Jim shares his incredible journey from leading openings at his dream hotels, traveling to the greatest 5-star hotels in the world with Forbes Travel Guide, culminating with his current company, where he enables leaders and teams to better understand themselves and lead their teams using the Enneagram. Jim discusses how he developed his public speaking skills – and the importance of giving yourself some grace and compassion.
Jim shares his incredible journey from leading openings at his dream hotels, traveling to the greatest 5-star hotels in the world with Forbes Travel Guide, culminating with his current company, where he enables leaders and teams to better understand themselves and lead their teams using the Enneagram. Jim discusses how he developed his public speaking skills – and the importance of giving yourself some grace and compassion.
Hello and welcome to DEI Advisors. My name is Lan Elliott on behalf of DEI Advisors. And today's guest is Jim McPartland, who is the published author of the Enneagram at Work, Unlocking the Power of Type to Lead and Succeed. And he's also a leadership coach, an executive trainer, a self insight specialist. I love that title with his company that he founded, All Good People Corporation.
Jim McPartlin:Welcome, Jim. Thank you. Pleasure to be here.
Lan Elliott:So thrilled to have you here. We've been talking about having you on for a while. And for our guests, if you're not familiar with Jim and his many accomplishments, I hope you go to our website to learn more about him. But for now, I'd love to jump right in and learn a little bit more about your journey to leadership, Jim, and maybe some of the inflection points. And if there were any particular factors that you think led to your success, I'd love if you could share it with our
Jim McPartlin:audience. so much. I think I was very fortunate to have some great coaches along the way as so many of us speak to my, my first job out of hotel school was at Walt Disney world. And I was there for about five years, but, I thought my little degree, I thought I was pretty smart and I became a housekeeping manager. And when I showed off my degree to my boss, she allowed that I'd never cleaned a room personally. And so she had me clean rooms for a month until I could do 15 per day. Then she had me clean public area toilets at Disney for two weeks to make sure I got the lesson. I got the lesson, right? But I think that was a a narrative for me. It was like really understanding that you have to do the work first before anything else. And that really informed me because of her, when I became a general manager, I always started my day with housekeeping. It's the hardest working group physically in a hotel, and that really informed me, fast forward to 1993 in San Francisco, and I'm working for what was called Kimco at the time Kimco became the Kimpton hotel and restaurant group. But when I started, we had eight hotels, and Bill Kimpton was really an amazing individual, but he was all about self insight, and this was in the 90s, and it was just becoming a thing, but I had my first class in the Enneagram in 1993 with one of these gurus, and it really, Rock my world in such a way that I began to use it for the rest of my career when I managed my own hotel teams, and it really informed a lot of the rest of my life. And so I think I've been fortunate to have coaches like Maxine Bell, who was my executive housekeeper. I've had people like Jonathan Tish, who, of course, was the former CEO of Lowe's Hotels and Resorts. Obviously, Bill Kimpton, Ian Schrager. But there's a lot of really great people. I think that it took me under their wing. and showed me the way, if you will. And then, of course, the guru who really informed my life personally as well as professionally, Dr. David Daniels who wrote the Essential Enneagram and was a professor of psychiatry as well as a medical doctor from Stanford. And so I've been really fortunate, and you blink, and 30 years goes by.
Lan Elliott:That's so true. That's so true. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. And I love some of the lessons that are in there in terms of mentors who have inspired you along the way. And also I love the story of the housekeeping manager and it is certainly one of the hardest jobs in your career. and hospitality. I cut it for about two weeks as a housekeeping supervisor once upon a time. I couldn't quite do that, but good for you for cleaning the rooms. That is serious work. And I love that it informs being a GM.
Jim McPartlin:Yeah, I think also, look, I was raised in fairly rural circumstances in upstate New York. My mother worked in a factory for 19 years, putting together phones, my dad was in a chemical sales for photo companies, right? But it was one of these sort of things. I thought my parents did that work thing, but I had gone to college and that meant, I didn't have to do that. And really I was informed in a very elegant way. No, don't forget where you come from. And one of my greatest mentors is a gentleman named George Kalogridis. And George is the former president of Disney. And he just retired after 50 years, but I interviewed him. years ago, and he said, do not forget where you come from. And he started out as a street sweeper and then a bus boy at Walt Disney World in 1971. And here he is president, 50 some odd years later. And so I really, it was a good lesson for me to hear.
