Ep.99 Why Refusing To Fit In A Box Can Be Your Smartest Career Move With Silvia Coco

What if the very dreams people call “delusional” are the ones that lead you to a life that finally fits? 

This week I sit down with branding and business strategist Silvia Coco to unpack how multi-passionate creatives can stop shrinking to fit a label and start using strategy as a bridge from idea to reality. From refusing the box to designing goals that match your real capacity, this conversation blends honest stories with practical tools you can use today.

Silvia’s path runs from corporate communications to Parsons illustration to brand strategy, revealing how each pivot sharpened her gift for clarity. She shares why she left client-led design, how to reframe a job title as a conversation starter, and the simple definition of strategy that changes everything: the road you take from concept to done. We talk brand positioning, alignment, and the quiet traps that keep founders stuck even when they look “successful” on paper. 

 Silvia’s guiding word—intentionality—becomes a compass for multi-passionates: pick one theme, then express it everywhere through choices, collaborations, and content. We also trade podcast production truths, embracing the messy middle instead of chasing perfect timing. And we unpack “delusional to done,” a mindset that invites you to dream audaciously, select one strand, ship it, and let the proof power the next move.

If you’re ready to trade labels for leverage and fog for focus, hit play. Then share this with a friend who needs a nudge or leave a review to help more rebels find their road!

Connect with Silvia here:

www.lacreativa.ch
www.linkedin.com/in/silviacoco

https://www.instagram.com/iam_silvia/

Transcript

Dreaming Beyond The “Delusional” Label

Silvia Coco 0:00

Dream to a point where other people think that it's so unachievable, it's so crazy, it's so out there that they might label you as delusional. But delusional to done wants to be a positive message of you can allow yourself to have those big dreams, to be playful, to enjoy the process and get them to done.

Welcome To Mischief Movement

Meet Silvia Coco

Zoe Greenhalf 0:22

Hey there, welcome or welcome back to the Mischief Movement Podcast. I'm Zoe, your guide on this journey to shake up the status quo and design a life that truly makes you feel alive. If you've ever felt disconnected, stuck on autopilot, or trapped in a life that feels more like a treadmill than an adventure, you're in the right place. I know the change can feel scary, so let's turn down the fear and crank up the fears as we transform your life from the inside out. Whether it's solo episodes packed with actionable advice or interviews with some absolute ballass human beings who've dared to defy the norm by living life their way, we're here to inspire, activate, empower, and challenge you each week. My mission is simple: to help you reawaken your rebel spirit, break free from mediocrity, and design a life that's anything but dull. You only get one moral bloody. So what are you planning to do with yours? If you're ready to stop settling, start living boldly and create a positive impact along the way. Let's dive in and stir up some mischief together. Now buckle up and let's go. Hey mischief maker! Today I'm gonna put on my best Italian accent to introduce you to the brilliant Silvia Coco. Before we even get into what she does, I want to start with something that we talk about in this conversation that I think a lot of you are gonna recognize. And it's that feeling of never quite fitting neatly into one box. You know, having loads of interest, different skills, different creative pools, and spending years wondering which one you're supposed to choose. What happens when you stop trying to define yourself so neatly and instead allow all those different parts of you to exist and work together? Sylvia's path reflects this beautifully. She started out in branding, learning the craft of storytelling and strategy, and over time she's expanded into visual design, project management, and workshop facilitation. Basically, she's someone who loves taking messy, complicated ideas and turning them into something clear, creative, and actually useful. These days, she works a lot with founders and micropreneurs, helping people think more strategically about their ideas and building their brands whilst also bringing a strong creative and artistic perspective to the table. And one of the things that she does brilliantly is design workshops and collaborative spaces that help people think differently, spark new ideas, and actually move things forward. When we recorded this conversation, she brought such a vibrant energy to the room. She always asks really thoughtful questions. She's deeply curious about how people work and create. And she's someone who has clearly made peace with the fact that she doesn't fit into just one category anymore. And quite honestly, she doesn't want to. So if you've ever felt a bit too multi-passionate, a bit too curious, or a bit too hard to label, you're going to feel right at home in this conversation. Without further ado, here's my chat with Sylvia. I'm a bit kind of excited but sad because this is going to be my last guest on the podcast. I'm really happy though to welcome Sylvia to the studio. Would you like to tell everybody what your mischief is?

Silvia Coco 3:45

Ooh, my mischief is that I don't think I could ever fit in any box. I've always had so many different interests, so many different passions, and so I decided to stop trying. I rebelled to the box.

Zoe Greenhalf 4:00

Amazing. But what does that look like? Are you are we talking a personal life, career? How does that kind of play out? The sense of not fitting in a box and also not wanting to.

Life Beyond One Job Title

Silvia Coco 4:11

I think mostly career-wise. I mean, my profession and my personal life are very tied together. Yeah. I am that passionate about what I do that there's just no clear boundary. Um, but I would say in my professional life, it has meant coming to the realization that there's just not one easy title to explain my profession, and the one that I put is just a conversation starter and not a definition. Um and in my personal, yes, still professional life, I guess it's a little bit of embracing the quirks, embracing that I come on the podcast. So, you know, my logo, there's the rainbow in my logo, and I have the little hair up like this, you know. I I accepting that I'm fine being the cutie in the room at the same time, I know I can deliver and be a girl boss, you know, like having the confidence to know what I can bring, but the cute smiles and the sunshines and the cherry coats and all of that.

