S3E17 - The right way to open candy

On this episode, Jamie Brindle. Jamie has been freelancing for 16 years, and in that time, he’s had the privilege of working with clients ranging from local mom-and-pop restaurants to Fortune 500 companies like Google, Hillshire, Netflix, and Lionsgate.

In 2020, he began producing social media content for his fellow freelancers on social media. And now, across multiple platforms, he’s helping over 600,000 freelancers every day with practical tips, and still finding time to get out and do proper client work every month.

We discuss door-to-door moviemaking, failures of leadership, and the proper way to open candy.

Find Jamie here: 

https://jamiebrindle.io/

Transcript

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SPEAKER_03 0:00

Coming up on points of failure.

SPEAKER_01 0:02

I was in the uh Google offices in in Beverly Hills and talking to the YouTube team. And that was the first time, you know. I mean, that's a that's an impressive that's impressive company to be in. You know, like you're like, okay, these people, like they're killing it. These are these are A players, and you know.

SPEAKER_03 0:22

Welcome to the Points of Failure Podcast, where we explore the full spectrum of failure, from inaction to impulse. Our guests range from student experts to everyday people, real stories. Together we have active learning what might have been done definitely, what are you reflecting on the FATCON of current challenges, operating from freedom, etc. network and 2020, social media countries, double free language and multiple platforms, and 100 free language every day, practical tech, and stop planning to have to get out to do some proper client work every month. We discuss door-to-door movie making, failures of leadership, and the proper way to open candy. Hope you enjoy this episode. Jamie, why don't you introduce yourself and uh tell people what it is that you do and and uh I guess how we got connected even.

SPEAKER_01 1:39

Yeah, sure, man. I'm I'm excited to be here. We're gonna have fun today. I uh for those of you that don't know me, uh my name's Jamie Brindle. I've been uh freelancing since I was 17. I'm 35 now, so somebody who's who's good at math, figure that out for me. I don't I don't know how many years that's been. Um uh I I've primarily uh been freelancing in the video production world. Uh my wife and I are business partners. She she joined the business uh a little while back, and coincidentally, that's when we started doing really well. So we I I haven't quite figured out why yet. I'm sure that I'm sure it was just a coincidence. Um, but you know, circa 2020, uh I started making content for freelancers on the internet. Uh, you know, just our fellow practitioners, and we've grown that that audience base to a little north of half a million across all the social media platforms. And it's been really uh incredible to see, you know, how regardless of service, regardless of industry, everybody's kind of solving for the same stuff. And you know, everybody's there to support each other. So it's you know, it's it's been fun to be a hub for that type of support uh on the internet. And that's how you and I met. We we met on Instagram, uh, you know, so it's it's it's it's brought us uh you know, brought brought me uh closer to to many a many a new friend.

SPEAKER_03 2:55

Very good. Yeah, it's uh I was surprised to get your message, but I was excited. It was something new, something I hadn't really connected with. Uh, you know, the I don't want to plug you into social media marketing, but I mean, let's be real, that's pretty much where all the business flows these days, right? Is social media. So a little bit of um you said you started at 17, right? Doing the the freelancing. What did you freelance in?

SPEAKER_01 3:20

So when I got started, uh I I you know, I mean, my I made my first short film when I was seven in second grade. It was a Star Wars movie. We shot it in the backyard, we premiered it in the cafeteria uh of the school, right? So it's like so from the very early days, I was I was in video. Um, and then when I was in uh high school, I went to you could like major in my high school. So it's like you could like major in subject and so I majored in media uh design, media and design, right? So it's like journalism, you know, video production, graphic design, like all this stuff. And uh of course, having been, you know, poking around with video since I was seven, uh, I quickly, you know, got bored of what they had to teach and uh started ranting out equipment from the school locker uh to go get paid to make stuff. And so I would go door to door and um and sell local businesses on uh television commercials, which was which was fun. I'd I'd put on my men's warehouse suit and you know walk up to us and just do a whole strip mall. Just go do down down the strip mall and ask people if they needed a c a television commercial, um, which was you know, I mean, you don't know what you don't know back then. And so I think I think that's a I'm sure like a you know a 30-year-old now would would not enjoy that process, but a 17-year-old, like I didn't know that I could I couldn't walk into a blockbuster and and pitch a commercial to the general manager, you know, like and get all these strange looks. It was uh but it was an interesting first first job. What was did you what was your high school job? What was your first job?

SPEAKER_03 4:57

Oh man, my first job, I was a paper boy, it's the very first thing I did. Yeah, 13 years old. All right, yeah. And that was uh, of course, it's really funny. My so my my mom, I was not an only child originally. My brother passed away when I was very young. And so uh my mom, she would actually help me. So we'd go pick up the papers in the morning and come back and roll them all and throw them, and then so then she'd drive me around so I didn't have to ride my bike so I could chuck them out the car. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

So that was my that was my first one. I you know what a blessing it is to have parents that kind of nurture, you know, an entrepreneurial effort or or any type of you know, go get her spirit. I feel like that was I was I was blessed in that way too, where it was my parents were constantly nudging me in in the direction of, okay, well, you know, maybe talk to this person about this, or you know, I have this friend that did this with video, let me set up coffee, you know. That was I always watched my dad when when I grew up, uh, I would work like I would do like my school work and uh um you know, or like I I would like paint uh Warhammer characters in in middle school, you know, and I would do that in his office uh while listening to him on conference calls with, you know, like executives and senior vice presidents and stuff. And it was like he kind of like miyagi me. Like I was, you know, I wasn't really paying attention, but I think through osmosis, I was getting an education on how to talk to people about business. It was pretty fun.

