Tonya Kappes on Reader-Focused Promotion

Episode 062 / Prolific cozy mystery author Tonya Kappes joins us this week and we delve into how her reader-centric focus has brought her success. 

Intro links:

Jami has continued writing first each day and her words are adding up. Shout-out to Becca Syme’s video Why Can’t I Hit My Deadlines that helped Jami.

Sara’s revising and editing. She has a new desk stand.

It’s from a company called Harmoni. (#affiliate link). It’s made for use with a laptop, but Sara uses it as a standing with her iMac desktop and the keyboard stand she had made so she can stand while she works.

Come over and say hi to Jami and Sara in the WIKT Facebook group! You can find show notes and links at wishidknownforwriters.com.

In this podcast episode, you’ll discover:

• How a difficult time in her life lead Tonya to discover the joy of book clubs and reading
• Why Tonya wishes she hadn’t been so much of a “squirrel” when it came to writing in different genres
• How Tonya uses out-of-the-box thinking for her promotion
• Tonya’s innovate use of backmatter to motivate readers to sign up for her newsletter
• Tonya’s thoughts on going from indie to hybrid with a traditional publishing contract
• How having a camper helps Tonya her productivity

Genres discussed include cozy mystery and paranormal cozy mystery

Links: 

Tonya Kappes website

Waxcreative Design - website designer

The Big List of Craft and marketing books mentioned on WIKT podcast episodes  

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:05

Welcome to the Wish I'd Know Them podcast, where we focus on how authors found success, looking at strategies that have taken them to the top of the bestseller chart, as well as what they've learned from their mistakes. Because being an indie author is more than knowing the latest marketing trend. It's about being innovative and creative and learning from your mistakes. Welcome to the Wish I Know Them podcast. I'm Sarah Rosette.

Jami 0:29

And I'm Jamie Albright. And this week on the show we have Tanya Kathas. That's right. Christian history author, Southern Girl. Oh my gosh, y'all. Y'all get your hick to English dictionaries out and ready to go. Because between the two of us, it may be a little hard to understand. It was great, though. She is just a fireball.

Sara 0:55

Yeah, she's a firecracker.

Jami 0:58

Yeah.

Sara 0:58

So I was going to tell you a little story about how I met Tanya. And she says in the podcast that she is a storyteller. So I thought it'd be appropriate if I told you this little story about how I met her. So I was in this group called the Deadly Divas, and this was years ago, back when I was traditionally published. And a bunch of authors, we got together, and we would book our own book tour, and we would pay for everything, and we'd go, and we were, you know, we like find the bookstores and libraries kind of in one area, and we would go there. Usually somebody lived there, and we would stay in their house, and we'd go to these different places over about maybe a week. So we were at one of those events, and I was at this library, and you know, it was a good turnout, and we had, you know, like we wore feather boas because we were the divas, and you know, it's like we can't.

Jami 1:41

Okay, I really can't see you in a boa, but okay, continues.

Sara 1:45

Okay, well, the boas were on the table.

Jami 1:46

Oh, okay.

Sara 1:48

I think in the early days before they used to wear the boas or for pictures. Anyway, so we did our little thing where we talked about our books, and then you know, then they would have somebody there to sell them. So uh this lady came through the line and she had a stack of books and was having us all sign, like two or three each, and there were five or six of us, probably five. And I said, Thank you so much for buying our books. And it was Tanya, and she she lived in the area and she came to support us, and she said, Oh, I just love to spoil my readers, so I just will give these all away. And I mean, that is just her, you know, in a nutshell because she exactly, yeah, yeah, all about her readers, and so we talk about that a lot, like how what she does for promotion and how she connects with her readers.

Jami 2:32

Yeah, and I think that that um it's really good for well, it's good for all of us to hear, but especially when you're starting out to remember, because I think, well, I'm not even gonna say I think I know in this business, especially indie publishing, that the focus is on how much money we're making some of the time. Yeah, or how much how little money we're making some of a lot of the time. Um but what our focus really should be is our readers. And if you are if you can get that that um avatar of that reader that is your reader and write to that person, you're going to be successful. It may take five or six books, but if you're writing to your readers and you're focused on your readers, that you're gonna find success.

Sara 3:19

So and it's a totally different way of thinking about promotion than we like because there's a lot about like you know, like give book one away for free. And it it's just like you're shifting how you're thinking, yeah. And um, it's just not what we normally think of.

Jami 3:35

It's made me think of uh, you know, just kind of rethink a few things I've done since we talked to her, um which was last week. But uh yeah, I just have it's just made me rethink some things, so which is great. Um, you know, no, I'm not above learning.

Sara 3:50

It's always good to yeah, exactly. Change things up, keep it fresh.

Jami 3:54

So yeah, so um gonna say that I've continued my getting up and writing before I look at my phone. Yay! Yes, and I wrote uh 17,000 words in the six days, seven days, six days because I took Sunday off. Um but I generally take Sundays off. Yeah, so I was really happy about that. My goal really is just 2,000 words a day, but a couple of days I went over. Well, most days I go over it because I can write, you know, almost 600 words in about a 25-minute sprint. So I go over it and that just adds up. It's weird how it adds up. And then one day I did purposely write an extra two sprints because I knew that uh this weekend we're it's my grandson's birthday, so we're Saturday. I'm not gonna write. So um, but yeah, I'm pretty crappy. Yeah, I know it's you know, they're crappy words, but they're on the page. I can post.

Sara 4:55

But the but they're words and they're down instead of in your head, you know.

Jami 4:59

Exactly. And I don't have that um, you know, just that beat up feeling when you don't when you're not doing what you know, not necessarily that you should do, but it's your job, and so you should do it, you know. And so I really um I'm so grateful for that Becca Sign video. It really it's not anything I really hadn't heard before, but it was the way she described it that I went, oh my gosh, that is what is wrong. And so um, if you you can look at last week's podcast and edit me.

Sara 5:32

Yeah, we'll link to it again.

Jami 5:34

Oh, good because it's so great valuable.

Sara 5:36

Yeah, her stuff is always good.

Jami 5:38

What about you? What's been going on with you?

Sara 5:40

Um, I am I finished the draft and I'm so awesome. Hard as I possibly can to edit it, and I'm about halfway through. I have a deadline of the 28th of March, which it's a little, I mean, I like a little bit more time than that, but I'm gonna get it done. So it's pretty much that's pretty much like all I've been doing.

SPEAKER_03 5:59

Yes.

Sara 6:00

Um so and this book is a little bit different. Normally I write a who-done it where it's like who is who is the murderer. This one is just a little bit different. I don't know if you've ever seen um Rear Window with uh Grace Kelly, and it's like they kind of know who did it and they're trying to figure out how it so it's like a how done it, like how did this person get away with it? So I'm a little nervous about it because it's a little bit different, but you're not alone with it. We're too far down the road to turn out.

Jami 6:31

They're gonna love it.

Sara 6:32

But yeah, and the other thing I was gonna tell you about is I got this new thing, it's a desk stand, it's actually for a laptop, and it's um I'll put a picture of it in the show notes. It's three pieces of wood that you put together, and it's really simple. It's you just it has a stand for your laptop and a stand for like an external keyboard, and it's adjustable, it has little slots that you can move the uh things up and down because I was having some neck pain, and I think it was because I was kind of hunching over my computer was not at the right height, and I actually use it with my iMac because if it's not over a certain weight, you can use it with a screen, you know. So I really like that. So that was my exciting thing this week. Yeah.

