STEAM Spark - Think STEAM Careers, Podcast with Dr. Olufade

Journey of a Late Bloomer: Innovative Approaches to Diversity and Mentorship in Tech & STEM Fields – PART TWO

• Dr. Ayo Olufade • Season 2 • Episode 6

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What are the real barriers to diversity and inclusion in STEM, and how can mentorship make a difference? This episode features an enlightening conversation with our expert guest, who reveals the indispensable role of female mentors in guiding women through the unique challenges they face in STEM careers. We dissect the current landscape for BIPOC individuals in STEM, discussing male dominance and the financial incentives that these fields offer. Yet, with the recent ban on affirmative action, minorities face even more significant barriers to accessing opportunities and resources. Our guest posits that tackling socioeconomic disparities and bolstering early education programs could be key strategies in creating a more inclusive STEM environment.

Educators hold the keys to a technology-driven future, and we shine a spotlight on how they can inspire the next generation of girls in STEM. By integrating cutting-edge tools like ChatGPT, Gemini, DALL-E 3, and Canva into their lessons, teachers can craft engaging, personalized learning experiences that showcase the real-world applications of technology. Collaboration across different disciplines is essential to creating a holistic learning experience that connects technology with critical areas like healthcare, the environment, and social justice. These efforts can help students see themselves as vital participants in the tech space, ready to thrive in an increasingly digital world. Join us for this compelling discussion on the transformative power of diversity and inclusion initiatives in STEM.

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Dr. Olufade:

To me. I think that, as a woman, definitely you will not have a problem finding a woman mentor to mentor you. Am I wrong? It depends, because there's some time.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

It depends on the field that individual is in, because if she's in something that's very demanding when I was overseeing all the science labs that I had a very demanding schedule, so it was very difficult for me to do that. However, I was able to carve out that time because that's something that was important to me. So it really depends. So if you have someone who's doing research, they may not be the mentor for you. And another thing is you need to find out what the expectations are of that mentor, and then the mentor needs to give you an idea of what she can commit to. You have to. It's almost like you have to interview your mentor as well.

Dr. Olufade:

Wow, wow, wow, wow, wow. That's very good point right there Finding a mentor. That is extremely important. So will you prefer a male mentor or female mentor?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

for females I think that I think a female mentor is better for a female.

Dr. Olufade:

I do because.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I think that the experiences are different. I don't think that the males experience the same thing that a female does.

Dr. Olufade:

Okay, I'm going to move on to the next question. What is the current representation of the BIPOC in STEM education and career and how does it compare to previous years? You seem like I'm going in circles, but I guess I want to put a little number, if possible. Yeah.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Yeah, so when I researched, I found that approximately 65%, but those are males and approximately 35%, and those are basically minorities. Okay, so it's still male dominated. And another thing people need to know about these fields that they're more lucrative. You can make more money, you can make a better living for yourself and it really challenges your mind. Look, that can help you down the line with something like Alzheimer's or something if you keep your mind sharp. Seriously, I just can't emphasize it enough. I do the best I can with trying to inform people of the benefits of being in a field that you can only do with.

Dr. Olufade:

I like the fact that you said it because it goes back with my, with one of the things that got me started. When I was doing my thesis, I discovered that the median salary for someone doing engineering was about $80,000 a year. I felt that, okay, minorities leaving money on the table by not pursuing STEAM and STEM careers, and that goes to what you're saying. There's a lot of money to be made, and why not?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Yeah, we're doing other things right. And that's what I say too, and that's why I tell my students. I understand you want to go into something service oriented, like you had mentioned earlier. However, you can also help your community, as well as yourself and your family, if you make more money, and that's the bottom line. I said, if you want to travel, you want to make sure you can pay your bills. This is the field to go in, so I definitely tell them that as well.

