79. Teaching Our Daughters to Love Their Bodies with Caroline Kalicki

Join me as I explore the remarkable journey of Caroline Kalicki, a mother of two young daughters and a life coach dedicated to supporting moms. Caroline shares her experiences of navigating motherhood during the pandemic, highlighting the challenges of socializing her children in these unique times.

 Listen in as she opens up about her path to motherhood, including the trials of undergoing IVF, and the significant impact the global shutdown had on her postpartum journey. We also discuss the broader topic of anxiety levels in children, a crucial concern during these unprecedented times.

Caroline also sheds light on the importance of finding mom groups and fostering a supportive community. We explore the Mom Walk Collective, an inspiring organization that connects mothers through shared experiences and mutual support. Caroline emphasizes the value of positive affirmations and steering clear of negative self-talk to promote a healthy self-image in children. Together, we reflect on those "burnt pancake moments" in motherhood, where quick reactions can be challenging but ultimately provide opportunities for growth and learning.

In our conversation, Caroline shares her inspiring transition from a corporate wellness career to becoming a postpartum and motherhood coach. We discuss the initial experiences of educating large groups and the realization of missing personal connections. Caroline's personal story of being laid off during the pandemic and starting her own coaching practice is both relatable and inspiring. She highlights the need for support in postpartum life, focusing on self-care and the societal pressures to quickly return to normalcy after childbirth. Through her journey, Caroline aims to make a significant impact in the lives of mothers, emphasizing the importance of community and support during the motherhood journey.

Connect with Caroline:
Her Website: https://www.motherhencoaching.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/motherhencoaching/

📺 Watch the episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLOpw5ui4uxJHx0tLFVtpnfSkpObfc4d-K

You can find Katie at:
website: burntpancakes.com
YouTube: @burnt.pancakes
Instagram: @burntpancakeswithkatie
Email: katie@burntpancakes.com

🚽 Did you know Katie is also a Certified Potty Trainer? 🚽

☎️ Schedule a 1:1 chat today: Schedule Here
💻 Digital Potty Training Course HERE
📖 Potty Training E-Book HERE
🆓 FREE potty training resources HERE
Instagram: @itspottytime
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Transcript

00:09 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Hello, hello and welcome back to the Burnt Pancakes podcast. I'm your host, Katie Fenske, a mom of three on a mission to remind moms that everyone burns their first pancake. I have on the perfect guest for our podcast today. Her name is Caroline Kalicki and she is a mom of two little girls. She has a very unique experience to talk about of a time when she realized that self-love and caring for herself as a mom not only is important for her but for her daughters. So she's going to share that story and also share how her experience with motherhood has led her to become um a life coach for moms. So she is part of mother hen coaching and I had so much fun picking her brain and just sharing our common experiences about motherhood and postpartum care. So please sit back and enjoy my conversation, my momversation with Caroline. Caroline, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for having me. I'm excited about this topic because this is something that I've wanted to bring up for a while, but I just didn't know how to talk. I'm not an expert in this. 

01:26
I don't know, so why don't you start off by introducing yourself? Let us know where you are, how many kids you have? 

01:34 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
all of that, yes, so my name is Caroline and I am in Colorado, just outside of Denver, and I became a mom in 2020. 

01:43 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I have two daughters. 

01:44 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
My oldest, riley, will be four years old this coming Sunday. 

01:49 - Katie Fenske (Host)
She will not let you forget it, thank you. 

01:53 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And then my youngest, um Noah Carlene. She is nine months old. 

01:57 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Oh my goodness, you are in the trenches right now. Yes, I am yes, Okay, and then you had your first fright during the pandemic. Right Like yes. 

02:06 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Oh my gosh. So like the world shut down, yeah, we just had gotten pregnant and like the world shut down like a few days later. So we just made that like cut off Cause we went through IVF. 

02:16 - Katie Fenske (Host)
So oh my gosh, oh my God, cause I had my last in December of 19. So I had like a couple months of normal before it all came crashing down. But oh my gosh. Okay, I want to know a little bit about your like journey to becoming a mom. You said you did IBF and you kind of like talked about that a little bit on social media, but also, how was the pandemic thrown in there? Like, what was that like? For you it's been a whirlwind. 

02:44 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So, yeah, our journey to becoming pregnant alone was, you know, five, six years stint of just trying everything we could. We went through IUIs, first for both of us my, my wife and me included and it was just month after month, no, no, no, and we wanted it so badly. Everyone around us was getting pregnant. It was like you drank the water and they were getting pregnant. Right, we were not. Yeah, so, come to doing. 

03:13
We finally resorted to IVF and we wanted to let did like the less medically necessary route first kind of deal. So we did IVF and then we got pregnant with our first, right after the world shut down, or right before the world shut down, basically, and we had prepared so long for pregnancy. So I think we're okay to quit that. Even though the world shut down, it was it's the learning after the fact, it's the postpartum, which was really difficult when the world was shut down. And just like seeing her, how different her attitudes and mannerisms and stuff like that and socialization is different than our youngest right now, because the world is open now. So that has been a huge shift to seeing how she's not as comfortable in front of crowds and big groups of people, because she didn't have that when she was younger, Whereas my youngest you can throw in her crowd. She'll look back and make sure I'm there every once in a while, but she could care less where I'm next to her, whereas my first is very, very close. 

04:15 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I am very curious to see if anyone does studies on that age group because, like you, do hear a lot about not only anxiety levels of kids this age but, like the high school, the kids who are going through like junior high high school during the pandemic I've heard anxiety is like through the roof. Yeah, wonder, like how that has affected them, cause like my, my oldest was able, we went to classes, we did all these things and luckily for my third, he went through the pandemic with siblings around. Had it just been like just me and him, I wonder how that would affect it. That would be interesting. 

04:55 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Yeah, I mean we definitely made the best of it and I feel like we're really close because of that but, I, feel like there are some moments where I'm like, ooh, is that why she's like this today, or you know. So you just you wonder, and I don't know if anybody's ever done official studies, but I'd be interested in, I think, I'm sure that, yeah, yes, but also like she is a firstborn. 

05:13 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I know a couple of friends who have firstborns who are very much like that, where it's like I stick to mom and my oldest is not like. He is the opposite of a firstborn, like complete opposite. I don't know how he turned out the way he did, but I remember looking at my friends thinking I wish mine was like that, where they like wouldn't leave my side and cause mine will just like take off at a park and just go running. 

05:37
And I'm like oh my God, you're one and a half, you have to come back here. But they were like no, it's really hard, Cause I can't send them off and do it. 

05:47 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
I think it has some, some pros and cons kind of deal to it, but yeah. 

05:51 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah, Very interesting. Okay, so let's talk a little bit about um your story of how your daughter. She made a comment that was kind of like a hot light bulb self-care, self-love, body image came about, Cause like when you shared that story with me. I'm like, oh my God, I need to talk about this on the podcast, so share a little bit about that. 

06:13 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
For sure. So it's kind of like one of my biggest burnt pancake kind of moments in motherhood right now, navigating being a mom of two girls, and so we were getting ready to go out to a family gathering. I was about three months postpartum with my youngest, so I was in that weird stage where, like, maternity clothes are kind of too big but your regular clothes are still kind of small, so you just kind of are still feeling getting back to feeling like yourself right Without baby, while taking care. 

06:42
Yes, thank you. The frumpy stage Love that. And so I was getting dressed and I hadn't seen these family members for a while, so there was a little extra pressure on that. My dad was in town, like it was just a big thing, so I had tried on I don't know how many outfits, bought some new outfits too, and thought that was the answer. And I just we were in a hotel room, so we're close proximity, right, and I was not aware of what I was saying to myself in the mirror. But somehow that clicked with my daughter. She heard me talk about my body in a negative way and I'm sure what I said was not kind to myself. I think sometimes we can be our own worst critics. And we were getting ready to leave and my daughter looked at us and said mommy, I don't feel good in this, I need to go change. And I was just like, oh, my heart, like you're, you really are listening to me. 

07:38 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yes, At that time, how old was she? She was three. 

07:43 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So three and a few months, yeah, and it was just like this aha light bulb moment where I was like, whoa, what did I say? Even if it's just about my body, has a huge impact on her. 

07:58 - Katie Fenske (Host)
And it was nothing, like you said, directed to her either Cause I look back too and I think ever, like ever since I can remember, I always thought I was bigger and like, as a first grader probably said, I was fat when, and I'm like my mom never said anything to me. But looking back, I'm like I wonder if maybe I just subconsciously picked up what others had been saying, not necessarily to me, but just what was being said. 

