Bashar Wali, Founder and CEO, This Assembly and Practice Hospitality, Interviewed by Rachel Humphrey

Bashar discusses the many ways his passion and love for hospitality fuel his career journey. He talks about public speaking, how self-care means something different to everyone, and how he took every opportunity to learn through doing. Bashar shares what he's curious about, how his patience has both gotten better and worse over time, and taking risks.

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Rachel Humphrey 0:02

I am Rachel Humphrey with It's Personal Stories, a hospitality podcast, and I'm really excited to be joined on the show today by Bashar Wali, the founder and CEO of This Assembly and Practice Hospitality. Bashar, welcome to It's Personal Stories.

Bashar Wali 0:16

Thank you for having me. Delighted to be here.

Rachel Humphrey 0:19

We are going to jump right in, and everybody knows that one of the reasons I love the hospitality industry so much is that we each carve our own path forward. to leadership. No two paths need to be exactly the same. So tell us a little bit about your journey, where you started out, how you got where you are today and if there were any pivotal moments along the way that you really think shaped that trajectory for you.

Bashar Wali 0:40

Happy to. So I grew up in the Middle East and we have a quote that goes as follows. When a stranger shows up at your door, feed him for three days before you ask him who he is, where he's from or where he's going to, because by then he'll either have the strength to answer. You'll be such good friends. It won't matter. So it's interesting this hospitality thing that we all sort of overcomplicate. In my opinion, we are all born with hospitality in us. We know how to welcome people. We know how to make people feel good. Some of us are better at it than others, but it's not a educational thing. It really is an innate thing in us humans. So I came to the United States as an immigrant legally. I'd like to underscore and emphasize that to go to college. I went to Johnson and Wales University in Providence, Rhode Island, and studied Hotel Restaurant Management. And frankly, I was a pretty terrible student. I recall never buying a book ever, like I'd borrow it from a friend the night before, from the library. I worked full time to go to college, but I felt like, What are they teaching me in college about hospitality? I'm confused. Mathematics accounting, et cetera, were interesting. Got out of college and literally worked as a PBX operator, which was interesting for a non native speaker to be answering the phone. And I'm sure a lot of young audience don't know what that means. PBX operator. I know it wasn't one of those plug in the cables. It was an actual phone. And that was it. That was the very first job and very last job I ever applied for really worked from the ground up. And I always felt that getting your hands dirty, as it were, was really the way to learn rather than sitting in a classroom and learning it somehow. Dealing with people that are on the outside guests or on the inside teammates was the way you're going to grow. And I was one of those guys who literally never said no to anything. I worked absolutely every department and not in a fancy management training program. I actually cleaned toilets and made beds and cooked in the kitchen and dishwashed as part of my desire to learn and grew from there. Learned account. I've done accounting. I did back a house. I did front of house, then managed one hotel that managed multiple hotels, then pivoted into the real estate side of the business, always within hotel companies, deploying capital, acquiring refinancing, et cetera. So then I felt I really gave myself through hard work, a very well rounded education. On the ground in the school of hard knocks. And you ask about pivotal moments. There's a couple of them. One was I had this mentor GM who was young as a GM. He was 28 at the time, I think. And my goal was to like beat him. I was like, I am going to beat you. I'm going to make GM younger than you. And I recall my first GM job was. 27 in a 300 plus room property that is Union. And it was such a big learning experience because I walk into a staff meeting and I'm literally the youngest person in the room by a lot and really understanding what it takes. To earn people's respect regardless of your age or your background or your education. So those were formative moments in my career But the one I like to talk about the most goes as follows I am a front office manager at some hotel And the vice president of the company walks by and this guy is like three levels four levels above me And he says hey you do a good job here. I said great. Thank you. He says do you want a promotion? I said sure he said, okay, why don't you go to this hotel? And we'll give you a promotion. I said okay, when do you want me there? He goes This was a Tuesday. He goes, can you be there next Monday? I said, sure. So I go there next Monday, I do my thing. And I was doing the job of rooms, division manager from for office manager, six months go by guy walks by. He goes, Oh yeah, you're here now. I forgot you're here. Did we ever adjust your title or your salary or anything? I said, no. He says why didn't you ask? I said, cause I knew you would eventually catch on to it and gave me more money than I would have never asked for in a bigger title that would have asked for. And the reason why that moment really resonated with me. And I tell people. Do good work and the money will come But if the money is your North Star, you'll make a lot of bad decisions along the way. This was a great move for my career and I ended up getting more out of it than I would have ever asked. So if you do what you love and you're passionate about it, all the other things will catch up. But if you're only doing it because you're building a title for your resume or trying to get more money, I think ultimately it backfires and it does not give you the word you The rewards you would have gotten.

