it, and then you do your next experiment. So rather than thinking like, you have this goal and you need to stick with it and that's it. It gets very narrow and black and white. The goal becomes flexible and adaptable and dynamic. [00:31:00] We get to learn as we go and have fun with it.

[00:31:02] So also part of creating the experiments is be fun. Have fun, get playful. Do something new and different that you've never done before. Mix together different kinds of nourishment. I, like to think of okay, can I get three different kinds of nourishment in one experiment?

[00:31:21] Going for a walk with a friend every week. So I get nature nourishment, I get social nourishment, I get movement, nourishment, all in one. And oftentimes with those kinds of forms of experiments, the buy-in is much bigger and it's much easier to sustain. 

[00:31:41] Autumn Carter: I love when things are stacked like that.

[00:31:43] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. 

[00:31:44] Autumn Carter: It always lights me up when I find a way to do that. And that makes me think about how. For me, part of my self-care, I really thrive on having a network, which is why podcasting is perfect for me. 

[00:31:56] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. 

[00:31:56] Autumn Carter: But tomorrow, for instance, we are doing [00:32:00] Ladies Night Out. I co-host it once a month and we are going on a scavenger hunt around our city.

[00:32:06] We are learning our city more and the downtown area has the coolest vibe ever.

[00:32:11] So it's going to be downtown. There will be food involved, which food is totally my love language. Yeah. And I get to be around other women, get to meet other women. A friend of mine who co-hosts with me, she always invites a variety of people, which is. Super fun. I wanna be like her when I grow up.

[00:32:29] She's younger than me, I think, or a year older. I can't even remember. But anyway, just that idea of I'm increasing my social network, I'm moving, I get to try a random fun dessert while I am downtown 'cause they have tons of fun food and I'm getting to know the city that I love more, deepen my roots there.

[00:32:51] So that's exactly what you're saying. And it makes the child in me very happy. And I don't spend enough [00:33:00] time. My coach has even called me out on this. I don't spend enough time listening to my inner child or my inner teenager enough. Adult a little too hard in my life. So the child in me is very happy.

[00:33:13] The teenager who likes the connection with friends is also happy. So it's totally a win for me. 

[00:33:18] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: That's part of the language of playful in, this key is how essential it is for us as adults to play.

[00:33:27] And we forget that culturally it's programmed out of us, but it's, so important to our state of vitality that we play. And what that looks like for all of us is different. But 

[00:33:38] Autumn Carter: yeah, maybe that's a reminder. The kids get the summer, which, whew, that drains me with my kids at home. But that gives them the chance to play.

[00:33:48] So maybe I should be doing the same. And how much time do I need for that to put into my schedule? And maybe that needs to be a little bit more non-negotiable than it is. So that's [00:34:00] that self-reflection question that I'm gonna be asking myself. But I'm pretty sure some of you need that too. Yes. Enjoying together.

[00:34:06] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Think again. It's another thing that's pretty rampant. Key Seven connects in with Key Six. 

[00:34:12] Key Seven: Discovering Easeful Discipline

[00:34:23] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: So key seven is discovering easeful discipline. And just noticing when I say that so often the word discipline, can't you say useful. Easeful. So bringing ease.

[00:34:25] Autumn Carter: Together. 

[00:34:26] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. So that's purposeful because it is very possible. So many of us have a relationship with discipline that's about. Being strict. Like even when, I say the word you might notice, like discipline, can cause a tightening up and a bracing.

[00:34:42] Getting yourself ready for something that's gonna be really hard and that strict inner parent voice can really get triggered. Or the self judgmental or mean parts of ourselves can get really loud with discipline and some of us react to that in a rebellious way.

[00:34:58] And some of us react to that of like, [00:35:00] all right, I'm gonna do it. But it's a very stressful doing it. So easeful discipline, discovering, easeful discipline is about being in that same playful, curious, experimental place, but adding in some clear commitment, some intelligent strategy.

[00:35:19] And structures of support. So being like, it's like coming from that place that we talked about before of like really having our own back, like really being there for ourselves and doing what it takes to create the changes that we seek in our lives. And we do need discipline because habit change takes a while.

