Alex and Lee are joined by returning guest Jamie Gagnon to discuss Alex and Jamie's trip to Sundance 2024, the slate of films they saw, and the overall festival's accessibility.
Watch the Thelma Post-Screening Q&A! (minor spoilers)
Watch Jamie's newest horror shorts here!
Questions? Email us at darkroomfilmcast@gmail.com
Search for Audio Description availability for any title on the American Council for the Blind's Website!
Find transcripts of our episodes on our hosting site, Buzzsprout!
Subscribe to our YouTube Channel!
Support us on Patreon!
Follow us on Instagram!
Find us on
Alex and Lee are joined by returning guest Jamie Gagnon to discuss Alex and Jamie's trip to Sundance 2024, the slate of films they saw, and the overall festival's accessibility.
Watch the Thelma Post-Screening Q&A! (minor spoilers)
Watch Jamie's newest horror shorts here!
Questions? Email us at darkroomfilmcast@gmail.com
Search for Audio Description availability for any title on the American Council for the Blind's Website!
Find transcripts of our episodes on our hosting site, Buzzsprout!
Subscribe to our YouTube Channel!
Support us on Patreon!
Follow us on Instagram!
Find us on
Lee Pugsley
Happy February everyone. Welcome back to The Dark Room where two blinds cinephiles illuminate the sighted. I'm Lee Pugsley.
Alex Howard
I'm Alex Howard.
Lee Pugsley
And this is a podcast hosted by two legally blind guys for film lovers of all abilities. And today we have a really fun show planned for you. Alex, why don't you tell us about it?
Alex Howard
Yeah. So I went to Sundance with my friend Jamie. So Jamie is on with us today.
Jamie Gagnon
Hello, and thanks for having me again. It's been a wild year. Excited to be in 2024 and to talk Sundance with you both.
Alex Howard
And Jamie was my companion at Sundance. So for today's episode, we are doing the blind Sundance experience. So I was lucky enough this year to go to Sundance. We're going to be talking about how it differs from other film festivals, the transportation situation, but then also we're going to talk about the films that Jamie and I saw at the festival and then one film that Lee and I watched together virtually.
Jamie Gagnon
We should say that we're going to discuss these films but not go into spoilers. Nothing more than a logline or trailer already gave away.
Lee Pugsley
That's really exciting, especially that you've been able to go to two prolific film festivals within the last couple of months. And I'm really curious to hear about your experience at Sundance and also to hear about your experience too, Jamie. And thank you so much for joining us to tell us about your experience too.
Alex Howard
To preface, if you don't know what Sundance is: Sundance is an international film festival that takes place in Park City, Utah. This year was the 40th anniversary of the festival. And it's the first big deal film festival of every year. But yeah, so Sundance is known for the bidding war, a lot of networking, it's in the snow. It's a really iconic film festival. It's always been my dream to go to this festival. So I went virtually in 2021. And in 2024, this is my first year going in person. One difference between Sundance and TIFF, which we did a TIFF episode in September, sometimes is much more spread out. TIFF is like four theaters, all walking distance from each other. Sundance, you have to take buses, the theaters are not close. So it's a much different feel, much different experience.
Jamie Gagnon
I'm happy to be back.
Lee Pugsley
How would you guys sum up your Sundance experience?
Alex Howard
I felt like for me, I watched more films that I liked at Sundance, I was definitely less tired than I was at TIFF. I think overall, the experience of TIFF was a little bit easier, because it's just easier to navigate and get around. It's all in one area. It's funny, last year I think I had maybe three movies overall, the whole year, that I gave four and a half stars on Letterboxd. After Sundance, I already have three that have four and a half stars. So there are quality, quality movies at Sundance. And you really, I mean, you're in a community with, you know, like minded movie nerds. And it's just, it's a place to be. I mean, all festivals are great. But Sundance has like a certain feel to it. It's, it's awesome. You hear people talking in the lines while you're waiting for movies about what they saw. So you'd like really get a sense of the buzz of the festival.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, it's like being in an exclusive movie theater, like an AMC, but like an exclusive club of people. And then everybody in town is either skiing or watching movies. And you're surrounded by beautiful mountains. There's snow on the ground. It's cold at night. I mean, I felt like I was back home in Maine. Overall, it was a really fun experience. And like you said, it was really nice to hear, and to discuss with all the people we were on shuttles with and stuff what, we had seen, what they had seen, and what they, we each thought of those films, and it was really cool to hear other people's experiences on those subjects.
Lee Pugsley
Yeah, that's really, really awesome. I've been to Utah a few times, and it definitely gets really cold over there. Definitely reminds me as, you said, your Maine days, Jamie, it reminds me of my Idaho days of snow and ice and all of that good stuff.
Alex Howard
I did want to touch on, there's a tip for my cane that I started using called the Dakota disk that helps in the snow. And at first, it was very cumbersome. I thought like it looked weird. But then once you start using it in the snow, you're like, oh my god, this is so cool. Like it glides right through it. So it really helped me get around a lot better.
Lee Pugsley
That's really interesting about the tip of the cane. I haven't heard of that. But I've never had to use my cane in snow, at least that I can recall, because I try to avoid going home when it's snowing. But yeah, I'll still look into that.
Jamie Gagnon
It looks like a little metal detector. [laughs]
Alex Howard
Yeah, people kept coming up to me at the festival and asking if it was a metal detector.
Lee Pugsley
And out of curiosity, was there anything that surprised either of you guys about Sundance? Maybe it was like something that you were expecting that didn't happen or something that you weren't expecting that did happen?
Alex Howard
I think overall, like, it was definitely, I mean, surreal to be there. I've always dreamed about going to Sundance so it was really cool to actually go. The feeling of just being there, in the snow, like, being there for the buzz of it all and hearing, you know, what's getting bought by who and just... It all really lined up in that way with some of my expectations, it was really, really cool.