Lan Elliott:That's incredible. I want to talk a little bit about taking risks, because you rose from that initial role to some of the most interesting, Leadership roles in terms of leading a number of major lifestyle hotels in our industry, and it was at the time it was cutting edge for our industry. There weren't a lot of lifestyle at that time. And then you took a pivot and went towards executive training, leadership, coaching. Could you share a little bit about taking risks and how you approach that?
Jim McPartlin:Yeah, I think it's one of the sort of things that I, and we'll talk about the Enneagram later on, but my type tends to be sort of anxiety based and worries and thinks a lot. But we also get bored when it gets too safe. And so we take risks. Now, sometimes we can take stupid risks. For instance, in college, I wanted to rock climbing without a nap because I wanted to prove I could do it. Don't do things like that, right? But career wise, I was able to really jump from I was in Fresno, California running a holiday in 1993, thinking, what have I done with my life? And I don't want to be here. And I just jumped and joined a little company called Kimco based upon an article I read. From there, 10 years later the hot hotel brand was Starwood. And of course the W San Francisco came open. I applied and all of a sudden here I am working with some really High profile, smart people. It was like walking into a master class and I was like, Oh my God, I'm in charge of all of you. And they were all the best in the industry. And so I did that. I ended up running West Coast operations for W. I moved to New York to run the W Times Square. And very quickly, within a couple of years, I met Ian Schrager and he says, Hey, I'm going to give you the keys to the city. Come open the Gramercy Park Hotel. Two years later, Andre Bellage, celebrity hotelier. He says, come run my company, right? And he has all these cool hotels and it got it was, wow. But I liked the adrenaline. And for 10 years, I did this and I ended up back at W because Carla Murray, who's one of the greatest. mentors of mine in the world. She's now president of Marriott. Carla had this opening for the W in Hollywood. It was a brand new campus being built and I thought, okay, I'll just jump and do that, and that was a really amazing experience and then in 10 years has gone by and you realize, wow, I'm in a lifestyle hotel, I'm in my fifties, it's a club every night. I don't want to do this anymore. And so the safe thing for me to go back to New York and run a fancy hotel in Park Avenue, which I did, and I liked openings. Openings are really great for the adrenaline post opening. I was like, and now you're in your fifties and you've got the dream hotel and you don't want it anymore. And so I thought I'll start hanging out my own shingle and I'll start with doing self insight work on my own. But Forbes travel guide came along and they said, how would you like to travel around the world, inspect and teach at the greatest five star hotels, restaurants and spas in the world. and get paid for it. So I did that. But back to the Maxine story, my boss, at the time was probably a good 20 years younger than me. And he said, Hey, you're going to be a trainee for six months before we allow you to actually get the program. And I was like, I ran a hotel company. I don't think I need this training. It's amazing how we think our egos are not going to be a problem any longer. And they come back in a very elegant way. And I had to be a training for six months and learn all the standards from Forbes, which was the hotels, the restaurants, the spas. And it is no joke. There's a reason why they are the preeminent rating system for the hotel industry in the world. And it was really exceptional to go through it. So I did that for about seven years. I became their vice president of leadership. I started teaching, of course, self insight work with them and communications and all that. But I really get to travel at an amazing level and they let me keep my side business, which was. Develop it at that time. Also, as long as it didn't interfere, with the hotel side, but my clients are as varied as a construction company, luxury goods. I've got a U. S. Fighter pilot as a guy that I coach, right? But all of us started to happen very quickly. And then, of course, COVID hit. And at that point, I thought, I've been saying for years, I'm going to write a book. I should write a poem about a book, right? And that's what happened. I found an agent, did a pitch, and it happened, right? And it's one of those things, I think, that you tell yourself sometimes, Oh, I can never do that. I can't do this. You just step and start the process. There's a great quote from Rumi that as you get on the path appears and I think you just start doing it. And it's hard to believe that's now 2023 and this year is coming to an end.
Lan Elliott:Yeah, absolutely. And I loved you talking about rising in your career and getting to a point where you go, everything that I wanted, I now have. And now I want something different. That feeling of what next, where do I go from here? I love that theme. And I also love the idea that when you're ready, the next path appears. And I love the roomies quote as well. He has so many great quotes.
