Finally Take Control of Your Money with Fliss Wallace

Make more money. Hold onto more money. Protect more money.

We don't talk about this enough as women. Money is still treated like something we shouldn't mention, a very British kind of silence. I refuse to accept that.

In this episode of Girls in Property I'm joined by financial advisor, financial coach and SAS practitioner Fliss Wallace to blow that taboo wide open. This is a real, honest conversation about building wealth, protecting what you've worked so hard for, and finally feeling in control of your numbers as a woman in business.

We talk about why money still feels like a taboo subject for so many women, and why we hesitate to ask the questions that could change everything. Fliss shares her own journey into financial advice and opens up about the gender gap that still exists in wealth conversations. Because the truth is, you can't grow what you don't understand.

From cash flow planning and knowing your numbers to pensions, ISAs and tax efficiency, this episode is packed with the practical foundations every woman should have. But it goes deeper than making more money. We get into protection, wills and power of attorney. The pieces most of us avoid until it's too late. This isn't just about wealth. It's about safeguarding your future and the people you love.

We also explore business succession, exit planning and legacy, plus the power of surrounding yourself with the right people. Your Avengers list, as Fliss calls it. Because no one builds real wealth alone.

If money has ever felt overwhelming, or like something other people just "get," this is your invitation to start. It's never too late to take control, protect what matters, and build the future you deserve.

If you want to get involved with our 5 day money challenge within the community starting Monday 06th July, join our community here: Property Community for Women | Girls in Property

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Transcript

0:02

Good morning everyone and welcome to another episode of the Girls in Property podcast. So, ladies and gentlemen, let's talk about money today and wealth. You know it's one of my favourite conversations because let's face it, I just feel like we are not having enough conversations at the moment actually about this. It's almost like we're very British and we're very like money is the root of all evil. Let's not talk about money, let's not talk about wealth. And actually, I'm completely the opposite. I'm like, no, let's talk about it because. It's one thing to make money, and there are so many different ways that you can actually make money. But what about actually holding money? What about actually holding wealth? And what about this notion of kind of being deserving to even be allowed to hold wealth and finding the right balance in that, which is what this conversation is going to be all about. Um now, this particular person that I'm going to introduce you to all, she actually spoke at Rebecca Barr's Wealthy Woman conference recently. And as soon as she spoke on stage, I thought to myself, I have to get her on the podcast. Number one, she is a woman. Number two, she's a financial advisor, and so much more than that. And three, just her energy was absolutely brilliant and it really showed me that you can have fun, be fabulous, and hold wealth at the same time and really be in that field. So I'm going to show you all today that we can make money fun, we can make wealth fun, and we can really do it in a really energized and fabulous way. So without further ado, I'd love to introduce Flis Wallace. Hey Fliss! Thank you very much for having me. Of course, of course. I love this conversation. I love talking about this. And as I said to you before you came on the podcast, I have had wealth conversations on this podcast before, but because of various reasons, they've actually all been with men. So you are the first person that's actually coming on as a female to talk about this notion of wealth, financial advisory, holding wealth. And I think that's what I really love to have this conversation about today. for all of the women and men listening. So are you ready to go? Absolutely far away. Okay, let's do it. So first of all, can you please introduce yourself, tell everybody about you? I am fascinated to hear how a woman such as yourself, in your gorgeous pink dynamic suit, got into the world of finance, got into the world of being a financial advisor and what that has really entailed for you. So yeah, floor is yours. lovely. Thank you very much. Well, my name is Fis Wallace. I am an independent financial advisor, a financial coach, and a SaaS practitioner. My background was very varied. I came out of university with a biological sciences degree and then did absolutely nothing with it. In the sense that my first proper job was then working for a uh Professional rugby club looking after events and hospitality. So completely separate to where um I am now. But through various, you know, meeting people at the right time and in the right place, I gradually migrated all the way through to advisory via property. So I used to have a previous company that specialised in helping international clients, predominantly buy property in London. and we're looking at how to structure that in an efficient way. Uh, most of the reasons not actually being tax, as one might assume, it was actually more about privacy and anonymity. So I had a previous business assisting in that area, um, and I was already qualifying to become a financial advisor in the background. But as one might expect when you work in business, you there were always pivots in life, and there were always uh stress tests, and our stress test was Brexit. So The literally the day after Brexit happened, the phones stopped ringing because inevitably no one knew how quickly it was going to be implemented, what implications that would have for international purchases of property in the UK, predominantly London. um And luckily, because I was just coming to the end of um my financial advisory exams, we we actually had already identified that our biggest scope for growth was moving into the regulatory space. And being able to assist clients with more than just property, but looking at a more more of a helicopter view of their worldwide wealth from everything from investments, tax efficient investments, property, pensions, and sort of family legacy planning. So I had a very varied unpredictable journey into advice. Um that then pivoted into coaching. So I absolutely love working with Um, particularly women in business, but also women that are first generation wealth. So inevitably, what happened when I was coming across women in that space was it wasn't just the knowledge and the confidence in investing that they needed. They actually needed a bit more of financial coaching around the emotions of holding money, retaining money, not pushing money away. Um, and the particular areas that I worked with, aside from women that were suddenly becoming very successful in their businesses was death and divorce. So, you know, I I do look after a number of widows who um unfortunately lost their husbands and then had all of this wealth and plans and investments and and had no idea how to manage or deal with it or what could be done. Um, so I've I've really enjoyed helping that particular area of of clients, but also those that have um recently become divorced. And again, it's the first. time they've ever had to manage their own finances. And as as you know, Athena, they don't teach this at school. They don't give us a lot of education and knowledge around investment risk, capacity for loss, investment horizons, what is appropriate to you, what is, are you looking forward to, you know, children, grandchildren's kind of uh wealth. So I've I've inevitably over time, I've ended up migrating more and more to assisting females. as opposed to males. But that said, I work with families, I work with three generations of families, I work with, you know, family businesses. Um, and I and I absolutely love what I do in whatever capacity they need me for. Mm. I mean, how incredible is that that you get to do that, really? I mean you're you're you're literally like changing people's lives by just having conversations with them and talking again through my money. And like we said, this just wasn't taught at school. And you know, particularly for women, you know, we often talk about this notion, which is still baffles me to this