Happy New Apocalypse (Casual Dead) | Zombie Book Club Ep 76

Episode Description:
In this spirited episode of Zombie Book Club, Dan and Leah explore the intersection of humor, horror, and humanity. They share life updates, from awkward bed mishaps on their anniversary trip to indulging in nostalgic Canadian treats like Nanaimo bars and Pizza Pizza. The duo tackles tough topics like the misuse of sexual assault as a plot device in media, sparked by their recent viewing of It Stains the Sands Red. Their thoughtful discussion touches on representation, the male gaze, and the role of trauma in storytelling.

To lighten the mood, they share groans from the hoard and gear up for January's guest appearances by authors Z. Martin Brown and Sylvester Barzey. As always, they mix sharp critique with playful banter, making this episode both challenging and entertaining.

Relevant Links:

• Movies Discussed:
  • It Stains the Sands Red: IMDb
  • Die Alone: IMDb
  • The Cured: IMDb
• Grace Lee Boggs Quote Reference:
  • Living for Change: An Autobiography

Transcript

Krampusnacht and Life Updates

Speaker 1 0:00

So , as usual , we're halfway through the episode and we realize well we need a trigger warning . So this episode discusses sexual assault . It does not discuss it in detail , but it does discuss its use very frequently , specifically by cis men , as a plot device that is objectifying of women , gratuitous and used as a way to move the plot forward when it's unnecessary when it's unnecessary . So if that's something that would be hard for you to listen to , absolutely you should skip this one or just listen to the first , like 15 minutes , where we talk about vapid things , about our own life , yeah , and maybe the second we mention .

Speaker 2 0:33

It stains the sands red . You just skip ahead like five or 10 minutes 15 minutes to be safe .

Speaker 1 0:38

Yeah , so yeah , that's what's up with this episode . Happy Krampusnacht , krampusnacht welcome .

Speaker 2 1:05

Zombie book club , the only book club where the book is a holiday . Well , we won't say which one , but from what we can tell without spoilers , it is both holly and jolly .

Speaker 1 1:14

It's a holly jolly cramp must knocked .

Speaker 2 1:18

That is the one . I'm Dan , and when I'm not being quite jolly myself , I'm writing a book about a zombie outbreak that is neither holly nor jolly . Has anyone written a book like that Let ?

Speaker 1 1:32

us know . I thought it was neither holly nor jolly . What did I say ? Neither I say neither . I say neither .

Speaker 2 1:39

Well then , I guess we need to get a divorce .

Speaker 1 1:43

That's the end . And I'm Leah when I'm not preparing for a family Christmas in Canada which involves traveling 10 hours over two days with two geriatric arthritic dogs who despise change and new people Yikes . Spending a small fortune on hotels . Yikes , eating snack food from convenience stores and preparing ourselves for everyone , asking us about our next president when we get there and what we think about that , and asking why we don't have children yet . I'm not sure which question's worse . I'm dreaming of my very first bite of a nanaimo bar , which will make all of it worth it . If you don't know what an animal bar is , dan is rubbing his nipples thinking about it .

Speaker 2 2:20

yeah I think they're okay really .

Speaker 1 2:23

I think they're pretty good that that means that everyone we get is mine , if that's really how you feel about it . That's why I always let you have more than me you do not I do sometimes you make me split them evenly , which I think is cruelty . That's not equity . In this case , I my appreciation of the Nanaimo bar is a 10 out of 10 , and if yours is a 5 out of 10 , then you should have a quarter of the Nanaimo bars .

Speaker 2 2:44

Yeah , and that's how much I do have . No , okay , well , last time we got Nanaimo bars , you had like five and I had one .

Speaker 1 2:52

I don't believe this . I don't remember . I don't remember it that way , dan .

Speaker 2 2:55

We release episodes every Sunday , so subscribe . Welcome back . We've missed chatting with you .

Speaker 1 3:03

I've missed chatting with you too . Missed chatting with you too . I was talking to the audience , oh fine then , although you know I will say that our , our podcast talks are always like a weirdly intimate and lovely thing that then everybody listens to . Yeah , and I say things I regret sometimes , like uh , being excited about a ceo dying , yeah , and having an outtake where he said that the president was dead that was .