08:26 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Yes, and I think our kids do that. I think we did as well too. You know, my parents never said, my mom never said anything negative about my body per se, but I did realize and hear her say that a few times about herself, you know, and I think we do pick up on that as kids, but we don't give kids enough credit that they can pick up on that. We're like oh, they're too young, they won't remember that, they'll forget that. 

08:48
But I think subconsciously they do, they kind of carry that with them and I've carried that with them. Like you said, I mentioned I've had body image. You know, issues kind of fluctuate throughout being a woman and then becoming a mom, when your body shifts from what you wants to do it to be, oh my right, like having kids. 

09:08 - Katie Fenske (Host)
That's like whoa changed it. Like I used to think in my 20s I was like I need to get in shape. I'm like gosh, could I have that body back like? If I had known that this body's going to carry three babies and totally transform, she would have appreciated a little bit more. 

09:25 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Exactly, and I think too. Society does us a negative, you know, does it as service with us, because they put so much pressures on us having to bounce back after being pregnant and be back who you once were, and that's physiologically never going to happen. You're always going to be different. 

09:42 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah. 

09:42 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So I was already struggling with that and I struggled with that a lot with my first anyways, with when I was newly postpartum, with my first, where I just was struggling to kind of find my body and who I was again. Um that I was kind of shocked that it happened again and postpartum but you're vulnerable in that time period to early postpartum. Then it was just kind of like, wow, what I am saying, though, matters around my daughter. 

10:08 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah, yeah. So what have you done to like? Have you healed that? Are you like? What are you doing? Like consciously now, cause it is hard to stop yourself from saying and thinking things and like, even though I have boys, I've still noticed too. I have to be aware of how I'm talking in front of them, um, not only how they think of themselves, but like how they're going to think of other women when they get older, right? 

10:39 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So it's. It's an ongoing work in progress. I'm never going to say I'm going to be perfect at it per se. 

10:44 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Or healed in any way Right. 

10:46 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
I'll magically just figured it all out, but there are some things that I've started to do of just practicing gratitude with my body and what it can do rather than what it looks like. So we talk about that a lot of like look, I, you know, I'm able to get down on the floor and play with you all, I'm able to run after you in the park, things like that, versus saying, oh, I'm size, you know eight again, or I'm you know this many pounds. It's so like getting rid of the numbers per se and focusing more on how you feel and just practicing that gratitude and then really working on challenging that negative self-talk. 

11:26 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Oh my gosh yes. 

11:28 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
That could be an episode on itself, right. 

11:31 - Katie Fenske (Host)
That inner dialogue. 

11:33 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And it's tough. I mean they say that we have anywhere between 12,000, 6,000 thoughts a day, and 80% of them are negative. 

11:40 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Oh my God. But yeah, I believe that. I believe that we're just so hard on ourselves, especially when it comes. 

11:43 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
But yeah, I believe that I believe that we're just so hard on ourselves, especially when it comes to our bodies, especially as women? 

11:50
I think yeah. 

11:52
And so just focusing on just shifting that negative self-talk to, if I catch myself going down that that route of saying, okay, I feel so fat or something like that, like I don't feel my best today, I'm going to do this to feel better, you know, whether that means take a walk with the girls outside or spend some time, you know, doing some breath work or yoga or something that I enjoy doing, just to kind of flip that script and not be so hard and negative on myself. 

12:20
And then I'm thinking it's really about just creating rituals to make me feel good about my body, things that I love to do. So if you don't like working out in the gym and I don't know who likes to like work out for hours on end, I don't but doing stuff that you love that bring you joy, you know. So, just like doing yoga or like going on a walk with the girls, I feel better going for a walk around the block than I would going to the gym right put it on that just out that you're like oh, I have to do this, yeah, right right and then reaching out. 

12:52
Like I am a big fan of community, especially as becoming a mom and we've all we're always taught when it takes a village to raise a child and when you become that mom, you're almost like where's that village? 

13:03 - Katie Fenske (Host)
like where do you find them? 