SPEAKER_03 6:26

Yeah, I would imagine you'd pick it up, you know. Just sometimes just sitting in a room with with people and watching them do what they do, you can absorb quite a bit if they're if they're prolific, you know, and they're really kind of a larger than life image. So yeah, absolutely. Certainly. Yeah. So what do you think? Uh, you know, I mean, I imagine you experienced all sorts of failure at 17, going door to door at a strip mall, but moving, moving on uh as you as you built your your business and your freelancing, um, what sort of made you pick a direction and and aim toward what led you where you are now?

SPEAKER_01 7:00

Yeah, I think it was like, you know, I like it's interesting teaching this stuff on the internet now because in the doing of it, it never felt very methodical. It was like I always learned the lesson after, right? So it was never like it was never like, okay, cool. I'm gonna here's the plan, you know, I'm gonna do these five things and get these five results. And it was more uh, you know, it was more well, what if I did this and then getting burned and being like, okay, we're not gonna do that again, you know? Um, so I I I think you know, accidentally I I discovered the concept of uh you know niching down and and like I knew I knew from the beginning that I wanted to be in video, so that didn't need to be figured out, right? But how like in what capacity needed to be figured out? Like how was it going to pay for my life? Um and and I so it's like on accident, I discovered selling video as a as a solution to a problem that like B2B companies were having, right? Like before that, I I would say yes to anybody who needed a video, right? You need someone to film your wedding? Sure. You need someone to film a commercial, cool. You need somebody to film, you know, XYZ, I'm there. Um, but then if there was a conference I went to, I had been asked to film at a conference, I interviewed some executives, um, and I shot it uh like a short film, you know, like and and I didn't know at the time that that world was not used to that type of attention from video. It was like very much like set up a camera in the corner, film it, and it's over. So, you know, I got another call from somebody who saw that video and was like, Hey, can you go to do that at our conference? You know, like, yeah, sure. You know, and then I got another call. And then at that conference, someone who owns an agency that that serves conferences walked up to me and said, You know, you want to do this for all of our clients? You know, and so before I knew it, I had niche, I had niche down in the you know, meetings and events space. Uh, and and that's how I was building my company, you know. Um, but I didn't realize that until two years in, you know, I was like, I'm only doing conferences. Maybe that's maybe I should optimize for that, you know. Um, so yeah, I I think it's you know a lot of people like procrastinate on their ambitions because they think and maybe you've seen the same, they they think that um they have to have a plan. Like they think that they have to have it figured out. And you know, in actuality, like the plan reveals itself in the doing. Have you have you noticed that? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 9:34

And you know, I I think for me, I think there's a lot of um, there's all these gurus, if you will, and all these people out there writing books and this and that, and and telling you, oh, you gotta have a vision and you gotta what is your goal and what is your vision and what's the purpose and write the step, you know, what are you gonna do and what's your three-week plan and your six-week plan, you know, all these steps.

SPEAKER_00 9:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:56

And I think that there's so much of that out there that I know even for myself, you get inundated with this, oh, well, I don't, I don't really know how I want this to go yet. I don't, you know, I I know I want to do this thing, yeah, but I don't know what it's gonna look like in five years or six weeks. And so I think that holds a lot of people up. I know, I mean, like I said, it it did for me. Um, it was really difficult for me initially with the getting the podcast up and running because I didn't have a plan for it. I just thought, well, I'll do some interviews and I'll get a backlog so that I could just pop them out. And then I got so excited I released my first one. And then I was like, well, I'm off up and running now. Yeah. So I mean, that's the thing. It's um yeah, absolutely. I I think that like you said, the the the plan reveals itself as you start going and eventually you can go, oh, okay, all right, I need to tweak this. This is working, this is not, and then you it kind of starts to reveal itself, you know?

SPEAKER_01 10:55

Yeah, yeah, it is. I mean, I it's and I don't think we're unique to this discussion. Like, I think like a lot of people, um, you know, at at our level, and also people who are more successful than us all say the same thing, right? Is it's just like it's you know, the the action is should be the objective. You'll you'll learn more in you know two weeks of doing via via failure, right? You'll learn more in two weeks of doing than you'd learn in six and a half months of planning. It's you know, because it's really at the end of the day, I mean, we can keep it limited to business, but I think life in general is kind of a game of data collection. You know, it's just you see, you see what throw shit against the wall and see what sticks, basically.