Speaker 1 3:28

Are you gonna add that to the end of the episode ? Yeah , I think . Okay , you all can get that true at the end . It was definitely not . It was . It was a subconscious statement . Today we've got a casual dead episode for you because it's krampus knocked .

Speaker 2 3:41

Yeah , it's krampusnacht . Yeah , it's Krampusnacht . That's my favorite holiday . I love running around dressed like a demonic goat man , throwing children into bags and then beating them with reeds .

Speaker 1 3:56

Don't tell my little nephew that .

Speaker 2 3:58

I am going to tell him about Krampus .

Speaker 1 4:02

It's another holiday season , but you can guess we're talking about some life updates today , Dan . Oh , do we ?

Speaker 2 4:08

have life updates .

Speaker 1 4:09

We do . We're also talking about sex in the apocalypse .

Speaker 2 4:12

Oh , we are , and the male gaze . See , you know , the previous episode , leah was the one in the dark and I planned the episode . This one , I have not seen the notes . Yeah , because you were editing the episode that comes out in two days .

Speaker 1 4:26

Yeah , despite the fact that dan is off work for the season and I've been off for a week , we are still recording this episode a day before we have to leave for canada , where we will not have the opportunity to record any episodes . How does this happen ? So , yeah , it's , we've had a lot happening in the last little while .

Speaker 2 4:43

Does that mean that we have life updates ? Leah , we do .

Speaker 1 4:47

We had an anniversary getaway to Stowe Vermont .

Speaker 2 4:50

Yeah , it was our anniversary .

Speaker 1 4:52

Yeah , four years of being married , that was a lovely time it was really nice .

Speaker 2 4:56

Yeah , I had a hard time sleeping at the place that we went to , the Governor's Mansion . It's a lovely place . The beds are hard as rocks and they give you one pillow that flattens out immediately .

Speaker 1 5:08

Yeah , the bed is very bouncy though .

Speaker 2 5:11

Yeah , that is true .

Speaker 1 5:12

But it's not good and we've been spoiled by my apologies , the bed wasn't great yeah , but Stowe is lovely . Stowe is lovely . What was your favorite part of the anniversary trip ? Dan , oh boy .

Speaker 2 5:26

You know I had a really great time walking by the frozen river . We went to this place that had like a walking trail and we ignored all the rules and just walked our own path instead of the path that was laid out before us . We just walked down to the river and walked around on frozen water .

Speaker 1 5:47

For the record , I didn't know the rules and then when I learned them , when we got back , I felt quite badly because it was probably not good for the ecosystem . So I am not recommending that you go off trail , but it was still nice . We probably shouldn't have done it .

Speaker 2 5:59

We were . We were the ecosystem Leah . It was us .

Speaker 1 6:04

We probably made some like special fish extinct . Some special fish you can only find in Vermont .

Speaker 2 6:08

Yeah , the Vermont fish . Yeah , leah . What did we do in Stowe ? Have you ?

Speaker 1 6:14

forgotten already .

Speaker 2 6:18

Yes .

Speaker 1 6:22

Well , I'm going to start with my least favorite part , but I think was necessary A rite of passage living in Vermont , which was the Ben and Jerry's factory tour . Yeah , there's a few people listening to this podcast that I think would enjoy the canned moo jokes that were constant , but it was really terrible .

Speaker 2 6:35

Would love all of the cow jokes .

Speaker 1 6:39

There were endless cow jokes and puns . They were all terrible . You could tell that the tour guide has to say the exact same thing with the same punch lines like 10 times a day .

Speaker 2 6:49

Yeah , and the sample wasn't even that great yeah , the , the ice cream sample at the end . Yeah , yeah , I forget what it was some caramel crunch thing .

Speaker 1 6:58

It was all right , so I it's fine . Yeah , I don't really recommend going to the ben and jerry's tour actually

Stories, Updates, and Medication Journey

Speaker 1 7:04

. Yeah , in fact , our , the person who hosts us at the bed and breakfast , the governor's manager , was like you did that . I told you it was a waste of your time . I was like I know , but I'm still glad I did .