Rachel Humphrey 4:58

So many great lessons in there. Certainly the learn by doing. I love the concept to of your title doesn't automatically give you respect. That's something you have to earn regardless of what level you are in your career. And then certainly to follow the work and the passion and the money will come. That brings me to a couple of aspects of leadership that I'd really love to follow up on. One is this idea. I hear sometimes people are like, I knew I was born to be a leader. I was born to be a CEO. And others say to this day, I don't even know if I consider myself a leader from that standpoint. Where do you fall on that spectrum of things? Did you feel like you were always bred to be a future leader?

Bashar Wali 5:40

Really interesting question. And I'd be arrogant to say I did. I obviously didn't. I came from very humble beginnings. I, like I said, I worked full time in college to pay for myself. There's always this, one of my favorite quotes is lead, follow, or get out of the way. And I feel like in often in situations, and I'll tell you an actual story about this, I felt like I. Because nobody else did. I didn't do it because I was smarter or better or more educated, but I just did it and no one else did it. And I remember there was a transition period for GMs. I was for office manager or hotel and the GM left and another was going to come. The vice president when the new GM came gave him a turnover report and the turnover report said in it Bashar Wali really good guy works hard. However, he sometimes thinks he's the GM and when he's not and I'm saying Yeah, I did because there was no one else there was a vacuum There was a gap and I stepped in not for glory not for anything But I always took ownership in what I did And if there was a decision to be made and no one was going to make it I stepped up and I made it and took The responsibility for making it I was willing to put You Myself, my job, my career on the line, because I knew someone had to make the decision. So this idea of leadership, I think there's something innate in us that allows us to be those people that are, the leaders or the followers. But can someone be taught it? Absolutely. Did I think I have it? No, but I think through trial and error, I realized I had it because I was the guy who's stepping up to the plate when nobody else did with no fear. That's the thing is you cannot be afraid. And you have to be vulnerable and we learned this through the pandemic by the way this idea Great leaders are very vulnerable. They don't know everything. They don't pretend to know everything And I was always the guy that said I know nothing about this. I'll give it a shot I'll jump up and try it and I think you'll learn along the way and you get respected for it that way

Rachel Humphrey 7:28

I actually have some follow up questions. I want to ask you about leadership But i'm really interested in what you were just talking about how you left one role for another role, not knowing what it was, not knowing what it would lead to. Do you consider yourself in general a risk taker? Do you think that's what would define you as a human? Do you find it in your career, but maybe not in other parts? What are some of the risks that you think you've taken? How do you analyze them and decide which ones are worthwhile?

Bashar Wali 7:55

Honestly, again, yes, I am a very big risk taker. If I believe passionately about something I'm not gambling. It's not a gamble I have to strongly be have the conviction that this is the right thing that I must do And i'm willing to take the risk for it and I say look i'm going to do it I'm going to do my best and if my best isn't good enough That is all I can give it and that is all I can offer So I never worry about am I good enough? Am I not good enough? I always know that i'm going to give it my all And if I'm not smart enough or if I'm not hardworking enough, I gave it my all in my opinion. And if that wasn't good enough for you, then it wasn't on me. It was on you, so to speak. But look, when you're young and you don't have a lot of responsibilities, you don't have a family, you don't have a mortgage. It's a lot easier, obviously. But if there are other people depending on you, particularly in the work construct, like I am not going to take a risk in a hotel that I'm managing that could backfire and end up causing people their jobs or their hours, but if it's for me personally, and it doesn't have an effect on those around me, I will absolutely take the risk and, no guts, no glory as it were, but you have to be Passionate about it. Don't just do it because it's risky and you want to take the risk do it because you absolutely Positively believe in what it is that you're doing because 99 percent of the time I think passion is what gets us there More than skill more than hard work is passion really drives a lot of what we do Again in our industry if I am operating on someone's brain, I am NOT taking any risk I'm gonna follow the book but for what we do what is taking risk? Think about it. It really isn't that complicated. We're just housing people in our homes every day. That is all that this business is all about, in my opinion.