[00:35:39] And the beginning of habit changes often has a transitional period that's uncomfortable. If you think of starting to exercise after. Do you haven't for a few weeks or longer? It's there's that uncomfortable time or the detox that happens when we stop taking in a substance or a food that's really not doing well for our body.[00:36:00] 

[00:36:00] There's that transition time that's uncomfortable. So the DI discipline is what keeps us in the process moving forward. When it's in that, transitional time, it be useful. So it's looking at, part of what trips us up often is we, have these intentions and we jump into creating these changes, but we haven't really looked at the realities of our life and grounded what we're doing in those realities in an honest, clear way.

[00:36:29] And so we have these obstacles show up that get in the way. It's like the yoga in the morning example. Oh, sounds really good, but we have a little one at home who needs us to help them brush teeth and hair and get dressed and so that time in the day actually isn't very realistic 'cause they're wanting our attention while we're trying to do yoga.

[00:36:50] It's looking at it as rather than obstacles that there's other real needs. That need our attention. And so shifting that orientation of [00:37:00] oh, like how can I attend to these needs and come up with, a solution that works for everything? And support is absolutely vital.

[00:37:10] Having reminders for ourselves, having relational support, which we'll talk about next, setting ourselves up where it's blocked out in our calendars. There's different ways that we can structure it into our lives that is supported rather than just trying to will ourselves into making a change happen.

[00:37:31] Autumn Carter: What I've noticed for me and for people I've coached is there is so much, what is even the right wording? It's about falling off the wagon and getting back up is what really makes that change permanent.

[00:37:47] And it is remembering that you need to fail and then have that grit to get back and oftentimes fail a few times. And then you're, [00:38:00] okay, I've got this, I understand where I need to be. I understand how this needs to be. And that goes really well with what you're saying about yoga is deciding, okay, do I need to wake up earlier than my child?

[00:38:13] If it's a newborn, maybe it needs to be during their nap schedule that ends up being all over the place. Where do I need to fit this in? When does it work for me? Maybe I need to be going to bed earlier. So I really like what you're talking about here about, yeah. Taking that time to be intentional to check in.

[00:38:32] Okay, what needs, and staying curious instead of judgmental, what needs to change. Okay, let me try this change and see if that works for now. And going back to a past key is realizing what works now isn't going to work in the future, so you're gonna need to adjust again. 

[00:38:48] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. What you're, speaking to is the learning as we go, like really letting go of even the idea of, succeeding or failing.

[00:38:58] It's simply we're learning as we [00:39:00] go and not expecting that we're gonna set something up and all of a sudden it's gonna be there for the rest of our lives. It's gonna be a flow. There might be a lot of bumps at the beginning as we sort out,

[00:39:11] how it works best for us at this time. And then things are gonna change and maybe that solution or practice doesn't work for us anymore. 

[00:39:19] Autumn Carter: Or we don't need it at that time because the kid's all grown up. 

[00:39:22] Key Eight: Inviting Support and Connection

[00:39:22] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Key number eight is inviting support and connection.

[00:39:26] And this one, it's key number eight, but it's actually the embrace that holds all of it. It's absolutely, essential because. As humans, we are relational creatures. We're just wired to thrive through connection and support. We're not meant to be on these journeys alone. We're not meant to feel isolated.

[00:39:50] So much of the shame and self-judgment that can happen in our journey of, guiding ourselves. In our vitality and wellbeing comes [00:40:00] from that isolation. So when we find the practitioners to relate to one-on-one, or we find the communities healing groups to come into, and we're able to be vulnerable and feel safe together and share the journeys and the ups and downs and what we're learning, it's like it catalyzes things at a level that.

[00:40:20] Just doesn't happen. Can rarely happens on our own. So just really wanna emphasize this key that yeah, if you're not already finding some relational support for yourself in your journey and particularly your self-care journey, please reach out and, find that.

[00:40:39] I work primarily with women and I'm a huge proponent, of coming together in circle and being in groups. I, love the one-on-one work too, but it just feels like just touches into this primal place and I just see, the changes and the self-actualization happen at a level [00:41:00] that's hard to compare.