Lee Pugsley
I can imagine that the energy there would just be so thrilling. And then going to you, Jamie, what was surprising, if anything, about your Sundance experience?
Jamie Gagnon
It's kind of funny because I-- I guess I, you know, I knew it was in a mountain town. And I just never thought of what that would mean. Like trying to traverse these like icy snowy streets in the middle of January, or late January. It's funny that everybody from LA goes to a small mountain town in the worst time of year to watch movies. And that's really cool. I think it says a lot about the prestige of this festival and how celebrated it is, you know, being here for 40 years. And being a staple of, like Alex was saying earlier, the start of the Oscar race for the next year, you know, start of the buzz, and all the people buying films. Like, the sales are huge. And this is when it starts. And there's always that joke of LA really starts picking back up after Sundance, because it's like a long vacation from Christmas and Thanksgiving. So it's like a big party in the mountain town. I love it.
Lee Pugsley
And I can imagine too, just, in addition to how much excitement there is there, it's just great to have so many people that are passionate about film in one place. Whether it's you know, people that are looking to make business deals or just you know, random movie fans. I think that it's a really cool bonding experience.
Alex Howard
Yeah, not only do you have Sundance taking place there, Slamdance is going on at the same time, which is another festival, it just happens to be at the same time at Sundance in the same town. It's almost like an underground genre festival, I guess you could say.
Lee Pugsley
Yeah.
Alex Howard
And so it's really funny that like, you know, you got those two festivals going, some people are going to both, some people are going to one, but pretty much anyone you run into on the street in Park City that week is at a festival of some kind, or they're skiing. We were on the bus with a lot of skiers and snowboarders too.
Lee Pugsley
That would definitely track with it being in Utah. So let's go ahead and jump into the movies that you guys saw. I'm curious to know what your slate looked like, what you thought of the movies. And if you think that any of these are going to stay in the awards conversations as we move into the next award season.
Alex Howard
So we did 10 movies in four days. Which was crazy because I was less exhausted than I was at TIFF and I think I only watched like seven or eight at TIFF. So on day one, we watched Every Little Thing and The Moogai at The Ray Theatre, which is the only theater we went to that day. Every Little Thing is a hummingbird documentary about a hummingbird sanctuary in LA. I thought it was really interesting and it had beautiful visuals. It was definitely like a Sundance movie, like a documentary about hummingbirds. You know, nature, it feels like a very indie documentary. But it was really good. And I like how they tied it into the bigger, like life questions.
Jamie Gagnon
I mean, yeah, it's really cool. It's a great little look into this woman, who's been doing this for almost 20 years now in LA and just rescues hummingbirds. And they mix, they mixed it with this beautiful cinematography, the Phantom cameras so they can get super slow motion, high detailed shots of these hummingbirds. And like there are a few hummingbirds you follow over the course of the film, like, you know, as she's rehabilitating them. If there's, you know, you kind of follow their progress; if they, if they pass, if they survive. And like she has like a recovery stage, like different phases of recovery. Like she has like little cages, and then she has like a flight cage to try to test the flight with the bird. And then finally, she has an outdoor sanctuary where it's just like the final step before she lets them out. And it was just such a beautiful moving piece that mixes her work with her personal life. And it's really touching. It's nice to see a movie in Utah about our home, LA, which is really cool. And I was like, "Oh man, that's that's my home."
Alex Howard
So at Sundance, what's really cool about film festivals, is a lot of times there are Q&A's after with the filmmakers. We had a Q&A for Every Little Thing. The director was there, the subject was there, no hummingbirds, but the woman who saves the hummingbirds was there.
Jamie Gagnon
Terry.
Alex Howard
That's one of the coolest things about festivals honestly, is the Q&A part of it all.
Jamie Gagnon
Not every film had a Q&A. We were, I think we were fortunate to have at least, I think seven or eight out of all of them. There was only a couple we didn't get. Then we watched this kind of horror thriller called The Moogai, from New Zealand. It's about this horrific thing that happened in real life, it's in probably the 60s or 50s in New Zealand. They would steal Aboriginal children from their families in the woods, bring them to white houses, almost like to dilute the population to make everybody more white over time. So they take the youth, so the old people die out and they're slowly losing their heritage and it's really crazy to think about. So they took that premise and made a horror out of it. And it was really cool. I thought it was really fun idea. The character-- So it's like a typical gaslighting thriller, right? So she's fearful of this creature called the Moogai coming to take her kids and her husband doesn't believe her. And then, you know, all that kind of stuff, she starts being called crazy. And-- but it's a weird shift where normally you believe and want to see that woman succeed, or that person who's being gaslit succeed. But she was such a, like an asshole as a character. It was really hard to root for her in the movie, even though that's what you're supposed to do, right? Like, you're supposed to want her to finally prove it to her husband, like, "Yeah, this is really happening." But it had some pretty funny humor in it. And it had some pretty shocking moments I don't want to spoil. But there was one point where everybody gasped in unison, it was like insane.
Alex Howard
I-- Yeah, it was, it was definitely fun. I think it didn't hit me as hard as I was hoping. It was a little bit by the book, it felt a little like, Blumhousey, if that makes sense. It had a little like, an Invisible Man feel to it. Which, I loved the Invisible Man in 2020. This one wasn't as good as that. But it was still, it was still interesting enough. And like the whole indigenous angle made it very unique. So like, there was nothing bad we saw at Sundance, for sure. This was probably on the lower end of things. But every film that we saw, had something to admire about it, which is another great thing about Sundance. Because you know, even if you don't necessarily like a movie, it's not going to be like a waste of time.
Jamie Gagnon
Mhm.
