From Corporate Life to Property Investor with Tammy Hart

Ever felt stuck in a 9 to 5 and wondered what life could look like on the other side?

In this episode, I’m joined by Tammy Hart, who shares her journey from corporate life into becoming a full time property investor and what that transition really looked like behind the scenes.

But her story starts way before property.

Tammy opens up about working in a slaughterhouse, where she was the only woman and the only Brazilian, and what that environment was really like for her. What she had to navigate, what she experienced, and the resilience she built through that chapter.

Because those moments shape you. They build the strength you end up relying on later.

We also talk honestly about leaving the structure and security of a corporate job and stepping into something completely different.

The version of entrepreneurship we often imagine sounds like freedom and flexibility. But the reality can feel very different.

No one is telling you what to do. No one is setting your schedule. And suddenly you are fully responsible for your time, your energy, and your direction.

And that’s the part no one really teaches us. How to manage ourselves.

This is a real conversation about the messy middle. The discipline it takes, the mindset shifts that come with it, and what it actually looks like to build something for yourself.

If you’ve been feeling the pull to do something different, but also the weight of what that might mean, this one is for you. 

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Transcript

0:01

Good morning. everyone and welcome to today's episode of the Girls in Property podcast. Right guys, we are halfway through March. Let's keep going. Let's keep doing it. So we've got some sunny days, we've got some rainy days, feels sometimes a bit like a weather forecast actually, because I always start with the weather. But you know what? It's a very wonderfully British thing to do. But also I'm obsessed with sunshine. Like somebody said to me the other day, they're like, Athena, what do you worship in life? And I'm like, I worship sunshine. So whenever there is literally a sunny day, I'm here for it. So I hope today there is beaming sunshine on your face as you listen to a beautiful, beautiful episode. So in today's episode, the conversation we really want to have is a conversation that I think is really important to most people because most people have either been through this transition or are going through this transition or are trying to navigate it themselves. And that is the transition of going from your corporate life and job and world into becoming an entrepreneur and what that actually looks like and what that feels like more importantly, and the things that are good, the things that are difficult and the things that nobody can actually prepare you for. And I have this conversation with this particular guest I'm about to introduce you to. where we really think about kind of, well, what was it actually like transitioning? How did it, like, what were the actual steps? What were the sticky bits that didn't quite feel right? What was the messy middle? And actually, quite frankly, the messy middle that we're both still in now and being very vulnerable and very open about so that you guys feel that your voice can also be heard today. So as always, don't forget to comment. If you are new to Girls and Property and you are in Tammy's world, then welcome, welcome to the wonderfully dysfunctional family of Girls and Property. If you've been here a while and you are a avid fan of Girls and Property, love you dearly you know who you are thank you for your comments thank you for your celebrations thank you for your DMs keep them coming and always if you want any information about joining the girls and property community we are a gorgeous community of over 130 women now it is a gorgeous gorgeous place to be we do in-person events we meet up online fortnightly and if you want any information about it just go to www.girlsinproperty.co.uk Alright, so without further ado, today I would love to finally introduce you to all Tammy Hart. Hey Tammy! Hi Athena, how are you? I'm good, welcome to Girls in Property. Thank you and thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited about today. No problem. I have seen you really doing fantastic at the moment. I see you shining, Tammy. I see you having your voice in your own voice, your own spotlight. I have seen you going on various podcasts and I really sense this glow about you at the moment. Like when I look at you and I look at the way that you smile, the way that you look, I just feel really positive energy coming from you and it is wonderful, wonderful to see. And I hope that we together can really inspire so many listeners today. So do I. So do I. has been, it has been very busy, but I'm actually, loving it. I'm loving every moment of it. Brilliant. Well, that's what we want to hear. So before we begin and delve into the world of this notion of transitioning from corporate life into being an entrepreneur and a property investor, can you first please introduce yourself? Tell everyone a little bit about you, your background, kind of how you even got into property, the world that you're in now, something that you're looking forward to this year. And then to have a bit of fun, maybe something that people don't know about you as well, wow, okay. Wow, that came in like straight away. I don't think anybody knows this about me, but I'll start with the introduction. So my name is Tammy. I work with my husband, Danny. He's never in any events or you literally just see me, but I'm only one half of what we do. So we invest in the Northwest. We've been in property for about two years and eight months. We are on project number 10, which has been chaotic. It's been like, so mad. eh We've done flips, HMOs, we're starting to work with supported living providers and we're just buying our first listed building which I'm so so excited about so it's like commercial and listed building at the same time because we don't do anything by haps. Wow. Okay. Okay. Pause on that a second. Hold on. Hold on. So number one, did you just say two years and how many months? Okay. Two years and eight months. You have purchased 10 properties. Oh, that is incredible. That is insane. Right. Okay. So we're coming back to that. That's number one tick. And you're just about this, this one, this number 10 is a listed property. Okay. Gorgeous. most beautiful window I've ever seen in my life. I'm so excited. Oh, I love that. Okay, which I'm sure comes with its own caveats in terms of the whole process of purchasing a listed building. Yeah. Okay. Right. We're to come on to that as well. Okay. So talk to me then about just go back a bit then. So go back previous to property. Because this notion is about corporate life in transitioning. So what did you do before property? You know, your life before it? So I started in a graduate scheme with a food manufacturing company in the UK. So I was with them for seven years. I did quality control. So I have a technical background as in I did biomedical sciences. So it was very helpful with food safety and food quality. And that's what we did. That's what I did in the graduate scheme. So I worked for two different companies, seven years in one. just under three years on the second one before I pulled the plug in my corporate life. Okay, and was there a reason that you pulled the plug or were you pushed out or was it the fact that you wanted to transition? Like talk to me, tell me, tell me the story. So there were several reasons, I think. I've never had one entrepreneurial body, bone in my entire body. Like I've never, I've always been a follower. I've always been, I've always felt very safe in my corporate job with my salary at the end of the month and you know, knowing how much I could spend, how much I couldn't. So it was very interesting for me, the whole transitioning into being an entrepreneur. But it all started with, I've had, I've always had this dream. So when I first came to the UK, I was 17 years old. I didn't know anyone. I didn't speak English and I had this dream. And my dream was I