Ep. 18: The Blind Film Festival Experience - Pt. 2

In this part 2 episode, Alex continues recounting his experience at the Toronto International Film Festival (TIFF) and discusses the ways the film festival was accessible as well as areas where there is room for growth.

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Transcript

Lee Pugsley  
Happy spooky season everyone! We are back with episode 18 of The Dark Room, where two blind cinephiles illuminate the sighted. I'm Lee Pugsley.

Alex Howard  
I'm Alex Howard.

Lee Pugsley  
And we are your hosts -- two legally blind guys who are doing this podcast for film lovers of all abilities. So this is part two of a conversation about Alex's experience at the Toronto International Film Festival, also known as TIFF. In the last episode, you can check it out and hear Alex talk about the movies he saw. And in this episode, we wanted to touch on accessibility in film festivals, and what Alex's experience was like in regards to that. So Alex, I know that we talked last time about the many movie options that you have. And it can be a lot to handle. I know that it can also be hard to get tickets to some of the more high profile screenings. And you have to go through a process to get rush tickets or what's called a Lobby Pass, which I know you'll touch on in just a moment. So why don't you tell us a little bit more about your experience with getting tickets to some of these screenings?

Alex Howard  
When I would go down and get my tickets in the morning, most of the high profile movies were sold out, because they sell out super quick. But since I needed accessible seating with my blindness and my cane, there were some times I was able to sneak in there, even though they were sold out, and get tickets, which I was really -- you know, there aren't many advantages to us being blind. But I think sometimes you know, needing those wheelchair seats, it really helps. Even at AMC, you know, there's a sold out show, people don't think to take the wheelchair seats, which is where I normally sit anyway, so I don't have to deal with stairs. So a lot of times it helps out to get into screenings like that. I also had a Lobby Pass. So for Hell of a Summer, I was in a rush line, which means I didn't have tickets at all, because all of those seats were sold out. So I went in the rush line. But thankfully TIFF gave me a Lobby Pass. A Lobby Pass is for people with disabilities. And it makes it so that you don't have to wait in the rush line, winding around the corner with everyone else. They let you sit pretty much in the lobby. I was number 22 In the rush line for Hell of a Summer. But I was sitting in a lobby and someone just came up and gave me their ticket. And so I was able to just go right in. But you know, having the Lobby Pass helps a lot, also with accessible seating and all that kind of thing. So Toronto was really great with making things accessible.

Lee Pugsley  
Yeah, so let's go ahead and touch on that for a few minutes. In terms of accessibility, how was your experience? What were the things that Toronto did, that made you feel comfortable in, you know, navigating around an unknown area in this film festival? And also any other kinds of accommodations or accessibility needs that you had, how did the festival help to meet those things?

Alex Howard  
Going into Toronto, I was very nervous, because I had never been out of the country by myself. I mean, I went on Birthright. But that's different because you're with a group. But I've never, I'm basically going to this festival on my own. And I, this was the first week where I used my cane literally all the time. And I think going to a place like that, where you're not familiar, it really made it apparent that my eyesight is a little worse than I thought. Because in your own home or in your own city, you're kind of filling in the blanks with your memory. And so, you know, sometimes I'm like, "Oh, I don't need my cane." But in Toronto was very apparent that I didn't need my cane. Plus, there was construction, and you know, different things going on. But TIFF made me feel very included. There were people I talked to, um, Lauren in the Customer Service Office, she helps with accessibility there. So I was able to talk to her about anything I needed. Canadians have the stereotype about being nice. Oh my god, they're so nice. Like, I felt like literally everything I needed, I could ask people for help, ask people for directions. You know, whenever you got to screenings, or even getting directions to screenings, the first screening I went to, I walked out of the theater and I was like, "I have no idea where to go." So you know, just kind of asking people, "Oh, is this the way?" You know, kind of getting there. Just, people were great. And then the volunteers at TIFF too, I would tell them I needed an audio description device and we would you know, they'd hand me off to different people, point me in the right direction. But everything was very accommodating. I think for Flora and Sons specifically, that was the best accessibility-wise time I had at a screening, I think. Because the manager of the theater was there, and she came up to me, she sat with me in theater until the audio description started working, until we knew it was working. And then she left. So there were a couple of movies where like I had to go out and change it out. But for the most part, honestly, like, I think Toronto was like, six or seven with audio description, I think there was only once where it wasn't working, and then they got it to work. And then obviously, the one time where it didn't work at all. But all the other times, they got it to work. The first time, I didn't need to change out the device or anything. So it was, it was a really, really pleasant experience. And I really hope that other festivals can do what Toronto did, but also expand on it, and make it so that it's almost like an "if you build it, they will come" kind of thing. Like if they can make these festivals accessible, and, you know, make people like me feel comfortable there, then I think more low vision / blind people will come out and go to these festivals.