What Strategy Really Means

Zoe Greenhalf 5:13

Love that. Um, but in terms of then what you're currently using as your conversation starter, and we won't say label, how do you then frame what you do in a way that makes sense to you and also to your clients?

Silvia Coco 5:30

So I would say the title now is Brandon Business Strategist. Why is it a conversation starter? Because for the most part, people then say, So what do you do? It's a business strategist. Yes. Um it's a conversation starter because after that question, I can go in and explain. Well, I work with microenterprise. I love supporting people that want to build their business. And usually it's people that are very passionate and want to build a business that fits their life and it fits their passions. And, you know, what are you passionate about? And then, you know, it's it sort of goes back into I ask the questions and what are you building? What are you dreaming of? And the conversation can then take different channels based on who's in front of me because I am part designer, facilitator, you know. Um the the strategy comes in in creating exercises and workshops that are the custom tailored and then part coach and part consultant, and there's there's the advisory part. So uh there's not one term that I found that would give the definition. Um, it's more of a it's more of a title, like I said, to to give a sense of at the core, I help you with strategy.

Zoe Greenhalf 6:54

Yeah. Okay. And just so we're clear, what does strategy look like? When you when you get that question, where do you go to to explain exactly what you do?

Silvia Coco 7:06

Well, like I said, it's it depends on who's in front of me. So as a general answer, I would say strategy means what's the road you need to take to go from your idea to seeing it exist. Brilliant. Okay. Um in the individual conversation, for somebody it might mean brand positioning, like how how are you on the market? To you know, what is your business coherent with what you actually want to do? Like a conversation I've had recently. Um, they were serving a market. They're trying to sell something and then ended up selling another thing because the market requested it. And when we spoke, it's like, okay, you're not selling what you wanted to sell. Yeah. Well, let's look at what happened, why you got sidetracked and realigned the step, like build the step back to what you actually want to sell.

Zoe Greenhalf 8:02

Yeah.

Silvia Coco 8:02

Um, so yeah, so it can take a lot of a lot of shapes.

A Squiggly Creative Career

Zoe Greenhalf 8:06

Yeah. And how has your career developed in order to end up at this point? Has it been very squiggly like a lot of people's?

Play, Perfectionism And Output

Silvia Coco 8:15

Yes, very squiggly, very uh mischievous at times, and it's meant in difficult conversations at times. Oh wow. But maybe I can do you want me to do a sort of chronological recap and walk you a little bit through my interests and yeah, let's see. Let's find out how you got where you are. Okay. Um, I was always a very creative kid in a family of accountants. So a little bit of the of the black sheep. Um, and when I had to go to university and decide what do you want to be when you're a grown-up, I was like, of course I want to do a creative career. And my family was like, yeah, maybe not. That's not a good idea. So the closest thing I could find was marketing and communication in general, because it was the only sort of traditional field that had an element of creativity and potential, even though at the time, mind you, uh maybe I don't look it, but um at the time there's no social media, there's not, you know, so we're talking about PR, internal communications, um, pure like old-style advertisement. So the content creator did not exist as a role, right? The maximum creativity is writing a press release and working for a design agency and advertisement. But, anyways, it was still better than being a lawyer, right? Which I've had no, I would have had no patience for. Um I did that. And then when I was finishing my degree in corporate communications, I finally decided to take a leap and tell my parents, look, I I need your support, I need to go through a creative career. I will die if I don't, like I will not be able to be happy. Um so I was accepted at Parsons in New York and I studied illustration. Fantastic. Complete pivot, right? Like New York City at this point. I'm like 23. All the people in my class are 18, and I'm like such a diligent, you know, I'm here after already such a battle of proving that I wanted to be a creative, and everybody else is like, you, Barney, let's have fun in New York. And I was like, no, my professors are my future colleagues. You know, super seriously about it. Um but I graduated when I graduated, what happened is it was about a time when marketing or the understanding of advertisement was starting to pivot, and logos started to be seen as brands. And brands meant that you needed story, you needed identity, you needed a little bit more than just a cool design. And because I had the comprehension of the marketing and the comprehension of the graphics and the storytelling, especially of illustration, yeah, it was like the perfect skill set blend. And when I started my career, I felt like wow, I'm almost spot on, right? Like there's this, I remember giving myself the title in my first job. Well, not my very first job, but my first like serious job. Like, you know, when you pass the little university gigs, uh, my first serious job was brand manager. And at the time, I felt, oh my god, that's so cool. That title didn't exist at all. Like, I completely felt like I totally made that up. Already I was like inventing titles for myself. Um, and I was in that role for a year. So around 2016, I decided, you know, like two years out of uni. I was like, no, I cannot follow a career in an office, even if I give myself the title. Even if it's like all the skill set that I put together, I will not be able to stand being in these corporate dynamics. Um, I hated the office gossip. I was not particularly lucky for sure. I entered sort of a family-owned company in Italy with, I don't know, these like succession dynamics. So the son was entering, but he didn't the different vision and the father, so a mess. So I decided to go at uh freelance and I started being more of a designer and an illustrator. Eventually, you know, more getting more and more freelance branding clients. And with COVID, when everybody had a moment for introspection, yeah, I I decided that actually my my best skill when it came to to branding and design was in the strategy, was in trying to understand why you are looking and sounding like this? Why are you speaking to these clients? Why are you on this market? What are your strengths? What are your weaknesses? Is your offer well positioned? Is does it have what it needs to solve a problem? And in the few years after that, it's just been a constant iteration and pruning and refining to the point where I entirely dropped the design side, which I now keep as a personal, not a hobby, but you know, like some personal outlets, but a personal expressive outlet. Yeah. And focus for the very most part on just selling strategy.