Jim McPartlin:Yeah. And I think we're both devotees, obviously, to the Modern Elder Academy. I just completed it. I know you've done it, but I think one of the wonderful parts about that is that Chip Conley really acknowledges that as we get older, we have wisdom and we're so youth based as a society. It's all about what's new for the kids. But honestly, at this age, I'm healthy, blessedly. I've got a great life. I get to do what I want, but I've got still a lot that I want to contribute. It's. And take part in. And I think that's a wonderful place to be when you realize, Hey, here's what I thought I wanted my career to be at the age of 14. I decided I was going to be a hotelier and I loved it. I love hotels. I love hotel teams. But then I realized side friends going the direction of CEO and CEO. And, the reason why there's so few of these positions is because you give up a lot to get there. And you've got to be really dedicated and focused and work the hours. And I realized, I want to really, truly work smart and not as hard and just love what I do. And so when I work, I really work. But I make time for my family and I think family is really important. Your friends are very important and you should not discount that because again, 10 years can go by and you can look around and say, wow, how did that happen? Yeah.
Lan Elliott:One of the things that Chip does really well is help you focus on what are your values and what's important to you now. And maybe in your thirties it's the chase and the career, but then later you have more wisdom and you know yourself a little bit more and then you're looking for different things.
Jim McPartlin:Mhm. Yes.
Lan Elliott:And I think that's a good segue into Enneagrams because you're a recognized authority on using Enneagrams to better understand interpersonal workplace relationships and hospitality. You mentioned Kempton uses the Enneagram. How did you discover the Enneagram. Was it part of your Kempton training? And what's so unique about it? Because you clearly are now spending the next chapter of your life focused on it. Why specialize in this when there are so many personality tests that are out
Jim McPartlin:there? I think, number one, in 1993, my first month on the job, I had a seminar with someone named Helen Palmer, who was this major guru in the N. A. R. M. world, right? And it was because of Bill Kempton and we sat there all together, and I thought, what's going on here? And then I thought okay, this is fun, and each of the types was being revealed and spoken to, and I thought, this is fun. And then it got to my particular type association, and it was like And the world cracked open for me. And so I think that ability to really get a kind of a lesson on my personality traits and recognize that doesn't mean that it was me personally. It might be as a structure of type, right? A personality structure. It really hit home. And so I've been a student now, the Enneagram for better than 30 years. I'm very careful never to say, I'm on authority. And so in the sense of a master, because The Enneagram itself is old. It goes, it's an ancient system going back a couple of thousand years. There are lots of great modern systems like MBTI, disk, string finders, that the Enneagram can link up with. But the main thing with the Enneagram is to understand is that you're a couple of things. One is that it's really based in your three centers of intelligence. You have your logical intelligence, Your emotional intelligence in your gut or your kinesthetic intelligence and you're possessed of all three chances are you've got a heightened sense in two of those centers and then probably need some help in one of the other ones. And then these nine personality structures, if you will, surround that. And the easiest way to think about that is you've got a child that's born. And the kids really happy and every moment they're in there in that moment, a four year old does not have regrets about two years ago. If a five year old envious, they're envious of something in the moment. They're not really thinking six or seven months from now, right? They're just they don't have the capacity. But as that's happening, their personality is over here, right? And the personality is fairly elastic. in childhood. But as it gets validation, it starts to really protect the inner core of child and gets validation like, wow, great job. You won this race. You got a star. Yes, I'm a star. And that child starts to get validation and getting things done right. And each of us has some kind of experience in that and it forms a structure of personality and gets us through life. It works through your twenties and thirties. Honestly, it does. By the time you're 40, most of us experienced that natural sort of place called midlife crisis, if you will, right? But it's really your core, your true nature saying, Hey, here I am. Remember me. And most of us just jump back into our patterns thinking that's going to change things as opposed to the Enneagram shows you, listen, it's just a pattern, and the patterns are fine, but also you could actually break out of that pattern. If you want to, and part of that is that recognize and I always tell students that you're fine just as you are, you're showing up every day, you're doing your job, there's nothing wrong with you whatsoever. And the Enneagram says very clearly that I'm not about putting you in a box and assign a number to you. You're already in the box. The Enneagram is a compass to get you out of the box, and you can evolve as you want to, right? Now, the overreach is we get to a place of, Hmm, I'm back to my core, we're all going to be like core together, be our authentic selves. It's never going to happen. We like, unless you're the Dalai Lama, it's never going to happen. But you, we like our patterns too much, and our patterns like us, right? But it's one of those sort of things that as you evolve, Over a period of years, you begin to realize, right? For instance, the type eight, the challenger eights typically see things very clearly. They can't understand why you can't speak your mind. I speak my mind and I get stuff done. I make things happen. And then sometimes it's wow, that was harsh. And there's a frustration for the eight. But over a period of years, it becomes maybe today, as opposed to being so upfront about my opinion, I will pivot and say something like, interesting, tell me more. And each of the types has these similar sort of challenges, if you will, but it can be a wonderful way to build a team, a wonderful way to understand each other, and it's fun. The way I teach it is don't make it so serious, right? It can be fun as well.