Lee Pugsley  
Most definitely. I think, you know, once again, it's kind of the same thing that we always talk about too, is like, why blind and low vision people don't go to the movie theaters as often, because it's such a hard thing for them sometimes to even navigate. Like, how to get to, you know, the actual, like, screening, like theater that they want to see the movie at. If, like, employees are too busy to walk them there, or, you know, having to switch out the audio description devices and all those kinds of things. You know, those things were more in place on a consistent basis, you know, more blind and low vision viewers would come to the movies more often, I think. And to your point about festivals, as word gets around, and festivals start to become more inclusive and accessible for blind and low vision viewers, I think that there would be a higher turnout and a bigger representation from our community. Which would be great, because once again, it would dispel that myth that we don't have an interest in those things, or we don't want to be there. We do. On that note, then, um, as you talked about, like, you know, hopefully festivals will kind of expand their reach of inclusion and accessibility. Now that you've experienced one of these festivals in person, what does expansion look like to be more accessible?

Alex Howard  
The first step would be getting audio description on more movies. There were 12 there, like I said, I think I saw six or seven of them. I mean, it's great. And I'm thankful, but it's also not enough. I think, if we could have gotten description on Dumb Money, or Next Goal Wins, or these bigger studio movies, it would have been great. But at the same time, you know, having open audio description screenings. I saw they had open captioned screenings for a few movies. Like, you know, I think really pushing accessibility in the distribution arm. I know, I went to a disability panel there. And I completely support, you know, being inclusive for people with disabilities behind and in front of the camera in the production process. But I think the distribution, accessibility is also extremely important. And I think that's where I'm more coming from, like, so many people are promoting me in front of and behind the camera. It's almost like okay, "You guys handle that. And I'm going to try and promote the distribution arm." Because I think at every level of production, you need to think of accessibility. And I think if we can get accessibility in the festival phase of films, then it will kind of trickle down. Because you know, the festival phase is kind of the first. It's literally the first audience to see it. I mean, I went to about six world premieres at TIFF. And I think if a world premiere can have description... And I would hope it would follow the film through the whole journey. I also think educating the volunteers on accessibility is huge. A lot of the volunteers knew about accessibility, but a lot of them didn't. And they would always direct me like, they would have this lost look on their face. And then they would direct me to someone with a, with a headset, and they would know what description was, and they would be able to help me. But I think, yeah, having staff on hand that knows about accessibility and knows, you know, is there.... I mean, they're all there to enhance the audience's experience. But especially when it comes to midnight screenings and, you know, things like that. There are times where, you know, you get out of a midnight screening at 1:30, 2 in the morning, and you need to get back to your hotel, and it's dark outside and there aren't many people. Whereas normally, I could just stop anyone on the street in Toronto and be like, "Hey, how do I get to this place?" Um, I had someone actually walk me from the theater, at my midnight screening to my hotel. They were so nice. They had a headset, it was not part of their job, but they just wanted to make sure I got back to the hotel okay. And I really appreciated that because there's so much construction. That's the other thing. There needs to be less construction. Because it's so hard to get around. Like even if there's no construction, you have the streets blocked off there for the red carpet, for the directors coming up in their cars and getting out. I can't even imagine what it's like if the stars are there. Like, there was a big crowd lined up to see Sandra Oh get out of her car, because we weren't sure if she was going to be there. And she wasn't. But imagine if she was. Like, if the stars were there, the crowds would be so much more. And so I think having an accessible entrance and exit, especially for people with the Lobby Passes, is super important.

Lee Pugsley  
Yeah, all of that makes sense. I mean, let's be honest, even putting aside any kind of visual limitations for people like us. Construction in general just makes it more complicated for people to navigate how to get from one place to another, too.

Alex Howard  
Oh, definitely. I also had the idea. Like they had arrows on the sidewalk. And the arrow said, you know, the theater, the venue you were trying to get to. And so it was trying to guide people in the right direction. And obviously, I can't see what the arrow says. But I can see the bright blue arrow on the sidewalk. But I was thinking like, "Why aren't we making these arrows different colors for the different venues?" Because there's only like, maybe four or five venues, you could make the arrows different colors to match the venue. And then that way, I mean, I wouldn't have to actually read what the arrows say. Would that help you as well?

