EP 009 Lisa Baskott Talks About Why Womens Safety needs to be Center Stage

Lisa talks about the evocative moment during the week of Sarah Everard's death that things changed for her, and why women's safety needs stronger focus for the night time economy. Women and girls continue to face sexual harassment and are subjected to the highest reported figures for their drinks being spiked. Lisa talks about her involvement in the bigger much needed solutions.

Prior to starting 2nd Line of Defence, Lisa had a 20-year career in B2B media, specialising in publishing, tv, online and mobile advertising. She left advertising in 2014 to pursue her passion for property development. Lisa set up and continues to run her own property business buying, renovating and selling period properties in the UK.

As part of a commitment to serving her community, Lisa has been a serving Magistrate for 10 years; she sits as a Presiding Justice in both the Adult and Youth Magistrates Courts in Sussex.  In October 2021, Lisa was appointed by Lady Justice Simler, Chair of the Judicial Diversity Committee, to be one of 7 newly appointed regional Inclusion and Diversity Magistrates (IDM). She represents the SE of England. IDM’s contribute to a range of diversity work within the judiciary to provide a source of good equality and diversity practice for their colleagues. 

Lisa became a qualified Security Industry Authority (SIA) licensed door supervisor in September 2021. Since then she has worked as part of security teams covering special events at the Hilton Brighton Metropole and The Grand Brighton hotel, including the Labour Party Conference (September 2021). 

Most recently, Lisa has been named as one of 100 most influential businesswomen in the UK.The f:Entrepreneur #ialso100 campaign highlights, champions and celebrates 100 inspirational female entrepreneurs across the UK who are wearing many hats and doing many inter-connecting roles, with a specific focus on community and sustainability.

Lisa relocated from South East London to Hove in February 2021 with her 2 children; Eva and Jack.

https://2ndlineofdefence.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lisa-baskott-116398241/

Security Circle ⭕️  is an IFPOD production for IFPO the International Foundation of Protection Officers

Transcript

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Hi, this is Yolanda. Welcome. This is an IF POD production for ifpo, the very first security podcast called Security Circle. If PO is the International Foundation for Protection Officers, we are dedicated to providing meaningful education and certification for. levels in security, and make a positive difference to our members mental health and wellbeing. Join us and our special guests as we delve into all of the matters, security related that matter to you. Find us@www.ifpo.org. Well, hi, welcome again Today to the Security Circle podcast, I have a very special guest with me. Prior to starting second line of defense, her business, Lisa has had a 20 year career in business to business media. and she's also a presiding justice in both adult and youth magistrates courts in Sussex. Chair of the Judicial Diversity Committee to be one of seven newly appointed regional inclusion and diversity magistrates. She represents the southeast of England most recently. Also, Lisa has been named one of the most 100 influential businesswomen in the uk. Wow. What can I say? Welcome to Security Circle Podcast, Lisa Bascott. Thank you very much, Shao. Thanks for having me. I'm thrilled. Thanks. Well, listen, it's a pleasure. We had a great conversation this weekend, and I have to say, I can't wait to hear your story again. So first of all, let's get to find out what drew you to the security industry. Yeah, well, I, I think I'm an accidental security person if you put, if you wanna put it that way. and I've been asked that question many a time. But, for me, the catalyst for starting my business, second line at defense, I can remember the event, very clearly. I had at the end of February, 2021 just relocated from Southeast London where I'm from. Where's my two children, Eva and Jack. And, I was on pretty, pretty high excited about my new location by the sea and was just kind of getting on with, filling out the house and doing stuff as you do. And, and it's really odd. I, I don't normally watch daytime tv, but something told me to turn the tele on that day. And unfortunately when I did what was plastered across As a news bulletin that day was the disappearance of a young woman in Clapham in South London. Now, this truck a chord with me because Clapham, south London is my hometown. I'm born and bred there, and it transpired that this missing person was a young woman called Sarah Everett. And within a couple of days so this happened. Sort of the news bulletin was within two weeks of me leaving London and within a couple of days of seeing that first news bulletin there was an announcement that was made on the 9th of March saying that they'd arrested a police officer for her kidnapping, rape, and brutal murder. That, that incident changed my, the course of my life essentially and has subsequently led to the establishment