Zoe Greenhalf 13:37

I I love that you have been on this whole journey, especially. My God, I I just had this vision of you as a as a as a child being like with all your family sat there around their spreadsheets, and you with your paintbrushes, like, no.

Silvia Coco 13:50

No, there used to be a TV program because I'm uh born Italian, didn't wasn't raised in Italy until high school, so I was raised in France. But there was this TV show, which I don't know if there was also in the UK called Art Attack. Yes. Okay, cool. You loved that show. I love that show, and my mom would call it every time I took out a pencil, like whatever creative, crafty item. She would say, Oh my god, here she goes with her heart attack. Because she would get the heart attack of like, oh my god, it's gonna get messy. So I was in pottery, I painted, I drew, I built some woodwork. I'm I'm the person that has like all the hobby and craft like things in boxes, right? Like I tried it all. So I was always. I love that though.

Zoe Greenhalf 14:42

You know how many people like don't allow themselves to try all of the things and then wonder why they have a crisis when they get to their sort of middle-age years, going, Oh, I don't really know what I want anymore. Sometimes I think it's just because when they were a bit younger, they didn't actually try all the things. So they've still got no idea. But it feels much harder at that point to go, okay, I'll just start creating because it might feel good. It's like, well, no, that's just frivolous and a waste of time.

Silvia Coco 15:12

Um, and maybe it doesn't even feel good because as a child, when you start creating, you're not thinking about what's it gonna look like. It's play. As adults, we put judgment before that play. So there's a you don't even start if you're not gonna master it. Um, this isn't applied to everybody, right? But but generally, there's a little bit of that. Oh, what it's gonna take me like six years to really be good at sewing, it's not worth it.

Zoe Greenhalf 15:42

We add this barrier of perfectionism and output, and so it's it's that productivity culture as well, isn't it? You know, everything needs to be that there needs to be a productive reason behind everything. And when you can enter into the headspace of I'm just gonna have a gut making this thing because it might feel good, it's so different, isn't it?

Finding Alignment And Packaging Value

Silvia Coco 16:07

Yeah, it's funny that you said that though, because maybe I'm not um well, I no, I do have a little bit of that high productivity in me for sure, but and even more so, I was always the kid, like as since I was a kid, that was thinking about can I sell this? Really? That's interesting. Maybe it was less about the judgments or if is it good or bad, but it's like will it be marketable? Will someone interesting? Did you ever get to the point of selling things that you were making? Oh yeah, oh yeah. I definitely I I was always in competitions as a child, maybe more so than than um than selling it, but like for for pottery or for drawing, even for grant for French orthography. That's crazy. Um, I was never a writer though. Um but uh as I grew into a teenager or and then as an adult, when you have the most, you know, freedom about earning and and having a business, um, I was always having sides. I was always thinking like whether it's a print on a t-shirt or embroidery or an item, a collectible, or some what jewelry. I was always thinking, can I sell this? Where? To whom? How do I market it? So it was always definitely in me, like the desire to be autonomous and to be an uh entrepreneur is always part of my nature, I would say.

Zoe Greenhalf 17:41

Yeah. And how do you find it now? You're running your business, um, you're you're able to be creative, but with strategy, you're able to kind of pull these experiences together. Do you feel like you're in a place where finally things have come together in a way that feel good and feel aligned?

Silvia Coco 18:02

Yeah, for sure. I think it's taken years. I would say it's like my entire journey leads to where I am today. Yeah. Um, it it was not visible to me at the time, like it took an evolution to see it. But now I think I'm really tapping into what I'm I'm meant to do. And I feel it's right also because I listen to the the feedback, not as in any reviews or anything, but if I have a conversation and something clicks and people tell me, like, oh, oh yeah, oh you're good at that. Oh, oh yeah, that makes sense. Right? Like those little hints tell me that comes so easy to me, almost like it feels like magic. It feels like I'm tapping into some universal connection that flows through me, right? And that makes me feel like, okay, it's this is bigger than me. There, there's something in my brain that's wired to do this. Now the effort is more so how do I structure it? How do I package a structure around myself so that I can tap into this like day in and day out, whenever I'm because I can enter into that, into any conversation, but how to sell it has been my sort of my work of the last year. Like, how how does this become a business?

Zoe Greenhalf 19:23

Yeah, because we started this conversation with the sense that you found it hard to put yourself into a box and you've got to a point where you don't want to be putting yourself into a box, but in a certain context, that box is almost necessary to be able to communicate clearly what you do. So, how do you navigate that situation?

