The Token Takeover
Join us on "The Token Takeover", where we dive into the exciting world of web3 gaming and explore the latest trends and developments in this emerging industry. From NFT collectibles to decentralized gaming platforms, we'll break down complex concepts in a simple and fun way, making it easy for anyone to understand and get involved in this rapidly growing ecosystem. So, whether you're a seasoned crypto veteran or a gaming newbie, tune in and discover how blockchain technology is revolutionizing the world of gaming and beyond.
The Token Takeover
#11 - Creating Interoperability Standards for the Metaverse w/Batis Samadian from OMA3
In this episode of the Token Takeover Podcast, I share a conversation with Batis Samadian, Co-Founder of OMA3 a collective building global standards for Web3 metaverses.
OMA3 is working collaboratively with the largest brands in metaverse gaming to establish asset, security, and interoperability standards that will act as the cornerstone of tomorrow's internet.
You can now watch this episode as well as listen! Check out my Youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEk4_UVuQwUxRWblJoOKAJw
Links:
https://twitter.com/oma3dao
https://www.oma3.org/
https://www.oma3.org/#members https://www.linkedin.com/in/batissamadian/details/experience/
Follow us on Twitter - https://twitter.com/GamingStartUp_
Hey, what's up everyone? Uh, this is Ryan No Autopilot. Back again with the Token Takeover Podcast, episode 10. Nice round number. Uh, today we're joined by, uh, Batis Samadian. Did I pronounce that right? I feel like I did it.
Yeah,
Batis Samadian:that's right. Yeah. Yeah. It's Batis. Hi everyone. Great to, great to be here. Thanks so much for inviting me.
NoAutopilot:Heck. Okay, so, uh, baddest is the co-founder and vice chair of Oma three. Did I also get that right? Yes, sir. Boom. And they're aiming to move, uh, from platform centric to user centric, user owned Spatial Information Highway. And I know what you're thinking. You don't know what that means, but we're gonna break it down. We got you. Um, yeah. Okay. So, so Battis, this is the first time you and I have met, uh, we got connected through Paul from Made for Gamers. Shout out to Paul. If you're listening, uh, if you don't mind, like give us a, give us a little bit of your history. Like what have you been up to? How did you get to this point?
Batis Samadian:Um, absolutely. So, uh, that is, I grew up in Zurich, Switzerland. Been working in tech for the last 10 years. Um, always kind of in a product role. Um, and, uh, probably started my crypto journey back in 2013 when I was mining with a couple of mens out of our college dorm in Vancouver. Um, took on a couple of product roles working for iot company in Vancouver. Um, been working for a venture studio in Los Angeles for about. Four years together with a good friend of mine. We had a lot of focuses. Uh, the biggest focus was folk reality, which was my, uh, early, uh, foot in the door. And in 2020, I moved to London, uk, where I currently still reside, uh, where I first worked for Zap as a head of product or product lead, helping, uh, basically, uh, bring that business, uh, get that business going from scratch. Um, and then I started space, uh, in the fall of 2021. And space is a shopping virtual world. And so, um, the, the very interesting story about ALMA three is that when I started space and I had talked with a lot of people in the industry, uh, with my co-founders who all have video game backgrounds, you know, we, we really started to realize that like, hey, um, You know, this, this metaverse thing, or spatial internet, or 3D internet, um, it's, uh, there's a lot of work that's gonna need to go into that from regulation standpoint, from making, protecting user information, making sure that it's privacy first. Um, and even the fundamental infrastructures for bordering between worlds. Um, Mapping all the content and all of that. And so the more I talked about it with more and more people, I realized, okay, um, there's a lot of work to be done and I gotta get all the other virtual world, uh, founders together in a room to really talk about this because it's pretty much the biggest impact to the career we've chosen. Um, and so, uh, first I met Dirk lut, who co-founded this with me. Um, me and him basically, uh, after hanging out a few times, realized that we're both just as passionate about the problem. He's actually even a book about where the Metaverse is heading and navigating towards. And, uh, together with him and, uh, Robbie Young from Anani moca, we pretty much jumpstarted it. Had a couple more people that OG started it with us, like Decentral Land, the Voxels guys, uh, super world, um, and a few more. And we got Alfred Tom. He's, he's led a couple of consortiums to come and help us basically set up, uh, open Metaverse Alliance as a consortium in Switzerland. Uh, so that's a very brief, uh, quick intro about me and my origin and, and, uh, what we've been doing.
