Do Whatever It Takes | Will Pattat

What does it actually take to go after the life you want?

In this episode of Creatively Connected, Chris Rippy sits down with Will Pattat for a conversation about taking leaps of faith, chasing success, and being willing to do what it takes to reach your goals.

They talk about betting on yourself before the outcome is guaranteed, making difficult decisions in pursuit of something bigger, and why playing it safe can sometimes be the biggest risk of all.

Will shares his perspective on ambition, sacrifice, discipline, and the mindset required to keep moving when there is no proof that everything is going to work out.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Take a very honest look in the mirror and ask if you're willing to climb this mountain your whole life and possibly die on the side of it. You can't pay somebody enough money to stop being who they are. How far are you really willing to go to get what you want? Life is what you make it. You're probably just being a little bitch about it.

SPEAKER_02 0:23

Hey, welcome back to the Creatively Connected Podcast. I'm your host, Chris Rippy. Today's guest is needs no introduction. My friend, my um creative partner, ladies and gentlemen, Will Pettit. Brother, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 0:38

Oh man, I'm blessed, brother. Thanks for having me here, Rippy.

SPEAKER_02 0:41

I put out a thread, uh thread post last week, and it was like Nashville Creatives, who wants to record a podcast this week? And I looked through the likes, and this man had liked it. And me and Will go way back. We've known each other for what, probably five, four or five years now, maybe pushing six.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

Yeah, it's gotta be following some change. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:01

Yeah, the the music industry uh it it brought us together. Uh I'll never forget. Do you remember the first time that we met? You remember where it was?

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Wasn't it in a hotel room in Martin, Tennessee? I think I like walked in with McDonald's.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

It was that night, but I but I met you a little bit before. It was at that sh the show there at that little Yeah, the sliding rod, the original location. Yeah, yeah, sliding rod. You walked through and I was like, I don't know. You you you just uh you stood out from the start. You were like uh and I mean this in the the absolute best way possible, but you were like a a a cartoon character to me. Just how you walked in, and I was like, I like this guy. I appreciate it. And uh now, fast forward five, six years later, I don't know what to figure that out. Fast forward to now we're sitting here doing a podcast, and I'm I'm stoked for this, bro. Um so yeah, tell the people a little bit about you and uh what it is you do.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

So I am a songwriter. I also have dabbled in producing records, you know, XYZ like everybody else, but uh I came up mainly being a vocalist uh in church, which then led into secular music, played rock and roll for years, made a living doing that. And then uh eventually, like most other things, everything leads to Nashville because if you have to pay a mortgage, um, and it also helps that somewhere along the way I fell in love with songs instead of music. So, you know, I figured this would be a good mountain to climb, and you know, halfway through the 10-year dredge, here we are.

SPEAKER_02 2:37

Love it. Will if every creative listening could only remember one lesson from your career so far, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 2:45

Don't give up. There is no linear timeline to whatever you choose success is for you. Um, it can come fast, it can take forever. Chances are if you look at the inside of a decade, both of those boxes will be checked at some point. Maybe it'll start off strong, maybe then you'll have a really, really low point. Sometimes maybe you'll be going for a decade before things happen, then everything just goes crazy. But regardless of any of those dudes' stories in any of their respected fields, it's because they just kept showing up. And so, you know, there's always going to be reasons why you could probably justify not writing a song or editing a video or whatever your job may be today, but somebody else will. And as long as that person doesn't give up, they've got a day at the office ahead of you. So if you're really doing this, if you know that you're a lifer because you know it's gonna take twice the work with half the pay, then keep showing up and run towards the things that you feel like are gonna be painful because guess what, that's where the growth is. And an honorable mention I'd say is make sure to draw a fine line between where friendship lives and where business can healthily exist. That goes for anybody who is a collaborative creative in any field because at the end of the day that can skew the lines of what everybody's trying to accomplish, which is to build something that they love and can sustain, but at the same time doing it with their friends and not feeling like you have to go to work every day.

SPEAKER_02 4:40

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

So yeah, just don't give up.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

If you can if you can make work feel like you're uh not working, you know, that's how you know you're you're doing what it is you're called to do. Yeah, I don't feel like I've worked a day in my life since like 2018. It's a uh and I like to say I don't have a real job too. You can you can find those uh shirts in the linked in the description of this if you want to. It's our new uh new merch, you guys. But yeah, I feel like I I literally truthfully don't feel like I've worked a job since 2018. That was like the last time, you know, when I was back in college, and that was still a part-time job. So it was just um, but you mentioned don't give up, and clearly you haven't never gave up. You're very you've carved out your own path in the music industry, very successful, um, and have done many of things. I appreciate that. Absolutely. I try. But at any point throughout your journey, was there a uh a point where you were about to give up and clearly you didn't? So if there was a point in time, what was it and what did you do maybe mentally to to get through those moments?

SPEAKER_01 5:47

So the time that I was probably farthest away from being a creative was in my late twenties, I was uh I'm an old guy, I just turned 38. But in my late twenties, I was working a corporate gig. I'd been doing it for about a year, making good money, enjoying being a normal person for a little while, and then find out that I'm gonna become a father. And so during that time I had to do a lot of checks and balances on what I f really felt called to do the next 20 years, other than try my best not to screw up that up.

unknown 6:26

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Sure. But I just knew that from what I had seen that year inside the Matrix, so to speak, for the first time the first time since 2004, that there was no way I was gonna be able to raise a happy, healthy kid if I wasn't happy or healthy. And you know, I just knew that you can't pay somebody enough money to stop being who they are. You can repress it, but eventually they're just gonna end up representing you. That's right, man. That's right, because it's unnatural.

SPEAKER_02 6:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:56

So if you're lucky enough to actually know what you're supposed to do, even whenever it seems scary, sometimes you just gotta do it. So that's what it was. I uh quit that gig, uh, put together a new band, started touring, started doing this, that, and the other, which eventually led me around COVID to moving into creative. And uh I've been driving back and forth two hours one way, four hours round trip since 2021, a lot of times three to five days a week. And so anytime I hear somebody talk about the reason this or the reason that, life does happen, and there's always gonna be things that we cannot avoid. But ask yourself, how far are you really willing to go to get what you want?

SPEAKER_02 7:44

Yeah, because a lot of people with that, they they would look at that two-hour drive three to five times a week, and I'm a uh an eyewitness, I've seen it for for years, you doing that. Um, and and a lot of people would look at that, and that would be the reason they don't go after their dreams. They they couldn't handle that, and you balancing of starting a family and have having babies and a wife, and and on top of that far drive, like that. Um I think that's a huge you know reason why it's all coming to you now, and you're and you're receiving the gifts uh of your work and your labor is because you were willing to put in that work. Like people want things to come to them, but are you willing to go the extra mile, jump through through hoops like you're doing, making that long trip, just to even have the opportunity at success. It doesn't even mean that success is guaranteed. It just means that there's a you're giving yourself a chance. And I feel like if you do that enough times, and I know you've done it time and time again over the years, that you put yourself in the rooms, you give yourself enough chances, it's gonna happen eventually.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Well, and you said it the the that doesn't guarantee any particular result, like it's just the cost of your pursuit. Yeah, you know, we we have the right of pursuit of happiness. Happiness a lot of times can end up just being a choice to be a state of mind. Um but I will say I don't feel like I'm special because I've done what I've had to do. I know a guy who just recently got a number one um shout out to Peter Daniel Newman. And this guy was coming back and forth from British Columbia. Wow. And you know, at the end of the day, how far are you willing to go to get what you want? Yeah. And past that, the best I can tell about this town, Nashville specific, is you will end up being a common denominator and a derivative of how you treat other people.