of my business. I, as a woman and as a magistrate, found the information that, was coming out about this particular. Horrible incident resonating with me in so many different ways. As a, as a law enforcer, I couldn't get my head around the fact that it was a police officer who abused trust in such a heinous way as a young woman. A little girl who was born and bred in her only, but. And nothing but wonderful memories of Clapham and Clapham common and having time with my family there, I couldn't put the two together. It was just really difficult for me. And I remember being angry. Do you want me to be absolutely honest? I was absolutely enraged that in the 21st century, still women are being brutalized in this way and in particular in this instance by someone who. In a position of trust and is supposed to be safeguarding people. It was particularly horrible to hear that he flashed his badge during the pandemic and that's probably the only reason why she got into the car and persuaded her that she was breaking lockdown rules and that, She needed to go with him, and this was a girl who he, she followed all the rules. She left her friend's house at a decent hour. She was wearing flat shoes. She walked on the, the bright side of the road where it was well lit. She called her boyfriend on the way home to notify him. That she was on her way home and was making plans with him. All of the things that we tell are female friends or our young, daughters or aunts or whatever. These, these are all the things as, as in particular as a woman, we're told subliminally and, and not that we have to do. And she did all of them, but nothing was gonna save her that night. I, I remember at that point thinking that this is unacceptable. Women have the right to be out at night, be their true, authentic selves, walk as walk along the street without the fear of being harmed. And we need, as a society, we need to start taking stock and doing something about this. And that's essentially what I decided to do. been a mother of two children, one daughter, soon to be 16. She's very close to that age where she's going to be, wanting to shout from the rooftops about how she wants to be her true, authentic self. She'll be of a legal age to start drinking and going out, and I need to be sure as a mother that the environment that she finds in herself in is going to be the safest. Possible, and I've, I've recognized that there is. A huge gap particularly within the frontline security industry of the right type of individual and training being offered up for people in those roles. It needs to change. There's a huge disconnect between the people who are manning those doors essentially, and the audience. Coming through them. And there needs to be a change in the narrative around what it means to offer security in those environments. And I, I believe we need to move away from the idea of securing premises and move towards. The really important message of looking after people, facilitating people's nights out, and ensuring and safeguarding individuals in those situations, we need to change the narrative, and that is only going to come about. I've decided through seismic Change. In the industry at that level, cultural systemic change across the board so that we can start having an open conversation about all the changes that need to happen. So yeah, this is where I find myself at the moment. listen, I, I, I think we need you. I remember, I remember when the news of Sarah Everard hit the, hit the press, and, I, I remember. Massively emotionally provocative. It was. And I remember seeing women who had just gone there in an open space to, yes, during covid times, but very safely cuz everybody was taking meas measured precautions. I, I saw how some of them were treated and I saw how the media portrayed that and, I don't know if that Lisa, there's a part of me that thinks, had that not happened, maybe she wouldn't have got so much coverage. I don't know. But it was, it was difficult because that incident around Sarah affected that local community, didn't knit very deeply. Massively. So, and, and, and you're right. I mean, as I said, I remember standing in my living room watching the news feature about this person being missing, and there was a rising sense of feeling of fear and panic because I, I knew that she wasn't gonna be found alive. Just knew it. And then to see the response of the Metropolitan Police to peaceful gatherers who were mainly women, but for the first time, maybe that was the shock. It was one of their own, but it was also a group of women finally saying, enough is enough. This is, this, that culmination that, the, that Peaceful Pro protest on Clap and Common. Was about women for, for, for decades having to deal with issues like this. And I think that. It was A com. A com, a com. A combination of, the mood has changed within the last decade, 20 16, 20 17. The Me Too movement started off that kind of, we are not having this, in, in certain industries and it, it started to gather momentum and I think. Coupled with the change in the audience of the sort of people who are voicing out the millennials, the Gen Zs, who are demanding to be heard and have