Jami 7:14

So put it in the show notes.

Sara 7:16

Yeah, so I'll put it in there in case anybody else needs that.

Jami 7:19

Yeah, exactly. Well, let's get on with the show because y'all are not buckle up. Oh my god, is what I'm saying right now.

Sara 7:26

You might you might need a Kleenex because you might laugh and you might cry.

Jami 7:30

She's awesome.

Sara 7:32

So yeah, just uh let's listen to Tanya. Okay, here we go. Today we're really excited to have Tanya Capus with us. Hi Tanya, how are you? I'm good.

SPEAKER_04 7:42

Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Jami 7:45

Oh my gosh, Tanya, with your accent and my accent, we may need a translator for this podcast.

SPEAKER_04 7:52

I know. Doesn't it like do you ever ask Siri on your phone something? And it's just like, huh? Yeah, exactly. It never understands me. Uh-uh.

Sara 8:02

Uh well, let me read your bio and then we'll jump into the questions. Um, USA Today bestseller Tanya Capas has written more than 80 southern cozy cozy mysteries. She's best known for stories charged with southern charm, emotion, and humor. She lives with her husband in northern Kentucky. Now that her four boys have flown out of the nest, Tanya writes full-time in her camper. Which that sounds like a potential question.

Jami 8:27

Yes, we'll get to that later.

Sara 8:30

It's fun.

Jami 8:31

I know. Tell us uh how you got into writing.

SPEAKER_04 8:36

So um I long story short, I was not a reader until my 30s. And I had yeah, no, I hated it. And I was a child therapist, and so um I took everything I had in my body to write my therapy notes because I'm like, I hated reading, I hated writing. I actually have a fourth grade report card that I carry around with me to events that I talk at and I show it and it says in the comments to my parents, um, who were my mom was a stay-at-home mom. They were they've been happily married for over 55 years this year, and um so uh what happened was that my teacher had said Tanya really fell down this um quarter. She would have done much better if she would have just turned in two of the three required book reports. And I said, I say to my parents, where were you during this time? Weren't you watching me? You know, weren't you making trying to do my homework? Uh and so what had happened was I had um gotten a divorce, and I never thought I would have ever gotten a divorce, right? So um we had a son, and he, my husband ex-husband, had gotten my son every other weekend, and I was just so depressed. And so I had met a girl in um graduate school because I'd went back to school to become a child therapist, and she said, Oh, you need to join our book club. And I kind of laughed. I'm like, listen, I hate reading. She's like, Oh, we have chocolate and wine. I'm like, what time did you say that book club was? So I joined the book club. First book club, and I still had never owned a library card. So I and for probably six months, I still never picked up the book, ever, ever picked up the book they were reading. I just went to get out of the house. And they were so good. They always had it when my son wasn't home. So what happened is eventually I picked up, and they mostly read romance. So I picked up the book. I had finally decided I would go to the bookstore. And at that time it was um, it was Walden's in the mall. And I went on a whim. I did not go specifically for the book, I was just at the mall. And I actually picked up the book, and it sat on my bedside table for weeks. So when my son had gone to his dad's, I I clearly vividly remember just not getting out of bed. And so I rolled over and um, and mind you, there's a whole story behind this. I had gone to get help, and my therapist is like, no, you don't need medicine. I'm like, I need medicine. She's like, You need a hobby. I'm like, I tried all sorts of hobbies and nothing helped. So I remember um rolling over in bed and grabbing that book, and I opened it, and literally, um, it was like the time just flew by before I knew it. The doorbell was ringing, and it was my ex-husband with my son at six o'clock on a Sunday night. And um, I literally realized that I just had escaped into this book, and I mean, I didn't even get up to do nothing. Like I didn't, I was used to not eating and all that kind of stuff because I was so depressed. And so years later, I was remarried and I had four children at that time, and I was still had my book club, and we um, as we always do, you know, tell stories. And so my I was hosting it and my husband, and as you host it, you get to pick the next book club. Well, I had gone to Barnes and Noble and I had picked a stack of books that big. So my husband kind of looked at the stacks and said, Wow, those are kind of expensive. And um, he picked one up and he started thumbing through it. And he said, Really, you could tell a story better than this is written. And I just kind of laughed at him, right? So that night um we had had some riots in Cincinnati in 2001. Um, and I'm just over the border in Kentucky, and it was it made me sad because the area that was rioted had fond memories for me, and I was telling them some of those memories, and they were it was making them laugh because they were some funny stories. And um so one of them had said to me, Oh my gosh, you should put that in a book. And so, you know, that seed was already planted a few hours before them. Yeah. And so literally after a little bit more wine and chocolates, they had left at midnight. And I went upstairs and woke my husband up, who gets up at 4 30 every morning to go to work. And I said, Do you really think I could write a book? And he's like, Yeah, I go, but can I write a book just to help somebody escape like I did? Yeah, you know, there was no other, I mean, I was a therapist. I was making good money. I owned my own practice at that time. Um, I didn't need another career, you know. And so, because the previous career, I was a teacher, then I decided I wanted to be a therapist because, you know, I just had nothing better to do with my life than raise four kids, be a therapist, and raise other people's kids. Yeah. So um that next day, two of my kids played P Lee football and you couldn't leave them because if they got hurt or they cried, you had to go on the field. So I had stopped at Walgreens and um I didn't have any sort of laptop. I think I had a smartphone, I think I had a uh uh, what were those big phones called? Um, I can't remember what they're called. Blackberry. Blackberry. And so um I picked up a spiral notebook and a um papermate pencil, mechanical pencil, and I started writing my first book underneath an oak tree um at their Pee-wee fool practice. That's um so that is how I got started, and I never looked back. I just got bit by it. So long story longer. That's what I say I do.

Jami 14:21

I make a long story longer. Did you go traditional or did you self-publish that book?