Speaker 2 7:13

But we were like but you have to , though , and she's like no , you don't .

Speaker 1 7:16

It increased my class consciousness because I job is torture like . I bet you that in their dreams they're just reciting the moo jokes . Yeah they're .

Speaker 2 7:26

They're gonna be telling moo jokes when they are in the retirement home and they have alzheimer's . Yeah , they're just gonna be like I can't even remember any of the jokes .

Speaker 1 7:35

I can't either we teflon panned them , I'm pretty sure . But we also went to really lovely river and that was nice river was really nice .

Speaker 1 7:42

It was a running river even though it was winter . Oh , and we went and saw , um , a haunted covered bridge , which we have a covered bridge in our neighborhood . We have a few , actually , and we have the longest covered bridge , I believe , in the united states um , in the town next to us actually . So now , if you can google that , you probably will find us . But anyways , the cover bridges aren't that exciting , but going to a haunted one at least felt a little bit , yeah , exciting there's .

Speaker 2 8:08

There's so many covered bridges to go to and like every single one that you go to , there's always somebody there like snapping pictures and stuff , and it's like we were there too , so like we're not we're , we're just as lame as those people . But at the same time we got to make jokes like let's not not go see the covered bridges . We got covered bridges at home .

Speaker 1 8:28

Yep , ha ha you like it . No , it's not a good joke , but at least the people that were in Stowe were pulling off to the side of the road , versus the one that's right by our house that we have to go through to get home .

Speaker 2 8:49

Where people just park in the middle of the road and stop us all . I want to tell you all the ghost story of emily . Oh yeah , tell me about the ghost story . Let me find it the very real and verifiable ghost story .

Speaker 1 8:55

Okay , so we went to the gold brook covered bridge you can look this up and the legend of emily the story of emily the jilted young woman has been told for far and wide . The most popular telling remembered by some still alive for the 1940s has a young farmer's daughter , emily . Sometime in the past , perhaps as early as 1849 , deserted by the man she loved on the day of their intended marriage Wow , in despair she took her life at the bridge . Some believe her spirit haunts Emily's bridge , especially on moonlit nights , waiting for her man to return . I , a dude , wrote this , yeah . However , others remember it differently . A local luminary recently explained that quote . In the 1970s , witchcraft was enjoying a big wave of interest in schools all over the country .

Speaker 2 9:40

That was mass hysteria yeah , because people like led zeppelin .

Speaker 1 9:44

Anyway , yeah , black sabbath , on one warm summer's evening , a story was made up in the presence of some impressionable college students about a young emily being jilted by her intended , after which she rode with fury back across the bridge . The horses panicked and she was thrown from the wagon to her death . The story spread like wildfire . That's the . That's the tale of the gold wow brook the second one sounds much more believable yeah , apparently they thought that they were going to find gold here .

Speaker 1 10:10

But hold on , you know there was , there was gold in that brook .

Speaker 2 10:14

There's gold in that brook there was I've got an issue with the second story , leah , and the first story , yeah , which is she jumped from the bridge or she was thrown from her horse and fell off the bridge . It's a covered bridge . It has walls , it has a fucking ceiling .

Speaker 1 10:33

But was it a covered bridge in 1849 ? Yes , Probably . All I know is the picture of it . That's really old and black and white is super creepy . Look at that . Oh , that is creepy .

Speaker 2 10:46

It looks way scarier in this photo than it was actually there I bet , I bet that that when they , uh , when they took that picture , they're like let's make a black and white , so it's scarier what else did we do ?

Speaker 1 10:56

instead , we ate a lot of food .

Speaker 2 10:57

That's always so much food there's this place called ranch camp . That's a bike store , but they also have food . Oh , and we went to a bookstore a real one , yeah , big one .

Speaker 1 11:07

And we got a present for my nephew about monsters and how to draw them yeah he's gonna like to draw , and a little journal for me with a skull on it because I'm cool and hip yeah , and I've bought a brain that you can put on your finger and then I gave it to your brother and I didn't realize he actually thought I was giving it to him because he took it I just wanted to show it to him .