Rachel Humphrey 9:29

Do you think you take those risks with a lot of fact based data and other things? Is it a gut instinct? Is it some combination of those two things for you?

Bashar Wali 9:39

It's always a combination, but I'm always going to follow my heart more than my head. And if they were competing, my heart's always going to win again, because of the line of business that we're in. So passion, do what you love. And you'll never work a day in your life. I don't want to perpetuate these corporate taglines as it were, but I truly believe in it. I am. I am so lucky because I don't work. This is not work. I wake up in the morning. Excited jumping out of bed. First I get up for that cup of coffee. That's my drug, but then I'm excited about what I do. I love what I do. And I tell people often, if it doesn't set your soul on fire, it is not worth the burn, do not do it. If leadership is not your thing, don't do it. That's okay. We need as many leaders as we do followers. We can't all be leaders, right? And that's why I think it works because we have some people that are adverse, they don't want it and others that do. So that tension and that balance is what makes everything work really well.

Rachel Humphrey 10:31

I love that thinking about your leadership evolution. There are areas that as we continue to progress, we either through practice or through study and intentionality become much better. And then sometimes, as we progress, there are things that get worse over time. Can you think of something in your leadership style that has maybe gotten better over time? And then maybe something that's gotten a little worse over time.

Bashar Wali 10:59

As I have the patience of a 3-year-old on a sugar diet. I say, so understanding that the nuance of learning styles, like I'll say something to someone and I'll be what are you waiting for? Let's go. Let's go. Go. I told you, and this idea of some people need to process, like they need to take a minute to process. My brain can't understand that concept. I'm like, I told you. It's easy. Go don't process, just go. So I feel like I've gotten a lot better in understanding, learning styles from colleagues, people that work for me, people that I work with, because it just makes you a better leader because we in art, we, a personalities. Assume the whole world is like us, and God, if the whole world was like me, I do not want to live on this planet. So really understanding that difference in learning style was crucial for me to become a better leader, to really take it all in and make sure that I give people the space they need to take the information in the way they need to do it, not the way I expect them to do it. In the very same token, I feel like my patience has run even less than it was before. But it's something you have to really work on because it's not about me. It doesn't matter. It is not about me. It's about others. And another one that I feel like I've improved on a lot is this idea we talked about in a minute ago of vulnerability and the pandemic was a fantastic example. Because here I am, I'm standing in front of a bunch of, teammates that are looking to me for guidance and I'm looking at them and I'm saying, guys, I've never done this before. I have no idea, but we're in it together and we're going to get through it together. But I don't know any more than you do. I don't know what happens tomorrow. I don't know when we're going to reopen. I don't. And I think when you don't pretend people respect you for it, but Your job is also to assure. So you don't want to create panic. So vulnerability isn't about creating panic and not has been vulnerability has been a skill that I've really honed in over time. And I think I've gotten a lot better at it. I'm willing to tell you, I have no idea. Let's figure it out together rather than pretending to know everything. So I'll have more patience for more things, but less patience for more things. So I guess it's a dual double edged sword as it were.