SPEAKER_04 14:26

Well, I think Sarah knows this story. So I had um I had joined Romance Writers of America and loved it. We had a local chapter, a lot of well-known authors are in our local Cincinnati chapters, a lot of writers that live around here. And I became friends with a lot of them because I didn't know that you needed an agent. I mean, I was so green. I didn't know you needed um a publisher. I didn't know how none of that worked. I was like, I just write a book and see if it's something I'm gonna put in a book. So um I then I researched it a little bit more and I thought, wow, if I want to do this, I'm gonna have to be smart, you know, with how I'm gonna get my name out there and all this kind of stuff. So um I started looking at writers' blogs and I started commenting on a few. So finally one of them had said to me, you know, uh Melissa Bourbon, Misa Ramirez, she writes Cozy Mystery. She had emailed me and she said, Oh, we love your responses on our blog. We'd love for you to guest blog. You know, do you have a book? And I'm like, no, I don't even have one written. So long story short, is I started becoming a guest blog regularly on her blog with her other five writer friends. So I started building my readership before I even wrote a word. I mean had written a book, right? Because I was still writing in that little notebook. And um, so I started going to this uh writers of America, and I had gotten literally with this first book, I had gotten a deal, which was unheard of, right? And it was a small press, but it was still a book deal, right? And I had already had a readership. I said when my book was coming out, I had planned the um, so I knew that, oh, I'm not going to go to a bookstore. I want to have it at a bead store because this was a women's fiction story about a girl that had a bead store, a jewelry beading store. And I said, I want to have it at a bead store. And so they're like, Why would you do that? Why wouldn't you want to have it at a bookstore? I'm like, because beating are my customers, you know. I every Joe Schmok could walk off the street, but people that beat probably want to read books about people beating, right? Or making bracelets. Right. So I had booked my own um tour around Kentucky and Cincinnati at bookstores or in at beating stores. And so about I had got the first book that I picked up that I escaped was Jane Porter. She was a romance author. And so um, long story short, Jane was I stalked Jane until I forced her to be my friend. And so she had actually when uh we were friends online. I was a good reader, friend of hers. And um so she had actually messaged me, um, emailed me, and said, I'm coming to Kentucky, I need a place to stay. And I'm like, Yeah, oh my gosh. So literally she didn't know me off Joe Strip. I mean, we live in the backwoods of Kentucky. I could have kidnapped her and put her in a holler and no one would ever found her. So I picked her up at the airport, and so we became fast friends. And so um, you know, she was really good at helping me. Well, you need to do this and you need to do that, and let me know. And of course, now she has a publishing house, which is uh at the time she did not, and at the time she had just gotten her first lifetime movie, and so um anyway, so uh I had gotten about three months out of my publication date, and I had questioned the editor about when I was gonna get my final book because I was supposed to already have had it. And with this small publisher, they were so late on their deadline of getting stuff to me, but I was always on deadline. And so uh, I mean, I always made my deadline, so they got mad at me and I'll never forget it. I was um, yeah, I was in a we love our hospital gift shops. It's so strange, I know, but we have the best gift shops in hospitals around here. I was going to get my mama a Mother's Day gift, and um so I was in the hospital gift shop and I had gotten across my Blackberry a message from the publishing house that said, we're parting ways. You have your rights back to your book. And I about had a heart attack, nearly about. So I put back my mama's present and I went to my car and I emailed this publishing house. I'm like, what do you mean? Please, I'm sorry, I questioned you. I mean, I went short of begging them. And um, then I stopped. Something made me stop from sending it. And I called um uh my husband and he says, Well, have you heard of self-publishing? I'm like, no, you can't self-publish. That's that they say that's vanity publishing. They go, I don't know. I've got this Sony reader. He had a Sony reader, Kendall wasn't even out. So I called Jane Porter, and she was on her way to Hawaii because she has a house, she has two houses in Hawaii, and I said, Oh my god, Jane, this has just happened. She's like to take a deep breath. And I said, My husband said something about self-publishing. She goes, Yeah, you know, it's getting really popular. And I said, Well, I have my meeting this weekend with my um RWA. I'm gonna ask them about it. Um, and so um she said, Well, I thought, you know, some people you can talk to, you know, an editor, you know, if you want an editor, they'll do some freelancing. I know a cover artist. So she messed emailed, so he says, I'll give you a cover blurb if you self-publish. And I said, Okay, she goes, I'll read it, send it to me, and I'll read it while I'm in Hawaii and I'll get to you over the weekends. So I went to um my RWA meeting on a Saturday, that Saturday. And I love White Castle coffee. We have White Castle all over Kentucky and Cincinnati, and our meeting was in Cincinnati. And so um they had this thing called Cheers and Tears basket. And I love coffee, and they had a mug in that basket with about it said writer, something about a writer, and I had my eyeball on that mug. And so um they you to go around with the basket, and I said, Well, I've got a tear and a cheer. So my tear is that my publisher and I parted ways, and they just gassed, I mean, collectively gassed. And I said, but I think I might self-publish it. They couldn't get that basket out of my hands quick enough. Yeah, they told me. I was waiting for you to say that. Oh my god, I was um not a writer. I was shaming writers, and I just couldn't believe it. So I got up and I walked out and I drove to White Castle. I got me two sliders and a large coffee, and I drove back to Kentucky and I had my Blackberry and I called my husband and I said, You figure out how to how to self-publish. So he um he learned all the ins and outs on his little Sony e-reader and he formatted it, he learned how to do all of it. I had to be a cover artist. Oh my god, yeah. And so uh we put it up that weekend. I mean, Jane Porter had read it. We she had gotten that editor on it. I mean, I paid a dear price for it.

Sara 21:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:46

And I put a cover on it that was similar to the cover the publisher. So a week later, when the book was out, um, the publisher had also said, Well, I'm gonna sue you because it looks awful familiar. So little did I Know that the cover artist that I had gotten a hold of, her brother was a lawyer, so he helped us tweak it. So we had another cover put on it.

SPEAKER_05 22:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

Um, but I had gotten that weekend, my son was playing also playing pee-wee baseball was when seasons were football practice was beginning for the summer and baseball was getting over, and around Mother's Day. And so um my parents had come up and and I was telling them about the publishing contract at the ball game. They don't live near me, they are two hours away. And my dad was like, You're gonna do what? My mom said, You're not one, you're gonna do an ebook and and and you're gonna publish it yourself. And well, I don't understand that. And I said, Well, let me show you. So I pulled out my Blackberry, the KDP, um, because Kindle had just come out. And so I pulled up that and the um Google spreadsheet. And I had said, Oh, I I was while I was sitting there trying to explain to him, I had gotten an email from this guy, and he said, Oh, my wife loved your book, by the way. Um, and I have this little company I put together and I'm gonna promote you. Maybe I can help you sell a few books. I'm like, oh, great, thank you so much, whatever. So I'm showing dad the little Sony Eerier thing, and I had maybe sold like three books. So then I said, But then there's this Amazon thing now, they're coming out, it's called a Kindle, and you can read these books on their dad. And so he um was like, oh, okay. And so I was shown on the dashboard and it said like a thousand books. Oh my god. And I'm like, oh, there's a glitch. So then I went out and I said, Well, let me show you again. I I think it's messed up. So I did it again, and it was like 1400 books. Oh my god. So then I kept refreshing it. And then I kept refreshing and like I'm like, what in the world? I'm selling all these books, and there's not that many people self-published on um on Amazon at this time. So and they didn't have like that whole ranking thing, they didn't have none of that, and so I'm like, something ain't right here. So I left the ball game to go home to my computer to see what I had done. I felt like I had done something wrong. I'd put up somebody else's book, yeah, something had happened. And so I went back to that email and I said, That man said he could help me. So I emailed him back and I said, Exactly, who are you? And he had just started e-reader news. Oh my god. Oh wow. And so that is how I sold my first few thousand of books of that one book. That's amazing. So that's my story. Yeah, it's crazy.

Jami 24:37

I knew when you were talking about RWA, hey, just judging by the time the fact that Kindle hadn't come out, just as I went to my first RWA meeting, because you know, you can go to two free. And so I went to the first one, and they like someone they had their program, but then someone got up and talked about the evils of self-publishing, like how horrible it was. For right, they're gonna own you, they're gonna own all your stuff. You'll never make any money, you're not a real writer. This whole thing, and then I think I went to one more meeting and then decided, no, I you know, this I'm not really a writer. So, you know, it was like another few years before I went back. But by the time I went back, things had changed. Yeah, I knew where your story was going.