day, that women weren't even allowed to have their own mortgage until about fif fifty years ago, which nineteen seventy five, which is just crazy. So This whole dynamic of needing a man to buy a house and needing a man's signature, only fifty years ago, you know, in our parents' age, basically, time, which is just crazy. So brilliant story. I love that. And I love I love the story that you tell. And I love the fact that again you're, you know, such this dynamic figure within this world. I mean, what has it been like for you really to be a a a female within this world, in the financial advisory world? Are there many of you, or have there been some real sort of sticky parts that you found as you've been going through it? What's it been like? Yeah, it's an interesting. from moving into events and hospitality and beyond, the areas that I've ended up migrating to have inherently been male-dominated environments. I think my worst experience was probably every year I had to go to MIPIM. Um, and and the sausage fest that is that and how awful that is as a female, because you're definitely in the minority there. Um, but in terms of females in financial advice. You're pretty much looking at a unicorn because there's only 16% of red registered advisors are women. Even fewer of those are independent financial advisors rather than tied agents. And there's a big difference between those. And then even fewer of those, again, actually run their own business. So Seymour is a female-led business. It's my business with my own my business partner. Um, there are six of us in the team, and five of us are women. And it it has a great energy as a result of that in terms of welcoming more women into you know the knowledge and um of investing and feeling they have a good team around to support them. Just like you know, you would use a a lawyer, you would use an accountant, a tax advisor. I think often financial advice gets put on the back burner. And I think particularly from the female side. Sometimes, and I certainly get this feedback from um happy clients that have come to me, is you're the first person I felt I could ask a question because I was scared of asking a male palesdale advisor, you know, in case he thought I was stupid. So often women miss out on that opportunity to maximize their opportunities for their wealth because they're scared of feeling, you know, underrepresented, but also feeling that they can't ask questions. And hopefully, you know, we are. Building a a momentum and a reputation for being able to welcome those women into our space. And no question of stupid, absolutely none. Um, so it's great that we have that trust for our clients and that they, you know, they pop me a voice note, they drop me a message off list. I was just thinking about this. Is this a good idea? Is this not? And I love working in that kind of fast-paced environment like many of my clients are, because they are business owners themselves, they've got kids, they're juggling, everything. Um and you know, I really lean into that because that's the space that I'm in. That's exactly what art I'm doing um at the moment as well. that's what makes you so unique is you can actually really associate with the women who are sending you those voice notes and probably cooking you've got the kids in the background going Harry put your shoes on you know what do you think about this and I I I totally hear you and what would you say to like women listening to this then who hasn't haven't yet started let's say that they because for example I'm I I'm I'm actually one of these people fliss so I actually have just started really taking I would say my finances serious in the last year just under a year I actually do have a um financial advisor myself, but I think it's really been this case of needing to actually understand it when you've got so many different businesses and actually it's like, well, hold on, where does it go? And for me, it's also about being tax efficient as well, and understanding right, how much shall I put be putting into my pension in order to have those taxes? So when would you say you really find it that women start to really, really start thinking about getting a financial advisor and wealth building? Well, I'm very fortunate with the women that have come into sort of my community is that they've they've also found me through a number of peers that I work with who they themselves are saying, you need to go and speak to a financial advisor. The answer is always the earliest you the earlier you can get a financial involved financial advisor involved in your business and in your wealth, the better, because then you can make more informed choices. And one of the strongest pieces of work that we do with clients is cash flow planning. So we can put together your ground zero, like what you've got now or what you haven't got now, equally fine. But project it forward in time to when you're telling us you want to retire and what income you want to retire on. And if there is a shortfall, if there is a gap, that's fine. But we now know we've got time on our side to then make informed choices about how we close that gap with different investment options, different growth. strategies and and focusing on tax efficiency as well, you know, where you're leaking money to the tax fund that you don't need to just by being more tax efficient and and maybe getting things done earlier on in your business year rather than after when you can't do so much about your tax bill. So it can really bear dividends to get somebody involved, but most of my female clients probably approach me mid to late 40s. Um, I do have clients obviously into the 60s, 70s and 80s as well that have come to an advisor for the first time, but they all have slightly different objectives and needs and, you know, um pressure points for them that hopefully through you know the plethora of of companies that we have and the peers around us that we can support them with. I love that. I absolutely love that. And and I I definitely find that when you're asking women about sort of like their why, like when they get into property investing or or why they want the money as it were, it always comes back to the children, it always comes back to legacy, it always comes back to to giving back as it were. And I think this is where a financial advisor would be really good is actually understanding in terms of well, how's that gonna work? How are we gonna be passing this down? What's the comfort like how should we be setting up in the right way? And you know, you're 100% right. The best advice I can give is, and it's a bit like an accountant as well. It's it's quite similar, which is I think a lot of people say, Well, I'm gonna start my business, I'm gonna make this money, I'm gonna do this, then I'm gonna get an accountant, then I'm gonna get a financial advisor. And it's like, yeah, but you now are gonna have to undo all the work that you've just done because the company structures are set up in the wrong way. You've lost out to the tax man because you didn't understand that actually you should have been moving your money in this. Like, even me, even me, I've had to learn that. There was a certain period of time in which I could have moved money into the pension and then I went over it. And I was like, well, nobody told me that. And I'm uh you know, and now sort of now I've got my financial advisor working with my accountant and we're all working together. So to be like, right, everybody needs to know the the the outcome of, you know, getting a a house abroad at 40, for example. And as you said, it's like, okay, the money might not be there at the moment, but how do we plug those that that gap? What is it that we need to do? And I love when you said about cash flow projection. I don't think enough of us actually do this in terms of our businesses and having that. Um, do you find that with a lot of women that actually when you ask them if they have a cash flow projection, do they tend to not really have one? Yeah, no, I would say they they definitely don't have I think the biggest question that takes the longest for them to answer is when are you going to get off the hamster wheel? You know, we've set all these businesses up, and unlike um, you know, perhaps why men might set businesses up, and that's a very generalized assumption, but there was a recent study that said that 92% of women said that their business is a reflection of their personal values and their goals and where their alignment was. Means women are more in tune with what they want to use their business for on a short, medium, long-term basis. But what they don't necessarily think is you don't start at the end. So a lot of those businesses have been set up around the school run, around being a parent, around other things. And sometimes the best thing, the best way to start a business is start the end and go, well, when do I want to exit? Do I want to exit? Is this a passive income play? Is this something that's going to sit in the background and supplement my retirement? Or am I building something that can be scalable or can be sellable? And those questions are the hardest to answer, I find, for clients, because actually we're so busy on this hamster wheel of getting everything done, getting invoices out, getting things paid, um, you know, services, etc., that It's very difficult for any business owner to imagine a time when that stops, when the phone doesn't ring, when they don't have that business, because it's another baby, isn't it? Let's face it. and trying to understand how that plugs into your retirement and whether that plugs into your retirement is the the strongest decision that we have to make from a cash flow perspective. Because basically, we then draw a line in the sand and say, right, from 65. You are either going to be completely reliant on your pension and investments that I manage for you, or if things go as planned, you're going to exit for two million quid because you've told me that two million quid is your financial freedom number that you think that you need. I'm going to tell you you need three and a half, or I'm going to tell you that you need one based on everything else we're doing in the background. My job as an advisor is to try and make everything else outside of your business a plan B if something doesn't go to plan. So if you if you don't sell your business because nobody wants to buy it or it's the wrong time in the in the market cycle, et cetera, if I have done my job properly, then your pensions, your ICEs, your other investments are going to be able to carry you forward through that difficult time until something can be done with your business. Or if you intend to retain it as a passive income, but it doesn't generate the income that we're projecting. My job is to make sure that we have saved over and above what you need to be able to carry that difference. So, um, and and property obviously is a huge extra component that can form part of your lifestyle income now, but also your retirement income. And we we basically work around that, you know, with my background and understanding of whether I think you're in the right structure or whether that can be finessed in itself, um, or indeed if your plan is to sell. And I I know there's a lot of people out there, particularly in the residential vital let space at the moment, that are coming to me and saying, Flips, I've solved my business or I've sold my company or I've sold my property. Here's a chunk of change. What do I do with it next? And sometimes the answer for them is I don't want to go into property right now. What else can I do? Um so it's a blank sheet of paper when any client comes to me. that we then over time we fill in those gaps and we cash flow what those possibilities look like. And then you've got you can make informed decisions about your future then. Mm, exactly. Isn't that just such a beautiful thing to do to be able to sit with somebody and be like, Look, I've sold this, I've sold this, now I've got this chunk of cash, what shall I do with it? And actually having somebody qualified to sit down and go, Well, you could do this, you could do this, and just to almost just talk through your ideas. I feel like sometimes a lot of a lot of women sit with their ideas and they actually sit on some fantastic ideas that they have, but they don't talk to anybody about them. And so all they ever remain is an idea that sits in your head on the school run. as opposed to actually moving forward with it because I feel like we get so fearful, you know, there's there's so much fear around it because let's face it, when you've never done anything before, it's a really scary thing to do. You don't have any proven outcome, you don't really have anything there. But I always say to people, if a seed has been planted in your brain, it's been planted for a reason. There is a reason that you should do it. You just gotta speak to the right people about it and get gain expert advice. Because you know there are lots of tricky bits to it and caveats and everything. And so it is a bit of mindful that you need professional help with. There's most things. Absolutely. And it's not, you know, um, it's not all doom and gloom. Sometimes when I set up with clients for the first time, um, whether they've come early, middle, or late in their in their planning um as to whether they have a pension at all for it's not always a case of you haven't got enough. There are no end of cases I deal with where because clients have been successful, they might have not done everything perfectly, but because they're on track for success, it's great to be able to say, if you do what we've agreed to do together. the projections indicate you can afford to retire at the age that you want on the income that you said that you want. That is such is such a a good day when I'm able to say to somebody, that's going to close the gap or meet your expectations and then some, you know, then a margin of error and those kind of things. And if anything else comes into the into your plan that was unexpected, then we can meet those unexpected outcomes, whether that's positive or a negative impact on your finances. And nobody knows what's around the corner. It's my job to try and uh anticipate those curveballs. And we all have curved curveballs in business, whether that is saving for the future, whether that's anticipating a projected exit of something, or whether it's providing protection and control of assets, control. So everything from looking at wills and power of attorney, business power of attorney, That leaves, you know, not having a business power attorney if you're running a business is a huge vulnerability. If you're in hospital and no one can pay the payroll and no one can make financial decisions for the business, you don't want to come out of hospital and find you've lost your business because no one could make any decisions without you. So those kind of documents are really, really important. But also uh protecting that downside. So what happens if you lose your key salesperson? Um, from your business because they're they become seriously ill or they pass away. That's a huge aggravator to your business sales and your projection if you're reliant on one person. That person might also be you. Um, and protecting that from for your family, but also the business itself, which is in inevitably quite a key part of your wealth if you've got a successful business. We look at all of those issues and make sure that. We are mitigating any of those anticipated risks. Hmm, it's such an important conversation to have, isn't it? Because I'd be honest with you, Flis, I've often avoided these conversations. You know, we want to talk about things like income protection and all sorts. I'm like, no, I don't want to talk about that. Because I feel there's quite a negative stigma attached to it as well. I feel like when I like when I've started my business, like I used to see all these people just trying to sell it for the sake of selling it, if that makes sense, without actually explaining it as to why it was necessary to have it. Whereas listening to you just speak, then I thought, hmm. It's good point, actually. You know, if this was to happen, if this was to happen, currently I'm not protected. I'm not. And I'll openly share that. So I think it's really important to actually have these conversations. So you've just sort of hit a light bulb moment for me in that, going, hmm, maybe it is time to have this as, you know, as the business grows and and the what ifs. I think they're really important. You know, we'd never do we'd never go on holiday without travel insurance, would we? So why have a business without Without the insurance side of things, I suppose. oh underplay our value as well. You know, I I often have conversations with female business owners where it's not uncommon for me to insure their lives for a couple of million quid or more. And they're like, Really? And I but you think about what you're