Dr. Olufade:

Absolutely yes. Look, you can still do the Soviet Oriental work if you want, but do it in the STEM field. You can find something that you can do it with and if you want to help your family members, like you have said, do it in the STEM field. We all know that our members in our community, our parents, are aging right, our relatives are aging Guess what. We need to take care of them, or we need to be informed, have the knowledge to know what to do so that the quality of health can really increase. This is a really rich, and we can keep talking and talking, but we have other things that we need to do. So you've talked about the gaps. There's still gaps. So what are the challenges that we're still facing?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Definitely access, because now, with the, we don't have the affirmative action anymore. Therefore, you're going to have situations where students, especially minorities, are not going to get into those schools who have the resources and who could actually cultivate that skill set so that they can be productive or, in that particular, in the field, a STEM field. So that's a huge thing, the fact that they're not going to have that access. And also, I would say again, the exposure, because if you have, you don't have the funding and you can't provide them with an authentic experience, then again they're not really getting a real feel of what it's like to be in a STEM field. So I definitely think the main one is access.

Dr. Olufade:

I'm glad that you mentioned affirmative action. How has the recent ban of affirmative action impact effort to promote diversity and inclusion in the STEM education and careers?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Yeah, access. And the thing is, I think, that how they can remedy that is to look at socioeconomic background. If you start saying, okay, this is a student that's disadvantaged financially, and not look at race as a factor, that may be a way that they could possibly remedy that situation, but there's going to have to be an overhaul or something. And then another thing is we're going to have to provide programs to help prepare students so that they can get into these other schools, and that has to start early on. If we can do that in K-12, like I said, through the testing, teaching them how to do the test so that they can be competitive, and still, you know. So the fact is that it's gone, okay, we don't have it, so we have to look at ways to make it where they can get into those schools to make it where they can get into those schools.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, I'm really passionate about this affirmative action and DEI. I'm sorry To me. I think I benefited being an immigrant to this country. Absolutely, I benefited from the affirmative action. I benefited from the civil rights right.

Dr. Olufade:

I benefited from, I'll say even, diversity. And here is also, I think that people should not be ashamed of saying that they benefit, because, look, yesterday we just celebrated Juneteenth. Juneteenth took place about 100, I did the the math, I think, approximately 159 years ago now. If you look around the world, we can still find people that are 120 years old. Yeah, so the point that I'm saying I'm making is that 159 years is not long ago, it's not now, when you look at slavery was over about at least about 400 years, 400 years.

Dr. Olufade:

So I always like to allow. I liken this to let's say, if you're on the race field, you have a competitor, then you say to your competitor I want you to start running, maybe about 50 yards. After you've reached 50 yards, then I'm going to what?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I'm coming after you. I hear you.

Dr. Olufade:

Imagine that gap. We know that the marginalized community are marginalized. It's not that they're not capable. They can't do phenomenal things. Look at the astronauts that we have. So if we can do phenomenal things and we know that the marginalized community are already behind because of man-made factors that is generational why don't we encourage programs that can help in making sure you close these economical gaps that exist? I can't contain my emotion on that and I just feel that doesn't help. Yeah, it doesn't.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Yeah, you're right, it doesn't help anything, and I don't know. I think they're going to have to find a way. Even maybe some of these colleges can have a program to some type of outreach to help prepare the students. That's the way around it as well, so.

Dr. Olufade:

I don't know.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

It's a difficult thing.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, so what roles do diversity, equity, inclusion play in addressing systemic inequality Can you talk about, if you can, so that they can see what we see, please?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I don't think it's working. I don't think it's working. I think that when we had the situation with Black Lives Matter and everything, I think that they were trying to make an effort to change that, but I think that the fact that there's systemic racism, I just don't think that it's easy to change that. I think there was an attempt, but it failed. I've seen a lot of people who have taken on roles to be that person to make that change and they've quit the job because they weren't able to implement anything to make that change and they've quit the job because they weren't able to implement anything to make that change. So I don't think it has been effective at all.

