Dr. Leonard Jackson, Program Director, Leven School of Hospitality, Kennesaw State University, interviewed by Rachel Humphrey

Leonard discusses his lifelong hospitality career journey, how mentors from his career have shaped his current leadership, and his mantras that guide him. He shares the importance of nurturing relationships, how his curiosity has influenced him, and how he has developed new skills while evolving many existing ones. Leonard talks about the future of hospitality as seen through the eyes of hospitality school education, one thing about him that would surprise everyone, and his advice to his younger self.

Transcript

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Rachel Humphrey 0:00

I am Rachel Humphrey with its Personal stories, a hospitality podcast. We are a nonprofit dedicated to empowering personal success within the hospitality industry. I'm super excited to be joined today on the show by doc with Dr. Leonard Jackson from Kennesaw State University, and we are gonna jump right in. Dr. Jackson, welcome to the program.

Leonard Jackson 0:21

Oh, thank you, Rachel. Thanks for having me.

Rachel Humphrey 0:24

As everyone knows who listens regularly, one of the things that I really love about the hospitality industry is how unique everyone's path is. You and I can have incredibly different journeys to leadership and yet still end up in hospitality industry leadership. So tell us a little bit about your background. Tell us about maybe some of those pivotal steps, but really who got to you to where you are today?

Leonard Jackson 0:47

Absolutely. Thank you. So my personal journey into this amazing industry started on the sunny island of Jamaica where I was born. I started working in the industry in 1984 at a French boutique style hotel. And I worked my way. I worked there throughout my entire high school and I started off in the back of the house. And as I got older and taller I was moved to the front of the house. I continued my journey in the industry when I moved from Jamaica to Toronto, Canada. And started college there. And while I was working in college, I worked for several different companies. And once I finished college, I worked for Fairmont Hotels and Resorts, Hyatt Hotels and Resorts, and like most professionals, when I started college, I was also working in in the industry. So I was able to pursue all my degrees while I was also working in the industry. One of the beauties of our industry is that hotels are open 365 days. 24 hours. So for college students, you can always find employment in industry. A pivotal moment in my career that led to my current position in academia came when one of my professors Steven Burr he encouraged me to pursue a career in academia. I had no interest in academia to start off, but he saw something in me that I didn't see in myself, and he encouraged me to continue my education and head into academia. So that was a very pivotal moment for me. And following his his advice I was able to pursue several degrees. I ended up with eight degrees.

Rachel Humphrey 2:30

Oh my

Leonard Jackson 2:30

goodness. Eight degrees overall, but it all started with someone who saw something in me that I didn't know I had. And following that journey, I've worked before my current position here at Kennesaw State University, I worked for leading academic institutions such as Central Florida, the Rosen College. Studied at Oklahoma State University and gained a necessary academic skillset that is required for one in academia.

Rachel Humphrey 2:59

That's incredible and so many different leadership themes that I'm looking forward to exploring in a little bit more detail. One of the ones I wanna start with is, you touched on the fact that you've really been in this industry since you were a kid growing up.

Leonard Jackson 3:14

Yes.

Rachel Humphrey 3:14

What is a skill that you learned maybe in that first job you had at the boutique hotel? That you still use in your role today? And then what is one skill that as you were progressing through different roles, maybe you didn't learn in an academic setting, but you knew you had to set out to learn it on your own if you were gonna be successful in your role?

Leonard Jackson 3:36

Yes, absolutely. So quite often, where you start in your career can be so important in terms of how it shapes you as a person, but also as a professional. And I was very fortunate in that the owners of the hotel had a mantra. There's no substitute for excellence. And all employees were required to uphold a mantra of excellence. So that has imbued in me. Just the discipline that whatever endeavors I undertake I should always aspire to execute it at the highest level of quality. So as a professional, I've always looked back at how important working at that resort was for how it has in terms of how it has shaped me as a professional. The owner she has since passed. She, there was always the notion that average is never enough. We'll never be average. We always want to be the best. In terms of something I wish I had learned earlier. I was taught that my work should speak for itself. And I was always that worker who was always relying on my work to speak for itself. So one thing I wish I had learned was, yes, you should always aspire for excellence, but you should also let your boss know what you're doing. That's

Rachel Humphrey 4:53

such good advice.

Leonard Jackson 4:55

Yes, I think it's important. Don't assume that your manager, your supervisor, your boss, they know exactly all the tasks that you are you're accomplishing. You don't necessarily need to brag or boast, but just make sure that you're aware of what you're doing.

