Episode 8 - Creed III

This week we discuss the latest in the line of 'Rocky Universe' films, the first to not actually feature Rocky himself. We hope you enjoy!

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Hello and welcome to the Save the Chat podcast. With me, Michael Coburn. I'm joined by my co-hosts Michael McEleney and Steve Hodgetts. How are you guys? Very good. Pretty good. Fantastic. So let's get on with it because we have got as much time as we normally do. So let's get straight into what we've been watching recently. I actually watched again recently a film because we've been talking about one of my scripts that I'm writing at the moment, which has a kind of like a big hedge fund boss type character or one of these kind of bigwigs from a stockbrokers. It's a film called Margin Call. I don't know if you guys have seen it. Oh, I've seen that about the crash. Exactly. Right. And Jeremy Irons plays like the big boss character. Mhm. And so I'm kind of basing it on on him. I really like that film. I recommend anyone go and watch that. It's, um, it's kind of one companies. Um, you follow one company through the first few days of the financial crash and how they found out about and what they do about it. Um, super interesting film, amazing cast. I missed that. Yeah. Yeah. He plays the sort of the ultimate in corporate greed, isn't he? Yeah, in a way he does. But what I found interesting about it is, like, he's completely amoral. He's not like I'm a greedy bastard. He's just like people. People mean nothing to him and never will, and he's just completely amoral guy. That's how he made it to the top. And he can just make decisions based without any emotion or guilt or anything. He just does what what will make the most money. And I think that's what's really interesting about those kind of guys, because they're not like. Um, while they're about to fuck us over again. Well, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think that'll be a good appetite for. For this kind of film. Yeah. Very true. Very true. As we've seen recently, we already seeing it with things like triangle of sadness and lasagna and like, there's a real appetite for, like, Yeah, watching the people's excesses. Like coming the menu. Yeah. I mean, yeah. So. Yeah, it's in the zeitgeist. It is, exactly. Yeah. But anyway, I recommend that film Margin Call must be about ten, ten years old now. But, um. But yeah, go check it out. Have you guys seen anything worthy of recommending recently? I saw I rewatched the call my sister the other day and which is sort of 2003 disaster film. It's on Netflix at the moment. I'm reminded about how how good it is. I mean, it's bad, but it's very good. Interesting stuff. Stanley Tucci. Stanley Tucci plays a scientist. Aaron Eckhart, another another scientist. Great cast. Hilary Swank. Way. I think I have. And yeah. The score is heating up too much, right? It well so I stopped by the plot so stupid. But there of course stops. Basically it stops rotating. And so all these scientists decide that they need to go and drill into the core of the little crew and find nuclear bombs that they call very American. They know that in order to save the day, it couldn't be more American. But what are they going to do with the bombs? They just drop the bombs. That's what they the bombs into the cold to reignite it. It starts rotating also. Kind of. Sort of. Sort of. Yeah, Yeah, I love that because that will happen. People outside. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everybody knows that when the thing stops rotating, you fucking nuclear bomb it. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. You just build a very, very quick machine. No one's done before and just drill very quickly into the core with a crew who've never done it before, they don't know what they're doing and then find nuclear bombs. To be fair, if there were ever any one, I would want to to to to be responsible for that test. That would be Stanley Tucci. Yeah. I trust him. Yes, he does play a bit of a dick, though. His character is interesting because he plays a real dick, actually, and he don't like it. But then at the end, you sort of do. I don't. Spoil it. That's like, Yeah, I wish they made more disaster movies. Maybe they make plenty and I haven't seen them, but I do have a bit of a soft spot for those shows. Uh. I think they just took a break because. Because it was like it was so popular. They just do whatever. It's popular. Whatever. Yeah. Just made people go to the cinema right now is the how a company was created that's the most. Yeah. If you have the insight to it like Tetris, they're fucking the MacDonalds one. Yeah. All just all Yeah. Yeah. And I just. Try to