Dr. Olufade:

Wow. Why is that so?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Because of yeah, because of the system, the way the system is already set up. When you look at the system, you can't just easily take or eradicate systemic racism. It's not going to happen overnight, and I think that's the barrier and that's why it hasn't worked. Because the thing is, everybody was like, okay, yeah, let's go ahead and make this change and try to have more diversity. But I think when they came up with the concept, they didn't know how to actually make it happen. And then when they thought about okay, wait a minute, that's going to change our whole structure you know what I'm saying and so it just didn't work, yeah.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, so I'm going to change the subject. I'm going to go to the role of men and women in inspiring girls. We have to look towards the young generation. What has happened to our generation has happened, but now we have to look towards the young generation. What has happened to our generation has happened, but now we have to think about the younger generation so that we can utilize the experience that we have to guide the younger generation coming, so that there is more participation, more representation. So how can we collectively encourage both genders to both actively, to actively inspire and support girls to pursue a career in technology and STEM and STEAM?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I think we have to recognize that everybody has a perspective that can be of value at the table. I definitely think by us collaborating, because, think about it, you have some of these males who are probably in STEM and they probably have daughters, and I'm sure those are probably the ones that will be advocating for women. But I think it's really. It comes down to respecting each other's perspective and understanding that we all bring something to the table. You know, because I've been at those tables and I let my opinion be known and regardless of what, you don't know what people were thinking. However, another thing is a female has to know that she belongs at that table yeah so yeah, that's, that can be a challenge, sometimes like a self-esteem exactly imposter syndrome.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, that somehow the women have to find a way to overcome. At least maybe true mentors. Other older women needs to find a way to encourage and to mentor the younger ones that you belong on the table and it's also nice if you do have a mentor to that.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Sometimes they bring you into those meetings so you can see what it's like, so you can get that opportunity to sit in there and learn. I've had opportunities to sit at tables or be in rooms where I would not have normally been in I guess really invited and I sat there and I listened and I learned. So those opportunities, that's great.

Dr. Olufade:

I like that point. I like that point very much. So you just talked about a strategy, so that's a strategy. Like that point. I like that point very much. So what's? So? You just talked about a strategy, so that's a strategy. I was because I was going to ask you what strategy have you found effective? And you just talked about it bringing younger generation to the meeting.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Absolutely. Yeah, see, and I also had the opportunity when I was a lab manager. I had an opportunity to actually hire students that would never have an opportunity to work in a lab. They had no idea what it was like, so I was able to bring in students that were Latino, that, of course, that students that look like me, and that gave them an opportunity to build their resume. So I was in a great position at that time where I did my best to make sure that they were able to build their resume by having that experience and I taught them as much as I could possibly teach them.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, I like that. I like that You're doing your part. It would be nice if we see more and don't feel like, don't be shy about it. Exactly, exactly, very important. I want to go to educators' role in demonstrating technology's impact. I know we talked about the importance of educators and counselors in schools. As educators, how can we effectively demonstrate to girls the practical application and benefit of technology in various aspects of our lives, of technology in various aspects of our lives.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

First of all, you have to use it yourself. You have to use it yourself and I really can't see how anybody's getting by without implementing some type of technology in their classroom. I just can't see. As a matter of fact, I'm teaching an integrated science course this semester, in the fall, and this is for students who are pursuing education K-12 education so my focus is going to be on technology, even though there's other stuff that's intertwined with it, but the foundation is going to be technology. I'm going to teach them how to use ChatGPT, gemini, as well as Dally 3 to create their lesson plan, so also using Canva. So I'm doing just a segment on that to familiarize them with the technology that's available to them. That's going to make their life easier.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I really believe that you have to use it. You can't just tell people about it. You should be using it yourself and, to be honest with you, most people are using technology. Think about your cell phone. That's technology. I mean you can get access to google and you can look up anything so that's, and that's what I do there you go and I use.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I use technology in all of my courses, as a matter of fact, also in my cell biology and genetics course this semester. Everything is going to be tech-based. When they come in, they have to do the attendance on their cell phone. Their exams are going to be face-to-face, but they're going to be done via technology. Okay, even now, when I don't collect hard copies of papers and stuff, it's submitted through a Dropbox, so everything. So you have to implement it yourself, okay, and that's going to force them to actually use it.

Dr. Olufade:

Absolutely. I totally agree with you a hundred percent. So can Sal send out a survey on LinkedIn? I guess it's based on what Bill Gates wrote. And then the question is do you think AI has been a game changer? Ai has been a game changer.

Dr. Olufade:

So I was going through people's comments and I was a little bit confused and a little bit disturbed by people making a comment about how bad AI is in education. It doesn't allow people, it will not allow students to think, and they made all kinds of comments. And with any innovation, there's always going to be people that are going to take advantage of it or people that are not going to apply themselves. But it doesn't mean that it is not an effective or a game changer or a good thing. It is a good thing. If you're so much concerned, there has to be a data that supports that concern. If they're really concerned, then there needs to be training, professional development.