earning now. So if you were to pass away, your family would not, you know, your capacity to earn. So your capacity to earn is at least 20 years of your current salary and dividends. Okay, so that's one thing that will not be there. You then add 20 years of the pension contributions that we've agreed to put in, plus all the growth that would have happened had they been put in and the market had performed as we may anticipate long term. Plus, we're going to assume that your business is going to increase. So the value in that business is going to drop if the key person is not there in terms of if you are reliant on the business operations. So you add all of that up for clients that are approaching me in their 40s and 50s quite often. And they're staggered by their actual loss to the household of them not being there. Um, and that is without, you know, we are all very used to being sold mortgage protection when we get a mortgage to pay off the mortgage. And so when I speak to clients and say we've got protection, I've got that source, I've mortgage protection. I said, Yeah, but what happens then is if you die, your spouse is going to inherit a mortgage fee property. That's great, like tick. How are they gonna live and pay the bills on one income? You haven't ensured your future earnings, your capacity to earn, to continue to live there when you've got one income, not two. The bills aren't going to go down that much if you've got kids. Your council tax isn't going to go down that much. Like all the operations of a joint household will reduce inevitably, but not by enough where if the other person isn't on a really sizable income where they can carry the weight on their own, you're going to have to downsize. Or, you know, if you're not there. Who's going to be doing the school run? Maybe you have to get help in nannies or assistants or um, you know, trying to manage that person's job on their own, but having to do two persons um interactions with children and and all those kind of things. So actually ensuring your debt is a tick, but it's only half the story. And when you explain that, there is a light bulb moment of, my God, that would have been my loss to the family. I just realized, you know. my husband or wife, et cetera, would would have to downsize because they couldn't carry the the burden of of the household bills on one income alone. So yeah, we do talk a lot about that. And it it is often quite, you know, a a sobering conversation. But it is very, very it's a very, very important one and you cannot ostrich your way out of it. Um it's it's getting that alone, getting your wills and power of attorney and your protection is probably more important to start with than then looking at okay what should I be investing in? What can I put into my pension? How can I close the pensions gap? And you know, women unfortunately do have um a projection of lower pension pots than men for lots of reasons. uh And I'm definitely um on a huge um intention of closing that gap for my for my ladies in business. Mm, I love that. And let's let's let's talk about that because I think pensions and you know SAS is a really, really big one for a lot of women in property. Just before I do that, Fish, just taking a break from this, um, as I mentioned to you with Girls and Property, we we always talk about celebrating on this podcast as well. Because, you know, it's just such an important thing to do. I really believe that as women, we just don't take time to just take a moment to just stop and go, actually, what am I celebrating? Personally, professionally, whatever it is. And so I love to do it on this podcast with all of my guests. So What would you say that you are celebrating at this moment in time? well I'm celebrating. I found out on Friday I have been nominated for Entrepreneur of the Year and Financial Advisory of the Year by the Women's Recognition Awards, which is key in the financial services industry. So yeah. So I was very pleased to put to get that email on Friday. So I will be um diving into whatever application process is required for, you know, for the actual awards itself. But I was I was very pleasantly surprised to be nominated. So that's what I'm celebrating at the moment. Absolutely love that. And are you up against a lot of guys then with that award? Oh sorry, it's a women's recognition. in our financial services field. Um, but it's still nice to be nominated. Oh my god, hugely, hugely. And you know, I think this is so wonderful when there are women recognition awards, particularly for for something such as this as well. And um I absolutely love that for you. So congratulations, that's huge. Okay. Yeah, right, we'll get your application in and fingers and toes crossed for you, but that's absolutely brilliant. Um what am I celebrating at the moment? I I recently celebrated on on last week's podcast when I was doing it, this notion of life. celebrating life, you know, the fact that I'm out in Spain at the moment um and sort of just able to live and work abroad and everything. I think if I'm on the theme of kind of if I'm on the theme of wealth at the moment in terms of celebr celebrating, I suppose my celebration would be that I'm gonna celebrate my I'm gonna celebrate my power team actually today I think because I think what's really been amazing is whilst I've been out here in Spain I've been able to I said this the other day to somebody. I've been able to almost have all the team being able to do what it is that they need to do. And I've almost been like the person that sits above, almost like the orchestra, being like, right, where does everybody need to be? So, for example, you know, last week alone I spoke to my broker, my solicitor, my accountant, my financial advisor, my uh two executive assistants that I've got, my community leader. Like, I was able to talk to everybody, and everybody just delegate and kind of be where they needed to be. They came to me when they needed to to. They were like, no, we're fine if they need they were fine. And I think that I've often said this and I really mean this. Like it is really about who you know, not what you know. It really, really is. And I really stand fast in that. Like for example, I also went to Gibraltar last week to with one of my business mentors called Atta and we we went and He was able to introduce me to his team and I was able to meet loads of like really, really high net worth individuals who had so much money, like a ridiculous amount of money, who literally were like property developers but built like massive, massive skyscrapers, built everything from Bournemouth to Brighton. But yet they're in Gibraltar living there in shorts and a t-shirt drinking a pint. You know, we weren't in Mayfair, we weren't in like you know, Marbella, we were in Gibraltar. And I just feel that it really, really comes down to just conversation and it comes down to connection in this industry and then people being able to connect you in the right way. So I think for me the biggest thing I'm recognizing is genuinely like my power team is everything. Um, which takes years to build up. I think I've said it's taken me a good three years to build up a decent power team now. At least three years. Um and then the connections that I had last week and the conversations I had with these high net worth individuals. Um Who were all there, literally with like open arms going, Athena, if you if you wanna move to Gibraltar, Spain, we've got you, come find us, like gave me their numbers. you know, we'll introduce you to some people, they introduce me to some other women as well who I'm gonna be connecting with while I'm out here. Just really, really, really cool. So yeah, I think connection and power team is what I'm also gonna celebrate. It's it's really important. Yeah, we always talk about so I'm a brand ambassador for the She Io Collective, which is a women's um business collective where you get a meeting of minds within that group, and there's some absolutely incredible powerhouses in there, both mentors and um, you know, I'm their in house financial advisor, but there's obviously other people that are well being mentors and things, and there is a weekly meeting where everybody says, you know, what their problem is, and there's always somebody in there. That has done that before, whether it's, I've got a problem with a Facebook ad, or oh, this advert isn't working. Can someone look at the copy? And there's a brand and there's a brand specialist in there as well. Amazing lady called