Rachel Humphrey 13:03

It's interesting. I've actually heard. Recently, several people identify patients as one of their depleting skills. So maybe there's something to that, whether it be timing or where we are in our careers, or as we learn to develop other skills, that's something that maybe and having,

Bashar Wali 13:21

and having children teaches you, obviously you can't they are, in fact, my wife often will say, dude, We don't work for you. Like you've got to do it on the you can't be this go, very systematic thing. And again, learning styles. It really is fascinating when you dig deeper into it. They're not slower. They're not less intelligent. They're not less hardworking. It just, their brain is wired differently. So while my information goes from here and comes out immediately and it's ready, there's takes a longer path, but it doesn't mean it's, in fact, I'd argue it's probably better because they're more thoughtful about the response. They're not just jumping in like I would. Which has gotten me in trouble sometimes

Rachel Humphrey 13:59

and you talked about having vulnerability and really being something that came to the forefront during the pandemic. I think that a lot of us have talked about that. It is 1 of maybe the lasting. Impacts of the pandemic from a leadership standpoint is much more vulnerability from a lot of our leaders, whether it be sharing or admitting that we don't know how to do things or leaning into maybe a more empathetic side of leadership. So I think that's you hit that 1 right on the head

Bashar Wali 14:26

and people respect you more for it. I

Rachel Humphrey 14:28

agree. 100%. And that's one of the things I love actually about this podcast is how vulnerably everybody shares their stories, their strategies, the things that they think they're strong and the things that maybe could use some improvement. One of the things that I have found fascinating about this podcast series is how many leaders have identified their curiosity as one of the things that they think has really propelled their careers. Whether it was like you of saying if nobody else raises their hand, I'm going to. Step up and do it, or I went to work in all of these different areas so that I understood the whole business, whether it's teaching ourself new skills or developing new areas. Is that something you would, a way you would describe yourself and I'm, I am curious about something that Bashar is curious about today. Maybe one thing in the hospitality industry and one thing in life in general.

Bashar Wali 15:19

So I, I think the curiosity part, and you already know this, Rachel, I think I have. The neurotic relationship with hotels that is a one night stand. My claim to fame is I never stay in any hotel more than once or one night out of curiosity. So if I'm in New York three nights, I move three times. My current count in Manhattan is 251 hotels in Manhattan. And if that isn't curiosity, I don't know what it is. And I tell people I'll stay at luxury, ultra luxury and pay whatever. And I'll stay at a hostel and share a room with people doing sketchy things in the middle of the night. And it really has informed my thinking about. How I think about hotels. I learned a lot of things. By the way, I learned almost more from the lower end than the higher end, because they're more scrappy. They have to think of different ways to do things that come easy to the higher end because they have the budgets for it. So I would say I am a very curious person in general, particularly for my industry. Cause I'm always looking for ways to do better. And I tell people the minute you think, everything you're dead, nothing I know absolutely nothing. And I learned more and more every day. Now, interestingly enough, I feel like we hospitality. Hotels generally have gone to the same well again and again and we expect different results and I say, okay Maybe I should look elsewhere and where I've been looking more and more is retail I feel retail came to the brink of extinction as it were And necessity is the mother of all inventions. So they had to reinvent themselves So as I look at them, i'm in portland, oregon as we speak. Nike is here. I look at Nike When you walk into a retail store, Nike knows you're not there to buy anything because you could probably buy it cheaper online, not pay taxes if you live in a tax free state, shipping is free etc. Why do you want to carry it with you? But they know that they have to build loyalty with you to the brand. So they've thought of their stores now as experiential places where you go in. To create loyalty to the brand, not to buy a pair of shoes. So I am looking more and more at retail and how they're addressing the future and the customer to learn from them, to bring it into hospitality. In fact, I say we hotels hate people that want to transact with us. We want to make it harder for them by step 72 on the booking engine. I'm on the zip code field and you're making me have to change my keyboard from alpha to numerical. Meanwhile, I go to Instagram. I see a pair of shoes I like, and literally within two clicks, someone is knocking on my door, like your shoe is here. So really understanding what's happening with retail has been very interesting. Now, broadly in life. I hate trends because by definition they have a shelf life, they expire quickly. I'm a keen observer of human behavior, which takes decades, sometimes centuries to change. So I'm watching how generationally the millennials, the younger millennials and the Gen Zers, how they're interacting with the world, what's important to them, what gets them excited. We're watching a lot of Literally generational shift between us and those generations and how they interact with hotels is of great interest to me. And I'm really a keen observer of it to see how we can pivot to accommodate their needs.

