Liz Dahlager, Chief Operating Officer & Partner, Mereté Hotel Management, interviewed by Lan Elliott

Liz emphasizes sustained career growth comes from consistently asking what comes next and seeking opportunities beyond defined roles. She explains the importance of expanding perspective by understanding how different functions connect, particularly financial and operational considerations, and encourages professionals at all levels to learn the broader business language. By intentionally exposing herself to unfamiliar areas, she was able to contribute in more meaningful ways and open new opportunities for growth.

Transcript

Lan Elliott: 0:01

Hello and welcome to its Personal Stories, the podcast dedicated to empowering personal success. My name is Lan Elliott with its personal stories, and today I'm delighted to have my friend Liz Dagher, who is the Chief Operating Officer of Merite Hotel Management with us. Welcome, Liz. Hello.

Liz Dahlager: 0:21

Hello Lan.

Lan Elliott: 0:23

Good to finally have you on. Yeah.

Liz Dahlager: 0:25

Thank you.

Lan Elliott: 0:26

Yeah. I've known you a little while, but I would love if you could share a little bit about your journey to leadership and what were some of the inflection points in your career, and do you think there is something that was the reason you were so successful?

Liz Dahlager: 0:45

So I have been in the hotel industry for 25 plus years. Started sales and marketing. And I think for me, the big changes were really moving from an on property to more of a regional or area role on the sales and marketing side, and then. From that point moving into the hotel development side. So those were three big shifts is going from on property sales and marketing to above property. And then saying, okay how you. I didn't wanna be a director of sales forever, and so I was like, okay, I've got this down and I'm, and I figured it out, but I just wasn't sure what the next step was. And that's when I started looking at hotel development and saying, Ooh, that's interesting and my skillset. On the sales and marketing side was an interesting, way to get to that point because, but I had very strong opinions about what brands go and what markets and how to match those. And would talk to operators and developers and question some of their things and then say I have a different perspective just based on my background of working with hotels from a sales and marketing perspective. So I think that those were pretty significant shifts each time, right? To go on property to above property to, and then expanding my. My scope from selling a hotel to, okay, what supports top line performance at a hotel and why, and how can I take that knowledge and build on it to open up some more opportunities for me from a, from a. Based from a job perspective, right? From just a, from a career perspective. And then you add to that going from an employee to an owner, right? So I'm a part owner in the management company. So that's another shift, right? Is how do you take your, a sales and marketing background and go, all the way to where you're overseeing a portfolio of hotels and looking at new business development. And for me, that was really. Another shift just in how I think about things, how I'm approaching things from an owner perspective, et cetera. So those are pretty big inflection points. I'll just throw that out there. Each one was pretty daunting in some ways, I think, but exciting too, right? I wanted to learn something new, so yeah.

Lan Elliott: 3:06

What do you think was, if there was a factor in your success, what do you think that would be?

Liz Dahlager: 3:12

I think I was always looking for what's next. I was always curious or wanting to be challenged. I didn't like to be doing something. I knew really for example, on the sales side, I felt okay, like I. Done it. I know what I'm doing. I know the, all the different segments. I, all the different kind of moving parts. So for me it was always like what's next? What can I do? What, how can I add to whatever I'm doing or contribute in a bigger way would be, maybe a. A better way to say it, but I always was like, what's next? And I still do that, which at times can be challenging,

Lan Elliott: 3:51

but I love the idea of asking for more opportunities. Or asking to learn to grow and to learn new things. I wanted to stay. On that topic. Of curiosity and always looking for what's next and thinking about continuous growth. Because what we've learned from doing this podcast is that a hallmark of great leaders is this curiosity of always wanting to learn new things. And I'm curious if there is a skill you wish you had learned earlier. And if so, how did you develop it?