Speaker 3 11:25

It says now , but it is his , now belongs to him .

Speaker 1 11:27

Yeah um what else has been ?

Speaker 2 11:31

going on in our world . Um , I don't have very many life updates . Things have just been really busy between , like , going to stow and dealing with the snow situation . It all froze and it became a nightmare . So that's been occupying a lot of my time and I haven't really been writing that much lately . And that's kind of making me sad and it's something that I'm realizing , that there's all the things going on that makes it hard for me to write .

Speaker 2 12:03

But I'm also realizing that the medication that I was on for anti-anxiety and anti-depression , I think , is like sucking the life out of me . You know it's sucking the creativity out of me . It's sucking everything out of me . Um , you know it's I . I feel less motivation . I feel less creativity . I feel less motivation . I feel less creativity . I feel less emotional connection , which is not good , especially when your anniversary is coming up . And , on top of that , it wasn't helping me with my depression or my anxiety . It was definitely not . So I don't know why I'm taking these drugs and I'm stopping , I'm weaning off of that medication because it's not good for me .

Speaker 1 12:49

You were kind of like a zombie .

Speaker 2 12:51

I was absolutely like a zombie you have .

Speaker 1 12:52

Dan the zombie work season zombie . And then you have Dan on medication . That's not right for him . Zombie , yeah .

Speaker 2 12:59

And yeah , I'd rather be depressed and anxious but also be emotionally connected and creative . Like writing a book is better to me than not feeling depressed or anxious .

Speaker 1 13:14

I think it's your own definition of what mental health is . It's different for everybody . I know there was a point when I was a teenager I was on an antidepressant that I don't know what it's called now and it made me feel like I was literally watching myself outside of my body , which wasn't good . I've talked about it with my current therapist . But at the same time , life was so hard then that it was almost it was better , like as much as it was strange , and I didn't feel like I was connected to my . It was like watching somebody in a movie or a dream . Um , it kept me here , so that's good . Good , it's like it's hard to know sometimes when the right , when it's the right time and how much and which medication to take for depression and anxiety , and I'm definitely a fan of , like anybody , if you need medication , you should take it . You find the right one . Maybe this just isn't the right one for you , or maybe it's not the right solution for you at all .

Speaker 1 13:58

Worse I mean , I think it depends on how it interacts with your body . You know , there's a reason why there's so many different ones .

Speaker 2 14:05

Yeah , that's true , Leah what are your ? Life updates .

Speaker 1 14:08

Well , my foot was doing really good and so I walked a lot in stow and now my foot is yes , my plant , you made that sound so fancy Plantar fasciitis . My foot is mad and I'm able to do anything on it for the last five days , but I'm hoping that it will get better . On the flip side , I've been off for a whole week and that's been great , yeah , and I made a crown a zombie wean crown for Lori Calcaterra , made of zombie flesh . That is , I'm really proud of it . I'm really proud of it . So that's what I did with not being able to walk . Oh , and the season . So that's what I did with not being able to walk . Oh , and the season finale , for Survivor happened . That was fun , yeah .

Speaker 2 14:47

That's it . The crown looks great . Yeah , and this is Lori's crown for last year , and , of course , sylvester is the crowned champion for this year , but Sylvester is making his own crown .

Speaker 1 15:03

Sylvester , you're going to regret it .

Speaker 2 15:05

Sylvester , when you see this crown , you're going to change your tune .

Speaker 1 15:09

I'll make you one , sylvester , it's not too late . But yeah , I decided to make one for Lori because we were just getting started as a podcast . We were little podcast babies , yeah , and she took a chance on us and did Zombie Ween game show the very first one and kicked ass and it's become a friend ever since . So I wanted her to have something to commemorate that yeah , it's , it's pretty great yeah , and I'll take orders for other .

Speaker 1 15:31

You want this crown ? We'll share pictures of it once lori has it in her hot little hands . Uh , you want one , you do you let me know , yeah , I'll make you one .

Speaker 2 15:38

Well , you have to money you have to win .

Speaker 1 15:40

Well , I won't make the zombie ween crown yet , but I'll make other crowns .