Rachel Humphrey 18:13

You said two things there that really resonated with me. One is learning from other industries. I think that's such an important thing, especially because hospitality tends to be maybe among the least innovative of so many, you mentioned doing this. But I loved what you said about the generational because of course you and I know that you and I met recently through a panel that was talking about generational impacts on the hospitality industry from a booking standpoint, from a marketing standpoint, and it's one of the most interesting conversations that I have probably had this year because it's, there's so much to learn. to learn and it changes every single day. So when you talk about innovation or the lack thereof, there's such a great opportunity within the industry for innovation there. You also told me when we first met about the never staying in a hotel more than one night and I am Fascinated by it. I'm overwhelmed by it. It would not work with my personality. Although I never want to go back to the same city twice or the same country twice. I understand all of that, but talk a little bit about managing business travel in the weeks leading up to now. You've been gone to many countries over many days. You're on the road, a pretty consistent part of the year. Tell me a little bit about, do you have tricks you use for managing business travel? And are you able to incorporate because of your love of the industry Maybe your personal life or your family into that business travel as one of your strategies.

Bashar Wali 19:36

First of all, I love doing it all myself. I don't rely on a third party, not an assistant or a travel agent or anything. Because to me, learning part of the experience is the guest journey. I want to go on your website. I want to see how easy it is. I want to get the confirmation email. I want to learn from that as well. So I do it all myself. Now, in terms of managing it or incorporating my family in it, I don't necessarily incorporate my family into my business travel, but I do a lot of traveling with my family. And I think I've talked about this on the panel you mentioned, and I'll touch on a little bit about how we, I want to be in the New York Times, like every hotelier wants, because it's good for our ego. Yet, at the end of the day, I took a trip to Asia with my daughter, a 10 day trip. She booked everything. That I would not have found on my own and I loved every single one and she did it all on TikTok. So when I talk to colleagues in the industry my colleagues and I say listen It's nice to be in the New York Times so you can brag about it at a party Go be where your customers are. Yes, New York Times is good for ego But TikTok is where the action is at the moment then that'll change. So in terms of managing my travel I really do like to try different channels whether it's I've booked on TikTok I've got found hotels through Instagram, etc and But any tricks, look, people ask about jet lag to your point. I just came off of a London, Dubai, Saudi Arabia, Colorado and back home to me. It's, you have to really be part of the destination you're going to. I love this quote about travel and I use this a lot, even in business travel, a tourist sees what he came to see. A traveler sees what he sees. I am a traveler. I will go. I will roam aimlessly. I will go sit at a coffee shop next to someone and start talking to them. It's less about the monuments and more about the emotions in those moments. And I think it informs how I think about my hotels because we've all talked about this idea People want to come to your hotel. They want to meet locals in the lobby. They want to feel like a part of the neighborhood. We talk about it, but we don't execute on it. So how do we bring this idea of community, again an overused term, into our hotels is something I think about a lot. But managing my travel is neurotic to your point. I'm the last minute guy who will book it the day before. So I don't have any tricks or hacks to get a better, but, and because I move a lot, it really isn't, Consequential. It seems because I'm constantly moving, but people say, how do we build loyalty with you? And I say, the only places I go to twice. Are the places that acknowledge me as a human, not as a statistic, not as a VIP, but as an actual person, those are the places I will go to more than once. So again, finding the human connection, even in business travel, doesn't matter what kind of travel, that's what I'm looking for.

Rachel Humphrey 22:02

I love that you book it all yourself, too, something I do as well, because you get to know and then you make decisions based on your experiences there. As I mentioned a couple minutes ago, we met. through a panel earlier this year. And one of the things we hear a lot from rising leaders is either the lack of public speaking or their fear of public speaking, they think is one of the biggest hurdles to their path to leadership. Coming into this industry, the way that you did being an immigrant into the U. S. Is public speaking something you've always been comfortable with as part of your journey? Do you have strategies you use? I can guess from our interactions, not a whole lot. But talk about your evolution maybe for public speaking and how that journey has been for you.