NoAutopilot:Yeah, I, I mean, okay, so there's so many roads we can go down on that. Um, I was telling, I was telling Batis. I'm part of the blockchain Game Alliance. Shout out to the blockchain Game Alliance. And they had made a post about OMA three and Batis and his team's work. And I was like, oh, that's cool. You know, metaverse standards. I could see how that would make sense. But then when you click on these things, you're always expecting it to be, you are very aspirational with not much teeth to it, you know, not much actual content. And then when I popped open your website, I mean, you, you mentioned some of the largest brands in, um, in Metaverse play right now. You guys have consortiums that are like focusing on specific issues or, you know, opportunities. Like I, I was really blown away. I was really blown away with what you guys are building.
Batis Samadian:Thank you. Yeah. Um, Yeah. So, uh, I guess if you want, I can respond to that. I think, uh, you know, these standards are incredibly important and really what we strive for is that, um, as web three fundamentalists, we really wanna make sure that as we go into this next iteration of the. Internet in a spatial, uh, shape and form, it's really important that it's owned by the users, um, all their data or their information. And really, if you think about what, what activities you'll be doing as a, as a user, um, ownership is fundamental. Um, and, and the ability to, uh, basically transfer with your backpack of owned goods and items and identity everywhere you go is incredibly important. And so, uh, when we wanted to put this together, we really wanted to avoid a round table of nights or what you would call basically like a infinite discussion pool. And so what we decided to do is, uh, we created working groups from the start where we were like, look, there's a lot of things to tackle. Let's prioritize what matters to us the most, or what are the most important things to further the industry, and let's focus on those first, such as portal, link and mapping. Um, asset transfer. Um, and, and many more things. And so, um, by doing that, we, we essentially focused ourselves around interworld portals, interworld asset transfer, land domain names, uh, and, uh, ensuring creator royalties get paid, um, with N F T Standardizations. Um, so, um, yeah, I'm, I'm super proud of all the members and, and all the help we're getting right now and everyone who's joining us. And if you haven't, Please do. Um, we're on a very big mission and we need as many arms and legs as possible. Heck
NoAutopilot:yeah. And I'll, and I'll have the links to, uh, OMA three, uh, in the description of this podcast. So at the end of this podcast, definitely click on that and check it out. Um, okay. So one thing I think might be helpful, so for folks who maybe aren't as deep in the weeds on some of the challenges slash opportunities, Metaverse, like what is the, what does the future look like from a user perspective, like with these interconnected worlds, like, you know, kind of paint that picture for us a little bit on, on what that could look like through the work of Oma three.
Batis Samadian:So, I mean, I think some of us basically share this identical hypothesis that. The spatial internet is gonna be, um, an aggregate of all virtual world content. Um, and it's gonna be something that you can basically walk between. And, um, comparatively you do that right now on a browser flat. You, you open tabs. The browser you're using has already indexed and mapped all content on the internet or most. And, um, You navigate between them seamlessly. Right. Um, on the other hand, virtual worlds are, uh, somewhat, uh, a newer topic in, in, in the shape and form of spatial internet. Um, and previously only known as kind of like a, a genre of video games. Um, and so starting out by, uh, you know, mapping all of this content all, and what we believe to become basically three dimensional websites, three dimensional apps on land parcels, which are what we believe to be like tomorrow's top level, do domain like a.com. Yeah. Um, that is really the future you should be imagining is that you're, you're, you're basically on a parcel. Experiencing this three dimensional experience, but you can portal from there to anywhere else, um, that is offering that form of an experience or other dynamic environment experiences, and we can get into that as well after.