Rachel Humphrey 5:10

There's no substitute for excellence is certainly a great lesson to have carried throughout your career and really advocating for yourself. I think you're right. It doesn't mean that you are bragging or that you are taking away from the work you're doing. You're just making sure that those, they've, everybody has a lot going on. So making sure that your supervisors or your management knows what you're doing is really important. Thank you for sharing that. That's such good advice.

Leonard Jackson 5:35

Absolutely.

Rachel Humphrey 5:36

Earlier about having a mentor that saw something in you that you did not see in yourself, and how it really changed the trajectory of your career for you. That's actually something I relate to, and I've talked a lot about having somebody see things and really, not even just encouraging me, but trying to, convince me that I had. Either skills or roles or something that I just wasn't seeing. Talk about the role of mentors, allies, and champions. How do you think one seeks them out? What do you think the role of that can be for students, for rising leaders, but also for seasons, leaders who may need that extra support system?

Leonard Jackson 6:15

Yes. So mentors are very important because they shape how we behave, they shape how we pursue excellence and importantly how we carry ourselves. So my first mentors were my parents, right? So the value system that I have as it relates to my personal life and my professional endeavors as well, were shaped by my parents. Their s value system was one of integrity, one of ethics, and all my decisions or all decisions that I make I'm always ensuring that such decisions are grounded in ethical principles. In terms of champions I think they're very important. So I perceive a champion as someone who's going to vouch for you. Behind your back, right? They're going to stand up for you. They're going to advocate for you when you're not present. So I've always encouraged my students to ensure that yes, you can have mentors, but also carry yourself in a manner so that and others can become your champion without you knowing. And for me it, there has been several champions in my career. It's really hard to single out one, but. Several people have advocated for me without me knowing, and it's all about how I carry myself in a professional manner at all times.

Rachel Humphrey 7:35

I like the differentiation too, between mentors and champions, but that if you continue to behave when you're not intending to be establishing those relationships, that people will see who you are and want to champion for you. So that's great advice.

Leonard Jackson 7:51

Absolutely.

Rachel Humphrey 7:52

Talked earlier about the personal mantra of the resort, where you got your career start, and also that your parents established in you a very high ethical standard. What is the personal brand or the personal mantra that you use as your personal guiding North Star, whether it be in career decisions, personal decisions, how do you look at yourself in a way that allows you to be consistent in your decision making?

Leonard Jackson 8:20

So for me how I'm consistent in my decision making is, it goes back to what I mentioned earlier. All of my decisions are grounded and centered on ethical discipline and ethical discipline. Rachel, I wanna make sure that whatever decisions I make can withstand any scrutiny. So I've always tried to. Ensure that my personal or professional biases do are not interjected into any decisions that I make. It's always about the task that we need to accomplish. So all decisions that I make are task focus, people focus and they all surround the pursuit of excellence.

Rachel Humphrey 9:03

Excellent. One of the things that I have found very interesting as I've interviewed hundreds of guests over the last couple years is this recurring theme of curiosity. Probably a word I would not have used to describe leadership or even myself when I started on this. Journey. But I'm interested, I'm guessing someone with eight degrees has a, an element of curiosity to you. Would you describe yourself as a curious person and how do you really satisfy that drive for curiosity? If so, and then if so, what is one thing that you're very curious about today?

Leonard Jackson 9:38

Absolutely. Thank you. So I'm very curious by nature. So I have an insatiable. Appetite and hunger for learning. And I started, as I mentioned earlier in this industry in 1984. And I've seen how the industry has changed and evolved and mine satiable Appetite for Learning has helped me keep abreast with the changes in the industry. I didn't mention also that I have about 14 professional certifications. So every time there's a significant change in the industry, we do have certifications that we can pursue to keep us abreast. So I've pursued those because I've always believed, I believe, as well, Rachel, that to teach one must learn, right? So as an educator my curiosity for learning has served me well. It has served my stakeholders well because I'm learning. And I'm, I parting the knowledge that I gather onto my students so that they can be better individuals first, but also great talent for our industry.