13:04 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
but seek them out, like find support, find a good girlfriend that was like just can cheer you up and like give you that sense of encouragement so that, even if you don't believe it in the moment, you're able to kind of walk away from that conversation, be like, okay, I'm being a little hard on myself right now. This is not really my reality, you know, because our thoughts do become our beliefs, our beliefs become our reality and our reality becomes our habits. 

13:28 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yep, so true, so true. So you talk a little bit about community. How were you able to find like mom friends and mom groups? Was that hard for you, or were they, but still? 

13:40 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
different Right and I had some good girlfriends but they weren't local. And it was just. It was really challenging. Well, the second time around, I feel like I've attracted some of these groups. I found them a lot easier. There are great mom walk collective as a great group. That's okay. 

14:09 - Katie Fenske (Host)
So statewide one. One opened up in our area, but I didn't find out about it until my third was, I think, three, three or four. So then I kind of felt like the older mom. Everyone had like babies that stayed in the stroller and I had a three-year-old that was like I'm not sitting in the stroller anymore. So I was thinking like, oh, I wish this had been around when I had my first, because I would have been all about that. But yeah, it's a great organization. 

14:37 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
A great organization you can find it online Mom Walk Collective and it's just a group of moms that gets together and walks and you can kind of share and vent to the moms that are there. Everyone kind of gets it and it's just that sense of community. 

14:58
I've had some really good conversations too, but just I'll show up sometimes and just like I just don't feel good in my body and we'll go for a walk. We talk and I feel way better. So, and my oldest pretty big group too Well, there's a few out here in Colorado, so there's a few that I kind of hop back and forth. 

15:08 - Katie Fenske (Host)
They're pretty. 

15:09 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
They're growing. I think they're gaining more popularity. 

15:12 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I was shocked the first time I showed up. I'm like we are all going to go to that coffee shop. We're going to like take over that coffee shop, but it's so awesome seeing like a whole horde of moms with strollers like walking down the street. It is. 

15:25 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
It's really cool. Yeah, people always stop me like what's going on, like especially the bigger events in Denver proper. Those can be like hundreds of people. And people are like what's happening with all these strollers? Like, but my oldest loves and she doesn't sit in the stroller not either anymore, but she brings her own stroller to the park so she'll push her babies as I push her sister. 

15:47 - Katie Fenske (Host)
So how cute, gosh, that's awesome. Um, so what are some things that you are purposely saying? Cause, like, there is that new thought that you're like, don't tell your children you're smart. Have you heard that before? Like, don't say you're smart, you're this like, or like with girls. Like don't always talk about their looks, talk about their like. Wow, you're a great problem solver. Is there anything like you're consciously making sure to say or not say with your kids? 

16:18 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So I really avoid the self-criticism language like ugly or flawed or hate. I really take those kinds of words out of my vocabulary. So don't say I hate my body today because I feel like then that just inflicts on her and she'll feel that way too. Body today, because I feel like then that just inflicts on her and she'll feel that way too. We do practice affirmations though. So like I am strong, I am brave, I can do hard things, I am capable. I think those are important to do because you're still instilling those ideas into them to help them grow and believe that about themselves and have that different thought pattern. Instead of the negative self-talk it's the positive self-talk. So I think there's still some value to that. And it's funny. 

17:01
You brought up the word beautiful and then, like we're not supposed to tell them our kids are pretty and they're beautiful. And I asked her the other day. I said I said Riley. I said do you know what the word beautiful means? And and she looked at me and she said she's like no, no, mommy, what does it mean? I said what means something to different people? I mean it could be you're beautiful because of how kind you are to others and we're focused on kind because we're learning how to be a big sister right now. 

17:29 - Katie Fenske (Host)
So that's an ongoing work in progress for my boy. 

17:33 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Okay, I figured it wasn't going to happen in the first year. Her sister was here. The sharing thing. Yeah, we're still working on that Sharing space, sharing time, sharing mom everything. 

17:46
Yes. So I just I want to instill in her that beauty is really the eye of the beholder too. I always love that, that saying, but really it's about the inside, not our outside, and kind of the qualities that we have as individuals and people and our actions versus how we look. And it's funny, cause then she will come up to me and she's like oh, mommy, you're so beautiful. I said, why did you say that? She said, oh, because you made me lunch. Oh, sure, cakes. Oh yeah, yeah, like you never know. So it's just important to instill those positive words with them, so and then they can focus on those non-physical traits to like kindness, so that they aren't attaching their worth to how they look or their appearance. They're attaching it to who they hire as a person. 