Lee Pugsley  
Yeah, I think that would be a really good idea. Or even like, you know, there's different colors, there could even be like different shapes. Like, you know, the triangle one represents this venue. The circles represent this venue, you know, that kind of thing as well, different colors, different shapes. There's a variety of ways that that could be done, I think.

Alex Howard  
Yeah. And I also, I mean, this was a great experience for me with my cane as well. Like, I mean, I know we're talking about the festival itself, but like growing in my disability identity, I think was huge this past week. It's so crazy how different people treat you with your cane, like. It's hard to say if it's a Canadian thing. But people were so nice. And I'm like I never, I've never experienced that in L.A. Maybe I don't ask for directions that much here because I know where I'm going. But there were times I was lost and people... Tthere was this woman, she had come from her apartment. And she saw that I was lost. And she was like, "Oh, my apartment's right across from your hotel." And she walked five blocks with me back, basically to her apartment, where she had just come from, just so that I could know where I was going. And I was like... There was one woman I interrupted on the phone, and she helped me get to where I needed to go. Like people are so nice with the cane. And also honestly, one other advantage. There aren't many, many advantages to being low vision. But one other advantage is, it's a great conversation starter. Like there were several people that I would just stop, you know, I'd hear them be like, "Oh, I'm going to Alexandria Theater, where is it?" And I'd overhear them asking a volunteer and I'd be like, "Oh, I'm going there too, can I follow you?" And so they'd walk with me to the theater. And then it turns out, oh, they work at Universal or oh, they work at Roger Ebert or wherever. And oh, they live in, you know, Toluca Lake, which is right by where I live. And it's crazy. It's a great way to meet people, because you're asking for help. And then it just sparks a conversation about the industry. And that can always lead into other jobs. So, it's really interesting that I had such a positive experience with the cane this week. And I'm definitely going to start using it more.

Lee Pugsley  
I relate to everything you're saying. Just kind of about the differences as someone who's low vision, when you're not using a cane, and the way people respond, versus when you do have a cane and the way people respond. It's really like a night and day difference. And I know that me and you have talked a lot about cane usage. And I know that you're newer to using a cane on a more consistent basis than I am. So I'm really glad that this experience gave you the opportunity to do that. And one of the things that I've realized about using a cane too, is, I used to look at it as kind of like a limiting factor. And something that like limits like, you know, my capability. But on the other hand, I've realized now that it kind of gives me more confidence to be mobile and to get from one place to another. Because even if I don't know exactly where I'm going, you know, the cane will help me look for obstacles, but it also will clue other people into there's someone that might need help. And so both of those things give me a lot more confidence than I had before and hopefully you experienced some of that at TIFF, and you'll continue experiencing more of that too.

Alex Howard  
Yeah, I'm definitely going to use it more at the theater and just generally. I think, I mean, I've been told I'm a lot more confident with it. And, I mean, I took my first picture with my cane ever on the red carpet at TIFF. So that was really cool. And just even, I mean, I had gotten ready to a party up on the roof of the Lightbox. And I had my cane out there. And I felt like, you know, it's funny. I feel like it makes you less threatening, going up to people, if that makes any sense. And just starting a conversation. I feel like people are more willing to open up than normal. Have you experienced that?

Lee Pugsley  
Absolutely. It definitely makes you feel more approachable, I guess, or at least gives, it kind of invites people into a conversation, like you were saying. Because even if, let's say, there's someone that's helping you get from one theater to the other theater, you're not just gonna like walk in silence. You're gonna start with like, "Hey, what's your name? How are you doing?" You know, like, "What are you most excited about with this festival? What movies are you looking forward to?" It just opens up really unique conversations that if we didn't have the cane, we may not have those same conversations in certain instances. So yeah, I mean, I guess with everything, there's always a positive perspective to keep on it. And there's the other perspective, too, but... I think it's helpful for us and for anyone that's listening to this who's blind or low vision, to realize that there is, um, there are different perspectives to take on being blind and low vision. That doesn't mean that, you know, life is a walk in the park. Because obviously, it's not, there's real frustrations. But there are certain unique things about our experience that can be positive and unique.

