EP 067 Chuck Andrews "When life forces you from 147mph to 0 sometimes you got to slow down. I'm still under repair but finding ways to get shit done"

Named IFSEC #1 Security Influencer Worldwide! Global SECURITY Advisor & Strategist
BIO

Forty (40) years of Law Enforcement, Corporate Security, Business Risk and Consulting professional experience, training and education in both domestic and international venues, organizations and corporations in the physical (traditional) & virtual (logical) security industries. 

Self-motivated and results-driven security executive and consultant demonstrating leadership and influence while positively impacting industry EBITDA from a security value-added proposition. 

A security industry expert demonstrating global & functional competencies in multiple business environments, law enforcement and the corporate security (virtual & traditional) industry in the form of top-level certifications, degrees and significant real-world work experience positively impacting business operations across industry, both in the private and public sector. Successfully identifies emerging issues & technologies impacting security programs in the business environment on a local, state, national & international scale to the benefit of the business as value-add and cost/benefit plus. Further, has identified & demonstrated RISK/THREAT mitigation strategies involving millions of dollars in ROI with national impact to the benefit of a Fortune 250 corporation. 

Accumulated, leveraged and maintained over 5,000 direct relationships and ~156,000 working contacts in the law enforcement (foreign, federal, state & local) and corporate security sector across varied corporations and organizations through FRIENDS OF CHUCK (FOC). 

SPECIALTIES: Trusted Adviser, High-Net-Worth, Cyber Security, Forensics, Security Investigations, Security Marketing, Security Trends, Security Personnel Recruiting & Job Placement, Relationship Management, Corporate Investigations, Business Intelligence, Security Emerging Technologies, Security Operations, Conducted Investigations, Law Enforcement Experience, Police Officer, Federal Law Enforcement, Who's Who in Security, Opportunities & Forecasting, etc......
Forty (40) years of Law Enforcement, Corporate Security, Business Risk and Consulting professional experience, training and education in both domestic and international venues, organizations and corporations in the physical (traditional) & virtual (logical) security industries. Self-motivated and results-driven security executive and consultant demonstrating leadership and influence while positively impacting industry EBITDA from a security value-added proposition. A security industry expert demonstrating global & functional competencies in multiple business environments, law enforcement and the corporate security (virtual & traditional) industry in the form of top-level certifications, degrees and significant real-world work experience positively impacting business operations across industry, both in the private and public sector. Successfully identifies emerging issues & technologies impacting security programs in the business environment on a local, state, national & international scale to the benefit of the business as value-add and cost/benefit plus. Further, has identified & demonstrated RISK/THREAT mitigation strategies involving millions of dollars in ROI with national impact to the benefit of a Fortune 250 corporation. Accumulated, leveraged and maintained over 5,000 direct relationships and ~156,000 working contacts in the law enforcement (foreign, federal, state & local) and corporate security sector across varied corporations and organizations through FRIENDS OF CHUCK (FOC). SPECIALTIES: Trusted Adviser, High-Net-Worth, Cyber Security, Forensics, Security Investigations, Security Marketing, Security Trends, Security Personnel R

Security Circle ⭕️  is an IFPOD production for IFPO the International Foundation of Protection Officers

Transcript

0:02

If you enjoy the security circle podcast, please like share and comment or even better. Leave us a Fabry view. We can be found on all podcast platforms. Be sure to subscribe. The security circle every Thursday. We love Thursdays. Hi, this is Yolanda. Welcome. Welcome to the Security Circle podcast. IFPO is the International Foundation for Protection Officers and we are dedicated to providing meaningful education and certification for all levels of security personnel and make a positive difference, we hope. to our members mental health and well being. Our listeners are global. They are the decision makers for tomorrow and now. We want to thank you wherever you are for listening and for being a part of the Security Circle. And if you love the podcast, we're on all podcast platforms. Don't forget to give us a review, subscribe, comment, and share on LinkedIn. Thanks ever so much, guys. It means a lot. Well, I can't tell you, I couldn't say that quick enough, Chuck, because I just couldn't wait to say hello to you, Chuck. Welcome back to the Security Circle podcast.

Chuck 1:24

Let me tell you, when I respond to welcome back, that has great meaning for me. The hostess with the mostest yo yo. It is good to be back. My brain works, my fingers work. And the voice of security works.

Yoyo 1:41

I stole that

Chuck 1:42

from Chuck Harreld. I have to give that credit to Chuck.

Yoyo 1:45

I found I've never met Chuck Harreld yet. Do you know that? Not like I've seen him on his YouTube channel, but I've never met him yet. Maybe I should make a intention to bump into him hip to hip when I see him in Orlando this year. We'll talk about Orlando. Hey, listen, no one can help but notice you've been a little bit absent off the circuit recently and some people will understand and some people wait. How's it been for you, Chuck? What's it been like being away from your network?

Chuck 2:11

Well, it's never happened in six decades, or I guess that's technically three scores just for technical purposes. I have never experienced this in my life, but as we all get smarter and wiser, we also have a few. that are needed from time to time. And I kind of gently let the world know, because I feel genuinely bad knowing that I probably couldn't respond to people or work on certain projects. Or so I kind of put some stuff out there and I'm, I think it was a picture of my wife took of me, the emergency room and that kind of, that kind of said it all. You know, basically uh, I've moved, moved to a new status of titanium man.

Yoyo 3:02

So you're not, you're not just volunteering in titanium world right now. You're a full fledged member.