SPEAKER_03 11:40

Yeah, I uh a good friend of mine, his dad was uh was an entrepreneur and he invented some things and became a millionaire. And as entrepreneurs do, yeah. As they as they tend to do. Uh he's just you know, he's just one of those guys that was just smart and saw a need and was like, hey, I'm gonna make this work. Um, one thing that he told me, uh, you know, I got my business degree and and I was chatting with him once and he's like, Oh yeah, business school, they teach you to buy it for a nickel and sell it for a dime, right? And I was like, Um, well, yeah, I guess kind of. He's like, Yeah, you could have figured that out. I would have just done it, you know. And that's in my mind, you know, it's it sounds so simple, but or so profound or whatever, you know. But I mean, yeah, absolutely. You you just start doing it, just start doing the thing and see, you know.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

Yeah, it's it is funny how like it and like in in the doing, it suddenly becomes so apparent, like something that like legitimately probably took you four years to learn in school, right? Like it's like you know, like systems and processes, and it's like when you do it, you're like, what the hell? How did we talk about this for four years? Like it was, you know, really like okay, business is the exchange of money for solutions check, right? That's it. Like, cool. Like, go solve money, go solve problems that are more valuable than the money that they're paying you to solve them for, you know, and the end. Now that works, cool, go do it again with another solution, you know. Um, and it does. It takes it takes a minute to learn about it and you know, and and no, no time at all to experience about it.

SPEAKER_03 13:10

Yeah, no doubt about that. I I think that the and I think you quickly flesh out, like, you know, my there was a time where I had a dream, if you will. I don't know if I'd call it a dream, but I thought that I really wanted to own like a bar or a nightclub. And I think it's I mean, and I think it's just because I was in that business for a while and I'm you know, my I still bartend on the side here and there for fun, a little extra cash. Um, but I I think that that was what like, oh, I love this, you know, because I what I like is the people, you know. This this part of the podcasting is what I really enjoy. It's going home and then having to edit it and split, you know, all that that I don't enjoy that much. But when I actually sat down and had an opportunity, if you will, to buy a location and it was almost perfect to set up a place and just had to do a few changes. But at the end, I I just whipped up a quick pro forma to see what it was gonna cost me and I started breaking it down and realizing all the effort that was gonna go into getting a liquor license and this and that. And then the point being that at some point, I think you flesh out whether or not this is really your place, you know. Um, Mark Manson says you he knew he didn't really want to be a rock star because he just wanted to be Eddie Van Halen up there shredding the guitar. No, you know, but Eddie Van Halen had to learn how to do that first, right? So you don't want to put the effort in. If you're not really driven, you don't really want it.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

That's that's that's a great observation. Like that's a that's a big moment, like for for what you're describing. Like it's it's when you you like where the rubber meets the road, basically. It's like, okay, I've got a goal. Here's the first brick wall that I have to run through. And if like if at that wall you're like, I don't I don't think I want to get bloody running through that wall, you know, then it's not for you. Like that's that's how you figure it out, right?

SPEAKER_03 15:01

Right. Yeah, exactly. And I I think that was the big thing for me was uh seeing how much money it was, you know, just to get started. I was I I forget now, but it was it was in the somewhere between two and five million dollars just to get started, and then like an operational cost annually of like a two to three million. And I was just, I mean, I'm I'm this guy. I'm I'm working, I forget, I think I was working for uh uh for a retail company at the time, and I was like, nobody's gonna give me a five million dollar business loan for a business I've never run, I've never owned one, I've never even started a business, you know, at that point. And I was like, so yeah, that wall was too much. I wasn't ready for to bleed on that one at all.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Yeah, yeah. No, that's fair. I like I'm trying to think if I have had any any moment like that. Because I do, like, I do think that I was fortunate that like I I I clearly have a a passion. Like it was always pursue video, you know, and and have always felt that way about it. And it's I, you know, I I feel like I've got, you know, I've been told that not everybody has this kind of like entrepreneurial spirit where it's like like I can't stand asking permission for things. I never have like when I was in high school, it would, I mean, like I was like the president of everything, but I hated authority, you know, like it was I I hated asking permission for you know to do any. I would just like like leave school because it's like, well, there's nothing I don't need to be here right now. You know, they're like, no, you do need to be here. Like, no, no, I don't. Like, even when I I lasted in a uh um a nine to five for like seven weeks after college. Like I I went, you know, worked in a cubicle for seven weeks and um and I started working from home in the middle of it. Like, cause and this is before everybody worked from home, you know, and it was because they found out that I could do video editing and and they asked me to do something for the CEO. And I was like, well, I I can do it, but I have to work from home because you know, a terabyte back then was this big and I was like, I'm not bringing that to the office every day. And then I just never I stopped coming into the office because I was getting so much done from my dining room table in my apartment. And you know, I I had it out with my boss who was a friend. It was like a a uh, you know, it was a cordial disagreement, but he was like, You got to come in. And I'm like, why? Why why do I have to like why? I'm getting more done at home. Why do I need to come in? Because just because you got to, you know. Um, but yeah, it's I've I've always had that like, you know, like I I don't know. It's it's uh it's a passion of mine, entrepreneurship and and video. So I've I don't think I've I've come to a point where I'm like, no, I don't think I want to run through that wall yet, uh, which I'll I'll consider one of one of my many blessings.