18:36 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah, I love that. Um, what would you say are some of your burnt pancake moments in motherhood? You? Haven't had any. 

18:46 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Well, I'm sure we've all had them, but any that you want to share just the one of me saying you know whatever I said to myself in the mirror, that one day. 

18:55
I have a lot as we are navigating these new, this new age of emotions and learning what our emotions are. I think a lot of my pancake moments are just reacting fast and just being triggered by things that just drive me crazy, Like the growling when we are upset, like we are not animals. That is not a form of communication. Right, I think that's a trigger. But then switching in I don't know if you've heard this word glimmers before. 

19:27 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yes, yeah. 

19:29 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Okay, and focusing on those little small moments of joy versus the triggers that are just kind of make a spiral. So I'm just trying to practice. With those burnt pancake moments of where I react too fast, I'm like, okay, take a calm breath, what can I what? What's the glimmer in this situation? It's not this big emotional tantrum that she's having right now, but the fact that you know she's at that age where she's learning and she's learning how to name her emotions and such like that. 

20:00 - Katie Fenske (Host)
So I'm impressed by that, cause I, I think, cause I I mean I worked in school, I was a teacher, but I didn't have kids like just blow up temper tantrums. So when my kids started having those, I was like what is going on? I didn't know how to like react to their big emotions. And that was like the trigger for me and it was just instantly like gone Right. 

20:24 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So you always think too, like oh, when they're my kids, I'm going to teach them differently. They're not going to have tantrums. 

20:29 - Katie Fenske (Host)
They're not going to. 

20:29 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
I'm not going to let them get to that point. Hate to break it to you. 

20:33 - Katie Fenske (Host)
It happens to everybody, yeah, yeah, and there's no way to have those big emotions with you Cause this is like their safe space, right. But I and also having all boys I thought like, oh, they're not going to be as emotional as girls. Oh, my goodness, like tell how their moments, right. My four-year-old, yeah, he loves to. Like run off crying, slam the door, it's okay. Yeah, it's a lot. 

20:57 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Yeah, it makes me feel good knowing that. 

20:59 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I'm not alone, like my daughter is going through. 

21:01 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
everyone kind of goes through this at the same show. 

21:03 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yes, but big stuff. So you have since become a coach. The mother hen coaching, tell me, cause I bet you know five years ago that was not on your radar. You didn't think like I think I'm going to go into this. How did that happen? And like what was your journey to becoming a coach? 

21:22 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Like that's a great question. 

21:23
So no, before that I was before the pandemic, before having babies, I was in the corporate wellness space where I would go into big organizations and I would do like lunch and learns about stress and sleep. So I was educating like in the masses, which was really cool, and I always loved speaking and public speaking and being able to help people like empower them to feel like they could be more proactive versus reactive with their health, and I've been in the health and wellness space for a while. But it was kind of like I was missing something because I felt like I couldn't see it through. I never got to see their aha moments. I never got to see them actually make these changes Right. 

22:02
So flash forward to like the pandemic I was, you know, had just left a job and I was doing sales for a while for a organization that was teaching people to become coaches and I was like, oh, this is really cool Now that I'm in the kind of coaching space but I'm helping other women and men become coaches, which is cool. But I'm like, wait a minute, I want to do that, like that sounds like a pretty good gig just to be that support and accountability person for somebody. 

22:31 - Katie Fenske (Host)
And so, like all types of coaching, like, yes, all types of coaching, yeah, all types of coaching yeah, mainly health and wellness, though, and life and life coaching really. 

22:40 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And so during the pandemic, I landed a gig, right as we got pregnant with my oldest, into coaching. It was more weight loss coaching. At first I was like this is okay, and then shift forward a few years. We overhired and they had to let people go and so they had a reduction in force and so I got laid off and it was kind of like this sign like okay, I think I'm meant to do this on my own. And I had such an aha moment in postpartum with my first, where I just felt like everyone gives you so much support during pregnancy and we knew we had waited so long to be pregnant that we were. I was prepared, I mean, we knew the ins and outs of pregnancy, we had the time for birth, like we felt like we were prepared, but nobody told me about postpartum, like I was postpartum, it just slapped me like a ton of bricks. 