SPEAKER_02 9:41

Yeah, absolutely. It's a uh it's it's a big town, but it's a small town, you know. And one in the town, no matter how big the town is, that that's just uh a good rule for life in general. You you put good out, you do good and treat people right, good will find its way back to you, you know, and not even just so it finds its way back, it's the you know, morally it's the correct thing to do, but then in return it will find its way back to you as well.

SPEAKER_01 10:10

It's kind of like the way that the stereotypical grandpa from the greatest generation, you know. He always had these character traits about him. And you could tell that none of them were super intentional, it's just the way that they were raised. It's from the the time that they were from, they were taught to be impeccable with their word. And if you even attempt to do little things like that and be self-aware enough to try to watch how you actually treat people, then chances are people are gonna remember that because it cuts through. A lot of people don't think that way these days. Um, just like in business, you know, how do you learn to swim among sharks but still keep a different diet? And I'm not gonna act like I know the answer, but so far the best I've come up with is just work twice as hard and worry about the rest later.

SPEAKER_03 11:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:04

Yeah, that that's a that's the the simplest way to put it.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

You know, there's always gonna be sharks in the water anywhere you go. Um, and that doesn't mean that they're even bad by nature, but people are primitively what they are. So there is a way to learn to hold court with sharks, but not eat like one. And at the end of the day, isn't that what all of this is? It's sociopolitics. Um, how do we find ways to be useful enough to other people for them to value what we do for them? You know, and that's a little bit different view than say, per se, an artist or somebody who's using themselves as a brand or flagship XYZ. Whenever you're providing creative services, it's trying to find little nuances that seem authentic to somebody. And you know, uh there's no right way to do it. You just have to invest the time and hope you bet on the right horse, right?

SPEAKER_02 12:03

Yeah, absolutely. And talking about success and you know, like working at it and putting yourself in the room. I know you and I kind of see eye to eye on this just c from previous conversations over the years, but what role uh do you think detachment plays in in reaching success and getting what you want? Detachment as in being able to work for something and have a goal, but not let it completely become your whole life or drive you crazy per se.

SPEAKER_01 12:41

If I knew the answer to that, we'd be on my podcast right now. But the best I've come up with is that you have to be honest with yourself about where you're at, how you're feeling, and how much gas you actually have in the tank. Because I'd like to think that most people in the creative realm, we all run off of the same fuel, which is mental capacity. And depending on how hard our focus has to be on certain things for various reasons, there's only so much gas in the tank per day. So understanding whenever you reach a point to where even if you keep working, you are undoing good work, and that can be really hard.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

Can be for sure. At what point did you know that like you just weren't built for a normal path and you you were gonna chase something that's kind of outside of the norm?

SPEAKER_01 13:32

Oh man, let me think. If I'm being honest and accurate. Burf says burf. I mean, you know, shit do be innate sometimes. But uh I'd say as far as not really having a doubt or an interest in anything else, I'd say around the time that I was twelve or thirteen. Really? So pretty young. Music was already a big part of my life, but um for different reasons. I grew up in church and uh music ministry is a good chunk of my musical foundation. But um when I saw what it could do for people emotionally, especially through lyric and melody, like it's different. Instead of it being just trying to make something beautiful beautiful, you're searching for sounds that just might save somebody. And as corny as that can sound, once you've lived through it and felt it if you have the natural abilities to do those things, you m you're probably gonna end up called to it. In fact, I know a lot of people who didn't have natural abilities who felt called to it who are now on top of the world. You know, um w what doesn't cut through whenever you have nothing but time and a groundstone.

SPEAKER_02 14:52

Amen to that. Amen to that. I always find it interesting. Like, I don't know, for me, I didn't find my passion for for storytelling and video and photo until I was like 19 years old. I mean, it was it was there in ways that I didn't know that it was just developing, like I always had an eye for stuff, but I always find it interesting talking to people who are musically inclined, you know, artists, writers, producers, everything. Like, when did you discover that passion? Obviously, you said around 12 or 13. Um, and I just I don't know, I always think like, dang, I I wonder where I'd be right now if I found found my passion. And not that I didn't have passions then, like I was all into sports and stuff at the time, so I was just dedicated but into a completely different field and different whole whole different thing. And then once I found a camera and picked that up and started getting, you know, into the creative realm, it was like it felt like it was always there, but it it just took me until 19. So it's cool to hear stories of people finding it at 12 and stuff, you know. It's uh interesting.

SPEAKER_01 15:57

I started singing publicly around four, right? And I knew that I enjoyed it. My family did things like that. Singing at four, dude. I was absolutely shameless. I was the epitome of a ham. I could see that like walking up bow tie and everything, shaking your hand, hi, I'm willpad. What'd you bring for the pot? Look, oh yeah, that sounds dope. All right, later, Jimmy. You know, like just you know, um, didn't know a stranger. And it wasn't until I was like around that 12, 13 years old age that I really started to think it could be feasible for me to do this. And honestly, it's not just because I was called to it, it's because I didn't feel called to anything else.

SPEAKER_03 16:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:40

Um nothing else seemed interesting in the the terms of like at least theoretically, with music when you're that age, it's still a very, very deep swimming pool. You're nowhere near to understanding certain types of theory or blah blah blah blah blah that you think matter. Plot twist. It doesn't. Um, and it really doesn't. It doesn't. And eventually you learn that there's no money past the fifth fret, and no matter what, try to tell the truth.

SPEAKER_02 17:12

Always tell the truth.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

Yeah, with an internal rhyme if possible.

SPEAKER_02 17:17

What advice would you give to a an aspiring creative who is, you know, maybe they're feeling called to pursue a certain route, whether it's you know, video, photo, or music or you know, anything outside of the normal realm, but the people around them are kind of pulling them in the opposite direction, what advice would you give to those people that are kind of in the in-between right now and figuring it out?

SPEAKER_01 17:43

Oh, this can be a very multifaceted question. It can seem cynical. But um, in today's climate, I would say if you feel drawn to it, but you seem to have other avenues, or you seem to have other strengths, or you seem to have anything else in life that's going for you, take a very honest look in the mirror and ask if you're willing to climb this mountain your whole life and possibly die on the side of it if you don't figure out what your success looks like and get there. And then ask yourself, would you rather do any of those other options than die on the side of that mountain trying to get to what you want? And if the answer is yes, run towards that thing. But if no, and you're being honest with yourself, and you're just crazy enough to think you can do it, and just cocky enough to know that you can do it, don't give up.

SPEAKER_02 18:42

I wish I was a listener or a viewer if they're watching on YouTube right now, because I feel like they're just on the edge of their seats. You're you're a natural born storyteller, Will. Always have been, ever since I've met you.

