Marketing Guru's Take on the Stubbornly Young Audience

I had to catch a new wave... I asked myself, "What is happening in the world that can make me newly relevant with the core competencies, skills and life experiences I've earned over the last 60 years?"
-Mark Schaefer, bestselling author & international speaker

Dave's first guest has been an influence and support towards Dave's idea of releasing the Stubbornly Young podcast. Mark Schaefer is a Bestselling Author having written 10 books on social media, marketing strategies, advertising, and personal branding to name a few. A highly sought-after International Speaker, Mark sits with Dave to talk about important ways of being relevant in a rapidly changing digital work.  

Mark shares three assuring notions to remaining relevant while entering his final third of his career, and ways you can also apply your skills and competencies to continue being relevant and overcoming the fear of learning something new in your fifties, sixties and beyond through experimenting and learning to adapt to the times. 

Episode Highlights:

• Importance of staying relevant as people age
• Need for continuous learning and mindset shift
• Leveraging core competencies and life experiences
• Maintaining a personal brand and being known
• Addressing challenges of ageism and shedding stigma
• Courage and confidence from continuous learning
• Staying conversational about current trends
• Curiosity-driven approach to learning
• Appreciating the rebellious nature of each generation

Share it!

"We need a new mindset for relevance."
 
"If you're compassionate and generous, you definitely can become newly relevant, but maybe applying it in a new way."

“Being aware of your special skills, your special talents that make you unique, and applying it to the world in a way that makes you relevant is more important than ever.”

-Mark Schaefer, bestselling author & international speaker

Check these out!

Mark Schaefer’s website
Mark Schaefer on LinkedIn
Mark Schaefer on Facebook
Mark Schaefer on Instagram
Mark Schaefer on YouTube
Ready Player One book by Ernest Cline
Marketing Rebellion: The Most Human Company Wins
KNOWN personal branding Workbook by Mark Schaefer

Read my Blog called Rules For Being Stubbornly Young and let me know what you think!

Email your thoughts at dave@stubbornlyyoung.com

Check out where it’s all happening on the Stubbornly Young website

Thanks and looking forward to hearing how you’re remaining stubbornly young!

Transcript

[INTRODUCTION]

Mark Schaefer (00:00:06) - The change is happening so fast and so unexpectedly. We may not see these changes coming at us and we need a new mindset for relevance. I just needed to catch a new wave. I had to teach something else. I had to see what is happening in the world that can make me newly relevant with the core competencies, the skills, the life experiences I've earned over those 60 years. I think that's an important way to look at relevance.

[INTERVIEW]

Dave Tabor (00:00:38) - This is the first episode of the Stubbornly Young podcast. It's been over two years in the works, and I'm your host, Dave Tabor. Stubbornly Young is for people in their 50s and 60s and beyond who are interesting, have valuable perspectives, and are fully engaged in the world. We want to maintain the status we've earned and continue to be seen as relevant to the younger people who follow in our way. My first ever guest on Stubbornly Young is Mark Schaefer. I learned about Mark when I read his book, Marketing Rebellion: The Most Human Company Wins and then read Known: How to Build and Unleash Your Personal Brand in the Digital Age.

Dave Tabor (00:01:16) - Mark has actually authored nine books and is a sought after speaker globally. He's been in the Wall Street Journal, WIRED, NPR, and many others. I had a personal consulting session with Mark and told him about this idea. I had to build an audience for what I'm now calling Stubbornly Young, and he offered to be my very first guest when we launched. So here we are Mark, I'm so glad you could join me.

Mark Schaefer (00:01:40) - Oh my gosh, it's been just a joy to watch the ride and see that you've finally arrived here with episode one. It's fantastic, Dave.

Dave Tabor (00:01:49) - Well, thank you. We'll see what arriving looks like a little further down the road. But you know, it was a couple of years ago that I shared the notion with you that I think many of us in our 50s and 60s worry about staying relevant, not so much seeing ourselves as relevant. It's more about how others see us, particularly those much younger. And you encouraged me to explore this whole idea and now I've launched Stubbornly Young. So what are your thoughts?