Silvia Coco 19:43

Well, a lot of it is accepting that you're flexible, you don't have to also set yourself in stone. There's different spaces for different conversations. Something that I often say is you're the common point between all those things. Like if you do 10 different things, guess what's in common? You're doing them. So if if you if everything has to is the if the source is you, it means you can wiggle yourself in different channels, you you can find different ways to explain your story. The source is still authentic, it's still you. You you are the common point within. So when I'm in certain spaces, I lean into certain topics. So for example, if I'm talking about uh branding, right? If I'm starting a conversation with somebody that's telling me, oh, I don't know that my brand looks aligned with who I am. I don't know if I'm representing myself well. I start from there and then we unpack. Sometimes the starting point is more, like I said before, a conversation about what I'm selling and what I want to do feels out of place. And so I start from there. Other times it can be, I'm always busy, I feel successful, but I cannot, I reached a roof. I don't know how to go beyond that. That's the starting point. It doesn't matter that those sound like three different conversations at the start. But when you go on pack and the process of understanding where's the obstacle, that's in common. Like the content changes, but what I'm trying to do is the same is asking you the right questions to help lead you to your answers and and and to figure out what was in your way and how can we remove it. And then that's the strategy, right? It's what's there, how do we get you moving again? And how do you get past the plateau, for example? How do you get past an obstacle? Beautifully said.

Rebel Reset: Cut Through The Fog

Zoe Greenhalf 21:47

In which case, what are some of the most common obstacles that you come across when you when you meet people? And I mean, that could be in the context of they're already your client, or it could be people that you meet that you think are this potential. Potential here to be able to help them. Do you find that there are a lot of kind of common problems and you're kind of seeing the same themes coming up?

Retreat Insights: Dreaming Bigger

Silvia Coco 22:08

Well, a common problem, I would say, is people that are passionate, they have a vision of what they would like for themselves. And they maybe understand, if they're ready to work with me, they understand that there's something in their way to that vision. So a sense of there's fog about I'm not sure what's why I'm stuck. Or um, yes, like I can get past something and I don't understand why, like everything seems successful, but for some reason I'm stuck. Or um, you know, I there's this disalignment, but I don't have the answer, or I cannot help myself alone find the answer. So that's definitely a common pattern, like getting you from A to B, and you don't know how to write a roadmap. Another common problem is that micro enterprises, when they're at the stage of being just one person, are very lonely and can only get you so far. So another common topic that we discuss is how can you find partners, collaborators, complementary channels, support around you to build yourself up, which doesn't always mean hire. Sometimes it's a it's an open partnership, uh, you know, how if I have a service that is complementary to yours, how can we collaborate? Yeah. Or um, you know, uh you need marketing, for example, service like content creation services, and I need coaching, would you be willing to like exchange and barter these services for a little bit? Because then guess what? If if they're receiving coaching, they're working better, they're feeling better in their business. And if you're getting content, you're being more visible. Both of you are earning more, and now you build the foundation to be able to pay for the continuity of that service.

Zoe Greenhalf 24:10

Yeah, for sure.

Silvia Coco 24:11

So I help a lot in then once you're stable and once you identified your direction, first of all, that focus, that clarity gets you moving immediately because you're like, oh, now I know what I'm going after, and it changes everything. And the second is who do I want on this journey with me? Who are the cool people that can be on my side to accelerate, to keep going, to get to the next level?

Zoe Greenhalf 24:39

You know, I've been talking to so many people lately who feel a bit stuck, not broken or lost, but just caught in that weird in-between where you know that you're meant for more, but you just can't seem to get yourself moving. Um, and honestly, I get it because I've been there too. That's actually why I created something new called the Rebel Reset. It's a 90-minute session where we shake things up, we cut through the fog, and we get you moving again in a way that actually feels like you. So if you've been waiting for a sign or you're tired of ending the year feeling frustrated, this might be exactly what you need. You can just message me reset on Instagram, or you can reply directly via text through the show notes if you're curious. All right, back to the episode. You actually held your first retreat um only a few months ago, didn't you? Yes. How did it go?

Designing Goals Around Real Capacity

Silvia Coco 25:43

Oh, it was so good. It was a very intimate group, but being that it's the first, I am not surprised. And in fact, I loved it because it gave me space with my with my partner Romina, who was in, you know, this is something we built together to really explore and um and enjoy the moment without a little bit of logistic panic, right? Because when you have a bigger group, there's there's a lot of little details. So we loved a small intimate setting. And it, I think it went really well in the moment. It was very intense because the retreat was about reviewing the year past and and how to set the goals to reach your vision for the year ahead. Yeah. And we had exercises that were about really tapping into what are you dreaming about. And for for a couple people, the the shift was what are you allowing yourself to dream about? And breaking even that roof that we put on our head of what's possible for us, what are we even allowed to dream for, is a bit, you know, shakes you a little bit in your thought because you're not you're thinking that you're coming and putting down events in your calendar, you know, and you think that you're gonna come and have a clearer to-do list, and then there's these two women that are telling you that you need to dream bigger or and and mind you, bigger, not as in everybody needs to build a big business with a hundred employees. Yeah, bigger means don't keep yourself small out of fear. Yes. So it was really interesting. And a month after um those two people came back, one of them was uh a woman who, to reach certain goals that were a little bit bigger, needed support with childcare. And she was a bit worried that that would have, you know, a repercussion in her part with a partner or that she wasn't ready for it because it's an expense. And so we helped her reshift that as like, no, it's an investment. Because if you have more time for yourself and you know, to dedicate to your business, not only will you pay back that childcare, but you'll also be able to leverage that extra um support to reinvest in other things and keep growing with your business. A couple of months back, she came saying, Oh, yeah, as soon as uh we got past the holidays, I had the conversation. My partner immediately said yes. So, first of all, she it was all in her head that she would have, you know, uh backlash from that. Um, but also she was really happy that that that time earned she could put back into her business and she was fulfilled. Win-win.