SPEAKER_03 17:41

So for somebody wanting to go into this, I want to think about somebody out there that's that maybe listening to this that says, hey, you know what, I really want to do video. What do you what do you think are the most, I mean, you can however many one, two, three, um the most impactful failures for you that really taught you, okay, this is how I've got to, you know, this is the course I gotta take right here.

SPEAKER_01 18:05

It's a good question. I I would say, I mean, my wife and I were on a walk right before this, actually, and we were talking a little bit about failure. And I was like, it's it's never been, it's never been a bad word to me, like failure. Like I've always it's always been an indicator that I was doing something interesting. Um, like it's like what we were talking about earlier, that that you know, it's a game of data collection, and like failure is another way of saying like it's like you're out there collecting failures, like on the path, you know, it's like, okay, I I'm basically shutting down paths not to take as I'm working my way, you know, forward. Um, so you know, failures to me have always been just that, like data points. Um, and but I would say that probably some of the most informative ones, one would definitely be um uh I would say when early in my career, the first time that I had a pitch meeting with a really significant customer, like a brand that anybody in the world would recognize, um I labored for weeks uh working on that pitch, like like writing out on index cards what I was gonna say, researching the company, trying to get a sense of what they're doing, like you know, what they could want, research, like everything. Like, you know, I was definitely uh you know outpunning my coverage on the pitch. Like it was it was very obviously, you know, and I get on the call and there's like seven people on the call, and uh, you know, and they say, All right, uh, you know, what you got, what you got for us? And and I proceeded to talk reading from the index cards for probably about 20 minutes, right? Nonstop, not stopping to to ask any questions, to, you know, and uh, you know, I finished my my dramatic reading of my index cards, and they just said, okay, um well, thank you. And uh and we'll we'll we'll talk to you. We'll we'll we'll talk soon, you know, and hung up the like that was it. There was literally like there was like no, you know, no like casual end of call banter, you know. Uh so I imagine they all had left the room at that point, you know, and and it was just whoever had stayed said we'll talk soon. Um, and that was so that was a big data point for me. And that informed, you know, how I handled those meetings moving forward. It was, you know, okay, I should not talk that much. Like that's definitely not a, you know, and also um I should probably get us all on the same sheet of music about what we're doing here. Like what how like what problem are you actually trying to solve? Like I realized, you know, how about instead of doing a bunch of industry research, I just ask. Like, like how about I just ask them and let them tell me what problem I'm supposed to be solving for them, you know? Um, so that was a big that was a big one for me, I'd say. Uh it you know really informed uh the way that I handle client conversations. Uh I think uh ultimately in any uh business, uh I was gonna say any freelance business, but honestly, it's probably any any business exchange ever. Like it's we're in a we're people, like it's it's a people business, right? Like friends hire friends or friends are friends. Um people like doing business that they you know enjoy talking to. So it's like that's a big part of it, is like just like refining and getting really good at communicating. And so I think that a lot of you know, a lot of those early data points for me were about that, like locking in on like how you actually talk to people about things and how you actually, you know, another one is when I uh another big big brand, uh, when I first moved to LA, uh, I was in the uh Google offices in in Beverly Hills and talking to the YouTube team. And that was the first time um, you know, I mean that's a that's an impression. That's impressive company to be in. You know, like you're like, okay, these people, like, they're killing it. These are these are A players, and you know. Um but like by then I had I had developed a a way of communicating to clients, um, you know, and and walking into that office, it was like, okay, what if I treated this guy like uh Miss Lucille, who owned Lucille's restaurant in Richmond, Virginia, that I did videos for, you know, four years ago. Like, and just like, why how how about I just treat him like a human being, you know, and and and that's so it was cool to see that. Like I remember having that moment where I was like, oh yeah, this is no different than you know, than that. And so it is, it's it's been fun to see those, you know, kind of like come to fruition, like those data points then be put to work to, you know, to my benefit down the road.

SPEAKER_03 22:51

That that makes a lot of sense uh to me, especially, you know, your first example with learning how to communicate with uh sort of reading the room, I guess, in a way. Yeah. Um, and that's uh I, you know, one of the things I learned doing this podcast when I would each episode I release as I went through and listened to it and edited, I would listen to myself. And it's funny, the things that you do in a normal conversation when you're talking to somebody, you nod, you say things, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, true. Whatever, you know, you you can banter back into it. Yeah. And I found that I was doing that so much, or in my mind, I thought I was engaging. It was distracting. I was constantly like, yeah, sure, yeah, sure, yeah, sure. You know, like every 30 seconds with somebody. And uh it was I found myself like, man, that's so distracting. Nobody's gonna listen to this. So over time, I just got to where I learned from those. And to me, I'd be like, okay, that that episode I'm still gonna release it, but wow, you know, learn to shut up, Steve. So that's uh yeah, reading that room and um is is a huge point, I think for sure, knowing who you're knowing who you're talking to and what what they're really gonna want, you know.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

Yeah, yeah. It yeah, and like like you know, realizing that you can ask a question, you know, like it's like uh like it's you don't have to be talking the whole time, you know. It's it's little little things like that. I've noticed that like I wonder if you've seen the same. Like now, I guess like now that you know, because I I I call accumulated failures wisdom, right? I I think that's what we all like that's that's what we recognize as wisdom is just somebody's failures stacked up, you know, poetically, basically. Uh and and I've found now that uh I can sense when when I'm about to fail. Like you can like you can like see it happening, you know, you're like, this doesn't feel right, like mid-conversation or like mid mid-project, uh, you know, to to this day, you're like, hmm. And it's like any time that you're kind of breaking from that wisdom, you know. Uh, but I feel like maybe that's that's probably the only way you can add to the ammo stack, right? Is like you have to go out and keep failing. But like, have you have you experienced that where you're like mid mid-conversation and you're like, yeah, this is over?