Liz Dahlager: 4:28

Yeah, I think there's lots of things I probably wish I would've learned earlier, but in, but an easy one, or one that I often will share with people is I didn't go to school for business or finance or accounting really no business classes when I went to college. And that was something I think had I done that sooner or got clued into that. Sooner it would've been helpful, right? So I had to reset my learning when I wanted to expand my my scope of how I work into that, whether it's p and l review or whether it's talking to an investor. So I really had to. I had to do some work on that because it wasn't something I already had. So I did, I read a lot. I took classes, right? I did, I talked to people, but I really probably read a lot. And then I took the hotel asset management and development class at Cornell and it was, that was really helpful in understanding kind of the piece that I was missing. So I think had I learned some of that sooner. I think our operators now, general managers, generally have. Not all, but a lot of them have stronger knowledge in that now than they did when I was coming up in the industry. And again, to be blunt, like I didn't know to ask anyone. I'm sure someone would've told me. But I make it very I don't pass on that mistake. So it's one of the first things I've always wanting people to understand and know. And. I'm very transparent about it with people now that work with me, but they understand from the beginning, not a few years in the bigger picture. And then the skills that they'll need to be able to use that information in a way that's productive.

Lan Elliott: 6:10

That's amazing for a leader to say, okay, this would've helped me earlier. You need to focus on these things. What do you usually recommend that they do?

Liz Dahlager: 6:20

I recommend that they don't limit. For example, think of a hotel department manager or a sales person, right? A hotel sales manager or coordinator even I don't like to limit it even to the managers and say, okay, but this is your piece. But have you looked at all of these pieces and have you talked to those department heads and learned what their top three priorities are and what they're looking at, from a finan, summary, p and l financial overview just. Just the using the language and showing them the impact those things have, I think is, it sounds basic, right? It sounds, of course people should be doing that, but not everybody does. It's busy. You get busy, you're like, this is my part, this is what I'm doing. But as soon as we get them exposed to how that impacts other departments or how other departments have to think about that, first of all, performance improves, right? Because people understand. But I also, I just think it's a piece that we tend to either skip over and assume they already know it or it's not important. You're just doing, just do your part. You're, that's good enough. And those are the things I think that don't serve us now, especially with younger workforce.

Lan Elliott: 7:31

Yeah, I wanted to highlight two, two threads that I heard you talking about, and one of them is not limiting anybody's potential. And to say whatever level you're at, it will still benefit you to understand the bigger picture. Yeah. And then the piece of encouraging people to talk to other departments, learn more about different areas of where you're working. And we've had a number of leaders on the show who've shared that. By being curious and trying to understand all the different areas within their company, it has led to them getting promoted because they were the one that actually understood the greater organization over time.

Liz Dahlager: 8:11

Yes. Yes. Lan. Yes.

Lan Elliott: 8:16

I wanted to switch to this topic that you and I have talked about, the difference between influence and authority. Because a major transition in one's career is when you go from an individual contributor to a manager. Of people and hopefully from there to a leader of people. But no one trains you for any of that. They train you how to do your job, but not really how to manage or lead people. And I say that as being two different things, managing. And it can be really challenging ex. Especially for people who have been very successful as an individual contributor. They're a high performer.

Liz Dahlager: 8:54

Yeah. Yep.

Lan Elliott: 8:54

Individual contributor. Their success has been built by their two hands, everything that they've done themselves. And now they need to learn how to work through other people. Can you talk about this transition and why influence and authority are not the same thing? Ugh.