remember because it was 2012 and it was just the whole thing with the Mayan calendar and it felt like just Yeah, another one. After the other, The Nike one is now banned because that's, there's like I think eerie stuff but, but, but, but yeah, the cool is funny because I saw that when I was about 12. So it's like following on from the conversations we've had recently, I think I found it more than nostalgic because of course it's so ridiculous, like cocaine backwards, but and it has new character development to it. Whatever we thought about how it how however the hell we put it when we spoke about cocaine bad but but it's actually because I watched when I was 12 for the first time and it's so dumb. I think it was a nostalgic element to it as well as like, Oh yeah, I'm really liking this. When I was 12 and then I rewatched it again and you know, I liked it because I liked it when I was 11 years ago. Well, maybe now that the world is actually ending, that the people's appetite for disaster films, it's sort of like watching the news now. So they're like, Well, I don't really. Well, that's the thing. Yeah, that's my disaster film. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. We watch disaster films every every day. Maybe we should do one episode on the best disaster films of all time. Yeah, I'll be up for that. Roland Emmerich, the master isn't of. Yeah, that's a good idea. Remember that? Oh, yeah. I don't know. What was it, Dante's Peak or. Yeah, it's 2012, the day after tomorrow. Yeah. Oh, good one. That's a. Comment. One. I'm thinking that what was the comet with Elijah Wood? No, no, no. That was another one. It had Elijah Wood in it and it had the comet deep impact. And I said oh yeah. Oh deep. Deep impact in Armageddon I think might have come out same, same, same time. Yes. And then you have the weird ones like the von Trier one where the moon is about to crash into the earth or whatever it is. Oh, moonfall, whatever. I haven't seen that. I think so. Maybe it's just a meteor, but it's basically a party. And then they know that, you know, uh, life. The earth is going to be blown up in a sec. Well, um, very good. Well, it's always good. Steaks, isn't. It? Is that worth seeing? That one is worth seeing is von Trier. So it's got to be weird. I'll try it. You know, go to Alexander Skarsgard again. I'm not gay, but very attractive. Oh. So that one won't be Moonfall because volunteer can't imagine von Trier did. The most recent one called Moonfall must be a no no. It was a movie. I think it was a meet meteor that was going. Right, right, right. Okay. Um, no, no YouTube cooking shows this week. Actually, I don't even know why I ask. Of course. Oh. Well, you shouldn't have asked. I thought you never. I don't. Know. No cooking. However, I am obsessed. There's this dude. I don't know what it's named, and it's just on YouTube shorts, and I never save it. All he does is, uh, talk to people that are in debt and tell them how stupid they are for getting in debt. So he's just sitting there with their, like, bank accounts and all the transactions, which is embarrassing for anyone. And then you go, What the fuck is this? What are they doing? Well, because they are clearly in trouble and maybe there is some hope at the end of the tunnel. But but basically what he does is just helps helps you organize your life. But sometimes it goes it's it's you're done. So it's like Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares, but not for your financial. I was thinking exactly that. Yeah, it's exactly nightmares, but for the bank statements and wouldn't be the same mentality. We yeah we should make some that for a TV series because I think it's like the selling sunset or Gordon Ramsay. Yeah, but just with you because you get to see how how crazy some of these people are that just look like you met them on the street, but they're in fucking $300,000 debt. Yeah, yeah. Still, they wanted to Teslas and they worked on my dog. Yeah, that's fun. And you could do a fly on the wall for you. Could follow them around to the local mall on a Saturday and you just follow them and. And they get. So what would you usually buy. What I. Yeah. That's why you buy that you got no money. Well I've got a credit card. Don't do that. You stopping by the butcher shop. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All of that. I would watch that. Uh, very good. Very good. Okay, cool. Well, given this is going to be a slightly shorter episode this week, um, let's move on to our main review, which is Creed three for anyone who, for some reason doesn't know. What about the Creed films? They are essentially spinoffs from the Rocky films based on Apollo Creed, son, Adonis Creed. Um, which is my least favorite part of these films. The fact that he's called Adonis is the stupidest Adonis ever, but. Probably mean something, huh? This feels like the writer was like, This means something. Well, it does. It means like a perfect physical specimen, basically, so. Oh, does it? Yeah. It's a Greek. Greek word, I think, for, like, the perfect male specimen. Yeah. A very Adonis. A very handsome young man. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. There you go. So, um. So it's. It's. And I guess this is one place, a fairly interesting place to start, because first, Rocky came out 47 years ago. Wow. Yeah. And then obviously there were a bunch of Rocky films. I think there were five main Rocky films. Um, and then, you know, some, you know, someone had the good idea of sort of revitalizing it with Michael Jordan playing Apollo Creed's son and that first film that did pretty well. I thought it was quite good. And Sylvester Stallone still playing Rocky training. Uh, Adonis Creed, and he won a well, he got nominated for an Oscar for best supporting Actor in that one. So it wasn't like that, you know, although I suppose Rocky won Oscars as well. So it's they've got quite a decent history of awards, these films. Yeah. And it's got, uh, Michael B Jordan as director for this one, which is interesting. Yeah. Um, written by Keenan Coogler, Ryan Coogler and Zach Fail And Ryan Coogler was the director for the Black Panther films, and he's also a writer now. So I think that he probably showed Michael Jordan the ropes a little bit. And this is, you know, that's kind of why he was on this as well, is starring Michael Jordan, Tessa Thompson and Jonathan Majors, who's unbelievable in everything I know. He's one of my favorite new guys. The first time I saw him was in the Loki series. Oh, I remember. It was a very rarely like, uh, go, Who the hell is this guy? Like, I really remember leaning forward and being like, Whoa, this guy is amazing. Like, straight away he's got some kind of. He's got some presence. Yeah, he he does. You really buy everything he does and five? Yeah, for sure. He's super into it and like, very, very just very intense in everything. Yeah. Right. Yeah. He's a real talent and he's becoming well, I mean there's this and man Quantumania, which he plays the same role he played in the Loki series, which is Kang the Conqueror. It's a different version of him, but he's, he's really landing some big roles now. So just, yeah, let's, let's get into what did you guys, uh, what did you guys think of this? Yeah, I mean, it's funny because I've never, I've never seen any of the Creed movies. And I'll also say that I've only ever seen the first Rocky, Okay? And I saw that when I was about 13, I think, and I really enjoyed it. So but, you know, Creed's in the original Rocky, so I sort of got a little bit of what was going on from this season and we're in the future, but it's just, it's more of the same, I suppose. Um, I quite liked it. I quite liked it. I thought all the central performances were great. As we just mentioned, Michael Jordan did a very good job directing and acting bloody well. That must be tough. I can't imagine doing that. I mean, I don't know how you do it. I really like, do you do a take and then you rush to the monitor, rewatch that, take, give your own, give yourself notes, do it again. I mean, I never quite understand how people do that and how can you do it when you know your own opinion is one thing, but it's you need someone else surely to tell you. But I mean, he smashed it. He smashed it. Yeah. I just don't know how you can get the balance there. I mean, obviously some people, Ben Stiller does at Disney and quite a few people do it, but oof! And something so intense. Kudos to him. But yeah, the fight sequences were probably my favorite. Weirdly, I thought the last fight sequence was bloody good with it. I mean, you know, without spoiling too much, it it's more about their mentality, isn't it? It seems, from a fight and psychological state. So who was really smart and clever? And. But I was mainly impressed by Jordan acting, directing is some brutally honest. Yeah. I was like yeah. Was impressive. Well, I guess. I guess maybe this is partly why having Ryan Coogler on board. Maybe he's the guy who stays at the monitor while Michael Jordan's acting and then gives him some notes because otherwise you're right, be complete. You'd have to watch everything you've just done, see if you've got to keep going. If you don't think you know. Yeah, it's. Well, maybe he did, but maybe I don't know what the partnership would have been like. Maybe Jordan's. Maybe Michael Jordan's like, what? I'm directing, so I'll do it. Or maybe he was like, I'll direct