Zoe Greenhalf 28:29

Amazing. Yeah, sometimes it just takes that external person to put a new perspective on something, doesn't it? And just allow you to see what you either can't see or you're refusing to see for yourself.

Silvia Coco 28:42

Yeah. And the in general, taking a moment to reflect on your journey and being guided through what you want with an external guidance can be so powerful because we can also get really busy, especially around end of year, start of year, really busy, really wrapped up in promises, you know, that you that we make ourselves for the year ahead. Then you never respect them or you fall off track. So this was a space to rethink how you set goals, you know, give you the tools to design in a more sustainable way from the get-go, what you're aiming for. Not the revenue goal, but what is work that is aligned with my real capacity. Like, like, let's let's break down how much time I really have in my week and how am I spending it on client delivery and on sales and on marketing and all the operations that my business needs, right? Because otherwise, you're yeah, it's like wanting to have the Barbie body just because you think that's your vision of the ideal, and not taking into account, you know, your how you're eating and how often can you actually go to the gym and what your body shape is, and you know, all those other factors.

Zoe Greenhalf 29:58

Yeah. I'm so glad you brought that up because you know, the key word there is design. And this is how I hope to inspire people with these conversations. We get to design beyond just our businesses, we actually get to design our lives the way we want to. But I think the key to anything like that is setting those intentions, like being intentional about what those goals are, what those steps are, and then taking the subsequent action. But it's the kind of yes, you can design it, and here are the intentions that you're then gonna like implement.

Silvia Coco 30:40

Right. Find again the real motivation that's gonna guide you in the long term, not the you know, the quick fix or the quick serton and boost to get you going at the start, and then when you don't see the results, you give up. Like some goals are are right to be broken into small wins and small reward, you know, small moments of celebration. But that's not the only motivator that's gonna keep you going. You have to have a deep, deep understanding of who you are, what you want, and it's just gonna be so much more powerful than the small celebration.

Zoe Greenhalf 31:19

Yeah. So if I was to then put that back to you and ask you what your goals are for maybe for this year, and what's your driving force behind what you do? How would you respond?

Podcast Experiments And Production Truths

Silvia Coco 31:33

Well, instead of having all the start-of-year promises, it's been a few years that I only work with one keyword. And it's fun you said intentionality before because that's actually my keyword. Oh, is it? There you go. It is for 2026 because I'm a person with so many interests and the generative impulse of creativity, of wanting to always start something new and always wanting to be involved in something different, um, can be very dispersive. This maybe is my guiding word for 2026. Now that I think I found something to tap into that's so powerful for me to stay a little bit more focused, which I'm learning now three months into the year, um, that doesn't mean less creative. It just means that my creativity is less dispersed into very different channels. So there's there's like one topic, which is okay, this is going to be my focus of interest, but it can take different nuances, right? So if my support, my work is to support small entrepreneurship, what in one way is through my co-pilot services, and another way is showing up in communities where I find a type of people, and another way is doing my podcasts, in other ways it's uh establishing collaborations with other people that are supporting the same target audience, but it all compounds towards the same topic.

Zoe Greenhalf 32:59

I love that as a word as well, because it does, like you say, just help kind of keep that focus. Um, I'm glad you brought up the podcast as well, because how how many episodes have you released now of that? No, I it's it's yet to be released.

Silvia Coco 33:12

I have recorded eight. Okay. I've recorded eight. Here's the thing: I love talking on the podcast, I love bringing in the guests, I'm loving the production. There's a buck coming. The edit. Oh my it's not even hard. It's not a question of hard, it's a question of sitting back with the post-production that's just not where I flow is not where my magic happens. So I need to release it because it's too good to stay on my hard drive. Uh, but I have to say, for understanding this, this is such a great experiment. And I don't know if you ever heard of Tiny Experiments by Anne-Laure Lecon. Yeah, it's a great book. So I started the podcast like this. It's like, okay, I just know that I'm into podcasts. Um, and this is great advice for anybody listening in. Like this technique to get into moving forward with an idea without being stuck in perfectionism, what we were saying before a little bit, like going with the play aspect without being blocked by the output aspect. Um, so I started podcast because I thought, oh, it's such a good medium. It's gonna give me so much content, it's gonna feel effortless because I am, you know, chit-chatty. Um, and it's gonna put me in front of cool people, like it's win-win. So I started, I recorded it, and then December hit when I needed to edit the podcast, got busy, as everybody you know, it's the holidays, the silly timing, no problem. I'll do it in January. And then I edited one and I was like, oh my god, I think I will still edit and release this mini series because, like I said, for the respect of my guests and because they're too cool to not, you know, to hide those conversations away. Yeah. But for 2026, I understood, okay, I don't want my own production, I want to be a guest, or I want to be interviewing for somebody else's production. And that has quote unquote manifested for me. I'm speaking with other guests or with other hosts, because well, guess what? Now I'm positioning to be a guest, and so when I introduce myself, like, oh, I love podcasts. Well, do you have a podcast? Oh, how cool! I'd love to be here. So, like that, that's a true, genuine, like authentic pleasure for me. Yeah. And thank you for having me. Um, and the other is that because people have heard teasers of my podcast or have heard me being um a guest on some other podcasts, now somebody has reached out to me saying, Hey, do you want to do a series for our brand where you're the host, but we take care of all the editing?