a different perspective on safety, on what it means to be safe and be allowed to. Be their true, authentic self without the fear of harm. And I think it's that societal sort of pivotal change along with, people finally, women finally saying, no, no, this is not good enough. What are we doing about it? What are we doing? What practical steps are we taking to make the life of women and other vulnerable groups? Because when I started this, It was from the perspective as a woman for sure, but very quickly in my time of doing research around this area, that scope widened and it widened to young people. It widened out to specific groups like the gay community and certain ethnic groups as well, and the. The, the time at which it is more likely than not that these people are going to be disproportionately affected by harmful behavior. And that nighttime community with drink and drugs, all of the things, poor lighting on streets, you name it. All of these things into a melting pot, will affect these groups more so than others. We, we, as a society, we need to be more proactive about the steps that we take to ensure that these people start their nights out as, as and they should end in the same way without fear of, harm. you get excited about going out in an evening. You get dressed up, you go out, you come home. You wouldn't be able to do all of that without issue essentially. But unfortunately, all too often, All of the precautions, particularly for these vulnerable groups is, is not a straightforward one. It really isn. So when we look at Sarah Everard, she hadn't been drinking had she, she was wearing sensible shoes. It was, I think a sensible time of the day. It wasn't something like, oh, she was out at an unusual hour. But look, let's talk about that because we are, we've, we were. young girls at, at one stage not too long ago. I like, I like to think but it's getting further or further away. But yeah. Mm-hmm. and I, and I get it, we had it drummed into our heads as little girls, to not walk down dark alleys. Those dark alleys still exist on social media, though. You just don't know whether you're in one or not. But Absolut. they, we were told to wear flat shoes so that you could run if you needed to. make sure that you cover yourself up. Try to walk like a man, try not to walk too much like a girl. And, and I just remember, I mean, they're all things that we've grown up with that men just don't seem to, to understand. You are gonna like this, but somebody that I used to work with very recently, a young person, recently transitioned from male to female, trans woman. Mm-hmm. And I supported them with their process and I, I definitely felt sometimes so deeply worried for them because when you emerge suddenly into society because this individual had been presenting as female outside of. but in work hadn't yet made that, communication and was presenting as male. Mm-hmm. My role was to support her with her work transformation. And in the process of her transformation in the workplace, we, we got to talking. what it was like for her and her age and had she faced a lot of prejudice and she said she hadn't, and I said, wonderful. It means that, things are getting better. Right? But the, the, the one thing she said to me that I'll never forget, she said to me, I understand white male privilege now. Right? Because when she presents a female in public, she feels less. and all of those things that we've been talking about that we, we were conditioned to think when we were young girls. All of a sudden she's all of a sudden needing to consider her safety and, and I was flawed by that. I'm thinking if only every, every wonderful man out there could understand that challenge, so absolutely. This has led to you, hasn't it? Going down a path of looking at nighttime economy and women's safety. Tell me what you did next. Yeah, so yeah, so the, so what, I started, as I say, I started to think about women's safety and myself in particular, and my daughter, my daughter Eva who's soon to be 16. She was, if you like, my muse because I kept thinking as her mother. Knowing that there was this time coming up really imminently where this young woman was going to be out, expressing herself and you know her right of passage and I wanted to know, help her on that path, but also ensure that whilst she was out there, Going to be as safe as she possibly could. But I knew I couldn't protect her, 24 7. So I started to look at the industry sector that I thought outside of the first line of the, the fence, the police the ambulance and the fire services outside of them. Who are we looking to essentially in those situations to look out for people? Well, it's those people within frontline security. And when I scratched beneath the surface of the industry itself, it didn't. Too long to realize that actually, oh my God. There's, there's an awful lot of work to be done here. We have roughly around 400,000 licenses that have been issued in the UK since about 2001 when the industry was regulated by the security industry authority. And I scratched beneath the surface and found that only. 8% of that number in 20 21, 22 are women. I I knew the number would be low, but