Jojo. and I do find actually it is all about constructing your Avengers list of people that are on your go to, you know, your ride or die list. Well, and you know, I we work with female accountants in there. Um, the lady who runs Sheo Jess, she's been a friend of mine for about 20 years. And once you find your person, your tribe, you take them with you on that journey. And I think the the more people I'm finding in this community and the and the inspiration that you get from female business owners, the more you're able to help them as well and connect those people. You know, I know a tax advisor that can do that restructuring for you. I know an accountant who's done that before and I'll put you in touch. Or I know a mortgage, you know, advisor or something. Finding that list, as you're absolutely right. It's not what you know, it's who you know. But it's also the trust and the confidence that you've got the right people on your side. And it's okay. I think the biggest issue we have with as women in business, we don't have to do it all ourselves and we don't have to know it all ourselves. We just have to have the right people that you trust to do the job. Um, and certainly for for Seymour for my advisory practice, you know, we struggled on as two people and then three people for as long as possible because of that that block, that that belief that you have to do everything yourself. And as soon as I myself unblocked that, we've gone from three to six people really quickly, our capacity. To help more women because of the bandwidth we now have, I've got another advisor who supports me with ongoing services. We've got um my marketing um assistant, Sasha, who does a lot of our social media for us. We've just leveled up, you know, really, really quickly in that space of time to the point where you're like, why didn't I do this before? Why didn't I ask these questions of the people around me before? And I think that is a huge barrier that women in business that I speak to, suddenly, once those barriers are taken away, they level up. And again and again and again. And it's all about the people that you meet on that journey. Hmm, do you know, perfectly said. And I I was that when I first started. I definitely had mentality that I had to do it all on my own. I think trying to think why we feel like this. Maybe we feel like we earned it more if we just did it by ourselves. Maybe there's like a badge of honour in that. Like a you know when women sometimes say, I don't need anybody, you know, I did it all on my own and and and they wear it with such heart. And it's like actually it it th there isn't it's almost like they see it as a weakness. Like it's it's weak to have to lean on somebody or somebody else. And I think as women, maybe because we go the other way almost, we really don't want to lean on anybody else. We really want to stand in our own power, but that can actually sometimes be quite detrimental to growth. And for me, I think that when I first started my businesses and I was literally a one woman band, I mean I and you'll know this listen so many lists will know this. I ha I held every single job height you can possibly imagine. From sales to marketing to admin to funnels to everything. You know, that that's what a business is required. I think it was something you said to me the other day, you end up doing like 180 jobs all at the same time. And with that, you can't actually be creative. You can't actually think about where the business is going to go and expand because you're in it. Now I know that when you start out in business, of course, that's sometimes a necessity because you have no choice, the cash flow isn't there. So I understand that and I understand that's where we all we all go from. But I think just that little bit of question, that little bit of it, and you said it beautifully actually, Flis, which is, you know, I encourage every single person to find their own community that works for them, whether it's a business community, um, if it's a property community, you know, of course that I run Girls in Property, everybody, which is a beautiful property community of 130 women now. And, you know, you all come in and you all ask questions and you all help each other and you will like my biggest pride and joy is when I see A question that gets uh asked, and then suddenly all of all of you guys can like answer all the questions, and I just get to sit there and kind of go, This is great. And I might, you know, chip in if I think I can add any value. But other than that, I just think to myself, Great, there you go, that's what community is all about. And I think that that is what we don't do enough of as women. We don't ask enough or lean on it. And it's about leaning on the right people because there will be people out there who won't understand what you're doing. Like you might be like at the gate and other mums are thinking, what are you doing? And parents might say to you, When are you gonna go and get a proper job? I've had that one before. or other things. So it's just about being around the right people. And you said it, Phyllis, like you don't need to know everything about everything. We're not built to know everything about everything. Find your experts, find your Avengers, which I loved. I am so do you know what really made me laugh? I used this terminology when I was looking at getting my accelerator programme together in my mastermind. I said, I feel like I'm getting the Avengers together. That's how I feel about it. And I stand by that. I really think that the Avengers, you know, and you do build out this power team, don't you? That they then come through these different stages of life. And people come and go all the time, but I think that that's such an important thing that you just said. So yeah, I encourage everybody today to take one step forward is just to find your your people, your tribe, your power team a hundred percent. Yeah, and I think it I I certainly would say consider a even a short or medium term investment in a coach or a mentor, everybody I've spoken to that has gone down that journey of looking at leveling up or scaling up within whatever community they want to work, having that and quite often now an online community, because let's face it, the thing that used to wind me up about networking was that they were always breakfast. Times or evening times when you're doing bath bottle bed or taking the kids to school. They were all the timings of them were so hostile to women that even if you did go, you were the only woman in the group. And then you realized all the men were just all passing business between them and you get a soggy bacon sandwich. And that was it. And I think there's never been a greater opportunity for us to find our tribe and find that community online at a time that works for us. And It's one of the reasons that I hopefully that my clients find me, you know, able to support them to the to the max is because whether you consider it healthy or not, whether there's boundaries or not, a client can contact me at any point, in any way that they want. And quite often it isn't a case of writing an email because a lot of my clients are in the um hair and beauty industry. You know, they are in the chair or they're operating around the salon, they cannot sit and write an email. It's not even in their like their skill set is not to be sat in front of a computer. It it stresses them out. If they feel comfortable asking me something on a voice note or in any other way that allows them to get their point across to ask their question in a way that feels comfortable. I'm all for that. So and I'm quite good at responding. I love a I love a little voice note so long as it's not more than a minute and it becomes a podcast. But It's the quickest way to get the answers that you want and being able to adapt your business to that rather than this kind of square, don't talk to me outside the hours of nine or five, and it must be an email. I think we've all had to adapt. We've uh, you know, particularly women who have got young families and things, you just have to grab that opportunity at whatever time of the day it is. And a lot of these um communities in whether it's property, whether it's women in business, whether it's learning about finance. It's such an opportunity now because they're all recorded. You can watch them again. You can log into your groups whenever you want. You can walk the dog and listen to a podcast like some people might be doing now. There's never