Lee Pugsley
And I think one of the great things too about Sundance or any film festival is it does give you the opportunity to have exposure to films that maybe you would miss otherwise, if you weren't at a film festival to be able to see them. Because if they don't find a distributor, or they don't get a wide release, or they're only in theaters for a few days, or you know, so many different factors could affect your ability to see some of these great films that you guys were able to see.
Alex Howard
Oh, yeah, exactly. And I think one more thing, my movie, the creature effects are really cool, too.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, actually, I have another thing too, is that in the Q&A, they had the two, I guess the lead three actors there and but the director wasn't there. And apparently the two actors who are the leads, who were indigenous and had not seen the film before the screening. This is-- and these two were the world premiere, by the way, Every Little Thing and The Moogai were the world premiere, the first time anyone saw them ever. And so they were there. And like it's a, it's a perfect story for for their people to have to witness on screen. And they they had no foresight beforehand, which is crazy. Like they're just still trying to process it. They're like kind of shaken up after in the Q&A. I'm like, wow.
Alex Howard
Yeah. And there was someone else who was indigenous in the audience that said it really affected them. So it's nice to see that like the movie hit the people it was trying to hit in the right way.
Jamie Gagnon
But it was wide enough where a lot of people could enjoy it. And so yeah, it was really well done.
Alex Howard
Day two, we watched three movies. The first one we saw was a good one, which I think Lee would really like this one, because it's a very intimate movie about a daughter going on a hike with her dad and her dad's best friend, and their conversations, you know. Obviously there are things that come up that they disagree with, and all that kind of stuff, but it's definitely an intimate movie with a small setting and it's gorgeous with all the nature shots. But their conversation at some points really hits home. It's really good.
Lee Pugsley
It sounds right up my alley.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, it's a nice little independent film where it's, it's just a, it's just a character study. You know, you learn a lot about them and the personalities and talk about their past. And the dad's best friend, you know, the son was supposed to come with them. And then he just had a fight and he didn't come, so he just, it was just three of them. And then he's talking about his divorce. Like, you know, there's really good stuff there. It's a really good character study. And the acting, the performances were all fantastic. Like the three leads were exceptional. I really had-- that was my favorite film at that point. And I was like, this is not going to change, so... But then that changed very quickly. So.
Alex Howard
And I think they said the girl, they just found her. Like wasn't she the dau-- Like the friend of the director's daughter or something?
Jamie Gagnon
I think so, she was an actor, but she didn't really have anything of note yet. So yeah, it was really cool that she, this is her big break hopefully.
Alex Howard
A lot of times what-- another thing that's cool about Sundance is a lot of times this is the filmmaker or actor's big break. Like a lot of filmmakers start at Sundance. I think Richard Linklater did with Dazed and Confused, and there are so-- Ryan Coogler with Fruitvale Station. There are so many directors that like got their start from the Sundance Film Festival. So it's cool to like just be there and like feel the history of of it all too. Um, what did we watch? Let's see, we watched so many movies... What did we watch second that day, Jaime?
Jamie Gagnon
Desire Lines at the Egyptian. That was our only time at the Egyptian, which, a beautiful theater.
Alex Howard
Yeah, Egyptian is the only theater on Main Street at Sundance, which is that was really surprising to me because I thought Main Street was going to be like TIFF, where there's like three or four theaters. Everyone hangs out there, which-- If you go there just during the day at Sundance, it's mostly people are chillin', hanging out there. But um, like, they had a Napoleon Dynamite truck, because it was the 20th anniversary of Napoleon Dynamite. They were handing out tots and things like that, they had--
Alex Howard
Napoleon flash mob.
Alex Howard
Yeah, they had the merch store. A lot of things going on on Main Street. But yeah, the Egyptian's the only actual theater there. But shout out to Matt Lauterbach for producing the audio description track for Desire Lines. So Desire Lines is a... I guess it's a narrative. But basically, he's blending the line between documentary and fiction. So it's about um, a--
Jamie Gagnon
A female to male trans person. It's interesting because it's like a time travel in a way. That's how it was like presented in the description. But it's like, this guy is in a, in a future, researching-- well he's in like 2020. But it's a little more futuristic. But they're researching the female to male trans community. And then they intercut that with the doc part of it, where they're interviewing a lot of FTM males and how like, you know how their sexual attraction started. And like they were like, for sure, before they transitioned, they were interested in women. They were talking about like turning like gay. And it was an interesting, like, juxtaposition of the doc and narrative function. Some really laugh out loud moments and really fun conversations when the doc part-- I liked the doc part more than the narrative, actually, on my end, but...
Alex Howard
Definitely the audio description track is great. I think it doesn't hold back from being adult. I think that's one of my, that's been a lot of my criticisms of description, is they kind of try and play it down for like PG. But like, no, Matt, Matt did a great job of making sure that it was as adult as the movie was. And something that really stuck with me from the Q&A that the director said was, "As we push the boundaries of gender, we had to push the boundaries of genre." So I thought that that was really interesting.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah.
Lee Pugsley
Yeah, that is a really fascinating way to do a film, and unique choice to kind of blend documentary with narrative. I'll be curious to check that out when it becomes more widely available.
Alex Howard
So then we went to my favorite film of the festival. Love Lies Bleeding, which was in Salt Lake City. So they do screenings in Park City, which is the main Sundance Film Festival and then they'll do screenings in Salt Lake City too, for some of the movies, because I think that's where most of the Utah population is. So we went down to Salt Lake to see Love Lies Bleeding, which comes out March 8. It's from A24, starring Kristen Stewart, Ed Harris, Dave Franco. And who's the female co-lead?
Jamie Gagnon
Katy O'Brien.
Alex Howard
I love this movie. This is totally right up my alley. It's a romantic crime thriller, almost like Fargo where it like spirals out of control. Ed Harris plays almost like a Nick Cage character. He's crazy. It is so, so good. And I don't want to say too much. I just, I can't wait for people to see this movie. I can't wait to go see it again on March 8. It's from the director of St. Maud, which I haven't seen. Lee, have you seen it?
Lee Pugsley
No. I've wanted to see that movie. I still need to check that out. It was on my list when I first heard about St. Maud. So that's exciting to know that it's the same director.
Alex Howard
Yeah. And the audio description is also great for this movie, obviously, since it already had distribution by A24. I think it was Deluxe that did the description. If I remember right, Laura Post was the one who voiced it. But no, this is an outstanding film. And I cannot wait.
Jamie Gagnon
I should note that I've heard it's very different in tone from St. Maud. So that might not be a good indicator. As long as you trust the director's process, you should be okay. But it's not the same tone, I've heard. It's completely different. Because this is like an unraveling string. It just keeps going and going. And it's like how can this ever resolve? Like it's such an edge-of-your-seat fun thriller, and it's so gory, it is insanely gory, just just a heads up for anyone who doesn't like gore. But it is a really fun time. And there's again, there's really gasp moments too, there, in that film, which I don't want to spoil, but I can't wait to talk about 'em.
Jamie Gagnon
And there are funny moments too.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, very much.
Alex Howard
And I was telling a friend about this the other day, like there are certain movies that almost give you like a high. It's almost like, I keep, you know, we keep going to the movies. That's why we love it so much. Because we want to get that like, that high. There were at least three or four movies at Sundance where I got that like, oh my god, this is so good. I don't want it to end. That like high feeling. And Love Lies, I think, was the first one that gave me that and it started off with a string of them. That was our end of day two. So we ended day two on a high for sure.
Jamie Gagnon
And then we started day three with my favorite movie the festival. Thelma. And so Thelma is a very low stakes action movie. It's made with this 93 year old lead, but played by June Squibb in her first starring role ever, I think. And she is this, you know, this loving grandma. Her kids are kind of like, a little worried about her all the time, her grandson is a little bit worried about her. Like you know, she's living by herself in her own house. So she gets a call from who she thinks is her grandson. And it's a, you know, unfortunately the truth now, there are people who will use A.I. or a similar voiced person to make them think that it's your, is their grandson. So he's asking for money to bail out of jail, $10,000. She sends it out, and the cops won't do anything, so she takes matters into her own hands to find the money herself. And she goes on this wild adventure in LA, and it's a fun time. It is scored and it is shot like a Mission Impossible movie. So like, it's, it's intense action, and it's a very low stake, like she's rolling off the bed, like you know, it's like, it's like treacherous for somebody that age to do these kinds of things. So it's really funny that it takes that gravitas of a higher paced action movie like Mission Impossible and puts it in an old lady's story and it's really fun. Clark Greg, Parker Posey. Richard Roundtree in one of his final roles before he passed. And to me the standout besides June Squibb, of course, is Fred Hechinger, the grandson. You might have seen him in like the first season of White Lotus, I think. But he's phenomenal, too. He's really good. And he's like, kind of stuck in his life. And you know, he's like, "How can I be stuck? I'm only like, 22" or whatever. So and it's a really cute little relationship between him and his grandmother. So... Oh, and Malcolm McDowell. But I highly recommend it. I-- Do you know, if it's coming out, is it picked up or anything yet?
Alex Howard
I recorded the Q&A. I put it up on YouTube, I'll have to put it in the show notes.
Alex Howard
I don't know if it was picked up or not. I think it will be because there were a lot of, there's a lot of buzz around that. So we saw this movie at the Eccles Theater, which is the biggest theater at Sundance. It's the venue everyone wants to play at because it's thousands of seats. It's a high school auditorium. And so since I had my cane, we got to sit like in the front row of the Eccles. It was so cool. And so for the Q&A, we were like right there. Jamie got to talk to...
Alex Howard
Yeah. So if you want to see the Q&A for Thelma, check out Jamie's YouTube channel.
Jamie Gagnon
I think there are minor spoilers in there, just so you know.
Alex Howard
But no, this movie is a lot of fun. I think this is one that Lee will like as well. It's very, it's like an action spoof with old people. It's very charming, for sure.
Lee Pugsley
I also appreciate the fact that it's like a refreshing take on the action genre, you know, because usually you think about just like, you know, these, you know, young or middle aged men or these like, you know, kick ass women. But once again, not people that are you know, in the senior citizen or elderly category. And so I think that's a really unique and fresh take on that genre that I'll be very excited to see. And I really like June Squibb a lot. And it's great to see that she's finally getting a starring role in something.
Alex Howard
Yeah, it's nice. The director was saying, it's kind of-- obviously it's not based on a true story. But.
Jamie Gagnon
She was scammed this exact way. She didn't send the money. So they caught her. They caught her in time before she actually put it in the post office. But he kind of pictured like what would happen if with-- his real grandmother is named Thelma, and it's kind of based on her personality. And she's still alive. She's 103 now, so she got to see the movie, which is really cool. But like he just thinks about grandma, this personality, would do in this situation. And she would go after and get her money back. And it's really fun.
Alex Howard
I think that was the best audience we saw movie with, because there were so many people. And it was such a-- I think comedies are such an atmospheric experience to watch in the theater. So I feel like that was the best audience atmosphere that we saw. Would you agree, Jamie?
Jamie Gagnon
Oh, absolutely. All the laughs hit where they're supposed to. Everybody was, you know, having a great time. It had that high you were talking about earlier for me. It was just like, that's the movie I didn't know I needed to see. But I am glad I did. So.
Alex Howard
And for that one, we actually have a friend at Sundance that I met through a friend of a friend. Skip. If you're listening to this, thank you for driving us around Sundance. But yeah, he gave us a little tour of everything and went to the movie with us. It was, it was really great to have a contact who actually lives in Park City.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah.
Lee Pugsley
That's great. It's always helpful when you're in an unfamiliar area and you have someone that knows the area and can show you the ropes a little bit.
Alex Howard
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And so then our second one that day is another one that I think Lee will really like. This was one of my favorite movies at the festival. It's called Hit Man directed by Richard Linklater. So this premiered at Venice last year, then it was at TIFF, and I didn't get to see it at TIFF. And then it was at Sundance, so I finally got to see it at Sundance. It was acquired by Netflix at Venice. So they've still been doing the festival circuit even though they bought it. But Liz Gutman wrote the AD tracks, thank you Liz Gutman. The AD track was great. It's so good. I was telling Jamie literally before we walked in, I was like, "How is Richard Linklater going to do an action movie?" He did Bernie, he did the Before trilogy, the Dazed and Confused, but I'm like, those movies do not, like, scream 'action.' And oh my god, like this is exactly what you would imagine it to be. Like a very personal, grounded action movie. It's about a hitman who-- Basically, he poses as a hitman and arrests people who try and hire him. So he's working for the police. So it's a--
Jamie Gagnon
It's a sting an operation.
Alex Howard
Yeah, it's a sting operation. And it's fascinating. Because obviously it's a crime thriller, spirals out of control. But like, Glen Powell is so good in this movie. And he embodies, he models his hitman after whoever's hiring him. So he embodies a character of who they think, who he thinks they would want as their hitman. He's so good in this movie, I would love for him to get a Best Actor nomination. I don't, I don't know that that's going to happen, maybe an Indie Spirit Award nomination. But he also co-wrote this with Richard Linklater.
Jamie Gagnon
He gets to play around a lot too. Like, he has different, like, characters he plays, and he plays them really well. His initial character, Gary, is really meek. And, and then he drops that facade when he becomes these other people. Yeah, I wouldn't say it's an action-- it's definitely a crime thriller in a fun way. It's a phenomenal performance from Glen Powell. And I really was was delighted with that film. It was really fun to watch.
Alex Howard
Yeah, Richard Linklater is one of my favorite directors. He was not there. I was so sad. I was hoping he would be there, but it's okay. I got to see the movie. So that's fine. But yeah, watch out for Hit Man on Netflix. Because that's definitely one of my faves. And I'm excited to see what he thinks of that one. What did we--? I can't even remember what we saw after that one, our third one that day?
Jamie Gagnon
I Saw The TV Glow.
Alex Howard
Oh, that's right. This was one of the weirdest movies we saw at the festival. It's called I saw the TV glow. It's with. It's with Justice Smith from Detective Pikachu.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah. And Bridget Lundy-Paine. They played the daughter in Bill and Ted Face the Music.
Alex Howard
I'm gonna let Jamie talk about that, because, okay, all I have to say about this one is the visuals are beautiful. The story is really weird. I think I liked the first half better than second half. Like I said, there are no bad movies we saw. But I think, I don't know that I need to watch this one again. It was interesting, but I think it hit Jamie really, it sat with him really well. So I'll let Jamie talk about this one.
Jamie Gagnon
You know, at first, I was kind of upset of how it ended. Like, I feel like there was no character growth. And I think that was, it was more of a subtle growth than I expected. But yeah, I came in with high expectations for this one because the description talked about... So basically, these two, like, kind of outcasts become friends in high school and start watching this show that is pretty much based off of Are You Afraid of the Dark, but they have a monster of the week, which is kind of like Power Rangers-ish. And there's like an overlord they have to get to, it's like a psychic battle with this, this moon demon or whatever. But it's very much like the cheesy Are You Afraid of the Dark from the 90s they're kind of parodying. And they both love the show. And then you kind of jump in time around a little bit. You see them in the future when they're a little older. You know, they kind of have a falling out. And then it's a really interesting premise. Beautifully shot. The visuals, the colors are so nice.
Alex Howard
Oh, it's gorgeous. Lots of reds and blues.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, like I don't want to go into spoilers but I took something from it. And then we talked to a person, another-- Another great thing about Sundances is,s we talked to somebody on the shuttle waiting for the shuttle.
Alex Howard
She was a volunteer at the festival.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah. And she was there when the director, when she was there the last time, and it was, it was more about like hiding who you are like as a queer person. And I was like, "Oh, I didn't totally get that at all." And so now I really want to watch it again to see what I pick up on, knowing that. I don't know if that's supposed to be public knowledge, but she said it in the Q&A. But I looked at it more of like, creativity and kind of being stuck, because that's what I get out of that stuff as a cis white male.
Alex Howard
Yeah, I think you and I were more looking at it from a career standpoint, but hearing that really opened our eyes to it more. But yeah, I, I mean, if you're into more artsy movies, definitely check this one out. It's not for everyone, but it's certainly an interesting movie.
Lee Pugsley
With the way that you guys have been talking about this movie, even before we started recording this, it makes me incredibly intrigued. Whether or not I like this movie is, jury's still out on that one. But I'm really intrigued to watch this movie now.
Alex Howard
And I think this was Bleecker Street, right?
Jamie Gagnon
Uh, I believe so?
Alex Howard
Yeah. So it should be at the Burbank 6 or 8. It should get a small theatrical distribution, I would think. So that was our end of day three. Our last day, day four, we watched two movies, both of which I really liked.
Alex Howard
Yeah.
Alex Howard
The first one was Skywalkers: A Love Story. Ironically, I wore my Star Wars shirt on this day. Even though Skywalkers is not a Star Wars movie. Skywalkers is a documentary about a couple who are, they are rooftoppers, so their whole thing is, they break into skyscrapers around the world. And they're not stealing anything. Their whole goal is to just get to the very top of the spire and take a picture for social media. And so that, I guess this is kind of like an extreme sport people do, especially if you're like acrobatic and things like that. So the woman is a former gymnast...
