Beards On The Street - Episode 112… Live in studio with Thomas Dockstader

What happens when a former FLDS cult member confronts decades of buried trauma and finds spiritual awakening? Thomas shares his extraordinary journey from Warren Jeffs' polygamous community to the depths of alcoholism to profound transformation through ayahuasca.

Growing up under extreme religious control, Thomas's childhood was marked by child labor, indoctrination, and sexual abuse. After leaving at 18, he experienced what he calls "the pendulum effect"—swinging wildly from restriction to self-destruction through alcohol, failed marriages, and eventually a near-suicide attempt with a loaded gun on his front lawn.

The turning point came when Thomas realized alcohol wasn't his problem—it was his solution to deeper wounds he'd never addressed. Through meditation, hypnotherapy, and eventually ayahuasca ceremonies, he uncovered how childhood trauma becomes coded into our subconscious beliefs, creating patterns that can rule our entire lives unless confronted.

Thomas offers profound insights into healing generational trauma, breaking addiction cycles, and finding self-acceptance. His most powerful revelation? "You don't need to be healed. You just need to remember who you truly are." This perspective shift—from seeing ourselves as broken to recognizing our inherent wholeness—changes everything.

For anyone struggling with trauma, addiction, or simply feeling disconnected from their authentic self, this conversation offers both practical tools and spiritual wisdom. Thomas's vulnerability in sharing his darkest moments creates a roadmap for transforming pain into purpose and living from a place of genuine self-acceptance.

Subscribe to hear more conversations that challenge conventional thinking about healing, purpose, and what it means to live an authentic life. Your journey toward remembering who you truly are begins with stories like these.

Transcript

Episode Introduction and Housekeeping

Speaker 1 0:20

Hey, hey, hey people, it's Friday, easter weekend. Welcome to Beards on the Street. I'm Perry Dean Ward, we got Mr Thomas over there and Mr A-A-A Ron Morning. You know I always add different A's in yours. Like I get going so fast, I add like five A's, I believe it. You go fast. No Right, it's not fast, dude. You go fast. No Right, it's not fast, dude, it's with purpose. Yeah, come on. Did you see, I think, bouncing them back and forth? We're not live, that's okay, we'll go live. Maybe it's my fault. Wow, weird, that's my fault. Wow, weird, that's so weird.

Speaker 1 1:07

Dude this guy. He and electronics do not work at all. You haven't seen the cluster we have with me and the calendar. I was just going to say he just tries to set up a calendar invite and send it out and it is absolutely muddled, for lack of a better word.

Speaker 1 1:37

I didn't tell you this, but I did it with our appointment yesterday with Gary, or two days ago with Gary, and did you mess it up? And he sent me the soft reminder of hey, wrong day. And then well, it's funny because we got off the phone. Why is it so hard for you? You walked in my office the day I did it. You walked in my office and as soon as I was inputting it, you started talking to me. Oh so it's my fault, this one was. And then, squirrel, as I was inputting it, I you started talking to me. Oh so it's my fault, this one was. And then squirrel, no, I know my, my attention span, so I did it that he and then I had to text him back and forth and then I sent it to him. It was wrong. And then he, and then he sent back this nice he's, he's, he is like one of the pillars in our real estate community.

Speaker 1 2:24

I mean, been an agent for 40 plus years, right, Really stud of a dude, like influence in our industry. Yeah, and his little response to me was what was it? It was basically to the point of keep it tight to impress, or something like that Are you challenged? It was kind of like, hey way to impress me, kind of a deal. It was nice the way he said it, but it was just it was teasing me. I have the faith in you, aaron. I think that you're.

Speaker 3 2:55

I think you're going to get it down one of these days.

Speaker 1 2:57

I will figure it out. It's really. I mean, you've got the date, you've got the time and location, you've got the date, you've got the time and location, you've got the location and who's coming and you've got the invites. So maybe make yourself a little list and a little checkbox type list, right, right, it seems to be the date that I'm having a hard time with. All right, so here we are another week. We're a freak. We're already more than halfway through April already. Time is flying. We're already through first quarter. First quarter, yeah.

Speaker 3 3:31

We're in second quarter already.

Speaker 1 3:32

A blink and it's over. It's insane. Anyways should we handle just housekeeping type stuff real fast? So we can get in with this cat. Yeah, get into the fun conversation. So I picked up another listing. It's actually a sell-by, so happy about that. I got to be there for that, yeah wasn't that fun.

Speaker 1 3:55

Yeah, they were great, cutest little freaking. It's some really good friends of mine, it's her dad and mom and I swear to you, dude, this dude's five feet tall, wow, and just Ex-military. Diamante is his last name, so Italian, big time right, and he's ex-military. He's an ex-retired highway patrolman, oh wow. He retired from the military, then he retired from highway patrol and then from something else and then from the water district or something. He's had three full careers and now he's going on 20 years working at a golf course. This dude is amazing, sweetheart guy too, so nice Anyways.

Speaker 1 4:38

Yeah, picked up that If he pulled me over, I'd probably take the gun away from him. I'd like to see you try, bro. That guy would whoop your ass. He'd just punch you right in your balls. Dude, I'd just lay on him Right, if I could get to him right, right, yeah, no, no, nicest guy, I guarantee you. That guy never had. In my opinion, we'll have to ask him if he ever had any confrontation ever in his career. I'll bet he didn't, because he's just one of those guys that you just immediately respect. You know what I mean. Doesn't talk down to you, nice as can be, doing his job, guaranteed. He was that guy. He shows up with that respect as well.

Speaker 1 5:19

Did I ever tell you, I sued a Utah Highway Patrolman. Actually, I sued the state of Utah Successfully. Yeah, actually, I sued the state of Utah Successfully. Yes, is his mic on? Yeah, the sumbitch attacked me. Is his mic on? Check, check. Yeah, okay all right, yeah just get your face in it, dude, all right.

Speaker 3 5:34

Get my face right in it, finny, no.

Speaker 1 5:47

So, anyways, had a killer week as far as VIP 50. Uh had an amazing meeting yesterday with uh a couple of cats with a couple of cats, um, you know, we're uh, uh there's an owner's meeting that we're going to partake in in uh next Tuesday, uh to to talk about our VIP 50 and train it's it's about a thousand agents Over the full brokerage.

Speaker 3 6:02

The full brokerage, the full brokerage, yeah, over the state of Utah. Different owners, but same brand.

Speaker 1 6:07

Wow, yeah, it's really cool. Had an amazing meeting with a guy that I met not too long ago. I did a deal with him Scott Eames, with Rill and really I mean we talked probably five or six times after. It was really cool Because he kept going Like he's so freaking, he's so tell you a little bit about Scott, this guy. I mean he's a stud dude and been an agent for quite some years and before he was an agent he was in car sales and very, very, very successful he and his brother and actually trained other car salesmen how to do their job and do it right, the psychology of the cell, like just you know yeah really cool stuff.

Speaker 1 6:52

But last year he kind of got his legs kicked out from under him. He had like five or six people close people in his family and friends that all passed away. One of them was his brother that took his own life and and it, it, it knocked him down. It staggered him for sure, like hard, and anyways, I thought it was really cool. Dude, I didn't share this with you, but he called me up after and he's like you know what, dean, he's like you know what's been going on in my life. You know that that it's it's. It's been a struggle. And when I walked out of our meeting yesterday I had that burning thing. I was in the car for that. I haven't had a fire that I can recognize in a long time and I do right now. Thank you, yeah. Yeah, he's got it so pretty amazing. So anyways, yeah, good week all the way around, man, I'm excited where those relationships are going to go oh

Speaker 1 7:47

my gosh dude, we have so much cool stuff. We also pulled the trigger on our national campaign for going national through the VIP. So we're basically doing for lack of a better word, do you know what ClickFunnel is? Have you heard of that? Absolutely. So we're doing a ClickFunnel campaign nationwide to bring on agents to participate in the VIP 50 and let us train them and then coach them through our system Very cool, which our system? I don't know if Aaron's told you about it.

Speaker 1 8:17

It's all about focusing on your relationships and your people 50 of them in your realm or in your sphere and actually really, really, really showing up for people and and and leaning in and really paying attention.

Speaker 1 8:34

Um, and the by-product is is you have an amazing, amazing group of friends and relationships and a community that you're the mayor of, that that you're. Basically you're the one that's bringing this joy to everybody. Cause, I mean, you face it and I'm sure that, just based on the title of your book and I just met you just a few minutes ago but based on the title of your book, I guarantee you this is, this is your woo woo spot, for you know, serving others and being present and being being paying attention to what's actually going on around you and actually giving a shit? Yeah, absolutely. We're in an industry where a lot of agents they stake claim to family and relationships and those kind of things and we teach how to get in true flow and alignment with your friendships and relationships, to where it naturally comes up and it's an opportunity. It's not just as soon as I hear you're going to buy a house.

Speaker 3 9:28

It's like you're on them like a dirty car salesman. Single threaded relationship right.

Speaker 1 9:35

Right.

Speaker 3 9:35

And then, once I'm done, I'm done with you.

Speaker 1 9:37

And it's never hear from you again, because you have nothing to offer to them.

Speaker 3 9:41

Yeah, they, in other words does that sound familiar at all?

Speaker 1 9:44

I understand that words, you get it. And then the by-product of that of of actually, I mean it's fun, dude, it's it's. I mean, we all love our friends, we love hanging out, we love doing fun shit, we love going out, we love, you know, meeting up with a buddy and catching up and having a beer, and and that's all fun, fun, fun stuff, and that's our daily freaking grind, so to say and it's not a grind, it's freaking amazing. And the side product of that is you turn these people into freaking. They'll go out of their way to help you get business Out of their way.

Speaker 1 10:19

The real healing, though, is the deep and meaningful relationships that you foster with the people. You're back in relationship with your brother and sister, you're back in relationship with the people you say that matter to you, and you're actually that connection. That happens. That's the real value and byproduct of the biz. Yeah, it's really cool. So, anyways, we pulled the trigger and hired a firm to guide us through the process of building the ClickFunnel and the ads and all that stuff to to guide us through the process of building the click funnel and the ads and all that stuff to really get it out there, Cause, I mean, dude, we want to change people's lives, man, I mean for the better, and and I mean really, really, really make a difference. So it's kind of cool.

Speaker 3 10:58

Well, now's the time to do it. It is sure there's lots of folks out there that are looking for outside-the-box ways to create.

Speaker 1 11:05

Yeah because it's a tough market.

Speaker 3 11:06

It's really tough right now. Yeah.

Speaker 1 11:07

Yeah, so Good time to do it. Yep, let me remind everybody those of you watching, talk to us, man, send us, chat with us through the Facebook feed. So the way this works. So it's on my page, we're live as, so it's on my face, as live on his as well, and then it later, through the system, gets dumped into YouTube. It goes into all the different. Oh my gosh, we're idiots, dude, I know, but why, what do I know? From now on, we need to have them put us live on their freaking Facebook. It takes two seconds to set it up, to put them them live, so it's feeding out to their people. Would you have enjoyed that?

Speaker 3 11:49

Yeah, because I have 18,000 TikTok followers, so you could go live on TikTok.

Speaker 1 11:54

Oh my hell dude, we've got to get our shit together.

Speaker 3 11:58

That's actually a really smart idea. Yes, it is.

Speaker 1 12:00

We are running like 8,000 miles an hour Okay we're going to shut this off.