[00:41:02] So just wonderful. 

[00:41:03] Autumn Carter: I think for anybody who's disagreeing with what you're saying and that it's important to remember that if you haven't had trauma, it's really easy to connect with people and if you have a hard time connecting with other people, it sounds like there's probably some trauma going on if you find that you're safer when you're alone, so you'd rather be alone.

[00:41:25] What do you need to do to help heal that area of yourself so you can feel secure enough? Because one of the, what I feel like the biggest contributor is to aging, especially premature aging, is not having those social connections. And we very much live in a time where we are very connected with phones and everything else.

[00:41:52] But we're not connected with people. And yes I'm, getting some of my needs met connection wise, talking to Deborah right here. But it's not the [00:42:00] same as if we were in the same room talking to each other. So really think about that and if you are thinking of anybody else who needs to hear this, now is a great time to share and remember that you're not supposed to do this alone.

[00:42:15] Just like Deborah saying 

[00:42:15] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I appreciate you bringing in the trauma lens too and just acknowledgement. Yeah. That it's not easy and it can take a lot of courage. And the other thing I wanna share around that is discernment. So absolutely essential when we're leaning in for relational support, that we have discernment that it's the right connection or connections for us because, yeah if we're not listening to that inner voice that's letting us know if this is a, feels like a safe space or a safe person or not, then we could find ourselves actually entering into more trauma. So just really [00:43:00] yeah, trust yourself, trust your inner knowing. Have the courage to say no if it's not the right fit and trust that the right fit is out there.

[00:43:08] Again, whether it's one-on-one or group, or. 

[00:43:11] Key Nine: Living Like You Matter

[00:43:11] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: So the final key, we're up to the final key, key number nine is living like you matter and Oh, 

[00:43:18] Autumn Carter: I like that. 

[00:43:19] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah, this to me just brings it all full circle. So recognizing, again, our uniqueness that none of us are here by accident. Each of us matters in this web of humanity.

[00:43:33] To live that way means prioritizing our own self care and wellbeing. Recognizing that we're not serving anyone if we're getting burned out, if we're depleting ourself in our work or service in the world, or how we're tending as a parent or grandparent or whatever it is, we're engaged with that.

[00:43:53] We need to prioritize filling our own well. Starting with ourself that [00:44:00] we matter. And that is what allows us to continue to show up in all of the love and care and service and work we're engaging with in the world. That's the foundation and absolutely essential. And yeah, to not put the needs of others before our own.

[00:44:20] For that reason we won't be able to be there for others if we're not attending ourself. 

[00:44:26] Autumn Carter: And I know there's so many women that bristle with what you just said.

[00:44:32] But what I've noticed is when I am taking better care of myself, I'm a better parent. 

[00:44:40] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes, 

[00:44:40] Autumn Carter: And my husband's even had to stand up for me because I started waking up earlier so I could have this time for myself to do my Miracle Morning routine.

[00:44:49] And then my two oldest decided to wake up 30 minutes earlier. That's fine. But then they started bothering me during my time. [00:45:00] So they were getting offended that I was getting upset and my husband finally had to, okay, let me put it this way. Different perspective, different person telling you after me complaining to him about it and him being like no, I know how much you need that. It makes it, I notice when I'm yelling more. It's 'cause I'm dysregulated and I need to do that. Check-in with myself. What's going on here? And women, oh, we are so hard on ourselves and we have society telling us that we need to be all these things and have a superhero cap while we're at it and be wearing high heels and makeup.

[00:45:38] Yeah. And the thing is, if we are taking care of ourselves, our children see it. They know that they need to also be taking care of themselves. 

[00:45:49] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. 

[00:45:50] Autumn Carter: I wonder what it's like to be a grandparent and see your children making the same mistake of sacrificing everybody [00:46:00] else. Yeah. And now it's a different lens because you can see that you're not the one in the thick of it.

[00:46:05] That must be so heartbreaking to see. They're doing exactly what I did. So it's one way to put it, but not in a guilt lens of I'm doing this for them as well. 