Chuck 3:08

No, I'm, I'm, I'm part time in the iron man club. So, basically, uh, after many years of wearing a gun belt and, and doing all the things that I've done, uh, over the years my back, uh, said. Timed for a rehaul, redo, refix. And so that's exactly what happened. I got titanium put my back. Now, listen, there's a lot of people that have had this done. I've talked to so many kind people who have called me and shared their stories. And so for me I got to learn a lot from them and understand what this journey was going to be like. So my poor truck's been sitting there for two months all by itself and it did get a car wash. I got released to at least go down the street and wash my truck, but no travel for Chuck right now. Uh, but things are getting better. I'm dealing with it. And that's what you have to do is deal with it straight on. And, and I hope to be, you know, maybe set a goal of going to GSX in Orlando. That's probably a good goal.

Yoyo 4:13

Yeah, I think so. And I think I remember when I got kind of booted off LinkedIn for three weeks, and I remember I suffered, like, really, like, I suffered just not being able to connect with people. It was like someone hijacking your address book and not being able to make calls and ring people and get in touch. And I know, because of your popularity, that a number of people would have made a point of staying in touch with you and giving you a nudge from here to there. And it's important, isn't it? Because when you're going through what you're going through, it's really important to look after your mental health. How's it been? Like, have you found it hard in that sense?

Chuck 4:46

Extremely difficult for me and my personality. Remember I'm doing 147 miles an hour in a 50 mile per hour zone, that's my whole life. Yo yo. It's going fast and going places. And I'm a, as you know, I'm a huge advocate of. Meeting people in person, you know, the networking piece. So this has really been tough. I have to say that the walls have kind of caved in on me because, uh, you remember the movie, uh, Bill Murray, Groundhog Day. Every day is the same for Chuck Andrews. And so that's been tough for me because my life is made up of a very intentional balance and diversity of doing things differently. I'm a squirrel. I know that. And it's a, it's, I do, I do 19. If I'm not happy, if I'm not doing 19 things in parallel. And so it's been really hard for me to mentally adjust, but. You don't have a choice. You're forced measured. Sometimes I think spiritually though this has happened to me, uh, as a message to, to slow down and, uh, to be honest with you.

Yoyo 6:01

You've preempted what I was going to say, because this isn't something that you do of choice. It's interesting that you talk about spiritually as well, because maybe when you have to take that break and you have to hear your inner voice a lot more. Because it's not being drowned out by the traveling like a squirrel and storing nuts everywhere and enjoying good hibernation. Uh, but you know, just doing that whole going around at 190 miles an hour. Maybe listening to that inner narrative is important right now. So how, how are you listening to yourself? And what, what are you telling yourself? What's, what's the common thing coming through?

Chuck 6:37

So, you know, day to day my social media has picked up because my fingers work. My brain works. And, uh, I can't sit for, you know, any long period of time and I'm trying to follow the doctor's orders. My personality is not conducive to being a good patient. That has been a fact my entire life.

Yoyo 7:01

You're a little bit stubborn, are you, Chuck, by any chance?

Chuck 7:04

I am, but I know the danger associated with not following the rules. And so I'm being very cautious. And, uh, very, listen, I'm paying attention this time because it hurts. Not to want to go back and have my spine worked on, uh, again, but to answer the question, I, uh, I'm trying to, uh, manage this and I have to see, I'm, I'm the kind of guy that has to give, I have to give myself literally permission and write on a piece of paper, Chuck, it's okay for you not to do something for three hours. Like, like literally when I have all these people sending me messages, I even, you know, I even had to come up with a canned quote to give to people in mass. And a lot of people listening to this also got this message and it goes like this, Chuck, how are you doing? How are you feeling? What's going on, Chuck? What can I do for you? I want to take, you know, a minute and express my appreciation. For the kindness of outreach by the masses. And I'm here to help people. I can. I can still do that. I just took somebody up with a security director job yesterday, got him the interview and good Lord willing, they're gonna get the job. I continue to do that to help folks around around the world where I can. But the quote is this It's a slow boat to China, but the navigation is set correctly, and the prevailing winds are in my favor. End quote. That's very

Yoyo 8:39

nautical.

Chuck 8:40

Yeah, but let me tell you, it is a slow boat. It is a slow boat, right? Because it takes forever for your bones to heal. And I will tell you a story, when I came out of surgery, And the nurse came in, doctor came in, they were telling me some things to do, not to do. Well, I was still on opioids.

Yoyo 9:04

Did you propose?

Chuck 9:05

Well, no, it didn't quite get that far, but she goes, uh, she looked at me and said, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I couldn't discern anything. And she goes, no BLTs. And I think I started crying and I responded and said, Oh, bacon, lettuce, tomato sandwiches. Oh my God. No, what she meant was no bending, Mr. Andrews, no lifting and no twisting. So, and after she made that point clear, I wiped away my tears with joy, understanding that I could get back to my BLTs in life.

Yoyo 9:44

I am never going to look at a BLT the same way again.

Chuck 9:47

Right, right. So, look, yo, yo, it's tough. It's really tough. They, you know, even as a kid, you know, at 13 years old, I had, I was mowing lawns. I was delivering flyers for the movie theater. Yeah, I was doing odd jobs. That's never changed my entire life. work is not work for me. You know, work for me is hobby. And living a life of public service as a police explorer, and as a Boy Scout, and all the volunteering, it just doesn't change, even as a Texas Master Peace Officer today. I volunteer my services in a law enforcement capacity to protect the community everywhere I go. And so that hasn't changed. So it's hard to give yourself permission, but literally I have three notes right here saying it's okay, Chuck, to, to do that. And people are telling me some of my friends been around a long time, Chuck, you should consider retiring. And I said, no, you're breaking up. What did I can't understand you. It's like, what is that? You know, that's just not in my future. Not in my future.