23:31 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I feel the exact same way I felt. So I'm like a planner. You know, I read the books. I knew exactly like, well, I ended up having a C-section because my son was breached, so didn't really prepare for that. But it's like read the books, we are prepared, and then like he came home and my world was just like rocked, like I don't know what I'm doing. 

23:53 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Nobody talks about it. And then you typically have this one six week check and you're cleared for certain it. 

23:57 - Katie Fenske (Host)
And then you typically have this one six week check and you're cleared for certain things, and then you're just supposed to be all magically back, to go, go back to normal, bounce back and get back into life as it is, and it's just like there was no support Cause at the time, I think I went back, for I think I had an appointment like pretty early on, and then my three month appointment, I don't know, for C, C-section, it must've been different, but my dad had just passed away that same week and I went in for my appointment and I remember just being there and she's like how is everything? 

24:30
And I'm like I'm fine, like I was a wreck, but I was just like I'm good, I'm okay, and she just like, okay, I was a wreck. But I was just like I'm good, I'm okay, and she just like okay, you're clear to go back to work and everything's fine. But I I was not okay, like I should have told her I'm a wreck, like I cannot go back to work, I can't do this. But it was just like just keep moving forward, I don't. 

24:48 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
This is what I'm supposed to do, because it's the pressures of society that we're supposed to have it all figured out. We waited this long to be a mom, or we wanted it so bad to become a mom. Why don't you have us figured out why? Why are you struggling? 

25:01 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Get it together and then you feel guilty Cause you're like I wanted this so bad. I asked for this. But yeah, it's really hard, like I do. I did have a moment. We got home from the hospital and I remember thinking I wish I could just put them back in my stomach. It's easy then, he was so much easier when he was inside. Well, you knew what to do right. That's a whole other can of worms, right. 

25:26 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And it just nobody talks about this and no one talks about some of those moments like teething and sleep and like how are you supposed to still take care of you? And you know, all attention went focused on baby. But that's where I felt like I was in a fog for those first nine months postpartum where finally I like snapped out of it right around that nine month mark and I was like, okay, I gotta do something for me, like I cannot keep giving to her my daughter, expecting, you know, to not take care of myself. At the same time I wasn't eating enough food I to be able to keep up with breastfeeding. It was like that was a big chore. No one told me. Like I just felt so disconnected too from who I once was. Yes, and that shift, whereas this time around I'm at that time, nine month mark, with my second and nine day different, totally different, nine day different. 

26:13 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah. 

26:13 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
But I think it also has to do with support, and that's why I picked to, you know, be a postpartum and motherhood coach, because I could focus in on this one area of motherhood that doesn't get a lot of attention, doesn't get a lot of support. It's just like figure it out here on your own. 

26:31 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I like your nuts. You don't have support, even though there is. There are people willing to help you. You just don't know how to ask. You don't know how to recognize that you need that and I just felt so lonely during those months. Yeah. 

26:45 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And you're not alone. I mean most of us feel that, that sense of being alone and those first early months, even if we do have a supportive partner and supportive family and that really wasn't the case, right. Right, it was just like you said you don't know how to ask for help or you felt guilty by doing so. You felt guilty for taking time for yourself. 

27:05 - Katie Fenske (Host)
I can't keep this all together if I can't make it all work. 

27:09 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Exactly. 

27:09 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Yeah. 

27:10 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So that's kind of where my my idea and my focus has turned to supporting more moms, so that we can help people feel not so alone and they can what I like to say thrive in this beautiful chaos of motherhood. 

27:24 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Oh, I love that. That's the perfect catchphrase, isn't it? So what does coaching look like? Because I don't think that was an option. So my oldest is 10. I don't think I don't remember hearing about coaching and motherhood postpartum care. When he was born, I like I don't even think I was. No, I was on Instagram at the time, but I feel like now it's much more prevalent. What does that look like? Like if someone was like man, I think I could use that. What is it like? 

27:54 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
So what I do is a lot of virtual coaching. So it's one less place for a mom to have to pick up her babies and go to an appointment, right? 

28:03 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Brilliant, make it easy. 