SPEAKER_03 25:17

Oh yeah. Oh gosh, countless times. I mean, being uh being single for the last almost two years now, I've had plenty of those conversations where like, all right, this the she does not want to talk to me right now. It's funny.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

Being being married, I've had those conversations too.

SPEAKER_03 25:33

Fair enough. Fair enough. Yeah, it's uh it is it is very interesting to to watch almost watch something just devolve and fall apart in front of you. And you're just like, wow, I really thought that was gonna go a lot better than it did. Yeah. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:47

And it is, it's like, you know, it's like plussing. Like, I, you know, for for me, at least with like business stuff, like it's like building out a new offer, you build it with like the the insights that you've accrued, um plus one or two little things that you're not that sure about, you know, and I I think it's it's when I go all in on the not that sure about that I get this feeling more often, where it's like where you know, it was I didn't like design this offer as intelligently as I probably should have. Or like, you know, I'm I'm way out here on on you know, in this field that I'm not familiar with, uh, you know, and I have to bullshit my way through this conversation or like something like that. I think that's been, you know, so that's maybe the the the learning there is to just responsibly, you know, try try to responsibly fail a little more often versus, you know, just going going all in on something you've never tried before.

SPEAKER_03 26:46

Yeah, no doubt. I mean, you I think about investors, you know, when they when they they take risks, but those risks are uh educated risks, right? They they mitigate their failure or they mitigate the risk by having at least some understanding of what they're risking. And I think that's kind of the same thing here is looking at something and going, okay, I mean, there's, you know, this has a 30% chance of failure, this has a 15% chance of failure. Uh, I think I'll focus on this 15%, and you know, it may not give me quite the return that the other one will, but I'm less likely to fail, you know.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

So something to build on. It all comes down to what the what the objectives are, you know. It's because it is like sometimes the you know, sometimes the 30% play is the play, you know, and it's just it's it's having the uh the the uh the wherewithal to to determine which one which play you're interested in right now at this juncture in life. I like because it is true, it's you know, your life uh shrinks and life expands, uh you know, depending on your willingness to accept risk. It's like I mean the the the the least the least risky life uh is probably the most contained life, you know, and and that's across the board, not like just business, like life in general too, relationships, um, you know, you you name it. So I think you know, and everybody's risk tolerance is different, and everybody what everybody wants out of life is different. Um, but I think that there's like that's probably one of the most straightforward indicators of the type of life you're gonna have is is the type of risks you're comfortable taking or like willing to take. I don't think comfort should play into it at all.

SPEAKER_03 28:27

Yeah, the comfort zone is not the not really where you want to live because you're not doing anything.

SPEAKER_01 28:32

Yeah. Where's the fun in that, right?

SPEAKER_03 28:35

Yeah, no doubt. So you said your business really got kind of kind of took off when you got around the time you got married. Those may uh I don't know if correlation is causation there, uh, but so uh clearly that was not a failure. Um any um any other sort of professional or personal failures you feel like really impacted your trajectory?

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Yeah, let's think. I will we'll go chronologically. So we we talked about that first one. Um okay, I got here's another interesting one. Um I did a project. I don't think I've ever talked about this one on the internet before. So this is this is an interesting one. So I don't I don't have like a soundbitey way to tell this story yet. So let me know if uh if I start rambling. But I did a project. Um, you know, uh again, we're we're post uh the era where we're we're we're a few years past the the phone call story, right? And uh I've been you know in business for a while, I've niche down, I have a team that I work with. Um and uh I reached out to a past client and I asked, you know, for you know if they know anybody that they they would be happy referring me to. Um and you can just open the chocolate, you know. My wife's over here opening chocolate really slowly. Uh she's she's she's working, she's got her headphones on. Uh so the this uh old client of mine referred a job to a friend of theirs, and it was a big production project um that was uh something I'd never done before. It was like a a a TED talk type thing where they were they needed it basically covered like you would cover an event like that. And there were you know three different stages, and uh it's not our traditional what we offer. Now, early in my career, uh I grew big time by saying yes to opportunities like this, yes to things that like I had never done before, because I knew that I would figure it out. Like I had that confidence in myself, and you know, and I knew that I could, you know, string together the right subcontractors if I needed to, but you know, for the most part, I I would I could muscle this thing into success. At this stage in my career, I was in more of a delegation stage. Um, and so it was, you know, we were managing multiple projects at a time, and I wasn't out in the field. I was at home um, you know, editing and dealing with client work um primarily. And so not realizing that there's a difference between what I can do and what other people can do, right? Or somebody who who's not doesn't own my business can do, uh, I delegated this figure it out, you know, task uh to my team and and just left them to their own devices, right? Like to the point where like I almost I forgot it was happening when it was happening. Like it was like I didn't like they I got a text from somebody on location, like as they were filming, and I was like, Oh yeah, they're doing that thing today, you know. And when I get the footage back, it was horrendous. It was like, you know, unlike unsalvageable. Like it was just they uh you know they brought the wrong lenses because like the stage were wasn't lit the right way, so everything was dark, and like you know, they didn't even have you know proper, like it wasn't telephoto, like they had like you know, there there were no close-ups, like you like all of these things that could go wrong with covering the event like this. Like we hadn't we had no coverage.