I was absolutely flabbergasted by that number, especially an industry that's been regulated for over 20 years. I just, when I put that into context, and as I say to people when I speak to them, especially as a woman, 90 odd percent of the time when you go out, the person on the door does not look like you or represent you in any shape or form. Yeah. But more importantly, just a bit like what you've just sort of mentioned about that sort of. The cognizance around what it is like to be a woman, what it is like to be in a vulnerable position. Yeah. They have no understanding of the the journey, if you like, literally both physical and emotional journey that a woman or a vulnerable person takes when they leave the house, to the point of them going out and then having to navigate their way back home. Most men take for granted when they're invited out. They throw on their shoes, they throw on their jacket, and they head out the door. And as they're walking out the door, they're probably thinking about what they're gonna drink when they get to the bar. That's as far as it goes for a woman or for other vulnerable groups. It's a very, very different story. Now, whether some of these things are subliminal or they're actually front and, front of mind at the time when I get a phone call from my girlfriend or my friend about going out, apart from being really excited about it, it's what am I gonna wear? Is my skirt too short? Have I got appropriate shoes on? Am I going to be comfortable and be able to walk home comfortably if I need to, if I can't get transportation or get a taxi? And then when I get leave the house and I'm traveling to the bus stop or the taxi office, it's. What idiot is going to bother me because I look the way that I do. Who's going to make a comment about whether or not they think it's a good a, a, a positive one or not? Who is going to bother me on the way to the venue and when I get to the venue, how difficult is that door person going to be? right? How, how difficult is it gonna be? And once I'm in there, I then have to consider my drink, cover it up. Am I gonna be spiked? Someone gonna try and touch me up, or approach me in an unwanted way. And then if I even make it that far and get through to the end of the evening, it's all over again, but in reverse. But this time it's in an environment full of pissed drunken, agitated d. People at a time where it's the middle of the night, there's little or no transportation. If there are there huge cues. The roads are badly lit and it is a melting pot of trouble essentially waiting to happen. And if you're slightly inebriated and all of that thrown into the mix and the, the, the danger. That surrounds that individual. Now, if a person on a door is unable to. Empathize with that individual. When they reach that point, then we are in trouble. This is a difficult, difficult time that we are in and we need within this sector of the private security industry, we need to understand that our roles are not just about, standing in front of a door and deciding whether or not someone comes in. It's. Recognizing that you are there to facilitate someone's night out. Of course, your duty of care is not to allow someone into the establishment if they're intoxicated or if they've been taking drugs. Of course not. However, what we need to be able to show door staff is that they're up. Alternate ways of dealing with situations. It's not always about you are not coming in because often that is not going to be the appropriate response, and it may lead to really, really nasty consequences. Separating friends from each other isolating people and putting them. In an even more vulnerable situation. We need as an industry at that level to have a different approach to think about people and their different circumstances and the journeys they may or may not have had. on the way to that, that particular establishment. And we, think about it. We, we've, we've come from two years of being essentially nearly locked down with young people. There is a cohort that sort of embarked at Uni University, embarked upon the nightclub scene around September, 2021, having been locked down for nearly two years now. Their right of passage in terms of learning. Tolerance level around drink and drugs, let's face it. Right. They was an opportunity to do that. They were locked up at home and then the bloody doors opened and after they went, and my God, I was there. They were bloody feral and, and it was not their fault, right? They, it wasn't their fault they had. Opportunity to test the water to see what it was like. And also mixed in with that was an awful lot of inappropriate behavior because they've just never been shown the way, they've never been in that social context with drink and drugs all sort of sloshing around. Okay. And so there was an awful lot of sort of educating individuals in those scenarios, sort of taking them to one Sinai going, listen here my love. No. That's you. No, that's not right. So you know as well as sort of, hugging and, looking after them when they were feeling pretty sick and throwing up in toilets, there was an awful lot of having to sort of take them aside and just sort of talk