wanted to go to university in the UK and I wanted to have a job that I was proud of and my family was proud of. And for me, that looked like working for a company, the same company for my entire career, retiring in the same company, because that shows loyalty and this is something that I'm very big on. So that was the dream. And when I got into the graduate scheme with this company, I absolutely loved it. They invested so much in the beginning and getting established and learning about the company, learning about all the different manufacturing sites. This particular company at the time had 21 factories in the UK. eh So it was very interesting. I was very excited. And then as I started working, so my first ever placement was in an abattoir. which is something I've never thought I would, somewhere I never thought I would work in. I come from farming. I'm a massive animal lover. For those of you that know me, you know that my dream is to open my own animal sanctuary. So for me to go into an abattoir as my first placement was very, very difficult. Yeah. And I remember um the actual environment wasn't the worst part for me. It was the actual people and the culture. And within my first week and As you come in for a graduate scheme, are straight away in like a management position. So I was a team leader and I was assigned to the offal room. So they processed all the offal from the different animal species. And I remember walking in and there was this long corridor with the door on the right, like a sliding fridge door on the right. So was walking out this long corridor, so nervous. I was the only woman in that team. And as... m someone slid the door open for me to walk in, I got hit by a kidney on my chest. And I had a wipe overall and the kidney hit my chest and it was fresh and it was warm and the blood just splattered all over my face. And all I could hear was just laughter, like loud laughter in the room. And I stood there and like, it was so... quick but so slow at the same time. Like I was just thinking to myself, what do I do in this situation? They are testing me. They are trying to see if I have any boundaries in place. They're trying to see if I'm weak. So what I do next is going to establish my position in this room. And all I could think about was do not let them see how you are feeling right now, because I could feel my face going red and I could feel like the tears kind of building up. And I just looked at them and I started laughing and I thought wow is this how you welcome your new manager? And then I just laughed and kind of went with it but showed them that I was not happy about it but that that would not get me and not upset me like they probably hoped it would. eh The next couple of weeks was very difficult. They wouldn't listen to me. I was trying to learn the job as well at the same time. And to be fair, like putting myself in their shoes, these men had been working there for 15 to 30 years. It's a hard environment to work in and I'm not defending them by any way, or form. But then a young woman comes in, bossing them around, managing them when... She doesn't know anything about the industries. She doesn't know anything about the hardships of working in those environments, in that environment. So I could see why they were frustrated with it, but they didn't care whether they were going to hurt me or not and how I was feeling about this whole situation. So I carried on. I did a few projects. I was there for six weeks. Did one project in particular that saved the company just over one and a half million in a year and the years to come. After two weeks, I got transferred to the boning hall. So it looks like it's a massive warehouse with like rails on the ceiling where the carcasses are hung and that's how the carcasses travel. So at different points of the room for you to cross from point H, point B, you would have to go through where the railing is above you. So when it's really busy, someone would have to hold the carcass for you to walk past or you would have to wait for a gap. And in this day, there was literally no gaps. The production was at full swing. So this guy that was working on my right, he just nodded at me and held the carcass for me to walk past. And I actually don't want you to visualize this, it's like, you know, those carcasses were fresh. They had just been in the room. So there's like blood on the floor and things like that. So he held the carcass for me. And then I went to walk past and he released it and So I fell on the floor. I had a white shirt under my white overall and I could feel the blood soaking through and there were about 30 people around and I could see them all like laughing. Some of them were shocked looking at each other like what on earth, like I can't believe he's just done that. But the majority of them were laughing at me and I got up and I thought to myself, okay, you just need to repeat what you did two weeks ago. because they will see that you are resilient and they will see that things like this won't get to you. So they will stop. It's just behavior. They're gonna stop once they see that it doesn't get to you. But I just couldn't. And I could feel the tears again and the redness on my face. And I just ran upstairs to the office, took my overalls off, realized that I went to the bathroom and I could see there was like blood like down on my ribs, on my side. And all I could think was, I didn't drive at the time and I could think I have to walk home. It's a 15 minute walk home and I smell of animal blood and it's literally covered up. What are people going to think? And again, you shouldn't think about what people are going to think, but at the time that was the only thing I could think about. What are people going to think when they look at me walking down the street? So I was sat in the toilet for about two and a half hours and I was crying and I just could not stop. And that took me to the end of the shift and I remember getting up, washing my face with very cold water and literally darting for the door without looking at anybody. And that was the hardest walk on of all I've ever had to do. I got to, it was actually a HMO I was living in and I got to the HMO, went into my room, started like trying to wash the blood off and I just made it. bigger mess because it just spread everywhere on my white shirt and that really upset me. For the first time, I felt like I didn't belong, but I also felt like I would never belong and it didn't matter what I did, how I treated people, how bossy I was or how nice I was. There was literally no way out for them to not even respect me, but just respect the fact that I was working there. So I couldn't come back the next day. I was, it really got to me. So I decided to take the day off. I called, called, I called in sick, went back the following day and I tried to spend as much time as I could in the office and not go into the factory. And I knew I was only there for six weeks and I knew it was going to end. And I remember on my last meeting before I moved on to my next placement, my mentor, was really happy because I still had done that massive project and saved the company lots of money. And the site manager who was oblivious to any of what had happened because I couldn't even talk about it. I'd never shared it with HR, never shared it with anyone. eh He actually said when I did my end of placement presentation, said, Tammy, we've never had a graduate that delivered so much in such a short period of time. We want to offer you a full time position here. And I was like, and then my mentor just said, absolutely not. She's going to the biggest factory in the group because we need to duplicate this work that she's doing here. So yeah, fair enough. And then in my head, I was like, is this a good thing? Is this a bad thing? I don't even know because if the culture is like that here, what is it going to be like in the biggest factory of the group? So in a way I was like, it might be a good thing. So let's just hold on to the positives. So I went. And then it was, the factory was massive. There were about, think, just under 3000 people working there, six factories in one. And I went to look after, to work in the