Changing Minds: Letting Go Of Illustration

Zoe Greenhalf 36:06

So wow, this intentionality is really working for you, I think. Yes, it's the power of clarity, honestly. You know, you've you've kind of set the scene. I've got this multi-passionate, very talented person in front of me. But what have you changed your mind about over the years? Because I know that your career has been a culmination of lots of different things. Have you had any things in your life, major milestones, or things that have made you go, no, uh completely, I've changed my mind about that.

Silvia Coco 36:40

Well, yeah, I mean, as an illustrator, I've come to understand. So when I was trying to, you know, strategy is just part of my value proposition, and I'm just you know it's the it's a cool add-on that differentiates me from other designers and illustrators. At some point, I realized that I could take feedback and pushback on advice or or consultancy I was giving, but I was not capable of taking pushback on my designs. And so there's a point where I realized, okay, I don't think that I can be an illustrator as a profession because it hurts me so deeply, like at a very personal level, if I'm releasing a design and the client says, no, actually change all the blue, make it green. I like, oh my God, this, I cringe. I it's no, I don't, and you cannot imagine the number, if I think about it, the number of projects I've done that I was repulsed by releasing into the world that are not in my portfolio because I'm like, no, I've just been the hands to somebody else's eyes, and I don't like what they're seeing in it. I don't like, I do not want my name to be associated with that. It's not that the client wasn't happy. I delivered to satisfy my clients and I was earning money, but I could not, I had nothing to put in my portfolio 98% of the time that I felt really good about. And so I was like, no, this cannot be my this cannot be my profession because it's too frustrating. I am probably more of a fine artist and a commercial illustrator. I'm somebody that needs to have their collection, you know, their their work put in a gallery, and then buyers come loving what they see, right? Yeah. But at that stage, I wasn't in a place or it felt scary to find an agent or to find a gallerist. And so because I had the strategy aspect of me going strong, and because I enjoyed, I had some really good clients, and like, yeah, I was doing a lot of designs for like weddings and things like that, where compared to any other industry, weddings are super fun because people want something beautiful. They're not thinking return on investment. And so I started shifting and taking more of those. There's been a whole segment of my career where where I was doing party gifts and like those types of designs. I then moved um to Switzerland and I pivoted again because it was getting difficult to produce import and expert materials. And so that forced me into a shift towards service rather than product. Um, and it's just funny how life just you know, I was very good always at adapting and finding another little pivot, but but for sure a big disruptive moment was that understanding that illustration could not be a profession.

Zoe Greenhalf 39:59

Wow. Does the illustration feel like you had to kind of let go of a bit of a dream? Or are you not that sentimental about it?

Selling, Ethics And Delegating Money Talks

Silvia Coco 40:08

I had to give up an identity. Not a dream, like a dream for sure, because I wanted to be, you know, a creative person, but it was really something that at the time thought, you know, this is who I am. I I fought so hard. I stood up against my family. I had already been plenty mischievous to be able to say, oh, I'm an illustrator by profession. Like, you know, it it's it takes a lot of courage, of grit. It's not easy to be in a creative profession. Um especially when, yeah, like when you're a crafter of some sort, right? When you produce art in some way, because it is seen as something that is not about function, and so it's harder to sell. Yes. And yeah, at the same time, I know we talked about this a little bit um off record, but it's funny how now, as somebody that sells strategy, I'm even thinking, oh man, it was so easy to sell design.

Zoe Greenhalf 41:15

How the tables have turned, huh?

Silvia Coco 41:18

Yeah, exactly. So always think when you think it's hard, oh always think that from another perspective. It's actually easy. If money was no object, what do you what do you think you would be doing? Oh, I would open like free office hours and be a mentor. I I would do what I and I think that's another thing that makes me convinced that I'm on the right path. I would do what I do now with no price tag. I could do this constantly. It's just it just flows out of me. It makes me happy, it charges my batteries. It's actually hard. I'm now looking into a partnership with somebody that can be some sort of a business developer for me or some sort of a, you know, as an illustration, as a creative person, would have been like a studio manager. Now I don't know what they would be. I don't know a title for myself. How am I gonna find a title? Somebody sales. But I almost want to delegate the money part entirely, the contracts and the and the and the pricing discussion, because for me it comes from such a point of passion that it's difficult to have the money conversation. That's that's a whole other interesting topic and about you know, removing the ick from selling and and how can you be authentic? And for me, it is really about I'm only gonna sell you something that I think is useful to you and helpful.

Zoe Greenhalf 42:36

Yeah.

Defining A Dream Client And Impact

Silvia Coco 42:37

And so I only engage into a sales conversation if it comes from a like if the starting point is I think it can help you. And that that's sort of my ethics. That being said, I could probably negotiate better on bigger projects or on bigger, you know, when a company calls me to do strategy advising or things like that, or that's where I would love to delegate somebody to do the negotiation for me. Yeah, for sure. Who do you think your dream client would be? My dream client is not necessarily the best paying one. My dream client is the woman that's going through a moment of realizing that she can take her life back in control, her business back in control, and bring it to meet the dream life that she wants. Like to me, that's the coolest outcome is if I've helped somebody bring freedom back in their life because their work supports their passion, their financial, their financial needs, and the type of life they want to live. If we've achieved that, I have made it.