Liz Dahlager: 9:11

That, that could be, this bias, we could just talk about that probably the whole time. But yes, it's a, I think it's it's a significant challenge and not unique to our industry, but our industry, I think it, it's sometimes is worse because we have so many doers and executors, right? People come up on the under, hotel operations roles and they're the doers, and then we give them a regional role. Role or a BP role and they're used to I joke with our team that people that move, do that transition, you were the like kind of king or queen of the kingdom and everything was great and easy because it was self-contained. When you're managing multiple units or over a larger region, it gets a little more challenging. And so this is something we talk about a lot. And I think, and I dealt with this as well, I thought, oh, I have the title now, so now everyone will just do what I say. Ha. That's a fun one. So I think what the, there's a few things I wanna say about this. One is and I tell leaders and new managers this all the time, is you need to be secure in. Who you are as the leader or manager, that you don't need to prove it because that isn't your job anymore necessarily. Proving by doing so. So they get stuck and I'll just do it. I'll take care of it, I'll micromanage it to whatever, result you need it to be. And it's I don't want that. I want your team to be able to do it without you doing it. Because then I know you're leading or managing them in that way, but that takes some big self-esteem, right? You have to be very secure in yourself to let other people be the doers. And so I talk about that a lot, is, I think that's really key is being secure in yourself as a leader to let other people do. You can coach, you can mentor, you can be curious. You can ask questions, why, did you think that went well? What would you do differently if you could do it again? What did we learn? What could we have done differently? Why did that work? Why did it work this time and not last time, whatever that is. But I think I. Talking through those things from a question and curiosity perspective versus a dictatorship or or just saying, this is the instructions from A to Z every step of the way, right? Saying, Hey, here's the goal, here's. Some guidelines, here's where we're gonna check in about it. But letting them be the doer is so key. And I think you get buy-in, you get more trust when you let go, but that's what I see as the biggest problem specifically in our industry where we just. We'll just go do it. We can do it. And because we were so good, which is why we're in this new role, we're gonna do it really well. But that other person isn't gonna think you're a great leader or a great right. They're gonna be like, okay, they're not gonna be able to sustain that performance. And then you get burnout and all the things on both sides. I work on this still. I work on this every day myself, right? I'm a doer. Most of us in this industry are doers. And so I have to constantly be like, okay, don't do it for them. Ask questions. Be curious. And assume, and I think this is another part of that is assume everybody wants to do a good job. And so that, that does shift your perspective, I think from authority to influence when you know they're trying to do a good job.

Lan Elliott: 12:24

I think just helping them and coaching them.

Liz Dahlager: 12:26

Yeah. Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 12:27

It's always going to be faster if you do it yourself. But you can't scale if you do that. And it doesn't help the people who work for you to learn. No. And so I think you're right. Having the ability to be confident enough to say if I help them learn how to do this and they end up doing it even better than me. I will look good. And I think you do get points for coaching your people and having your team become high performing and like you said, be able to do things. Even without you. So that's,

Liz Dahlager: 12:59

it's, but it's really hard, right? When you're a new,

Lan Elliott: 13:02

it's hard to let go

Liz Dahlager: 13:03

and, yes. And so I think, like I said I say that a lot to people. I'm like, you've gotta, you've gotta trust that you will still get credit, right? Because a lot of these. High performers, high achievers, they also, so they'll be like I see you and you're gonna get the credit. But you've got to, you've got to let your people and influence your people in such a way that, that they can do those things without you being the doer. I think that's the, that's hard. It's hard.

Lan Elliott: 13:31

It's hard. But a critical skill if you're gonna continue to move up. Yeah. Because you can't do everybody's job.

Liz Dahlager: 13:37

You can't do it. Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 13:38

Continue to move up.

Liz Dahlager: 13:39

Yeah,

Lan Elliott: 13:40

let's

Liz Dahlager: 13:40

for sure

Lan Elliott: 13:41

switch over to mentors and champions because a lot of people have said this has been a key component for them advancing in their careers. And I'm curious, how important is it to find champions and mentors? How does one go about it? How have they helped your career?