Lan Elliott:yOu alluded to some of those types. I'd love to get into those types because I find it so interesting. And I have to say, as a lot of people who are watching this interview, they've probably taken a lot of different personality tests. For me, the Enneagram was also moment because you get th that's kind of me. I get out. But the inner ground the first time I said, oh why I react the I know we can go down a huge rabbit hole on the nine types, but maybe if you could share just a quick sound bite of each of the types, and maybe we start with the three heart types, and they don't go in numerical order, so bear with us. The three heart types, which are the two, three and four.
Jim McPartlin:Correct. So as stated before, there are three centers of intelligence, and so we'll start with the heart types, which are types two, three, and four. And these three types perceive the world more through an emotional filter, right? And so type two is called the giver, or the considered helper, and really the type two's motivation is to take care of people. It is really, it's almost like I can take care of the world and they're excellent at this and they can perceive very quickly. They're possessed of an incredible amount of empathy and they're great at knowing what you need before you even know it. Now the problem though is that they're not always good with boundaries or taking care of themselves. And so part of the two's growth is learning to say, no, right? You can do it yourself without my help. Type three is called the competitive achiever, sometimes called the performer. And the three is the kid that's hey. I want to race. I like getting stars. I'm gonna keep on getting stars. And so they're very focused on task, getting things done, being a winner. They're not great with empathy. And even though they're in the emotional triad, it's the one gift they suppress in favor of logic. And action. Logic backs up action backs up logic, let's party. And that's really validated, especially in American society, right? But, they're not always as adept at being empathetic with a member of their team who says, Oh my gosh, my pet gecko died over the weekend. And for them it's huh. Next, right? Because feelings are messy and I don't understand feelings, right? But they're amazing when it comes to task, getting things done, moving things forward and being very upbeat. They can be phenomenal coaches. Type fours are called the intense creatives, sometimes called the romantics. They love all feelings, especially their feelings, and they like going deep and walking to their own drum. You often find them in the arts, actors, musicians because they have a depth and they really want to get into it. And if you say to them, hi, how are you? They really want to say, let me tell you and really get there. That can be off putting for some types, Steve Jobs was a type four. And he wanted to change the world. And honestly, he did, right? And his sort of hike on the original iPhone was, I want the interior to be just as pretty as the exterior. And some people could not understand that. But that's what he wanted because he thought differently. So then you move into the logic types five, six and seven. Type five is known as the observer. Think Mr. Spock. Logic. Logic. Logic. I don't need a lot of drama. Just give me the facts. Great under pressure. I really like data. And I like thinking about things. I'm perfectly fine being by myself and being non emotional. And they can be really steady. And really put things through right now, the concern for them or the challenge can be really personal connections and becoming their right type six years. Truly, we perceive the world in wow, the world could end quickly. I'm in San Francisco at the moment. What if an earthquake happens? Oh, my God, I have to have a plan, right? So six is yeah. Think in terms of what's the worst that can happen and then we got a plan for it. Now at our best, we're very strategic, we think ahead, and we have plans, backup plans, and backup plans. But the, really, the challenge you meet at Type 6 is that we worry. And even if there's nothing to worry about, we think of something to worry about. It's all we do, right? And growth for a 6 is really just, having faith it's all going to work out. Type 7 is known as the epicure, the adventurer and also called the enthusiastic visionary. And 7s, I sometimes smile and just say, they just want to have fun. 7s, Have a really very fast mind. So a type fives logic goes like this. Six is tend to suppress logic. Seven's logic is like a computer and they put things together very quickly and their core motivation is to really have joy, not have to worry about conflict and just be forward thinking. And so they're really upbeat and fast. They can be focusing on idea and then it's wish next idea and they can be all over the place. But when they learn to focus their mind, And really move forward, they can be incredible leaders and they often end up in the C suite because their vision is absolutely phenomenal to watch in action. In American history, John Kennedy, for sure, Barack Obama, George W. Bush, in the hotel world, Barry Sternlicht, without question, they really just think differently and can really move things along. Then we move into the body triad, which are types 8, 9, and 1. And these three types are based in their gut knowledge. It's like They, they actually perceive right? And there's all sorts of information now about your the neurons in your gut that actually send you information. So we actually have intelligence here and intelligence here, but it's also gut intelligence, right? So type eights are called the challenger, the boss, and they're the kid that they saw something out of control and they just took control. And as they got older, they just took naturally took