Rachel Humphrey 10:44

That's incredible. And I, the certificates on top of all of the degrees, I imagine that Correct. Continues forward, that you're never gonna stop being curious and never stop learning there, Dr. Jackson? That's correct. You and I first met, I believe when you were the founding director. For the Michael Levin School of Management, entrepreneurship and Hospitality at Kennesaw State. And in that role over the years, you have an opportunity to impact truly, thousands of lives. The students, the other faculty, your colleagues, and all these people about the future of the hospitality industry, about the industry itself, the love and the passion that comes along with it, the career opportunities. What are you telling students today about career development? What are you, what is, what are they learning? From a leadership standpoint, what are they, what are you focusing on with them? Because we can all learn the substantive matter of different. Majors of different courses, of different roles, but what do you think some of the important leadership attributes are to be teaching the future rising leaders in the industry?

Leonard Jackson 11:53

Thanks for that. Question Rachel, because one of the things I pride myself in is that I spend a lot of time working one-on-one and in group settings with our students. And the things I try to impart on my students is one, the importance of building and fostering professional relationships. Our industry is intricately connected and I tell them all the time never burning the bridges. Because we're so well connected on the other side I also tell them, or share with them the importance of building their personal brands and protecting their personal brands. And I, each one is gonna have their own personal brand, but is this the brand that you want to. Portray is what you're doing representing your personal brand. And as I mentioned earlier, because we're such a connected industry, if you have a brand that's not a solid brand, you can destroy your career very quickly. I also, going back to this whole mantra of excellence, I also tell them that they should always strive for excellent excellence and there are no substitutes for professional excellence.

Rachel Humphrey 13:02

I love that the such an important lesson that you learned at the start of your career. You're now getting to share with others as they begin to start theirs. I think that your former mentor would probably be very pleased to know that she was. Impacting future generations to come. You touched on something really important about building relationships, and I wanted to develop that a little bit further. I'm imagining that in your current role at the Levin School, relationships help with internships, with jobs with. Introductions to mentors, to faculty advisors, to different you just came back from a conference to different conferences. How do you set out and how have you over the course of your career to actually build those relationships? Because I think you and I, while very different. Have the ability to lean into our own personal attributes in how we build relationships, in how we network with others. So how do you set out to build those relationships that might be suited more to your individuality or your personality?

Leonard Jackson 14:08

Yeah. Thanks. Thanks Rachel. So for me I see relationships as living, breathing, things that have to be nourished. You have to just think about I, I'll use the analogy of a plant, right? A beautiful flower, right? So if you look at this beautiful flower, if it's not nurtured, if it's not watered, it'll die. The same thing happens with relationships. So I try my very best to maintain and foster the relationships that I have, because those relationships usually lead to other relationships as well. So I spend time, as you mentioned, we do have a lot of industrial partners that we work closely with, and I make sure I make time to visit with our industrial partners. So I will spend, I will take time to go visit with them at their place of employment. If that's not possible, I will reach out periodically to through email just to check in and see how are you doing? So yes, there's a business relationship. But all of the partners that I work with, there's also a personal element as well. So I'm first in interested in how they're doing and secondary how is the business doing or how is the business coming along? And of course, I'm always offering my assistance. If I can offer if I can offer such assistance, and I must say those relationships like a plant, right? A lot of plants have fruits and seeds and it, those seeds you can, those fruits you can reap and you can plant the seeds, right? So because of always foster those relationships I'm pleased to say that a lot of relationships that have. I've grown and fostered, started with my time in the industry, and I've left the industry 24 years ago. But those plant, those relationships that I establish of born amazing fruits and I keep reaping those fruits today. So it's very important to build the relationships treat them like a plant, maintain the relationships, and they will spread into or, and multiply into. And inordinate amount of relationships.

Rachel Humphrey 16:19

The fact that you have such deep relationships so many years after you left the functional roles within the industry is really a testament to how nurturing you were to those relationships early on. When you're talking to your students who. Either may be more nervous about the introductions or about how to go about that or early careerists at the same time. Are there ways that you can recommend to start off if maybe that isn't your personality or you're a little bit more nervous about how to start building those relationships?

Leonard Jackson 16:54

Oh, absolutely. And I get that question quite often from students who are very, they're introverts, right by nature. So I usually tell them, just build one relationship at a time. Build that relationship one at a time, maintain that relationship, that professional relationship, and over time you will start to grow in your level of. Comfort, you'll start to grow your level of confidence. And over time, before you know it, you are going to have at least the plant analogy, you're going to have a forest of relationships. Most people see me now as being an extrovert. But when I started off I was an introvert. And today, most people when I tell them, Hey, I was as shy as a leaf blown in the wind. They don't believe it. And I keep telling them, yes, I was. I always tell my students, just start off with one relationship. Build that relationship, foster that relationship, and it'll multiply into an inordinate amount of relationships.