SPEAKER_00 32:03

Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_01 32:04

And I turned, you know, I did what I could with it, turned it in, never heard from these people again, never heard from the client that referred me to these people again either. You know, so it was like I lost a potential relationship and I lost a cur what was a thriving relationship, uh, you know, with a client from just you know, just leave leaving it, you know, a team to their own devices. So uh and that's on me. That's not on them, by the way. Like that's not, you know, that was that's a that's a leadership problem, not a not a uh execution problem. So um, but that was a that was a big learning moment for me too.

SPEAKER_03 32:37

I'm sure. Yeah, it's uh those moments where you, you know, yeah, you want to delegate something out, you want to give someone their, you know, empower them to do something. But sometimes I and I've seen this a lot and you know, in my I've got a I've got a regular sort of nine to five that I do as well as I'm building this podcasting business, but I've seen this in different areas of leadership where and I think I saw it the most in restaurants where I had my mentors in restaurant management where they would they had this skill set where they could empower you to do what you had to do, but still managed to have their hand on it. You know, they still were able to still still still have some piece of the control. Um, but they were just so adept at what do you what do you think that what do you credit that to? You know, I I I guess at the end of the day, it's um I don't know what to call it, but the the really good managers that that especially in restaurants, it's just a particular skill with people. Um, that they just I think they understand that you need to be able to do it in order to excel at your job. Um, but there also has to be some some sort of oversight, you know, because it can't just go off and you know do whatever. You don't, you don't, you don't put everybody in the restaurant and then take them off down the road and go eat somewhere else and just see what happens when you get back. You know, you still have to be there.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:07

So yeah, and I I I don't know what particular thing, like what to call that skill, but uh it's definitely a soft skill. It's not something, you know, I and I I don't even know that it's a skill that that could be taught because I felt like I was a pretty good restaurant manager and I felt like I was pretty good at empowering my team, but I don't know that I was that skilled at at holding both of those pieces where here's your power, but I'm still I'm still holding on to it too.

SPEAKER_01 34:36

Yeah. I I think what I what I started learning from that from that particular scenario and then continue to learn over the next few years was that like A, it's casting, like it's hiring the right people, right? Like there are just some people who will not excel in this job. So like that's where it begins is like bringing in the right people. But then B, I think that people thrive. Uh you know, the right people, if you've put them in the right place, thrive when they know how they're being graded. Like if like if it's very if it's been explained to them uh, you know, very clearly, this is the scoring system for your performance, right? And it doesn't have to be like points and things like that, but just like here's what success looks like for you this month, right? Like if you if you accomplish this, uh you A plus gold star, right? Like, and then that person knows what to do from there. It's like, okay, cool. Now now I'll I'll let you figure out what path you want to take to get to that result this month, right? Because I've that's what you're here for. You're the expert. But you know, here's here's our success metrics, you know, for for your not not our company success metrics, here are your success metrics, you know, for I I think that's been um the the best way to do it is to just be I I think too many people when they first start bringing in myself included, like is when you first start bringing in subcontractors or start hiring people, it's like you're like, Do you want to work on this? And like, you know, here's I mean, if you want to do this, that would be cool. And like they everybody kind of like gingerly tiptoes around this this subject, and it's like really you're doing everybody a favor by just saying, Hey, this is this is what your report card looks like, like you know, this is how this is how you're being graded this month, you know. Um, that person then gets to go, okay, cool, great. All this other stuff that I was worried about, I'm pushing off the desk because all this guy worries wants to happen is these three things, you know. So I'll just focus on those. Um that's what I've found has been has been the right way to to square it.

SPEAKER_03 36:41

I think that makes sense too, because you know, like you said, if if if my you know my leadership wants these three things from me, then I don't have to focus on anything else. I can focus my energy on getting those three things. And then if I really stay focused and I can accomplish those three things in a set amount of time, maybe I have a little extra time to get a little extra stuff done in there, you know, and it that's where you I think that's where you can get the over and above. Um, you know, I don't I don't think you get the over and above out of somebody that's you know saying yes to everything. You know, that that's I think that was one of my biggest things was I learned to say no and stop. You know, you want to show up, you want to be that, oh yeah, you can count on me, but you can't if you're doing trying to take every project on, because there's no way that one person can get every single project done if they're taking, you know, six 20-hour projects and you're only working a 40-hour work week. You know, that's not gonna happen. Or, you know, then you're working 80 hours or 120 hours, but yeah, you spread a little thin. Yeah, you're not gonna do it. It's not gonna happen. It's uh it it it's been a you know, I'll tell you what, I think I've failed more in my personal life than I have in my professional life, but uh either way, I've I've come around to learning a few things.