been a bigger opportunity to dial in and find your revengers. It doesn't have to be on a strict, well, if you can't turn up, then you don't get you don't get the goods. You don't get the value. Hmm, absolutely. I hear you one hundred percent. And you know it's gonna be people listening walking the dogs right now. So I love that. I know exactly. So Fleis, if we were gonna give some value today then, you know, sort of like some action steps if you like. So let's say that they're got somebody listening to the podcast and they're like, Girls, I hear you. I hear you, I really wanna do this. and let's say that they're they're they're at the early stages of their business, you know, they're about six, seven months in, they're just getting to grips with it. What's What's some action steps we can really give them today that they can now take forward from this podcast? The best, and I know it's the horriblest thing as well that I can ask clients to do is to look at their what I would call their yesterday's pot, their today pot, and their tomorrow part. So your yesterday's pot is looking at either in the business or personally what level of debts do you have. Mortgage being the most obvious one. If you are lucky enough to have already purchased a house, do you have credit cards in your business? Do you have a bounce back loan from a few years back when the C-word happened? What can we do about getting rid of those yesterday's pots if now is is becoming, you know, you're you're getting momentum and success success in your business? Because you can't fill your tomorrow bucket or even your today bucket. You can't fill a bucket with water with holes in the bottom. So if you're constantly servicing your yesterday's pot without making overpayments or getting it paid off as quickly as possible, is really, really difficult to then uh plan your forward projections for for your life and your retirement. So looking at yesterday's pot, then looking, you know, with being really pragmatic, we can't live like monks. We can't all live on cruel. We have to have a work-life balance and we have to enjoy our today because tomorrow isn't promised, is it? So having an understanding of what you're spending and what is a credible expense budget for, you know, a couple of holidays, for Christmas presents, for the kind of um discretionary and essential income that you are wanting for your lifestyle and being accountable to that, but also being pragmatic about whether it's even viable for you to reduce that or not. And once we've got those figures, we can then create both your business and personally your surplus income. Your surplus income is what's left over after you've serviced your today and after you've serviced your yesterday. And it's that figure that then I can go to work on with you because I cannot create a plan for your tomorrow if you don't have a surplus income number that you're comfortable and accountable committing. Your future. So coming to those meetings going, I now know that my business has X profit per month in a typical month, or I now know that at the end of each month I should have £250 a month left over that I'm comfortable committing that I don't need. You know, and we've we talk about emergency pots for cash and resilience within your business. That's the information that I can't help you with without going through your bank statements. And it's a real ostrich thing. The number of clients fill in their fact find and in the bit where it says what's your expenditure, they leave blank and I send it back and go, no, no, no. You're gonna have to get financially naked, is what we call it. You're gonna have to look at what your earnings are, what your ex expenditure is either in your business or personally. Because until I have that understanding, I don't know what I can do for you to go forward, whether that is, you know, build an ICE, build a pension, build, look at tax-efficient investments. Um, looking at how you might have aspirations for private school for your children or to buy a holiday home. Those conversations are great, but until we start with the here and now of what you've got to to throw at that, I don't know where I can go with it. So that that would be the most important thing is know your numbers and you're going to have to get financially naked with it. And it's a difficult, horrible thing to do, but it is the most important number that you that you need to be able to make meaningful change to your future. Yeah, I love that get financially naked. I'm just trying to think if I was to do that, because for example, business like Girls and Property, my God, there's so much expenditure. I mean, there's money flying all over the place. Literally like money flowing in, money flowing out. I'm just trying to think, because obviously I'm on zero. It might be that I literally just look at my expenditure actually on zero where everything's placed and kind of do it in that way. So I'm just trying to think for the listeners listening to this where they'd be able to do that. And I guess it would be through the the accounting software or an Excel spreadsheet, you those early people in their early days, just start making a note now. Maybe that's what they can actually do. Is because you're gonna need this down the road, it might be a good idea to start saying, right, you know, what was my expenditure? What is this? Um, but you're right, getting financially naked is always a is always a really interesting one. I just had to remortgage on on one of my buy to let's and my broker said to me, Right, what's your, you know, what what what your personal expenditures? And I was like, really? Have I actually got to do this? Have I got to go through like everything should I? Yep. What have you got? What what are your credit cards? What's your car loan? What's this? I was like, oh God. I was like, right, let me go through it all. And you know, once you've done it once, you're kinda like, okay, now I know. And actually when I did it, I went, Oh, okay, that's good to know. Now I actually know the answer to the question. But also it gives you that accountability. You know, we're trying to make forward plans, but we don't if we don't know where we are now, we we don't know what our ground zero is before we move on. But actually, for some people, it can be a real light bulb moment because we no one likes to look at it. And actually going, how much am I spending on Amazon? How much am I spending on subscriptions of magazines that just sit on the coffee table that I don't read? Do you know what? I think I'm gonna cancel that because I now understand. That I'd rather put that into an ICE than put it onto a coffee table. So it's having that kind of information in order to make really sound financial sensible decisions. And keeping an eye on the lifestyle creep. We all do it. You know, you get a you get an increase in income, whether you, you know, your partner is employed and gets a salary increase, or you might get a bonus, or you might be able to take a higher dividend than you were expecting this year. It's really tempting to be like, I'll go and book another holiday, or I will go and upgrade my car. But actually just going, just taking stock for a little moment and thinking, actually, I'm just going to speak to Fliss about that because she might say it might be better to pay my credit card off. Or it may be sensible to look at putting part into an ISA and part into a fun, fun to live and just have a slightly darled down holiday and enjoy a little bit of it like we should, but also plan some for the future. So just bouncing those ideas off somebody to give you a bit more of a, you know, an independent view of it, um, with the emotion taken away. It's really easy if you don't do a regular sweep of what your expenses are to let that lifestyle creep um pick up. And inevitably, you know, we see all this rhetoric coming out. There was an another few, there's another couple of stories that came out this week about how much Somebody in their 30s and 40s are going to need to have a comfortable retirement. And now is the time in your 30s and 40s to be able to make a meaningful dent in that projection. So there was some data that came out, I think, this week, that said the current comfortable requirement retirement income for a single person is about 45,000, but that's today. You impact inflation on 20 years. So in 2046, with the impact of inflation, the equivalent income you're going to need to buy the same basket of things and the same