Bashar Wali 22:49

Look I, again, non native speaker, right? I remember by the way, my most embarrassing English story ever. I'm 10 people and some person asks me a question and says the word reciprocity. And I'm drawing a blank. I'm like, what the hell is that? What does it mean? I literally have no idea. So for a while I was reluctant because of English, but then I said, listen, it doesn't matter. Back to really back to the thing of passion. If you're passionate about something, whether it's broken English, whether you look fully dressed to the T or not, it doesn't I never leave a room. Ever where someone doesn't say, man, that guy is really crazy about this industry. They may say he's annoying. They may say he's not super smart. They may say any of that stuff. It doesn't matter. But I've never been in a setting where someone didn't say, good God, that guy really is crazy about what he does. And to me, that's ultimately what makes me comfortable on stage. Clearly over time, the more you do it, the more comfortable you are. And to your earlier comment, I hate preparing for anything because I feel that then it comes across rehearsed. I have a point of view. I will not disrespect you with my point of view, but I will not shy about my point of view. And again, authenticity is one of the most overused words of today. Authenticity to me means an unapologetic point of view. So I feel that when I stand on stage and if I deem myself an expert in there, in my industry, what preparation I should, if I have to prepare, then I'm not an expert. I'm not good enough. I should not be leading a hotel company. If you're going to ask me about some other subject that I'm not is not my field. I may need to prepare, but if it's my business, what am I preparing? I may have to refresh my number on my memory on our numbers, if you're asking me anything specific, but otherwise I just show up as me. I have a point of view. I speak authentically about my point of view. I never disrespect. Now I will be blunt. I've called out some brands on stage about some silly things I've done. I will say that, but not disrespectfully. So I think when you don't have a brand, you are your own brand. And I think as leaders, we are our own brand. And I have worked very hard on building my brand. And by the way, I often get offered money to speak. And I say, no, I always turn it down 100 percent because I don't want to be a paid speaker to me that has negative connotations with it. But if you're a leader and you want to build your own brand, you've got to work hard at it. And if you're not comfortable publicly speaking practice.

Rachel Humphrey 25:07

And I love to, if you know your topic and if you're passionate about it. You should be picking things that fit that area. And then it becomes less overwhelming. Possibly. You just mentioned first of all, you've talked about a lot of your guiding principles. I think a lot of your North stars throughout the course of our discussion, but just mentioned personal brand as well. Talk to me a little bit. Do you have one guiding star that you follow that you think this is really what, how I evaluate decisions or how I want to be known?

Bashar Wali 25:38

I hate to go back to what I repeated in nauseam already. I want to be known to be passionate about what I do. And by being passionate about what I do, I think it doesn't matter what the outcome is. I've done it with passion. I've done it with love. And if it succeeds, great. But if it doesn't, I still love the process of doing it. So to me again, really, I cannot say it enough. Listen, our industry at the end of the day, it's not a great industry. Days and weekends, 365 days a year, 24 seven. We're probably on the pay scale on the lower end. So people who love this industry aren't doing it for any other reason other than love. And I say to them, if you don't go to something else, it is far easier. It'll probably pay you more hours. So my personal mantra has been, I love what I do and it shows, and I speak about it and my public speaking, by the way, in addition to being a personal brand, it's also my way of giving back. So hopefully if someone I've done a TEDx talk that I know a couple of universities use in their sort of freshmen classes about hospitality. And that to me is such a heartwarming thing. I don't want to. Write a book and sell it. I want to inspire new leaders to follow this path. Those who have love for this industry. So my personal brand and my personal mantra is. Again, do what you love. You'll never work a day in your life. And if it doesn't set your soul on fire, it's not worth the burn. Just love what you do. It's not worth it. Life's too short.

Rachel Humphrey 26:55

In the short amount of time of knowing each other, I would say that describes you to a T. We are going to run short on time as I knew we would. So many things we want to talk about. I'm going to ask you a couple of rapid fire questions just to wrap up today. But one of the other things that I think has come out of the pandemic is a renewed focus on self care and wellness. Especially for our employees, our teams, our families. Do you think that is something that is important to you? Has it always been the case? Are there ways that you take care of yourself? And that, some people equate it certainly with fitness, physical fitness. Others in different ways. But is that?