SPEAKER_01 18:57

Uh I've been gifted with being able to say words in ways that make people nod, and I'm just like, oh fuck yeah, this is working. I'm gonna keep going. Somebody pour me a drink, it'll get better.

SPEAKER_02 19:08

Yeah, that that it could increase and uh intensify it a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

I go from being a professional to like a redneck, bald-headed version of Burt Kreischer. Nobody needs that, at least not this season. Let me make my money and I'll just start showing up randomly at open mic nights, but instead of doing us cover song or whatever the hell, I'll just start doing stand-up. I got five hot minutes ready to rock.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

What's your uh what's your first um joke if you if you're on a stand-up stage?

SPEAKER_01 19:42

It depends on the room, but I don't know how young our listeners get to the show. So like, you know. Yeah, yeah. Um I'll I'll go pretty tame with like, you guys know what sucks? What you lose 50 pounds, you're still fucking fat. Yeah, you're just sitting there like, yeah, dude, I shed 50 pounds, but this 2x is still snug.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

I think that that that's a good good first drop. That's a good first drop.

SPEAKER_01 20:18

We can add an edit over the F bomb.

SPEAKER_02 20:21

I could see you doing doing a little comedy. Go out there in the shades. Yeah. People don't understand. I sleep in these. No, it's it's a lifestyle, it's a choice. It's a look. Given it is sunny outside and we do have a bright light in front of us. I kind of wish I had some shades.

SPEAKER_01 20:38

Yeah, shades help me um not have adverse effects to my medicine. Fair, fair.

SPEAKER_02 20:45

Um talk a little bit about some of the songs that you've you know been a part of and gotten to write on, and I know there's a lot of big ones that are out there, and you you know, you kind of have a diverse portfolio. So just talk a little bit about those and the success of some of those songs.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

So I was um lucky enough to start writing and get to do a lot of work with a buddy of both of ours, Chase Matthew, and we spent a lot of time together for a few years, and I was really lucky that a lot of the songs that we ended up writing um ended up being part of his story. So I've got a pretty good existing catalog with him. Um I've also touched on stuff with the rest of the Ignition Nashville catalog, uh, handful of other people here in town. Um and realistically, I'd say that it's just kind of flattering that I was able to serve somebody actually telling a story that was real to them that other people resonated with. Because watching that happen in real time is surreal. Watching something Go from an Airbnb to a stadium in a month and a half is pretty crazy. Surreal. Yeah, absolutely. And you know, if anything, it taught me not to take things for granted because just like that, a new season can change. And so, you know, don't give up.

SPEAKER_02 22:23

Talk about riding the waves of seasons, you know, just in life in general, like, you know, I've ex we've all experienced it where things will be going really good for a little bit, and you'll be, you know, very booked out and busy and and life will be great and groovy, and then, you know, the next month it'll be a down season and it might be really slow. Talk about how you've managed to ride that wave and and kind of just adapt to that.

SPEAKER_01 22:54

So I won't say that I'm perfect in that way. We're all creatives, and one thing about a creative is that they're always a couple bad decisions away from a crash hour. Right. But no, over time, um, whenever a season is down, advice that I would give to my younger self in a down season would be say less than necessary, and instead of looking at things with a perspective of you in first person, just search for the lesson. Something in the equation right now isn't working. And regardless of what it is, all that matters is that you become aware of it. So until you start looking a little bit deeper at what you might be able to change, you're probably not going to start to make a rise out of that valley because you're not doing anything different. Contrary action can make or break you, right? But knowing when to put contrary action in might just make your fucking dreams work. I took a little bit of contrary action in 2021, and it's the reason that I'm still here talking in 2026. Um, you know, I probably got off topic of that question, but uh it happens.

SPEAKER_02 24:14

It's the name of the game.

SPEAKER_01 24:15

Um, what was the recap on the question again?

SPEAKER_02 24:18

I don't even remember where we were at to be honest. I was just so drawn in to listen to what your answer was. I don't I forget what I asked. Um I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 24:28

That's all right. We'll work it out in the edit and we will smooth quickly keep it.

SPEAKER_02 24:32

We'll keep it. It's the the raw, authentic. All right, this is us.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

I promise I was going somewhere with that. Long story short, don't be a butthole to people, especially whenever you feel like you're down. Because everybody has emotions, everybody has to navigate them, and the best thing you can do is try to find a little bit of humility and really attach to it because that's the only way that you get to have another season. Don't go burning bridges just because you're mad you can't get across the one you want right now.

SPEAKER_02 25:07

Clip that. Um, definitely clip that. Uh yeah, I I got lost track of the question because of uh I was already thinking about the next question and thinking about what's your answer. There could be lots of possibilities, but what's one belief that you have that most people would think is crazy? Oh man. Brace yourselves.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

Life is what you make it. You're probably just being a little bitch about it. If you don't like what it's be if you don't like what it is, then why aren't you making it something else? Everybody's got hurdles, but life is what you make it. So if you don't like what it is, get off your ass and do something about it.

SPEAKER_02 25:51

You heard that? You definitely heard that. We were talking a little bit before uh we got rolling, um, and you'd mentioned you'd mentioned a book, uh, I think it was like 48 Laws of Power. Is that what is that the one you mentioned? Uh and I know we've had lots of conversations in the past about books. Talk a little bit about how reading and you know just expanding one's mind can can benefit them, not only in life, but you know, as a creative, and just just uh how can reading be really beneficial to to a young creative or any type of creative, but someone who who maybe doesn't read right now and and that is thinking about getting into it.

SPEAKER_01 26:34

The answer to the thing that you're scared to run towards isn't necessarily in front of a crowd or somewhere that's going to be painful and an experience the way you think it is. A lot of times it's sitting in a book somewhere that you don't know the name of that might just change your life. So guess what? If you get through a few pages and you don't like it, you can always stop reading it. But as a rule, flip through a few pages. Um you mentioned the 48 Laws of Power. Um that is a very deep swimming pool in itself of a subject, but um essentially it's this guy named Robert Green who mixed a little bit of history mixed with some, you know, anthropology to basically form 48 laws of how he thinks that power dynamics work in ancient to modern civilization. And things like that, you know, I'm not gonna say that's day one read stuff, but the truth is, is a lot of people that I've talked to who tried to read that book said, yeah, man, I just kind of thought it was messed up in general. And from a moral perspective, I understand what they're saying. Unfortunately, whenever you start talking about books like The Art of War, Meditations of Marcus Aurelius, it isn't about morality, it's about the truth. And sometimes the truth isn't pretty, but look at it this way: if you can't change the way the world works, educating yourself on the way that sometimes people can move will help you navigate people that A may be to your detriment, or B, that you might be able to help make something bigger than yourself. It's about being double able to identify these things. And if there's something in life that you're trying to figure out, the only thing to be scared of is not figuring it out. And the truth is out there. If you don't like to read, do like me. I don't have time to sit and hold books. I use Audible, I rock podcasts like my boy here. He puts out a banger, y'all check out this episode type shit. Um but like just grow because the only ceiling over you is the one that you put on yourself in here, you know. And if you don't start thinking for yourself, then you don't really have any control over what happens next, do you?