Dr. Olufade:

We teach as students. We adapt because we do this all the time. But application in education is a good thing. You said it so beautifully. One of the advantages of AI is that it really augments our capacity to do things. Say, for example, taking attendance grading paper. You can personalize the teaching. You can collaborate across board. We are already using it anyway. It is important that we incorporate all of that technology, ai in our education. By us doing that, then the students will see us as a role model. Then they will automatically do it too. And, by the way, they spend so much time on their cell phone 24-7 anyways.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Exactly, absolutely. I like what you mentioned about the personalization, because that's exactly what I do when it comes to my PowerPoints, because it's important to me that I show images of people of color in my PowerPoints, so I actually even people who have physical challenges and disabilities I have them represented in there PowerPoints, so I actually even people with who have physical challenges and disabilities I have them represented in there as well. So it gives me a chance to actually put out there what I want them to see and that shows them that they actually belong. So, yeah, that I love doing the PowerPoints and creating images, because those images actually bring my text to life. That's exactly what those images do for me by using ai.

Dr. Olufade:

I love it, I love it, I love it, I love. One of the things that I think I like is that you model it by you modeling, then they will to be inspired. But they can see you do it and then they can. Then they feel like I can do that Absolutely and then they will do it. But we can't just sit back and expect them to do it. That's right, or even effectively. Show them how to do it effectively, exactly, and guess what they will adapt.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

You have no choice. You don't have a choice. I'm going to be honest with you. You really don't have a choice.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, so, coming to the end of our conversation, how can educators across different fields collaborate to create interdisciplinary learning experience that showcase the intersection of technology with other domains, such as healthcare, environment and social justice?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

You definitely you're going to have to see you can't work as an island anymore, Because even in my environment I collaborate with various areas. And to me, because you'd be surprised how they are actually connected, Even though I may even like when I teach three different courses, I'm able to make that connection between the three courses. And it may be on different levels, it may be in layers Okay, this one may get a lower level, but this one in the middle, and then, when it comes to anatomy and physiology, you get a higher level. But I love the fact that I can actually integrate all of that together. But I also work with colleagues that are in different areas.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

So we actually make a concerted effort to see how we can make those connections so that when that student especially when we have students that are coming in, they're like dual enrollment. So we want to know, okay, how can we connect their English with science so that they can see that it's really connected. So you have to reach across those lines to disciplines that are not related to yours and then actually collaborate and find out how you can make those connections and it can be done. And, to be honest with you, if you're looking for grants and stuff. That's what they want to see. They want to see that you're collaborating across disciplines and you have a better chance of getting that grant, of course, if it's written correctly.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, I like that. I like that. One of the things that I'm walking towards is trying to make connection between what I do in my classroom and food, because I'm into food. I don't know if you've seen some of the videos. I'm into books. I'm into books too right, I've written two books, a children's book, but let's talk about the food. I think that there is a great connection between chemistry and food. I always tell my students when I was teaching chemistry and I teach biology Next year, by the way, I'll be teaching biomedical science all right, biomedical science, biomedical engineering, engineering.

Dr. Olufade:

I think that's what nice yeah, so, um, so I always tell my students in chemistry I said, look, chemistry is like you being in your kitchen. It's all about recipe, right? You measure this, a little bit of that, a little bit of this, and everything has to be at least close to precise, right? You have your balance, right, you have to. You have. Usually you use cup, but we use test tube with beakers, right? How is that different from what kitchen? Make that connection. The students would get it, they will get it. The other way is in regards to books, writing books. I know you've written some books, if I'm not mistaken. You want to talk about your book?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Actually, what I'm working on is actually it's a textbook. Okay, it's a textbook, yeah, so it's a cell biology and genetics textbook and the whole idea around that was to have more representation in it and things that were relatable to people of color. So I'm actually still working on it, but it's an e-book and basically it can be used as a supplemental textbook or it can actually be used as a textbook as a whole.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, excellent. There is a connection again. There are a lot of ways that we all can make that connection to make learning STEM much easier. As you said, our students are not one size fits all right, so they come with different way of looking at things, different modality of learning too. We, as educators, have to consider different modality of learning, and experience and perspective is very important. Culture is very important, so I really appreciate your thoughts on that. So, as we come to the end of our enlightening conversation, I want to ask you one final question that will leave our listeners with lasting impression what do you envision, or how do you envision the future of STEM and STEAM, education and career, particularly regarding our community, regarding diversity, regarding equity, regarding inclusion?