Jamie Gagnon
Whose parents were in the circus. So she grew up in that kind of acrobatic lifestyle.
Alex Howard
Yeah. And so she meets this other guy who is also a roof topper. And you know, obviously they start falling in love, but it's all like in the backdrop of the Russia- Ukraine War too. And just like the shots in this movie are incredible, like on top of these skyscrapers. And I'm kind of bummed that Netflix bought it because that means most people are gonna want it on their TV.
Alex Howard
Yeah.
Alex Howard
I want to go to the Egyptian, the theater that Netflix owns, to rewatch this, because I would say try and see it on the biggest screen possible, because oh my god. Like there are moments where I felt a little nauseous because you feel so high up, but it is so good. And like it's almost like a thriller of a documentary, I would say, because it's just, it's so intense. There, there are parts of it where you're like, you think you know where it's going, but you don't. It almost becomes like a heist movie at the end.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, it does. Because they, you know, they use like this, the heist movie aesthetics and score. And the graph of them trying to climb this building is this new skyscraper.
Alex Howard
One of the coolest things that they said at the Q&A was-- So the guy, basically, when he goes up there with his girlfriend, they want to do like an acrobatic pose. So a lot of the time he'll be holding her, or you know, do something crazy on the top where you're like, "Oh, my God, I would freak out." But at the same time he's holding her up, he has to fly the drone. Because the crew doesn't go up to the top with them because it's too dangerous.
Alex Howard
They shoot all their own footage.
Alex Howard
It is crazy. I'm like, he's holding her and flying the drone at the same time. It is so impressive. This is definitely my top three at the festival. This is another four, four and a half star for me. I absolutely love this movie.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, hopefully, if it comes out in theaters, even for a week, you know, Netflix usually does like a very short run, try to watch an IMAX if you can.
Alex Howard
Yeah.
Jamie Gagnon
Oh, man, you need to watch it in biggest screen possible.
Alex Howard
So one of the best things about this documentary is, I love it when you come out of a movie and people are saying, "Oh, I need to watch more documentaries." That's what you want from, from this movie. And that's definitely how you feel. You're like, "Oh, I want to find more movies like this."
Lee Pugsley
Nice. I'll have to catch it before it hits Netflix, hopefully like you were saying, Alex, at the Egyptian Theatre. And I always love good documentaries. And I really appreciate the fact that documentaries are starting to get more recognition and more widespread attention throughout the past few years. And I would love to see that trend continue. And it sounds like with a movie like this, that helps push documentaries forward as well.
Alex Howard
Yeah, I think the volcano one from a few years ago, Fire of Love.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah.
Alex Howard
That made my top 10. I actually think I like this one better than Fire of Love.
Jamie Gagnon
It's a very similar premise, right? Like, you follow this couple who's doing something very dangerous. And they were doing it for geological research. You know, this is for social media fame, but it's still, like the love story at the center of the film. And then you follow them as they tried to accomplish this massive goal. And it's really cool. It's a different style, though, definitely feels more intense, like, like a normal narrative movie, because of all the stakes, because of the POV shots where you're looking over the edge, like, "Oh, God." I was like, "Oh, no! I'm gonna, I'm gonna stop eating this popcorn right now." [laughs] Because I was getting queasy. You know, you don't know if you're afraid of heights until you see something like that.
Alex Howard
Oh, I knew I was afraid of heights. But I think that's an eyesight thing.
Lee Pugsley
It kind of reminds me of some of the shots in Free Solo.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah.
Lee Pugsley
The documentary that came out a while-- like 2018. Or maybe it's 2017. Somewhere around there. But just some of those shots, you know, like, were really intense, and could easily make anyone afraid of heights.
Alex Howard
I still haven't seen that one. It's been on my list forever. And I regret not seeing it on the big screen.
Jamie Gagnon
It's on Disney Plus. You could watch it there with AD.
Alex Howard
Yeah. One other thing about Skywalkers, I thought it was interesting that it's all in Russian. That's what the subjects speak, but they do voiceovers in English. And someone asked him a question, like, "How, did they know English?" And he said, "No," he taught them how to say those lines in English. They were from interviews that he took before and he just had them say it again. And he had them do it in English so that it would appeal to more audiences if it were in English as well. So I thought that was really interesting that he knew that it would reach a wider audience if it wasn't just in Russian.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, that was a good idea because their story of the love between them is such a relatable thing.
Alex Howard
That was a great audience too. Because it was such an intense movie. I feel like the audience was like on a ride with us. It was crazy.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, speaking of wild rides.
Alex Howard
Yeah! Dude, oh my gosh. So our last movie we saw was called Sasquatch Sunset. So I went into this movie with low expectations because someone had messaged me and told me to skip this one. And he said, "There's no dialogue." And I was like, well, there's no dialogue. The audio description is going to be great. Boy was I right. This is such a fun movie. This is like, it's definitely not for everyone. I honestly don't know how Lee is going to feel about this one. But it's, it's about a family-- a year in the life of a family of Sasquatches. There is no dialogue. Jesse Eisenberg, and Riley Keogh play Sasquatches. Full makeup. You never know it's them until the credits roll. It is so funny. It's hilarious. Like they have so many stereotypes of like, the drunk husband, the you know, there's so many things like in our lives that we can relate to this movie and things that the Sasquatches do. It is so funny. I can't remember the last time I laughed that hard in the theater. And honestly, I think the audio description helps my enjoyment because of the way they were describing things. And just-- I was laughing so hard, like, at the description. And I'm like, I wish we could play this movie with open description at AMC, and urge people to go, because I think this is the perfect movie to point to be like, "Oh, you don't know what audio description? Go watch Sasquatch sunset, and you'll see what it is."