SPEAKER_02 28:58

The only ceiling over you is the one you put over yourself.

SPEAKER_01 29:03

Facts.

SPEAKER_02 29:04

I'm I'm threading that after this podcast, and it's going viral. I love it.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

We need to just start sending stuff to Hallmark.

SPEAKER_02 29:12

I love that. I love that. So you're you're clearly into you know, you're very intellectual, you're into self-improvement and development. So self-awareness. Self-awareness, yeah, that might be a better way to put it.

SPEAKER_01 29:27

All of that stuff is important, but without self-awareness, it's just food for thought because you're not applying it to the thing that might sting a little bit, which is you.

SPEAKER_02 29:37

True. So it's what version of yourself did you have to let die to become who you are today?

SPEAKER_00 29:46

Oh man.

SPEAKER_01 29:47

Um I've lived a few lives and in previous times of my life I'll say that I have been a very I have been a very self-centered person. Not in a I'm not even gonna say in a messed up way, because in a certain way it's human nature, self-preservation, all those things. But I truly never was able to see anything larger than myself or my own ends. And once I started to see past that, it was checkers to chess. Um you want to find a way to change your life. How can you help somebody? How can you do something that isn't just for yourself because everybody wants to everybody wants their needs met. A good good example. Networking. You hear the word and it just sounds greasy and dirty, and just like a room full of a hundred guys wearing aqua de joe who all want something from you. And then you hear a word like relationship, and they have two completely different cognotations. One feels authentic and one feels self-interested. And once I started to look at building relationships with people, regardless of what the ends could or couldn't be, the same way, everything changed. Because innately we can smell self-interest from a mile away, right? Sure. We know whenever people want something from us. But what do you do whenever somebody all of a sudden is the source of a pain point being eased who's actually useful? Well, chances are you're gonna consider that person valuable. It's not hard to be valuable. You're as valuable as you make yourself. Just find a pain point and try to ease it, bro.

SPEAKER_02 31:51

I was reading a book and something tells me we've talked about it before years ago, but uh and you might know what book I'm talking about, but it was basically what it was saying, and I'll probably butcher it, but summed up, it was it is saying most of the world is self-seeking. The the man or woman who who is is not self-seeking and and willing to to help the next person um has the world at their fingertips. And it's a um I wish I could remember what book it came from, but it's so true, you know, because so many people are selfish and in today's time and always, you know, it's just it's human nature to have we're all a little bit selfish, but if you can be a little less selfish and and um be selfless and stick your hand out and help the next one in line or whatever that looks like, you know, uh then the world's at your fingertips and whatever that may mean in in your particular case. But um I wish I could remember what book it is. I feel like we we had the conversation about it probably like three or four years ago out on the back deck.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Well, and there's a lot of truth to that because even if you look at secular religions, um, like almost all of them have gratitude woven into the actual, you know, the actual blueprint. And that's basically what those things are. Like a sense of selflessness is going to be somebody who can have enough humility to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them. When everybody driving down the street has their own complex life, who do people want to spend time with? Somebody who isn't over there complaining about their own stuff, and not that it's not okay to vent, but it's also okay to remember sometimes that not everything's about you. You're not the main character in every movie.

SPEAKER_02 33:38

Yeah, absolutely. A lot of people struggle with that, you know. I used to be not that I was really bad about it, but I I used to have main character energy. Uh, you know, not proud of it man enough to say it, and I think we all have at some point in time.

SPEAKER_01 33:51

I have had main character energy for 38 years. And the crazy part is is I have had no desire to be the main character for about 10 of those years. But you are who you are. But self-awareness and trying to stay on top of it is, you know, we can all do that a little bit. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:08

Don't don't aura farm, I think is what the kids call it these days. Aura farming.

SPEAKER_01 34:13

Well, y'all, y'all let me know if I do that shit. I don't want to do that. We don't do that. Do you feel like it sounds like chloroforming and that's creepy?

SPEAKER_02 34:21

Do you feel like you are are up to speed and hip with like the modern slang and and terminology, or or do you feel like you're just you're just so far away from it and just don't don't give a shit?

SPEAKER_01 34:36

The best I can say is I try to stay on top of the slang and terminology present in the viable country market.

SPEAKER_03 34:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:45

But outside of that, uh, you know, I love learning new things. I think it's cool that there's still cultural vocabulary that changes generation to generation, because it means that there's always that heart of a generation looking to be creative and unique in their own, looking for their own identity. So, you know, don't listen to them. I don't care if it's whack, I don't care if it's stale, whichever generation you came from, y'all pop your shit. Be yourself. Yeah. Because at the end of the day, you're the only one that can carve the path for what your generation will be known for. So you're right. You shouldn't lean on anybody else's stuff. If they don't understand, that's cool.

SPEAKER_02 35:27

Speaking on like trends and social media and everything, do you think social media has made people want lives that originally they wouldn't naturally want?

SPEAKER_01 35:39

You know, without thinking deeply on it, I'd say that I think that social media has done a lot of things that kind of skew the realm of what we consider reality versus something that lives inside the box. And I think that especially when you integrate the fact that if you dedicate your life to making something beautiful inside of the box, you can have everything that you want. And so, you know, if that's what you're called to, I don't think that there's anything wrong with it. Go do it, climb your mountain. But as far as casual use or consumption, um, I think that anything can be a drug, man. True, you know, like like that bottle of water can be a drug and it can also kill me.

SPEAKER_02 36:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:26

Um, I think that if we digest too much of anything, it'll eventually be to our detriment. So, like, as long as you're a little bit self-aware, make sure that you're not having FOMO every time you check a push notification or see somebody on a beach in a dress that would look cute on you, or whatever it is, um, then you're probably fine. But whenever you start to self-identify those feelings, here's the good news that's not the real world, it's just the highlight reel that everybody puts up. And you should probably just take a break from it for a little while. Cause guess what? By the time you come back, you'll probably have your own pictures and your own highlight reel to put up because you're living your life not focused on a screen all the time.

SPEAKER_02 37:10

Yeah. Um I need a break from it.

SPEAKER_01 37:15

I won't lie, man. I just got through with like a two-month hiatus. I cleared out my calendar, and I have sat at my place in my studio, worked on stuff that I like, that will probably never see the light of day. But um you know, you have to recharge that battery sometimes because if you don't, everything you do will pay the price of it. Like everything you create will pay the price.

SPEAKER_02 37:41

Yeah. Yeah, that that's definitely something that I I struggle with is and you know, it's my job, you know. Most of my work is going on social media, either for a client or for myself. And it's uh not that I'm even like not that every day is spent just scrolling through Instagram or anything like that, but at least at least at some point throughout the day I'm on it, you know, and then it's just like and most people will probably, you know, fall into that category too.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Also, to be fair though, and to just not to interrupt you, but like with what you do, that's kind of an exception. You know what I mean? Like that's market like that's your enough to work. That's right, man. And so that's like me not hyperfixating on the hot country playlist. Well, that's kind of sort of market research. That that's important. Not that it's the only thing people like, but it's definitely a current representation of what they really like, yeah. And so, you know, past that, I know a lot of other creatives, there's no way to really do this one way or the other without having a strong social presence. I don't want it to sound like I'm against taking advantage of your own marketing abilities that you have in front of you with the blessing of the internet. But whenever it comes to scrolling for your feelings, that's the stuff you want to keep an eye on. You know, getting locked in for an hour, that's the part that's bad for you.

SPEAKER_02 39:05

Yeah, and and it'll happen quick too. It'll happen quick.

SPEAKER_01 39:09

Dopamine's a hell of a drug.

SPEAKER_02 39:11

There's so much things you can get dopamine from these days. You know, it's a uh I don't know. Part of me wishes I I grew up in a different time, and then part of me is like really grateful for the time that I I grew up in, and I'm kind of coming up in because just the opportunities are a lot different, you know. Like, and I'm sure you can attest too being being a little bit older than I am, not too much older now, but a little bit older. Um that you know, you you've seen the the change and how you know just technology has advanced everything, and it's just like I don't know, you got you there's pros and cons to it. Yeah, we're really glued into screens now, uh, and it's taken away a lot of how the world used to be and how it used to operate, but now there's also thousands, millions of more opportunities that never existed then. So, you know, it's uh you gotta find a I guess a good middle ground.

SPEAKER_01 40:06

I agree. I think that like the game has changed, right? Like, in that us mass consuming media isn't a new thing. Because even previous to radio broadcast, printed media, because technically that's what it is any type of local or formulated journalism, that's media coverage. And what is media? It's basically just a word to identify things that we digest that are programmed, and it's always been here. There's always gonna be a medium or cutting edge newer medium of how to digest it. And at the end of the day, yeah, man, like compared to whenever I was a kid, ignorance is a total choice these days.

SPEAKER_02 40:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:55

There is literally endless information on anything that you could imagine at your fingertips, and you don't even have to go find it now. You can have a dude read it back in the voice that you like. Like, I'm telling you, if you hear this for some odd reason, Morgan Freeman, get in touch with Grok or Apple. I'll pay a hundred dollars to get your voice on Siri or Grok. Just saying, if anybody feels this, start a petition, I'll sign it twice.

SPEAKER_02 41:24

That would be pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_01 41:25

I would pay a hundred, I would I would let go of a fucking hundo for that. Morgan Freeman just telling me my shit the rest of my life. Like, yeah, bro. Like, uh Morgan, what do I do with this verse? Well, what you see now is what I would I'm sorry, then we're gonna stop right there. Morgan, I respect you.

SPEAKER_02 41:43

I love that. Talk I don't know how to to move on from that one. Uh talk about, I mean, talk about like Siri and and how there's opportunities at your fingertips and any answer that you want. And obviously, we're you know you're touching on initiative. Yeah, initiative and you know, getting into artificial intelligence. Talk about your thoughts and and viewpoints on on AI and what how you've seen it, you know, impact the music industry and just the world in general, and do you like um the implementation of it or do you hate it? Kind of what where do you stand on on the whole AI thing? He's taking a sip. Y'all sit y'all better brace yourself.

SPEAKER_01 42:25

So I'll start with saying I don't claim to know more about AI than any other person who likes to read. Um because let's be real, there's only the information out there that it's published on it. So I learned through watching the internet era whenever I was in high school and first getting into the music industry, and everything started switching from old format, physical format, to a more digital, you know, DSP revolving world, and it was slow at first, but man did it pick up. And it didn't do anybody any favors that worked against the grain of where tech in their industry was going then. I don't think it will do well for anybody now, not saying that you should use it for low-hanging tasks that help you avoid creativity, but there's a difference between a finished product and a really useful hammer that helps you build something quicker and or maybe cooler than you would have without that hammer. Um, you still are the one prompting, you are still the one who's going to have to tie it all together, and if it looks a mess, you're still the one responsible for that. If it looks really good, well, that's because none of it would have happened without you taking initiative. So I don't know. Do I think that I would feel different if it was completely taking over my field right now? I'm sure that I would, but I also am not a I'm I'm not naive, I'm a realist. There's going to be a certain people who get ahead of the curve in that, learn the tech, and can be more valuable with the tech than the tech by itself. Because at the end of the day, somebody still has to be the one behind the initiative. Somebody has to initiate action.

SPEAKER_02 44:17

I think that's the the part a lot of people fail to realize with the whole AI and and you know, I'm speaking a lot in photo and video editing and generating um terms, but um people think you just type in something simple and and it generates and gives you exactly what you want, and and that's the finished product product. And dude, I I mean I I dove a lot into the video editing side of things. I'm the a pro the highest subscription you can be on a lot of these you know these sites because I don't want to be half time. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

That's market research, bro.

SPEAKER_02 44:53

But dude, I've I've spent hours on like just a 10-second scene to like make sure everything was exactly how I wanted to. And sure, if I wanted to film that that that entire scene, it would have cost me you know thousands of dollars of production and travel. So yeah, I would the a couple hours, you know, and I'm not saying I would trade the in-person shoot over that, I'm just saying it can be done. It's a different work for it. But it's not just typing in, make me this, and then boom, it's done. That's right. And there's no create, you have to know how to think like a director or think like a music producer, know how a sound or a certain instrument sounds and how where you want it to play in. It's not just, oh, do this and then bam, it's there.

SPEAKER_01 45:37

Well, and that's with completely creating a finished product that you're gonna publish and put out. Like realistically, what everyone who's in the creative field should be doing in almost any way possible is using AI to help you think creatively. Yeah. Think outside of the box. Like similar would be you see a video that didn't quite go right, but it put an idea in your head that you never would have had. Now you know how to properly start to prompt and craft the direction towards what you see until it gets closer and closer. So, as to what you were saying, like you're right, to go and make that happen with film would be a lot more of a fiscal equity. You would have to pay money to do that. Sure. But did you you still had to pay for it because instead it was time and sweat equity. So it isn't like it's an easy button that's here to kill all creatives workflow. It just means that maybe certain things aren't gonna be gatekeep anymore simply because there's more than one way to make great content or create really cool things these days. Um, the the one perk about there being more creatives now actively seeking a career in the world than there's ever been is that we're probably gonna keep coming up with cool innovative ways to do something different and or maybe a little bit better. We just can't be the old guys who refuse to play ball. How did that work out for Nikon?

SPEAKER_02 47:05

Yeah, yeah, facts. You have to learn to adapt, and that's with AI, that's with uh anything in in life, you know. The one who learns to adapt will go far. The one who who gets accustomed and gets comfortable in a certain setting or environment, you it's you're not priming yourself, you know, and it's uh you have to be willing, willing to adapt, not even able to adapt, willing to adapt. Well, yeah, because there's no choice.

SPEAKER_01 47:32

Yeah, otherwise, you're just going to have a lot of mental dissonance during the changes of life that are probably gonna leave you a little bit bitter, man. Yeah. So basically don't take it personally. Look for the lesson, make sure you have it the first time and keep on.