to them about the scenario that they found themselves in and just kind of go, look, do you think it's appropriate? Would your sister or mother approve of you? Hand around that girl's neck in that way, even though you thought it was funny, you were having to laugh, and it, and, and it's a different world that we're in now. And so again, as a door supervisor in that situation, we need to have an understanding of where these guys are coming from. This is a different world. These are a different set of cohort that are now, and I, I listen, I, I think we are still waiting to see the real repercussions of some of that, the mental. Issues that will be affecting some of those young people. I think we're getting drips and drabs of it now, but I don't think we've seen the half of it. In terms of how that has had a huge effect on them and their lives. And again, as dual supervisors, we need to, when we, think much more holistically about our role in society and within, the, the shift that we happen to be working. And that night, our sponsor of this podcast, Tia digital solution limited. Offer a wide range of cross-industry it products, applications, and services to meet the global techniques of their customers. If you need CCTV systems, cameras, port switches for sock rooms, PKI, keys to name, but a few Tia digital solution is a solid and reliable vendor partner for you. Market leading brands include ubiquity networks. Tell Tanika Aruba, HPE Jabora Microtech and many more. Contact them at www.theinsightssolutions.com. so your passion for women's safety at night has led to you getting involved with other projects as well. Yeah, so you know the, there is sort of a, there is a sort of, if you like, a two-pronged approach. Approach to how I feel that. I need to tackle the changes that I think are necessary in this industry. The first was me obviously putting my money and my mouth first, and I decided, right, if I wanna see good door supervisors out there doing a great job, well then I'm gonna have to go and find them. So I set up my recruitment company and the recruitment company specializes in frontline security, but it has a special focus on women. It has a gender bias because why? Because there are only 8%. Of women representing this industry. And, and it's a shocking number and it that, that absolutely just needs to be addressed. But I recognize that in order to address that, I'm going to have to essentially be talking to a community of people that wouldn't ordinarily see themselves in this role. So whether it's a stay at home mom who wants to do. People working who's not quite ready to go back to work. Might be thinking about having another child, but just wants to get out there and get some pocket money or, members of the gig community, be they an Uber driver or a bricklayer who isn't earning enough money from their normal jobs or their everyday jobs, but needs, needs to stop up. And let's face it in the. Economy that we're, we we're in at the moment, that that could go almost for, for everyone and anyone. I, I've said the good community, but this affects lots of people, nurses, paramedics, you name it, and it's about offering them that flexibility. And that additional income stream. But in, for women in particular, it's about saying to them the narrative, showing them how much the narrative needs to change and how much I believe that they are part of the solution to the problem. So we want to see more women there. Well, we need to get them, we need to. Talk to them. We need to encourage them to be a part of the change. we wanna change the narrative of a male dominated industry when the 51% of the population are the ones that are going in and out of those doors. Well, we need to step up basically. And I put my money where my mouth was. I went off and I got myself qualified as a door supervisor. Because I thought it was absolutely essential, for me to be authentic and talk to these women about how they can make a difference in that role. So I, off I went and then on top of that, it didn't stop there cuz I'm a bit of a party animal. So I decided I actually needed to come out there and do the job right? So there's no point in just doing the course cuz that doesn't really mean anything. I needed to get out there and do the job, but I also by doing so wanted. Get some anecdotal evidence as, as to what I felt was, happening out there and what I think the, the audience, the customers wanted to see. They, I know they want to see ship change, but I wanted to present it to them in the, in the form of me, interact with them and see what the response was. And I, needless to say it was formidable, it was amazing. And, and that has spurred me on. On the one hand, I'm trying to go out to find sort of new cohorts of, representative individuals that reflect the wider populace who are coming into bars and gloves and restaurants. We need there to be a proper reflection of the people standing on the doors and the people coming through the doors essentially. It's really, really important. And if we can't do that, we're we are failing. quite frankly, I just think if you know that segment of the industry is unable to be representative, then, then