NoAutopilot:Okay. You're, you're kind of blowing my mind a little bit here. Like just the way that you described this and I, and I've been in, in blockchain for the last few years, like, I'm not new to this, but. Just the concept of having domains be land plots and the ability to have my assets be interoperable between them, you know, as similar as logging into something with Google. Uh, that is, yeah, that is, that is a lot to, to process. That's very exciting. Yeah. Well,
Batis Samadian:it, it's, it definitely is. It's a lot. Um, it's, it's a new kind of consumption, right? Uh, it's a new way of interacting with mediums. It's a new way of consuming mediums. Um, and it's also a, a new kind of like choice of responsibility and privacy to basically be in charge of what. Backpack equipment you travel with, or what identity you travel with between these worlds. Right. Um, and I think it's a, it's, it's, it's basically a, a, a future world that I think will be best for the users. Um, a safer, more protective of their interests. And that's really what we're fighting for. Um, hence all of the like independent elements and working groups that need to, uh, come together to, to solve these very difficult problems. Cuz I'm speaking to you about it, like, as if it's like, you know, easy to understand or at least I'm trying to uh, easy to comprehend. Yeah. In reality, um, these are very complicated topics that require a lot of energy, um, by contributors. Um, To the open metaverse, right? That's, that's how we look at it. We think it has to be an open metaverse, um, and it needs to have all sorts of open economy, uh, incentives for people to help grow it and manage it and secure it. I'm,
NoAutopilot:I'm getting, uh, I'm, I'm drawing a lot of parallels to Ready Player one, which I'm sure you hear all the time. Oh
Batis Samadian:yeah. So I mean, uh, I think, I think the movies actually all prophesies a disastrous tomorrow. Uh, which I think we're, all of us who really care, are trying to avoid such a disastrous, uh, prophecy, uh, you know, across all of them, right? We've got like, uh, some sort of mind manipulation that happens, which is a combination of like, you know, generated. Scenes and infinite game loops by like some master metaverse God. Um, this is definitely the future we're trying to avoid by simply standing for open metaverse,
NoAutopilot:dude. Heck yeah. Okay. Okay. So, um, and I know I'm jumping all over the, the plan document here. I'm just too excited to like, dig into these little, little uh, yeah, for sure. Aspects can focus on whatever you like. So, okay, so there's a lot of different metaverses being built. So how do you build interoperability between those assets? Like if, if I'm in the sandbox and I have like a backpack, but then I go into decentral and it's a completely different tech stack, like mm-hmm. How does it get rendered? How does it. I guess, how do I prove that it's mine going from one project to the other? Like, and again, I'm not like a super tech person, so like basic
Batis Samadian:understanding. So I mean, um, the basics understanding around it is that like fundamentally, uh, it's a problem that will be solved in pieces, right? So right now, um, most worlds allow you to log in with a phantom wallet or a meta mass wallet, or a wallet connect. And, uh, In most cases, um, you are somewhat limited in how you can use those NFTs again, uh, per world, right? So for example, I got airdrop, uh, uh, announced our, uh, tennis ball avatar. Like I'm, I'm like a walking tennis ball. It's kind of cool. Um, and it works in the central land, but it doesn't work yet in other worlds. And that has a lot to do with the fact that basically that asset transfer. Uh, interoperability, um, doesn't really exist yet. Right? And, and what we are trying to do is we're trying to specify the requirements for that infrastructure and work closely with people who are tackling these problems. Um, like Feda, gg like, um, uh, meta Factory that does different rendering qualities. Um, and, and help basically specify this metadata for describing assets as a standard and develop. General guidance suggested best practices, some sort of certification program in hopes that basically, once the first few worlds adopt this standard and solution, um, more worlds will basically follow the same tech and standards and, and, and use the same protocols so that my noun style avatar can walk through all of them. Um, and, and, and then on the backpack side, right? So, so one thing is the avatar, but what happens if my avatar portals through, but it arrives essentially naked. It doesn't have the equipment it had from the previous world. Um, so let's, let's break that down. Um, let's say in, uh, in my platform in space, uh, my tennis ball avatar is wearing sunglasses and a hat. But when I go from there to the decentral and, uh, parcel of, uh, like a casino experience, Suddenly I arrive and all of these assets are missing on my face. Mm-hmm. Right. So th these, this is basically like metadata that needs to be written, um, and rules that continuously get written about. Um, okay. So when I go through here, remember to keep it on, but also here, not to get all too deep, but. It's not that simple, right? Because I could arrive, but this asset doesn't actually work here yet. And so, right. What we will see in the very first versions of this is just that there's an acknowledgement of this protocol and system existing, but it will sometimes say, Hey, not available. Sorry. Come back later if you really want to use this. Sure. And the, the goal is basically to move towards having as many platforms, uh, have it as an available asset because then y you know, you, you truly are in charge of that identity traveling across the world, rather than interacting with companies who all have different rules and sets of rules. Um, Which, um, as you know, right, like we, we, we generally, as end consumers ignore individual company terms and conditions, which is why the Open Metaverse is so fundamentally important is that rather than complying just by visiting, um, you're actually in charge and you get prompted, um, for, for, for, for seeking your data. Um, and I think that's what's fundamentally important about the world of tomorrow. Got it.