SPEAKER_02 47:53

Yeah. Man, I I've seen not to like harp too much on AI to be the last thing I say on it, but I've seen so many there's like a disconnect, and it's kind of split like 50-50 of people on social media, and I've seen it a lot because I've I've posted you know my fair share of AI generated stuff. I just had a post go crazy viral. I don't know if you've seen it the other day, the Taylor Swift thing. No, I didn't. So I I AI'd a um photo, it was on uh 4th of July, so Saturday, Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey's wedding was Friday night at Madison Square Garden.

SPEAKER_01 48:27

Wait a minute, I think I did see that. I don't remember exactly what it was, but I was like, wow, Rippy's posting about Swifty.

SPEAKER_02 48:33

Yeah, yeah. So the wedding was super like exclusive. They had it, you know, the no photos or videos were coming up.

SPEAKER_01 48:39

Yeah, event of the year type thing.

SPEAKER_02 48:40

Yeah, yeah. Blocked off all the streets from around Madison Square Garden. Anyways, I woke up out of a dead sleep at um like three in the like three thirty. It was three thirty-three in the morning. It was it was weird. It was kind of weird. Witching hour. But it's repeating numbers, you know. I I find it as a good time. Anyways, I had the idea. I made an AI generated picture of of me shooting a photo of Travis and Taylor uh at the wedding with Patrick Mahomes uh in the background, Adam Sandler, and then I was about to post that one, and I um I was like, no, it's missing something. So then I added Kanye right over my shoulder. So when people did see that when people it's got like three and a half million views on Instagram, bro. I I I'm I'm pissed off Swifty Nation. Some of them, some of them thought it was funny, some of them are so against me. And what that was getting to my main point of like, there's so many people that are for AI, and not even necessarily like, oh, go AI, but it's like they find it comical or they find it beneficial, and then there's some people who just like absolutely hate people who use it. Like, I I've like received not necessarily threats, but for instance, yesterday someone was telling me saying that I was a terrible human being because I and I've and I've fallen off because I'm using AI and gotten this whole little argument in the comments and stuff, and it's just like people really like hate people that use it. And I don't understand what's the the disconnect there. Why there's some people that are for it, and then there's some people that just like why does it affect you so much that someone's generating an image in my instance or or a song, or why did it how does it affect you as a person so much? I guess some people are just pissed off with the world, right?

SPEAKER_01 50:28

I I guess some people think things are that black and white. Yeah. Um, but there's a huge difference between using a legally marketed tool to do something and doing something that actively represses other creatives from making a living. Now, this can maybe be argued a few different ways, but I could also m use the word initiative right back at most of the counter-arguments because if you are this, that, and the other, if you have these skill sets, if you've done the work, then why wouldn't you integrate to make sure that you stay competitive in your market? Or if you're just a broad consumer, why do you have such an opinion about it in the first place, other than the right to kind of be reluctant? I mean, we've all seen Terminator.

SPEAKER_03 51:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:16

Um, but at the same time, I guess the real weird thing is why do people feel so compelled to hate something just because they don't understand it? And that word hate's a good thing to focus on because that's just gotta be an externalization. Like, why be hateful about something that doesn't directly affect you?

SPEAKER_02 51:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:37

Uh I don't know. I don't understand it, but I think it is human nature to fear things you don't understand. But that's also why it's human nature not to grow and and and rise up to be better than you possibly would have been. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 51:53

It's funny that the person that I actually knew the person that was commenting the thing. So I'm not gonna go into details because I uh that was yesterday's problems, you know.

SPEAKER_01 52:04

But I they were don't hate on any other man's hustle. If you if you really think there's something that wrong with it, then show him better. Well my go do it better.

SPEAKER_02 52:14

Absolutely. And my biggest thing on on that is like social media people, and it's a big epidemic we have, people love to to write things and type things on social media, but if given the opportunity in person, like not like on any fighting or anything like that, but given the opportunity in person to to speak your mind and speak what you're saying on social, they don't set step up to the plate. I I ended up calling this person at FaceTiming, and they neither one of us had each other's number. I've only talked to this person, met them one time in my life, and as soon as they answered and realized it was me, they hung up and and wouldn't answer my calls. And it's just like, why why are you gonna go on social media bitching about some AI stuff? And then when I call and give you the opportunity, like I'm talking like saying you're a terrible person, you fought you're not a creative anymore, like some personal stuff, and then given the opportunity to to speak on it, you don't speak on it, you know? It's just like I don't know, that's a huge problem we have in today's time.

SPEAKER_01 53:20

I agree. I think everybody has gotten used to being able to speak with some level of anonymity, like even if it is your profile, this, that, and the other, oh, it's just the internet.

SPEAKER_02 53:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

And not on any tough guy stuff because it doesn't fix anything, but I think it's also part of us losing scope of reality that sometimes people get punched in the mouth for saying things that come off douchey.

SPEAKER_03 53:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:45

And at the end of the day, when somebody says that, especially whenever it's something that doesn't really pertain to them or they don't really even have a reason to have that much of an opinion about what you're doing, yeah. Um, that's gotta be them externalizing for something else. So pray for them, don't swallow the poison and don't take it personally, because as long as you don't take it personally, then it's not your problem.

SPEAKER_02 54:12

Yeah, you took the words out of my mouth. I was gonna say, going back to what you said a few minutes ago, it it kind of all boils down to don't take it personally, anything, good and bad. Good and bad.

SPEAKER_01 54:23

As a creative, if you take things personally, you're gonna have a very, very, very hard life. I speak that from experience at times. Yeah. Um, especially about your work, because guess what? For every person that loves it, chances are there's three that don't. So uh what was it? I saw an example the other day. It was like the greatest selling album of all time is Eagle's Greatest Hits. It sold something uh roughly around over 30 million copies, and they were saying, you know, to be the largest selling record of all times, questionably the biggest, most successful American band of all times, and there were still 300 million other people in the country who didn't like it and didn't buy that album.

SPEAKER_02 55:14

That's insane.

SPEAKER_01 55:16

So if you're looking to be a people pleaser, you're in the wrong thing. Uh even whenever you fully connect and knock it out of the park, there's still only going to be so many people at that game. So if you're doing it to feel special, if you're doing it for anything other than because it's who you are, you'll eventually get to those plateaus if you work hard enough, and the only way to rise up them is to realize the superficial stuff that may have made you want it in the first place, isn't exactly as shiny as you thought. Maybe it's just seeing that you're developing and growing with what you do.

SPEAKER_02 55:56

It's one thing like traveling, especially the last I'd say like a year and a half, two years, because I've went to other countries and almost uh all 50 states now, it it's really opened my eyes and and made me learn that like we're not that you know, we're not that important. We're not as important as we think we are. Not and not saying that you don't matter, everybody matters. Everybody plays a role on this earth, but what we get so fixated on and get so caught up in in our day-to-day life, our work, our problems. It's like I don't know, lately, I mean I went to Australia earlier this year. I was gonna ask you how that was went to London and I'll touch on it in a second. Went to London and all these other places, and and not even just those places. I mean, I've done a lot of traveling, but it's really opened up just like observing other people. Here I was on the other side of the world, 15 hours ahead of time. You know, everybody back home is is sleeping, and then these people are living just living a completely different lifestyle and up in at in the middle of the day, and it's bedtime back home, and it's like we're here we are just worried about what's in our little bubble, and there's so much going on, you know. It's not to say that it doesn't matter, but it it's just that it's not the good's not as good as you think, and the bad's not as bad as you think either. You know? You can never get too high. It's all just a phase you're going through. Yeah, just gotta ride the ride the wave.