Liz Dahlager: 14:00

Oh my gosh. I feel like it's a loaded question because, you're one of my mentors. And champions all the things. I, I would not. Be in the role that I'm in, or even in the company that I work with. Had it not been for, I've had multiple throughout my career and amazing people. The general things I wanna share really are around you don't need just one. I think having multiple with different perspectives and different kind of interest, knowledge, whatever that might look like for me, I have mentors from the sales side that I still talk to, right? That. Supported me early on. I have people like you that I reached out to back in the day that I was like, Hey, I need to learn about hotel finance and development stuff and I don't understand, but then I have others that are not in the industry, that are just sounding board and I won't say life mentors, but right. And so I think having multiple, I think, and then when you're working with a mentor, I've done formal coaching slash mentoring and informal and I think both have their place and value. But I think understanding the differences and respecting people's time when it's not a paid coaching or mentoring thing is just being respectful. Being prepared, right? You don't want the mentor to feel like this is just another thing they have to do. You wanna just make sure that it's, that you're just respectful of their time. I think. The last thing I'll say. Is, there's a quote I do a mentorship, IRLI call it presentation. I've done it a couple times locally for industry gatherings and it's mentorship in real life for us. Older people that don't know my, it's IRL, right? It's in real life. Because it's such a thing, especially for women in the industry that mentorship seems like you need a mentor. And they're like do I get one? What do I do? And so I break it down in real life here's formal, informal, here's what you can say, here's how you should react if you ask someone and they say no, which has happened to me. But I love that a mentor. There's a quote, there's lots of, Oprah says something like this too, but it's basically, it's not somebody who walks ahead of you to show you how they did it. It's somebody that walks alongside you to show you what you can do. And that idea of having people that are with you along your journey, whatever that journey is to just show you what is possible. Is I think the best thing, and for me, you know this firsthand to sh to have people in my life along the way that just said, Hey, have you thought about this? You could do this. And those little nuggets can be life changing. And for me they have been, I would, like I said, I wouldn't be an owner. At Merit without Mo probably I can name three people that influenced me in that decision or opportunity. And that's, that's amazing. So I think there's huge value in both formal and formal mentors, champions people that you can. That have gone down some of the roads before. And that doesn't mean you have to do it the same way, but just have knowledge that you don't have that you're not gonna get in a book.

Lan Elliott: 17:10

So true. Not everything is in a book and

Liz Dahlager: 17:14

or online.

Lan Elliott: 17:15

You may not find the right book at the right moment when you need it. And I do think though, that asking for help is a bit vulnerable to Yes. Especially if you are trying to put on this idea that you're perfect and you know what you're doing and then asking for help can be a bit vulnerable. And it's something that you and I have talked about in the past, so I wanted to. Touch on the topic of vulnerability as a strength, because years ago you introduced me to Brene Brown, who I love, and for those who don't know her, she's a researcher first and a storyteller.

Liz Dahlager: 17:55

Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 17:55

But she has spent decades studying courage, vulnerability, shame, and empathy. And one of the things I learned. Through Brene Brown, as she discovered in her research, that vulnerability is actually a connector, not a weakness. Could you talk about that concept and how you utilize this in your leadership style?

Liz Dahlager: 18:22

Yeah, I think it's back to what I said earlier, it's also being transparent, right? So when you're being transparent. Maybe with a bus, with a big picture business conversation. Talking about the why. All of these things aren't really unique ideas, right? It's a different way to frame it, but I think being vulnerable means being honest and having some built in trust. I think Brene talks about trust a lot and being kind. Is being honest. And all of those things work really well at work. And for me, I think it's back to assuming that people are doing the best they can every day with whatever's happening and coming at conversations, meetings, whatever's going on, knowing that, trusting that, and then being honest and, and forthcoming about whatever it is that's, that we're addressing, dealing with whatever we're working, maybe we're working on a project together, whatever that is. So I just, I think that just gives you a really strong foundation. I think for me it shows up in, easy examples recently, if I don't have the answer I'm a fairly recent COO of a company. I just told you I didn't go to business school, so yeah, there's some vulnerability where I have to sometimes be like, okay, explain this to me. I, these aren't my questions. But it's not hiding under, back to what we said, it's not, I'm not being insecure, right? I'm trusting that I don't have to be the doer and that I don't have to know all the things. But I can be that way because I have trust with the people I work with in that, I know that they've got me too, from that regard or from that perspective. Yeah. It's not easy. And I think that's why Brene talks about it or talks about it, when she brought up that idea back in the day. It's not easy. It takes a lot of work, a lot of, quieting some self talk, right? Where you're like, oh, what are people gonna say if I don't know, or if somebody else doesn't know and I, you don't wanna call them out. It's just it's something you have to work on constantly. And it's not, I don't think to the people that are super. Successful long-term in the professional corporate world that it is an easy default, right? We literally have to be like, okay, I need to unlearn some things and then be conscious about that approach. Everyone's doing the best they can. It's okay to explain all of the reasons why, or that I don't know something. And it's okay if they don't know something, right? It's almost like that psychological safety, same idea.