Yoyo 10:58

But also like I took a year out as everyone knows last year. And this is where I started doing the podcast. And this is where I kind of did the first recording with you. And, and I remember

Chuck 11:09

this journey. I remember this journey.

Yoyo 11:11

Right, right. Here I am a year later, completely and utterly. changed as a person, uh, 100%. And there was also this defining moment, you know, when I thought, shall I do this? Shall I not do this? And I think, I think it was a very brave step to sort of go ahead, do it, do it alone and just see, see what happens. And, and I remember as well, sort of, even while I was off during that year, being so disciplined, even though I wasn't Earning any money. I was being very frugal and I was still getting up at nine o'clock every morning and still at my laptop every day, all day doing things, networking, staying in touch, just finding ways to be really productive in the day. And it's difficult, because I get it. And I remember when I was off with a broken toe. Well, actually, I'm going to tell the truth. I had to have my toe broken and reset again. It was the most excruciating thing I've ever done. And it was a good sort of six weeks, you know, of a lot of pain. Big toe is fine now, but I remember I caught up on every single episode of Grey's Anatomy. I became a master in medical explanations. Have you set yourself a plan to maybe catch up with lost or, or more distant connections, uh, communicating with more people, reading books, maybe, or have you caught up with some great box sets?

Chuck 12:28

So, uh, yes, and yes, I am catching up with lots of people. 1 of the things that I did because of the nature of my work is. And this is just when Facebook was coming on and I was probably the first 10, 000 people when LinkedIn started, I jumped on that bandwagon. I say, LinkedIn is my Facebook, right? And so now I'm able to catch up with people because I have the time to do it. I'm doing much more mentoring and coaching as part of the friends of Chuck network to help, to help people out. Involved in reading more, right? Uh, articles on LinkedIn and, and certain books and trying to play catch up, where I can. You know, I, I, there's a lot to talk about there. It's good to catch up with folks and spend a little bit more time with them, which I'm sure you can appreciate. Uh, there's value, there's value in that because every day I'm on the phone with a new security person every single day, including Saturdays and Sundays, just to catch up with people. And how can I be helpful? What's going on in your world? You know, I always invite people to come to the ranch in Texas from other countries. It's a It's a life experience for them, right? So, yeah, I am catching up with folks and reading a few more books.

Yoyo 13:58

Well, look, talking about books, what a great segue. Just going to refer to yours, your book, Yes, Sir, under the chapter of relationships. You talk about in the segment, how to dream big. Now that you have your big dream, let's align with your actions, with your dream. To do that, there are three tasks or areas you need to tackle. One is networking. Two is building relationships. And three is creating, stroke by stroke. Finding mentors. Let's talk about that last one because I, I get it. I'm going to, I'm going to say to you sort of from an entrepreneurial perspective, I find the more pro bono work I do, the more life just gives me dividends. I don't know how that happens. It's like a quid pro quo with Mother Nature, or whoever, your spirituality, or wherever you're inclined to believe. The more you give, and the more harder it is to give, that as well, the more dividends you get back. And for me, that journey started in 2020 during COVID. So I already understood the benefit to volunteering my time for free. You do this, and it's worth me mentioning as well, which is why I mentioned the book, At the moment, I, I have For women on my mentoring capacity. I don't really have the capacity to take on anymore. My bandwidth is very full, but I'm always telling them to look at pillars in our community that really do wave flags for great truths. and great methodologies and you, you're one of them. Your book, Yes Sir, I refer it a lot and I refer to you and specifically around this piece about relationships, which we're going to talk to. And then I talk about Dr. David Rubens, because he represents this global phenomenon of global, crisis risk and strategic management. And then we go to the Southern Hemisphere for Dr. Gabrielle Schneider. And we look at resilience and how he's coined that phrase and his brand and his narrative. And there are three massive things to draw from that as I'm mentoring other younger women. But the, the relationships piece, Chuck, I can't underestimate how powerful that's been for me since I read that. And I ha I hear that in my head, it's, it's, it's been that powerful. You must've had other feedback as well.

Chuck 16:08

Yeah, listen, I cannot emphasize that if nothing else in the book, right? Relationships, but the, you know, finding and keeping a relationship is 1 thing maintaining it completely another. And I talk about that. You have to maintain these and it is work. That means work equal. It takes time, right? To, to, to be able to do that. I cannot, I could write another book just on the, what relationships can do for you emotionally, financially, socially, and professionally. Because I, the craziest things happen to me because of the Friends of Chuck Network that People would say, Oh, no, no, no, that's complete and utter fiction. There's no way, Chuck. I mean, I'm quoting people who are like, You did what? Who called you? They asked you to do what? You were involved with? And it's really amazing. And look, let me, let me say this. Volunteer and help others without expectation. Make sense?