we're gonna fail In terms of being diverse and inclusive, we're just going to fail. But also I recognize that there are 400,000 licenses out there, people carrying badges, and not all of those people are. People who have been given the opportunity to be more aware of some of the, the, the issues that I've talked to you about around sexual assault, around neurodiversity, around mental health, around the L G B T Q community. Now, the problem that we have in this industry is that there is no. There's no level playing field, there's no benchmark, there's no standard across these modular areas, and we really do need this. So I am curating as we speak an online training course, which is essentially a number of modules that I having worked for 18 months within this industry sector. What I have come across and my colleagues have come across time and time and time again, life are quite, quite certain that these are the ones that as a door supervisor, if you have a certain standard level of awareness for these six or seven areas, you have gone some wonderful extra way of making yourself. Or as relevant as you can in that role, in your shift. And they cover, looking into alcohol consumption, especially amongst young people. Drug consumption, spiking of drinks, neurodiversity mental health, the L G B T Q community, and a number of other, of, of other issues as well. And it's about making this training accessible. All of those people who currently have badges because what is all well and good me going out there and finding and, and shaping the new, the future as it were. But if we still have sloshing around people with a particular mentality, let's say around what it takes to be. a person's, who is in a position of authority securing somewhere. If there is a disconnect still with those people, then we need to do something about it. So it's not just about going out and finding new people to fill these roles. It's about making sure that the people currently in the role are brought up to this requisite standard nationally. All of a sudden we can literally say, if you're in Newcastle or whether you're in Bath, there is this standard that we, we as an industry are saying we will not fall below. Right? This is the requisite standard, or we'll not fall below it. And that is what I'm trying to achieve within the industry at the moment. You're very inspiring. I was thinking while you were talking that, there are a number of nightclubs that have a, a great deal of conscientiousness around their branding. If I had a nightclub, I would actually ensure that one of my security team would be a women's safety ambassador. their job is to always be present, to be eyes and ears for everything going on, and to certainly make sure that when people are leaving, that they're leaving in a relatively safe way and spot things that are troublesome. Because when I looked at the drink spiking figures for last year, they were in the thousands. Yeah, absolutely. Like I think, I think over 4,000 reported incidents, that's not withstanding the ones that weren't reported. And I'm thinking that's just not like one bloke going around with a kinky fetish. This is a, this is, this is more than that. It's, it seems to be a lifestyle for some people. Yes. And, and I think there's a, there's a huge benefit to having a safety ambassador in every single major nightclub over a capacity of, say, a certain thousand or whatever is there anything like that going on yeah. I, I think I think you are absolutely spot on. And, and that is exactly when it comes to sort of the industry side of it. They are, these are the sorts of conversations that I'm trying to have at the moment. In particular the festival season is, that particular audience for me is, is, is my prime target audience. The, the, the, the levels of assault and misuse of drugs and that happens in those events is. Enormous and, one mess hub in one of those events could, as you can, can imagine, lead to fatalities. And I think it's really, really important, particularly as a parent. So some of these events are frequented by very young people. So for example, my daughter's about to turn 16, she wants to go to the Redding Festival. Okay. With her friends in the now, mom and dad are the ones who control the purse string to whether. Daughter could go to said festival. Now I know as a parent that those festivals should be marketing me. They should be marketing towards me telling me just how safe an environment it's going to be for my daughter. Yeah. Because my daughter isn't paying for the ticket. Yeah, I am. And so then, so very much for me, I am, with my training element, I want to, I want to create a, a kite mark, if you like, for the industry, for a standard for door security people working in those events whereby, festival event people should be saying to any security company that they have a board prove to me. Prove to me a if you, if you like, how diverse is your team, but also prove to me that they also have this basic level of awareness around these care care. And if you can't, then you should be questioning whether or not you actually want that team working for you at that event. I, I just think I, it's a