Speaker 1 12:06

We're going to turn on him. We're going to turn on him. Give us 10 minutes and we'll be right back. This is a good segue I want to hear about. So how okay, I've been going to the gym. I've been a member there since 06, lifetime Me too, 06. Okay, really Well, I just started noticing him about two years ago. Weird, and it's like I paid attention to this guy, okay, and he works out, keeps to himself, he's there for a purpose. When I went up and approached him, it was interesting. You have a lot of your own stuff that comes up when you're going to interact with people. So every little impression I gave of of what I thought, how I thought he was, it wasn't about him, it was about me. Right, like the, the stories you tell, the, the interactions, what you think, who you think, who you make him up to be. Also, your false beliefs yes, or whatever your projections are, or your false projections yes, and I didn't have. It was interesting. You seem to do that on a kind of a regular basis. We all do.

Speaker 3 13:17

We do. You're actually talking about something that we all do from. The brain works this way If I see someone, it will automatically make a full circle of who that person is Automatically. We contextualize I may only have a 0.0% understanding just what you look like. I just immediately make it up, right, then you talk and then I'm like, oh, that changes that much, yep.

Speaker 3 13:41

Then you tell me a story oh, that changes that much. Oh, you're married. Oh, that changes that much. Yep, then when you tell me a story, oh, that changes that much. Oh, you're married. Oh, that changes that much. Oh, I see your wife. Oh, that changes that much. Then we're building a fuller circle, right? But we all make those snaps, of course we do. Of what someone looks like. Is we okay? We're using past experience to determine who this person is.

Speaker 1 13:58

Right, you know what else we're reading? A book that's's, um, what's it called? Charisma myth yeah, the charisma myth, and it's a killer book. And it talks about, like, literally in that first millisecond, when you're, when you are talking with somebody, you, in literally that fast, you're reading what's going on in in them, through their eyes, through their facial facial expressions, through how they hold themselves. It's like that and you know it's crazy.

Thomas's Background in the FLDS Cult

Speaker 1 14:29

I walked up he was, it was leg day. I walked up and asked him how many more sets he had on the extension, and then I kind of went and did a movement, and then you let me know when it was available. And so I went and did that movement and then I was walking out, he was coming out of the bathroom and I'm like, hey, and I approached him. Good, well, he's been, he's made an impression for two years and I want to engage that. So you approached him and did this when, about a month ago probably Wow, but it took you that long, fun to find out he and I are in total alignment. We're in total alignment with a bunch of stuff. Actually, let me introduce you, thomas. The correct way, so, thomas, is I'm bringing up on our screen your book. So your book's up there now. The cheat code huh, he wrote a book called the Cheat Code and I don't know this other one with your zeros and ones. I'll throw that up there with the leaf thing.

Speaker 3 15:29

It's the same logo.

Speaker 1 15:31

It's the same logo.

Speaker 3 15:32

Same logo from the book.

Speaker 1 15:33

Got it, okay, perfect, so you wrote this book. So talk to us about this book, tell us a little bit about you and what your journey was to writing a book. Yeah, what your journey was to writing a book.

Speaker 3 15:43

Yeah, so I think I've lived five lifetimes in this lifetime. I was raised in the FLDS oh wow, the polygamous cult. Right, warren Jeffs was my principal.

Speaker 1 15:57

Like down in Colorado City.

Speaker 2 15:59

Yeah, the leader that is now in prison, serving two life sentences.

Speaker 3 16:07

Warren Jeffs he was originally his father was the prophet and we actually lived up here in this area and he had a compound up Little Cottonwood Canyon and that was where our school was.

Speaker 1 16:17

Is it right by Lakai? The one right by Lakai? Do you know what I'm talking about? It's not there anymore. The perimeter fence is still there.

Speaker 3 16:24

On Warren's house only I don't know if he still owns it.

Speaker 1 16:26

I don't understand that but now whereby lakai north, south, as you're 90 two little cottonwood there's there, there uh, top of the hill above there's a big, huge um, probably 13 acres.

Speaker 3 16:38

That was walled off, and this was when I was in it was only a wall.

Speaker 1 16:41

This high huh, I know where you're talking, but I'm anyways. Anyhow, that was a bunch 80s and it was only a wall this high. Huh, concrete, I know where you're talking, but I'm anyways. Anyhow that was our Bunch of houses on it.

Speaker 3 16:49

That was our school that we went to, so I went to school there and it was church-led school. So even from first grade on I was getting like three hours roughly of church history indoctrination, whatever you want to call it, as far as they looked at it, flds Right. Yeah, so way, way more slanted towards the original Joseph Smith beliefs polygamy my dad was a polygamist.

Speaker 1 17:15

We were both. Well, yeah, they wanted to slant it towards what they were participating in, so that they made it okay.

Speaker 3 17:21

Sure, but it was based off of what Joseph originally taught, right, okay? It okay sure but it was based off of what joseph originally taught. Right, okay, they, they stuck to that. But then they they just like the church and manipulated it and added things right. So I was a part of that no, I, the church doesn't do that yeah let's not open up that hole.

Speaker 3 17:44

My mom's gonna pull my ear and kick me in the ass but um, went through a lot of stuff let's just put it that way and um, some traumatic things, but in the time I didn't really relate what I was going through as traumatic. Okay, right, it was. I in my mind I related to as a pretty good childhood. People would look weird at us, but whatever, they didn't know me, all right. Well, when I turned 18, I uh was like I don't want to do this. I'm leaving the church. Leaving the church means leaving your family, leaving your yeah, they, they, they.

Speaker 1 18:18

What's it called?

Speaker 3 18:19

Excommunication yeah, you're, you're out, out and and they can't like for the most part of the people in the church. So all the kids I grew up with my friends, it was just a hard chop done done.

Speaker 1 18:29

You're cut off from all of I watched a special about and and and I don't mean to interrupt you, but it's about they called them the lost boys yeah, that's who I was.

Speaker 3 18:38

Yeah, but I was one of the first before they named them lost boys. So, um, but to that point I didn't get pushed out. I decided to leave on my own and I was 18 and I was doing construction since I was 14, so I had good experience and heavy equipment operating and stuff, so I was able to go get a job really easy, um, but what happens is because you're so indoctrinated and you're so protected, we weren't allowed to date. I didn't even talk to girls.

Speaker 1 19:09

Well, you were competition to the old bastards.

Speaker 3 19:11

Well, kind of. But in that particular religion the prophet was the only one that could tell someone who they could marry. A man couldn't just go out and find a wife, Right? The prophet had to tell him. But they couldn't even ask. The prophet assigned it, so it was all about obedience. So you could. If you had more wives, that means you were holier Right. So it was like a reward, a gold star, Right.

Speaker 1 19:34

Perspective Right. So um in leaving because we were in so so if you were kissing the ass of the prophet, well enough, then you got more wives Donating lots of money.

Speaker 3 19:43

Right, well, there's that too, that was a very close correlation to who was running the church.

Speaker 1 19:47

Of course.

Speaker 3 19:50

And so what happened was I was so naive that when I came into the world, when I left, in my subconscious I believed oh, I'm going to hell Because that's what I was told, right, no, I get that. A lot of LDS people I, because that's what I was told when I was a little kid, right?

Speaker 1 20:04

No, I get that A lot of LDS people.

Speaker 3 20:05

I was raised strict, strong LDS.

Speaker 1 20:06

Yeah, If you leave it doesn't leave, right, it's baked into you, right, right.

Speaker 3 20:10

And so I did what I call the pendulum effect. I went from really over here when I left.

Speaker 1 20:16

To the other side.

Speaker 3 20:17

Drugs, alcohol, sex to hell. So why? Why does it matter? Off a cliff Right Like?

Speaker 1 20:20

literally Right.

Speaker 3 20:28

And and the re, and the reason that that is so true is, like a lot of these boys that left, um, I know dozens of people who've committed suicide, dozens, wow. Because what happens is you leave and you dive deep into this. You think, oh, I'm not in this church. So you leave and you dive deep into this. You think, oh, I'm not in this church, so I'm supposed to be doing drugs, I'm supposed to be. You don't realize that there's a middle Right, there's a happy place.

Speaker 1 20:51

Yeah.

Speaker 3 20:53

And that you're not supposed to be destroying your life. And so I got married really soon. I was drinking immediately I got divorced. My dad died. I got married again by the time I was 24,.

Speaker 1 21:07

I was married twice. I joined the.

Speaker 3 21:07

LDS church, because I was lost and I thought well, maybe this is right.

Speaker 1 21:11

This is the answer.

Speaker 3 21:12

Got married in the temple. Six months into being married to that girl, they found out her parents found out that we went to Chili's on a Sunday and they freaked out. She had to go stay with them. She wouldn't come back back home. I ended up getting divorced from her only six months in. She ended up moving in with me and leaving her parents and leaving the church. Then we ended up breaking up and all this time my alcoholism is just like slow worse and worse slowly creeping up.

Speaker 3 21:37

I get into sales. I'm high pressure, sales jobs, right, I'm doing well in sales, but my alcoholism is continuing to climb. I end up meeting a girl at work, getting her pregnant, getting married to her. Some bad stuff happened into the infidelity, this, that, uh when and we ended up getting divorced. When my son was six months old, I took 50 custody of him. But after divorce the alcoholism got really bad. I was drinking gallons of vodka per week like couldn't function without it. I would wake up shaking, I would have to drink. I'm telling you like, on the weekends and my weekend started on Thursday On the weekends I would wake up and take six shots right in a row Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, wow. And then I would drink all day. I would have a water. On the weekends, I would wake up and take six shots right in a row boom, boom, boom, boom, wow. And then I would drink all day. I would have a water bottle full of vodka.

Speaker 3 22:29

I would drink all just straight vodka all the time and I wasn't eating and I'm just drinking, drinking, drinking all the time driving around you name it, and a lot of people. I was like high functioning, because a lot of people couldn't tell that I was drunk, you're were just functioning with it.

Speaker 1 22:42

Yeah.

Speaker 3 22:43

But of course, what? What comes with that is like the hangovers would be so wicked. I'd be like I have to drink.

Speaker 1 22:50

Yeah, Cause I mean you poisoned your body to the point that that you were in trouble. Yeah.

Speaker 3 22:56

Wow. So what ended up happening was when I was about 34, I was so.

Speaker 1 23:03

it was so bad 1834, it was so bad. So you're talking almost eight years, eight years of 18 to 33. I'm talking about this period where you were like really, really, really.

Speaker 3 23:18

Really high, like high level alcoholism was about four or five years. Yeah, like in extreme levels, to the point where I got to the point where I was not four or five years. Yeah, like in extreme levels To the point where I got to the point where I was not partying at all. I would just sit in my house and just drink.

Speaker 1 23:31

By yourself.

Speaker 3 23:32

Yeah, big time, and I got so bad I would hide alcohol in my own house and I lived alone.

Speaker 1 23:39

Trying to manage yourself. It loosens your brain Right.

Speaker 3 23:42

No, because I was worried that people would come over and see the alcohol and think I had a problem. Oh, wow, that's how messed up my brain was. Oh, by the way, when I was 29, I was leaving a bar and I was super trashed and I got in an argument with a guy and his two friends and him beat the shit out of me, literally knocked me out, stomped on my head, fractured my skull. I had a traumatic brain injury. I was in a coma for a month. The doctors thought I would not be able to walk and talk and I'd have to go through all of that. Luckily, for whatever reason, grace of God, I only lost my sense of smell. So even today I can't smell.

Speaker 1 24:19

But that wasn't enough. Eating food has got to suck.

Speaker 3 24:20

I had lots of spicy stuff.

Speaker 1 24:22

Right.