Yoyo 17:23

Yeah, it

Chuck 17:25

comes full circle. You have to take capitalism out of your head and that expectation of immediate gratification through or whatever it is, you need to move and dismiss that. You just need to fill the pipe with helpfulness, kindness, assistance, volunteerism. And it will drip consistently out of your control for the rest of your life. And this

Yoyo 17:56

is

Chuck 17:57

yo, yo, we're friends. All you have is friends and family and you can have all the money in the world. You can have all the fame in the world, really. And especially as you get older in life, you, you realize, I realized this a long time ago, really in the end, that's all that is important. And I have rekindled some great relationships. With great high school friends that have moved back like me to my hometown to take care of their parents. Right, because they're elderly. We've become the very best of friends and genuinely enjoy being together and all the friends we make in this industry. You and I are Ray O'Hara. Or, you know, pick different people that are well known in the industry and we all have an obligation to give back right as mentors to the mentees. And I know you're doing a lot of that

Yoyo 18:57

well, giving back is really important. And I, and when people come to me and they say, you know, how do I improve my brand on social media and LinkedIn? I've done it by promoting people who are excellent in this business. And so, really, the kickback is that people have come to know me just because I provide the platform to promote those great stories, great achievements and great narratives, because that was the beginning vision Chuck I thought, how can we shine a light on the excellence that we do in this community? Because when things go wrong, it's like the marine industry, crikey, look at Baltimore. And when you look at the airplane industry, the civil aviation industry, when something goes wrong, it goes really wrong. And it's the same in the security industry. When it goes wrong, it goes really bad. And we're not very good, really, at saying how great we are at stuff. And that's why I decided there was a gap. For us to do this. So I say to everybody, you've got to have this kind of idea about what do you want to achieve? And how do you want people to feel about you? How do you want people to look at you? And can you be consistent with that? Can you deliver the same thing without being inconsistent with your narrative? Consistency is important. I think, isn't it?

Chuck 20:08

Yeah, very, very much. So that's the maintenance part. You have to be consistent. You have to consistently check in on people. You have to Consistently put content out that is a relative. And I talk about that in the book. I say, look, you have to actually respond to people. You can't just keep putting stuff out, putting stuff out, putting stuff out and not take the time to go in and In a very courteous way, comment in comments. That's great that you keep putting stuff out. And I've called people out for it and said, Hey, uh, Biljo, Susie, love you, but it can't all be about you. 24,

Yoyo 20:50

Yeah,

Chuck 20:51

just a kind note saying, go comment on other people's stuff, right? Yes, it's part. I put a lot of crazy stuff out there.

Yoyo 20:59

You do a great job actually, Chuck. I love seeing your little emoji everywhere. It's hilarious.

Chuck 21:06

Well, listen, uh, one of the things I've done my whole life is, I, what did I tell you earlier about my personality, which is, I, I have to mix it up and it's like, okay, how do you, uh, how did I garner the whole friends of Chuck thing with, you know, You know, hundreds of thousands of people. How did that happen? Be different. Don't be normal. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Give people diversity of flavor and imagery and sound. I guess I should have been on Broadway and been the choreographer. I was

Yoyo 21:47

thinking Can Can at the time. I was thinking it was definitely a bit of burlesque there in you, Chuck. Well, I think maybe in your 20s, you'd have been able to, it was a calling. So I ordered some stickers the other day. They're not that expensive. They're going to be about sort of six centimeters wide and it's going to be the security circle logo. It's going to be great slapping them on the backs of everybody when I'm at GSX. Why don't you get some stickers saying you've been chucked?

Chuck 22:23

Well, I'm gonna, I don't know. I think, uh, we can

Yoyo 22:26

have a sticker competition.

Chuck 22:29

We could have a I'm wearing my sticker right now. Right?

Yoyo 22:33

Right. Exactly. But it's, it's, I think there's something in that, like, you know, when you say you put the sticker on. comments on people's posts, you definitely need to have a, an emoji that says you've been chucked. And, and I think we can have a bit of fun with this. So how I think about this GSX, I'm, we can have a little sticker competition and see how many stickers are on the backs of everybody. And, you know, and we can have a little bit of fun with it. But look, going back to mentoring I find it critical to pay it forward. And just because my journey hasn't been smooth sailing and I didn't go through the standard, you know, thread of being where I am now,

Chuck 23:10

I

Yoyo 23:10

kind of don't want other people to feel like they have to have that, you know, Just as hard. So I feel like this obligation to say, Hey, don't fall through that crack in the pavement. This is the best way to go around that hole. And, and I think if someone's willing to listen, Chuck, and just be a sponge. We can have great productive hours. You know, I have to be, I have to sort of time it like no more than 45 minutes. It's free. You know, it's my time. But we make it constructive. How can we tell somebody who is in the market knows that they need a mentor and understands that actually most people who are successful do have mentors. How can we tell them how to find one?

Chuck 23:51

So I'm going to give you a cowboy have mentor will travel, right? And listen, if you don't know where you're going and there's the analogy, right, you're going to be traveling through this journey of your career and your job. And delivering best practices, lowering the risks in your company, given we're in the security vertical, you need a mentor and that can come in different shapes and sizes. Right. Based on your comfort level, I I could not be successful. You know, without the mentors, which are, you know, part of the, all that senior wisdom, right? These are people in their 80s now, 70s, late 70s, 80s, even one that's 94 years old that I have conversations with. And so I intentionally. Kind of have the old school, the middle school and the new school perspectives. Young professionals, I got to keep up with the, they're fast, right? They're got a lot more energy and then the people that are in my world. And then that, that, that I would tell you, man, if you could do that kind of trio. And mentorship, right? People that you can work with younger than you, people that you're currently, uh, where you're at in life, kind of that middle mentor. And then the senior folks who are experienced with wisdom, that trifecta can be very, very powerful because They all offer you something that you can act on as value, and then in turn, they get your perspective as well, right? It's very

Yoyo 25:40

You've made a really good point there, because you're right. I learn just as much and gain just as much talking to younger security professionals, because otherwise, how can I represent them if I don't understand the challenges they're going through, where they're not sure, And,

Chuck 25:54

it's

Yoyo 25:54

almost enviable, isn't it, that they get that journey where they're putting fields out and I think, oh, if I could do everything over again, I know I'd do it differently.