number of holidays and the same upgrading of your car every three years that they're projecting for a single person is going to be£74,000. Now, the state pension currently is offering £12.5. And yes, that too may go up, but there's also now rhetoric the state pension will. We could well be means tested by the time we get there. So some of us might not even get it, or they might move the goalposts again by saying you can't have it to your 70, or it's not going to go up by the triple lock. So we cannot rely on these things that perhaps generations before could reasonably rely on. We have got to paddle our own canoe. And even with auto-enrollment in pensions, um, workplace pensions, we now know that people are still not providing, you know, still not providing enough for their retirement. So there is going to be. This huge gap between what people expect and what people are capable of taking. And the only way we can do that is actually being very um focused on what we can do about it now, not coming to an advisor at 69 and saying, I want to retire at 70, have I got enough? And the answer is sadly no. Um, the easiest way you can make meaningful change is to, is to, to, you know, to grab the thistle, grab the nettle and and um be able to. Work with an advisor to carve out a bit that is credible for your future, but also enjoy your today. Hmm. Do you know I love that and you're so right with what you just said also. I remember the day that I left my job and I became um a business owner and an entrepreneur. One of the things that was really, really prevalent in my mind was this notion of the pension. I think because my mum's always been very much talking to me about her pension, she's really like a stifler for it. I think that I knew that my pension was quite healthy when I was in the travel consultancy. I was putting in the maximum amount that you possibly could. So I was on quite a high commission based salary. And so my first thought was, right, I've got to set this private pension, I've got to get it working, I've got to do the ICEs. But I think a lot for a lot of people, they don't actually, they're not part of this conversation. I guess I was always part of it with my mum when I was growing up. Whereas I think for those who don't talk about money in their household, they don't realise that, hold on a minute, like I actually have to get a pension. Now I'm a business owner, and how does that work? And you know, I I speak to a lot of business owners a lot, and I say to them, Have do you put money aside for your pension? Have you got one? They're like, no, not yet. I really need to do that. That's what they keep saying. I really need to do that. I really should do that. And they're about 37, 38. And I'm like, you really, really should start thinking about this. so I I agree with you, and that's why I love this podcast. I want more conversations to happen where even if somebody listens to this podcast today and goes, actually girls, you're right, I should really, really do that. And it could be as simple as setting up an ICE, you know, it could be the ICEs, it could be um SAS, as we say, it could be um, you know, personal pensions, it could be, it could be any of those. It's just about talking to the right person because everybody is different. So obviously talk to a financial advisor, talk to somebody who knows what they're doing. because I think a lot of people think they can just do this on their own and not pay the fees for the for the advisors, which you can, absolutely, but I'm in a world where I believe that I would rather get the expert advice to save me down the road. Yeah. opposed to thinking that again you don't need to know everything. We come back to that conversation once again. Yeah, I mean it's probably slight and slightly arrogant a phrase, but in our industry, DIY investing is known as destroy it yourself. Because ultimately if you if you if you a little bit of knowledge can be dangerous, can't it? And we we help we stop people from making mistakes as often as we empower them to make good decisions. We actually stop them from bad decisions if they've come to us at the right time. Um, I mean I I helped a client last year who didn't take advice even when she was asked to. And signed waivers to say, I'm the master of my own destiny. I don't want any advice. She took money out of her pension and unwittingly triggered something called the money purchase annual allowance, which means that even though she had a pension shortfall for her retirement, because she took out a penny of income, she the maximum she's allowed to put into her pension every year now is limited to 10,000 pounds a year. Now she runs a million-pound business and she wants to put 60 grand a year in, as she can at the moment. She's now restricted from doing that because she didn't take advice when she took out 10 grand. Because she didn't take the, she didn't heed the advice even of the pension provider to say, you ought to be aware of the tax implications of the way that you've chosen to take this money. You know, and we I helped a client who's now a SaaS client over on the SaaS practice. I stopped her from using her company to buy what was a mixed-use property at the time. And she was planning on living in one part. And then using the rest for her salon. Had she done that and used her limited company to be her main residence, to own her main residence, she'd have triggered something called the annual tax on envelope dwellings, which is basically a double council tax, effectively, to own a property inside a company that is a residential dwelling that's a main residence. So thankfully, we stopped her just at the right moment. We actually split the title and we used her SAS, her pension, her company pension, to buy the commercial part. Meanwhile, she moved and bought the residential part in her own name as she should have done for her main residential property. We saved her thousands of pounds of probably taxes and fines and extra SDLT and all kinds of issues as a result of just asking the question at the right time. And you know, even if it is something that's tax-related, like that, legal-related, you know, it wasn't advice that I could help her with in terms of financial advice. She needed to split titles. But as you say, because I've got that Avengers list of people that are in that right space, she got in front of this the right people, the tax advisors, the lawyers, et cetera, that knew what they were doing just at the right time. So sometimes those calls can bear dividends. Even if it's a case of I can't do anything for you, but I think you should go and speak to someone to set a will up and come back to me in six months when you've told me all these other things are going to be different, then I feel like I've added value even if I can't. you know, take on a client because it's it's not the right time at in in their particular, you know, journey. Yeah, fantastic. So well said, Miss honestly. That's amazing you're able to do that for her as well. I love that story. And these are the things that that and it's okay that we don't know. I think that's what's an important thing to say. I think it's okay if we don't know what we don't know because how can we know everything? And and that's why that is. So I hope that in today's conversation we've inspired everybody together to really think about wealth, really think about setting up the right team. I'm really thinking about what's one thing that I can do today. uh and as you said, sort of like money pots, in order to think, right, I better do that, or need to have a pension, or invest in stocks and shares, or whatever it is, because I'm certainly now dabbling into this. I'm very, very new to this space of investing, if you like, and um as I go, I'm learning and growing and and doing all of that, which is fab. Um Phyllis, I've got one question for you, which is a question that I actually got asked on a podcast. a couple of months ago and it actually sumped me in my tracks because I wasn't quite sure like how to answer the question but I've asked this to to a to a couple of the people that I've got on and I'd actually really love to ask you this question which is what's one question that nobody has ever asked you that you wish that somebody would have asked you? Gosh, that is a difficult question, isn't it? I guess I guess no client is actually outrightly asked, Am I doing the right thing? We we talk about what should be done. But actually saying, I've got it all set up like