SPEAKER_04 25:24

Yeah, oh gosh. I mean, it didn't take too long after that for a lot of those authors or writers in that group to privately email me. Um, and then soon came the big chapters. Can we fly you to South Carolina to teach self-publishing? Sure, I'll take your money. Can you fly? Can we fly you to Dallas? Yeah, I'll teach them how to do self-publishing. I'll take your money. By that time, I'd also had been in it, you know, and and grown my readership. And I was already thinking outside the box at that time, you know, trying to reach readers. Um, and and honestly, what I found out is readers, they don't care how you're published as long as they don't even know. Like I was, I would put on my blog, who publishes your favorite book? Well, I don't know. You know, well, who does this? Who does that? And, you know, I was making, I had business cards um with my name on it before I even had published the book, um, giving them out to anybody I could, you know, I had um it was doing giveaways because I knew what my book was going to be about. And I had actually owned a lapidary with my sister and a friend of mine. Um, and the reason it went under is because none of us wanted to start start um stop our regular jobs. We're like, oh, we don't know about this retail stuff. But we ended up selling it. But I had made beaded bracelets and done giveaways on that blog before, you know, um, before I had a book. Um, and you know, I was doing things that, you know, some people just weren't thinking about doing. They were relying on a publisher at that time to do those things. But as time had progressed, um, I did um, I have traditionally published with three publishing houses. Um, and um one was HarperCollins, who I dearly love, who did really well by me. And I ended up not doing a third contract with them because I own the rights to the books. And so I knew that after I used them to where I wanted to be, um, that they couldn't take me any farther than um than what I needed. So I had still published the books and the series after that. And um, then I was with Henry Press, um, who I don't own those books. And so I um did not um even finish out that contract. And then I had a contract with Crooked Lane, and they wanted me to um write under a pen name. And I said, Well, that really isn't gonna do well. And I really suggest it not be a pen name. Oh no, because I have an agent at this time as well. And so um she's like, Oh, well, it's okay, you need a pen name. I'm like, well, as long as they put my Tanya Capus books in the book. So they do have my Tanya Capis books listed in their books. And of course, like I said, you know, they're going to come out with a $25 hard copy book. And I that's just not gonna cut it. And I tried to tell them, listen to me, I know what I'm talking about. I know my reader, and and I would tell my readers, do not buy a $25 book. I'm gonna get like 500 of them and I'll give them to you. Um, and so I said, I don't care if I never get a contract with them again. I'm not gonna sell a $2,500, a $25 book. That's ridiculous, it's rude. Yeah, and so um the books didn't do well. And then they come back and said, Well, do you want to write for us under your regular name? And I went, no, I'm fine, just doing what I'm doing. Yeah, you know, but they weren't bad. They they weren't bad, but just people I think um, and writers or authors especially, that they just don't um if you don't know know your reader, you know, you're doing yourself a um a disservice, you know, and I just feel like that uh I feel like I know my readers pretty well, you know.

Sara 29:10

So well, yeah, I think that you have a really good handle on who your readers are and you're so good at promotion. I think we'll circle back to that in a little bit because you have lots of tips and really unique ideas, but um, but we wanted to ask you too. One of our things is like we ask people like what they wish they had known about certain things. Like, so now that you're farther down the road, um, what do you wish you had known about writing your craft?

SPEAKER_04 29:36

So um I wish that I wasn't a squirrel in the beginning. So I had this book idea over here with this set of characters, this book idea over here with this set of characters, then I had these other five down here. So I would write one book in each of those series. And it it took me literally until two years ago to really come up with this. And um, it is to um with my camper series, it just hit right at the right time, um, two years ago. And um I'm like, okay, well, I kind of started seeing the pre-orders of the other books that had done really well. Like I would have 15 books in a series, and I started seeing the pre-orders decline, but the order on the next camper book triple than the last one. And I thought, wow, that this is really something they they want, and I enjoy writing in it more importantly. Um, and so, and just the other day I gave another, I still have writers that message me or email me and say, What's your writing advice? I'm like, stick with one or two series, don't be a squirrel like me and try because I have all these other, I have eight series, and I'm only writing in two or three of them because the other ones got to three books, and I'm like, okay, I'm done with that one. I'm gonna carry on with this one because it's doing well. I heard myself say it, but I didn't continue writing in it. So um I would I would say um, which is a funny question. I'm in a group with a bunch of um writers, um, mainly um Diane Capri, Jana Dalyon, um Pamela Kelly, H. Y Hannah, um, there's probably Jamie Scott, there's um a handful of us in this group, and we talk openly and um to each other. And the number one thing that we always say um is um once you write in a series uh that seems to be selling really well, continue to write in that series as long as you're enjoying it and it's right selling really well. So that would be my advice to people is to write one series and try to get that going. Um to and if it's going, keep writing it when it's as long as you enjoy it. I mean, I think it's hard to write something if you don't enjoy it, but um, you know, I think that um when you're that you're kind of writing to your market then, right? Which some authors say not to do, but um, if you want to make a career out of it, you gotta do balancing both. Yeah, you kind of say yeah, so yeah.

Jami 32:20

That's really good advice, yeah. I should have listened to that before I jumped into a different series, but you know Me too! I'm gonna make it work, but yeah. I'm gonna uh because I had my bride series and then I went to another small town series. I'm gonna I'm seating in a character in this other small town series that will go back and be a bride in my bride series later. So hopefully, you know, get some um continuity out of now. Right.

SPEAKER_04 32:52

Well, you know, and that's another thing that I'm doing is I'm was so bored with my witch series because I had had that's the series, that series hit hard, you know, a few years ago, and it did really, really well. And so I got so bored with writing it after 15 um chapter or 15 books. Um, and people are like, when's the next book coming out? When's the next book coming out? And so at the last book, she had had a baby. So I'm actually starting a new witch series where the baby is an adult. Oh so um we're funneling in the other characters that were in the because she's not a witch, there's a whole story. So she actually can't live in the town that I had made because you have to be um a witch. And so she has to live in the mortal world. So she's a sleuth, and so it's a southern series, and so um in her series, which everybody's so excited about, which I am starting a new series against my wishes, but I'm still writing in the camper series. But um she um is living in the mortal world, and of course, finds dead bodies, and of course, people from the old series who are older um will funnel in to this series. So they still get those characters, and I feel like I'll have some crossover, so kind of like your bride.

Jami 34:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's really smart. Very good. So, what do you wish you'd known about marketing uh when you started?

SPEAKER_04 34:17

Marketing, um well, marketing-wise, that so you know there wasn't Facebook or any of that kind of stuff, right? So um now I don't know. I guess with marketing, um, I was always kind of good at that. So there's really nothing that I would, I mean, I think I did everything I needed to do to get where I'm at today. Right. But um but a piece of advice for today for writers is that um you don't have to be on Facebook. I mean, Facebook, I don't even do Facebook ads, I don't sell my books. Um, but um I don't think you have to be on social media, you know, to sell your books. Right. And I don't know if it's maybe I I write my newsletter, that's where I see, you know, I track every link. And that's where I see like I can put a newsletter, I put a newsletter out this week and um I put a friend's book in, and I know her click, her link alone got over a thousand clicks. And when I looked at it that afternoon. So I know that my readers are buying my friends' books from my newsletter. Um, and when I put a link in my Facebook, that a different link to track it, you know, maybe they get like two or three clicks, right? Right, right. So um really building up that newsletter um is what I think is a key to us is your number one tool. Period, starting out right now, going forward, yeah, period, is your number one. And that's one thing I didn't have when I started. I just relied on that blog and pulling in those readers and pulling in their readers, right? So, because they had all written books and had been established and were with publishers. And I was like a little on nobody in Kentucky that's just like, oh, I feel like I'm somebody, you know. Um, so um, so a newsletter is really what I wish I would have known then, you know. But now I have built up. But yeah.