no-brainer for me. I don't understand why it doesn't happen. Lisa, you mentioned earlier presiding lady justice. Similar. lady Justice similar. She's the chair of this particular commission. She's a very amazing woman. So she heads up for the entire judiciary, the movement on equality, diversity and inclusion, and the Ministry of Justice. A few years ago put together a five year strategy around equality within the magistrate and the wider judiciary and outta. Came a couple of specific roles within the magistrate, looking at ways in which the organization could make itself more relevant and representative. one such role was the role that I became appointed to. For the southeast of England and I am in addition to being a presiding justice in the adult and the youth court. On top of that, I have a specific role to do with equality I'm called an Inclusion and Diversity magistrate, and essentially what it means is that I've taken the five year strategy of the m OJ for diversity and inclusion, and I've basically made a template. So I've drawn from that and. Created a template that is specific to the region that I represent. I have six other colleagues that have done exactly the same across their regions, all across the country. And we work as a unit together to promote all things diversity and inclusion within the magistrate. So once you become a magistrate, it's, it's all about what are we doing as an institution to ensure that the journey of that magistrate for the moment that. Being appointed to their particular bench, to the moment that they choose to retire and leave the magistrates. What do we do to safeguard to look after their wellbeing? Whether it's mental health issues, whether it's dealing with women going through the menopause, okay. Whether it's neurodiversity, all of these issues that we didn't talk about. All of a sudden we are putting them front and center of each of these regions, and we're working as best we can to form, and it's an iterative process. The idea is that we're not ticking boxes here. We are all about trying to ensure that we are busting some of the myths. The myths, first of all around what it takes to be a magistrate and. Making sure that we're going out into the communities rather than waiting for them to come to us. We're actually going out into the places where these people live, work, sleep, enjoy their lives, and we talk to them where they feel comfortable and feel safe in their own environments and within their own communities. And we tell them how much we need them, how much we need to diversify the representation within the magistrate. It's about equity. I mean, it's all about equity. It's about this level playing fill, essentially, rip down the, the fence, right? So we can all see. And if we can't do that, then make sure that we've propped each other up to the point where we can all see. Over the fence. this is what I am, I'm charged with doing. And it's not an easy task because first of all, there are some uncomfortable conversations that may or may not have to be had around many issues. And I think the misnomer is everyone, when we talk about diversity, I think people fall into the trap of kind. Embodying ethnicity and race. It's not just about that, that it's an element, but there are so many other things, whether it's age, whether it's, There are so many things and it's, I think part of the challenge is getting that, educating people and getting that across to them. Telling them not to fear that you're not challenging them, but you are just hoping for an. Open dialogue so that we can move forward essentially. So this is what I've been doing for the past year or so, and that I continue to do, and I am, if you like, for the Southeast of England. I am the spokesperson when it comes to anything internal to do with the magistrate around those issues. It's an amazing role, but it's a scary one. But I, I mean, I am passionate about this and this, this, this and the line of work that I'm doing with my news business, they go side by side, right? So, often the work that I do within the security industry very much ties into the sort of level of work that I'm doing within the magistrate. So I can pull from my experiences there and push that information into the line of work that I'm doing. About the change that I want to bring about within the frontline security industry. But I'm absolutely honored to be one of the seven people regionally to be put into this really, really important position. And, I've, I'm in the role for three years. Somebody else can do it after me or if they still want me, and I, I, I would relish continuing this role for as long as I am a part of the institution essentially. I mean, you've been a serving magistrate for 10 years. You must have seen some funny things, Lisa Oh, yes. I mean, plus, Well, I give you time to think about something funny. I remember as a serving police officer, I interviewed a boy and he was about sort of 16, 17 years old, and he was going up in the system in the wrong way, if you know what I mean. Mm mm And we, we, he'd become very well known to us, but he was very, very likable. And he was arrested for stealing in a halford. And he was represented