bacon department. So where they like sliced the bacon. And it was really good. It was different, different. It felt like a different culture. Like the managers above me were really trying to get me to understand the processes. the people working there, you know, they just looked at me like a normal co-worker. There was no animosity, not like I found it in the abattoir. So that went on for about two months and then I got transferred to a different department because they wanted me to learn all the six different departments. So I got transferred to a different department and the manager of that department was once a graduate. So I remember having a conversation with him and he was really nice and he said to me, Tammy, this is going to be very hard for you. And was like, well, how come? And he said, because I've been where you are now. And I am, but I'm a man. So it was hard for me. It's going to be 10 times harder for you. So if you need anything, just come and talk to me. But he didn't elaborate. And I was like, shit, is this going to be the same thing that I've just literally escaped from? So in this department, there were four managers. So I was one of them and we're all at the same level. And the department had 130 people working in and the four of us were responsible for the entire production and the team of 130 people. One of the other managers was also a graduate that had started a year before me. So he was still learning. was new to that department. Two of the other ones had been there. One had been there for, I think, 25 years and the other one had been there for like 19 years, something like that. One was nice, but kept to himself. And the other one did not talk to me. he wouldn't look at me. And I was like, okay, fair enough. He just might be an introvert. And I was shadowing him on my first week to learn the processes, but he would not talk to me. So like every time I had a question, I had to go to one of the other managers and I, had a morning meeting every day with the site manager, HR manager, engineering manager, all the heads of departments. And we had to go and just talk about what happened in the department the day before. if there was any breakdowns and any problems, would it cascade down to today? Would it affect production today and where we were at with uh our goals for production? So that was my first time. I had been to that meeting about three times because it was towards the end of the week, but I had never spoken. I just stood there and listened. And for the first time, the site manager turned around and said, Tammy, why don't you give a go? Give it a go. Let us know how has production been in your department? And I remember looking at this guy. And he just looked at me and he said, he put his hand on my face, like so close, I could feel the warmth of his hand on my nose. And he said to me, you are not saying anything because there's nothing you say in this room that is of interest to anyone here. This is my job and I'm gonna do it. And straight away, I just thought, Has he just done this in front of the entire management team? And what happened? How did the management team react to that? They did absolutely nothing. And I was, remember looking around the room seeking help, like what do I do? And the HR manager just went on her phone and the other managers just looking at each other. One of the other room managers, the one that had was teaching me before in the baking department, he looked down and it was silent. And I was looking up for some sort of, validation, but like I knew that was, I was looking for support. And I thought to myself, I would never treat anybody within my team, outside of my team, above me, never treat them like this, because this is not professional. And so I was looking for that support. Like, is anyone thinking what I'm thinking here? And you were all very high up in this organization. Can someone say something? Nobody said anything. And then he said his piece, I was literally choking down the tears because I just had this flashback of the abattoir. And then I left and went upstairs as soon as the meeting was finished. And again, I was crying in the bathroom. I think I spent so much time crying in the bathroom when I was working for those factories. It's crazy thinking back at it. I just didn't have a backbone. I didn't know how to react and what to say. So that went on, then I was in that department for I think six months. And it got to a point where the second thing that happened before I got moved to Night Shift. there was another uh manager that joined the team, but he had been in the company for years and years. He just got transferred from a different department. And we were in a meeting just with our department. So no heads off anything. uh And he turned around to me and he was a bit of a joker. I remember he had like four golden teeth and he was like very weird but a bit of a joke. Like no care in the world. And he just looked at me and said, tell me, I thought you were Brazilian in front of about 15 people. And I said, well, I am Brazilian. I was born in Brazil. And he said, you don't look Brazilian. And I was like, what do you mean I don't look Brazilian? And he said, you've got a flat ass. Like Brazilians are meant to have like a good bum. I just looked around and I was hoping that he was gonna laugh and then like it was gonna be a joke and he didn't and he kept looking at me like are you gonna answer my question? Like are you really Brazilian? And I thought I've never felt so embarrassed in my entire life. Never felt so embarrassed and I didn't know what to do. And I just froze and I walked out of the room and I literally did not look back so I don't know what happened. I don't know if anyone said anything. I literally just walked out. And the department manager who had spoken to me about my life being really hard in that department, he saw me darting out, but he didn't see what happened. So he came to me and I literally, and he said, let's have a chat. So I went into his office and I told him everything, like what had happened in the abattoir, what had happened in the main meeting. And he was like, have you told anyone about this? And I said, no, because I have a feeling that this cultural behavior spreads like a lot higher up than I thought it would. So to be honest with you, I don't even know who to go to with this. And he said, that's fine. You know what I will do? If you're happy with it, I have some two really good managers in the night shift. They will support you. I'm going to move you to the night shift just to give you some breathing space. And in my head, I was like, if I was him, I would resolve the issue. I would not move the employee that is being targeted and harassed somewhere else, like she's the problem. And then more and more I kept thinking to myself, this is not the environment that this does not align with my values. Like I can't grow here because I either become like them or I have to grow a really, really thick skin to go against them. No Tammy, no. Yeah. So then I went to night shift and it was a lot easier. But at that time I was already thinking, I can't be here. I just can't, this is not for me. And I worked there for about a year and 18 months. then I kept moving. then I, honestly, sometimes things happen and you will think that it's a curse, but it's actually a blessing. I broke my ankle. So I had a hiking accident, so I couldn't go back in the factory. And the technical department needed some help. And the technical manager was talking to him at lunch and he was asking about my background. I said, oh yeah, I'm a biomedical scientist. He's like, what? And you are in production, why? And I said, well, because there was no graduate scheme for a technical, which is like the food safety and food quality side. And he said, I need someone. to help me with a project and you can't go back in the factory. If I speak to your manager, would you want to have a go? And I was like 110 % just like tell me when I'm, tell me how high and I'm jumping with the freaking cast on my leg, but I'm jumping. And I did that and then I stayed with technical for I think after that was about five years. So I had done about two