Speaker 2 15:44

A crown of some kind .

Speaker 1 15:47

The last thing I want to talk about on Life Updates is just what I'm anticipating is going to be happening in a few days , which is eating all of the Canadian treats . So what is an Animo bar , Dan ? Why are you asking me ? I want an American to explain an Animo bar to Americans and people from the UK . An An and the Naimo bar .

Speaker 2 16:03

The Naimo bar is a big pile of a layer of hard chocolate , and then there's some white stuff , and then there's another layer of different stuff that's brown , and then there's stuff on top .

Speaker 1 16:20

I'm just going to stop you . That was terrible . The bottom is like a brownie , like a really , really dense brownie with a bit of coconut in it , and then the middle is like an icing , like a buttercream , but a little thicker , and it comes in different flavors . All of them are good . Oh my God . The peppermint , one don't even can't talk about it . The peanut butter one , the regular one , all of them are amazing . And then the top layer is a hard chocolate at the very top , and it is incredibly sweet , incredibly wonderful , and not a thing that you can find in the United States . So that's a guaranteed thing . I'll be eating a lot Also , canadian wheat thins .

Canadian vs American Junk Food

Speaker 1 16:52

I'm going to bring back a few boxes because they are superior to the American ones . They are not the same . Yeah , in what way ? I don't mean this in a derogatory way , but the wheat thins in America are not thin , but the wheat thins in america are not thin .

Speaker 2 17:09

Oh , they're not thin , they're real .

Speaker 1 17:10

They're actually quite thick and they're quite large . They're american thins , they're , they're sugary . As a fat person , I feel like I can make that joke , but like they're , uh , they're very sugary . Yeah , versus canadian ones , canadian ones are a little more on the savory side .

Speaker 1 17:21

Everything in america is sugary , sugarier yeah , tell me about it um shreddies , my favorite uh cereal growing up , which is literally just shredded wheat . But like in little cubes , little narrow , not really a cube , a square , a square where shredded wheat um rockets , which you all call . What do you call them ? Again here , smarties yeah , smarties is actually a canadian treat . I don't like smarties . Give the canadian ones . I like the american smarties that are actually canadian rockets , but I don't like the canadian smarties which are like american m&ms . Hopefully people can follow that . And then , last and only , is pizza pizza baby .

Speaker 2 18:01

Yeah , we love pizza pizza because it has so many vegan things now and it's disgusting and junky and wonderful it's like the only place that I that I can think of anyways that you can order a pizza as a vegan and get cheese on it like vegan cheese and have a fast food and have it delivered to you yeah , and then they have all kinds of other vegan things it's very yummy and it's very fun like like , like sandwiches . They have nuggies , they have strips , they have sauces . It's wonderful . What else do they ?

Speaker 1 18:31

I think they have a calisone , probably probably it's like a five out of ten . Like , let's be honest , it's not great , but it's like sometimes you just need the really bad junk food . Yeah , and pizza . Pizza is that , and it's also the special treat because we only get to eat it when we go to Canada .

Speaker 2 18:44

You know I have two types of pizza cravings . I have cravings for the top end , the really delicious , masterfully cooked pizza , but I also have cravings for what I refer to as garbage pizza . Yeah , this is garbage pizza . Yeah , like pizza that tastes a little bit like cardboard , it's a little the crust is a little bit like cardboard , it's a little the crust is a little bit sauce , okay , otherwise it does dripping with grace . Yeah , yeah , um , and this , yeah pizza pizza fits that bill perfectly .

Speaker 1 19:14

It's like the high end of garbage pizza , I would say yeah , I didn't realize when I moved to the states that I would not have access to a lot of my favorite food things , so it's , it's a fun part of the ritual going up there and eating them , yeah , but let's talk about zombies , dan I wanted to hit this last thing on your list corn bran squares .

Speaker 2 19:30

What , the ? What are those ?

Speaker 1 19:33

also cereal . I grew up with very bland cereal .