NoAutopilot:Okay. Okay. So, so a lot of these metaverse firms are, are likely already attempting to solve some of these issues, but since there aren't standards, it, it's a lot of duplicated work. Um, uh, struggling with interoperability, interoperability with each other as well.
Batis Samadian:It depends, like, some of them definitely play two roles, right? They're, they're trying to solve, uh, fundamental problems while trying to run their business. That they're trying to run. Right. Um, but in reality, like, um, you see it with the consortium, everyone's like incredibly busy focusing on their, their main product that we need this conjoined efforts to, to achieve it. Got it.
NoAutopilot:Okay. And then, um, I know you've touched a couple times on security for the end user. So what, what, um, Potential challenges arise if this future were, I'm moving between Metaverses with a wallet that shows the assets that I own. Like where, where does that security piece?
Batis Samadian:Hmm. Um. Do you mind expanding on your question? Feels like Yeah. Could go in a
NoAutopilot:few ways. Yeah. I'm sorry. Uh, so, so I know you mentioned a couple times how important the security aspect is to what you guys are doing for the end user. Do you mind just elaborating on that a little bit for us?
Batis Samadian:Yeah. Okay. Sure. So ownership, fundamentally, um, what, the way that we look at it is that, um, Screw ownership only exists in the form of these like secured, individual owned wallets or DIDs. Um, and this is the basically the future that we're trying to make sure exists rather than one where you, uh, log in in non web three ways. Um, and what we want to make sure of, and this is kind of like the whole alluding to certification programs, is that. We want to make sure that these platforms that may become, you know, your tomorrow most consumed, uh, site page application, um, follow these certification programs that, that basically, um, from, from, from a, uh, open first principle, comply. Comply. That's kind of the whole purpose of why we exist, is to make sure that, um, certification programs exist, that that force, um, In a way, force basically virtual worlds to comply to a open first approach, um, where, um, all assets, all identity, all information of a user is owned by the user rather than the company. Got it. Um, so it's very fundamental to Web three belief, uh, and we just want to make sure that once it's, uh, no longer like transaction based, but also just like identities roaming around literally virtual worlds, uh, the same fundamental staying place and don't disappear. Got it. Got
NoAutopilot:it. Okay. Um, so I, I spend most of my time kind of working in like the. Web three gaming side of things. Um. Mm-hmm. And I know like the, the thought process of having interoperability there is brought up quite a bit where at some point this gun you could take into other games. And, um, does your team kind of see that as like a potential area focused down the road as well? Like the, it's a,
Batis Samadian:yeah. It's definitely a cross collaboration point, uh, which is why we work with the B G A. Um, so just to go down that, that route with you, right? Um, just, just think about XP leveling, right? Um, like conceptually, these are things that, like across games, across different role playing games, um, all of that, um, there, there's a reason why you level up to achieve something, to have access to something. Um, but this could be actually gamified in, in more interesting ways where, um, you know, the leveling you've achieved in. Your identity or as for your avatar is something that universally, um, is valuable to you? Um, basically the same way, or not the same way, but. A freestyle example would be like, as if, like, your miles program just keeps being valuable to you outside of that one airline, you know? Right. Um, and so like, uh, I love the, the, the weapon leveling up example or the XP leveling example that, uh, allows you to go to more areas, do more things, have access to closed areas that you need to have leveled up to two. Have access to. Um, I think that's definitely along the, the, the, the lines of how we're thinking about it, both in a, uh, game experience format as well as in other social or shopping or other kind of content, uh, perspectives. Um, also I think like one of the, the, the funnest, uh, things that, that, that is applicable to the PGA vision is, um, You know, we all grow, grew up with these, uh, these, uh, these video games where, um, uh, like a battle video game would combine brands of different entities into one like Marvel meets the Pokemon Universe, right? And you could have them like fight out. Um, but in this kind of a world that we're envisioning, you don't need ea games to make that. Um, you essentially go in with your n style and fight against. Is bored, ape, uh, wherever you want. Right? And, and that's just really cool and inspiring. And it changes the whole, like, reason why you play has a lot more to do of like you developing with the character you care about. Um, rather than just consuming dude. Okay.