Mark Schaefer (00:02:14) - Well, certainly. I am now looking into the final third of my life and my career. And, I mean, that's the central issue I think is how are we at least relevant enough to enjoy the world, take part in the world? And I love the way you put it, sort of capture the respect I think we deserve. I mean, I think that's a beautiful way to put it. And I had a crossroads moment a couple years ago and an epiphany about relevance. When the pandemic hit, I was an early adopter. I got sick in March of 2020. I was really sick. And when I awoke from my haze, I realized that all of my business had gone to zero. Everything had been canceled in a period of about 48 hours, and I felt irrelevant. And I think the difference now, compared to when we were younger is we could sort of see irrelevance coming at us in the past, you know, like we learned about the internet.

Mark Schaefer (00:03:21) - Oh, well, we better learn about that. We'd better get some more skills. Maybe we take some more classes. And I think what typifies where we are today is that the change is happening so fast and so unexpectedly, we may not see these changes coming at us, and we need a new mindset for relevance. And that's what dawned on me in this period. And I felt like I was a surfer. I had a really good surfboard. I'm a teacher. I wasn't really relevant teaching marketing anymore in that moment of the pandemic. Everybody was just trying to stay alive and, you know, keep their businesses. However, I was like a surfer with a great surfboard. I didn't need to change my surfboard. I was still a great teacher. I just needed to catch a new wave. I had to teach something else. I had to see what is happening in the world that can make me newly relevant with the core competencies, the skills, the life experiences I've earned over those 60 years.

Mark Schaefer (00:04:29) - I think that's an important way to look at relevance. We have to keep learning, absolutely. But sometimes we don't have time to reinvent ourselves. Sometimes we just need to see what are we good at and how do we apply that to fractures in the status quo, these waves of change that are coming at us.

Dave Tabor (00:04:49) - You know, you're speaking at it from the perspective of a consultant, a marketing consultant, a marketing teacher, and so forth. And so you are still focused on staying in the game, right? 

Mark Schaefer (00:04:59) - Yeah, yeah. For sure.

Dave Tabor (00:05:00) - Yeah. What if somebody’s like, not everybody who reaches their whatever period of time they are, 60s, 70s, wherever they are, you know, we’re still a professional, right? Do you think this applies to them?

Mark Schaefer (00:05:12) - Yeah, I mean, absolutely. I think, for example, one of the mega trends that really means a lot to me right now is the whole issue of mental health. And this was something that was starting before the pandemic, and it was just accelerated during the pandemic, where people are more isolated, more lonely, more depressed than any time in history.

Mark Schaefer (00:05:36) - There was a headline in the New York Times that just sort of shook me to my core. It called Gen Z the loneliest generation. And the more time people are spending on the internet, the more lonely and isolated that they feel. So if you're a person that is filled with compassion, that is a very giving and generous person, maybe you have the gift of hospitality in your life, that's an example of like a core, a gift or a core competency that the world needs more than ever right now. So there's a huge place for you in the world right now. You can be, whatever you've done in your life, maybe you think it just doesn't work anymore. If you're compassionate and generous, you definitely can become newly relevant, but maybe applying it in a new way.

Dave Tabor (00:06:26) - Thanks. That's an interesting and I think a useful example, since you and I have been talking, you said you've had conversations with some of your clients around the book, Known, or other things you're working on about this notion of being relevant, and you get excited. You told me, I've been talking about, so what are some of these conversations looking like for you?

Mark Schaefer (00:06:42) - Well, this is why I'm so excited that you're starting this show, because, I mean, I am hearing this pulse in the world everywhere from people like you said, sort of in your 50s, 60s and beyond. And it's this fear that, you know, you're getting out of touch. And, you know, what I'm trying to do is experiment. I see these new things coming along. I'll be vulnerable and honest here. I mean, every time I see one of these changes come down the path, it's just like, oh my gosh, do I have to learn something new? Do I really have the energy to do this? And what I've found, Dave, you don't have to be an expert. You just have to know enough to really be conversational. I had a great lesson one time from my teacher and a mentor, Peter Drucker, very famous, you know, management and business author, maybe the most famous ever.

Mark Schaefer (00:07:38) - He said, to be successful in life, in business, you don't have to have all the right answers. You have to have all the right questions. I think that's a really good way of looking at it. There is no way you can be an expert in everything. There's not one single person alive that truly understands the internet, but you can know enough to ask the right questions, to follow your curiosity with some bravery. You know, I'm experimenting in the metaverse. I'm experimenting with cryptocurrency. I'm not an expert in blockchain, you know, but I understand enough. I can be conversational about it.