Speaker 3 24:29

I to suck. I had lots of spicy stuff, right, I eat a lot of red hot, um, but that wasn't a like quote unquote, rock bottom moment enough. It wasn't enough. I didn't. I didn't say, oh, I've got a drinking problem. I was like, oh, that was just that guy's fault, I would put the blame on someone else. And all this time that I'm drinking I was putting the blame on. Well, why didn't my parents raise me in that and why did? If I would have had a normal childhood, I wouldn't be dealing with this right now.

Speaker 1 24:47

Right the blame game.

Speaker 3 24:49

A lot of pushing the blame on others right Yep so 34,. I never owned any guns, but I was like I can't stop drinking and this is hell. It was not fun, right, there was no like good buzzy moment.

Speaker 1 25:05

hell, it was not fun.

Speaker 3 25:05

Right, there was no like can be buzzy moment. Like you felt like shit all the time it was drinking, just to feel like half as shitty right, like not even it was there's. No, there was no pleasure in it and it was just getting worse and worse and worse. Wow, so I went. That's sad. I went and bought a 1911 45 and said I'm out, I'm gonna do it. And this was all pre-made. This happened over weeks. Like I was like, okay, I'll get the gun and then I'll get the bullets, and then I'll do this and I'll have it here and I'll buy a safe so my son doesn't find it, just knowing it was going to come. Yep, one night I was like, okay, this is it. It was about 2 up the stairs to go grab my gun and I'm like, yep, this is going to work. Wow, got up there, got it and then I realized I'm like gosh, I live alone. Who's?

Speaker 3 25:53

going to find me, how long am I going to sit here before someone finds me? People don't even have keys in my house. I was just thinking about all this stuff and I'm like, oh man, I have a great idea, I'll go out on my front lawn.

Speaker 1 26:06

I'll do it on my front lawn, because then some random stranger will just drive by and see me.

Speaker 3 26:11

They won't be found. I won't be found by my family. I won't make a mess in my house. My family has to clean up whatever. So I got to that. I'm like, okay, great, that's crazy. I fully and I talk about this a lot when someone is truly suicidal, they won't tell anyone. You will not hear it.

Speaker 1 26:33

No and which is sad because that's the point where they need it the most Exactly.

Speaker 3 26:38

Because you feel like you can't tell anyone, because think about it. I go to my mom and I'm like oh, I'm feeling this way. One of two things is going to happen. Her reaction is going to be angry or it's going to be like we got to get you into therapists, you're going to get committed, right, like.

Speaker 1 26:52

So it's like plus, we're men and we're proud and we have egos, and it's like you shouldn't feel this way.

Speaker 3 27:05

Exactly. You're tough, right. You shouldn't feel this way. You're weak if you feel that way, right? So I go out there. I realize I'm like, holy crap, I have not shot this gun. I don't even know. I'm like, if I pull the trigger and it doesn't go off, fuck Right. So I'm in Draper pointing up in the air Boom, boom. Two times pulled the trigger In the middle of Draper freaking 45.

Speaker 1 27:26

How many times did the cops get called no?

Speaker 3 27:28

one came, dude, no kidding. So then I'm like all right, here we go, put it up to my head and I just, you know, you feel the trigger. You feel the like, the stiffness trigger. Here it comes, and I just had this thought and it was like wait, it's like you have money and you have this and you have that. No one knows anything about your life, and you do have a son. So if you're going to do this, please just like leave some instructions. Don't make this such a headache for everyone to deal with, right? So I was like, ah, so I'm like, okay, so I go in the house and then pass out. Well, I wake up and, by the way, I always lock my doors and everything. I wake up. My mom, sister and brother are in my house. The gun is sitting there on the coffee table and they're like what the hell?

Speaker 1 28:17

And apparently I had texted them goodbye. I was going to say how did they know?

Speaker 3 28:19

Yeah. So they're like what the heck? We got a text from you at three in the morning saying goodbye, and then they saw the gun and everything. So they flip out at me, I get all mad, they leave, take the gun, and then I of course I get drunk, but at that moment I knew I was like I have.

Speaker 1 28:37

That was your cry for help to myself. Right.

Speaker 3 28:40

Cause I wasn't going to accept help from other people, but I was like I have to figure out what the heck is causing me to do this. Why am I drinking myself to death?

Speaker 1 28:47

Right.

Speaker 3 28:47

So then I go on this. I decided I'm like, all right, I have to fix this, I quit just cold Turkey, I'm not going to go to rehab, I refuse to but, I, quit cold Turkey. Holy hell. That had to be pure hell for was hell for like two weeks. Then I got to what they call the pink cloud, where I felt amazing. I was like Holy shit.

Speaker 1 29:08

First time in years.

Speaker 3 29:09

Well, dude, I didn't. I forgot that you can wake up without a hangover, I like. I actually forgot that. Wow. And I woke up and I was like, oh my gosh, I I feel so good. But then what happened was I went three months and I won an award trip at my job and I was down in St Thomas and everybody's drinking and this, and that I went the whole trip. Was it hard to be around it? Super hard.

Speaker 1 29:30

I'm sure.

Speaker 3 29:31

I went the whole trip until the last night and my buddy was drinking. I'm like, screw it and I freaking take a drink. I got so drunk. We went to a freaking gentleman's club and I started a fight with the bouncer and my friend had to tell me this because I got so drunk I was blacked out. Were you mean? Drunk super at that point.

Speaker 3 29:50

I wasn't early on, but I got to be one right and and so but. So what I realized is, like, because I had gone sober for so long, I actually like when I went off it, it went, I went way far right Like super hard way off the wagon the crash is like ridiculous, like no control, wow, and I almost missed my flight going home and I remember getting the airport right in time and I was just bawling my eyes out.

Speaker 3 30:12

I'm like what the fuck is wrong with me? What is wrong with me? I don't understand.

Speaker 1 30:17

What were your buddies saying?

Speaker 3 30:18

They're like dude, like they like. It was just like like chill out bro. What's your problem? Like they, they nobody understood it and I didn't understand. So then I get home and I'm like, all right, I'm going to quit again. So I go another three months ball off the bender, not aggressive out, but just I couldn't withhold this. I had to go buy tequila and I couldn't.

Speaker 1 30:41

What, what, what, what triggered that one?

Speaker 3 30:44

Nothing necessarily. I just kept thinking about it and I was home alone on a Friday.

Speaker 1 30:47

Obsessing over it.

Speaker 3 30:49

And I. So I went into two days, Probably just bored.

Speaker 3 30:53

Well, I see, dude, I'm going through all these pluses. I'm like maybe I'm bored, Maybe I'm this, maybe I'm that, maybe I'm blah, blah, blah. Go through that bender, go another three months. Same thing happens again. This time, though, after I came out of it, I was like holy shit. I'm like cause I believe that if I quit drinking, that would solve it Right. What I realized was I'm like oh my gosh, you were still the same. Alcohol is my solution. It's what I'm using. It's not the problem. Alcohol is my solution to my problem. When I get sober, I feel my problem, and I don't want to feel it, so I drink.

Speaker 1 31:31

Alcohol was the fix.

Speaker 3 31:32

Alcohol was numbing me. Yeah, I didn't feel the problem. So when I quit the last time which now I'm coming up on eight years sober Good for you when I quit the last time, I was like I have to understand what is causing me to fill the need to numb. I quit my job I was sales person at Domo at the time just fully quit my job, didn't have a plan on how I was going to pay for anything, cause I was like I'm going to kill myself or I'm going to die, right? So this is like most utmost important. I completely quit my job and I started digging into like I read so many books from Deepak Chopra, tony Robbins, um, untethered soul, right, like you know you name it.

Speaker 3 32:13

I just consumed myself in it and I was reading, reading, reading, reading, reading. I learned transcendental meditation. I learned how to do hypnotherapy to myself. I met Deepak Chopra, I met Tony Robbins and about three months into sobriety I was getting real like Ante and I had researched. Every book I read was like learn to meditate, learn to meditate. I was trying to do guided meditation and all for all things. I was listening to howard stern and he talked about transcendental meditation and I was like what the hell is that? I didn't know. There's like different types. I go research it. You can't learn it online. You, there's a train. You go to a trainer. There's one here in salt lake. I go and see him. He's like it's a thousand bucks and I was like all right, you better it, better, better fix me, you better not.

Speaker 3 33:01

And the first time he trained me how to do it, the first time I did it, it like blew my mind. It actually shut my mind down and I actually had it calm that urge consciousness good, where I was like no thought and I was like holy cow because I was a like a massive overthinker, like overthinking. You saw it with my planning of the you know Right, I thought I could think through things and like that was my power.

Speaker 1 33:26

It was actually my. You could outsmart it.

Speaker 3 33:27

It was actually the worst part about me was that, because what I learned through meditation was allowing and letting go is the power of everything. So once I learned meditation, then I started to sail with sobriety, because then things started. I started to allow, I started to let and I realized that, like you can't fantasize about it, you can't give it energy, that just just thinking, man, it'd be nice to have a beer.

Speaker 1 33:54

Yep, that can't do that.

Speaker 3 33:55

It's out yeah you know what beer is? It's vomiting, it's disgusting, it's gross. I hate it. Alcohol anytime I think about it. That's my mind is now trained that I think that at all times, no matter what and when I'm around, I'm I'm in sales and tech and I go to like events and there's tons of drinking and stuff. Now I just see it, I see the energy and I'm like gosh, what are they running from where? Why do they feel they need to do this? What is it? What are their? What are they hiding from? Why do they feel the need to do this? What are they hiding from themselves? Of course, I can't say that A lot of people are like oh, you don't drink, you're so brave, and I was like you're brave, you're brave, I'm not brave, I'm actually myself. You're the one that's poisoning yourself to the point where you're inebriated. And then I love societies like You're like inebriated.

Speaker 1 34:41

And then I love societies like well, I was drunk, right, oh, so that now that's an acceptance now From all social lubricant and no accountability, yeah.

Speaker 3 34:50

Oh you were drunk. That's fine.

Speaker 1 34:51

Baby, it didn't mean anything, I was drunk. I've used that one.

Speaker 3 34:54

We've all used that one.

Speaker 1 34:55

Right. By the way, quick shout out Johnny, my little brother spat it off on here. I'm not sure what he meant. Up up, down down, left right, left right, b-a-b-a select start.

Speaker 3 35:04

That's codes, the cheat codes.

Speaker 1 35:07

The cheat codes.

Speaker 3 35:08

I believe that's Contra's cheat code. Oh yeah, cool, but he caught on to it because that is the play. The coding in the Lotus flower Lotus flower is your chi or your balance.

Speaker 1 35:19

Oh, that's what you get it. I didn't get it. I'm like what does that mean? Yeah, he knew exactly what it was.

Descent into Alcoholism and Rock Bottom

Speaker 3 35:24

So it's cheat code. Good job, johnny. The cheat code is your. It's like your codes, the codes.

Speaker 1 35:30

He just said, that's right yeah.

Speaker 3 35:32

It's like the codes for your life, huh, so okay, so we're getting to the good part.

Speaker 1 35:37

Okay.

Speaker 3 35:39

Well, I quit drinking and I learned to meditate. What I realized is I was like oh, okay, meditation helps me today. Now, right now. Okay, it helps me right now. I need to figure out. I know shit happened in my past, but I can't put my finger on what it was. Okay.

Speaker 1 35:57

Did Warren Jeffries touch you?

Speaker 3 35:58

He did not. Someone did A couple of people actually Really yeah. I didn't understand that, though. Okay.