Zoe Greenhalf 43:50

Oh my god. So much synergy here. It's unreal.

Silvia Coco 43:56

No, it's so fulfilling. It's so fulfilling to. Be able to say, Oh, I was part into this person's happiness, like finding their purpose, finding their journey. And they another thing that I really go by is I'm not into the business of making a client dependent on me. I've I've met my goal. If you're off and satisfied and strong, doesn't mean you can never call me back, right? But my goal is to make it capable to walk on your own legs and to have the team that's gonna help you succeed and go help the next person.

Zoe Greenhalf 44:36

Yeah.

Silvia Coco 44:37

Uh and when that happens, when you see somebody that goes off and says, like, oh my god, yes, I got this, ah, the sense of fulfillment is so big. There's no price tag on that.

Consistency Without Self-Punishment

Zoe Greenhalf 44:50

I love it when um I've been working with clients and they come back to me and they tell me about the action that they took. Because so often they're stuck in that weird place of like, oh, I don't know what to do, or I know what to do, I'm just not doing it. And then you go through some mentoring or some coaching with them, and then suddenly they come back and they go, I did that thing, and you're like, oh my god, this is fantastic as an outcome. Because you know that action then um, you know, it creates momentum, and if they can keep that momentum going, that's when they're gonna make progress. And I personally, there's nothing more rewarding for me than that sense of, oh my god, I helped them get to that point and get off the start line and launch that thing, and you know, but it's find the yeah, yeah, find the courage or find the yeah, like the connect the dots to see that it's possible and it's within reach. I love that. Yeah, absolutely. It has been absolutely wonderful talking to you again, and um, I can't wait for these podcast episodes to be released, so no pressure, but exactly I need I I must do it.

Silvia Coco 46:04

It's a work in progress. I have the first one pretty much like ready to go. So I'm deciding actually here a little advice for podcast creators. Do you think it's better to have them all edited and released one after the other, or should I just put the first one out? And then when it's out, just you know, let it be out and do the second one, and I'm ready for it. You want the honest answer? Yes, the honest answer and open to a little bit of live coaching.

Delusional To Done: From Idea To Action

Zoe Greenhalf 46:34

Well, the stat the industry answer would be get yourself a trailer and three episodes ready to go and put them all out so that people discover you with the trailer, but then have a chance to kind of binge a few episodes and really get to know you and get excited about the following episodes. That's um what I've heard to be sort of standard podcast practice, okay. Then you have a question over whether you want to release weekly and stay on top of the editing every week, or whether you want to edit them all in one go and release them every week as a series. But if you do that, you could be looking at months before they actually get out the door. So I think if you're keen to just get these conversations heard, maybe go for that middle ground of have a little a short trailer and a few episodes that you can just put out. Yeah. You don't necessarily have to commit to weekly, you could also drop them the following ones every two weeks if you want to. I think the biggest thing is you you get to make your own rules and you get to be intentional about the way you want this to be shaped. So make it fit with how it feels good to you in your life because I um am quite often frantically editing for I I edit over the weekend quite often, and then I need the episode to go out on a Monday night. And it doesn't always happen. Last week life just got in the way, and the episode went out on Wednesday.

Silvia Coco 48:15

Oh my uh 48 hours late.

Zoe Greenhalf 48:18

And I'm like, that's just life. That is just life. And I am not, you know, Joe Rogan or um yeah, you don't have a team editing for you. So I don't have a team, but I also don't have a huge massive following, and I'm not gonna come up against all these angry people, like, where was my episode? I didn't get to listen on my Monday commute. Everybody's just like, oh, cool, an episode came up. Wow, great, you know.

Silvia Coco 48:41

That's a great point because I think there's a lot of bias of feeling seen, feeling, you know, a lot of people are worried about committing to things. Um, I had a client who was worried because she was producing a newsletter, just like, oh, but what if I don't post on that regular day? Okay, so don't call it like Monday motivation and then send it on a Thursday. But if you if it's just your newsletter, I guarantee we're getting our inboxes full, everybody's busy. The one person who remembers that your newsletter should have come is probably a supporter. It's probably somebody that's gonna write, hey, how are you doing? I sorry you missed the newsletter. Everything okay?

Zoe Greenhalf 49:22

Yes, that's so true. That's so true. Yeah, and that's such good advice. If there's anybody thinking about doing that, you know, newsletters, launching something, starting a podcast. Um, yeah, I do think you're right there. The people who notice are the people who actually like really care about that thing that you've done and are gonna be also very understanding when it doesn't hit the day that you said it was going to. So exactly. So, yeah, I'll be interested to find out what you've what you decide. But I think the only thing I would suggest is just as much as you can get it to fit in with the way you want to run your life because sometimes these passion projects have a habit of taking over if you're not careful.

Silvia Coco 50:04

I think I will follow your advice of the three ones out, get a little bit of motivation from being happy that the first three are out and seeing the first you know, listeners, that probably will motivate me for the rest. And then I'm I chose already that I will probably not go into further solo production and and maybe partner with people for production. So that's good. Thank you very much. I will have to go edit. And any by the way, if anybody hears all the way to here and wants to see if it's out, the podcast is called delusional to done. So I love that.