control. They're natural born leaders. They just take over and make things happen and they understand there are weak people and strong people. I'm strong. I'll take care of you. Just get behind me. Be loyal. Don't lie to me. Ever. Because I have to have truth and honesty. Now, that toughness belies a very sweet underbelly. That's very vulnerable, but they don't like to let the world see that too much. So it's much more on the home front perhaps than on the professional front, but they get stuff done. They're a large and in charge. And the great thing with type eights is you can tell them exactly what you think. You can say, Hey, stop talking. We're done. Yes, I'll stop talking, and they have no issue with that, right? And so it's cool to work with them because they're not really gonna go you're hurting my feelings. It's yeah, fine You don't like me. I like you either, Type nine known as the mediator. They're all I know sometimes called the diplomat really See shades of gray. So even though they're they're have either side of the black and white thinkers, the type eight and type one, nines actually see the world as being very complex. There is not black and white. You should go deeper. You should take your time. You should build consensus and slow and steady. Like a glacier, gentle pressure make things happen. There are lookalike type to type two, but the key thing is twos get joy out of giving, taking care of people. Nines can become chameleons and just take on whatever energy is in the room and be incredibly diplomatic in their display and how they speak to people and really smooth things over and move things along. But they can be excellent leaders because they're very chill, right? Until they're not. And nines can, are possessed of anger as well, but it takes a lot out of them. And of course type ones are called the strict perfectionist, the teacher, the reformer. Ones like type eights are black and white thinkers. Ones unlike eights are not necessarily going to speak to it. One's the kid that came home from school and said, Mommy, I got an A. Was told, Great job, Tony. Next time get an A and the one child gets word. You can do better. You can do better, and you should do better. So they're possessed of ethics. details, a refinement, there's a way of doing things, there's a way of speaking, there's comportment, and I would love to take the weekend off, but the rest of you are not doing your job properly, so I guess I'll work once again. And there can be a resentment that builds up on others lesser standards. Where they begin to find their joy, of course, is learning to recognize that every day, every moment's perfect just as it is. You don't need to refine and change and fix everything, but for them it's almost if I just tweak that, if I just do this I can buy myself better. And so growth comes from realizing I'm good just as I am. And so each of these types also then interrelate. There's lines of integration between them. There's there's a diagram, right? You have wings on either side of you. You have these things called subtypes. And it goes deeper and deeper because the Enneagram goes back a couple of thousand years, right? But it's also fairly easily understood at first glance.
Lan Elliott:It's really incredible. And as you were describing each of those types, I was thinking, Oh, that person that I worked with, he's definitely that type, or I definitely see someone in my family, that's my type. As you would that's that particular type that you were talking about, so it's fascinating. Could you maybe help crystallize this by sharing a story of how. Enneagrams can be helpful in the workplace.
Jim McPartlin:No, of course. I think that when I was opening my hotel in Hollywood, for instance, it was a huge campus. It was tens of millions of dollars. And, being a six I was like, Oh my God, I'm seeing disaster. I'm seeing disaster. So I had a plan for every day, perceived it as a disaster was going to happen. I was all over the place and making sure asking questions. If a manager came into my office and said this is all good. I'm like, what do you mean? It's all good. Tell me about this. Tell me, make me feel safe. And that was great because I had my people on their toes at all times. They were all a concern making sure right. But also I had a wise HR person I work with said we need to talk your and she was a type seven. And so she moved very fast and kept things light. But she was also very good when she focused and she said you're killing the joy of this opening. No, I'm not. People love me. She's no, not so much right now. And so it was one of those ah, got it. I'm overdoing it. And I remember like ranting one day in the lobby about something. And I had a trusted sort of food and beverage director. Who's a type eight who came up behind me, grabbed me, hugged me and said, Jim, it's all going to be. Okay. And I was like, because I trusted him and I think eights, they love to protect and sixes love that protection and eights love the loyalty. We trusted each other. And I was like, you know what? You're right. I work for a large company. We have lots of help here. The opening is going to happen. Stop. And so each type has some variation on this sort of thing that can happen. And if I know that you're a type eight and I'm working with you I know I can be direct, to the point, and make sure I don't have a hidden agenda because it'll really irritate you. If you know you're working with me as a type 6, you're gonna know, don't withhold information, right? Don't give me weird non verbal signals because I'll start imagining things. And you need to reassure me. And often times people say to me, oh my god, I've gotta work on every person's personality and how to work with them better. Yes, that's how this works, right? It takes some time and effort.