Chuck 26:02

But, you know, they have a hard time seeing the value, to be honest with you. And so you have to really for lack of a better way to say it, make them see the value of what that can be. And I think people recognize that and you just have to understand the generational gap culturally of what works for them. I know the younger folks, they only get a text from me and they only skim Instagram. Right? I know that. So, uh, understanding that I take it from that perspective and communication, you know, with them. Folks my age are in the middle ground. You can go both ways and then the older folks call'em on the phone or shake their hand or see them in person, and that's how it works. And you have to be respectful of that. In my book, I call it the chameleon effect. You have to, morph yourself. Into that likeness if you want to be effective make sense

Yoyo 27:02

Yeah, in fact, I made an observation very recently and i'm gonna make sure that this doesn't come across too negative But I know of a very young very talented entrepreneurial individual who is I think I think she's not even 18 yet She's stunning. She makes great content on linkedin great content on social media content to die for right? She is amazing however, when I met her in person It was really difficult to have the same type of engagement. And then I realized this younger generation that's been growing up with social media content hasn't necessarily built the same communication skills that our generations have had the privilege to be able to do. And I wondered what the, I wondered what the future would look like where everybody's representation online is stunning, but yet when you meet in person, there are definitely communication challenges.

Chuck 27:56

Yes, very. You have to find out what works and then you have to draw them out to, using, listen, in terms of communication, everything that is available out there. I'm still not a fan of what's app. Right. And don't everybody else seems to, but I have my own, uh, uh, listen, we're not end to end encrypted, not interested. Right. And I try to explain that, right. Every time you communicate something, you can expect it pretty much these days. to be potentially discoverable from a litigation standpoint or hacked and used against you in some, uh, uh, some capacity. So you have to be cognizant of that on every channel that you use. Most things are best used, you know, by talking to people. audibly on the phone with certain topics. But I use every channel there is out there to communicate with people. and then literally, you figure out how people communicate. I hope that answers your question. Like this person only does text. This person only does phone calls. This person only does email. And I actually track that information with individuals. the profiles that I have to build. So that's what success is. You have to pay attention to what is important to other people, not you. Remove your expectations, remove your biases, and understand and take it from their perspective. And then once you build that relationship and you have the credibility to answer your question, that's when you can offer them other ways of doing things. Make sense?

Yoyo 29:45

Yeah, in fact, I recommend to a lot of younger security professionals to get into a security membership body. And I recommend more than one. So just join the one, join two, join three, join what you can afford to join or what your employer can sponsor you to join. And, and I think it, it was only then for me, that was the turning point. Oh my God, I'm around all of these amazing people who kind of love the same thing I do.

Chuck 30:10

I know it's like. Listen, over in England, I mean, you know, you know, oh, I love bread pudding. You too.

Yoyo 30:20

Is that your, is that your attempt at an English accent? I

Chuck 30:23

can't do my curse. He's too much like a pirate, you know.

Yoyo 30:29

Yeah, he is too much like a pirate. His ears are probably burning now. So we've got coming up ISC West. Wow, just a few days. So, 9th through the 12th of April. I've never been to ISC West. What's it about?

Chuck 30:42

You gotta go. You gotta go, yo, yo. It's the, it's the biggest, you know, in terms of technology, right? And equipment. So that's it's focused. They, this is done. Uh, I think it's, read exhibitions, does this with a SIA, the security industry, association. And, and it's a, you know, it's in Vegas every year and it's a, I, it's a great conference. I usually kick it off with, Gillies or throw a little micro Texas night event, which I've been doing for the last few years, but unfortunately. I can't go. I'm still under repair, but I have news. You want to know the news?

Yoyo 31:23

Yeah, I just hit me now.

Chuck 31:26

Well The security goat, the ambassador of security, Chuck Bobblehead, is making appearance in the lobby of ISC West at booth number one two. Find Chuck Bobblehead. He's there for your security selfie. Looking forward to seeing everybody.

Yoyo 31:45

That's actually really cool. That's super cool. Where did you come up with these ideas, Chuck? I mean, this is all about brands, isn't it? Where did you come up with these ideas?

Chuck 31:54

You know, as a kid, when Saturday Night Live, the TV show started, in 1973, you know, I guess it was always my dream to be on SNL and I love stand up comedy and parodies. sarcasm, right? And I guess really I'm a wannabe in that respect. jingles, you I'm a pepper, you're a pepper, everybody wants to see a doctor. You know, all these things in your head. It's like, man, this is like, what is this advertising, marketing, branding? This always appealed to me. And it's like, I'm in the security industry. how can I bring that out? And so, I, over the years, that's just, I got my, you know, for my mom who's super creative, she was a school teacher for 40 years and she was a home economics teacher, right? Which is really teaching kids about life. And for me, it's like, do things different. People don't want the same old stuff. you have to change it up. You have to be a little risky and take some risks and embarrass yourself, which I do on a regular basis. My wife reminds me of that. and so I'm okay with doing that., and I just, I put it out there. Now, listen, I keep it dampened. I try to be fair and diplomatic and and with look, people don't forget humor. Think about it. Am I right people do not forget and people that can do that. And I'm not one of those gifted people. I have to work at it, but I have friends of mine and I'll just shout him out Sean Mahoney. He lives out on the East Coast. He's in the security business. And, and Sean, Sean Mahoney, it's about as Irish as it gets. And he is one of the funniest human beings on the planet. And there are the Sean Mahoney's of the world who you're around them. And it's that, those kinds of people I'm talking about, they just make you laugh when you never forget what they say. And they give a presentation and they have a good icebreaker. And for me, well,, I'm wearing a hat and a suit and boots and people don't forget that they see the hat from 1000 yards away. And then, oh, I saw that on LinkedIn and Chuck posted that. And then people want to actually meet you. Right? And I'm very thankful for that. And I go the distance to make that happen for people. I never not shake a hand. I never not follow up ever. No, you're