Rachel Humphrey 17:52

I like the advice too of the recurring nature of it that you have to continue to foster it a life. A lot of people, I think you meet someone once and then you have a relationship, but there's such an aspect of it, of that continued nourishing. Or if we're looking at the garden, if you're not continuing to water. Those relationships, then it's gonna be hard to develop genuine relationships there. So absolutely think that's really great advice. One of the things that has been most fun for me with this interview process is that for some people like you who I've known for quite a long time now, I always learn something I didn't know I'm gonna. Expanded a little bit bigger. What is one thing that everyone who sees Dr. Jackson doesn't know about you? Or what is a misperception that maybe when you hear how someone has described you, they're like, wow, that is surprising Because other than that, maybe the introvert extrovert, since you've already given that one as an example,

Leonard Jackson 18:48

so of one misperception is is that I'm always in a suit.

Rachel Humphrey 18:53

Okay.

Leonard Jackson 18:55

Everyone of 'em, they joke about it actually. So my students, they'll joke and my peers they'll joke sometimes and ask me, do you sleep in a suit?

Rachel Humphrey 19:03

I love

Leonard Jackson 19:04

that. 'cause I'm always in a suit. So

Rachel Humphrey 19:07

do you that's

Leonard Jackson 19:09

it's as far away from reality. So I tell my students, this is my personal brand when I'm at work, this is my personal brand. But outside I'm an avid outdoors person. I love fishing. I love gardening. I love farming. So I tell my students all the time and my peers, if you saw me when I'm not at work, you would not recognize me. Baseball hat, cargo pants, camouflage shirt. That's me. That's me on the outdoors when I'm outdoors. Yeah. So that's a miss. Misperception. One thing that someone might not know about me is that I speak German. I speak German. I had an opportunity in 1989 to study German in Basar, Switzerland. And I took advantage of that opportunity. And so I started in Ger in Baso, Switzerland, but also spent some time in Germany as well to expand my knowledge of the German language. So that's something that someone who meets me would never know.

Rachel Humphrey 20:07

I should have invited the cargo pant, baseball cap, Dr.

Leonard Jackson 20:12

Yeah.

Rachel Humphrey 20:12

The interview people would not have believed it. You are right.

Leonard Jackson 20:15

That is true. That is true.

Rachel Humphrey 20:17

The hospitality industry is incredibly resilient. We have a million examples of being able to show that. But so really are so many of our established leaders and the people who've been in the industry for a long time, there's not one of us who has not had an oops moment in our career where we really thought, this is the end. I'm gonna be fired, or this mistake, I can't come back from this one. Can you think of an example of. A time in your career where you made a mistake, it felt in that moment, like it was catastrophic, how you handled it with your supervisor or your managers, and maybe what you've learned from it.

Leonard Jackson 20:52

Yeah. Rachel this is this one. This is one example that I actually use with my students. So early in my career I had the opportunity to evaluate two PMS systems for a company I worked for. And we had about five, and we had narrowed it down to two, and we made a decision to go with one PMSA over PMSB. I contacted both vendors and told PMSA, we're going to go with your property management system and PMSB, I'm sorry, great demonstration, but it does not serve our needs at this point in time. I did a follow up. I was going to follow up by email, and I drafted two emails in Microsoft Word. One for the accept, one for the reject. Someone came into my office as I was about to send the email and I was distracted and I sent the emails to the wrong person.

Rachel Humphrey 21:51

Oh my goodness.

Leonard Jackson 21:52

Accept, got reject, got accept. You can just imagine the embarrassment that I felt, but also how upset both vendors were, one was happy and one was upset, so I learned a lot from it. The lesson I learned was that take time before you send an email, but also when you're a leader, you're going to have, competing task that require immediate attention. Learn to prioritize and make sure that you are dealing with the circumstance at hand and not multitasking to the point where you make. These mistakes where my boss was concerned he thought it was hilarious. Oh, he laughed at me for sure. And because no doubt, no serious damage was done right. But potentially I was very embarrassed by this experience.