28:05 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
And then we focus on the mom and what her goals are, whether it's, you know, regaining that sense of self, if it's rediscovering her confidence, if it's managing the stress, finding the balance in motherhood and just focusing on her. We usually meet weekly and we allow the safe space to collaborate to help her move forward. Whereas therapy is great with kind of digging up the past and why is this happening, and all this coaching is more forward facing and more forward path. So you're focusing on, you know, setting goals, or what I like to call experiments, um, and seeing how you can kind of be more proactive versus reactive in what you're trying to achieve. Okay, I love that you brought up goals you're trying to achieve. 

28:59
Okay, I love that you brought up goals, you. 

29:00 - Katie Fenske (Host)
you named them experiments, because sometimes goal setting is like okay, goal setting, like another thing. I have to do like experiment, like let me see if I can focus on drinking more water today, like yes, little. Like challenges. 

29:12 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
like little challenges. I think it kind of gamifies it a little bit. Um, and like you said, goals are just so inundated. We hear that all the time. We have at the beginning of the year, right, we'll set goals for the year. How many of us ever stick with them? 

29:25 - Katie Fenske (Host)
right and how many of us go like I'm okay. Should I make that goal because I know I'm not gonna do? 

29:30 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
it right, right. So I kind of switch the the verbiage into experiments, because it's testing out what works or what doesn't work for you and, knowing that you're a work in progress, there's no kind of right or wrong way to do this, especially in motherhood. There's no like perfect way to be a mom or there's no perfect way to handle this situation. It's just figuring out what works best for you and helping them feel like they can follow their mother's intuition to it as well. 

29:55 - Katie Fenske (Host)
That's so burnt pancakes. Right. There's no perfect way to do it, even though I thought there was a perfect way to do it, I am learning. 

30:02 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
We all do. 

30:03 - Katie Fenske (Host)
There are other ways. Do you, with your coaching, ever do, um, like you said, you do one-on-ones, but do you have like collaborations or like mom groups, cause I felt like that was hard for me to find collaborations, or like mom groups Cause I felt like that was hard for me to find. It was hard for me to find my village, you know, to find my connection with other moms. 

30:24 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Do you offer that also? I don't at this moment, but that is something kind of in the works. I do have challenges from time to time, like we're in the thick of a 30 day gratitude challenge where I do have a lot of clients and moms kind of joining in to practice gratitude towards ourself and really celebrating those small wins in motherhood as well right now. So I have those for right now, um, but that's something I definitely want to add in Cause, like you said, I don't think we can ever have too much community in motherhood. 

30:53 - Katie Fenske (Host)
True, we'll add that to your plate with your four-year-old and yes that's the same with me. It's like I have visions of all these things I want to do and I'm like, okay, baby steps, yes, one thing at a time. Okay, I love all of this. Could you tell us so, mother hen coaching? Can you tell us how we find you and where we can connect with you? 

31:13 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
Yes, so you can find me on Instagram at mother hen coaching. You can also find me on Facebook, but I'm usually on Instagram a lot more. And then you can also connect with me there. Stay in touch, as well as my website, which is just wwwmotherhencoachingcom. Pretty easy to find me there. 

31:35 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Love it. I love the name. That's so cute. Did you come? 

31:37 - Caroline Kalicki (Guest)
up with that. I did so. Mother hens are really good at protecting and nurturing their young that sometimes it comes at the expense of their own health. It's actually a legit mother hen syndrome is what it's called, and so that's why I was like when I heard that, I was just like this. Is it Like? This is just. I feel this to my core and I want to help other mother hens take care of themselves. 

31:59 - Katie Fenske (Host)
Oh my gosh, I love it. That is so perfect. That is so cute. Well, thank you so much for coming on. You were a delight to chat with and I think you are doing a wonderful thing for moms out there. Thank you, I really enjoyed it. 

32:14
Big, special Thank you to Caroline for coming onto this podcast. I thoroughly enjoyed my chat with her. Again. It just brings me back to those postpartum days and what it was really like being a mom in those early days of motherhood and big shout out to her for going out and starting her coaching business, because, gosh, I needed that and I really hope someone who's listening right now might connect to that. If I really hope someone who's listening right now might connect to that. If you are loving this podcast, please share it with your friends. Go leave me a five-star review or come connect with me on social media, cause I love growing this community and being a part of your motherhood journey as well. So until next week's conversation, I want to remind you that everyone burns their first pancake, so just keep flipping. Thank you.