Alex Howard  
We were talking about a lot of positive stuff, but one of the struggles I had at the very beginning of the festival, the first 48 hours I was there, even, you know, the plane ride all of that. I felt like every human interaction I was having, I was asking for help. And that really weighs on you after a while. Of, you know, you feel like a burden. You feel like, "Should I even be here?" Like I feel like the waiters are going out of their way to help me, the airplane staff, the people at the festival, like I felt like I was just getting in the way of people's experience or people's days. Having zero friendly, people are friendly, but you know, they're there to help me. And so I didn't feel like people were there to be my friend. It was more to help me get to where I'm going. But once I connected with more people from Respectability, I made some friends from that whole group. And my, my friend Yaara, she was there too. But once I was able to connect with those people and actually have some dinners that wasn't asking for help in that sense, I think my confidence sort of came back and I was like, "Okay, I do deserve to be here." And I'm, you know, it was such like, honestly, it's been one of my dreams to go to these festivals. It was so, so much fun. And I really hope I get to go again, because -- and I hope you get to come to! Because like, oh man, it's just... Being a movie fan, it's like, you're with your people. And it's you know, everyone's talking about film, you can go up to anyone at the festival and be like, "What have you seen that you like? What have you seen today?" You know, have a conversation. It's just -- and you, it's easy to see the, I mean, at least for me, the people with the badges around their neck. I'm like, "Okay, they're with the festival," you know. It's such a great environment to be in. 

Lee Pugsley  
Yeah, definitely. I'm honestly so happy that you got to have this experience. And that's why, you know, we definitely wanted to take some time to unpack it. Because there's so many cool things about this experience, and so much insight to be gleaned from it, so many things that can be learned from it. And once again, you know, you're paving the way to open up those conversations about inclusion and accessibility at these festivals by even you know, talking about it now. So, before we wrap up, just want to see if you have any final thoughts. Otherwise, we'll bring it to a close.

Alex Howard  
I don't think so. Just like, I guess if you are blind and low vision, I really encourage you to use your cane, I encourage you to, you know, go to the movies. I mean, Lee was just, we were just talking about, I guess the AMC changed all their audio description devices. So that'll be fun to deal with when I go this weekend. But like, you know, as frustrating as it is. It's really hard to say you should go despite the frustrations. But, you know, we shouldn't have to deal with all of that. But at the same time, I feel like if you're feeling patient one day and you want to go, I feel like it can only get better. By educating the theater goers or whoever, even if there's a movie online that you're trying to watch, and there's no audio description, look for the customer service, email, contact them. Like, I really feel like if we can all you know, work together to fight the good fight and try and get things accessible, I really think there are some improvement to be had. Like, I never thought we would get up to 12 movies described at a festival. Like that's huge that, you know, we even got that much. And I mean, honestly, that's not even that much. Like, we, there's so much room to grow. But I feel like we're getting there.

Lee Pugsley  
Yeah, one step at a time. And hopefully, you know, next year, maybe it'll be 24 movies, or all the time, you know.

Alex Howard  
Yeah.

Lee Pugsley  
But we are headed in the right direction. And we'll continue to have these conversations, and there is room to grow. So for all you guys listening out there, first of all, thank you so much for listening to our podcast. And if you have any questions or comments on Alex's experience at TIFF, or kind of any of the other topics that we've discussed today, feel free to email us at DarkRoomFilmCast@gmail.com. Once again, that's DarkRoomFilmCast@gmail.com. And we're happy to funnel your questions on this podcast on any of our future episodes, or to have dialogues with you, you know, through email correspondence.

Alex Howard  
Yeah. And I will be excited to hear your thoughts, Lee, on these movies, when they, when they do come out. It'll be interesting to have a, you know, full-on debate with you about, especially The Holdovers, because I feel like you'll really like that one. But whenever you see all these movies, I'm excited to talk to you and maybe we'll revisit them on the show. Yes, please email us if you have any questions about my experience, about blindness, about literally anything. Like one of the things I think I learned at TIFF was like, I wish people would come up and ask the questions they have. Because sometimes you get looks. And you know, people are wondering things. And I'm like, "Please just ask," you know. So, I think I only had two people asked me what my level of vision was. Which was very surprising because I feel like most people just assume you're completely blind when they see the cane. But yes, please reach out to us with any questions. You can also follow us on Instagram, @DarkRoomFilmCast, and you can message us there with questions as well.

Lee Pugsley  
And we also want to shout out Matt Lauterbach and All Senses Go for making transcripts of this episode and all other episodes of our podcast possible. Really means a lot to extend that accessibility reach in that way. And on that note, we will sign off. Thank you guys so much for listening, and we'll see you here next time on The Dark Room.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai