Chulin 118

Daf Yomi

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Okay, today's the very hard Hulind Daf Kufjur Chas. So bear with me. We're gonna go through it uh again as we normally would, but we're in the beginning of Parakha'urba right to over here in Musachis Kulin, which deals with Tumatahira. Um hard concepts of Tumavataira. Today we're gonna have a lot of uh back and forth, a lot of different jaroshes, Indian today, or Indian and Tsara Shabash's and Kalbuchemers and Hekishas, and we're gonna go through everything. But what we need to know are a few concepts that we started with yesterday as it relates to tumovatira. We know that uh you have different things that can become tame. Now you have the different parts of the food itself. There are what's called yodis, a yad, as we saw, is something that you would use to handle the food. So uh a bone can be a yad, or a pit can be a yad. You're holding the food using the pit, or are you holding the bone uh you know to hold the basar on it? So that's what's called a yad. Now there's a question about all these things. A yad, is it is it gonna first of all be mitzariv to the shear? We know there are different shearim. Whereas that we saw in the Mishnah yesterday, there's a shear of uh kabitza for um for tamas navela, and there's a shear of sorry for yeah, for tamaslin and a shear of a kazayas for Tamas Navela, right? There's different sheerim. So can that, let's say you don't have enough buster over here, is that yad gonna be mitzarf to the shear? That's one question. Another question is if that yad touched tumma, is it gonna transmit the tumma onto the food? Is it gonna act as a it could be macabo tumma for everything else as well? Or if it was tame, if the food was tameh, can that food transmit the tumma based on that yad touching something else? So that yad is it considered or not? So that's the question over here. And so that's that's as it relates to yad. We have what's called a shamer as well. A shaimer is something that surrounds the food. So a shamer can be or it could be the skin, like the first part of the Mishnah. There it can be a shimer can be the peel of an apple, whatever it is. So that's a shaimer, a yad, and in all these things we have a question: can it be mahnis tama, which means can it become tame itself, bring in toma? Can it be mitsu toma? Can it be mitam is something else? And also Ulitsarev, can it be used to be mitzarev to get to the shir that it's going to be tame? And with that, we're on the first wide line of Khadikhas Maraf Tnan Hasam. We have a Mishnah over there. This Mishnah is in the beginning of Musah's Uktin. Kosho Yad Ulla Shaimer, Tame, Umitame, Venamitzarf. Anything that's a yad and not a shaimer, so it doesn't act as a guard for the food, it doesn't surround the food, it's only a yad. So it's tame umitame. Tame means it could become tame itself. Mitame means that it conveys that tum onto something else if it touches it. Umid vain mitstarf, but it's not mitzarif. If it's not a shamer, it's not gonna be mitzav. That thing won't be mitzarif to form the shear that you need for tomo here. Shoimer vahabbi shining yad. What if something's only a shamer and it's not a yad at all? It's only a shamer, meaning it's a peel, it's a this, but it doesn't act as a yad that you hold on to the for the food. So that tamey u mitame mitstarif, as long as you're a shamer, shamer's more chomer, that it's tomu mitame mitstarif, it's gonna become itself. That shamir itself, even if toma touched it, it could be mitame something else, or mitzarif, and it's gonna be mitarf to the shear at all. Lo yad viloy shamir. Something's not a yad and not a shamer. Loitame veloy mitame. It's not tame, and it's not going to be mitame either. So says the Gemar. Yodois Hechuksivi. Where do we find a pasuk? Where do we learn this din of yodois in the tairo? Where do we find it? Where do we find this idea that yadois can be included in tomavitaru, etc.? That tomavatara baklal applies to them. You would think, how do you know? Maybe your stem that you're holding your apple with. How do you know that stem tomavatara baklal applies to it? So it's heikhaksi. So where do we have that? Pas diksi, the pasik says, the hiutan ma'amal zera zeruah alzera, vinafal minablasom. Allah. The pasik says, vinafal miniblasam, love tameulachem. So what does this teach? Me, this teaches me lochem. So this is the pasik of uh, as we know, maqshir in. We learn from it that you have to be maqshir a fruit to be macabul tomoth. It has to you have water go on it, the hulu, but the qiutun ma'em alzera, and only after it was muqshar, then vinafum minablasim and then a veil of it. Tame ulakham. Now it's gonna become tame, but we dars on the word lachem to teach you lachem, lichhol shabitzarchim. Anything that applies to your tsrachim, meaning even yad'is. Because the yad you use, just like you use the fruit. The fruit is of course for your tsarf, right? You're using the fruit, you have a use for it, you're gonna eat it. So the yad you also have a use for it. If the hhol shibitzar chahim, you also have a use for the yad. So even yadis and the rabbis yodis that teaches me to be marbe also yodais to the concept of tumma, and that's how we know that yodis are gonna be tommy umatame, etc. So that's one posik. We have another posik by nava. And the posik says this is by Tumas Navaeda. So again, we have the word lachem. Lachem teaches me lachem, the hoshibitzar chahim, the rabbis the yodas to be marbe yodis. So we have two psuchim to be marbe yodais to to tumavita, to teach you anything that you would possibly use. The chhol shibitzar chahim, we learn it from the word lachem, even a yad. So tu qsuchim teaches me. Why do I need two? What's the two psukim coming to teach me about yada'is? Yad, lehachnis, ulahoitzi. It's coming to teach me that a yad is machnis tumah, otherwise known as tame, yad tame, it becomes tame itself. Ulahoitsi. Meaning it's mitame, it it it uh brings out toma and it's mitame something else if it touches it. So those two psukim by yadis teach me that yad is both machnes and it's maitzi. Shaimer lahachnis ulahoitsi lait t'sachra. What about a shaimer? So those were mikar to the fact we have tumma both ways of tumma, right? Tame umitame. In other words, machnes umightzi. So that was a mikar by yodhis that we have tumma. That it's machnes and miti tama. What about shamer? How do we know shaimer lachnus ulahitzi? How do we know that it's also tame umitame? It also becomes tame and also can convey tumma. That says the gamar lit sarchha. You don't even need a poslik for that. Why? Kavokhim yadasi. Because it's a kabochemir straight from yodhis. Where do I know yada's from? We just brought two psukin. So I just brought tsukim for yodis. Once I know yadais, I make a kalvochimir to teach you that's true also by shaimer. That by shamer it's also gonna be tame matame. Machnis u mitsi means the same thing. What's the kabohimer? That's not Megina, it's not shamir anything, and still Mahnes is a mighty, uh, it machines tame, it could become tame itself. Uh mighty and it could be mintame something else. Shoimer like Hol Shikane. So scheimer, that's more chammer, and it is Megina. It is scheimer something, it's a scheimer itself. Then, we have a kosh game, we have a kabohamer over here that that uh that tumov should apply to a scheimer. So, what just happened? We have, how do we know that tumma applies by yaddois and by scheimer? Fullness ulla haizi to be kam tame and to be metame. Answer is yaddois, we have two psukim, one lahachnis, one lahayzi, teach you that it can be come tame and be metame other things. And once I know that by yad, shamer lights are kra, because it's a makabu chimer from yaddois. Sends it about sham the kasa rahmana lamali. So if so, if I'm learning everything about shamar tumma by shamer from yaddois, then sham the cause of rahman alamali. Why do I need a pasik by shamer? And they're gonna ask me where's the pasik by shamer? We didn't say anything about that today. You're right, but we said it yesterday at the end of the day. We said yesterday, a pasuk by shamer, we ended off with the Tanadish Mal on Kofi Zaynam at base at the bottom. But I'll call Zera Zerua that it matters how you plant it. You plant it bikli posli, then it's gonna apply. Bikli pasli. You plant the bikli pasli, you take it out, bikli pasli, etc. Right? So, so that was the pasuk we brought to teach you about shamer. So, why do I need the pasik by shamer if I'm already learning ta that toma applies to a shamer? Lakhnasula from a kavochemer from Yodice. So, why do I need a pasik specially by shamer? Shma Minal Litsaref. It's coming to teach me Litsaref. That's what it's coming to teach me. Because again, I learned that yeah, it could be machni sumaitzi, it could be come tame and be mentame. What about litsaref? Can it be, can you use that scheimer? Is it mitzarif to the shear that you need to for now this to become tame? Let's say you don't have the shear of the buser itself or whatever you're dealing with, and you need this shamer to be mitzarif to the one shear that you need. Shma Minal Litsar, that's why I need the positive bad shamer. Says the gamar. Okay, so let's try to ask on this limud we did. Naimu, why don't we say? So again, what what do we have? We have two psokin by yodois, right? So we'd learn from there yadlahachnas, another part of the teacher with yadlahoitzi. Once I have those two, just remember the paper trails. So it will you know the rest of the gamer will flow as long as you know these basics. We have two psokin by yodais, one teaches me lahachnis, one teaches me lahoitzi, that it's metame umitame. Once I know that by yodois, cavalchymer too, scheumer, and sham is gonna be the same thing. Aye, so why do I need an extra posik by sham that we had yesterday? Shoimilitzaref. That's what the extra posik is teaching me by sham. Says the gymmark okay. Let's let's back up for a second. Meanwhile, why don't we say yad lahachnis vilay lahoitzi? That yad can only be machnis. It can only take into it can only become tame itself. Vilahitzi, but it can't be mitame. Shoimil lahachnis alhoitzi and shaimer as well. We're gonna learn, right? That shamer from a cabal chimer must come. We're learning that shamilahachnus, that it's gonna be machnes and it could be mighty because it's more hummer. So it could be machnes and it could be mighty because shamer is more hummer than yad. Avo yad the hoitzi for shamelitzarefloi, but yad to be mighty tomorrow. A yad to be mitame something else. Or shamir litzarif lai. I wouldn't necessarily know that. Says the Gemara. You can't possibly suggest such a thing because yad la hachnes villahoitz is a matz amrit. You can't possibly say that a yad would be machnis tomorrow and become tama itself, but not be mighty, not be mitami something else. Why can't you say that? Because interesting, says the gimara. Hashtag ulimi ayla, a pukemi bai, it's like a kavel khimer. Once it's a yulame aila, once it takes in toma, what a pukemi bai, you're gonna you have a havamina that it's not gonna be able to convey toma and transfer toma out? Of course it could. If it could take in, of course it could take out. You have to understand why exactly this is. If anything, you could understand the opposite, right? To be metama, something else is usually uh nah darga of tomah. But says the gummar, no, this is the kavel khama we're making, that if it can be machnis, then for sure, a pukemi bai, of course it should of course it should be mighty, and therefore you can't suggest such a thing. Says the gmar of aima, why don't we suggest the following? Yad lehoitzi beloy lahahnis, that yad, the posakbayad is teaching me l'hoitzi beloy lahahnis that it could be mighty. The exact opposite of what we just said, right? We just said the obvious thing is that it could be, of course it could be mighty if it could be machnes. So says the Gemara, why don't I say that Yad Lahoitzi Blay Lahahnis? That yeah, it could be mighty, it could be mitameh, but it can't be Machnes Tomate itself. Shamir Lahoitzhu Lahahnis, and Shamir could do both, because Shamir is more Hummer, so Shamir could be mighty and machnis. And so the Gemara, Yad Ya Sairah, Serah. Yad. Um, yeah, and by the way, if you're if you just had a question that how could it not become tame but give over tama, it's very simple. It could be mighty toma, yid the yad. We're talking about the yad. Can the yad act as a transmitter from the pre or whatever you're dealing with to convey the tama? So we can say that, yeah, of course it could transmit out toma, to be mighty tuma, puke apik, it could be mighty toma, but to transmit toma on let's say it was tar, that's if it was tame. So if the pre was tame, yeah, it could transmit the tama out. But to be na'aio the toma inside, to be machin's tama, to make it ta uh tame in the first place, if it was tar, that not necessarily. So we're not talking about the same exact case. It's uh important to remember if if uh you didn't understand what I just said, then you probably weren't bothered by the question. So it says the gemar like this that the ima yad no haytabah, yadach, and shama tahloi. And to the gemara, yad yes. I have extra time where we say yad, I have an extra pasuk, we're introducing a new pasik bayad, and that's how we're gonna know. So we're what's the extra pasik bayad? Taner vikiraim yutatz. So this is a pasik as it relates to tanirvakiraim. I'm gonna read the full possible. We know the haksha, the way you're supposed to cash or earth and we're clean, you gotta have yutatz, you gotta break it. Right? But basically, if it goes, an available falls into the even the airspace of a tanarkiraim, it's gonna be tmaim haim lochem. Okay, so we have the same word the chem. Lochem teaches me what? Anything you would use, a yad you would use, that's the rabbit's yada's. Clearly, we're being marbe, even yadis. Now what are we doing with this extra pasik now? Shaimel Tsar. That's our question. How do we know Shymel Latzar? Even Shamel Tsar, this would teach me Shaymal Tsar. Okay, so let's try to figure this out though. Which one is extra? Meaning after this whole khajbin, what do we come out with? We came back again. We have two psoken by yadis to teach me that a yad is mightziu mahris. Khabuchimir to shamer and that it's gonna be the same thing. Now I have an extra posik to teach me shamer litzaref. Very good. Which one exactly is extra to teach me that shamer is Litzaref? Which posik exactly? So you had a few psychim over there here. We mentioned uh the posik by Zroim, Al Kal Zerazirua, we had the posik of Tanarvikiraim, and we had the posuk of we had the posik of Tomas Navela, which was actually an enthusiast. So, Hayman Amyata, which one exactly is actually rahman of Zraim, Malaysa Anachminayu. If you're gonna tell me that the posik should only write the one by Zroyam, Al Kal Zerazerua, Vilaysu Anachminayu and the other ones meaning the Tanarvikiraim and the Tanarvik Ryan Tumas Navela should be learned from there. I could ask you, uh I could ask you Kash that why uh appearcha that Mal Zram shake and Tumas and Murauba. Zraim and the Khumra that their Tumasan Miruba Rash she says Mikaboma Vladituma, because it could be Makabotuma even from a Vlad Tuma, and Tuma applies much more broadly by Zraim, and therefore there's uh you're not gonna be able to necessarily learn the others out of it. Maybe you want to write from Tan, maybe you wanna write the posik by Tanar. And we should learn out Zraim and Tamas Navela from it. Malatanar Shekin Metami Avira. Tanner has a much bigger kumra than it's metanamiavira. You don't even have to touch it, you just go into the air space and stomach. It's a khmra, so you can't learn from there. Maybe you only write naveela and learn the others from it. Umitami masa it's also mitame only if you carry it, even if you didn't touch it. Umitami umitua yitzimufpa. And the tumma comes out of its guf, meaning it's the actual source. It's the actual source of the tumma, this navela. Says in the gumara, okay, so khadah mechadulyasa. So I can't learn one from one, right? What's the next step to try to do? Tas khadamitati. Let's try to learn one from the other two. So we should write two and learn the third, and that third is gonna be the extra one we're talking about over here. It says, Okay, which one? Hey, taste. Let the summary Zraim tasi mehana. Don't write Zraim, and let's learn it from the Tanor and Thomas Navela, Malana Shane Matam Slayba Heksha. Thomas Navela and a Tanur can become Tameh even if it wasn't Muksha Likabutama. You didn't ready it to become ta to become tame, right? The tanur doesn't need to have water poured over it before it could become tame. Of course not. And therefore, there's no Heksha Lakabutoma, and therefore, Tam Zraim Shay M Tama and Allah Haksha, Zroim have a kula, right? They only become tame once they're muksha lakabutoma. Once you put water on it, and with the tas by lim and you wanted the water to be there, etc. Right? Once you get it wet, then it's gonna become tame by Zroim. We know that's by food, but it's only gonna become tame when when it once it's moksha lakabutum, masha inken by nave, that happens on its own, masha inkin by kalim, a tanur, that happens on its own when it becomes tame. It doesn't have to be ready and be mokshir la kabutoma through water, says the Gemara, so that's so you're not gonna be able to learn it. Um, Rhunamarina Shua answers back to that, that's not true. Because Peris Shiloh Hikshiru, Ketanor, Shiloh Nigmer Milahtugami. You're looking at it the wrong way. You think it's a humra by tanur that it doesn't need hekshir? It does need hakshir. It's just not the same hekshir as it relates to zroim. The same way that zeroim needs water poured over it, a tanar also needs to be ready, the kabutoma. A tanner's not always a mikabutama. When is it not makabutumah? Before it's finished, right? Kalim should nigmer on milahtun. Kalim, that we're not, they're not in their final state, so it's not gonna be Makabutoma. So the same way by by by Zroim, it's only gonna become tame once you have water poured over it, because that's considered like now it's ready. So too by the Tanar. It's only, it's only it's only gonna become a top mikabutama once it's ready, once it's it's in its finished form as a tanner, and therefore tanar shalen nigma ma'ah dami is the same thing, that's the same thing of parishulay hitshru. So you're right, really it's the same, they're both not complete. It is the same thing across the board, and therefore it's not necessarily a human that tanner has over Zra because Tanor also is not complete. If it's not complete, it's not gonna become tamah. The question is of what whatever you're dealing with, you're gonna have to find the hekshar for that thing. The hekshar for a tanner to be ma'kabotummah is to finish it. The hekshar for fruits to be kabutama, zraim is to uh have water poured over it, and therefore, I don't think that's actually a good puercha. Allaparachophi. If you want to ask a purcha, you can ask the following. These things can become tamishilayman. They can become tame even if you didn't touch it. A tanar if you put something in the airspace. Uh Behama, right? Tamas Navaila, it just dies. The tama comes out of it, and it doesn't touch anything, and therefore, time of bizarre, shay and tamaraminia, you're gonna try to prove to Zraim that only becomes tame through Nagiya only through touching it. So those have a humra, and therefore you're not gonna be able to learn, says the Gemara. Okay, so obviously that's not the one that we're learning from. Maybe the Tara should have left out the one by Tanor. And learn Tanor from Zraim and Tamas Navela, says the Gemar. Those two, Tanur and sorry, those two, Zraim and Nivelah, it was an animal in the end of the day, so those things are both eichal. And Tanor is not aikhal, and therefore you're not gonna be able to learn it. L'inakh subrahman ibn Vela. So maybe this is the final one. And this is the final one, by the way. Linakh subrachman ibnvah it tastes me enough. The Tayra shouldn't have written Navela, and it should have learnt from Tanor and Zraim. And therefore, Yad Navela anomaly. Why do I need the Pasik to say the Yad by Nevela? So this is the extra one, and therefore, I'm Ain no Inyin Layad Navela, Tnay, Iin Layad the Alma. If we're not using it for yadda navela itself, because we just saw that we learned it out of Tanur and Zraim. So if it's extra, and it's aina in layada navela, what should I do, tine? Learn out a regular yad, yad the alma. That what? That yad the hachnes yad lahoitzi. We already know from the original Psukim that regular yad is might see, and regular yad is might see, uh regular yad is machnes and hoitzi. And therefore, what is this left for this extra pasta? Back to the drop board, what's this doing? Not back to that, this is the final uh thing, not the final, but in this uh version it is coming to teach you. Shimer is going to be mitzaref to the shear that you need to become Thomas. How are you using that Lashamil Tarif? I can tell you, you just said that yad by Nivela is uh is extra. That's what we just came out with. Yad and vela is extra, or rather in this version we said yad the tanar is extra, but we use yadinavela to the but says the gimmara, I use yadabinavela for something else. And therefore, kati yadinavela ipsrich. Why? Dinah Kazrahman, because if the tah didn't tell me by nevela, have a meaning day lovaminadinlias kanada, I would think that we should say day over here. And we should have a very limited application of yadlais by nevela. Why? Because if we're learning it from the other things, then whatever limitation applies to the uh the ni what were the the loim dim, we should learn it to the nilmat as well. Day lovanimanadin. Like whatever we're learning it from, it can't be more human than that. That what malahana salaymitame odam afnavela mitame adam, just like those things are not metameh adam, right? Thomas Navas uh yeah if you have uh tanar and you have uh you know the zraim or whatever it is, it's not metameh a person, so neve, which we know isn't a metame a person, if it's if it's learnt from those two, nothing and therefore afnavela metame adam a shame me metame adam. So Ella Yadana mitzarak. You need yad and vela. So what do we do? What do we not need? We need the yad that's said by Neveela. But shamer the nevelu lightsareh, but the shamer of neva that we don't need. Where did we have scheimer of nevelo? So this was at the top of the Ahmad, also what we learned yesterday. But either way, scheimer of Neveela is not gonna be needed. That possible we brought the end of yesterday's daff, top of today's, that we don't need. Why? Because the Maya Sakasira Why did the Tyr have to tell you that why did the Tara have to tell you about a shamer of Nevelo? Il its Taruf. It was coming if it was coming to tell you that a shamer by Nevelo is gonna be mitzarif to the shir that you need for Toma, who Amritlay Mitzarif. We said that a shamer is not mitzarif to the shir. Where did we say that? If you're holding, we don't have to be holding that much. We said in the Mishnah. We said in the Mishnah that Toma it's much easier for it to be mitzvah to eichlin, right, than it is for Thomas Nevela. Because Betamas Eichlin, the Shamer is Mitsarav to the Shir. But Tamas Navela, Ha Orva Rai Tevulu, right? It's not midstar of to the shir. Midstarf the time of Thomas Eichlin, Avalloi the Thomas Navela, the Mishnah said. So a scheimer is not mitzar of to Thomas Nevela. So what are you gonna use a scheimer by Nevela for? So what you what are you gonna use it for? Again, illitz tarufe, amrf a mit star. If you're gonna tell me it's coming to teach you that a shamer is mid starf by nevela, we said in the Mishnah that it's not midstar. Uhsi kavochamer miyada. Maybe you're gonna tell me that it's used that to tell you that by a a scheimer can be moitzitoma can be mitame, that's already learned kavuchamer miyad, right? We learned that today. Suns out of a kavokimer from yad. So what are you doing with the sharmer that's said by Nevela? Allah im eina in in the sham the neva, as we just saw we don't need it. T'eu ininliadinvelah learn it a yad of nevela. Why? Because we have a different plastic for that, as we mentioned it a second ago. So it's alma. So let's put it and learn something about a yad de alma. That what? Yad la hoitzi yadlachnes, or uh a general shamer is gonna be mitzaref. Not necessarily by nevela. But says the gimmick. Why don't we say the following? Why are we jumping? So we're we're it's a bunch of steps. Why don't we just say the ima? Would make much more sense, much closer to sayima in the inin. If it's not an inin for scheimer of nevela, let's learn something about a scheimer da'alma. That what? Shoimer lahachnis, the shamelessaref, that a regular shamer can be uh machnis and be mitzarev. Aval yad lahnis loi. But a yad can't be machnis d'un. Says the Gemara, because of this, you're right, we kind of like jumped the gun and started comparing uh uh more far-fetched things, and there was a much easier thing to say, and from the fact that we didn't say that, what's not going on, and therefore Gemara backtracks basically on all of this and says, Ella, this is a whole new answer. Me i koro kiksivo yad aha ahachnosa ksibo. If you look at the Pasuk, when it first talks about the yad, Lochem, etc., it's talking about being Mahnistoma. It's talking about being Mahnistoma and being being becoming Tame itself. It falls on, it becomes Tame. And if it's talking about being Mahnistoma, and that's where we learn yad out of from, so obviously a yad can be Mahnistoma, right? It's just learned from the posic itself, and that's why it has to be, and you cannot suggest otherwise. Ella Shamar the Nivela anomaly. Uh like. So says Gamar, so why do I need the shamer by Nivela? So we're And we keep we keep keep going back and forth over here. Why do I need a shimmerman available? I actually need it for its for itself. Okay, ulamai, let's explain. What do you mean you need it for itself? Ulamai for what? Ilit to rufe if to coming to me mitstar if I'm Ritloi Mitzdarf. We said a scheimer by Neva is not mitzarf to this year. That was our Mishnah, right? It's only Mitsarf for Thomas Baichlu, not for Thomas Navela. Illa Ahmed Sulahi, if you're it's if it's coming to tell me about the fact that it's able to be Machmesamaitoma, Kabukhammer Miyadasya. That's already learned from a cabochimer from Miyad. So says the Gemara, you're right. We didn't actually need it because we had a kabochimer, but Musa, sometimes you find an idea that even though we had a cabiner for this, still the Pasik went and uh and decided to write it. If so, if if you're telling me this, then why don't I say that by Shamir da Alma, which we used, what did we use? Sharma da Alma? Shamid Alma Alma means Aichlin, right? A shaimer by not by Navela, but a Shamid Alma, a regular Shamir by Thomas Aichlin. So Shamid'Alma, we said it's coming to teach you for it's coming to it's being used for tsirov to teach you that it could be mitzarath. So why not Shamid Alma imun the khalalahachnis tell you that really it's coming to be coming to tell you that it could be machnis tamah? Okay, I thought I had a kabochimer for that from Yad, right? Shimmer was always learned from Yad, because Shamir is more Khammer than Yad. So I had already had a Kabulheimer, so why do we need a puzzl? If so, I'll tell you the same thing. Milshasiba Kabuchimer Tarach Vikas of Lakra. And therefore, I don't necessarily know to use it to the fact that to tell you that it could be mitstarif, because maybe the whole posik is only telling you that the shamer could be Mahnis. And even though I had a Kabukimer, Milsad Asiba Kabuchemir Tarahva Kaz of Lakra. So this obvious answer, then no. Heikh the ekel and midjustinon. I have no other drosha to be made, I'm gonna say you're right. Maybe Milssiba Kabuchimer, Tarh Vakas of Lakra. But if there's clearly another Josha to be made, like we