Yoyo 34:20

as good as gold. When I, yeah, when I met you. So funny, because I'd obviously heard you were going to be there and the first day I was like, I haven't seen Chuck yet. Has anyone seen Chuck? Oh yeah, he was here or whatever. He wasn't. He's over there. And it was like an American being in Paris and looking for the Eiffel Tower and every time, it's in a movie and I'm sure it's Forget Paris. And every time, the Eiffel Tower's there, there's a van going through so they never see the Eiffel Tower. This is you. You were the Eiffel Tower for me in,, Dallas. And then the funny thing is, you'd seen me. And then you were running after me. Right.

Chuck 34:53

For those

Yoyo 34:54

three days, I'd been looking for you, and you were calling out, and I was in a conversation with Pam, and we were talking about something really intensively, and you'd sent your lovely lady running after me. That was Funniest thing ever, but it's just, it's good, but what a great event GSX is. So basically people can go along these ISC West and they can have a selfie taken alongside Mr. Bobblehead. I can't wait to see them coming up on LinkedIn. They just need to tag friends with Chuck. Tag you, Chuck, and then

Chuck 35:28

you can only do

Yoyo 35:31

it in person.

Chuck 35:32

I can't, I can't be there, but the security ambassador of security, Chuck Bobblehead will be there. He has traveled, 14 countries, 400, 000 plus miles. So we're tracking him. He has his own Facebook page now that just launched. And people think, look, this is just all in good fun. And what is it? Look, what's the forensic Chuck mantra? Dream big, know how to have fun. And I'm just living and, and listen, you know what people say, like you sell, uh, I sell bananas for a living. Okay. Well, don't eat your own merchandise. Well, Right? It's like you can, uh, you can consume that. And this is all about fun. This is a hard job. We deal with risk and death and loss, and it's stressful in this business. and we need that kind of release. This is why dreaming big, knowing how to have fun and basically, you know, getting shit done. This is, these are the things that inspire people and they can work with. And you have to have all those components if you want to, if you want to survive and thrive in the industry.

Yoyo 36:51

It's been such a cool journey, especially, I mean, I can't wait to go to GSX. I know that we're all tentatively waiting now to see if the speaker, uh, requests are going to be honored. Uh, that's, so for those that don't know, basically you can put in a, a request or an application to speak. And I know that I've got, uh, one going through with Mike Anderson. Oh, you had to say Michael Anderson from the Matrix. There you go. From Mike Anderson, yeah. And, uh, I'm sure he's never heard that before. No. We, we want to deliver something to GSX that's specifically around personal brand LinkedIn, getting the best out of LinkedIn, making it LinkedIn, that engine that's really successful for churning over what your narrative and your brand is and being consistent with that. So that's a really good piece. We hope that gets accepted. And then the other one is with Kirkashan. Uh, we want to present as two women in a cyber security role, and we want to give people a roadmap to break into cyber security from physical security.

Chuck 37:59

Oh, wow.

Yoyo 37:59

You

Chuck 37:59

can write your own ticket into cyber security.

Yoyo 38:03

I made this correlation, and I was, I was recently published to say that in the physical security space, we've got people, property. And assets and in cyber security, we have people, process and technology. Well, people are in both of those. And, and then I realized that physical security professionals have all of the risk assessment mentality, the crisis management mentality, they love problem solving, they love investigating the cause of problems, you know, they're usually very governance and legislatively driven, and all of those qualities are needed in cyber security. So people don't realize making that bridge, walking over it, is literally about doing a few courses, getting your cyber essentials done, getting your ISO 27001, getting NIST practitioner ready. You can do all these courses at home. Some of them are very reasonable. Some of them are a little bit more expensive. Uh, getting things like GDPR qualifications. Phenomenal. They can never take that away from you. You can be a DPO with a GDPR qualification.

Chuck 39:09

Yeah. You know what's interesting about this though? And I'm going to,, I, you know, I'm going to get some cowboy truths around being a CISO and being a CSO. Forever trying to merge those roles. Lots of conversation. And look, you really can't put a circle into a square peg, right? And, and I use that analogy to say that. Each of those distinct roles has a certain personality and competency, and I'm going to elevate that CISO role because unless you understand and are intimate with zeros and ones that you really understand the math around a kernel. And even though what a is. Mm-Hmm. and in, uh, encryption. Mm-Hmm. closing it and opening it and, you know, VPNs port eighties understand the architecture of a board and, and what we call swimming lanes and the balance of swimming lanes and data centers. Unless those people are super gifted and super talented, right? It, I'm just, you know, I'm not to say it, but I'll say it right here. It is harder to be a CISO. And it is to be a CSO because we suck at math. I'm just, and it's true. You are, have to be so gifted in your brain to be able to work in there. And I could never be a CSO and I've worked hard to understand as a CSO. I have to catch up to my CSO colleague and learn as much as I can. About the processes and the, uh, the open port risks, right. And, and, and cost evaluations of, you know, what it takes to, you know, build a stack vertically, right. And be able to protect the wall. And I'll stand by it that. Those combined roles will never come to fruition from a cost savings from a P& L of a corporation. You need both of those groups doing their job, working together. And that's what you really see happening in industry right now. You don't see one person taking the whole job, right? Because somebody is going to get left behind and you need two people paying attention. But the cyber security world, you can write your own check right now. You can, it's amazing, right? I wish I did better in Mr. Flannoy's math class. The one that I failed in sixth grade.