years, three years in operations and then about five years in technical. which was hard because I still had to deal with the operations team. So I found it very difficult. But anyway, it got to a point that I just, I wanted a better pay and I wanted, I kind of hit the ceiling of where I was at. eh And I wanted to go to a smaller company to be able to grow in my career, which I did. Great company, great people. That's when I was managing Seven Women. I loved my team. They were absolutely incredible. But then I had a problem with one of the managers with the actual director. And she, looked up to her so much from the beginning and I had her in this like pedestal, you know, that I wanted to be like her and both as a person and as a professional. And something happened that really disappointed me. And at that point I thought, this is never going to change. And I had met Danny. And Danny's always been an entrepreneur. He's got his own business, been running for 10 years very successfully. And he's never, I think he only worked for someone for like probably two to three years until he sacked it off and started doing his own thing. And he kept saying to me, Tammy, let's do something together. And I was like, no, no, I need like, I need my salary. Like how can you just jump ship and then just go and start something new? And I think it was when I had that very disappointing experience with that woman. I came home and I was crying and he was like, right, that's it. We're doing something differently, something different. And I used to be ashamed of saying this, but I'm not anymore. I used to love watching Homes Under the Hammer. I loved it. I used to watch it. And then it got to a point where, and I think I've always watched it for the entertainment value. I've never seen it as an opportunity until I was in a position in my life that I needed to make a change. And I was watching it one day, I think it was a Saturday morning, and I saw this guy buying this property in auction and literally like turning it around and I think he made about 15 grand profit. Now, I didn't see any of the numbers. I think it took him about eight months. And I thought to myself, how hard can it be? mean, under the hammer, they don't share all the details. So you look at it and it's like, well, if anybody, they can do it, I can do it too. It doesn't. saying, isn't it? How hard can it be? We've all said that. you actually do it. oh But yes, so that's how the interest in property started. And I remember, Danny was working because weekends are his busiest days because of what he does. He works with football. So there's always like games on the weekend and he had an office upstairs and I went to his office and I like, I think we should go into property. And he's like, what? And I said, well, you've been saying like, let's do something together. And I've just been watching Holtz and Hammer and then he laughed. And I was like, no, no, hold on a second. Like this guy did this and this and this. And he worked out and he said, okay, go and start looking for properties. I don't know, like, fine. I think he just wanted to get rid of me because he was so busy. And it's like, just go and have a think about it. And then let's talk about it over dinner. I watched Homes and the Dehammer the entire morning. I think I watched about five or six episodes, like back to back. And then I went on YouTube. And then I started looking for property investment ideas, came across loads of videos of, you know, like the gurus and all the mentors and this and that, sharing tips in this. And then I started looking at auction properties on YouTube, how to find a good auction property. And I was like, you know what, I'm gonna go and look for it. So I went on, what's it called? Auction house, auction house website. This was all within that Saturday. And I looked at, I found a house. on auction house in Leeds. I was looking in Leeds because I know Leeds very well. I went to uni there, I lived there for eight years. Danny went to uni in Leeds as well. He was there for three years. So I was like, okay, let's have a look in Leeds because we know the area. So I started looking, found a house and then put this big plan together. Didn't even know what an anarchist tribe was. I had no idea, which is like the frame around the door, if any of you don't know. And if you don't know, there's nothing wrong with it. eh So I started putting this plan together and I went on like trades website, like my builder, check a trade, where they do estimates for the renovations. And I was watching this video of the property, like, he needs a new kitchen, needs a new bathroom, needs new carpets. And I was writing down on this pad, on this paper, like, this is what it costs. This is it. And I put this, this budget together. And then at dinner time, I presented it to Danny, like he was literally like a business plan. but just for this one property. How was that? And I didn't expect this, but he turned around and he said, you know, we've worked all day on this, like, let's have a go, let's do it. So the auction was, I think it was like within two weeks. And we were just preparing ourselves, trying to learn as much as possible, what you can learn from YouTube and things like that about buying an auction, doing our due diligence, which should be fair, I'm quite proud of, because looking back, I didn't miss a lot of stuff. The only thing I missed, which I would never recommend is I never saw the I was body, body blind. didn't do that. But so yeah, so it was all still like within that two weeks and I was still going back to work and I kept thinking like, is Dani serious about this? Like, we actually gonna buy this property? And we had some savings until then. And I was like, I had already given my notice in because of what had happened with the manager. Hmm. I was already looking for a different job. So I had three months notice. I was already looking for a different job. I think I had two months left when we found this property. We put savings together and Danny had some savings in like investment stock. And then he was like, okay, let's, will just convert. don't know what you do with investment stocks. It's like the withdrawal, withdrawal. you with drool. Yeah. So that's what he did. And then we had the money to buy the first property. So we put it all together, bought it. And then I was driving to Leeds, because Danny was still working. And I was driving to Leeds every weekend to do work on the property. And I was like ripping carpets, doing all the rip-out, loving it. It was like, oh my God, I can do this. There's no bosses. There's nobody around me. It's just me and the radio. And I'm loving it. And we did that. And then it got to a point that I said to Danny, you know, there's a lot more work. than I anticipated here. And I had found another job and I was going to start within two months. And I remember us sitting down and he said to me, if we're going to take this seriously, this can't be, you're not going to be able to just do this on a weekend because you know, we've got holding costs. We need to get this property turned around because we're going to run out of money. So was like, okay. And then we made the decision and I said to him, let me have a look at it. And so I remember going through my bank account. like with a tooth comb and I was finding all these subscriptions that you don't know you have that has been there for like three years, draining like five quid here, 10 quid there. And I started like canceling things, doing a budget. How much money do we actually need to live and for how long? sold and then I decided to sell my car. Sold my car. I think I had about eight grand from the car. So like, okay, so this is gonna be living expenses. Cause we already had the money. for the house and the renovation. So this is living expenses for the next, I planned that we're gonna turn the house around in five months, did not turn it around in five months. But then I also had the house. So Danny and I had just moved in together and I decided to rent that house. So I had a little bit of income coming through, plus the car, canceled all subscriptions. Danny was like, that's fine because he had his