learnt already from it, that it's used to teach you that it's Mithsaref, so I'm not gonna tell you that really it's used to teach you something you already learned out of a Ka'bachimer, and Milsad's babah at Tarakhva Kazavakrav. No, if I have a if I have a if I have a different limb, if I have a different dress to be made, that's obviously gonna be made before we say such a thing. Says the Gemaro. Riv Khaviva Omar. Shani Shamid the Navela, so R Khaviva is going on the top line. And the question on the top line of the Umr over here. The aima, why don't we say instead, Ime inla sham the Nevela, much closer, right? T'neu in the shamir the alma. So it says the Riv Khaviva, Shani Shaman the Navela came with the Maysa, meaning what was the question? The question was, why are we jumping to Yad, right? What did we say on Namanalas at the bottom? We said I'm in the Sharm the Nevela, T'neu Indian, the Yad the Navela. And I'm in the Yad the Navela, because we have a positive for that, T'neu Indian, the Yad the Almah. And then we started and uh then we learned from there it's Siruf. Says the Gemar, that's a lot of steps removed. So the Gemar asked on top, the aima, why don't we just say instead of jumping to yad, I'm in a in the shamir the nevel, tnew inyan, what's the next natural thing? It's still a shamer. You don't have to jump all the way to yad and make uh a few steps removed. So if Khabiva answers that, you want to know why? Because Shani Shamir the Navela, Shamid Navela is different, came with the Maisi Yadka of it, since then today it also works like a yad. A shamer of a navela, uh sometimes you it can work as uh as your yad as well that you're holding for it, whatever the mitsyas is. So since it can work as a yad as well, a yad chadinam lay. So that's why we jump to yad because it actually is oysin, and it's kind of the same thing. So it's gonna maskaflah review the barrier bishmoel. A little bit of a new thing here, even though he's starting with maskaflah. He's gonna explain his question. Masklar you the mash bar barishmoel, hot it nan, that that we have in the Mishnah. Hapitmashul remoun, the pitum of a remoun, so the top uh part or whatever it is, the top part coming out. Mitstarefis. That's going to be mitzar. But the nates, the piece on top of the pitum, so you picture a pitum and then you have like uh maybe some leaves on top of it even. But the nates on top of the pitum animitsarf. That's not gonna be mitzav. Why? Krikon, why don't we s why don't we read the pasli that we learned? Alko Zerazirua Beleko. That it only applies to things that zera zerua, that is the way that you plant, right? We saw yesterday chitab, biklipasla, you put it in this, biklipasla. So alko zerazirua, what you the deruch that you planted, and therefore, what's the question? None of this should be mitzarif. Not the top, not the next, not the pitum itself, because that's not how you plant it. The way you plant uh a remoun tree is actually you put a branch in the ground. Bikhlaw, not uh the seeds over here. And therefore, and therefore, if so, why is any of it gonna be mitzarif? Why is the regular pithum of this gonna be mitzarif? This two, and furthermore, hot it's not that that we have in the Mishnah. Are these things plantable? Do you plant skin? I don't understand. If it's all learned out of Zera Zeruah, the way Kedarach bikli posan, the way you plant it, are these things planted? The skin of an animal, the right of a kipa of a hulu, mitzarav the time tomas, minon, how do you know that? That's also not planted. So has the Gemara Elotasak Raix CV. You have to read that posak and learn three things out of it. Al Khazer Zirua has the word three times. Al Khazera Zirua Ash Izaraya. So we have Zera Zerua Izaraya. That's three times, which means three joshes to be learned. What is Shamid Israel? That already we know, right? Klipah. It goes in with it. Klipah Khad Shemidilanis, which is like the peat the pitam over here by the pomegranate. Then I dokemer baser bait me dagim. The other one is for shimer of basur bait medagim, which is those mentioned in the beginning of the Mishnah. Orva retiva kipa, etc. says the Gamarvaiter. Am Ruchhi Barashi Omr Rabchiya Barash Rabchiya Barashi, say in the name of Rab. Yesh yad toma bain yad the hakshir. There could be a yad for toma. Yad can uh be mitztarif, or yad can we we know something not necessarily the tzar, but yad is going to be machnis toma, right? But not there's no yadl hakshir. What does that mean? So we know you have to be maqshar, maqshur food to be become mikhabultoma. You need water to fall on it, specifically water that has uh michasa for the for for the bailum, and it has the das