SPEAKER_01 57:22

Dude, there's a ton of truth to what you just said. Um I think that whenever you talk about stuff like that, like I've heard it referred to as the six degrees of separation. And if everyone you pass on the freeway has their own intricate, complex life, then it isn't that you aren't special. Everyone is special. In a way, we're all snowflakes completely hot couture unique. But at the same time, there's a lot of snowflakes on a typical snowy day in Maine, right? Like there's a lot of snowflakes. Doesn't mean that you aren't unique or special, it just means that that isn't enough. Get off of your ass and go do something. You know, um, nothing unique or special was ever celebrated without some hard work and effort. Um I probably lost the plot again.

SPEAKER_02 58:21

It happens. That's what happens when you get on minute 45 or hour. I don't even know how long we've been going, but we're rolling with it. I'm glad we've uh been able to do this this podcast.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

Uh uh there was one thing that I wanted to add to that. So with you talking about noticing that nothing's really that important, or there you you you know, just realizing how small you are in a grand scheme of things globally, especially with that. Like it's a reminder that anytime we start to get overwhelmed with where we're at, maybe we're worried about what's coming, maybe we still can't move past what's behind. But usually the problem with those perspectives is we need to zoom out some. And whenever you go abroad like that and you see different cultures and different ways of life that are so backwards of what you know, it reminds you that life is a lot bigger than the perspective we hold every single day on our best days. So anytime it seems too heavy, anytime it seems a little bit too larky dark, you probably just need to zoom out.

SPEAKER_02 59:29

Yeah, no, absolutely. It was uh that trip for me. I mean, I was over there for two and a half weeks, you know, very good amount of time. That's a long time. Yeah, good amount of time to really like settle in, uh, given we were jumping around all every part, every major city over there, but it was just I don't know, experiencing different culture, a different, like a real different culture that far away from home. It was uh very eye-opening for me, and it was dude, I loved it. I wanna I I'll be back for sure. I'll be back. The flight was far for sure. I got lucky on the way out there. I actually paid a little bit and upgraded my uh seat and got the exit row. Not that I need it, you know, I'm 5'8, I don't I don't have to get it. But on a flight like that, that matters. It was so worth it. It was like a hundred and fifty bucks for a 15-hour flight, and that's all yeah, for sure worth it. I was sitting comfy. It was it was nice.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:23

I'll definitely So two and a half weeks, that had to be long enough to completely recover from jet lag and then get it again.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:30

Oh, dude, I the first like week that I was there, I was really not sleeping, or if I was, it was at like the most odd hours. I'd get tired at like 6 p.m. and then I'd be up at 2 a.m. 3 a.m. and I watched I think I watch every I think I watch the sunrise every single day that I was in Australia, which is beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:51

That's a great that's a great thing to aim for. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:54

Yeah, I feel like I experienced Australia so much different than most of everyone else that was there, and you know, and they experienced things that I didn't too, but I'm saying as far as like the sun rises, I I'm I've gotten a lot into running, you know, since last time you and I seen each other. So I ran one morning in Sydney. I ran six miles from our hotel to the uh to the beach. Um uh what's the what's the beach? It's a very popular um Bondi, Bondai Beach. Yeah, it's like a real popular beach, anyways. And um, but yeah, just experienced all of it, and but my sleep schedule was ass backwards. I was and then yeah, by the time I got fully adjusted and was like getting good night's sleep at a normal time, it was like, okay, it's time to go home. Another 15-hour flight.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:43

Did you see any koalas?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:45

I didn't okay, so I didn't see a koala, but one day we were in uh we had like four days off in in uh Melbourne. More specifically, the area was like uh St. Kilda Beach, and we had this really cool like hotel, and it was kind of like not in a forest, but there was like a whole little forest out in like the courtyard area in the middle.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:08

Whole ass ecosystem, yeah, dude.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:10

It was crazy. Like I it was nothing you'd see here. Um there was something in the tree, and we we AI or chat GPT'd it and try to figure out what it was, but we we didn't have a good enough picture of it. But it looked like a koala, and I was convincing myself that it was koala. Wasn't a koala. Didn't see any kangaroos, that was pretty uh pretty sad. I was expecting kangaroos over there to be like, you know, seeing a deer over here.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:37

Yeah, like chickens in Key West.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:39

Yeah. I've never been to Key West. There's a lot of chickens in the West.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:42

Oh man, dude, there are street chickens everywhere, and they are not scared of you.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:48

I got a video. I'll have to insert clip. One morning I was out on a run and this in Australia, and just a dude, a freaking turkey. They had wild turkeys just all over the place. You said chicken, it made me think of it. Just started running after me, bro. Just started, and I and I was videoing, so I vlogged the whole entire Australia trip, like personal vlog, and I have it on on video.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:12

Yeah, those things are aggressive and they're kind of aware that we eat them on occasion.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:15

So it was like six in the morning, and I was getting chased by a turkey, and and this older older couple and they had like family with them. This guy just started dying laughing. And then he was like, Oh mate, don't be don't be scared, mate. And I uh I was like, those don't look like the turkeys we got back home, and he's like, Yeah, they're they're usually on a uh Thanksgiving platter, eh? It was so funny at six in the morning.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:43

Yeah, those Velociraptor jeans starting to pop out.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:45

I don't know if that was a good I might get get made fun of for that Australian accent.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:50

I mean, it was formidable to me, but you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:53

I'm not even gonna do it again.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:54

But I dingo didn't eat my baby, so what do I know?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:59

Australia was fun times. What's next for you, bro? I know you're in town right now doing some writes and and just m making music, making babies. Yeah, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:09

I got uh I got a couple uh I got a couple of projects that are in the works right now that I'm enjoying working on. Um working with a guy named Michael James that I really like what we've been doing together. I think that uh people end up really digging that. And then honestly, just kind of enjoying navigating things on my own time and having my calendar. I've been speed dating for a couple of years, and uh I just this is like literally one of my first days in town after taking that little sabbatical to clear my head and you know, like let the juices start to flow again, and it's great because I'm hungry again. What's next? Good songs, hopefully.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:51

You know if not, it probably wasn't my line.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:57

Writing songs, babies and taxes. What's your line? What's your what's your favorite? Bills and babies. Bills and babies.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:05

Yeah, death and taxes. There ain't no way out of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:08

Amen to that. Amen to that. If there's a creative that's uh listening right now that's feeling burnt out and and maybe um wanting to hang it up and and and go get a traditional job and and and not pursue this route, what would be one piece of advice that you would give them?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:28