Jami 36:23

That's very good advice. Very good advice.

Sara 36:25

Thank you. Well, so you talked about this a little bit about how you went got into publishing, but um, did you have any assumptions that you made at the beginning of your writing career? And did they turn out to be right or wrong? Like you talked about how you just assumed you'd go traditional, but is there anything else?

SPEAKER_04 36:41

So, yeah, so I guess when I I still wanted to be traditional, all right. Although I had success, you know, you still think, well, wow, you know, my peers are doing always greener. My peers are doing these great blogs or um book tours now, you know, my peers are doing this, and and you know, you're like, oh no, I'm just sitting at home self-publishing. Um so and counting your money, but I was gonna say readers. So I started getting invited to conferences and things like that, right? And so I had to, you know, force the readers to know me because my friend Lori Foster, who's also local, has an event event every year. And um, she's like, Well, I'll let you come. You can um sell books at your table, you know, because she has Barnes and Noble there and they weren't gonna carry my books.

SPEAKER_03 37:41

Right.

SPEAKER_04 37:42

So um I'm like, okay. So um she let me sell my books at the table. And people were like, Oh, you don't have sure. I'm like, no, but so I mean, I did and I sold out, you know, it was great. And so um, so and then that's when she started thinking about, oh, well, maybe we can start having self-published authors at the event and this, that, and the other. And so um also Lori and a couple of the other romance writers. Lokely always does a Barnes and Noble event, and I've gotten to know the Barnes Noble people pretty well at her event. And she has book signings, or they have them like a Christmas and Valentine's Day, and so um they got me in touch with Barnes and Noble Corporate, and they decided I ain't to deal with them to put my witch books in their their stores. Oh, that's and so I was able to start having book signs of my own at Barnes and Noble, and they were shelved. I mean, it was the craziest thing ever. And so um, so I did that for like a couple of years. Um, and then um, so oh my gosh, I done forgot the question because I was gonna lead into it.

Sara 38:52

Okay, just any assumptions that you had.

SPEAKER_04 38:54

So my assumption again was still I have to be traditionally published to be successful. When I look back, I'm like, wow, I feel like you know, maybe I was successful, or maybe I don't know. But what is success? But when you still hear your friends, yeah, oh, you're self-publishing, and you know, you didn't talk about money, you know. I didn't know that they were getting $2,000 in advance and I was making $2,000 a week, right? I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_03 39:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:18

And um, I just was like, oh, but it's just the idea, the thought of it, right? So um I when I got the traditional call, it was my ghostly um Southern Mystery series, and um they had not ever picked up a self-published author at Harper Collins. So I, you know, was like, okay, well, I want my books to come out every, you know, once every three to six months apart. I want all my titles in the books, I want full cover control, and I don't you can't own my series, and I don't want the books priced above $4.99. And so they made it happen, right? Wow, and then they sent me to the KISS Cons. They, I mean, it was it was great. I loved it, but um, you know, I wasn't making any money, you know. I had given them my series where I was used to making money, and I'm like, huh, you know, oh, and they pay me monthly. That was another thing. I'm not gonna be paid quarterly. So although they were great, and I had the best editor um around, and she's like the main editor there now, and we're still friends. Um the money, you know, I still had to pay for four kids, right? And um, their boys who outgrow their shoes. I mean, they could hand me down clothes all they want, but the shoes alone, yeah, you know, is a small flick. Yeah. And um, and I knew they were all gonna go to college at some point. I didn't know how smart they were gonna be to get anything, but so I had to prepare for that, you know, to help them out. Right. And so I think that um I wished I would have not have fallen into the trap of trying to get traditionally published because then I'm let myself believe, well, all my eggs aren't in one basket, you know, all my eggs aren't in one basket, and that made me feel better telling people that, you know. Um, so I think just realizing that um I don't need a publisher, I am a publisher. Right. You know, I'm my own publishing house and my own publishing powerhouse because I know what I can do, what I can produce, and I can make myself my own powerhouse. It might not be seen as a your kind of a powerhouse, but to me it's my powerhouse. So I think that's excellent advice.

Sara 41:37

And there is a lure of know of you know what it would be like and would it be better. But I'll just say if I ever negotiate a deal, I want you on my team to get I'll do it.

SPEAKER_05 41:51

True.

SPEAKER_04 41:51

And I'm not saying I'll never take another traditional deal, right? Either. Um, and I think that um Sarah and I had talked about recently my books have been um they're under contract for this option for a very popular TV station. Possibility, yeah. So um the interesting thing is that oh, now we have our own publishing house. So we would like to own all your books and give you a couple thousand dollars a book. Oh and that's not gonna work, is it? No. And I thought, well, I don't, I'm not a I don't care about a movie, I don't care about a TV show unless I got my books still in my possession. Yeah, so um, you know, all that's still ongoing, but it's not worth it to me um because I like my characters. And even if I didn't make the money that I make on them, um, I just don't I it just wouldn't be profitable. I can put food on my table if I took another deal like that. Um, so I'm not saying I'll never take another deal, just be a really sweet deal. Um, because I can control how much I can give to my reader and I the price, and I can control what books I put on sale, and I can control all of those things. So when you give them over to a publisher, I feel like I'm letting my readers down. Yeah. Because at the soul of why I do this still goes back to having my readers escape. It's not about the money. The money will follow if you're that passionate about your job. And that's with any job, and especially passionate with writing. Um, and you know, because I got my husband who also, and I still have a certification that I can go back to being a therapist. So it's not that I'm tied to the job, but the purpose, I do believe in my heart is my God purpose is to be here to help readers escape. And and I have readers have proven that to me over and over again. You know, um, and so um, you know, it it's not always about the money, it's about what comes with it. You know, you're not just gonna give them these 16, 17, 18 books for a minimal price, but what is the downfall, not just with me and my family, but with my readers who love it, because traditional books tend to be super high priced. Even ebooks still are high priced, I think.

Jami 44:28

I think they want people to buy the paperback, I I think. But we need it, we need a sweet deal like Julia Quinn, where they took her paper, they took her paperback and hardback, but she kept her ebook rights. Hello. Yes, hello.

SPEAKER_04 44:45

Which, if anybody goes to my site, her sister is my website designer, so she's a fabulous job, and she's behind it trying to get into cozy mystery. So she's giving home deals right now. So she does all of Julia's um websites. So go to my website and look them up because um yeah, because she's like, you know, Jane Porter and all them said, Oh, you're trying to get to Cozy Mystery. She does like Lori Foster's were like, contact Tanya. So for a couple of years, um, she came at me a couple of years ago and she's like, Oh, this is what it cost, arm, leg for a website. And I'm like, Did I tell you I have four kids in college and two sick dogs that I pay $800 a month for in medication for the vet? And so last year I finally went back to her and I said, Um, I think you contacted me about six months ago. She goes, I remember you, it's been two years and I'm still looking for a cozy mystery author. And she so she gave me a deal, and so I know she's looking for cozy authors. So no, if you're new to writing and you need a website, you know, look up Wax Creations. That's Julia Quinn's sister. So but um yeah, we could all take that sweet deal, right? Right, yeah. Um, that was really fun. That was a fun she deserves it.

Jami 45:52

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. So have you made a mistake that turned out to be a good thing?

SPEAKER_04 45:59

Oh yeah, being dumb and not knowing really what it took to be a published author. Yeah, uh, because it forced, thank God the internet was around because it forced me to Google things, YouTube things. Um, and so um ignorant, and I'm still ignorant about it. You know, people say, Oh, Tanya, you know, like COVID, right? So I put my paperback books on sale all the time. And people are like, oh, and I'm like, yeah, I put them on sale. And then writers will be like, well, you're only making three dollars or whatever per per copy if you put it, if you at your regular price, if you're putting it on sale, then you're already making anything. I'm like, well, no, but you know, that's part of being a Tanya Capus reader in my newsletter. You get these deals. Not only that, but I had been um back when all this started, I had I said, I'm selling books, fill out this form. If you want to print copy, I'm gonna hold an online book signing in my camper. And so I I said, you can order the books between this date and this date and this date. The I'll have the books by this date. We'll have the online party um on Facebook on my author page, and I would be like, hey Sarah, this is your book, and I would sign it online and I would hold it up. And so my readers um love that. They love that my reader group. So, you know, I'm always trying to find ways to just really think outside the box than really look at anything as a mistake. So instead of um, you know, um, you know, going to these conferences that really was a waste of my time because my readers weren't there, I started having my own conference, right? And so I pivot, you know. So anything, anything that I feel like is a mistake, I always say to myself, well, what can I do for a Tanya Capus reader? You know, what can I do for my reader to make it an experience for them? Because, you know, it wasn't the experience I would have wanted as a reader. So when you go into all these things as a reader now, I'm like, ah, she should have done that, or I would have liked if she'd done that. Um, and so instead of looking at things that as a mistake, I always, like I said, just try to pivot and change it um around. Um, but you know, I don't, you know, I I went down that whole rabbit hole of trying to learn ads and all that stuff, and you know, that just wasn't for me. Yeah. So that kind of waste of time. Yeah.

Sara 48:39

Yeah. It's yeah, and I think that I was gonna say, you're one of the best marketers I know. Like you just you I think it's because you have the reader in mind, you know, and so you're trying to figure out what you can do to help them and get to them right make their make their day, basically. Right.

SPEAKER_04 48:56

So well, it just really all goes back to that purpose, you know. When um I have a couple of readers now that have terminally ill cancer. And you know, that hurts me, you know, and so I try to send them something weekly, you know, just if it's a note, if it's a thing, because they were with me from the beginning and I know they're not reading or nothing. I don't care about none of that, but I felt like I have become friends with these readers and I know that I've never met them one, they're both on opposite sides of the country. Um, but I feel like um, they become my friends, you know, and you know, sometimes I can't even keep messenger on my phone anymore because I was getting phone calls, you know, at three or four o'clock in the morning. And my husband said, We need to get rid of this phone. He goes, Because people would call me and say, Oh my gosh, you're answering your phone. I'm like, it's three in the morning. Like I had one from like Alaska, and she's like, Oh, it's like you know in the afternoon here or whatever. And so, um, because I think that I do make them feel so welcoming, and that's okay with me. You know, if they need me, I'm there. Um, you know, as long as I can get the books written for them, too, because that's ultimately what they want, you know. But I just always want to keep my Godfill purpose in mind, yeah.

Sara 50:12

Really. Well, you've done some really cool, interesting things, like um you do um handwritten birthday cards for your readers, right? And you've done um in person. Every month, like two dames on a train and stuff. So can you tell us like what what you like some of the things you do like all the time, like your regular promotion and then some of like your special event things, like the train?

SPEAKER_04 50:35

Sure. So um every day I always get up and put up a coffee post. All my readers know I love coffee. I mean, I just opened up a card yesterday where readers sent me a Dunkin' Donuts gift card. Um, because they know I get coffee mugs, I sell coffee mugs, they know I just love it all. And so all coffee. And so I get t-shirts, you know, with coffee things on them. Not only about books, you know, it's just coffee because I do drink a lot of coffee. So um, anyways, um, so I always greet every morning, I always greet them. And so um other things I also publish monthly, which a lot of authors don't do or writers. And so every day I keep a um, I keep a uh for my marketing, a monthly calendar. So it's just handwritten because I don't do um this is March. I do not do any kind of eye calendar. I'm a paper and pen girl. And so every day I know, and because since I publish monthly, you kind of have to be on the ball with promoting. And I only promote one book. So the book that's coming out at the end of this month is one I started promoting on March 1st. And so I keep a I keep a calendar. So I know I'm gonna change my banner on Facebook the next day. I'm gonna put up a pre-order, it's a pre-order link. Then the next day I'm gonna do a sneak peek. Um, and it might just be a blurb or something or a southernism that's in the thing. And then I all my books have recipes and I cook. And um, especially the camper series, I do campfire recipes, and so I'll put up an old recipe, I'll put up um all the books that have you read the first book in the series, but every day has a specific goal for that book for that month. Um, I also make sure that every month I put up at least two or three books on sale a week. So the books that I published last year are gonna go on sale this year. So they've not been on sale. And I have now well over a hundred books. I probably need to update my biography. But um, so I don't have to put a book on sale every year. So I always say in my newsletter, these books are on sale this week. Um, so be sure you grab them because they're not gonna come on sale again for another year. And then that's true. I'm not lying or trying to scare them. Um, because people say, Oh, well, you had it on sale last week and I missed it. Like, oh, I'm sorry, it was on sale. And I use those Kindle countdowns because you know you still get your full price on those. Um also um I do a weekly newsletter and I call it coffee chat because it's really not a newsletter. So it's always something, a story. Um, it starts out with a story, something about me. Um, I don't know if you know that I have a cat now. Uh two dogs. Well, that's my sister's cat. Now my cat, she's Aunri. So I have a cat now, and she's so um I my dogs were so popular um with my readers because I used them as a tool, obviously as a marketing thing, but that was years ago. But through those 10 years, one of my dogs had to get amputated a leg from cancer. So they went through all his cancer treatments with me. Another one had to have his eyeballs removed because he had glaucoma so bad, he was in pain. So these animals of mine became a part of my reader of me, which I tell them, you know. I mean, I am an open book. I do, I mean, the other day I put up a picture of me in the bathroom with all the because I'm living with my sister. We're living with my sister while her house is being built. Um, and so all her animals went to the bathroom with me. I took a picture like TMI, I know, but here I am, and here's all the animals with me. And my readers love it, right? And so I'm an open book. And my mom always says, I don't know why you put that stuff on Facebook. And I'm like, Well, why are you looking at my Facebook? Get your own, because she gets it on my Facebook. So I had put a story in my newsletter about last summer, um, on Mother's Day, everything happens on Mother's Day. And she's like Mother's Day weekend, I went home to my parents and my sister. And my parents have a pool. And so, and I had live, I was living in my other house at the time, and I have a pool. And so uh we were talking about shaving our legs, just the three of us, my mom, my sister, and I had our husbands were and my daddy, we were they were all cooking. And um, I said, I don't know. I shave my legs every day again to another TMI. And I said, I don't mind. They were like, Well, we don't shave our legs at once a week. I'm like, I don't know how y'all do that. And you laid out here in the pool with your stanky legs all harried up. That's what I said to my mom, just teasing her. And so she went inside and I heard this ruckus. So I bolt in the house and we ran up the stairs to her bathroom, where she went upstairs and God love her soul, put her foot up on her little changing uh table stool and was shaving her legs and fell. Oh Lord. Oh no. And so she got a knot on her arm. So my sister is a neurologist. So the day when I'm like, Mom, you may need to get that checkout, she's like, it's fine. It's fine. I just fell and hurt it, it's fine. And so uh my sister's looking at it and she's like, Yeah, you might want to get an x-ray. And I'm in my bathing suit, my hair's all pulled up, right in a big top, big top knot on my head. And I I mean, so I said, Mom, let me take you over just real quick to the emergency room. And um, she said, You think I should go? Like, well, just do you might have a little fracture, you know, something. You have osteoporosis, you know, well, just go look. So she goes, okay. So she goes inside and she gets in her little dress on. And we're getting more southern, right? So she has her little bracelets on, she's got her little dress on. And she, I said, You ready? And I had my flip-flops on, I had my own my thing on because it was COVID. I couldn't even go inside. Right. And so she said, she sat down and crossed arms, she was like, I ain't going with you looking like that. Huh? And I said, What do you mean? She's what's that top on your head? You look like you from the mud flat. I said, Well, we're going to the emergency room. I don't even live here anymore. I haven't lived here in 25 years. Who am I gonna see? She goes, Well, I might see somebody. So we fought for 15 minutes about this hair day. So she won and I went inside, no kidding. I straightened my hair, I put on some clothes, she had me put on some lipstick. You wear a mask, she still made me put on the lipstick. So I took pictures of this whole event because I just couldn't believe it. Because I knew I was going to share that with my readers because they always say, Do you write like these people in your books? I'm like, Yeah, of course I do. It's all southern. Yes, Southern Mama Gill is real. And so um I had documented it. And so my mom goes, What are you doing? And they let me in the emergency room with her. I said, I'm gonna put this in my newsletter. Well, let me tell you what, it was broken, her hand. Oh no. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh, I said something about her to shave her legs. So I put it in my newsletter and I almost had a hundred percent open.