bailum, he wants that water to be on it. Then it's gonna be moksha the kabul tuma. So what if water went on the sten? Water went on a yad of the pre. Is that gonna be maqshar al-Kabaltoma? So said Rav that Yeshia the Toma, the yad is included for Tomah as relates to Akhlin Sulahoitzi, etc. But the Ain Yad the Haksha, but it's not gonna be included to be Maqsha this pre, so if it got wet, it's not gonna be Mahda the Pri. That yad applies both for Toma and for Hashra, and therefore, if water went on the yad of the pre, then it's gonna be already moksha the kabotoma if the dash, if the bylamadas. So it's gonna be my commitment. What's the machalic is between Rav and Rubiya nobody same masswar, ebay same makras. Some say it's a swara, some say it's actually a posik they're arguing in. So we'll take the posik one first. Marsavar, mikra, nidrash, lifanov, viloflayfanov. So Mar Savar, that I think it's Rav, or sorry, that uh Yeshi Yadatama. Sorry, this is uh this Mistama Rav that holds it. You only have a Yad for Tama, but not a Yad for Axra. So he's gonna hold that one. That the way you learn the Poslik is mikra nidrash lifanov, vilo lifnefana. Then you could only learn the poslik, the words that we're using, on the words that came right before them. But you can't take those words and learn them on the words that came lifnayfanov, on the words not right before them, but before the thing that came before them. What are we talking about over here? Because we're talking about the words, just to read it, the tamehulah, right? Al Qul Zerazer Rua, you read the full pasta, the end of the passa is Tamehulakem. So right before it said ta'mehulahem, it's going on Vinafa'minivlasam alov. So vinafa'minivlasam alov is talking about what? That's talking about Tumah right? Vinaf alminivasam a love, it's gonna be Matameh. So right after that, Tamayulahem. Lochem taught me what? Yad'is. Lochem, Loh Shibitar Khachem, anything you would use, even the yad, you the yad you would use, toma applies. So since I'm dartioning it lafana of Sawa came right before in the pasa of Vinafa'a'a minivla samalla to teach you about tumma. So that teaches me that toma applies to yad's. Viloy shalifnafana of what came before the thing that came before it, that was the beginning of the pasik. That's uh of course maqshirin. That's the fact that you can be maqshared. It could happen by itself as long as you wanted it to happen, etc. We all know this. So that's the beginning of the pasik is talking about heshir. The middle of the pasik is talking about tomma. The end of the pasik is where we learned how yad. So yaddois said rav applies only to tumma. And there's no yaddais lahkshir. Why? Because we only learn it lefanov villailif nefanah. Marsabr, Mikro Nish Lefan, Lailif Nefana. Mar Savar Bihan's gonna say that it applies to both. Why? Mikronidr s lefanov, vilifnefano, and in the end when we said Lochem is talking about Yodhais as being Mar Ba Yodh is going on the Gansap Posak, both on the Tumma part and both on the Hekshir part, and that's why Yodhis are gonna apply both by Tuma and both by Hector. So that was the Ibai Sayma Kra. Ibaise Masvara is Mar Savar Hekshir Thiilas Tomahu. Ribyaichanan. We keep switching orders over here, we keep flipping orders. Ribyoichanan says that Hekshir's Tchilas Tumah, that uh Hekshir, the fact that when you were Mukshir at the Kabul Tama, that's like a that's like the beginning of it becoming Tama, it's becoming Tame itself, even if it didn't become Tameh, it just became Mikabul Tama now, right? But still it's as if it's uh it's on the journey of becoming Tame, and therefore it's one Indian, and if Yad applies to Tama, it applies to Hector as well. That's Rib'iekan. That's a svara. Um, Rav's gonna say that no, Hekshar Lab Thias Tomahu has nothing to do with becoming tame, has to do with becoming Mikabul Tama. But if becoming Tame is a different thing, and therefore that's why Rav says that Yesh yad le tumma vein yad le heksher. We have a price supporting rubychin, that yadas apply to both tomah and and hekshar. That kishem shay shyad the toma, kach yesh yad, leh sure the price that says it verbatim. And the same way it's only mikabutoma once you detach it from the ground. So too, you can only be makshir pairs the kabotoma once they're detached from the ground. But if you have them growing on a tree and it starts raining and you add water, even if you wanted the water, you pour in water, it doesn't matter. If they are attached to the ground in the muchum alakarka, you're not gonna be able to be makeshir them the same way, they're not gonna be able to be kumtame itself. They can't be macaboltoma, and we will hold it over there. Get