Speaker 2 19:36

I'm realizing I don't know if that was because , like my family , was anti-masturbation , because isn't there like a connection between bland cereal and masturbating or something food that was so boring that mental patients would not want to self-gratify and would keep them sane , because mental health was , in this person's mind , linked directly to masturbation .

Speaker 1 20:15

Masturbation is bad for your mental health at this point . Yeah .

Speaker 2 20:18

You could be cured of your mental illness by abstaining from pleasuring yourself . That's really messed up .

Speaker 1 20:24

So he invented corn flakes that's what I'm saying basically is that I grew up with really , really bland cereals , but I actually really like them and it definitely didn't deter me . That's all I'm saying . Corn brand squares delicious little squares of corn instead of squares of wheat . We're seeing a trend here in my preferences for cereal corn . Don't give me that raisin brand . Don't need those corn flakes .

Speaker 1 20:47

Rice krispies I can go for some raisin brand , to be honest and apparently we can buy quakers , corn squares , which I'm not sure if they're as good as the real thing in canada . It looks similar on amazon for 13 that's .

Speaker 2 20:58

I'll just go to canada and buy it that is a lot for cereal , especially bland cereal . Um , we've watched a lot of zombie movies lately , leah so many zombie movies that we have not made episodes talking about like we used to , because there's just been so much going on and also we just watched so many movies and maybe not all of these movies merit an episode yeah , in fact , we're gonna list out for you the ones we've watched lately and we're gonna do a poll later on instagram which one we should actually do episodes on , yeah or you can email us , or whatever , and tell us yeah or let us know another one that you're like you must talk about .

Speaker 1 21:37

You can threaten us . Just threaten us and we'll do it . Or I've got a better idea threaten a ceo and ccs .

Speaker 2 21:46

I'm just kidding don't , don't do that . Yeah , ceos are are really butthurt right about now . Ceos are people too . Ceos do not have a sense of humor these days so what have we watched lately ?

Speaker 1 22:01

we've watched , watched just recently , like two days ago . It stains the sands red . Yeah , what is the ?

Speaker 2 22:07

it in that movie Are they talking about the woman who's on her period staining the sand red ? Because I thought it was going to be the zombie staining the sand red , but that zombie didn't stain anything red .

Speaker 1 22:20

Well , not the dinner period , because it was written by men and there was literally a tampon scene that I won't say more about because it would ruin a very . It's a fun . I'll admit that it's funny , but then like literally no blood on her pants , none , yeah .

Speaker 2 22:35

Later it did show her with blood all over her legs , but it somehow just didn't saturate through her very pale cheetah leggings .

Speaker 1 22:42

Yeah .

Speaker 2 22:47

Maybe they're waterproof . Yeah , she was a vegas show girl .

Speaker 1 22:49

She might have waterproof . She was the imagination of a couple of guys who have not thought a lot about women .

Speaker 2 22:53

That's I think that's absolutely or have thought a lot of women , but in a very um porn hub kind of way yeah , I mean , I think the story of uh of , of the Vegas showgirl who's kind of vapid , has merit and that's an interesting story to tell from that person's perspective . But they probably should have consulted a woman .

Speaker 1 23:15

I said we weren't going to talk about it in this episode and it's taking everything in me . I'll just say I hope somebody says we should do an episode on Stands the Sands Red . It was upsetting I . It was a . It's a great plot of a movie in theory and parts of it were very enjoyable , but it was so and the main character was a woman , but it was so badly written . Yeah , uh , like it felt very inauthentic to me . It's the same thing as , like dan , when you get a pet peeve of people and gunfights not reloading their guns . That's what it was like watching this . As a woman , I was like this is literally like every trope , with no sense of what it's actually like to have a uterus um , or exist in the world with a uterus like . It was just very , very , very , very , very cliche and then also involved um sexual assault .

Speaker 2 24:02

That was unnecessary completely yeah , um , they , they could have gotten to the same place in the movie a different way and uh , and that was . That was very upsetting .