business. So he was like, Tommy, if there's a gap in anything that you need. I will fill it. So yeah, he was like a massive support mechanism. He was like a massive uh safety net for me because he literally saw this dream that we could build together. It's like, just go and do it. And then I'll be the fallback if we need anything. So I hired Builder, it's Loads of Problems, which is like a whole new podcast that we had for first time. going to be, yeah, we need time for that. So yeah, so we turned the property around within eight months. We sold it, we made 76 grand. And I thought to myself, wasn't, my salary in corporate was 45. And I said, we made 76 grand in eight months. All right, we need to, we need to do it again. And then we just started, we were going again, and then we were lending as well. We've used bridge. And then the rest, like history, is just being literally one property after the next, a couple of properties simultaneously. Now we have four projects all happening at the same time. But it was, I don't think I could have done it without Dani's support, but the push that I had to get out of that toxic corporate job was, it was three things. When I look back, it's three things for me. One. the environment that I was in and the push that I had to get out of it, to the fact that I know myself and I know that I do not grow within my comfort zone. And the reason why I was doing well in my job, because I did really well on my job and I was making money for the company and doing all those projects, was because I was in a very difficult position and I had to live for 10 years. with this constant idea that I had to prove myself every single day. So I was never within my comfort zone. And I knew that if I did not jump into property, both feet, I would not do it properly because I need to be outside of my comfort zone. And I've always been like that. And then the third thing was Danny's support. Without his support and the fact that he believed in me, I don't think I could have ever made that jump. Hmm I just want to make some points on that sound beautiful by the way like I'm listening to you and I'm just like oh this is gorgeous and Just before I say what I'm gonna say. I I've never heard that story from you before That's the first time I've ever really I feel like I actually What's the words to use I've never heard that story before from you and everything about you makes so much sense to me, if that makes sense, like your resilience and what you've been through, everything just makes sense to me now because of that story. And I think what is so important to recognise is that every single person on this planet has a story and we don't always get the opportunity to actually hear everybody's story. And so what we do is we take a person at a moment in time that we meet them, but we don't know where they came from. And I think as soon as you understand where a person comes from, you then go, it all makes so much sense. And I think if we just took the time in life to really understand people and people's stories, I think the world will be a beautiful place because everyone will understand each other more. One thing I just wanted to say on what you just saying there is, I say this a lot, know, so I think the most dangerous place in the entire world that a person can exist and live is in their comfort zone. It is so dangerous beyond belief because what happens is is I see it all the time Tammy like I see it on a daily basis I have conversations where I'll say to to women I'll say And this is how you can take yourself forward and this is the dream and there's that and they're like, yes, Athena Yes, I love it. I love it. I love it. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go Leave them on their own for half an hour to an hour leave them on their own and the conscience comes in like a massive wave and it goes Oh, no. No, no, no, have a nice two and a half grand job. You're nice and steady You've got a mortgage to pay. Let's just keep you nice and still and then they go. Athena. No, I'm not gonna do it. I'm terrible I'm gonna stay in my job and I just say to them that's fine Do you and then they come back a year later and they go I'm gonna do it again and I'm like, are you though? Are you because do know what's so interesting when they come back a year later? Because they always come back to me. They haven't moved one inch in a year Not what I said it with love. I don't mean that disrespectfully ladies I'm saying this with love because I'm gonna tell you how it is You don't move one inch forward because you're coasting along your little comfort path And I get why you're doing it. totally understand it. It's because I think, and this is why I talk about it so openly, Tammy, I think that a couple of things. you literally had your back against the wall and you literally went, I cannot go back. And when you cannot go back, there is only one direction you can physically go and that is forwards. And I think that is, although it's horrendous in the moment when it happens to you, it is the best thing that will ever happen to you because it's like when COVID hit, for example, and I lost my job, there was nowhere for me to go but forwards. And you almost are wonderfully forced into taking action because you're in so much pain that there's nothing else you can do but come out of the pain. And I think pain is actually what is a... Although it sounds ridiculous, pain is actually could be used as such a positive thing to go, I'm going to feel this pain and I'm going to go through it because otherwise fear just keeps you comfortable effectively. So I think comfort zone is a dreadful, dreadful place to be. And I actually think, do you know what? think half, like half the people on this planet don't even realise that they live there. I think they lie to themselves. And I think that, you know, when you start to do the subconscious work, for example, which I'm massively into at the moment, and you start to go, actually, I'm really comfortable. This isn't a good thing. Like, where's the growth? Like, where's the evolution of me? Where's the next step of me? Am I just, am I the same person that I was five years ago? Am I the same person that I was four years ago? um And so look at you now, Tammy, look at how you have evolved, because you did that. And the other thing I just want to say is, you know, there are lots of women, and you'll know this, Tammy, that don't have the supportive unit that you had in Danny, for example, where a woman would have gone to their partner, their brother, their dad, whatever, a man uh or a woman, or a woman and said to them, I've just watched Holmes Under the Hammer, this is what I've done, you'd have put a whole proposal together, spent the entire day doing it, they'd have looked at it and gone, yeah, maybe next year we'll have a look at that. And they get dismissed. And then that obviously gives them rejection. that gives them fear, makes them feel like they're not good enough. And I think what was beautiful for you is because you've been rejected and had a hand in front of your face and told to stop talking. What you had in Danny was that Danny saw you and Danny heard you and Danny said, I love your idea, let's run with it. And you've now gone on to flourish and literally become this beautiful person with your 10 properties because you had that. so what... I'd love to hear your voice actually in this um Tammy. What advice would you give to women who are in a position that you were in who don't have that support system? How can they themselves give themselves their own support system and not have to rely on anybody else? think that the first thing that we all need to do, regardless of the position that we are in and the support network around us, is just ask ourselves, if I can fast forward to five years, and if nothing's changed because you haven't changed a thing, you are the same person that you are now in five years, would you be happy with it? Would you be happy and proud of that person? And then your honest answer will determine whether you need to make a change. And there is this... quote from Jim Rohn that is like it lives in my head every single minute of every single