Jami 58:04

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_04 58:05

So what did I do? I went back to every single book I have and reformatted it. And in the very last chapter of each book, I always say, um, continue your vacation at um at um in Honey Springs um coffee shop or continue your vacation at Happy Trails Campground with the next book, right? Yeah and you put the link. And I said, but wait, people always ask me if my if this story reflects any part of my true life. Well, let me tell you a story that happened to me. So I tell this story that I told my newsletter, which isn't quite as long as I told it to you guys. And I said, if you enjoy this kind of a real life story, join my newsletter. Um and let me tell you, my newsletter skyrocketed with subscribers has over the over it's like been a year. And so um, and people write to me. I probably I'll get a few thousand emails and I respond to all of them. So I I get a few thousand emails. I put my newsletter on Tuesday because it's called Tuesday Coffee Chat with Tanya, just because it I've always done it that way, and it just rhymed and I thought was funny, and so there's no rhyme or reason, just funny. And so um I get people will always respond, oh my gosh, that was the funniest story, or you know, it's it's always something. So back to my cat. So my cat, um, my readers, when my dog had died, my veterinarian had given a generous donation to a local no-kill shelter here. Oh, that's nuts. And so I put that in my newsletter, or my newsletter. Look at what my you know, vet did, and my readers, I mean, they sent me pillows with my dog's face on them. I mean, I got so much stuff when my dogs had passed because they literally passed within like three months of each other. And so um the the League of Animal Welfare sent me a letter and they said, Oh my gosh, you know how much donations we have received. And they listed out the names of my readers who had sent them donations like my vet did in honor of my dogs. So I went on another story for my news for my thing, my newsletter. I went to um it was it was Father's Day two years ago. And my son came home from college, and he was like, What is wrong with her? Is she depressed? Does she need to go to a doctor? And I marched down the stairs because I heard him in the kitchen and I said, Can't I be sad that my dogs have died? I mean, all four of you boys are gone. Can't I be sad? What's wrong with having feelings? I know you're not a girl, you don't get it, and you don't have girlfriend, but let me tell you, I'm sad. And so it was Father's Day, and I was hosting my parents who were driving up and my sister's family um over. So it's like 12 of us. And um, my husband said, Do you want to go to the league and thank them? Will that make you feel better? I said, Yeah, I do. So I drove, we drove over, which was 40 minutes from our house into Cincinnati to the league. And um, they were like, Well, do you want to look at the dogs? I'm like, No. Would you like to look at the cats? I'm like, okay, sure. My husband hates cats, so I knew I was safe with not having a cat. Well, well, three hours later, I get a phone call from one of my other boys and he's FaceTiming me. He's like, Mom, granny, granddaddy's here, everybody's here. Look there, and my mom's like, There's not Mary, a brown bean on this stove or a hot dog on the grill. Where are you? And I'm like, I'm bringing her the cat. And they're like, What? And I'm holding my cat, right? And so I said, tell Tracy to run down to Walmart and get me cat litter, cat food. I didn't even have a cage. So uh I brought her, I adopted a cat. And my husband's like, whatever's gonna make her happy, you know, because I'm like, I can't even write because I don't have my dogs here and I'm by myself. I'm lonely. So um, anyway, so I made her um a cover artist on my covers. And um instantly my readers just went wildly crazy. And so I would tag the league in it, and she got picked up by a magazine here, and they called me, and they're like, hey, we want to just have somebody come over and take her picture. And I'm like, okay, I'm not talking, I I thought it was just, you know, a picture, like a cell phone picture. They had a professional photographer come and for an hour followed her around in my house, did this big spread on her, and I'm like, what have I gotten myself into? So of course, you know, I had to use that in my marketing. And so, like, she's just been so, you know, I try to use things that interest my readers um in my marketing. And so that's some other marketing tools, you know. Even um, you know, the goofiest things like my camper, you know, I write and I call it, I used to have a she shed that I wrote in. So I would broadcast from my she shed. Um, so I do it every week. Another thing I do is every Wednesday I go live and answer a reader question. They can fill out a form and I don't pick the question beforehand, I just pull it up on the Google document. And one time the girl said, Wow, there's so many mistakes in your book. And I'm like, Oh well, I guess we I should have vetted the question before I answered it. But again, it's real life, right? Yeah, and I'm real with them. That's that's that is yeah. There's there, I tell people all the time, I'm not a writer. I'm not a writer, I'm a storyteller, I'm not an author, I'm a storyteller. There's gonna be a mistake, fog holes, it's all there, right?