Lan Elliott:It is so true. I think maybe a long time ago, the thought was, treat everybody the same, but what I found is so much more effective is if you treat everybody, not the way so much you would want to be treated, but the way they need to be. There you go,
right?
Lan Elliott:And understanding what each person needs makes such a difference. And so I love that Enneagram helps with
Jim McPartlin:that. It is meet that person where they are. And I think that's where the Enneagram can be a great structure of understanding. Because again, it's not about this. It's more about here's where I'm at. I will worry, or if I'm a type seven, look, I get bored after a while, you got to keep it somewhat fun and interesting or else I don't want to be here. And that's cool, and each of the types has that, but meet me where I am. And so I do a lot of team training on this and I do, everything is varied from, I've worked with venture capitalists in the last year. I work with luxury goods in New York. I work with a a cruise line and it's really interesting because people tend to. Get into this and they fall into sort of these nine ways of being and it's Oh yeah, here's how that happened when I was a kid. This happened flip like, yeah, I get it right. By the way, I'm very clear people, not a psychologist, not a therapist, none of that. I'm just somebody who studied patterns of behavior for 30 years and something called the Enneagram. And it's really helped to inform my life and how I managed.
Lan Elliott:I think it's really powerful. And thank you. Thank you for sharing that. My pleasure. I wanted to pivot as we're running close on time, but I wanted to talk about public speaking because it's something that you do very well and that you do a lot of obviously in your current work. Could you share a little bit about that? I learned recently that it can be people's number one fear. And how do you approach public speaking? And is it. Is it important? I think a lot of people think, and I know I did this when I was early in my career, I thought, I know my material, I know what I need to talk about, so I'll be fine, but the skill of public speaking really can make a difference. So I'm curious your thoughts on public speaking in advancing one's career and maybe some tips on how you've managed it.
Jim McPartlin:anD first and foremost, I mentioned I'm a type six on the Enneagram. So it's ah, right? But again, I like that risk. So as a child, I had a speech impediment. I spoke way too quickly. And even your listeners today will realize, sometimes I start going fast and I've got to start amping it back down. And I catch myself and remember to breathe. And so I did some improv work in Los Angeles in the nineties. Imagine being a type six and being told to get on stage and be funny. in front of people, right? With the speech impediment. So I learned to practice a lot to the point of boredom, read a storybook in front of a mirror 50 times. You get to the point, you're like, Oh my God, here we go again. But you enunciate and you start getting better, right? And so you practice and practice. And so then also acknowledge the fear and put that into what you're doing. Also, if you've ever been an audience member, you've seen speakers that really captivated you. You've also seen ones that were, Ooh, that was off, but mostly you're okay. And you check in and you check out during the speech. It's not all about you, even though you're on stage. And so you can really practice this a lot, but also give yourself some grace. It's going to be fine. So I do a lot of this now. I did an opening recently with Marriott for the addition hotel and Playa del Carmen. And I had 400 people and they tell me right ahead of time. Oh, by the way. The president of Marriott is going to be here at the luxury division. And I was like, and it really freaked me out, right? And I'm like, what are you doing? Play your intro music, get on there. Here are the three things I'm going to speak to you about today. Excellence, focus, inspiration, and then do your thing, right? And I really had a good time with it, and it went fine, and she congratulated me after. But again, it's that trip up of, oh no, right? So I think, knowing yourself, but also, then my hot buttons, and then also, do I know my material? What do I really want to think about? And my advice is always, Tell the audience in the beginning, here's what I want to speak to you about today. And then format a presentation around that. And then practice it and practice it to the point you're look bored. And then have some fun with it. Because once you have fun with it, the audience has fun too.
Lan Elliott:I love the theme of practicing. I'm being prepared. That's something that I think anybody could do, right? It's not just about having the skills to get up there and do it. Everyone can practice and do it at home until they feel more comfortable with it. So I think that's wonderful advice. And also just to get out there and do it. Sometimes it's scary, but just step on the stage and if you've practiced, then once you get the first few words out there, it gets better after that.