Pray about it and then be honest with yourself. If you still know that you can do it, then you can and you should. And if you don't feel like the fire is there anymore, then chances are you're smart enough at this point to know that there's a lot of things you can do that make you a whole lot more money. So, you know, there's nothing wrong with not being a lifer, but if this person were, I'd say do what's best for you right now, but understand that it's just a season and make sure that you always get back to that. Place where you're you and being creative because whether it's professionally, like commercially, or if it's just for family and friends, whatever it is, like one thing I know for sure the world doesn't need is less creative minds. Even though everybody's on the internet now and it feels like a massive rat race and XYZ, that's cool. That's just like everybody who swings a golf club or has a bag full of Wilsons wanting to be on the PGA tour, you can just see it in real time. Um you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:33

That's a beautifully painted picture to make it make sense. That is so true. So true. If you could leave every creative with one belief that you think could actually change the trajectory of their career and make an impact, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:56

Stop being insecure about that one thing and letting it hold you back from running because just by starting to run that thing will get better and better every day. Don't sit on a shelf or on a sideline and watching other people do something that you want to do. Because eventually you can't put sand back in the glass, man. And how long are you wanting to sacrifice before you really start to build? So I guess just you know don't waste time and don't waste time on people who don't fill your cup.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:41

Amen. Mic drop.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:44

Number one rule of being a creative everybody wants us, everybody needs us, nobody wants to pay us. Do not waste time, and do not waste time on people who do not also put into your cup.

unknown 1:07:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:58

And don't book gigs with anyone that does net 30 or plus.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:03

You know, I don't even know what that means, but I trust this guy.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:07

It's big in the in the photo video space, like net 30 pay like 30 days, and then you get paid out. Some people do net 90.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:15

Oh, there's no reason for that other than banking bull crap. Like that's yeah, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:21

It's like, bro, can you wait 90 days on your deliverables?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:24

Well, yeah, I was about to say that.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:25

Sorry, that was completely out of lift.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:27

I'll I'll make I'll make a contrast of in my business whenever it comes to collecting royalties from publishing representative offices. Um we're on it depends on where you're at and what quarter, but three months, more like at least nine months behind what you actually earned this quarter on getting paid out. Now they're concurrent, you're constantly getting one every quarter. But in this world of banking, what point is there to hold on to monies like that other than the obvious fact that they're trying to make interest on it for a quarter before having to give it to you? Yeah. Um, so I don't know, that's just bad business. Like if you need three months to pay your bills, then maybe you should have saved up before you got a bill. Facts.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:11

Oh, I I have a thread that always goes viral when I make a joke about net 30 or net 45. It's uh I don't know, photographers, videographers, they know the pain.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:22

Realistically, what reason is there to have any more than a couple of weeks to get an invoice squared away unless you are doing installations? So if it's net 30 on something, especially if it's broken up into segments in between, that seems like good transparent business. You know, uh you're made whole within X amount of time, and it's not like you're waiting for 29 days for something to hit.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:46

Yeah. If there's someone out there, and we'll wrap up after this, but if there's someone out there that wants to get into the music space, and you know, maybe they don't necessarily want to be a uh a singer or an artist themselves, but they want to do the whole songwriting thing. What would be your biggest piece of advice to them on getting going with no prior connections or resources?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:15

Buy a copy of Writing Better Lyrics by Pat Pattison, read it, do the exercises, and then do it again. Eventually you'll start to understand what it means to see a song in 2D and then to understand 3D. And it isn't just me recommending a book that I like, that's actually the course curriculum entrance book and lesson to songwriting at Berkeley. He's actually the guy who created the songwriting program at Berkeley. Um, one of Bob Dylan's collaborators. Um, but anyway, this book has nothing to do with music. This book is all about understanding lyric. And everybody in town, say you come to town, everybody's gonna have musical taste, everybody's gonna be good at the things that they like. So a lot of that is just to taste. But what does everybody always need? Everybody always needs a super strong, witty, relatable lyric sheet. Go read the book. Reading Better Lyrics by Pat Patterson. Yeah, I want to say that I've probably gifted that book more than a dozen times to people, and it's just because I didn't stumble upon it myself. I was listening to a podcast of all things, and I believe it was Ross Copperman who was talking about how he ended up seeing John Mayer after a show and managed to have a fanboy moment and ask for a piece of advice. And at the time he had just gotten in an Asheville and stuff. And I'm probably butchering this if you hear this, Ross. Sorry. But um, he said, What's one piece of advice you could give to an aspiring songwriter? And he said, Reading better lyrics by Pat Patison. And whenever I heard that in that podcast, I wrote it down, went on to read it, and changed your life. Yeah, man, it changed the way that I looked at lyrics because with music everything is a five-option multiple choice. But lyric is uh what people connect to a lot of times. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:23

You know.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:24

I think a lot of people underestimate the um the uh power that just one little thing like that can have on the trajectory of your career or life. You know, it's not that it's not that that book itself changed your life, you know, or can or can change your life. Sure. But it it it directed it, it got you thinking in a way to then take more steps and stack more days, and then it did. Without that book, that might not have happened, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:54

It was such an important piece to my puzzle because I had known for years that a lyric sheet was something that I was always drawn to in music, and I had gotten better at it, but I hadn't completely scoped the full picture or been able to like I guess like logistically understand the whole picture yet. And this m helped me understand things like imagery, it helped me understand things like following the natural form of the language that you write down whenever you take it and put it to a melody. Um, just lots of really cool things that seem common sense, but until you see them written down verbatim as a rule, you don't necessarily associate as oh yeah, I should always do that. So there's some good anchors in it.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:41

Because after that, it's all about what you have to say, just know how to take what you have to say and find a flattering way to put it to track.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:51

Ladies and gentlemen, Will Patton.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:54

Happy to be here, dude. Thanks for having me out.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:56

I appreciate you joining, man. I appreciate you joining. Guys, thank you for tuning in to another episode of the Creatively Connected Podcast. If you're a photographer or videographer and you're looking for a more efficient way to travel around and carry your camera equipment, I know I've spent thousands of dollars on camera bodies, lenses, and I've even broken a lens before because I used to carry my equipment in a soft shell backpack. Don't be like me. Go get your hard shell back hard shell case from Condition One. I got them linked in the description. If you use that link, you can get 10% off on any of the case uh that they have. I use case number 300. It's the uh one with the padded dividers, lid organizers, all kinds of stuff. You can go grab that. I got that linked in the description. But thank you guys so much for tuning in. Will, thank you so much for for joining. Do you want to you want to give them your your socials uh to follow or are you not?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:46

Yeah, man. If anybody's interested in checking out my stuff, it's gonna be uh William Rode at uh Instagram. I believe it's that on TikTok, and that's pretty much all I have. I only do like two hard posts a year, but unless it's a release or something. So yeah, if you want to hear my discography, I've got it in the link on my Instagram at WilliamRoadit.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:06

I know you like your privacy, so I wanted to ask before I just before I I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:11

And it's not like anybody can get too close of a look in. All you're gonna see is some songs and some barbecue pictures.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:17

Oh yeah, gotta have the barbecue pictures.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:19

Man, you know that's my life story.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:21

Anything, uh any final remarks, or you you touched on everything you want to say.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:26

Man, if y'all made it this far, thank you so much for your time. I hope you found something useful. And remember, even when it ain't, y'all, it's all good.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:35

What he said, guys. Thank you so much. I appreciate y'all tuning in. We'll see you in the next episode. Peace.