Zoe Greenhalf 50:48

We didn't even talk about that. You have you you have been on LinkedIn saying delusional to done with all your ideas, like just quickly explain what that is because it's such a wonderful concept, and I think it really might help people get off the start line. Yeah.

The Power Of The Messy Middle

Silvia Coco 51:04

Well, delusional to me, it's uh it's actually a bit positive in the in the whimsical, mischievous way, right? Like, dream to a point where other people think that it's so unachievable, it's so crazy, it's so out there that they might label you as delusional. I label myself a little bit delusional, like I dream so big that I know I take into account that some stuff is probably gonna fall off as I go. But delusional to done wants to be a positive message of you can allow yourself to have those big dreams, to be playful, to enjoy the process and get them to done. Maybe not everything, that's not the point, but the few things that will stick and the fact that you will have done them will be so reassuring and give you so much self-confidence and so much pleasure in the process that you know you'll just keep dreaming, you'll just keep being a big dreamer and just you'll just keep thinking that things are possible for you.

Zoe Greenhalf 52:06

I love that. And I love reading your content and on LinkedIn because of that and the updates. And it's like, this is what I'm doing, this is what I've done. And you're very good at sharing that, you know, you're you're you don't shy away from the messy middle of, okay, I'm planning this out with post-it notes, and here we go. This is what's on the schedule for this week. Am I gonna do it? Tune in next time and find out, you know. I love that. It's so it's so real though, isn't it? That's it's it's not the glossy, perfect, I've built this whole thing. It's you know, come with me while I figure this out. And and I think that that really embodies the personality that you bring to founders because you're right in the, as you call it, the pilot seat. You're the co-pilot, you're in there getting dirty with them, figuring all the stuff out. Yeah, exactly.

Silvia Coco 52:51

Thank you for saying that. It's it's right, it's spot on. It's exactly that. Like the the messy middle is all of the journey. You have a starting point, a messy middle, and then you're right. So why scare away? Why pretend like everything is perfect? There's moments that we can celebrate reaching milestones, and then there's all the in-between of that, which to me is never failure if there's a learning, you know. If you can take something away from it, it's just part of the messy middle.

Zoe Greenhalf 53:25

So um, just to finish up then, where can everybody connect with you? Where do you like to hang out?

Connect With Silvia

Silvia Coco 53:32

Well, like you said, I mostly hang out on LinkedIn. I am trying to be a little bit more present on Instagram. So I think if you find I am underscore Sylvia, uh should come up. But on LinkedIn, Sylvia Coco, and you'll find me. Please come and connect. I'm happy to always be in touch with new people. And I trust that networking is so powerful. You never know, you know, what the next person can bring to your table. Um, so I'm always open for conversation. And I think, yeah, the podcast, when it comes out, go find out. Maybe it's live yet. I love that. Thank you, Sylvia, so much. Thank you for having me. It was a delightful conversation.

Final Chapters And Staying Connected

Zoe Greenhalf 54:20

So, for the last time on this podcast, here's my rebellious roundup of what we talked about. Number one, if you're finding it hard to figure out a label to explain what you do, consider Sylvia's approach and treat it like a conversation starter. It's not a definition, it's just to get people through the door. Number two, sometimes a job can sound great on paper but feel very different in reality. So I have a lot of respect for Sylvia since she recognized this and courageously took the leap into freelancing. If you are in corporate and quietly suffering inside, maybe this is the sign you needed to consider a different path with more alignment and definitely less family politics or office gossip. Three, listen to your feedback. It will provide you with clues about where your own strengths lie. Four, flexibility and adaptability are your friends. In the same way that we were advised to tailor our CVs to specific job roles, we can also customize each conversation when it comes to explaining what we do. Remember that you're the common point between all of those things. Five, entrepreneurship can feel very lonely. So if you are on that journey, think about how you can bring collaborators, communities, and complimentary channels into your business. This doesn't mean hiring somebody, but it could look like a partnership or a skill swap, which is mutually beneficial. 6. If you're a fellow multipassionate, try choosing one word, one topic, or simply a theme for the year, not to restrict your creativity, but to harness its power and direct it at something with more focus. 7. If you're sitting on an idea but struggling to get started, take the pressure off and treat it like a tiny experiment. And Laura Lecumff has written a great book about this with the same name, Tiny Experiments. Number eight, it's okay if the rhythm of your content or creative practice isn't always 100% punctual. And whilst it is true that striving for excellence and consistency is important, nobody dies if your blog or a newsletter makes it out the door a little late. The important thing is that you bounce back. Number nine, be delusional about your dreams. If you are delusional, you are keeping your positivity, you are thinking big, and you are keeping yourself open to possibilities. And finally, number 10, remember that the messy middle can be a fun place to be despite the obstacles and uncertainty. Often the lessons are learned right there in the in-between. Wait, hang on. Before I go, a quick note. As this podcast moves towards its final chapters, the best place to stay connected is my mailing list. That's where I'll share what's unfolding next when it's ready to be shared, without noise and without rushing. You can also find me on LinkedIn, where I'm still very much around and thinking out loud in public. There is something new taking shape behind the scenes, but I'm giving it the space to fully form before I speak about it properly. If you're curious, patient, and happy to sit in the in-between with me, you'll be in the right place. Thanks for being here, and I will speak to you again soon.