Dave Tabor (00:08:16) - You know that reminds me of an example. I download and listen to a book called Ready Player One, which is a fictional book that takes place in the metaverse. And that was enough to sort of launch a conversation with my son saying, wow, this is what he's painting. This is the picture he's painting. What do you see? And to your point, it's enough to ask questions, right?

Mark Schaefer (00:08:39) - Yeah. I have a friend of mine,, she's in my community with me. We're learning about the metaverse. We're learning about NFTs. We're learning about, you know, this, this artificial intelligence technology, and we're just experimenting with it. And she said something really interesting. She said, the main reason I'm doing this is so that I can be relevant to my children.

Dave Tabor (00:09:01) - Yeah, yeah. 

Mark Schaefer (00:09:02) - This is the world they're going to be in. I need to be having those conversations. And so I'm just experimenting and learning so I can understand their language.

Dave Tabor (00:09:12) - Yeah. I wrote a blog post which is Eight Rules for Being Stubbornly Young, actually turned out to be nine. And one of those rules is to consume thought provoking content. And that's kind of what you're talking about.

Mark Schaefer (00:09:23) - Exactly. Yeah. The word I was using was experimenting. But yeah, I like your way of looking at it better because in a way trying something on the metaverse or going into an immersive 3D environment, I mean, that is consuming thought provoking content, right? You're experiencing something to make you go, oh, okay, I get it now. And I like the way just even reading one book for you sort of opened up a whole new, whole new world of conversations.

Dave Tabor (00:09:50) - Yeah. Well, funny, another one of my rules is to try new things. And to your point, you know, putting on a 3D headset. Right? So you have experienced what this is about, right. Same thing. 

Mark Schaefer (00:10:01) - Yeah. And I mean, it's just if you see something you're curious about you need to spend maybe a few minutes like I do –grieving. Saying, oh my gosh, it's another thing I need to learn, but then get over it and find somebody who knows something about this, or find a book that, you know, explains this, or a blog post or a, you know, you can find anything on, on YouTube to explain this stuff and just follow your curiosity, find out enough about it to be able to ask questions about it. And really, I think that's all you need to be relevant.

Dave Tabor (00:10:31) - I loved your book Known, and I wonder is you think about the concept that you promote in the book Known. Yeah. Can one be known as a person who has gotten older and remained relevant and remained exciting? Can that fit the model of your book?

Mark Schaefer (00:10:48) - I think it's more relevant and more important than ever for two reasons. First of all, let's put it this way, I do a lot of personal coaching in this area, and when I coach younger people, they're really struggling to figure out their identity. When I coach older people, the heavy lifting is over. They know exactly where they fit in the world. They have a keen sense of their skills, their heritage, their education, everything that makes them unique. So the heavy lifting is over for those, they're ready to move on to the next.

Dave Tabor (00:11:23) - But it can also be heavy lifting that's made them entrenched. 

Mark Schaefer (00:11:26) - Yeah. That's right. Now that's point number one. Point number two, this idea of being aware of your special skills, your special talents that make you unique, and applying it to the world in a way that makes you relevant is more important than ever.

Mark Schaefer (00:11:42) - Because in a world where increasingly technology is blurring all that. Technology is now doing a lot of the things we can do. Technology is creating art. It's creating literature, it's creating poetry, it's creating music lyrics, it's creating videos. If we're known, we transcend those threats because there's an emotional connection to us as a human. Frankly, it's the only thing that saves us against technology that may threaten our jobs and our employment. Having that personal brand, that human connection, that transcends the threat, frankly.

Dave Tabor (00:12:26) - Yeah, yeah. Now you, you're older than most of your clients now.

Mark Schaefer (00:12:31) - I am older than all of my clients. I am typically, you know, I'll tell you something funny. You just reminded me of this. I'm also typically the oldest person at every, at any conference I go to. And I spoke a few months ago at a huge marketing conference. There were like, 6000 people there. And before the conference, somebody posted this poll on Facebook saying, just curious, what are the ages of the people attending this conference? There are lots of people in their 20s and 30s and 40s.

Mark Schaefer (00:13:04) - There was nobody over 60. Well, I had a foot injury. My foot was in a boot. As I took the stage in front of these thousands of people, all younger than me and I, I started my speech with this poll and showed the empty slot. Nobody over 60, and I had my head bounced in like follow the bouncing ball and landed in the 60 slot. And I said, maybe many of you have been wondering what happened with my foot, why I'm in this boot. Yes, I'm here, I'm over 60, but I got this injury. It's from continuous use. I hurt myself from kicking so much ass. But the point was, I'm on the stage. You're not.