Yoyo 41:57

For those that don't know what a kernel is and a stack and are just thinking it's got something to do with spicy chicken wings and a secret blend of spices. Popcorn. Popcorn. No, Kentucky Fried Chicken. There are other crispy chicken outlets available. No, look. You're right, but you've mentioned a lot of things that genuinely have a lot of specialisms. I think where, where my opinion sits slightly different to yours there, Chuck, is that I think, this goes back to being in 2018 and my amazing boss at the time saying, Yo Yo, make up your mind which way you're going to go. Are you going to be a practitioner or are you going to be Are you going to be strategic or are you going to be tactical? Right? And I felt like that was a bit unfair, really, because I was equally good at both. And then I realized, and I didn't really respect the fact that it was unfair at the time. I didn't want to kind of do him in. He kind of was trying to give me some direction to focus, right? But then we've discovered, certainly with cyber security, that being a generalist is what makes me good at the job I do. Right. It's about looking across strategy and tactically, you know, how, and of all the things that you mentioned, you never mentioned data. And I think to get people's appetites wet about cyber security, it's not about wearing a, wearing a hoodie in a dark room with a blue LED light behind you, or having a sexy glowy keyboard. It's about looking at data. Where is it? Where does it need to stay safely? And at what point does it need to move? Because let's think about every financial card transaction. That's just data moving from one place to another. It's what we call data in transit. Let's look at records held about you on file. They're stored. They're not moved. They're not Going to change their state. So how we store data and how we move data. It's all about how we keep that data safe. And I think that's the essence of cyber security.

Chuck 43:52

Yeah, no, I, and as a CSO, you have a responsibility to catch up. Right. Truly. It's, uh, it's, listen, I have some great colleagues and friends. Some of which I only have their first name and all I know is a handle and they're on some island in the middle of nowhere on the planet. And one thing I know for sure, if they want in, they're getting in without any question and you'll never ever know it. And knowing that it's like, like literally, I listen, I get, I get the opportunity in our world. To get to see the things that people can't talk about and shouldn't talk about and wouldn't even believe. And then I get included in those conversation or asked to come bring some strategic thought to it. And interestingly from time to time, because I have something I call a go bag or go ready. I offer up to say, because look, these members of board of directors. They have no understanding of this space. This is why they bring people like me in to get perspective. And one particular time, a particular word, which will remain nameless said, you know, oh, we're well protected and blah, blah, blah. We got blah, blah, blah. And I said, okay, I need to get out of jail letter. And, uh, I said within 72 hours, as long as everybody signs a confidentiality agreement and an NDA not to discuss outside this room. So you can't prepare, uh, for what's about to happen. You will be read into death and we will shut your entire system down and it'll cost you a million dollars every 5 minutes of loss. Yeah, and I'm happy to do that. And and then say,

Yoyo 45:47

how comfortable are you now?

Chuck 45:49

And then the room went quiet. For about 30 seconds, because I did it, uh, wearing my cowboy hat and I gave him the old Clint Eastwood stare

Yoyo 46:00

bit menacing. Was it?

Chuck 46:02

It was so much that they said, well, maybe we should listen to Chuck

Yoyo 46:07

John Wayne, get off your horse and drink your milk kind of thing.

Chuck 46:15

Uh, yeah, I guess. Listen, every time I've done this, I've maybe done this. Just maybe 10 times where I got lucky enough to, uh, really great opportunity to come speak to the board and confidence of big companies. And not one has taken me up on the offer to prove the point that, you know, nobody wants to know how vulnerable they are. Yeah. Five million dollar company wants to know it's got holes in port eighties everywhere. Nobody wants to talk about the truth. The smart one will.

Yoyo 46:49

Yeah. Yeah. How can we be better?

Chuck 46:52

How can we do better? Exactly. Yo, yo. It's the world is crazy. That's all I know.

Yoyo 46:57

In fact, Stephanie Drysdale, follow her on LinkedIn. STEF, Stephanie Drysdale, yes. She was the one, she was the one who talked about the CS a hack. And for those that don't know outside the us, CE is the cybersecurity infrastructure security agency, pretty much like the, uh, the UK's version of the NSC look. Mm-Hmm, That, that's a statement that's saying nobody is, uh, safe. Basically, when you go it's almost like, you know, it's kudos, isn't it really? In fact. A lot of cybersecurity professionals are not putting on LinkedIn who they work for or the fact that they are in certain roles in cybersecurity, especially if they're a CISO, because malicious hackers will target them just to prove a point. And, and, and that's not a great place to be in either, to be honest with you.

Chuck 47:45

Yes, listen, they love to prove a point. This is entertainment for them. Truly it is. It's a challenge and it's entertainment. And so when Bounty get put out, they love it. It's just gaming. It's just gaming for them, right? This is why I always ship my guys cases of Red Bull with the newest Star Wars figures down in their basement. You kind of give them what they want, right? This is a part of that world it's really weird and, and I love having these conversations with you, but people think, and maybe it's true, I'm just a nerd. I am a nerd.