NoAutopilot:You're like kind of, it's, it's five 30 in the morning and you're kind of blowing my mind a little bit, man. Um, okay. So, As part of your consortium, as part of, uh, the project, are you in discussion with IP brands? Like, like I imagine, let's say Pokemon for example, loves the concept of the Metaverse, but there's definitely things they don't want Pikachu doing, right? They don't want Pikachu gambling at the blackjack table. Uh, if they can prevent it, like are they part of the conversation as well, or
Batis Samadian:some, some are, some are yet to be convinced. Um, that's kind of the short of it. Um, some people are very open to it. Some others need more time, need other conviction to happen. Um, so I'm, I'm gonna have to leave it as at that vague level. There's a lot of conversations going on. Gotcha,
NoAutopilot:gotcha. Okay. Um, all right, so for, for people who are listening up to this point and they're like, okay. What the hell? I want to help in some capacity for this. Where, where should we direct them? Like where do they go? What
Batis Samadian:do they do? Uh, okay, so come to the alma three.org website and there's a button that says Join us in the top right. And. And then just fill out the form and you can DM me, you can DM the ALMA three Twitter account. So that's at that samad or at Alma three. Um, we really would love to hear from all of you and get you guys to join, um, and, and help us achieve what we're trying to achieve. Sorry, it was at ALMA three Dow, by the way. Um, Please do. Uh, we really need as much help as we can, and realistically, like all the working groups need additional arms and legs so that we can keep moving forward to achieve our vision. Are there,
NoAutopilot:are there certain areas of expertise that you're, um, really looking for for this consortium? Like something
Batis Samadian:more than others. So the best way to think. Yeah, sure. So the best way to think about it is that you can join as a board member, um, with your company. You can join as a member, uh, in which case we want you to be a contributor, uh, to a working group. Um, and, uh, within those working groups, essentially what we're really seeking for is essentially technical people who understand the landscape of the conversations right Within asset transfer, within portal link and mapping. And then sometimes, like we've done now with the portal and mapping, uh, portal, link and mapping group, there's actually a subgroup. And the subgroup, um, kind of can naturally spiral out of the initial. Working group. And for example, what this subgroup does is, um, it's actually come to the conclusion that, hey, there is actually some experimental tech that I've built that I'd like to, um, basically, uh, open up to the ALMA three. Um, and why don't we sit together and basically try and, um, act together a prototype that could actually help bring that vision to life. Um, and then trial it and trial it and test it and go to the world and open it up and let people basically agree on the proposed, uh, solutions, um, and try and move forward that way. It, it
NoAutopilot:sounds like, it sounds like one of the most web three things I've heard, you know, a bunch of people. It's
Batis Samadian:one of the coolest things. Yeah, for sure.
NoAutopilot:Okay. Okay. Um, all right, so if you've listed up to this point and you're like, I'm done with the podcast, I just wanna sign up and I'll put that link down in the show notes, feel free to follow it through. Um, okay. So a couple more questions and then I'll let you get back to your day here. But, so I, I'm assuming this is gonna be chained agnostic then in essence.