Jim McPartlin:It does, and I've had material that I've done that I just, crushed it, like on a stage, and then two weeks later, do basically the same speech, and people are like and, you gotta get over that. It's not, you're not gonna hit the Academy Award every time. It's just, there's a lot of dynamics that go into it, and that's fine, right? Are you still having fun? Does it invigorate you? What's that look like? I do think, by the way is that getting some audience participation can be really helpful. I typically will key on two or three people and maybe bring them on stage with me and do a role play or I'll do something because that brings them into it. It's also like theater tricks, if you will, that you'd incorporate. But if it's more of a somber like experience, both of them, of course, pivot and make it that way as well.
Lan Elliott:Wonderful. I love that advice of getting the audience involved, especially early on. Yes. So one of our favorite questions at DEI Advisors is, what advice would you give to your younger self? And being a self insight specialist, we do actually think this question reflects on looking at your career self reflection. And I'm curious, as a self insight specialist, what advice would you give to
Jim McPartlin:your younger self? And I'm not sure my younger self would have listened, to be honest with you so I probably would say, you really need to listen a lot more than you speak. You're going to worry way too much. Do yourself a favor and cut that in half, because my friend, it's going to turn out beautifully. You're going to have the life you wanted and I think sometimes is that we don't pause for a moment and really Have compassion for ourselves And actually say it's you're good Dr. Daniels was sent to be you know One of his little training tips to me as far as working as a type 6 and he also was a type 6 Was sometimes just like pat yourself in the back and say you're doing okay. I thought What a weird piece of advice. I've been doing that now for about 25 years. When I start getting freaked out, it's you're okay. And that just calms me down. And we all have things we can do that can calm us down. But mostly I would just give ourselves some grace and compassion. And for myself, listen more, right? And cut the worry by half. It's all going to work out wonderfully.
Lan Elliott:That's wonderful advice. I do think this part of giving, having some grace for yourself is something that just takes a long time to learn, unfortunately. Wouldn't it be easier if we learned it sooner?
Jim McPartlin:Oh all the gray hair would be a lot darker. It would be much better. For
Lan Elliott:sure. And so as we come to the end, Jim, you've offered such amazing advice, and I've loved learning more about the Enneagram with you. Could you perhaps share one last nugget of advice with our audience, maybe for people who are struggling to advance their careers, what advice would you offer them?
Jim McPartlin:Don't let anybody tell you that you can't have your dream, because you can. Right now it takes commitment. We all want stuff. I want, but what are you committed to? But don't let anybody tell you can't have it because you actually can and do so joyfully. Now that doesn't mean that you don't honor your responsibilities, whatever that looks like, right? But I do think that you could actually say, actually, here's my goal. I want to do this. I want to write a book. I want to write a book. I want to write a book. And my better half, who's also a type one said to me several years ago, So when are you going to do that? I can't because I'm a type six. I started, no, you actually can. And so you start focusing, and focusing. And I'm very clear when I do speeches with young people, especially do not let anybody tell you, you can't have your dream. And what I do now in an audience participation is I'll make people take five minutes, get a partner and write down. something they really want to accomplish the next five years. And I'll bring four or five people on stage. It is amazing what comes out of that, right? And a young man recently write to me and just say, wow, I loved it. And I'm going to be a chief engineer of a luxury hotel. I'm going to do this. I'm focused. I'm committed to it. I was like, good for you. And I think those sorts of things is that sometimes it's all be a famous actor, actress. Cool. If that's what you want to do, that's great, right? But there are all sorts of things you can do. You just got to take the path. In your 20s, you have all these options. They're great. Your 30s, they start getting less because you still have more responsibilities. Your 40s, lot of responsibilities. But what people don't really understand is that this is just more clarity. It's a window. It's a door. If you will, at some point, step through the door and go into the next part of your life.
Lan Elliott:That is a wonderful way to cap off our conversation. I love that last bit of advice. Thank you so much, Jim, for being here. Thank you. And for our audience, if you've enjoyed this incredible conversation with Jim, I hope you will go to our website and look for other interviews with industry leaders. And Jim, thank you once again for being
Jim McPartlin:on. It's a pleasure. Thank you so much. Have a good weekend.
Lan Elliott:Thanks, you too.