day which is you can't change your destination overnight but you can change your direction overnight and your direction will determine your destination. Oh yes Tammy, I love that. Beautiful. think we are really strong and sometimes we feel like we're not. And when I look back to the person that I was in those factories, I didn't even know what to say. The only thing I could do was get up and walk away. And I've always been strong. I came to this country when I was 17 years old. Like I didn't speak English and I've achieved the dreams that I wanted to achieve. I was on my own and I managed to do it. So I knew that inside I could do it, but the environment that I was put in suppressed all of that, all of that feeling of, can do this. Oh, well, do you wanna know how it's done? Just hold my drink, I'll go and show you, because that's the person that I was. But your environment can change your perception of yourself. And it's just, we can't allow that. So we need to dig deep and we need to find who we are. And I think that... Yes, sometimes we don't have the right supportive network around us, but we are enough to support ourselves. We can give ourselves enough support and conviction that if we want to do something, we will find a way. Absolutely. I always think the best person you can rely on in all the world is ourselves. Like we've been with ourselves since the day we came to this earth and we can rely on ourselves, we can trust ourselves, trust our instincts. First of all ladies, you do not need approval from anybody to achieve your dreams. Nobody. You don't need permission, you don't need approval, you don't need anything. If you want something badly enough you go and get it and you hold on to it with both hands. Period. But what I would say is this, think what I've seen beautifully happen, and Tammy, you would have seen this as well actually in your world, is... Sometimes you might be listening to this podcast and you might feel very isolated and very alone as I know quite a few of you are and when you do you reach out to me and I really love it when you do ladies. But what I would also do is I would ask you this which is the most beautiful moments that I have and I'm sure Tammy's had these moments as well is where you watch people connect through the community. So whether it's girls and property, a community that Tammy's got, whatever it may be for example and you watch them connect and you watch them almost be like a my God, me too. Like that's how I feel. Oh my God, I had no idea that that happened to you. my God, that's what happened to me as well. And you go, but then you got out of it and they go, yeah, I got out of it like six months ago. And you're like, how did you do it? And then you, you feel like you connect with other women who just get it. And whether it's like being in a relationship that you no longer love, whether it's like, how do I do this and have kids? How do I reach for the stars? And it's just, it is the most powerful, powerful thing you can do. where you recognize that. and you let your mind recognize actually that you no longer in the drama circle drama triangle where you play a victim and you go, well, this is what happened to me and this is my life and this is why I stuck and this is why I'm in my comfort zone and woe is me. Get yourself out of that. Okay. And go and speak to other women who are in the exact same position that you are and then go and fly and tell me, I'd love to actually give an example of this right now, if you don't mind, which is, you we've spoken about, know, you, you've smashing it and you're doing all these and ten properties and everything but you did mention to me before coming on the podcast and I think it is important to mention if it's okay with you for a me too hashtag in a positive way which is what's happening with you with the whole situation with actually at a loss at the moment because I don't always want to portray this podcast as I like and then we made seventy six thousand pounds and now we're living on a yacht no what is actually happening for you at the moment Tammy that girls can go me too with So at the moment, and I've always been very transparent, and I do believe that we can only grow when we actually make the mistakes ourselves and get out of it. And then there's nothing to be ashamed about making mistakes, losing money, because those are all lessons that are actually going to help you jump forward so much faster. So at the moment, and I get people coming to me, like you've just said, I mean, you're smashing it. Look, you and Danny have done so well, two years, eight months, 10 properties. And I'm just listening, I'm thinking, I don't think they understand because it's not, I mean, what you can see on social media and outside. And I do post some of this stuff that we do wrong and things that times that we've lost money and this and that, but people always focus on the big things like you are smashing it. You're doing so well. At the moment, we're actually losing five grand a month. Five grand a month and with project number 10, we've actually never really lost money in any project, but we've made the decision that we have a goal. I mean, I have a goal. Danny, he's still figuring out. I think when we retire, he's just gonna go and DJ in the desert somewhere because, but I have a goal. I've made a plan, a five-year plan and in five years, I'm gonna start my own animal sanctuary. I'm going to do deals that money's off the table that I will do the deals because I want to do them, not because I need the money that comes with those deals. So I've got a whole set of like things that I want to achieve within five years. And then every year I'm like putting steps to get to the five years. And this year is all about scaling and expanding. And we have taken a massive risk where we had uh quite a few tenanted properties and our cashflow was good. but those tenant properties had a lot more potential. But for us to achieve that potential, we had to uh vacate those properties and then turn them into something that would be much more, that would cashflow much better. And we've made that decision because we don't wanna, and there's nothing wrong with doing one by one, but because we know where we wanna be this time next year, we decided to do it all at once. So what we've done is we've rehomed all of our tenants. For some of them, we've actually paid for deposits. We've actually paid for the removal costs and we've helped them find a better place because the properties that we purchased, they were in very bad condition. So at the moment we have four live projects. And if you're familiar with renovations, nothing comes in. Everything just goes out. Literally, there's nothing that can drain your bank account quicker than a renovation. Or my sister when she was in her shopaholic stage, but that's another story for another day. But yes, so at the moment we are losing five grand a month and we prepared ourselves for that. It's a scary place to be, but we've got everything in place to minimise any risks of us not being where we want to be next year. And when I hear people saying to me, you were smashing it. I haven't got money to buy anything at the moment. We're literally losing money every single day. And some people might think that they might not understand why you put yourself in that position. Some people might think, that's very ballsy. But I think you need to do what's right for you. And again, it goes down to the comfort zone. And Danny and I are very similar. And we have the right people in place at the moment within our business to help us deliver what we want to deliver. And I know for a fact, that going through this year, which will probably be the most difficult year that Danny and I have ever had to face. um But once we come out of it, we will be able to enjoy our lives better, we'll be able to spend more time with each other. And I just got married last year, and I don't want to, because property is hard. And I think if we did it slow for us to get to where we want to be, would take us about five years. And it's five years of not having time for each other. Five years of, and we are not prepared to do that. We're not prepared to