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

I have to say that I definitely think that we are going to have more students that are pursuing STEM careers. I really do believe that because we have seen some improvement, but now we're seeing people individuals that are in the field coming up with more programs because they want to make a difference. So the more people you have that are creating these programs and allowing students to participate and have this exposure, then you're going to see more people going into those fields and I really believe that a lot of these people are doing some great work. Like I said, I'm working with someone and he is doing some fantastic work, and as long as we continue to be involved and create these programs, I think we're going to move the needle even more. So I really feel very positive about it. Things don't happen overnight. It takes time, but I really believe that the future looks a lot brighter. Definitely looks a lot brighter Because another thing is people. Now I'm talking about students and youth. Now they are becoming more aware that these careers exist, and that makes a difference.

Dr. Olufade:

Yeah, thank you so much, dr Glandis Delancey-Bolden. I really appreciate your time with us today.

Dr. Delancey-Bolding:

Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. I enjoyed the conversation.

Dr. Olufade:

It's really my pleasure. Please don't be a stranger. I would like for you to come back again and we can talk about anything you want to talk about Now for our audience. Thank you so much for watching us. I would like to put in a pitch for my own self. Remember I've written two books and one of them is Adina's Magical Pearls. Please go and buy this book Now.

Dr. Olufade:

This book is a story about a young lady. Let me put it this way I often say that Africa also has Cinderella story. Right, we all know about Cinderella story. There's been cartoons and movies about Cinderella. But Africa has a Cinderella story. This story it's similar to that, but with a different perspective. It's about a young girl whose mother passed away and her father remarried, and he remarried and she inherited not only a stepmother but three stepsisters, but they were not nice to her. But you have to read the story to really appreciate the story of her life and how it can be particularly relevant to you and your children. But the story teaches you something about patience and forgiveness and also it highlights the importance that everybody has a destiny, even though sometimes your destiny may not start the way you want it. But you never know what's ahead. Things change. It's a story about hope. It's a story about transformation. It's a story about hope. It's a story about transformation, but what I'm really proud about is preserving our cultural heritage.

Dr. Olufade:

I don't live in Africa, but now I'm a member of the diaspora community. I don't want our community to ever forget about our connection to our motherland, which is Africa. I don't want our community to ever forget about our culture, about what makes us a community, what are important moral standards, the things that we value in our community. So that is what I'm really trying to convey in this book. But this is not the only book that I've written. I've also written another book called have you Ever Wondered how the Turtle Got Its Cracked Shell? Now, in that book, it's also about moral standards. It teaches you about the importance of not being greedy. It teaches you about something, about legacy. Now, is that applicable to our generation? Yes, what we do today will affect the future generation.

Dr. Olufade:

Myself and Dr Gladys Delancey-Bolden. We're talking about empowering girls and women to pursue STEM and STEM careers and education and STEM careers and education. Now, if we invest into our children at this point, it changes your legacy, it changes their life, it impacts their life in a positive way and many generations to come, literally. That is what we're walking towards. So we'd like to encourage you to please get involved. As Dr Delancey said, be a role model. Right, find a way, just do it. You just gotta find a way. You can't just stand back. Our community needs to be 100% into this. The whole Black community Now, hands on deck. We be about be part of the innovation. It would be nice if we're part of the innovation and making things for our community. I'm not trying to preach, I'm not a preacher. Games really sparks. Thank you so much for listening to us and thank you, dr Bolden, for coming. My pleasure. Steam sparks. Think STEAM career. Let me say it again STEAMs really sparks. Please think STEAM careers. Thank you so much, everyone. Have a great day. Bye.

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Dr. Ayo Olufade, Ph.D

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