Lan Elliott: 21:02

Absolutely. And I do think the idea of vulnerability being a connector, I think when you see someone who's willing to open up and share with you, yeah, it makes you more willing to do that because Yes, it's nice to see someone who's perfect, but you don't necessarily connect with them and have that kind of. Feeling that you could work together in the same way if you're just working with someone who's always perfect.

Liz Dahlager: 21:29

Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 21:30

I think it's also interesting when Brene first discovered this vulnerability kept coming up, that she tried to research all different ways around the fact that vulnerability being such a positive piece. She did not like that answer at the beginning, and she fought it quite a bit. But the research did come out and so I love that. Thank you for sharing that.

Liz Dahlager: 21:52

Yeah, of course.

Lan Elliott: 21:55

I wanna switch over to parenthood And the workplace. Because we've talked about new parents facing a number of challenges when they come back to work. After having a baby. And I don't just mean moms, yeah. Dads as well. There are dads who want to be involved with their children. And what advice do you have for new parents and what advice do you have for colleagues of new parents?

Liz Dahlager: 22:20

Yeah, I think, I talk about this again quite often on other interviews because I'm a mom, right? And I came up in this industry. Like in a hotel on the hotel side. And I've seen the scheduling and I, anyway, so I've been impacted, I think, on both sides. So it's just a, it's a topic that I think. Is always front of mind for me as I try to think about how is our industry gonna evolve. So my advice to new parents really is around being intentional and communicative both, and that goes for employer and employee. There's a lot of assumptions that get made when somebody goes on parental leave. I won't even say maternity at this. Point, right? Because their spousal leave, et cetera. They assume they don't want any more career growth. They assume they might want reduced hours. They assume they're not gonna be available for an after hours event. All these assumptions happen and nobody talks about them. And then on the flip side, the employee probably has assumptions or they don't know. Parenting could be, the first time it's new and they don't know how they're gonna feel. I can tell you how many conversations I've had, with women because they're the ones that are giving birth who are like, oh, I'm coming right back. And then I'm like I get, I hear you totally support that, but let's just see what happens because you might have different feelings. And so I always, and I don't hold them to those feelings either way. I'm like, I get it, but I just try to be like, just give yourself some time.'cause you don't know how you're gonna feel and it's probably gonna change. Throughout your whole parenting journey of what that looks like. And so my big things are being intentional about people that are returning from leave. So as an employer, being intentional about having a conversation. What are the expectations? What, what are your goals? How often should we check in on this and what's working and what's not working? And then on the employee, if you're on the employee side, same thing. Be intentional, be communicative, say, Hey, I'm all in. I'm, nothing's gonna change. Okay, great. If it does change, let us know. Or, Hey, I don't think this is gonna work for how I'm gonna be doing this, so what are my options? What can I do or how can we figure this out? I think those are the two things I think that get skipped a lot is what is the intention, and then let's talk about it instead. There's always assumptions made and things get done, and then it's wait, did we ask them what they wanted?

Lan Elliott: 24:39

People can get nervous to ask them, right? Yes. It's a little bit of a scary conversation. Yes. Should I ask you, should I not ask this? Is it appropriate to ask this, but

Liz Dahlager: 24:49

yeah. Employer,

Lan Elliott: 24:49

the other option is just assume what they want.

Liz Dahlager: 24:53

But I think. Back to your vulnerability and being a good employer and, you can tie, I love people that talk about life, work balance, but won't talk about this. So it's like you can't, this is part of that, and so I really feel like those, the intention and communication and not assuming anything gets us a lot farther until we can make even. Bigger changes. But I think that alone gets people at least engaged around, Hey, it's not a dead end. Hey, not everything stops because of that. And that's the big thing.'cause we miss people when everything stops or they get ignored because we don't wanna have that conversation. Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 25:34

Imagine that communication being a grateful, I

Liz Dahlager: 25:38

know, I know, right? Just can we just talk about it? But that requires time, right? Older ability. All the things. All the things that nobody seems to have, but we're trying.

Lan Elliott: 25:53

One of our favorite questions on our podcast is, what advice would you give to your younger self? And I'm curious, what would you say to 22-year-old Liz? What would you want her to know?