SPEAKER_01 37:55

That's where all that's where all the growth happens, right? Exactly. Yeah, I mean, like at the end of the day, that's the thing though, is it really is, I mean, I I I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I think you agree with me that like it that really kind of is the point, right? Like it is like it's an indicator that you're growing, right? Or you know, that's what uh also hesitation, I would say. Like if you're you know, if you're looking at a decision and you're like, let me hold off and think this one through, like that's an indicator that you need to just push through it, like keep like, you know, because if you're like concerned about failure, right, it's like that no, still that means you're on the right path, like charge ahead, right? I had my uh my great-grandmother had a had a poem that that she would cite and I hope that hopefully I'm not gonna butcher it, but it was you know, uh a component of it was um make the best decision you can as quickly as you can. The moment of absolute certainty never arrives. So many people hold off for that moment where it's like, well, when when do I when can I be confident that this is the right play? And it's like, well, you're gonna be standing there for a long time trying to figure that one out because that moment never arrives. It's it's a fake moment, you know, it's a phantom. Uh so it's just like just move. Just you know, if you if you if you're thinking on something, like if you've got a choice to make and you haven't made it in like a day, move. Just go, just pick one and go. Like you can, I mean, and if that's a failure, great, get back on the original path and pick pick the other one. Like it's just just move, get get the data.

SPEAKER_03 39:28

Yeah, I think that uh we have this backward concept of, you know, well, first I gotta get you know motivated and then I'll do something and then I'll get the results, you know. But motivation comes after acting. I think when you just take that step and you know, you go to the gym and you start working out and then you start feeling better. And so the oh, that motivates you to do it some more and continue to do it. And I think we we get that reversed, and we're all waiting for that inspiration to suddenly hit me, and I'm gonna go kick out my my novel and and be this best-selling writer. And that's just not gonna be what it is, you know.

SPEAKER_01 40:02

It is funny how like all of the people on the other side of that journey tr we we try to tell. Like it's like, and there are so I've I've tried so many different ways to say what you have just said, right? Where it's just like you get the lesson after the test, you know, it's it's and there's I mean, it's it's all we can do to keep trying to to push people towards that. And then there are it's funny because like even in my life now, you know, because I I mean, I'm we're we're successful, but by no means are I mean, there are people that are like you know, 400 times as successful as we are, and they'll they'll look at us and they're saying the same thing to us. Because even even at now now at this stage, we're looking downrange and there's all these things that we're you know apprehensive about, and people are like, no, just push through that shit, like just keep going. Like it seems to be the theme.

SPEAKER_03 40:51

That's what I keep hearing. And you know, I try to I try to repeat it to myself because I find myself doing that, like, ah, I don't know. I don't know if this is the right time to, you know, and sometimes like, you know what? When's the right time? What is that? I used to actually um I go back and forth with a friend of mine because she'd always like, well, I don't think I'm I'm ready for a relationship or ready for this or ready for I'm like, what does that mean to be ready? What what is that, you know, when you think about it? So I don't want to settle. Well, what does that mean? What does settle settling look like? Is that, you know, do you settle for a guy that's under six feet? Is that settling? Or you know, I mean, what what is the settling part? You know, and so I think that I once I began to actually think through some of those things myself because I heard myself say it and then I was like, Well, that's really profound. I'm so smart. But then I wasn't doing it. Yeah. Yeah, right. You listen to my own advice.

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Let's walk in on some definitions here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:42

Yeah, like what am I settling on? What am I waiting for? You know, so yeah. That's a really funny like moment of profundity. Yeah, yeah. When you're you're coaching someone else along and realize I needed the coaching, but I appreciate this moment.

SPEAKER_00 41:54

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:55

So any uh any uh I've got a I've got a little of some some fun questions I'll throw at you here, but any any final thoughts you want to lay out there?

SPEAKER_01 42:04

I mean, I think we've covered we've covered a lot of ground. I it's just you know, I yeah, I I would say I'll I'll double down on the whole, you know, failure's kind of kind of the point thing. It's you know, it's just it's uh you know, it it really is. It's raffle tickets in the hat. You know, I I don't think that um you know in any uh uh pursuit, right? And and in any, like whether professional or not, like it is like you know, it's it's however many raffle tickets you get in the hat, uh, you know, is your likelihood of winning, right? There's too many people and you know, I mean, down to business, right? Uh like folks, for instance, that do uh cold outreach, uh they'll DM me and they'll say, you know, it's it's not working. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not generating any leads. And uh and I say, okay, well, how many people are you reaching out to right now? Like, first off, I have I have my own list of issues with cold outreach, but we'll use that as an example. I'll say, How many people are you reaching out to right now? And they'll say, Well, you know, I'm I'm DMing like 20 people a week, you know, and I'm like, okay, well, there's your problem. You should be DMing like 250 people a week, you know, and like and that's but like that is so illustrative of life in general, right? Where it's like we we don't know what we don't know. Like we don't know uh the type of input that we're supposed to be uh, you know, the the the the effort we're supposed to be putting in uh to yield a result that we want to yield. Um so really, but truly it is it's raffle tickets in the hat, just just as in you know, as in cold outreach, right? The more the more doors you knock on, the more yeses you're gonna get. The more failures that you collect, the more wisdom, the the more, you know, eventually the more successes you're gonna get. All it's all the numbers game.