Yoyo 48:25

I think you should be proud to be a nerd. I am a nerd., I recently built a Formula One engineering car, uh, that's about, I don't know, 40 centimeters long. And I messaged my brother and I said, shit, I love this so much. I wish I'd been an engineer. And then I realized, I'm just realizing that there are so many things I didn't get exposure to when I was younger that I never thought were in my grasp, but I wasn't great at math either, to be honest with you, Chuck, but I think you can be successful and smart without necessarily remembering Pythagoras. I mean, someone gave you a million dollars an hour to explain Pythagoras. Could you do it? No. Uh, trigonometry. Uh, no. A quadruple, a quadrangle. Uh, no. I'm

Chuck 49:09

gonna stick with, uh, 3.1 4 7 2 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 pie, both the math and the pie

Yoyo 49:16

and the pie. So raspberry. What, what is your favorite pie?

Chuck 49:20

A very viscous coconut cream pie with proper crust. There you have it.

Yoyo 49:27

I have to say I love Texas. I really did. And for anybody who hasn't been to Texas, definitely entertain it. it was such a polite, it's a very gentlemanly state. I felt safe. I felt like everybody was very courteous.

Chuck 49:44

You came from England, right? So, listen, with some bias, uh, in my tone, but it's actually fact. Texas is the friendliest place in the United States of America.

Yoyo 49:59

Yeah. You said it would be. You know what?

Chuck 50:01

Challenge me if you don't believe so, challenge me. I've been to all 50 states. I've been to a lot of foreign countries. I don't care. Texas is the friendliest place and it's part of our culture. Listen, people go, uh, people around the world or in the United States will go, Oh, you're from the South. No, I'm not from the South. I'm from

Yoyo 50:22

Texas

Chuck 50:24

because there's two or three versions of the South. Yeah. Yes. Friendly and culturally friendly. Economically, I think we're the fifth largest world power in the world, right? And gross national product, we have our own power grid. And this, this is how attitude and our culture, Texas pride is a common theme and a common denominator of Texans. I don't care who you are from Texas. I don't care about any orientation of who you are. If you're a Texan, you're a Texan tried and true. And this is the way that we like it in Texas. And a lot of people are moving here. And the reason they're moving here is they like the politics and the culture and the friendliness like literally didn't even get to go down a country road out in West Texas. You don't go by without waving to somebody. you need to help. Somebody will pull over and they will help you.

Yoyo 51:23

What's next for Chuck this year? Like, I get it that you're still in a, you're still in the repair shop and undergoing assessment. But listen, we're already talking. I don't want to put pressure on you, but we're already talking in the back end that, we're worried that, Texas light isn't going to happen to Orlando. And

Chuck 51:39

well, I'm just saying it's not. I hate it. I'm sorry. I'm officially announcing it. Let me tell you. It's just 1 person putting on an event for 4000 people. The amount of work that it takes to do this. There are other reasons for it not happening as well, which I'm not going to go into right now that are outside my control based on some rules. So, and being respected. And I'll get into that at some other time and that will be broadcasted. The compilation of both those, under repair and still in reconstruction yeah, the amount of work is enormous because it's just me. my assistant, that's it to put on an event and. I worked like 12, 14 hour days for months, and this had paid off. Everybody had a great time. Yeah, but I think all evening events, there's going to be some new rules coming out at GSX. And so those things will, uh, have to be taken into consideration. Right. And anyway, that's a whole different conversation, but being respectful, I don't want to be disrespectful to the process and the system, but I do like to give people what they want. And people for 10 years have loved Texas night because the experience Yeah, right. So we'll just see, right? But for right now, that's kind of where we're at, but the future for me is as I'm going under repair, my social media will pick up. I do have one big announcement. You don't even know about only on the yo yo show, right? I'm going to bring back, and people have asked me and asked me, but every time I do it, I have more people than I have space I'm going to bring back the Friends of Chuck, show. On zoom. So literally, twice a month, people will come and bring food and drink and bring your attitude, your knowledge, cool stuff to show. And it's like member show and tell, I don't know if you have that as a kid in England and bring something in thing, we're going to do that. And then I'm going to try to bring on some of the most interesting and famous people for five minutes to appear with for commentary and thought. just all kinds of people in life. To come on the show. It'll last an hour. But I always try to keep it at a 100 people because I want to keep it very intimate and people to get value out of it and actually turn on their microphones. So there is an exchange of dialogue as opposed to Just sitting there and listening. And it's hard to get to every 99 other people and say, give me your name, where you're from, and then I try to acknowledge every single person and how I know them, uh, you know, because it makes people feel good and then other people get to know who you are. To grow your network. So I'm going to try this and it'll be the first hundred people that sign up. And then next time, if you did the first one, you can't do the second one and tell other people, try to be fair and let other people enjoy. People really enjoy that. And you learn so much. I mean, people have found jobs within an hour, uh, growing their networks. They got, they linked in with them. They needed help with a special project so they could subcontract to them, right? So, I'm announcing it right here. The Friends of Chuck show is back.

Yoyo 55:18

Awesome. I can't wait. And listen, tag me in and I will share it this end and make sure that we can get that to as many people as possible, because I bet that's going to be great. And I will tune into that as well. Chuck, what can I say? Follow the doctor's orders. I know it's important. Stay healthy. Mentally and physically, and I'm sure everyone will want to send you, all their best wishes and love for a speedy recovery. Thank you so much for being on the Security Circle podcast today.

Chuck 55:49

Yo, yo, you're the best. Thank you. Look forward to seeing you at GSX.

Yoyo 55:54

GSX! Here we come, y'all!