[00:46:17] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. Which, is, what I was naming before, of these basic life skills that most of us were never taught. So if we are learning them for ourselves and putting that into action, if we're truly prioritizing our own wellbeing and having boundaries that we matter to.

[00:46:35] Our children or others in our lives get to see that. So it's like we're modeling it and we're also, like you said, caring for ourselves to give ourselves that foundation of energy and vitality and wellbeing that then shines out in the world with whoever it is we're engaging with and supporting and touching

[00:46:55] and that matters. That expression of our vitality matters [00:47:00] in the web of life. Regardless of what your life circumstances are or who you engage with or where you're located, to trust that there's no accident you're here. Each of us matters. And we don't often know the ripples that we're having in the world and the impact we're having, but the more vital we are the more we shine out and the more those, ripples really can have a positive impact in our world.

[00:47:24] And I would say a world in need of that. 

[00:47:28] Autumn Carter: And I love how you talked about how it can be important to reach out to a therapist, a life coach. A friend who's, done it the way that looks right to you to get advice and to make it your own. Because we are the sum of the eight people that we spend the most time with.

[00:47:51] So if you don't have those people, you can find somebody who works in that. And that's when you [00:48:00] find a coach, that's when you find a therapist and they can help hold you accountable. They can help ask the right questions. And because they're not your friend, they won't give you the BS answers.

[00:48:15] So I really like how you added that part into. Yeah. Is there anything else as we start to wrap up? 

[00:48:25] Wrapping Up: Final Thoughts and Resources

[00:48:25] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: That, completes an overview of the nine keys. Like I said I have the new companion book coming out, so if you found these nine keys to be helpful for you there's the original book, the Vitality Map audio book as well as paperback or ebook.

[00:48:44] And then the companion book is a journal that you can just write into. With different prompts and questions that will just engage you right away with what's true for you in your life. What might need to be uncovered or explored to allow [00:49:00] these principles to really land and begin to manifest, and how you're moving through your days and how you're.

[00:49:08] Creating that foundation of really having your own back and, supporting your own wellbeing as, number one priority of how you move through life. 

[00:49:19] Autumn Carter: I love that. And the link to it is in the description and it should be out right now or coming out within next week, right? Yeah. Timing wise.

[00:49:29] So pick up a copy, give it to friends, share this episode with other people because. She is doing this to reach more people and to help heal, which my type of person right there. 

[00:49:45] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yes. And I also just wanna acknowledge too, and this will, be in the show notes that I created a landing page just for podcast listeners that offers a free download

[00:49:55] of a worksheet for the nine keys and a 15% [00:50:00] discount on any of my, programs and offerings. So if you're curious to explore it, go to that page as well. 

[00:50:06] Autumn Carter: Perfect. Thank you so much. And for those who don't wanna look at the description, tell us where to find you.

[00:50:13] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Yeah. I'm at vital medicine.com. You can just go to my web pitch. 

[00:50:17] Autumn Carter: Thank you so much for being on and for sharing all of this with us today. 

[00:50:21] Deborah Zucker- Vital Medicine: Thank you, autumn. Yeah. I really enjoyed our conversation. 

[00:50:25] Autumn Carter: Thanks for tuning into this week's episode. I am your host, autumn Carter, a certified life coach dedicated to empowering individuals to rediscover their identity, find balance, miss chaos, strengthen relationships, and pursue their dreams. My goal is to help people thrive in every aspect of their lives. I hope today's discussion inspired you and offered valuable insights.

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[00:51:30] So please spread the word about our podcast and about our newsletter. Thank you for being a part of our podcast community. I look forward to continuing our conversation, sharing stories and exploring wellness in all of this aspects. Take care until our next episode. You can also work with me one-on-one or on demand through one of my programs by visiting wellness in every season.com/programs.

[00:51:57] One last thing to cover the show legally, [00:52:00] I'm a certified life coach giving general advice, so think of this, this more as a self-help book. This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. I am not a licensed therapist, so this podcast shouldn't be taken as a replacement for professional guidance from a doctor or therapist.

[00:52:18] If you want personal one-on-one coaching from a certified life and parenting coach, go to my website, wellness and every season.com. That's where you can get personalized coaching from me for you. See you in next week's episode.