everybody else. But Ryan, you can give me notes. That would be it. That's a smart thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But then it almost would feel like the coach. Makes a lot of sense. Yeah, it does make sense. What did you think of Clooney? Yeah. Yeah, I thought it was. I thought he was pretty much the same scenario. Steve I've only seen the first couple of Iraqis. However, I'm half-Italian. So many Italians force me to watch it over and over, especially American Italians. Fuck me. But, um, I haven't seen the first two creed even though they were all ama especially the first one has been on my list for a while. I thought it was good. I, I, uh. Uh. Mr. Jordan is fabulous. Just. I really like him as well. He is very intense by all means. Um, but there's something about him as well, um, that I find really, uh, just very vulnerable and, um, still very strong. Um, a lot of themes going on, um, that I feel like sometimes they went into it, sometimes they didn't. I will be very curious to see what happened with Stallone because obviously he was on board and then he wasn't. Um, well, so what, what creative differences was that? That, uh, kind of they were split on and where did they go, where they weren't going before? Yes, Well, I mean, he's touched on it briefly, but yeah, I doubt he's telling the whole story. Well, all he's said about it is that they were going in a direction that he wouldn't have gone and they had creative differences and decided to go their separate ways. And Rocky wouldn't be a part of this, which he was a part of the first two grades. Yeah. Um, and all he said is that he said or the quote exactly at the end of the quote. Anyways, I wish them well, but I'm much more of a sentimentalist. I like my heroes getting beat up, but I don't I don't want them going into that dark space. I just feel like have enough darkness. So I guess he didn't he didn't want to go into too much. The the back story of the two characters and well. Child. To kind of mental. But to be honest, I was a part of the film I quite like. So maybe in the end they made the right decision. But it would have been interesting to see if Rocky had been in there as well, how he would have fitted in. That's, that's, that's what I liked about it was that back story, and they brought it into the final fight and you know, the whole story down with his mum or his, his adoptive mum I think, or Yeah, um, you know, spoiler up, you know, passing away added an extra layer to it of just, you know, real life. I was honest because I honestly couldn't remember much of Rocky and I haven't seen Chris. I was expecting just a bit of old. You want a fight? Yeah, it's less of a fight. And then and it's the end. That was honestly what I was expecting. Like the Fast and the Furious. Just lots of cars racing. I was expecting lots of boxing, which it was boxing, but they added in these layers that were necessary, I think, to making it a more rounded film. This is it. And I think they've done quite a good job. In fact, you know, you can't really compare these films to the old Rocky films because film makers have done so much. But, you know, essentially they're very good at, um, developing and building the tension to the point where you really want to see the final fight. You know, it's coming not, yeah, who's going to win, but you. But you at least you think you know who's going to win. To be fair, what they did quite well in Rocky. The first one is that Rocky didn't win, which was quite a surprise. Um, but you saw. Yeah, he was going to win at least a bit and. But you still, they build it to the point where you're still like, okay, I really want to see this final fight now and, and see who's going to win it. It really activates this quite basic. Maybe, maybe it's more of a guy thing, but this quite basic kind of the and the thought brain just going right. I want to see these two punch each other and see see who wins, you know. Yeah. And they developed enough with the back story and I thought they were quite clever with this. Uh, you know, the, the, the challenger, why it came about and it's in keeping with the Rocky themes as well as a nobody being given a chance, just like Rocky was given a chance. Yeah. And, and I wonder whether from the ending, I wonder whether there's going to be another trilogy, you know, maybe ten years down the line of his daughter. Yes. Exact being a female boxer, female creed, which I think is the right way to go. You know. I think so, too. I think I think that's exactly what they're setting up there. Um, because he can't continue boxing now, like, even with this, he's supposed to come back from retirement. So if it's going to be anything, I think moving on a