give those years to the business. There's nothing wrong with doing that, but we want to fast forward to a place where we do business because we enjoy, not because we have to. And this year will make it for us. It's just risk appetite. It's resources. It's risk appetite. It's alignment with your soul. It's alignment with your partner. It's alignment with yourself. It's so personal. And this is why I never quite understand it when, I feel like, I feel like I could be wrong in this. I'm wondering if women do this more than men, where we always compare ourselves to other people and we always think, oh well, hold on, we should be doing that or we should be doing that. It's like, no, it's like, what's your risk appetite? What is it that's right for you? And I love your dream, by the way, like your five year goal of going from a slaughterhouse to an animal sanctuary is just brilliant. Like absolutely fantastic. And do you know what? I love the fact you have a purpose, you have a goal. It's an alignment with you, Tammy, like... I just know you're going to achieve it and to now know your story and to watch this play out for you and to grow like honestly I'm your biggest supporter like I just love it I love the story I love everything about it and I can really see in your eyes, I can see how driven you are and how much like you almost had to go through what you went through to make you the woman that you are today and the women that you'll be in five years time. And I think that, um I think what's a beautiful story about this to say is if anyone is kind of watching this and thinking, God, do know I'm in a job at the moment where this is happening to me or I'm going through a similar situation, you know, it is important to reach out to people like Tammy who have been in a situation like this and to talk to other women who have because then you know that there are there's a brighter day to come and that's what I really want this podcast to do. I mean Tammy just to sort of help sort of like bring this beautiful podcast just to like... uh full circle. So you know, this episode is going to be all around transitioning from corporate life into entrepreneurial ship, which you said, you know, at beginning of podcast, said you didn't even have a, an entrepreneurial bone in your body. Look at you now girl. So, you know, what would you give us your advice for this transitional period? What would you say to anyone going through this or about to go through it? I think it's being patient. mean, having patience, nothing happens overnight. It goes back to Jim Rohn's quote, you you just need to make the first step in the direction that you want to end up at and just trust yourself that you're gonna end up there. For some people, you might take months, for some people it might take years, but then when you get to that position and you look back, you'll be so proud of yourself. And also, you might not know the support that you have around you, but you might have people that will be able to support you in this journey that you never thought you would. And I have found people within the property community that is supporting me so much. And I never thought I could have those people in my life. I thought it was only, you know, just Danny and myself. And now it's not just us. It's a whole army of mainly women that are supporting me and I can talk to them, you know, I'm not sure about doing this or... What do you think about this? And they've either gone through it or I'm thinking about one lady in particular, she's just like this elevated spiritual being that even if she hasn't been through that, she knows exactly how to advise you and she'll give you the best advice. I've got one of those in my life, which I'm very grateful for. But it's just like when people come to me and they ask me, how did you, they tell me about their problems and their challenges transitioning. I can go back now and I have the knowledge and the strength to potentially act differently if I could. If I could teleport myself to those challenges that I had in the abattoir and in the bigger factory, I would have acted completely different. But that's because of the knowledge that I have now. And when I have challenges and I reach out to people that are ahead of me, they probably made those mistakes. But because of the knowledge that they have now, they'll be able to advise me in a much like... what to do, the best thing to do. So it's just think about the people that you have around you. And if you don't have those people around you, do try and surround yourself with people that will help you grow and help you try and become the best version of yourself. Surround yourself with people that you look at them and you want to change who you are to improve yourself. And you do that and you can't go wrong. Yeah, beautifully said, Tammy. I think this word patience is so beautiful. think where we are in the moment, I think as a society, we're all about instant gratification. And I think what happened, if I think about the transition from corporate world to entrepreneurship for me personally, my advice would be is when I was, when I had my job as a premium travel consultant, you know, I would put a holiday together. They would then confirm. I would then get the commission. I would then get paid. And it was very transactional and very linear in its starting. Very, very linear. so got used to living a linear life, you know, and I got used to living a, uh if you do this piece of work, this is what will happen. This is a result and you'll get paid. Property investing in entrepreneurship is nothing like that. Nothing. You could literally spend hours and hours and hours putting together proposals, putting pieces of work together, being on a discovery call for an hour to get absolutely nothing. Yes. You could do all of the work analyzing a auction property, go to a bit of auction and somebody outputs you by five grand and you're like that was months of work and you get nothing. And I think the hardest bit that I had to learn was that just by doing work did not result in money. And it is absolutely heartbreaking at the start because all you see is money coming out, money coming out, money coming out and there's nothing coming in. And so your whole nervous system, and get shocked to shit quite frankly because you're like whoa this is scary and whoa this is weird and terrifying but what you almost have to do is you have to regulate yourself to go, you know? This is normal. This is part of it. Like Tammy's just said, know, five grand loss in order to get the future. And if you actually watch things like Dragon's Den and you listen to entrepreneurs and you listen to TEDx talks, I'm telling you, there is not one entrepreneur, not one who has ever said, this is how I started. I started and I made money from day one and I made money year on year and grew and grew and grew and Nobody has ever said that. You'll hear the story of when they slept on a park bench and when they slept in their office and when they went bankrupt three times and then there and I'm telling you the key word that I love to actually give to you all today based on Tammy's story and based on going from corporate life to being an entrepreneur and the word is resilience like resilience is what you need in order to do and become what it is that you want to it is consistency and it is resilience and I feel like there's a time where you'll sit with yourself very quietly And for some people you'll sit there and resilience will just like, it will just make you like... it will literally embody you and you'll go, I'm a resilient person. I can do this. I know I can. And some days you'll feel like more resilient than others and like be kind to yourself, like be patient, be kind. And you don't have to feel like this all the time. But if you can have a burning, almost like if you can burn on a simmer for the whole time. And then ever so often when you're like, let's face it, women in ovulation mode, you're like, whoa, I got a spike here. But the rest of time you're just on a simmer, you will go far. If you're a person that lets that simmer go out and you go, I can't do this. I'm to talk negatively to myself. I'm in pain. I'm a