Dave Tabor (00:13:54) - Yeah. That's right.

Mark Schaefer (00:13:56) - But I think there is a mental thing you have to get over. You know, if I dwelled on that, it might be a little intimidating. It might be a little depressing even, to think, geez, there's nobody else like me here.

Mark Schaefer (00:14:08) - And sometimes this ageism creeps in, especially when people say, here's our most seasoned speaker or something like that drives me a little crazy. But, you know, I just choose to shed that, is just is to not be bothered by that and to own my place. I've earned my place there. And, you know, I'm not going to I'm not going to be worried about my age.

Dave Tabor (00:14:30) - That's great. And it sounds like you're actually successful in doing that. Right? So you feel good. 

Mark Schaefer (00:14:36) - All right. So far, so good. Dave.

Dave Tabor (00:14:39) - You do seem kind of activated by this subject, and I appreciate that a lot. I mean, as you think about challenges and also opportunities for people like us that are over 60 that want to maintain a reputation as being relevant and vibrant, I mean, what do you see both as challenges in those opportunities?

Mark Schaefer (00:14:58) - Well, I think the two things that we that we talked about, I think really sort of sum it up, number one is just just the continuous experimenting and learning, not necessarily to become an expert, but to know enough to be conversational enough to be to ask questions. All right. 

Mark Schaefer (00:15:17) - To see how your skills and your life experiences can apply to what's happening today. It can, you know, your skills are needed more than ever. You just have to find the new wave to keep it that way. And then I think just shedding stigma of ageism, the stigma of being the only person in the room with white hair and just owning your place and owning, owning your power and not being intimidated. And you know that takes, both of those things take a little courage.

Dave Tabor (00:16:02) - I think the courage comes from confidence, and confidence comes from actually sort of doing the things you suggested and the things that I write about in my, in my post to, you know, rules for being stubbornly young. I mean, if you actually live those things, then the confidence I think comes along a lot more easily, right? 

Mark Schaefer (00:16:21) - Yeah. Well, definitely especially it sort of goes hand in hand doesn't it. The more you learn about what's happening in the world today, the more you’re conversational about those things, the more confident you become as well. And I mean, a great portion of the things I read are about new things happening in the world. I subscribe to a newsletter written by Gen Z so I can understand, you know, what's going on with their fashion taste and what's going on with their new language. And, you know, I was I felt a little intimidated by, I saw this list of here are the ten biggest celebrity influencers of Gen Z. I didn't know any of them, so I clicked on the links, you know, who are these people? So now, I mean, I don't know, I still don't really know who these people are, but at least I'm conversational. (inaudible)

Dave Tabor (00:17:18) - And you kind of know what these people are about anyway, and what's made them into influencers. Right?

Mark Schaefer (00:17:25) - I guess for me, I'm just an endlessly curious person.

Mark Schaefer (00:17:29) - I love learning about these people. I love learning about new art and new music. And, you know, maybe it's not necessarily my taste, but I love to see where these things are, where these things are going. I mean, every generation rebels, you know, it was you know, it was the black leather jackets and rock n roll. And then it was love and peace and hippies. And then it was protests and then it was, you know, the, you know, one thing after another. And so it's fun to kind of see how is the next generation going to rebel and not really be intimidated by it, but appreciate it.

Dave Tabor (00:18:11) - Yeah. Yeah.

Mark Schaefer (00:18:12) - Go for it, kids.

Dave Tabor (00:18:15) - That's cool. That's a great, I think, that's a great outlook and I appreciate it. This is the Stubbornly Young podcast I'm your host Dave Tabor, joined today by bestselling author and international speaker Mark Schaefer. That does it, Mark. You've been guest number one on Stubbornly Young.

Mark Schaefer (00:18:31) - I'm so proud. Number one is in the books. Good job.

Dave Tabor (00:18:33) - Yes it is. Well thank you I'm Dave Tabor. My friends, glad you could join me. Please rate Stubbornly Young in your podcast app. Please encourage your friends to listen. The journey of staying relevant for ourselves and to those we care about is an exciting one. Visit stubbornlyyoung.com to read my blog, subscribe and send me feedback and ideas to make us all better at this.

[END OF TRANSCRIPT]