few years and having him train his daughter would be a good way to go. And it seems like, well, they're setting up. Yeah, that would be good. And it's just about enough. Enough to kind of revive Vitaliy with because they're really just sucking them. Of course, it's a new story and it becomes a new thing. Um, but, but you know, they, how much they lean on IP is fucking mad. And in terms of that, I have to say that it's, they're, I think they're lucky that they have people that really care about, um, this franchise in a different way even, and even though Stallone doesn't agree to it, it's, it's it's a really good example of how to make close to a dozen films and even though sometimes maybe they're not in credible they're all pretty good from my understanding and make a shit ton of money. Yeah, exactly like that. Well worth. Yeah. Well, yeah. 2 to 270 million. The box office so far for 75 million budget. So it is it does clearly still bring people into the cinemas which is. Yeah. You know, I guess like us that we have this kind of basic when it comes to a boxing film, there's very few other kind of set ups that you can that you can have that have such a definitive of that sort of third act piece. Like one of them is going to win the fight and it's going to be a boxing match. Like you can't really get more definitive than that as a as a finishing point for a film. So I think that's partly why they do so well. You're you know, what you're going to get and it's going to be, uh, trying to set up these two characters to the point where you really want to see the final fight. And that's what they did in this. And partly, yeah, well, one thing I have to say, if you want to see a film that makes you feel bad about your physical condition, then for sure. Yeah. See this? Because these two guys are just so, so ripped and just like, Yeah, this in Mexico, you know? How long would it even take me if I did it every day to get to that point? I don't even know if it's possible, man. Well, yeah, diet diets, which I know that. Oh, that's. I don't want to do that. Those words in that sequence, in the way you said it, I couldn't, I couldn't agree more as to why, uh, if I was paid a bunch of money, but probably not even then. Probably not even then. Depends how much. If there was if there's a couple of million flying around him, I might really consider it. But it's. It's. What is it? I mean, it's basically every day for one day of the week, maybe in the gym three times a day. And then, you know, eating boiled chicken and broccoli and brown rice three times a day. And, you know, for nine months. Nobody but me. I have to say, if I if they gave me the money upfront, I'd probably just spend it all on food anyway. So they would have to they would have to basically cut off my bank account for nine months. That would be the only way. And make me train every day then. But then I would maybe. Yeah. Then I would say you seem to be too complicated to deal with in general. So I probably wouldn't. That. Wouldn't take that risk. And to be honest, I would have done the same. Um, because fuck me, But it's also the weight loss, right? And they feel sick and they have to right before they shoot. They have to starve themselves even more. And all that stuff. Well, starve themselves. And also I think it's pretty common practice that they can't even have a drink of water for 24 hours before before they take their share of. So it's like, Jesus, they really like. Yeah, I mean, talk about giving people unrealistic body image expectations. I understand it from the woman's point, but from the man's point of view, you're like, I really can't do this. Let's go. Yeah, well. What one could argue we could, because he does. But what's really interesting is if we were on the erm or those dating shows when it was like uh, four guys and one girl and the girl picks, it will be funny if it was four guys, three of them was us and one of them were Michael B Jordan. And then we would go like, it's not even real. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. He's, he's got his top off and we've all got like jumpers on. Yeah, yeah. A little. Little cardigan just like. Yeah. I just love that difference of his. Anyway, underneath that I'm not going to show you. Yeah. Meanwhile she's already gone out the door with him. Yes, exactly. But it goes beyond it goes beyond acting at that point isn't it, when you go to do that like get into shape so much because it's like, okay, you got an acting job in 12 months, but you're also being paid for about a year to just be on a diet and eat stuff and go to the gym. So it's like you've got to go to jobs that really. Yeah, bizarre. It's kind of a strange situation. We're prepping a feature about a dude that gets stuck in the forest and essentially dies, but he's just going to deteriorate and get skinnier and skinnier and skinnier. And the dude that we have for it, he and he's done it before for a short with that, he's going to starve himself for a month and a half. When he came on the short you could see his ribs. Mm. And he hadn't eaten. Um, yeah. For about a month and a half. And the first time he ate was on camera. It's a shame we had to delete that scene, but. Uh, I was just kidding. I was just kidding. I was kidding. We had to delete the whole short, actually. But we're making the BAFTA, Am I right away? And he's a superb actor as well. He really can be really any part. Any part. He we had him for how to make a cheap for a little. A. Couple of lines and even those couple lines we've just done it in a way that I can't imagine any other actor could do it quite like him. Yeah, he brings a real gravitas and a commitment. Peter Frost Look him up. Peter Frost. Okay. Shouts out. Well, okay, just see if there's anything more quickly to say. But other than that, I think we've got to get going. Uh oh. I didn't know that. I didn't know this. This very common knowledge that Blum and Stallone wrote the first Rocky. I literally have no idea. Oh, man. Yeah, he wrote it in, like, a month or something. I was from an article and then. His first script as well. His first Christmas. Um, Billy, he wrote it and he saw it. And then he was, he insisted on playing the leads. And the studios apparently were like, Well, no, you can't play the lead. But by the rights for a couple of hundred grand. And he was like, No, I'm playing the lead. I'm not accepting that. And then they had to give him it. And then they reminded the story to the heartbreaking story because also I think from what I remember, like he was so broke, he even had to sell his dog and he sold his dog to this to this guy at a gas station. And then when he got the money from making the film, he tried to track the guy down again and buy his dog back. And the guy made him pay like 15 grand or something just to get his dog bounce. So he was really rock bottom and he still turned down all the money they offered him, even though he was completely rock bottom. So that's a that's a lesson in dedication and believing in what you what you've got a bit. Pissed off as far as the dog. But yeah. All right. Let's quickly give us some scores. Um, oh, I, I enjoyed it is just a standard. There's nothing if you've seen the other Rocky films in the Creed films, there's nothing to, you know, different in there. But I really like Jonathan Majors, and I think Michael Jordan did a good job in general. I'll give this a seven. A great Well, I would go with seven. Yeah, me too. Great fucking fight sequence at the end. It does What it says on the tin. Um, I think they were smart. They didn't fuck up anything, they didn't revolutionize anything. But yeah, type. Um, all right, well, on that note, uh, let's with next week, we're going to do well, we'll see. We're going to do the film Plane. I think, um, with Gerard Butler, one of my favorites when it comes to action films. Um. No matter how old is. No matter how old and this is. Yeah, this is one where he's starting to get young. So you're like, Oh, okay. But then they gave him a role that fits him being a bit older as well. So I like true, I got a lot of time for him. So yeah, I will see you guys next week for that. Again, remember to remember everyone who's listening to follow us on Spotify, Apple, wherever you are listening. And we going to be listening. If you are listening. Is there anyone. You you that Yes, please email and say save the chat, but at gmail.com uh, the quietest email address in the world at the moment. Um, but we'd love to hear from you what you think about the films, what you think about a podcast. At least let's get some junk mail in that. Makes me sick and stuff. Except those cookies. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, man, Yeah, some, uh, some penis enlargement emails, you know, that would make me feel better. I can forward mine, to be honest. That reminds me of. That reminds me. See me on the first. Ever. Post and then I'll send them, you guys. But I remember the first ever spam email I got for the penis. Enlargement was from the email address. Incompatible Johnson. Said. Compatible. Okay, so that was the funniest thing. So I almost almost replied just for that. That's great. But yeah, everyone, thank you for listening. Please join us again next week for Plain um and thank you guys for, for joining as well Thank you sir. Thank you. And see you next week. You're next week. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God.