victim. I'm going to stay on this victim triangle. You will not have resilience and you'll not be able to go forward. And the day that you admit that will be the day that you set yourself free and you go, entrepreneurship is not for me. That's fine. I gave it a go. I accept it. And I wish that more people would just accept the fact. that it's not for you. And I'm just saying this right now, if that ever happens to you and you have a day and you go, thought it was for me and it's really not, congratulations, go enjoy your life. Go enjoy your life, go be whoever you're gonna be. You don't need to be something that you're not. And I think not enough people say that. It's not about forcing you to do something, it's about... just leaning into it because you want to lean into it. And for me, Tammy, think, and you said it beautifully about this woman that you're involved with. For me, the thing that has changed my life this year, my God, has it changed my life, is I have lent into subconscious work. So I have learned so much about me. So my God, it's, I've learned a lot about me and it's been tough. It's been really tough. It's been really eye-opening. ah I have, you don't know what you don't know. and I have learned so much about the way I do things, why I've done things. ah I learned that I have huge abandonment issues. I've learned that I've tried to earn love my entire life. I've learned that I've tried to, I've been a people pleaser my whole life. ah I have learned that I don't have boundaries and I give people horrendous uh leeway with access to me. And it's interesting because once you see things in yourself, you cannot unsee them. And then once you do that, you almost evolve into a different person and a person that becomes then your higher self. And it is fascinating to say the least because all these things that then happen to you in life makes sense. And then you're able to evolve. I always, I always say this like a Pokemon, cause I love Pokemon, evolve like a Pokemon and able to then go forward. it's a, it's a beautiful place to be. Yeah, I think the moment that you accept those things as lessons and then you review what you've learned from it, they are invaluable. They are invaluable. And I, for a long time, I look at all the challenges that I had in my corporate life as negative things. Why did I have to go through that? That was not fair. Oh gosh, that was not fair. Kind of repeated in my mind thousands and thousands of times. But now, I... don't know who I would be today if I hadn't gone for that. Because I might still be that person that don't know how to react or respond and has to run away from a difficult situation. Whereas I'm not now, but that's because I had to be back then. I love that timing and then really quickly because I realized that we've been talking and talking such a beautiful narrative and way that I didn't ask you what you're celebrating at this moment which of course are girls and property we have to celebrate so let's finish today with your celebration So I'm celebrating something that I've worked really hard for, which is building relationships in this industry. And sometimes because we've been so busy with projects, I've so guilty at times of putting myself out there and doing podcasts like this and going to live events when literally the whole world is burning in my office with things to do. And it's like prioritizing that. And I've always believed in building good relationships. because people do business with people. And we've closed a deal with a supported living provider. Then I've been trying to build a good relationship with them now for a few months. And they've agreed to take on one of our properties and it's going to be the best cash flowing asset that we will have in our portfolio, but also the best cash flowing asset in the whole city that we invest at. Yes, Tammy, yes! so happy and literally this just happened in the last few days. And they've literally said, we'll do it because it's you and we know you will deliver. Wow, look at you, look at you fly. Go on girl, I'm here for you. That's amazing. Honestly, congratulations. That is a huge, huge achievement. I'm so happy for you. should be so proud of yourself and celebrate, honestly, celebrate it all. When it happens, make sure that you're rooted in celebration. You remember the moment and you just digest and look back at that Tammy who had that thing thrown at her in that abattoir and fell to the floor. And you look at that girl and you say to her, girl, better days are to come because it is gorgeous for you. So I love that celebration. And you know I'm gonna celebrate something as well for me which is obviously so the new website just got launched Brand new website for girls in property which has taken me so long the reason that the website took so long to put together by the way is because poor Jackie Jackie laws who is the best website designer ever I changed, I kept evolving. So over a year as the website kept getting developing, I kept evolving as a person. So the website kept having to change because the products kept changing. And Jackie was like, Athena, I can't keep up with you. You're like evolving so fast. So poor Jackie did a fantastic job. The website's good to go. If you're ever interested in working with me, whether it's you're at the start of your journey, I've just put together an online foundation course called the Girls and Property Online Foundation course. It literally talks you through the seven steps of how to go from corporate life to full-time property investor. is the seven steps that I literally followed in my own journey and it has everything in there for you. Whether you're looking at HMOs, buy-to-lets, service accommodation, it's all there. em And then the other thing also is that I've also got my girls and property accelerator program. That is a six month program where I work on it with Akhtar Khan, who's a business psychologist. We've already done the first cohort. It's been incredible. The transformation that women have gone through. And that is all about aligning who you are as a person with the strategies that you want to do. And then we've just introduced for 2026, the girls in prosperity mastermind. So as of today, we've got we actually only 10 spaces for the accelerator, 10 spaces mastermind. We haven't even launched it and six spaces for the mastermind have already gone through private conversations. So only four spaces left. And that is going to be all around buying businesses, investing in stocks and investing in yourself and diversification of a portfolio. And again, me and Acta are doing that together. The reason we're doing it is because I am going to be looking at buying businesses this year and really diversifying and then buying businesses and then investing in property. I'm learning all about it. It's an incredible strategy to do. I don't want to gatekeep. I want to bring everyone in. So when this comes out, I don't know how many spaces it's gonna be left or if it's sold out, but come and just click on work with me. And I've got all the pages about the online course, the accelerator, the mastermind, the community, why I've created Girls and Property. It is literally my shop window. Go check it out, girlsandproperty.co.uk. Wonderful, Tammy, I'd love to leave you with the parting words today. So what your parting words for all the listeners. I feel like I've said so much already. was gonna, you know what, I always try and finish with Jim Rohn's quote, but I'm gonna say it again. So it is, can't change your destination overnight, but you can change your direction overnight. And your direction will determine your destination. gorgeous. Go change your direction ladies. Tammy, thank you. It's been a beautiful episode. Thank you so much. I can't wait for everyone to hear it and I will see you at the Girls and Property Retreat in April. I'll see you there girl. I'm already picking my outfit. I'm so excited. uh I'll see you in a couple of weeks. um Right everyone, enjoy your week, have a great one, hope the sun is shining for you, sending you loads of love and energy today. Hope you can feel it, hugs around you and yeah, lots of love. See you soon ladies, bye.