by a solicit. We had some CCTV and we watched this individual move around the store and the cctv and I said to this individual, is that you? He went, no, miss. I said, all right. So you didn't pick up anything up off that shelf then? No. Miss, you didn't stick that under your jumper? No. Miss looks an awful lot like you. Doesn't he? This person on the cameras? No. Miss does it look anything like me, and solicitors, trying not to laugh because they have their job to do and then. But you're both wearing the same jump. And he has this really unique, thick stripes jumper with yellow stripe on it. Like it wasn't, it was not pretty distinctive. It wasn't like he was wearing a black hoodie or anything, yeah. And I said that I, I'm gonna put it to you that was you. And he looked at me and he knew he gonna get out of it. And you, and, and I, I hope he's all right now. I hope he grew out of his crime sprint, but, You must have seen some funnies. Oh yeah. Often you, so it's funny you mentioned cctv, cuz often, the first word of thumb is night wasn't me. It wasn't me. And then it was like, have you seen the CCTV footage? Okay, do you wanna go and have a little chat with your representative and then come back and we'll have a talk about that? So that's always amusing, but some of the things that I find the most amusing are just the everyday sort of foibles, if you like, of just people in and in those circumstances. And one of the funniest ones I get from time to time is being called your Majesty because just, which my friends find, Absolutely hilarious. So you know what? Generally it's your worship or mom or something like that, but this particular man just wasn't getting it right and he just kept, kept calling me Your Majesty. And I could see either side of me, my colleagues and I could see their shoulders going up and down cuz I tried the best not to laugh. But yeah, so there've been instances like those. And then I've also had defendants on the video link. So often you are speaking to a defendant from a police station or from a prison sort of blowing kisses at me and telling me how attractive. He found me during his his presentation about, whether or not he nicked whatever from a shop. So, often you have to try and find your PO face and try and, kick and it's really hard sometimes, cuz all you want to do is roll around with laughter. But they are characters often. And it's, it is, it's important to know that there is, you're dealing with serious subject matters and you are dealing with people's lives. And obviously that's no laughing matter, but it, it's life, it's real life. And sometimes real life is amusing. And, magistrates are human beings. And and that's what. the Magistrate is trying to do in terms of its recruitment program at the moment. And it's, it's about trying to get across the message that we want everyday people, we want people living normal lives to come forward and be a part of this process to be representative. And I would say now anyone, I mean, I'm constantly on recruiting for, for potential new magistrates and I just think anyone who's interested just go to www do. I can be a Magistrate UK and go for it because we need you, we need more of you. And it's the most, outside of having my two children, it's been the single most rewarding thing I have ever done in my life. I wouldn't change it for the world. I feel quite honored to, to go into court when I do. So, get out there, I think that's great. And I was gonna ask you, you've preempted the question there. I think, there'll be some people listening that'll be thinking, oh, what do you have to do to be a magistrate? And, and what are the prerequisites? So look, thank you. Thank you Lisa, seriously, for such an inspiring conversation. Keep up the good work. Thank you. So you're, find some, it's been amazing. Yeah, we are gonna find some ways to keep collaborating. May the force be with you and all that. And anything coming up for 2023 that's particularly noteworthy for you. Yeah, for me I'm, I'm hoping to put together, I'm in the process of specking out an event that will be specific to frontline super front frontline door supervisor work. And so anyone, any type of stakeholder that works within that industry, I am trying to put together an event that addresses all of the issues that pertain to them. I'm hoping to. Put this on at the end of the year probably in Brighton, and it will be the first of its kind. So I'm really excited about that. And I'm speaking to a number of people with regards to collaboration, but the idea is about joining up the dots and ensuring that all of those people that have a, a stake in Making sure that people are safe at night and that all measures are being taken to ensure that people have a good night out and stay safe. They need to start speaking to each other. So I, I'm pulling them all together. I hope in an event that will take place at the end of the year. So watch this space, hopefully good for you. And come back after, or before and tell us what you need and we'll see what we can do to support at Ifpo. All right. Thank you Yoyo. I will do, thanks very much. Take care. Thank you so much. It's been a real pleasure, Bye.