this. Am I am I doing the right thing? And I tell you where it we touch on it, but it they never outrightly say that. We do a lot of intergenerational transfer between parents and children at the moment for IHT reasons. So clients are saying, Do know what? I've realized because of the cash flow planning that we've done, I can afford to retire on my pension alone. I don't need all these other assets or and I'd rather see my children enjoy it now where they're squeezed at both ends. You know, they're paying their mortgages and student debt, but now they've got young families and their income isn't Growing by the same amount. So I'd rather watch them enjoy it. uh And we touch on it, but they never actually outrightly say, Am I doing the right thing? Because the thing you have to think about with that kind of area of work is you are taking a huge leap of faith and trust that your children are going to respect and use the wealth that you've given them in the way that you expect them to. And sometimes there is a lot of trust around. Or what if my children get divorced? Will I lose some of that in a divorce settlement? Um, is it right to pass wealth on to children? And I think it's an ethical thing as well, depending on how you feel about inheritance as well, which is a very emotional topic, full stop. Um, I don't think anyone has actually said to me from an ethical standpoint, Am I doing the right thing, giving them all this wealth early on in life? And I suppose. It's not really for me to answer it, I suppose. That's more of an ethical thing for them. All we're there to do is to try and make sure that if it if that does happen, that the children's own respect and understanding and knowledge of how to invest it for their legacy is at least imparted on. So a lot of my clients say you can have this money, but you have to use flesh to invest it. So she's got like I've got like a gatekeeping kind of tag on it to some extent. but yeah, I would say that's one that'd never been asked outright, am I doing the right thing, giving them this wealth? Mm, what an interesting question that is. That's so interesting. And I guess I can only think that the reason they haven't asked you is it's such a personal question that that only they can really ask. And I think that there's lots of different opinions on this. Um I tell you something similar that I've always thought to myself, and I've always actually thought this, is when I was younger, I never went to private school. I went to I think it's called public public school, is that like normal school, is that right? Yeah. Comprehensive or yeah. Yeah, just like a normal just a normal school in London. And do you know what? I see these I see these kids now that go to private school and I see a lot of parents now that put their children through private school and things. And I went to a public school and do you know, although that although those seven years of my life when I was in public school from year seven all the way to eleven was some of probably the most harrowing experiences of my life going to that school, it was like two what was it like two and a half thousand girls, all girls school, no boys. I became who I am in that school. Like I was absolutely bullied the crap out of in that school, which I've got a lot of something a lot of subconscious work at the moment. There's actually quite a lot of trauma that got stored as a result of like all that experience. But I often think to myself, my question that I ask myself is, knowing what I went through at school, would I allow my children to go to public school or would I protect them and put them in private school? Now, I'm not saying that children don't get bullied in private school and I'm not saying that that, you know you put cotton wall over them in private school. But it's a really interesting one, what you've just said, which is I always think to myself, even if I had all the money in the world, would I still say to them, you need to go to public school to learn what it's like to be there, you know, to learn and to grow and to become the person that you will become and you'll and you will thank me for it one day. So that's the question that I ask myself is what would I do in terms of if I had children, what s type of schooling would I give to them? And I think that's a that's one that I sit with constantly because a lot of people homeschool, a lot of people do private, a lot of people do public. And I'm sure I'm gonna get a lot of DMs about this of people who've got opinions about all sorts of things, I've got no doubt. But isn't it funny how personal money is to everybody and personal circumstances and things? So I think that was a great answer fliss. I really enjoyed that. you put me on the spot. I had to think about it. yeah, it's really hard, isn't it? Well this is the thing. I I got put on the spot, so I put other people on the spot. And I I said to somebody the other day, I'm gonna go back on the dating scene again and I was thinking to myself, What a good question for like a first date, you know? I was like, I'm gonna ask that on my first date and be like, Right, what have got here? Um so listen, I've loved today's conversation. Thank you so much and I think we've given so much value and I really, really I'm grateful that you came on and as a strong woman talking about financial wealth and planning and as we said finding the right balance I think is key and I think that's what we've really done in today's conversation. So where is the best place for people to connect with you, work with you, what can they do? So we've got a website obviously, Seymour Financial, and um I have an Instagram at at Fliss Wallace Financial that you can find us as well. Um and then our SAS practice is sasbureau.com. Fantastic. And then as always guys, I'm Athena Dobson underscore official, girls and property on Instagram as well. I'm also on LinkedIn and Facebook. And then do not forget to check out the website. We are girls and property dot co dot uk. If you want to look at the community, it's Floyd slash community just on the end. But for thirty pounds a month plus VAT, which writes out thirty-six pounds a month. I mean if I mean I know I'm biased, but it really is a no-brainer when you can have just education at your fingertips from both property, wealth, everything that you need. the community of over 130 women. I said to somebody the other day, I always ask people where they're where they're coming from, as in across the UK when they come in. And you know, people say I'm in Essex, I'm in Reading, I'm in Leeds, I'm in wherever I am, and I'm always able to connect people with people in their area. So it's just a gorgeous community. I love it with all my heart and probably the thing I'm most proud of. So if you need anything, just DM me the word community, come and ask some questions and give it a read over on the website. Fliff, speaking of community and speaking of sessions, Would you be open to coming and doing a talk in our community all around sort of wealth and this conversation? Yeah. Amazing, because the reason I'm asking you is I I love doing the podcast, but actually the women who are actually in the community, I think you would have a great time bouncing off of them. And if we did it live, they'd be able to ask you some really fantastic questions and you'd be able to give them some really fantastic answers. And I think we could make that a really great session. So if you're up for that, I'd love to have you in. absolutely get me in. I'd love to. That's my my my best. I I'm at my best when I'm solving problems. So give me a jigsaw. I will sort it for them. I love it, I love it, fantastic. Um, brilliant. Right, Phyllis, I'd love to leave you with the parting words for the listeners. So what are your parting words today? Um, if there's one thing that maybe I can impart on you all, it's definitely to start uh feeling confident in your numbers and getting financially naked. Once you have those figures to hand, then the world is your oyster. I love that. Right, guys. On that note, let's get financially naked. Let's embrace. Let's see the world as our oyster, as Fis says. And as always, have the most amazing week. Go and get your pension set up. Go and speak to somebody. Go and get yourself educated. It will be one of the most important things for you to do. Have the most amazing week. You know where we are if you need us. Sending you loads of love and well wishes. And I'll speak to you soon. Take care, everyone. Bye for now.