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah, absolutely. It's funny because I didn't know anything about the Sasquatch part of it. I thought it was just like a name, like an artsy name. I knew it was a Jesse Eisenberg movie. But the description says it's when you follow a family in the woods in a year of their life. Like, it's like you're watching a nature doc of this family with no narration. And it's like the, you're gonna laugh like, if you love the early 2000s, like raunchy comedies. Like that's the kind of vibe I got out of watching this, and laughing very hard at like, you know, fart jokes and stuff like that. Like that's why some people might be turned off by it, but I think it was really funny, and well done. And the prosthetics were amazing. I really couldn't tell which one was Jessie or Riley until I look at their eyes. I'm like, I think that's her?
Alex Howard
But yes, I would love for this to be best makeup next year at the Oscars for Sasquatch Sunset, that would be amazing.
Jamie Gagnon
So look out for this one. It's really fun. Like I said, if you like kind of more of a raunchy humor. Or if you just like nature docs, it's really a fascinating approach to a film. And a lot of those films that don't have any dialogue can be turned off. Like if the, if it's like an intentional art choice, but it works so well here and it makes sense that I highly recommend it.
Alex Howard
And for everyone listening to this, I urge you to watch this with audio description because it is so funny.
Lee Pugsley
I'm not gonna lie. When you were first telling me about this movie, Alex, and that it's about a family of Sasquatches and there's no dialogue and they're played by these actors. I'm just like, "This sounds absolutely ridiculous." And to a certain degree, I'm sure it is ridiculous. But I think it's to the point now where it sounds so ridiculous to me having no context for it, other than what you guys have talked about here, that my interest is highly piqued now, and I will eagerly be anticipating this movie.
Alex Howard
So then the last one, Lee and I watched together So Lee, do you want to give your thoughts on A Real Pain before I get mine?
Lee Pugsley
This is part of the virtual Sundance experience. And Alex and I have watched A Real Pain with Jesse Eisenberg and Kieran Culkin. So Jesse Eisenberg wrote and directed this film and I enjoyed it. I thought it was a really fun screenplay. There's a lot of like banter back and forth. There's a lot of fun character dynamics, some really good humor. I thought that both Jesse Eisenberg and Kieran Culkin did a really great job. They play cousins, and I thought that they had really good chemistry with each other. And I thoroughly enjoyed this film. I think that it could have possibility to be in the best screenplay category next year. But you know, it's still early this year. So we'll see what else comes out. But I think it's a very well written, very well directed, and very well acted movie with a lot of fun and a lot of heart too.
Alex Howard
Yeah, I really enjoyed this one, I think it's probably my fourth or fifth favorite from Sundance, because I had so much fun with the other ones. This one was a lot more serious, but it also had some fun moments too. Fox Searchlight acquired it for $10 million. I think they are probably gonna put it out November-ish for Oscars for next year. I think they're hoping for a screenplay nom, I think they're hoping for Kieran Culkin to get nominated. He kind of plays the same character he does in Succession, but he's so good at like that snarky lovable asshole kind of character, that you're like, "I could watch you play this all my life." It's great. He has so many like, of those snarky jokes where like, "Oh, man," like, "You're so mean." But you're like, "I don't want that to stop." But it's about these two cousins that go to Poland and to visit a concentration camp. So it is a rather serious movie. But it's definitely, it's interesting to see their relationship and dynamic and the backdrop of World War Two.
Lee Pugsley
And I think it handles the subject with a nice balance of humor. So it doesn't feel overly heavy while still understanding what the subject matter is and how to address certain components and certain things that go along with that subject matter too.
Alex Howard
Yeah, exactly. But yes, this one was very good. So I do recommend checking this out when it comes out later this year. I'm sure we will be talking about it down the line when it does come out into theaters. And but overall, like, I didn't see, I mean, obviously I didn't see any other blind people at Sundance, Jaimie, did you?
Jamie Gagnon
No.
Alex Howard
So I'm hoping as years go on, we can have more blind representation at these big festivals. I think that will benefit everyone to have that happen. But ya, no, Sundance was so much fun. I'm really hoping this isn't my last time going.
Lee Pugsley
On that note, in terms of accessibility for this festival, I know that we touched on accessibility for TIFF as well. How accessible was this festival for you, in whatever aspects you might want to touch on?
Alex Howard
I don't think Sundance was as accessible as TIFF. I think mostly because of the transportation side of things. Getting around Sundance is a lot harder, which is why I had Jamie with me. The snow and ice, but then, you know, taking the buses everywhere, all of that. But I do think there are ways that it can be done. And I think it is definitely an experience. And, you know, hopefully, we can get things easier at some point. But in terms of audio descriptions, there were some great audio description tracks, there were some just okay ones. Like, I think just like every other festival, there aren't as many options of audio described movies, as movies that don't have audio description. Like when you're picking your tickets just like at TIFF, if you don't get the ones that you want, you're kind of S.O.L. because you know, these are the only movies you can pick from. So I think there's still a long way to go for the festival system to become accessible. I mean, overall, I think the staff at Sundance is very accommodating. I think the accessibility branch of Sundance is trying their absolute best. And they did a great job actually. There was one time we went to the theater, the device wasn't working, and the next time we went to the theater, they had different devices for me ready to go. So, like, the accessibility at Sundance, the team that works on accessibility is outstanding. They are really trying to make this festival be as accessible as they can and try and break new ground in terms of accessibility and being super accommodating with everything. So I think everyone at all of these festivals, especially Sundance, are trying so hard. And I think all I can do is say thank you. And we're all learning to see how we can make things better.