SPEAKER_03 43:50

Yeah. All right. Well, let's um let's hit you with some fun questions here. Um so if you could pick up a new skill in a single instant.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

What would it be? A new skill in a single instant. Um it would be I'd want to learn a different language. I'd I'd wanna I'd wanna, you know, I I don't I don't know what language something cool. I'd like you know, I'd love to pick up ASL sign language, that would be a good one. I'd like I just I don't know. I I I'd love to be able to just like interpret for for people with whatever whenever they need it. But I'd yeah, any I'll take any language though.

SPEAKER_03 44:25

Yeah, very cool. Um if you were a wrestler, what would your entrance theme song be?

SPEAKER_01 44:31

Oh gosh, it would be something like hmm. It it would be like something super chill, like Sammy Davis Jr. or Frank Sinatra or something, like something completely antithetical to a wrestler's entrance.

SPEAKER_03 44:43

Very nice. I like that. Get the that sort of reverse psychology. Like, why is this guy so chill?

SPEAKER_01 44:49

Man, this guy is not is not on the same page that I'm on right now.

SPEAKER_03 44:52

Yeah, right. This is a championship, man. Come on. Um, or I are you a morning person or night person? Morning person. I used to be a night person, but I I am most definitely a morning person now. I'm finding that mentally I'm definitely more of a morning person, but physically I'm more of a night person. Oh, that's funny. Yeah, it's kind of a weird, like, why why can't I have both of those in one month?

SPEAKER_01 45:17

That'd be great. Maybe have a little meeting. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:20

Yeah. I'd be I'd be a superstar. Um, so what fictional world or place would you most like to visit?

SPEAKER_01 45:28

Huh. There are so many good ones that it would be, I don't know. I mean, the obvious answer would be like the Shire or something. That that seems super peaceful, but I'm sure I'm not the first person that said that. I'm trying to think of like uh what's another good fictional world? We can go with the Shire. I'll I'll stick with that.

SPEAKER_02 45:46

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:50

Now, yeah, my kids and I, we love uh well, my kids are adults now, but even as adults, we love the Skyrim game. It's just that's just you know, it's I don't know if you've ever played Skyrim on I've seen it played though, and it seems like it's like super peaceful, right? What what it is, yeah. It's it's one of those games that you know you just kind of get lost in. Um but uh I there's so many places in Skyrim I'd love to, I'd love to go visit. Uh all right. So if aliens landed on Earth tomorrow and offered to take you with them, would you go?

SPEAKER_01 46:18

Um if if they would bring Courtney with me and she was game, then probably yes. Otherwise, otherwise, no.

SPEAKER_03 46:26

All right, all right. Last one here. If you were left on a deserted island with either your worst enemy or nobody at all, which would you choose?

SPEAKER_01 46:34

Um, worst enemy. I think I could win them over. I think I think if if if if they were left with no option, I I think we could become buddies if we really tried. Sure.

SPEAKER_03 46:43

Yeah, I don't see why not.

SPEAKER_01 46:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:45

All right. Well, uh any more great questions. I got a I've got a list of, I don't know, a few hundred questions that I've just every day as I think of something, I'll write it down. Yeah, so I just kind of break them off into pieces, and you know, that way also I don't want every single person that I have on the show to have the same list of questions. It's kind of less interesting, I think. Yeah, so do the do the inside the actor studio James Lipton questions every time or something. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So uh okay, you wanna you want to plug anything, your business, and your websites?

SPEAKER_01 47:15

Hey guys, you know, I mean just just find me on uh on Instagram or LinkedIn and just shoot me a DM. I mean, this is you know, it's no no need to plug anything. We're you know, but we're we've we've got stuff. I'm sure you'll find it if you come find me on social, but just the Jamie Brindle. Um, just shoot me a DM and let's chat about this stuff. If you can't, if you can't tell, I I love nerding out about you know about business growth and and you know just just this journey that we're all on. So so don't don't hesitate. All right. Well, I appreciate your time, Jamie. Thanks for having me, man. Yeah, you bet.

SPEAKER_03 47:52

I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, please share it with anyone you think might also enjoy it. And if you like the show, please consider supporting it. It's the support of listeners like you that keeps us going. If you'd like to help, there's a link in the show notes. I'd like to thank all of our guests who've taken the time to have these conversations and share their insights on failures, both personal and professional. If you want to follow the show, the website is www.points of failure.buzzsprout.com. And you can find us on Facebook and Instagram as failurepoints pod and on Twitter as failure points. Please like and share, and remember to rate and review the show on whichever podcast platform you use. The ratings and reviews really help and keep us going. If you'd like to contact us directly with questions or guest suggestions, you can email us at failurepointspod at gmail.com. Again, thank you for listening. We'll see you next time on Points of Failure.