Speaker 1 36:08

Right. So I learned this. Well, you'd buried it, I'm sure, and freaking gone.

Speaker 3 36:13

Oh dude, I have a whole course on this Right Explaining this, Because everybody does this.

Speaker 1 36:17

Right, everyone does this. It's too bad, I mean it's too, too monster.

Speaker 3 36:22

Your subconscious is trying to protect you, so it walls off.

Speaker 1 36:25

My little brother said he really likes you.

Speaker 3 36:27

Good, beautiful. When we feel trauma as a child, we are subconscious automatically walls it off because we don't know how to, how to take the filling. So like, let's say, you're like a three or four year old and when you first start feeling emotions you're just like happy, sad, crying, hungry, right, you're just. And children bounce through it quite fast. How many times have you seen a child just throw in a fit and then all of a sudden switch? That's a child's brain. When a child feels deep shame, it doesn't know what it is.

Speaker 1 37:00

Okay.

Speaker 3 37:01

So all it knows is it doesn't like it.

Speaker 1 37:03

Right.

Speaker 3 37:04

And so the subconscious is like okay, we're going to compartmentalize this over here, we're going to put it away. We don't know how to reverse it.

Speaker 1 37:11

Shut that door, lock that door. It's gone, done.

Speaker 3 37:13

All I knew is that when I went into my other mother's room when I was three or four years old, it felt very uncomfortable to me and I didn't like it. That's all I remembered about it Right. Well, I learned from a therapist that I went to. I learned how to do this, this method. He taught me this method of how to do um, hypnotherapy to yourself, wow, and he brought me down in this elevator, in in in the hypno, and he's like I'm going to ask you a question.

Speaker 1 37:40

You opened the door.

Speaker 3 37:41

He said you sit down, there's going to be a whiteboard in front of you. And he says when I ask you this question, it's going to put a number on the board for you. And I was like okay, so I'm in the hypno. And he's like at what age did you first feel abandoned? And in my mind I'm like abandoned. I know I wasn't abandoned. My parents were there all the time. And then it writes four, man, and I was like four. He's like okay, you're gonna walk down this hallway, you're gonna open the door, you're gonna see your four year old self oh so I walk down the hallway.

Speaker 3 38:15

I open the door. I see a snotty nose crying child, blonde hair just bawling his eyes out. And he's. And here's the here's the awesomest part about this. He wasn't he not? This is not about addressing something. Okay, he said go up to that child, pick that child up and tell that child you are his protector. Now, you're never going to leave him.

Speaker 3 38:39

He's very cool and you're going to protect him now. So basically, he's teaching you that you are protecting yourself. There is an inner child in you that is screaming and crying, throwing fits and drinking himself to death because he's scared and afraid. Right, and he's like then he's like go and create this room. Right, and he's like go and create this room in this environment and make this child feel super comfortable. So I set up all this stuff. I remember I loved my mom's bed when I was a kid, so I gave him my mom's bed. He's like put a TV in front of this child and tell this child that it can see you at all times. Give him a phone and tell him he can contact you at all times. Okay, and he's like now just sit down and spend some time with him, make him feel really good. So then he's like go back, get up in the elevator so I come out of it. I'm like crying and he's like here's the thing, thomas. He's like you are throwing fits as an adult.

Speaker 1 39:28

Because you didn't know how to deal with it.

Speaker 3 39:29

when your four-year-old self your four-year-old self is running rampant in you. Yep, and talk to this four-year-old child as often as you can for the next couple of weeks. We're going to eventually join you guys together and you're going to become one. He's all, but he's like. I promise you this. He's like you're going to. That four-year-old child is going to call you when it's trying to come out. Two days later, I'm driving in traffic. This freaking guy cuts me off and I immediately just like shoot through the window and I'm like this is my four-year-old child. I'm throwing a fit. I'm being a baby right now. Whoa, calm down, be the adult here. I'm here. Hey, we're gonna get through this. Buddy. I literally said that in the car. Wow, I was like we're gonna get through this.

Speaker 1 40:11

That changed my life oh, I can't even imagine dude, because then I started.

Speaker 3 40:16

It started popping up all the time. Right, someone gets upset at me. I need a drink, oh yeah, me, and I'm like I need a drink, oh, that's not me, or if you're upset, I need a drink.

Speaker 3 40:23

That's my child, that's my inner child, that is struggling, wow. So then we did another session where we found where my anger came from, and that was when I was 14, when I got pulled out of school and I got. I basically was child trafficked and was put on construction crews and I was traveling to arizona vegas and they would put like, so you?

Speaker 1 40:41

didn't have a. You didn't have a childhood after 14.

Speaker 3 40:43

No, we, we have like 20 kids my age in two-bedroom apartments with um sleeping bags lined out one after the other like sardines did you ever have to do the uh?

Speaker 1 40:53

I saw another special maybe it was the same one about uh picking up the uh um, walnuts or something, the or something.

Speaker 3 41:00

So that was something we would do, right, like not that exactly, but we had what's called Saturday Work Project, where it's like all the community has to come together. They had young people, like everybody had to work all the time, right. But I was like on crews, where we'd go to Vegas, colorado, like actual construction crews. We would frame apartment buildings.

Speaker 1 41:18

At 14.

Speaker 3 41:18

So fast we were hauling Like dude. They would work us to death. But in my mind at that time I was like this is awesome, I don't have to be at school, I'm out with these guys. You know, this is cool, I get a.

Speaker 1 41:28

Of course they get paid.

Speaker 3 41:29

I'm being a man, I get 25 bucks a day in little incidentals, right, like you're out, you know, and we thought that was like the most amazing thing, right, I had twin cousins, two twin cousins, and we, we were together and we just thought it was so cool. However future state I was, I was. You know why I was angry?

Speaker 1 41:52

because my parents didn't seem to care where I was for like weeks and months at a time right we didn't have cell phones like out of sight, out of mind and then I'd come home they're like, hey, what's up? Like nothing dude and and inside you're screaming man, I need this, I need this.

Speaker 3 42:06

Why don't they care about me? Right like what, what the?

Speaker 1 42:09

and that got me really angry yeah so we.

Speaker 3 42:11

So, after a period of time, we joined my four-year-old, 14-year-old self and my current self together as one wow, and that really healed me. And then meditation helped. And then what I realized after that point is I'm like I have to go through my entire life with a fine tooth comb and I have to understand what happened. So what I did was I I literally went back to the very first memory I ever had. I can remember it still today.

Speaker 3 42:35

I was crawling up the stairs to my other not my mother, but my other mother. I was crawling up the stairs to my other not my mother, but my other mother. I was crawling up the stairs. I can remember the carpet, I can remember the railing, and so what I did is I jotted that down as a bullet point and I said okay, that was the first memory that I was like okay, what's the next memory? Next memory I can remember I was putting roller skates on the back um concrete pad in our house. I remember falling down, slapping my hands. I remember hurting really bad and I remember the parents were like laughing at me and in my mind I'm like why the hell are you laughing, right?

Speaker 3 43:08

but that freaking hurt I'm like, oh okay, you see a little kid fall right, it's funny. Well then, I did that, keep going, keep going. Then I come to a memory and the memory freaking hurts. I don't even want to think about it, I can't even think about it. And I'm to think about it. I can't even think about it and I'm not even four years old, I can't even think about it. It hurts, it stings to even think about it. And I realized it was when I went into my other mother's room and she pulled my pants down and I remembered I was beyond diapers and she was like it was. I remember thinking I'm like this isn't right.

Speaker 1 43:38

So you were molested by a woman.

Speaker 3 43:40

Yeah.

Speaker 1 43:41

Holy shit, yeah, do you know what the odds of?

Speaker 3 43:46

that are against.

Speaker 1 43:47

Yeah.

Speaker 3 43:48

Wow, so that I didn't even remember that until I started doing that work, Right, Okay? So then I realized I'm like oh, I'm onto something I need, need to write my entire life down and I need to find those red flag moments where it hurts.

Speaker 1 44:04

And address them.

Speaker 3 44:04

That's still causing me pain.

Speaker 1 44:06

Right.

Speaker 3 44:07

So then what I did is, once I wrote it all down, I started to connect the dots and say, okay, why I'll give you this is such a great example. Okay, when I was younger, my mom told me me because we lived in west jordan, right, okay we're like the pilgrim clothes and all that right. My mom told me she's like don't tell the neighbors what religion we're a part of and don't tell them that your other mother's your mother. Tell them it's your aunt.

Speaker 3 44:35

I was like five they knew but I was like what the hell is wrong with us?

Speaker 1 44:40

Right Now You're carrying a burden and a secret.

Speaker 3 44:43

I wasn't necessarily. She was just trying. I don't fault her.

Speaker 1 44:46

She was trying to go under the radar.

Speaker 3 44:48

She's trying to protect her family Right. But for me at that age I was like what's wrong with me? Right, so I immediately thought there was something wrong with them.

Speaker 1 44:57

You recognized that you were different than all the other kids. You internalized it, as you too.

Speaker 3 45:00

So now fast forward. How does? That manifest I had. I've been married four times and divorced four times.

Speaker 1 45:09

Are you married now?

Speaker 3 45:10

I'm engaged Good for you, I'm married. Yeah, that's a whole other story.

Speaker 1 45:14

This is the one.

Speaker 3 45:15

Oh, 100%. Yep, I can tell you a really cool story about that. Yeah, this is a good one. But what I realized is I was like, okay, these are causing me problems now. So I have to determine, like, what is the connection with the way I behave today?

Speaker 3 45:28

because I'm trying to determine where is this drinking coming from right okay, well, several of the girls that I dated, when I would go meet their families, I was very much just like stand in the corner, not talk to anyone, and they would take that based on what I look like, as he's an asshole.

Speaker 1 45:46

Right Okay In my mind he thinks he's better than the rest of us.

Speaker 3 45:51

Fearful to talk to people, but I didn't know why. I did not know why, and one day it hit me like a bolt of lightning as I'm doing this work. I was like, well, when I go up and talk to someone and say, hey, how are you, especially in Utah, they're like, oh, hey, what high school did you go to? Immediately I'm like, oh, shit.

Speaker 1 46:08

Yeah, I can't answer that.

Speaker 3 46:09

Well. So I came up with two things that I would answer. Either I would tell them oh, I went't even know, I don't know. And then the bad part about that is if they're like oh, do you know, so-and-so what's?

Speaker 1 46:20

up for you, Right exactly?

Speaker 3 46:21

Shit, now I'm lying to someone that I've just barely met Yep, or the opposite of that is I say, oh well, actually I was raised in the FLAS and I went to Alta Academy. Well, if I do that, they mean, is your dad a polygamist, someone I just barely met? So no wonder I don't want to talk to anyone.

Speaker 1 46:38

No shit dude.

Speaker 3 46:40

Because it's like I don't want to not be friendly, but I just I feel so trapped.

Speaker 1 46:44

And let's be honest, I mean kids at that age. They're brutal.

Speaker 3 46:48

There's not even kids. It's freaking. When I was in my 30s, oh no.

Speaker 1 46:52

but I mean back when going into meeting families like do I share MFLDS? Is he going to take my daughter into that? Is this? There's all these, there's all these stigmas around. So you're, so you're, guarded and hiding all of it.

Speaker 2 47:03

Yeah, I'm already ashamed of myself, and you don't even know why, yeah, for no reason, really Right, you cannot present yourself?

Speaker 3 47:10

It's just because you were different. Yeah, but it was you, didn't ask for it.