Rachel Humphrey 22:41

I think you're right. We all tend to take on so much at one time that ability to really lean in and focus on one task at a time is such an important lesson. Absolutely. And I appreciate you sharing that. One thing I'm curious about because while in your early. Talk about your personal journey. You said you've been with several different companies. Yes. You've had a lot of different roles and much of that then led to your career in academia. But as we go from role to role, either within a company or we switch companies, there are skills that we take with us that we then can further develop and we can. Continue to evolve. Then there are other skills we have to learn new. How do you take what you've learned in one role and really apply it to the next, but in a way that continues to expand your entire skillset or your entire leadership journey?

Leonard Jackson 23:34

Yeah, so I've been very fortunate. Thank you for that question. I've been very fortunate in that I've had the privilege of working in all the major sectors, and of course, these various experiences have imbued the importance of pain. Close attention. To my customers, both internal and external. So even my current role as an academic program director I see the hospitality industry as my customer and my students are my product. So the lessons I learned from my time in industry of paying close attention and listening to my customer, I still. Practice it as well in academia. So I spend a lot of time talking to the industrial professionals. My industrial board and their feedback have helped to shape our curriculum our activities that we have co-curricular activities in the program. And as a result we do prepare students who are ready to take their place in this industry. Again all of those experiences have imbued that insatiable desire to constantly talk to my customers, both internal and external, to ensure that we are serving their needs.

Rachel Humphrey 24:52

That's such a great thing, the art of listening and using that to further develop. One thing that you and I both care a lot about is. That the hospitality industry continue to be diverse at all levels, including the leadership levels, and you have such an impact on the next generation of students. What are you seeing from an industry standpoint and what can we all do to make sure that we are striving for that same goal?

Leonard Jackson 25:16

For me, it's from an industry standpoint in terms of, diversity et cetera, we just need to ensure that we are preparing future leaders who are going to represent society as a whole. So we should try our very best to prepare individuals from all different. Backgrounds and get them ready for leadership positions. And when those leadership positions arise, they should all be treated fairly in terms of getting access to these positions.

Rachel Humphrey 25:47

I love that. I love that. We appreciate all of your leadership there for sure. As we wrap up now, I wanna wrap up with just two final questions. One, which is my absolute favorite question to ask. I think for all of us, we are works in progress and part of that is reflecting on. Where our career has been, where our personal life has been. If you look back at Young Leonard Jackson in Jamaica, what would you tell yourself that, what would you tell that young man that either might have changed the way that your path was made it easier? What is one thing you wish you knew then that today

Leonard Jackson 26:24

I wish I had learned to relax more. I was so focused on my career, my education, which was going to lead to a career that if I believe at the time if I spent time engaging in activities that were not geared towards my education at the time, I felt I was wasting time. So I was very intensely focused on my education because that was going to be my vehicle to get me to the career that I wanted. So I wish I'd learned to relax more. But then again, if I did, perhaps I wouldn't be here.

Rachel Humphrey 26:59

Yeah, that's true. It's incredible actually. How many people I hear tell a similar piece of advice to their younger self. I think so many of us, you just have that early drive, but you're right, that may be what propels you to where you are today. As we wrap up, you've given so many incredible pieces of experience from your leadership journey and advice. To others, but keeping in mind our motto of empowering personal success, what is one final piece of advice you'd share with our audience?

Leonard Jackson 27:30

Sure. Thank you. I believe that all the per pursuit of excellence is an elusive quest. It's a journey that has peaks and valleys, and my advice is when you're on the peak and jaw, the peak, but spend some time to prepare for possible valleys. And we're nearing the valley, understand that there is only one way and it's up. So never give up, never despair. Just have a lot of fortitude and confidence and belief in yourself that you're going to get back to that peak. And remember, as I said, the pursuit of excellence. It's an elusive quest. Excellence is not a destination. We're always striving for that.

Rachel Humphrey 28:13

I think the peaks and valleys is such a great thing to say. Yes, and so important for everyone to hear that there are highs and there are lows and they will all be part of who shapes us into who we are. I appreciate you joining me so very much to those listening at home. We know you have a lot of ways you can spend your time, so we appreciate you taking. Some time to join us, Dr. Jackson. I am incredibly grateful for your time and the wisdom you've shared today, but also for all of the work you're doing, not just in the hospitality industry in general, but raising our next generation of hospitality industry leaders. So thank you very much for sharing your story.

Leonard Jackson 28:50

You're most welcome. My pleasure indeed.

Rachel Humphrey 28:52

And we hope everyone will head on over to its personal stories.com to hear from other industry leaders who have likewise shared their personal stories, their personal journeys, and their leadership insights as well. So thank you all for joining us.

Leonard Jackson 29:05

Thank you.