Batis Samadian:That is definitely the goal. Absolutely. Uh, I mean, you probably cover this all the time in your podcast. Things like interoperability are just like not so easily said and done. Yeah. Um, there's just so many factors that come into this. Um, and some people even talk about like the, the omni chain approach. Right. Um, but that is definitely the goal. Yeah.
NoAutopilot:Yeah, that Omnia chain approach has been interesting. I, I guess, um, in a future where everything is interconnected, I wonder if that would create a scenario where there's like duplicates in essence of assets, right? Like, if I meant an NFT on one L one, and I'm in an FT that's identical in another L one, but at some point they're married together, what's the value? If I have two of the same thing.
Batis Samadian:So, do you wanna quickly go into this for like two minutes? Cuz I have like some opinions on this. I'll roll, let's go. I, I, I would really love to also like, pick your brain on this. So from my perspective, what I, what I like about the approach is that essentially it's, it's dumbed down comparable to, you know, I, I buy one thing and I have all these additional formats to downloaded it. It introduces an ease of use and like, basically like a, a, a stress-free approach to owning many assets between chains. Uh, it introduces complications that are fundamental rather than, uh, practical. Right. Um, where do you stand on that and do you actually believe in the, the omni chain approach or do you think that the complicated, um, or, or that the more technically safe route needs to be taken? Um hmm. Yeah, we can park if, if it's for another podcast, but I just need to know. No,
NoAutopilot:no, we're good. I, I guess like, so with the knowledge I have, I think the security is, is paramount. Um, because, um, if I've. If I participate in a metaverse for five years of my life and I have assets that I've created or leveled up or earned from special events, like the last thing I would want is to have an opportunity for, for risk of those in moving between worlds. But in saying that, like if I jump into like the time machine and go 10 years in the future, and everything is a metaverse, And really it's just, it's as simple as like downloading a PDF from my email or directly from your website. Like I could see the value in that as well, especially for like adoption and non great, non crypto native users. Um, you know, being onboarded more seamlessly probably with that approach. Mm-hmm. Hopefully that made sense.
Batis Samadian:Yeah. Yeah. No, uh, great. Yeah. Okay.
NoAutopilot:Um, all right, so I think we talked about the working groups a little bit. So with, with your team right now, the biggest focus is just getting more bodies in that have expertise in this area that are willing to contribute. Like that's the main focus, correct.
Batis Samadian:Yeah, sure. So, um, the main focus is essentially the, the, the, the working groups that you see right now in my specific team. I'm leading the, uh, in interworld portals slash portal link mapping, working group. Uh, so that's basically my, I'm leading the responsibility to make sure that we make progress there within the first year and basically achieve our milestones of effectiveness, releasing a paper which we have, uh, gathering more feedback, working towards a prototype. Uh, hopefully, uh, finding a lot of alignment around that prototype and the standards we've been trying to set. Um, that's basically our mission for the first year. Got it. And of course, growing, uh, the, the general, uh, you know, base of members
NoAutopilot:and, and how has. When you've approached projects that are kind of building in this metaverse space, how has the, their reactions been to the forming of standards?
Batis Samadian:Generally positive. If they understand, uh, what the mission is, uh, and, and why, why we're doing this. Um, it's, it's, it's practically something that everyone fundamentally is with. Um, especially because building these worlds is, is very complex and you know, you have to build these communities, you have to find incentives for communities and, and it, it just seems to naturally align for, for people who really do understand the whole format of open. Um, so I would say relatively easy from that perspective. Dude, that, that's
NoAutopilot:amazing. That's how you want it to be. Like. You make, you make a phone call and they're happy you called them. That's great. Yeah. Um, okay. So I always, uh, I typically have kind of web three startups on here, so I always like to give this question, um, in case it can help you get some exposure. Are you fundraising and or hiring for any roles right now?
Batis Samadian:Uh, we are not doing either at this moment, forma three, um, and at space, um, we are about to do a fundraising round. Um, so yeah. Okay.