Alex Howard
It's definitely a team effort. And it sounds like you know, there's steps in the right direction for sure. And just wanted to check in with you too, Jamie. As someone who is fully sighted, but who was with Alex, if you had any additional thoughts about accessibility at this festival?
Alex Howard
I think also the theater staff and volunteers. I mean, everyone is so passionate about movies, and everyone's trying to make everyone's experience amazing. And especially at Rose Wagner, the Ray, Redstone, it's just like these people care so much about making your experience great, not just at the festival, but like a great movie experience, because they all love movies. And so whenever I'm getting the audio description devices and things, they're, they're all trying so hard to make sure it works. And I can enjoy it as much as everyone else can. And I really appreciate all of that.
Jamie Gagnon
I guess it's more of just getting around and not trying-- it's hard to traverse these sometimes icy, sometimes snowy areas. And a lot of times they close off the roads for certain events and stuff, especially in Main Street. So you have to walk around it. And usually you have to walk through snow. Like the first night we were there, we walked through a bunch of snow, because everything's kind of spread out. You know, there's a lot of space in Utah, especially outer parts of Park City or you know, surrounding areas. So stores are really hard to get to because you have to walk, there's no walkways, and if the walkways are there, sometimes they're not fully ploughed or shoveled. So it's, it gets to be a little cumbersome. But luckily enough, we were close to a shuttle route. So that helped us most of the time. And then when we couldn't do that, like, that's another thing too. I wish we'd had more shuttles that were later. There were some times where the movie get done so late, there was like one every 30, 40 minutes of the route we needed. Like they skipped every other one because they they didn't have enough drivers. Like if they had those available to us, especially knowing these movies are playing this late, that would be more helpful.
Jamie Gagnon
Shout out to Brian at the Ray who helped us perfect the audio description there over our four films there. And then Grubby at Redstone helped a lot. That was the one that he we got a new device the next day we went. It was really awesome. Like he got it shipped over just for you.
Lee Pugsley
Yeah, I agree with that. There is nothing like the communal experience of watching a movie with a whole crowd of other people and sharing those moments together. Whether it's laughter, tears, shock, fear, any of it. It's all just so wonderful. And yeah, thank you guys so much for recapping your Sundance experience and educating me on movies that I would have never known existed if If it weren't for both of you guys. And Jamie, thank you so much for joining us. Always a pleasure to have you on.
Alex Howard
Yeah, so Grubby volunteers at TIFF, volunteers at Sundance, is from Chicago and works at South by Southwest in Austin, Texas. I'm like, "How do you do this?" But no, it was overall, a very, very awesome experience. Literally like a dream come true. It was so cool. But yeah, I definitely recommend if you haven't been to a film festival, going. Go to the theater in general, obviously. We preach that all the time. Go to the movie theater. I know it's a pain in the ass, especially if you need audio description, but like they're only going to learn and get better. But I love the theatrical experience, the festival experience, movies in general, but like-- just this communal thing that you feel when you're at a festival or at a theater is amazing.
Jamie Gagnon
Yeah. Thanks for having me back.
Alex Howard
Yeah. Thanks for going to Sundance with me.
Jamie Gagnon
Oh, yeah, that was awesome. I mean, you didn't have to twist my arm that much.
Alex Howard
And thank you so much to Matt Lauterbach for making that awesome audio description track on Desire lines, but also doing the transcriptions for these episodes. So Matt Lauterbach and All Senses Go. Thank you so much. I'd really like to thank Sundance and Descriptive Video Works for helping me get over there for my first time in person. And I'd also like to shout out Ashley Eakin, who was on our show and who we ran into at Sundance because she had a film at Slamdance.
Jamie Gagnon
And we met our mutual friend Corey Reeder there. That was really fun to see, he was at Slamdance as well.
Alex Howard
We also met Nic Novicki , who was in charge of the Easter Seals Disability Film Challenge. And he announces that every year at Sundance, so we got to meet him and talk to him about that.
Jamie Gagnon
And it's a buddy comedy. And it's-- Signups are up until April 1st. So if you want to sign up, please do. And it's from April 2nd to the 7th, five days to make a film. So if you're interested, as long as you have any person with disabilities on the crew or in front of the camera, you should, you could be eligible for a buddy comedy. So look into it.
Lee Pugsley
And for those of you out there who are listening, if you have been to Sundance or any other film festival and you want to dialogue with us about your experience, feel free to email us at DarkRoomFilmCast@gmail.com. And speaking of engaging in conversation recently got an email from Brett. And Brett, we just want to shout you out and thank you so much for contacting us. Brett is an audio describer and he was just talking about what he's learned from the podcast episodes we've done with some of the audio describers we've had on. So yeah, anything that you guys want dialogue about, once again, feel free to reach out at any time. We love to hear from you.
Alex Howard
It meant a lot hearing from Brett, him saying that we get into the nuts and bolts of audio description. It always feels really good to hear from anyone, but especially in reference to something that we are so passionate about. So thank you so much for reaching out and we hope to hear from some of you other listeners as well at some point.
Lee Pugsley
And you can also follow us on Instagram @DarkRoomFilmCast. Once again that's @DarkRoomFilmCast. And Jamie, where can people find you?
Jamie Gagnon
You can follow me everywhere @GuyOnAWire, that's like man on a wire. Guy on a Wire on Instagram and YouTube and everything. I make horror shorts that are on my YouTube page. I don't post much on Instagram. But you know, if you want to follow me go ahead and drop a line and watch my shorts if you can.
Lee Pugsley
Yeah, Jamie's shorts are really good, everyone. So please check them out. They're awesome. And thank you so much for joining us today.
Alex Howard
And we will I'm sure be talking about award season and other things coming up in the very near future.
Lee Pugsley
Have a good day.