Speaker 3 47:15

I didn't choose to be in that, I was raised in it. When I turned 18, I left Right. So now you see what I'm saying. Yes, the connection, yes. So then what I realized? I'm like holy crap, I'm like you have all these beliefs put on you as a child Sub eight years old. It's real intense. Right, that's your coding, right, right, that is your coding, because most of the time at those ages, you're just absorbing, right you're, and especially from your parents, you're taking, you see them as gods. Right, and so you're taking everything that they do as like and it has to be right.

Speaker 1 47:48

It has to be the right thing.

Speaker 3 47:50

Even take the way that they treat themselves. You absorb the way that they treat themselves. So if they're not confident and loving themselves, you think you can't love yourself.

Speaker 1 48:00

Right.

Speaker 3 48:01

That's where, once I got sober, I was like and once I wrote my whole life down, I'm like I got to write a book. I have to write about this because once I started addressing all of this stuff in my life and writing the book was so therapeutic. Oh, I can't even imagine, because I went over and over and over and I was like, okay, that's not who I am, that's not who that's I'm, I'm something else.

Speaker 1 48:24

Talk about diving deep in and and and taking a hard look at yourself.

Speaker 3 48:28

Oh well, so the very first chapter is. That's what I said.

Speaker 1 48:32

I want one of your books Absolutely. I should have brought a couple actions. It's all right, I know a guy that knows a guy.

Speaker 3 48:41

What I realized is I was like, oh my gosh, I'm like I'm hindering myself, like it is me, like this is none of this is my parents' fault, because you started owning it. It's my fault I'm drinking and acting like an asshole. Right, that is my fault.

Speaker 1 48:59

Right, it's my fault I'm drinking and acting like an asshole.

Speaker 3 49:00

Right, that is my fault, right it's not if they get on their knees and tell me I'm sorry that doesn't stop me from making these horrible decisions, right. So once I owned it and once I went through this in my life, I actually dropped down at several levels in what I thought about myself, because I thought I was so, because I was successful in sales, right, all these things, and I just dropped down, but it was all false bravado.

Speaker 3 49:21

I'm lying to myself about everything. But the cool thing is, once I got to that rock bottom, I was like okay, what kind of person do I want to be?

Speaker 1 49:29

Do you know specifically when you got to that rock bottom?

Speaker 3 49:33

You want to laugh? Yeah, the day I quit drinking is.

Speaker 1 49:38

You mean the last time?

Speaker 3 49:39

The last time I, because I knew I kept going through that cycle of quitting Right about every three months.

Speaker 1 49:44

you were in a cycle. This is what happened.

Speaker 3 49:46

My ex. She was having a baby and she had my son and she's like, hey, when I go into labor you need to come get him. And I was like okay.

Speaker 1 49:56

So I'm assuming this baby wasn't yours? It was not mine. No, this was way after Got it, this was six, seven years after. Okay.

Speaker 3 50:02

And I have 50-50 custody of my son. I have since he was six months old. Awesome, she called me at like two in the morning. She's like hey, I'm going into labor, I need you to come get Silas and I of course been drinking. I was hammered and I was passed out and I answered the phone. So I run downstairs and jump in my forerunner in my garage and as I jumped in I just like put it in gear and then I dropped my phone and dumbass that I am I went to go for your phone of the car to grab the phone and the door was open and it just went.

Speaker 3 50:35

It just it caught to the side of the garage and just bent backwards and at that moment I'm like I am fucking done with this, I cannot do this anymore, Because now it's affecting your son. Well, it's dude, it's been affecting my life so bad, but it was just like that was like that was like it wasn't even a. It was a big thing, but it wasn't a big thing.

Speaker 1 50:56

Right, I had done way worse things. It's funny that that one little thing was so profound hair that dropped it.

Speaker 3 51:02

I'm like I'm done with this and and that's what I say to addicts now, when they're trying to go through this process of of trying to like, heal themselves and quit I asked him that question Are you done Because you have to come to that agreement with yourself? You're like I'm done Right, like it's not maybe I'll have a beer.

Speaker 1 51:26

It's like no, I'm done.

Speaker 3 51:27

Wow, never going to do this again. I freaking. And that was your moment, that was my moment, wow. But but again, to be successful in it and to get sobriety, like like the way I talk about it now. I don't. A lot of people are like oh, they're 10 years sober, I'm in recovery. I do not believe that. I don't believe alcoholism is a disease, it's just a coping mechanism. It is a coping mechanism.

Speaker 1 51:45

That's all it is. It's an excuse.

Speaker 3 51:47

If you go and solve your traumas, you won't have an addiction to anything.

Speaker 1 51:58

Dude I take this to an extreme level just. Have you ever had anybody that's that's, that's that's called you out on the carpet on that, on that attitude or that point, with them all day about it?

Speaker 3 52:08

yeah because if they, if they well, you were one, you know if they will do the work that I prescribe right, they will understand right it. Because, because if you stay in that, it's the society, societal thing disease is still victim right, that's right, that is their reason. They've just given them, them, a scapegoat with that, with that answer like like adhd and and having to be on riddlin and it's, it's, it's victim dude yeah, you're still a victim and you're still saying oh, it's something else, it's not my fault I'm not responsible for this.

Speaker 1 52:39

I was born this way.

Speaker 3 52:41

Well, the crazy thing is, as I've progressed and progressed and progressed because that's not the end of the story I have way crazier stuff that happened after that. My vibration has continually rised, and what I see? Alcoholism now, alcohol in general, or anything that takes away your it lowers your vibration.

Speaker 1 53:01

It lowers your vibration, it lowers your vibration. Talk about your vibration. Be more specific.

Speaker 3 53:07

So vibration is like I like to relate it to, like a radio station.

Speaker 1 53:13

Okay, okay, have you ever read a book Like a radio wave?

Speaker 3 53:16

Yes, have you ever read a book and it was kind of like whatever. And then maybe like years later you think about a passage, or you find a passage and you're like, oh shit, I didn't pick up on that.

Speaker 1 53:26

Right, okay.

Speaker 3 53:27

That's a vibration.

Speaker 1 53:28

Okay, it's also flow. You'll relate it to flow when you're flying high Right.

Speaker 3 53:33

Well, because I can say the same things to another person and they'll be like ah, he's crazy, he's this, he's that, whereas another person's like give me more, give me more, give me more.

Speaker 1 53:44

It's a radio station, they're on the same vibe or close to the same vibe.

Speaker 3 53:47

You've tuned into my radio station. You're receiving it, you understand it, you hear it and, dude, I'm telling you the world in general is raising its right vibration. You're seeing more psychedelics, less alcohol. Gen Z is using less alcohol than any of the previous generations. It is a vibration thing.

Speaker 1 54:05

Like you, start to realize that it actually Well, because using the alcohol kills that vibration.

Speaker 3 54:11

Yeah, if someone tells me they want to improve their lives. If I'm like do you drink? Yes, you have to stop that. I can't even help you. Wow, I cannot help you because you will stay in a loop that will never fucking end, really. You will stay in that loop forever.

Speaker 1 54:28

Is it just alcohol, or is it any substance?

Speaker 3 54:31

Anything that you're using on a daily basis to calm yourself. So if you're smoking, weed is like an interesting one because we can have some similar effects to psychedelics Okay, however, somehow they classify it as a psychedelic. However, here's the thing with weed. If I'm smoking weed every single day to get through life, it's still it's still a crutch crutch.

Beginning the Healing Journey

Speaker 1 54:58

That's a problem, right, that's a problem. So I have a question for you. So take a guy like me. I, I don't drink every day. I rarely, rarely. I mean, I have available to me all the time, but I rarely drink at home. Matter of fact, about the only time I ever drink at home is if I'm going out and I'm just doing a pre-gamer. Sure, I'm a 100% fun social it's. I don't have to have it. Yep, I mean literally it's. And I'm finding that the older I'm getting, like I mean, there was a time there where when I drank I drank a lot, but it wasn't like it was an everyday thing I would drink. I'd wake up the next day and feel like shit and go well, I'm not drinking for a week. Do you know what I mean? But, but even that is calmed out big time. But so talk to me about something like that, because I don't have to drink every day.

Speaker 3 55:56

I don't want to drink Bro.

Speaker 1 56:02

I bet money. It's's, it's the reading, it's, it's the space. We've stepped into the coaching. Right, I'll bet you've naturally, you've naturally shifted up.

Speaker 3 56:06

you will work away from that. Like if you go do like a heavy dose hero, dose mushrooms or something like that and you get into that space, you will stop using everything, naturally.

Speaker 1 56:18

Brian Smith. Well, there is nothing other than that.

Speaker 3 56:21

You will stop. It will just stop Right. It won't be like oh, I need to stop this, you won't want you won't be called to it, you won't want it. Dude the reason I don't want it now. I don't want to lose the amount of clarity I have in my mind at all times. Right, like the idea of I know what it feels like to get drunk. The idea of getting a buzz makes me agitated because I'm like I'll lose my clarity. But let me tell you something else here.

Speaker 1 56:46

Let me, let me touch Right, let me tell you something else, though that that that I'm finding out, that's kind of interesting. I can't believe you're admitting you're going into the woo. Dude, I'm going into the woo.

Speaker 3 56:57

It'm going into the woo. It's not woo dude, it's not right. It is true, I get it holy crap.

Speaker 1 57:01

I just I give him shit about being woo woo because he he I understand doesn't matter, it's just, it's just our way of teasing, teasing, yeah.

Speaker 1 57:11

But here's the other thing, though, bro is is I'm a huge gregarious. I love, I love being around people, I love going out and and, and you know, just having people are so drawn to me because I'm I'm gregarious and happy and and I don't judge anybody, my, it actually makes my wife go crazy, cause she says that you, just you, have no ability to read people cause you don't judge them. Okay.

Speaker 1 57:39

Anyways, the long or the short is, the less that I drink when I'm going out, the less that I actually want to be there. But I'm not okay with that because I love that.

Speaker 3 57:50

That's the vibration that I'm talking about Interesting. You know what I?

Speaker 1 57:54

mean you caught that? No, I caught it.

Speaker 3 57:56

He's right, you are out of a vibration, you're in a different vibration now, and so you're like, oh, I don't want to be here, however you want, but I love it, but you want the interaction, okay. So here's the thing like concerts.

Speaker 1 58:07

I love ask him we've gone to concerts and have so much freaking fun you don't have to be drunk.

Speaker 3 58:12

And you don't have to be drunk.

Speaker 1 58:12

I know that, but, but, I'm just saying to you but there's this, there's this shift with me.

Speaker 3 58:17

You can still go to a concert, right, and I know that. But what will happen is, as you change, it's like leaving a group and you're kind of alone for a while and then you'll start to magnetize another group on another vibration. So, like I'm, in big groups where there is no alcohol.

Speaker 1 58:35

But I don't want to leave my group this absolutely is.

Speaker 3 58:39

Do you see what I mean? This absolutely is a stage. I'm just telling you, this is what will happen.

Speaker 1 58:43

This is absolutely a stage dude.

Speaker 3 58:44

Right, this is what will happen. There's two things that will happen If you continue down the path of raising your vibration. Okay, which may be a big mushroom trip is what you need, or something like that you raise the vibration of everyone around you. Do you know that all of my siblings were massive alcoholics and have been arrested? My oldest brother spent 20 years in prison Since I stopped drinking almost all my siblings have stopped drinking.

Speaker 1 59:15

Right Because of that vibration.

Speaker 3 59:18

Dude the power of of vibration. The higher vibration is more powerful than the lower vibration, no matter what right you raise it wherever you go, so you might find that your, your group, starts to they already have okay, that's my point. It's not like we have to.

Speaker 3 59:37

We have to rid ourselves of attachment I can go level four on this shit and start to really rock you. But attachment is the enemy of enlightenment. Okay, You're attached to your friends, to this, to that. You're attached to your whatever your alcohol, your smoking, your whatever and it's keeping you at a certain level. The more we let go, the more we rise above it, the more we rise above it until we get to.

Speaker 3 1:00:05

But here's the thing, the reason that we want stuff or we like, even the idea of saying, like my child is as successful at school, or something like that, that's not even selfless, because that is validating me as a parent. Oh, so that makes me better if they're better. If they're better, then I can tell myself that I am better. If I have friends that do what I do, I can tell myself that I am good. Okay, when we start to get alone, we get fearful because we don't have validation.

Speaker 1 1:00:34

Oh, I used to be scared shitless of being alone.

Speaker 3 1:00:37

So if you're out of a relationship you're like well, where's my value? Why doesn't someone like that. Right, that's all a lie.

Speaker 1 1:00:44

It is a lie.

Speaker 3 1:00:45

All of it, you are enough.

Speaker 1 1:00:47

So my little brother said to me he said this, his vibration, meaning you, is resonating here, this part. He said sober, this is my little brother, so sober for a year. Never look back, stop, stop smoking mj a month ago. And also, not looking back, say more about the weed.

Speaker 3 1:01:13

You have a brother that does weed. Oh yeah, anything that, anything, that is okay. Okay, let's take substance out of it for a second.

Speaker 1 1:01:21

Anything that I need every day can be bad. Of course it's crutch and victim Netflix food.

Speaker 3 1:01:24

Food TV. Tv my friend. Porn.

Speaker 1 1:01:30

Anything outside of you, anything Work that you need. Work yes.

Speaker 3 1:01:33

Everything, everything, all of it. Okay, I'm going to tell you a story.

Speaker 1 1:01:38

Okay.

Speaker 3 1:01:39

This is amazing. Okay, I'm going to tell you a story. Okay, this is amazing. Okay, I was two years sober. Okay, I was writing my book. Okay, I was single and I was like you know what? I read tons of Deepak Chopra books about manifestation.

Speaker 1 1:01:52

I'm going to run back, keep going, and I was like I need to manifest a woman.

Speaker 3 1:01:57

I'd been divorced three times. I need to manifest a woman. I'd been divorced three times. Right, so I? I write down this list and we live in Utah here, and I was like, oh, I want someone who's and I was in my mid thirties.

Speaker 1 1:02:07

Oh, it was your. It was your ticker list of what they had to be I want someone who's my age, never married, no kids, beautiful, successful Wow. In.

Speaker 3 1:02:14

Utah. Right, I write it all down, I I write it all down. I take it to a real-life matchmaker. I give them $5,000, and I say find me this woman, the second person they lined me up on a date with. She was two years older than me, never married, no kids. She got her master's degree at Oxford. She got her PhD at the? U Smart. She was a business professor at the? U. She got her PhD at the? U Smart. She was a business professor at the? U. She owned her own orchard and she was Miss Teen Utah. Wow, and she liked me. Wow, and she just loved my story and everything okay. Okay, three months into dating she's like I want to have kids. I'm 37. I need to have kids.

Speaker 1 1:02:56

If you're not down for, that let's break it off, and I was like no a hundred percent.

Speaker 3 1:02:59

I'm down to do it. A year from the day we met, we got married. Six weeks after that she was pregnant, little girl. I was like, above, I love my son so much. I'm like I love kids, yep, I love my son so much. So, having a little girl. I was just like, oh my gosh, this is going to be so incredible. Eight months into the pregnancy she couldn't feel the baby moving. We went in to the doctor. They're like the baby has passed away. We had to induce labor. She had to give full birth. The baby was five and a half pounds, little girl, dark hair, soul crushing.

Speaker 1 1:03:32

Yes.

Speaker 3 1:03:33

Soul crushing.

Speaker 1 1:03:34

Yes, did you revert, so listen to this.

Speaker 3 1:03:37

Okay, Two weeks after she leaves me says she wants a divorce.

Speaker 1 1:03:45

Did she blame you?

Speaker 3 1:03:47

I won't go into all the details okay I won't understand, I won't yeah, whatever understood, she leaves right a month after that, I lose my job, job. I lost my job, lost my wife, lost my daughter in a three-month period. Anyone would have reverted, would have been like I'm getting hammered, I'm going back. It's hammer, time it's hammer time, what I did was I dug deeper into it. I'm like this is not a bad thing, this is for me.

Speaker 1 1:04:17

Right, this is the universe speaking to me Think about this for a second.

Speaker 3 1:04:20

This is kind of a weird thought. Jeff Bezos cannot pay for that experience.

Speaker 1 1:04:26

Nope.

Speaker 3 1:04:27

Do you understand I do Losing a child like that is so valuable.

Speaker 1 1:04:33

Right.

Speaker 3 1:04:34

You can't.

Speaker 1 1:04:35

This is what I talk about in our training.

Speaker 3 1:04:37

It cannot be created.

Speaker 1 1:04:38

Right.

Speaker 3 1:04:38

This is what I talk about in our trainings. It cannot be created Right, so why would I ruin this?

Speaker 3 1:04:45

opportunity to have this massive amount of growth, yep. So I dug deep into it. Good for you. I'm going to own this. I love this. This is what I want. This is powerful. I want to understand this. I want to feel it as much as possible. I want to feel the sadness. I want to feel it as much as possible. I want to fill the sadness. I want to fill all the things. Yep, all of it. Yep. I didn't even look for a job. Some company reached out to me and gave me more money than I've ever been paid. I didn't even apply for a job.

Speaker 1 1:05:10

You're skipping a point. What Aren't you, what Are we on your trip yet?

Speaker 3 1:05:21

No, no, no, okay, no that that's happened twice, dude, is it? Yeah, okay, it just happened in August again, so I didn't even apply for a job and they reached out to give me this job, okay, so then I worked for two years and I worked for a startup and I'm just like busting my hump, dude, working six days a week, like just so much work and we end up getting acquired and at this point I'm like four, five, six years into my sobriety and I was really good, like I wake up at 5 am. I go to the gym. Probably when he started noticing me is when this all happened.

Speaker 1 1:05:54

I've been going to the gym for six years, dude, Well you both said you joined the same gym back in 16 or six, six oh six 20 and he, barely, freaking, noticed you two years late, or two years ago, but that's the vibration and right shift.

Speaker 3 1:06:07

I, I get it, I believe it. So I have this feeling and, by the way, I haven't done really anything like. What I mean by that is substances okay and I have this feeling. I'm like I researched ayahuasca years ago and, um, I, because I was looking for something to help me quit at drinking alcohol, right, and I was like I can't go to the jungle and do drugs, that's I wouldn't trust myself, right, but, and you might shit yourself, well, probably, but I had this like deep feeling, I'm like I need to go do this, I need to go do this, I need to go do this, and I'm like I'm avoiding it, I'm not thinking about it.

Finding Clarity Through Ayahuasca

Speaker 3 1:06:43

And then, finally, I was. I did, was just so strong, dude, it was coming up everywhere. People were bringing it up. It was coming up everywhere and I was like, okay, I found the resort. I booked the trip to go to ayahuasca. I was laid off and I'm like, okay, great, this is the, this is the. At that point, I'm accepting everything at all. Right, I don't even fight it, right, I just accept. And I was like okay, this is perfect, because now I'm going to go down here, I'm not going to have my phone for seven days and I'm gonna, I'm not gonna be thinking about work, I'm gonna be thinking about what am I here for? Why am I doing this? Right, okay, so I go to this resort. By the way, it's the same resort that aaron rogers went to and in his documentary on netflix they show my book because I left a signed copy there. Nice, I was like yeah, it was so awesome.

Speaker 3 1:07:29

I showed my book on the documentary, I was like hell yeah you should send a copy to aaron I need to right. You should know.

Speaker 1 1:07:38

I'm going to shit all over you.

Speaker 3 1:07:42

So I go down. You're there for seven days. You do three ceremonies okay.

Speaker 1 1:07:49

Okay, did you go all in? Like, I understand there's different levels, that you can do it right.

Speaker 3 1:07:57

From Chad. Chad was telling me you, can you choose Meaning how strong? Well, yeah, well, yeah, okay. So you see what I mean. Yeah, I'll explain that. So the cool thing first of all, I've run into people here in utah that call themselves a shaman. Right, they're not a freaking shaman. No, like this guy, he learned it from his dad. He learned how to create, make the ayahuasca. He he's been doing ayahuasca, done thousands and thousands and thousands of trips. He leads them. It's a whole energetic thing.

Speaker 3 1:08:27

That guy's a freaking chum right and I have so much respect for it because the energy that he was able to create right environment was incredible right okay, so you go sit down. There was eight. I went to a resort, by the way, that only allows eight people. Some of these places allow 50, 60 people.

Speaker 1 1:08:41

Right, it's too much. You're all laying on shit around in a teepee and much energy.

Speaker 3 1:08:45

Yeah, eight people we sit down. He says okay. He's like I'm going to offer you the first cup. We're going to sit in silence for an hour. After about an hour or so I'm going to say I'm going to open up the table for another cup. You converse with yourself.

Speaker 1 1:09:02

I was going to say. What were you thinking about during that hour?

Speaker 3 1:09:05

I'll tell you. But he says you converse with yourself and determine if you need more or not.

Speaker 1 1:09:09

Okay.

Speaker 3 1:09:10

So that's to your point. Yep, you determine how much you take. Got it the first hour I'm just sitting there and I can feel it coming on, and by the way Like what does it feel like? Keep in mind I've been sober.

Speaker 1 1:09:24

Right, right. So I'm virgin, so you feel also like you're. I mean, did you feel like maybe you were cheating?

Speaker 3 1:09:31

No, not at all, okay, not even a little bit.

Speaker 1 1:09:34

So you said you could feel it coming on.

Speaker 3 1:09:35

What do you mean? I think because my body's so sensitive now because I don't take anything. So, like, like you were getting drunk, or you were getting high, or you were you could feel just like a little buzziness, like something okay, right, and I noticed my mind starting to like Go fast.

Speaker 3 1:09:53

Okay, I would think of something and it would just like go through this, all this stuff, like rip it all over the place. Okay, and I realize I'm like, okay, I would think of something and it would just like go through this, all this stuff, like rip it all over the place.

Speaker 1 1:09:58

Okay.

Speaker 3 1:09:58

And I realized I'm like okay, just so. It's almost like there's two versions of me. There's this version, that's like going fast. And then I'm thinking about like, well, what do I, what do I need to get from this and all this stuff? And and um, I remember my son just came to my mind and I'm like gosh, I love him so much and I'm like, and then I was like oh, when I'm hard on him, I'm also hard on myself. When I'm nice to myself, I'm nice to him. And then I realize I'm like I need to treat like I love him so much. I should love myself so much.

Speaker 1 1:10:29

And it was just like this that was your big kind of no no that was just getting started, so.

Speaker 3 1:10:36

So then I'm just like this is the kind of work in the process that's happening, okay. Then he he says okay, we're opening it up for another cup. All of us go up and get another cup, then I sit down, then he starts playing the music and they tell you, if you get lost, listen to the music, oh, okay. But, he plays music the entire time. He sings, he, he. He has a little that plays too.

Speaker 1 1:10:57

And you can hear it the whole entire time.

Speaker 3 1:10:59

Oh yeah, Okay, it's the whole thing. Okay, the music is the whole thing.

Speaker 1 1:11:02

By the way, that audio that I was telling you about. He talks about how the ayahuasca and about shamanism and he relates it all back to psychedelics have to be in residence. Have to have audible oh Okay, have to be in residence. Have to have audible oh okay, sorry, keep going, it's so incredible.

Speaker 3 1:11:18

Keep going so incredible. By the way, I was researching ayahuasca before I went and I found this ayahuasca playlist before I was listening to music and I'm like what the heck is this crap? I really thought that, right Now, it's all I listen to, right, all the time. Right, it's all I can listen to. So, anyways, we're in it. Then I start to freaking trip dude. Then it freaking hits me and I'm like tripping Right, like tripping hard.

Speaker 3 1:11:48

I didn't realize if I was standing up, but I didn't realize if I was standing up in my mind or if I was still on the mat and my mind was standing up. I was completely like disassociated. I didn't know if I was completely like disassociated, I didn't know if I was still there. The shaman's face turned into my brother's and then it turned into my mom. That molested me and I was like, oh shit, and it's like you have to face these things. We have to face these things. I had a conversation with Mother Ayahuasca and I said, please go gentle on me. And so then the music's playing and I'm sitting there and she and it was like it was almost like we were going through a swamp and there was all this shit that I had to deal with and she was like see, and the music was playing and she's like, see, I'm taking you through it real slow, but she's like we're gonna have to go into it. And I was like okay, and then the music starts and this is all your inner self doing all this.

Speaker 3 1:12:38

Well, that's why they call it mother ayahuasca, because you're like interacting, but it's like you're in your mind's eye, right, you're having a conversation with yourself, but the other voice is very separate, right, it's not like you're talking to yourself, right, it's very separate. Okay, and it's very wise. And then the music starts to speed up and I start to feel real sick. Yeah, and I can feel it in my entire body. My knees are throbbing, my freaking joints, my stomach is just turning and he just keeps playing faster and faster and I'm like, oh fuck, and we have these bowls in front of us.

Speaker 1 1:13:15

Was he playing faster in real life?

Speaker 3 1:13:17

So, yes, the songs do. They do it on purpose that way. It's really soft, and then it goes to an agitation. It's on purpose, okay. So then I'm like okay, I got to throw up, I got to throw up. So then I lean over and it's just dry, heave, dry, heave, dry, heave, dry, heave. I can't throw up, can't throw up, can't throw up. The thing is, they starve you before you go in. Right.

Speaker 3 1:13:37

So I can't throw up. And then the music calms down. I'm like, oh, thank God. And then I'm just sitting there quietly. And then, like, I start to think about my second ex-wife and I like turn over and the girl that was sitting next to me, it was my second ex-wife and I was. And I was like, and she was crying and I was like I freaking miss you so bad. And I'm like, just talk to me, because I have, by the way, I've not talked to this woman in 12 years, or something like that. Wow, I'm like, just talk to me.

Speaker 3 1:14:07

And then she's like no, and she like turns away from me. And I'm like, and then the medicine told me he's like see, she's suffering from this, the relationship you guys had. She's still suffering from it, but you need to let it go right. And, dude, that was an incredible. That was incredible for me, because I that was a reason that I had such hard time with relationships I couldn't detach from that person got it for whatever reason. Right, so then I finally relax. And then he starts playing the music bing, bing, bing, like just little slow thing. You're like, oh, this is nice. And he starts to speed up and you're like ah, fuck, you get sick again. Dry, he, dry, he, dry, he dry, he. We went through that cycle like six, seven times that's crazy that it was.

Speaker 1 1:14:54

It was the music dude, that's everything. Talk about waves.

Speaker 3 1:14:58

The whole time I'm tripping so hard, the whole time I'm thinking to myself why is he only giving me attention and I talk to everyone else? They're like no, I thought that Wow, and I was like what the? Anyway.

Speaker 3 1:15:11

So the first night ends when he ends the ceremony, you almost like come out of the trip like pretty quick, and then they eat fruit and whatever. And I was like I just left that night and I was like that was so chaotic. So the next day I'm like I don't even need to do it again. I understand what it is. It didn't really help me necessarily. I understand it, I don't want to do it again. But then you're out in the middle of the jungle. You're there, You've paid the money, You're like all right, we got to go again See where we're going. But the leaders say they're like you will not have the same trip, Right, you won't. And I was like, okay. So the second night I like went inside. Did anybody not show up? The second night, everybody did it. Okay, we did all three nights, okay. The second night I just lied on the mat still isn't, didn't move and went through the same thing, exact same thing what I would.

Speaker 3 1:16:05

He would play, I would dry heave and I'm like what am I like?

Speaker 1 1:16:09

were you having all the same thoughts. It was a resistance it.

Speaker 3 1:16:13

Something was like I couldn't let go of something there was right, whatever it was right but I was telling myself I'm like dude, what is wrong? Like let go. That night I took three cups the pre the first night I took three cups. Second night I took three cups. The end of the second night I went up to the shaman and I was like dude, I can't break through, I feel like physically.

Speaker 1 1:16:31

You went up to him.

Speaker 3 1:16:32

Yes okay, after we were done okay and I was like I feel like I'm like on the precipice of something major happening and I can't like I can't vomit, I can't like I can't let go, I'm just so tight. He's like the third night. He's like I'm gonna bring a stronger brew and he's like you're gonna have a breakthrough. And he's like that night cuz the first two nights you go seven o'clock at night to one in the morning he's all the third night.

Speaker 3 1:16:56

He's like we're gonna do nine o'clock at night to sunrise and he's like that's a long fucking time dude, trust me, this is much stronger than what you've been taking, and so I was like, all right, well, we have a day where we skip and we don't let your body heal we just and dude. The thing is, you're just mentally like fried oh, I can, I can even imagine. It just burned Because you disassociate Like you think you're never going back. Right, you're in this trip mode and you're never going back to regular life.

Speaker 3 1:17:25

Left it all behind. That's actually kind of scary. It's super scary, yeah, so anyways. So then the third night I come down and I'm so like I don't even have an intention, I'm just like burned and I'm like I don't care, Whatever happens, happens.

Speaker 1 1:17:42

You're exhausted, yep.

Speaker 3 1:17:43

So I take the first cup and within 10 minutes I'm like, oh shit, this stuff is way, stronger Way stronger here we go, here we go. So we wait for an hour. He opens it up. I go get a second cup and then, dude, it felt like he was playing, like he was like a band, like the sound was like a full band.

Speaker 3 1:18:06

He was controlling the whole environment. Got it and just taking you through. By the way, he takes it too During this. He takes it with you, Wow. So he's tripping too, but his trip is like helping you. Right, he knows how to help you, because he's on the same vibration. Right, so I'm two cups in and I'm just like surfing the internet, like freaking, going everywhere. It's crazy Allowing, allowing, allowing, and then he's like and then he didn't open it up for a third, but I like my.

Speaker 1 1:18:40

You wanted it.

Speaker 3 1:18:41

It's like go take a third cup. I tried to stand up and I couldn't. I crawled over to him and I'm like I want a third cup. He's like okay, so he gives me a third cup. And I crawl back. I see another girl get up to get a third. He's like no, no way. So he gives me a third did you yourself at any time?

Speaker 1 1:18:59

no, okay, but I heard that that happens often. The two ends right.

Speaker 3 1:19:04

It can come out of either end right or both, potentially. So I take the third and I lie down and I was listening to the music and then this thought my dad died when I was 22. Okay, and I did not have a great relationship with him. I'm laying there, he's playing this soft sound and my dad comes to my mind and I'm like man, I just wanted his approval and the medicine said he was doing the best that he could. Right.

Speaker 3 1:19:35

And I said I don't care, I wanted his approval. And the medicine said he was doing the best he could. And I said I don't care, I wanted his approval. And the medicine said he was doing the best he could. And I said I don't care, I wanted his approval. And the medicine said you mean like you give your son your approval and it just freaking stabbed.

Speaker 1 1:19:48

Oh man.

Speaker 3 1:19:49

And then it shoots back. It shows me six generations. It's like your dad wanted his dad's approval. His dad wanted his dad's approval Do you see what's happening?

Speaker 1 1:19:58

Yeah, you're just continuing on.

Speaker 3 1:20:00

It's not stopping Right. And your dad? It only gave you what he had, right? It's not his fault, right, he only had what he had. It's what he learned. He learned that he couldn't give you anymore and I was like holy shit, I'm like he didn't know.

Speaker 1 1:20:15

And that was the big was that the big uh-huh?

Speaker 3 1:20:18

So we're getting there. I was like he wasn't intentionally trying to hurt me. He was just. He really was doing the best he could. Right, the level of empathy I had for my dad was like through the roof. Wow, okay, dude, love was pouring out of my body for him. I never felt that kind of love for him before. Wow pouring out of my body for him. I never felt that kind of love for him before Wow and think about it.

Speaker 1 1:20:41

He's your dad.

Speaker 3 1:20:42

Yeah, I loved him. Yeah, like unconditionally yeah.

Speaker 1 1:20:43

I felt bad. You understood him.

Speaker 3 1:20:45

Yeah, I felt bad for him. I was like I'm sorry, dad, that you had to go through this Right. Then it shifts to my mom and I was like which mom? My mom, okay. And then I was like was like which mom? My mom, okay. And then I was like holy shit, she didn't know either and she was just giving me the best that she could. Then it goes to my brother. Oh my God, he doesn't know either.

Speaker 3 1:21:09

Wow, then it goes to everyone in my circle, at my friends including the, including the mom, that, that that molested you. She didn't come up, but it kind of like it just went wider and I was like, wait a minute, I'm like none of these people know it's the answer for everybody.

Speaker 3 1:21:26

None of these people know Right. They're just going off what they were given. Then it goes out to the whole entire world and, as it's going out, I'm feeling love like I've never felt, even people I didn't really like. I'm like, oh, now I know why you act like that. Wow, because you don't know Right. And then it goes to the whole entire world and I was like, holy shit, the whole world doesn't know, wow. And then it all sucks away and, dude, I was feeling love. The word love doesn't even encompass what I was feeling. Okay, then you wanted it back and I relate it to how you feel about your child the first time your child's born right, you just feel like the level of love you feel for your child is like crazy, right.

Speaker 3 1:22:09

It was like that times 100 for everyone, wow. And then it all goes away and and I'm like what the heck? And then the medicine says to me Thomas, you can give yourself that love. And then I had this a massive amount of love for myself and I'm like I don't know that I'm enough. Right, I am enough. And it's like Thomas, you are enough, you're everything, you're it, you have it now. You don't have to become now, you don't have to become anything, you don't have to learn anything, you are it.

Speaker 1 1:22:41

Right now, Right now.

Speaker 3 1:22:43

And then I was like oh, my God, I'm finally healed. And it's like no, no, you never needed to be healed, you just needed to remember Wow. And I was like holy fucking shit. And I was like I have to tell people, I have to tell, I have to tell. And then it's like do you see what's happened? You wrote your book. Do you know why? It's like everything in your life, every single thing you went through, is perfect, right, because it all it drove you to where you were, and guess what?

Speaker 3 1:23:24

When you go tell your story, people will fucking listen because of everything you've been through and everything you overcome Divorce, death, loss of children you freaking name it. Like I have been through everything overcome addiction, cults, molestation, you name it. Millions of lives have been through this. If you tell me a problem, I can most likely directly relate to it and that I've been through it.

Speaker 1 1:23:35

Right, okay, talk about a shaman.

Speaker 3 1:23:38

So it tells me. It's like tell your story, go, tell your story, tell it to as many people as you can. So then I'm just like I'm sitting there and I'm like I need to go, I need to leave. Now. I need to tell everyone because, because it was so obvious to me everyone's suffering, because it was so obvious to me everyone's suffering, it was so crystal clear that all anyone needs to do is go inside themselves and they will solve every single quote unquote problem they have, because everything is designed around validation. Am I good enough? Am I good enough? Yes, you are good enough. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, it doesn't matter what you look like. You're it, you're good enough, you're 100%, you are it. Yep, you just have to remember that. Now, believing that is another.

Speaker 1 1:24:28

Right. How do you get people to that? Connecting to that.

Speaker 3 1:24:30

So then it showed me it's like this whole, like affirmations like you write on you write on.

Speaker 1 1:24:37

We do them every day.

Speaker 3 1:24:38

Yeah, you put it on your. You put it on your wall and you say I am beautiful, I love myself. It was like that's ridiculous. Why do you need to tell yourself that you love yourself? You like, do you need to tell yourself that you love your child? Do you need to write a thing and say, okay, I remember that I love my child? What the the heck? You shouldn't have to do that right now. How? Now that's the first wake-up call and saying, like, okay, if I feel like I have to do that, what are the false beliefs in my life that I have about myself that make me not believe that I'm enough?

Speaker 3 1:25:11

right it all comes from childhood right it all comes from the world telling us we're not a lot, we're not enough, we're not enough, we're not enough car, you need a, you need a hot wife, you need this, you need that. Then what happens to those rich people that get that and then end up killing themselves?

Speaker 3 1:25:24

Right, it's not enough, it's not enough, because the only thing that is enough is you Right. That's it. That's the only thing that will validate you ever. Nothing else will validate you. You have, you have to validate yourself right. So how do you go on that journey of becoming that? So I've created courses on like. How do you, how do you like, start this process of like, unlearning these beliefs? I believe that going and doing ayahuasca is not it, it won't. I know people who've done it nine, ten, twelve times and still don't get what I have right.

Speaker 1 1:25:54

It was just perfect for you in that point the medicine where you, medicine will give you what you're ready to receive.

The Path to Self-Acceptance

Speaker 3 1:26:00

That's it. It doesn't matter if you do 50 drinks of it, it doesn't matter. It will give you what you're ready to receive. Because here's the thing, you are a God. You're a God in the sense that whatever you believe is reality, right. You're so powerful that you can believe that you're not a God. Right, and it will be, because that's how powerful you are, right. So if you can learn who you are, remember who you are, then you get to this place, dude, where I'm telling you nothing matters, right. And here's the example. Oh wait, let me tell this story really quick, right?

Speaker 3 1:26:38

And here's the example. Oh wait, let me tell this story really quick. So then, once I saw this and I was like holy cow, the medicine then proceeded to show me my entire future until I leave this earth. And when I say leave this earth, I did not die. I vibrated out. Wow, I literally saw myself vibrating out of this world, like I vibrated so high that I just left the plane. I just left, wow, I can't be here anymore because I'm such a high vibration. But it's a long time until that comes Right. And it showed me.

Speaker 3 1:27:06

It was like you meet this little Hispanic girl and when you meet her, she becomes your everything, meaning you never want to be with someone else. She like fulfills that desire you have for a companion. Right, not fulfill you, but fulfill your desire for a companion. And she will love you the way that you've never been loved by anyone else, because you're being who you truly are. Right, you're on that vibration. Now you can receive that person. Well, I get out of the thing and I'm just like, oh my gosh, it took me weeks to like come down.

Speaker 3 1:27:38

Right, I would wake up like buzzing from from the whole situation. I just couldn't even like collect my thoughts. I'm like, oh my gosh, this, I don't even know what to do. I didn't have a job, Right.

Speaker 3 1:27:48

So then I'm like okay, well, I'm just going to like try to like start creating stuff, to like get out to the world. So I have like a podcast, right, and like this and like that. Then, all of a sudden, out of nowhere, a friend calls me. He's like hey, these guys need a sales rep at this software company. Are you interested? I was like I'll take the call. Took the call, didn't even talk about my. I told them my ayahuasca trip. I told them my trip. They gave me the job. Wow. Then I worked for them for a year. They get all of us on a call and lay us all off all sales people, the whole sales leadership, everything. When that happened, the whole time I was developed, I was doing my podcast, I was developing like my course, not stuff. When they laid me off, I was like awesome, I'm trying to do this. Right, I didn't have money. In fact, my bank account was dwindling. I didn't care. It doesn't matter, and what matters is if I help another. You're on a higher purpose. That's, that's what matters, yep.

Speaker 3 1:28:37

So I'm going along doing that. The CRO of a big startup that I got laid off from. Before I went into ayahuasca, they hired a new CRO. This guy's famous for taking MongoDB public. He DMs me on LinkedIn and says, hey, I want to talk to you. Will you fly to New York and talk to me? And I was like what the fuck? Why?

Speaker 1 1:28:56

does he want to talk to me?

Speaker 3 1:28:58

But, dude, I think about it. I didn't apply for anything, I didn't do anything. He flies me out. We talk for about 45 minutes about work and about an hour, three hours and 45 minutes about my Ayahuasca trip my journey, all this stuff, your purpose? They hired me, they bring me on board, they give me all these products and they set me up on a comp plan where my first quarter I made $80,000 in commission on top of my salary. Wow, I didn't even do anything, right. I did nothing and I don't care.

Speaker 1 1:29:27

It just fell into place. It doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 1:29:28

Right, Because I have a mission and that's what I need to do so. The universe just brings you shit. It just gives it to you. You listening to this, I am, but I am it only when you match the resonance of I'm enough, I am in abundance of that Right.

Speaker 3 1:29:44

Then abundance comes to you. And what I want is not I don't care about money, I care about how do I help someone? Yep, how do what can I say? What can I do? How can I help them. Well, four months after I left ayahuasca, I meet, I go on a date with a girl five foot tall, 98 pound, hispanic girl. I did not connect the dots, dude. We, from that weekend that we met, we saw each other every weekend up until this day. That was almost two years ago. We're engaged now. I told her my whole story right when we met and I told her I said if you ever want to do any type of type of psychedelics, tell me and I'll take you on a journey, but I'll never, ever, ever force you to do anything. You need to tell me if you want to do it Right.

Speaker 3 1:30:30

Well, about three months later she's like I want to try it, like great, we go in, we're doing it. And I look at her and I'm like holy shit.

Speaker 1 1:30:39

It's her. You're the girl. It's her Because I went right back into my ayahuasca, right.

Speaker 3 1:30:43

I went right back into it and I was like, oh my God, this is the girl. Like I was flipping out. Oh, I'm sure I was like this is freaking wild dude. So now I'm so in belief of like just she came into your life because you opened that door bro right when I was ready to receive it I wouldn't even have received it before I did yeah right when I was ready to receive it, it came my little brother wrote down Don Miguel Ruiz.

Speaker 1 1:31:09

Who's that? I've heard the name, um never heard of it. I have no idea. I know the name. This is officially our longest episode ever. Sorry.

Speaker 3 1:31:18

No, you're good dude, I love this.

Speaker 1 1:31:20

I love this. We're going to have you back on because we haven't even talked about your book, unless this is all your book.

Speaker 3 1:31:25

There's tons of stuff, dude. I mean I could just go on. I could go on for days talking about this man.

Speaker 3 1:31:39

Because the thing is, since then I've elevated it, like it like even more oh, I'm sure where I am every day. You are, I understand that like. So, when you start to, when you start to like, when you stop lying to yourself, okay, and you start to be brutally honest with yourself and you start to take accountability for everything, what you realize is that your gut, filling your intuition, that small voice, it's always been there. We all felt it we've all said in hindsight man, should I listen to my gut feeling?

Speaker 3 1:32:01

yep okay that thing. When you start to vibrate, you start to realize that thing is talking to you, all, all the time and if you listen to it and you follow it, you start to create an intimate relationship with it to the level you have a trusted advisor with you at all times and you're feeling in. Your vibration tells you exactly how to be in, exactly what to do at all times.

Speaker 1 1:32:25

Wow.

Speaker 3 1:32:26

To where you have no fear. It, eliminates it because you're like, oh, this is for me If something bad is trust trust it completely my mom, just barely passed away a month ago.

Speaker 3 1:32:41

Super hard thing, yeah, losing your mother, right, her and I I years ago I said, cause her and I did not have a good relationship, I decided I was like I want a good relationship with her and I'm going to change. So I changed the way that I behaved with her. When she died, her and I had the best relationship. We were so tight. She never gave me praise and she was giving me praise constantly, all the time, not because I asked her to do anything or we had to come to Jesus.

Speaker 1 1:33:08

It's how you interacted with it.

Speaker 3 1:33:10

I changed and it created a better relationship. Yep, so when I talk about vibration, you start to see you're like, oh my gosh. Then what you realize is why do you think? Like people follow Steve Jobs or Elon Musk, those guys get to a point where they actually don't care about money. They have a mission and they have a belief. Nothing can change them. Right, they don't care. Right, people are so attracted to that because all that is, is they believe in, they know.

Speaker 1 1:33:44

Certainty. Exactly, they know themselves Exactly. That's it. That's it. That's all it is. I believe that.

Speaker 3 1:33:50

Because then they attract that right. And it's this vibration, everybody wants it, they want to be around it. It's this vibration, everybody wants it, they want to be around it, they want to be in business with it. They want to. They want to be like it. What they don't understand is that it's all inner work Right. It's not anything else Right. Once you get there, it doesn't matter what happens outside of you.

Speaker 1 1:34:07

Right.

Speaker 3 1:34:08

Because you know you're enough.

Speaker 1 1:34:10

Jeez the dog. I think he's got to go out.

Speaker 3 1:34:20

Will you come back on our show? Okay, man, are you still?

Speaker 1 1:34:21

doing your podcast. Yeah, I just did one yesterday. Cool, we want to come on yours you can tell us more there yeah, absolutely. I'll work with you to yeah absolutely, I want to go show you the room upstairs. We talked about the men's group. I want to get talking about. Yeah, let's do it. Okay, I'm sorry to cut you off, but man, we're. This is by far our longest one, I think.

Speaker 3 1:34:37

Thanks for coming in, brother.

Speaker 1 1:34:39

Seriously.

Speaker 3 1:34:39

Thank you for letting me share my story.

Speaker 1 1:34:41

Absolutely.

Speaker 3 1:34:42

Really, guys. That's what fulfills me more than anything. If one person gets one little thing that makes them go a degree better, it's like success.

Speaker 1 1:34:50

It's totally that. Exactly that's success. I guess this Don Miguel Ruiz. He's an author that taught my little brother a lot of these truths through his books.

Speaker 3 1:35:00

And that's what we were talking about earlier. Truth everything I'm saying it's not a methodology and it's not what I came up with. There is a single truth.

Speaker 1 1:35:08

It's not even woo-woo.

Speaker 3 1:35:10

It's truth. It's truth. If you read other books, you'll see things and you'll be like, oh, that's what Tom was talking about Right, it's right, it's all the same.

Manifesting a New Life

Speaker 1 1:35:18

Awesome. Well, thank you everybody for listening in. I told you this cat was going to be good. I like him. We're going to find out more. We got to get you involved in what we're doing way more, so trust me and we'll help you with your mission as well. Love it All. Right, everybody. Thank you so much. We appreciate it. Have a fantastic weekend Next week, have a killer week and we will see you next Friday.