Jami 1:03:40

I'm not, you know. So I think that I think that's important though, because you know your readers. I mean, that's the thing that that's what your readers want, and you give them what they want. That's right. That's your uh camper. So you're very prolific. So tell us like your writing routine. We want to know about the camper. I mean, all of that is about the secret. Do we all need a camper? We all need to go get a camper.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:06

So, um, anyways, yeah. So the so what happened was I have a little travel trailer, it's 16 foot long. And um, so we put, I bought this property, right? And of course, my readers and Lynn have followed along that because it was property up in the woods in the Ohio Valley, has a beautiful view of the river. And um, I have a nice stocked lake there. Also, what used to be there was a 5,000 uh square foot geodome house with another 5,000 square foot geodome house, 10,000 square foot geodome mansion. Wow and it was called known as a mansion on the hill that lottery winners had 69 million dollar lottery winners had purchased, had bought. Well, long story short, they uh all died up there. And um kind of gruesome, which you know, for a mystery author, it's pretty great. And I mean they were written about in the New York Times. I mean, they were written about in the New York Times. So I mean you can't, you can't, I mean, so for instance, you know, the woman was found dead and her dogs were hungry. So um then the son, yeah, the son moved in and he was found dead, and he'd been there so long he melted to the chair. Um, and then um the next of kin to get what $10 million was left were in the state penitentiary down in Texas. Wow. Um, because they had funneled drugs through the engine of their car mechanic shop across the border.

unknown 1:05:49

Oh.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:49

So when the house closed, when the property closed, they came up because they had gotten out of jail. So I got to meet them. Oh my gosh. And they're like, we are so excited. To see what you're gonna do with this dome house. I said, Oh, I'm tearing it down tomorrow. I've got a demolition crew scheduled, I'm building a 1400 square foot house on it. So, and I lost my she shed. So I said, you know, I need to buy something where I can go right because we were moving into a I sold my house within three hours. I thought it was gonna take me months. So we were like, okay, I'll sell it. So we moved into an apartment, and so then we didn't want to re-upload the lease because um, you know, the house is gonna be built. So my sister had she's an empty nester, her and my brother-in-law, and um she has dogs that need to be let out, so they had a mother-in-law suite. So we just moved in here, and so um it worked out, but um I said, I can't this her stuff isn't my stuff, it's not my um, you know, you can see there's like yellow walls, you know. I like white or gray walls. It does not this does not help my creativity, right? And so um, so I we had been, I had been always been campers, but we never owned a camper. And so um my husband said, I have found a camper we might want. So campers were selling as fast as houses around here. And so we finally um found one, and I just you know said, I'll um, so we went up there and bought it immediately, and um, we put it on the property. So every morning I get up. My husband leaves for work by five. Um, he gets up at 4:30, leaves by five, sometimes earlier. And I get up and I um have coffee because I have to have my coffee, of course. And then I get ready and get dressed, and I go like I'm going to a job. I go through the Dunkin' Donuts. They know me, they already know I'm coming, they know what time. They generally have it ready. I don't have to put it on the app because I just go up and show it. And um, so then it's just hot white coffee, extra large. And so then I go to the camper and I sit there and I mean I have electric. He's got my husband has hooked up the electric and he has it hooked up to the um the septic tank, you know, so I can go to the bathroom. There, I have a TV, you know, I have a refrigerator, so I keep all my food there. I have a coffee pot and it's always programmed. So when I get there, the coffee's brewing. And so um I sit there and I do writing sprints. I do pomodoro writing sprints, and I will find people on YouTube. Um, I will do live writing sprints with people, which is so funny because I'm like, oh, I got it that they'll say, How many words do you get done? I'm like, 1200 and like 25 minutes, and they're like, Oh, I got like 200. And then so now just put putting it in there because you know, you've been doing it so long, you can write that fast. Um I'm not saying they're great words, but they're words, right? And so um I will write for about three hours, and I usually can get anywhere from five to six thousand words written. Um, HarperCollins only required me to write 50,000 words for their books. Yeah, so I figured if it's good enough for HarperCollins, yeah, it's good enough for my other readers. So all my books are right around 50,000. Sometimes they go to 56. Um, and then I will eat, um, walk, try to switch gears so I can um do the business side of things. So that is to make sure I'll go in and I'll say hi on Facebook really quick. I don't get wrapped up all into that because that's a rabbit hole for me. Um so if I need to do Facebook, I will go in at night around seven o'clock when my husband likes to watch Mash. And I will um do it mindlessly then and say hi to people. So that's something I do every day. And like she said, I do um birthday cards for all my readers. They sign up to a form, you know, so you know a few thousand a month, and I I handwrite them um and mail those off. Um, and then I do my own reader group um on a train every fall. Um and of course we couldn't do it last year, but it's somewhere different in the United States every year. Um my other um readers from all over um the United States to come because sometimes they you know they'll say, Well, when you gonna come here? They can't travel that far. Right, right. So I try to put myself where I can come to them.

Jami 1:10:37

Oh, that's fantastic. So that is just amazing. That's just so great. I'm I'm so impressed. I'd love this conversation. Yeah, and uh nobody's you know saying ugly words. So uh um tell us what you think you've done to set yourself up for success. The best thing you've done to set yourself up for success.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:03

Well, um, the best thing I did um as a full-time author, because it's hard, you know, it's hard to sit down and and every day write. I don't believe in writer's block. I don't believe, oh, when the muse hits, that that don't help me because my muse, I don't even know who she is and that's what she's gonna hit. So um I set myself up for success by one treatment like a job, like a real job. And I think how that helped me is that I did transition from a real job where I had to get up every day. And um, so I never let that lapse. Um now do I take a day off here and there? Yes. Um, I don't write seven days a week, I write six. Um and do I take time off to go on vacation? Yes. I've written, I'm so much ahead in my writing when you only have to write so many words for a book that I just keep writing the next book, right? Right. And so um treating it as a job and then just really not looking at what other authors are doing. That's so easy. I did that, you know, and it was so toxic for me 10 years ago that it made me my self-worth feel so bad that I'm like, well, I don't want to write, you know, but I love it and I want to, you know, help people escape. And so I had to really block out that noise. Yes. And I I saw somewhere where they called it the FOMO, fear of missing out. Now somebody wrote Jomo, the joy of missing out. Yeah. And so I really try to not look at what my other peers are doing. And when I do um talk with my other peers and and we talk about things like this, when they say something, I'm like, oh, I might not be able to do it that way, but I might be able to do it this way. Right, right. And you know, I love to talk with other writers to come up with new ideas. I've um I've always wanted to be part of like a writer's group where we could get to meet and that kind of thing, and that just never has panned out for me. Um, so I think I'm always searching for that kind of group to be part of, you know, um, that we really can talk real, you know, numbers and we can really talk real strategies and helpful. But you know, I've not found that that group yet. So I'm always searching for that, but because I like working in an environment with people and and being at a job, you know, so just being at a job set me up for success. And for the writing part of it is that um I always know where I stop, and I always know what the next scene's gonna be for the next morning. So when I go to write the next day, I am not um stalled at where I need to start. So I don't have to be like, oh, okay, now where does this, where am I gonna start? Or oh gosh, I'm spending 10 minutes on reading where I was yesterday and what I had written. So I know exactly, you know, where um I'm gonna start. So I don't waste that time. Right, right. So that that I believe set me up for success. Right. Wow, that is great. So tell people where they can find you and your book. Um, you can find me on my website at TanyaCapus.com and all my links are there or on Amazon. Go ahead and follow me there because that's where all my books are because I am um strictly in Kindle Unlimited with all my self-published stuff. Okay, yeah, I was. So that's a whole nother that's a whole nother beast to tackle.

Jami 1:14:41

Yeah, that's a whole nother podcast. Exactly, exactly. I'm the one talking because Sarah's internet has crashed at her house. That's okay. Um just the two of us. But we just appreciate you being here. This has been so great. I know our listeners are gonna love it. Um, and we'll see you guys next week. Bye. Well, thank you, Janie. Bye bye, Sarah.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:07

Thanks for listening to the Wish I'd Known Then podcast. We hope this episode inspired you, empowered you, and made you laugh a little bit too. If you loved it, tell your friends about it. And if you feel so inclined, leave us a review. We look forward to being with you again next week.