NoAutopilot:Uh, are you okay if I throw your, uh, Twitter or LinkedIn into the show notes as well?
Batis Samadian:Is that fine? Yeah, please of, of course. Absolutely.
NoAutopilot:Cool. Uh, VCs, if you're listening, come on, get on board. What are you doing? Um, all right, so looking forward to the future. So next, uh, two, three years, let's assume everything goes ACEs for Oma three, you know, what are you most excited about in that, in that reality?
Batis Samadian:I mean, wow, look like if we actually achieve our mission, it'll be like a huge fundamental win for humanity. Like, I don't mean to exaggerate, but it really is. Think about it. The, the future of the spatial internet is basically in the hands of the users. They're in charge of their assets. It's privacy first thinking, and they're all following basically these certification expectations. Um, that would be basically the huge win and making sure that all virtual worlds follow this CER certification program, uh, and that we've pioneered in a lot of the technology that we are working on within the, that would really be the, the ultimate dream of what our vision is. Man,
NoAutopilot:again, I, I know we talked about it, but I'm getting like, ready player one vibes and like you're like that the good guy, the good founder, right? Who at the end kind of turns over the metaverse to the people. I mean, maybe it was a prophecy. Who knows?
Batis Samadian:Maybe there's a prophecy. Yeah.
NoAutopilot:Um, okay, cool. Uh, last two questions for you. So those that are building in web three right now, you have a ton of startup experience. I guess we kind of glossed over that, but it has a ton of startup experience. Um, what advice do you have for founders who are trying to build right now? Like what's your one piece of advice for, for being a startup founder?
Batis Samadian:You know, so many, um, probably the most important thing is like, don't think your ideas are that great. Go and talk to users about them and don't underestimate that. Um, talking with your users and having your ear glued to the floors, probably the number one thing that can help you solve a lot of otherwise hard lessons, hard skills. Bad luck, et cetera. It's like, I would say it's definitely the, the major key
NoAutopilot:gold that is a golden piece of advice. Okay. Uh, and then last question for you, Bartis. So, uh, where do you go, excuse me, badis, where do you go to get quality information about Web three gaming? Like where do you consume podcasts, medium articles, particular Twitter accounts that you think are interesting?
Batis Samadian:Um, probably mainly Twitter. There's this community manager of, um, Mozilla hubs, Matt. Cool. Um, there's Danked VR on Twitter as well. Um, quite a lot of accounts. Um, I do medium, but basically to, to just learn about what the other consortiums are up to. Um, I. Let's see, what else? And then mostly like just, uh, I, I call up my friends with, with urgent questions, like quite a few friends working in web three gaming, and we, we meet up for drinks or we run into each other at a conference and turn it into a lunch where we basically yeah. Convince each other of what's what, what tomorrow will look like. Man, that's
NoAutopilot:awesome. Yeah, that, that was one of
Batis Samadian:the, I can send you a list of a bunch of people who are following. Uh, I follow them as well, so feel free to follow them through me. Yeah,
NoAutopilot:that'd be great, man. Thank you. Yeah, that was, that was kind of the, the origin story of the podcast. Um, definitely not technical. Um, I've attempted to code, it's been a little rough, I'm gonna be honest with you, but I, I still want to stay educated and in the loop on like the real builders behind. Our future and, you know, being able to talk with people like you is really, really rewarding. But thank you for being honest. I'm also
Batis Samadian:a poor coder, to be honest. A better at hardware building.
NoAutopilot:Oh man. People keep telling me that I need to drop, I need to drop the stigma of not being a, uh, a coder. Yeah. One day.
Batis Samadian:Next weekend.
NoAutopilot:Next weekend. Um, all right, well, uh, bad has been awesome, everyone again.
Batis Samadian:It's been great. Check. Thank you so much. Check, check
NoAutopilot:out OMA three. Uh, we're really doing some amazing stuff over there and yeah, we'll definitely be keeping an eye on you and maybe we'll have you back on the pod in a little bit and, uh, see how you guys are doing. Amazing.
Batis Samadian:Great. Thanks so much for your time. Cool.
NoAutopilot:All right everyone. Peace.