Liz Dahlager: 26:06

I would say it's okay to slow down. And I don't mean not in pursuit of what your goals and things, but slow down as in it's okay to stop and talk to people and not be so results based. I was very business focused, businessy, for which I, of course, at the time probably thought I was being professional and, a top performer and all those things, but. I think I wish I would've slowed down a little and got to know some people along the way and back to that influence authority piece, but just invested more in my people relationships instead of being so focused on my performance or my team's performance or the results. And it probably would've benefited me to just slow my role a smidge and said, Hey, what do get to know the people that I was working with. I think I I see the value in that now, and I kick myself a little bit because back in the day it probably would've been. A, my performance probably would've been even better, honestly. And then BI would've probably had a better time.

Lan Elliott: 27:15

We have such incredible people in this industry and you get to form such great friendships. Yep. I completely agree with you. I thought I was just doing my work and Yep. Completely missed how important to slow down and build relationships with people would be so I love that advice.

Liz Dahlager: 27:34

Yeah, it's, it sounds, it sounds I think a little I don't know. It wasn't awful. It just was one of those things where I was like, yeah, I could have slowed down. I could have looked up a bit a minute. Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 27:47

Yeah. I love that. Liz, we always have way more to talk about than the time.

Liz Dahlager: 27:53

I

Lan Elliott: 27:53

know this time is no different, but I did wanna ask if you have one final nugget of advice for our audience, knowing that the motto of our show is around empowering personal success. Is there one last piece of advice you'd like to offer?

Liz Dahlager: 28:14

Yeah, I think what I would say, and I'm really speaking to those people that are, just starting, maybe their professional careers in the hotel or hospitality industry is. And again, I see this a lot at our company as well, is people are very back to work life balance focused, which again, is not a bad thing at all. Lots of boundaries. I talk about this a lot and but I would say like looking beyond your role, being engaged outside, back to what I said, instead of focusing on your one little piece of this. This very complex puzzle. How can you contribute bigger? How can again, lack of, this is an old, older phrase, but going above and beyond is a real thing. It's being good at your job is amazing, but looking for. Ways to be curious outside of your role to impact others outside of your role being a team player. Those key things I don't think have changed, and I think they're, they are totally possible and you can still have boundaries. You can still get more money for more work. Like those things are not exclusive. Those are not two things that are ex mutually exclusive. I really would love to see people be comfortable saying. I'm gonna do my job. Here's other things I'm interested in. How can I learn about that? How can I sit in on the meeting? That's what I did. And and it's not about paying your dues. I hear that sometimes, I'm like no. But it's about if you put yourself in those situations and expose yourself to something bigger than what you know, there's gonna be more opportunity for you. And I don't see that as a. Ooh, that's past, I'm not being compensated for that. And ooh, I, I only work these many hours. I'm not saying, go crazy, but just be open to something bigger than that. That's, I just think that's really key and it's really lacking because I think we are, we're, we've gone so far the other way, which again, I fully support. I'm a wor, I was a working mom for many. Like I get it, but I think there is a way to do it. And again, being intentional and communicative to the people you're working with about, Hey, I'm interested in something or I think I can contribute to that because of X, Y, Z. Could I participate? Get your head up, look around and see where you can have impact. That's the, I think that's the biggest thing is I want people that, that are engaged and wanna make a difference and have ideas. If you do those things, there's no stopping you.

Lan Elliott: 30:45

I love that. I love looking around, looking for opportunities, but also asking for them.

Liz Dahlager: 30:50

Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 30:52

Knowing that your role can be bigger if you're curious and you ask for more. Exposure and more opportunity to do things. That is fabulous advice to end on. Thank you so much, Liz, for coming on. I know we wanna do this for a while and I'm so pleased we were able to record today. So thank you so much for being a guest advisor on our show.

Liz Dahlager: 31:15

Thanks for having me. It was great.

Lan Elliott: 31:17

It's a pleasure. And for our audience, if you would like to see more wonderful interviews with hospitality leaders like Liz, I hope you'll go to our website, it's personal stories.com, where you can find many more stories of hospitality industry leaders.