Bashar Wali 27:34

Look, self care, obviously hugely important. And it comes in different ways, by the way. It's funny, my wife and I argue. She loves to read. I don't. So she's reading, I might be, I don't know, scrolling on social media, and she might mock me for it, and I say listen, that's my version of reading. People, again, back to learning styles and doing things to calm down and take care of yourself. I love finding things. I remember I tell people for example, I know washing dishes was one of my favorite jobs, because when you're washing dishes, The whole world could be on fire. It doesn't matter. You're focused on the task in front of you. So when I find things that allow me to turn my brain off and really be focused on what's in front of me, that those are the things how I take care of myself, you will be delighted to hear. My wife is also that I love cleaning like I love cleaning like deep cleaning things because that again makes me focus on nothing but that task that's in front of me. So you'll see me zipping around the house doing random things picking up because it allows me to turn my brain off and focus on the task in front of me. And I tell people and it really is half joking but What I do for fun in my free time is I think about where am I going next and what a trip am I booking next and where part of the world do I want to see. So travel for me is absolutely oxygen. It is what gets me up in the morning, what gets me excited. There's a big world out there and I want to see it all. So for me, self care comes in different flavors. For me, it is finding the one thing that might help me turn my brain off, monkey brain as it were. That's how I take care of myself and it comes in different ways.

Rachel Humphrey 28:57

Women everywhere tuning into this podcast are going to suggest to their husbands that clean deep cleaning is self care. So we all thank you for that. Everyone knows. I love this final question of advice to our younger selves. I think reflection is so important thinking back now to as you graduated, maybe from Johnson and Wales. Is there something you would tell yourself about either how things turned out or you wish you knew then that today? I

Bashar Wali 29:23

mean, honestly, I would say zero regrets. I do not. I'm not that guy. I have no regrets. Maybe in hindsight, should I've studied? I would be doing exactly the same thing, but maybe I would have studied finance, which I think is more relevant to where I am today than hotel management, which, like I said, I could learn. By doing, but I think the one thing I would say to myself is patience is a virtue, like it took me a long time to really understand and it affects, personal relationships, professional relationships, because by running and not focusing on what's in front of you. What message am I sending to you? My colleague, my employee I want to tell you, you matter. And just being patient and slowing down a little, seeing the forest through the trees, forget about the task in front of you back up a little, understand the bigger picture. So I would say reflect pause for a minute. Don't let the words that come in your head, just come out of your mouth. Just patience truly is a virtue. I'm still learning to this day. Like I said, I've gained it in some places, lost it in other places, but I wish I could tell my younger self. To be a bit more thoughtful and focused and not just jumping, thinking about what to answer rather than actually hearing your question. I did a lot of that and learned the hard way growing up in the industry.

Rachel Humphrey 30:32

Patience is an interesting answer, given the desire to be a GM by 27 and what that would have taken from a trajectory standpoint, but sure, as we wrap up so much great conversation today, but thinking about our motto of empowering personal success, is there any final advice you want to share with our audience?

Bashar Wali 30:52

Again, what I said earlier, the lead, follow or get out of the way. I think don't be afraid to step in, raise your hand, jump in baptism by fire, learn by mistakes, never let a good crisis go to waste as it were. Look at what we've learned from the pandemic. So I would say courage and fear, knowing that we're not saving lives, whatever it is that you do, even if it's a mistake, it's easy enough in our industry. So take chances, be brave, be authentic, Unapologetic point of view, share your opinion. Cause if we know everything, then our industry is going to hell. We need the next generation to step up, raise our hand and say, why are you doing it this way? We should try it this way. So I can't say that enough. Step up, raise your voice, be authentic and be part of it. Don't just be an observer.

Rachel Humphrey 31:36

So much great advice today. I appreciate. You joining us so much, sharing your journey, your passion for the industry, as you talked about earlier today, that comes through in everything that you do. But thank you so much again for sharing your story with us.

Bashar Wali 31:51

Thank you. Delighted.

Rachel Humphrey 31:52

And to those listening at home, we hope you'll head over to itspersonalstories. com and hear from not only Bashar, but the nearly 200 industry leaders that we've had the opportunity to visit with, who've also shared their very personal stories, their journeys to leadership and the lessons they've learned along the way. Thank you again.