Speaker 1 24:14

Yeah , we got into it on discord , actually on Ollie eats brains . It's called the brain munchers zombie collective discord . You should come check it out because we talk about things like the weather . We had like a very long thread about our experiences with weather in different parts of the country . But we also talk about things like sex and the apocalypse , sexual assault in the apocalypse , um , just stuff we're watching in general . But I did want to read I was going to do this later , but I do want to read this quote from one of the folks on discord who engaged in this conversation because about sexual assault in this um movie and why it's problematic in general in media , because I think it's really important it needs to be said yeah uh , and then I'll just to give some context .

Speaker 1 24:53

I just posted in our general discord dan and I about to start it stains the sands red . Anyone have strong opinions on this movie . And then I would say , like I don't know , 30 minutes in I I edited it to say trigger warning , sexual assault and a woman , clearly written by men who know zero about women . And then I edited that later and said it gets better in the second half because it did not . It's not its depiction of women , but the plot . There was fun , some fun plot parts , yeah , but it sparked a really interesting discussion on discord and um , there's so much there .

Speaker 1 25:25

I think we're going to do an episode on sex in the apocalypse in general and I bring in some other folks ideas from that . But what I want to lift up right now is summer c hearts commentary about sexual assault and why it's so ridiculous to be including in media . She says all right , folks , long rant ahead , sorry in advance . There is a real problem with sa sexual assault , both in emergency situations and everyday life . This is no shocker to any woman . I've seen informal studies done done asking when , what age they were in , a man first made them feel uncomfortable or inappropriately approached in an everyday situation , and it generally is under the age of 12 , so let that sink in .

Speaker 1 26:02

The problem is how media depicts essay . Essay tends to be used in one of two manners rape as a plot , or motivation or gratuitous . For the first one , rape as a plot , the main problem is that a lot of media is written by men who look around , ask themselves what motivation a woman would require to act in such and such a manner and then default to rape Because it's easy to see highly emotional event and doesn't require much thought on their part to really evaluate or understand women . A male character is very infrequently given this as a motivation . They're often much more nuanced or acting in response to violence on someone else , but they themselves are safe from it . And yes , there are some women writers who have fallen for this trope , but honestly I believe it's because the patriarchy has convinced them that women could not possibly have a deeper or more complex motivation , or they're being as lazy as their male counterparts .

Speaker 1 26:48

Imagine me clapping the whole time I'm reading this . I'm just like thank you , thank you for saying this . And then she goes on For the second one gratuitous . This is where the essay serves absolutely no purpose or plot development . I haven't watched it Stains the Sands Red , but it sounds to me as if the scene everyone keeps referencing falls into the second category . I think it's actually a little bit of both . Without getting into the details , it's completely unnecessary and there easily could have been other ways of furthering the plot without this added detail and I include this category .

Speaker 1 27:16

Any essay , including inappropriate touching , and I will just say this one was very graphic and upsetting . Yeah , like it's probably . Maybe there was a trigger warning , but I didn't see it . And then all of a sudden that was happening and I was just like whoa , like I really don't need that for lots of reasons , don't need to see that . Um , summer's heart

Portrayal of Sexual Violence in Media

Speaker 1 27:36

goes on . When you watch or read these scenes , you really have to ask yourself is there a real reason to add this ? Could they show a character's personality or motivation without going to this level ? If the answer is yes , then it's gratuitous and honestly , I feel like these scenes are added in for the male gaze and for males who like the idea of dominating a woman that way . Why else would you add such a theme to your book and movie and do that to your character if there's no reason . There are some male authors I refuse to read because every single one of their books includes scenes like that , and I feel like it shows something much darker and deeper about themselves that's yeah .

Speaker 2 28:09

I had that feeling too when I was thinking about the scene from this movie , and it's like that the existence of that scene says more about the person who wrote the screenplay than it does about whatever they're trying to say about the apocalypse and it ruined the movie for me . Like it , it had other good parts like I wouldn't recommend that movie to anyone . Now if if that scene wasn't in it , I'd be like oh yeah , it's a fun movie .

Speaker 1 28:48

And like it did serve a purpose , but that both the most like basic interpretations or understanding of what , like what , might matter to a woman .

Speaker 2 28:56

Yeah .

Speaker 1 28:56

It's really annoying , and I think that it's very easy for folks who are cis men to just be like , oh , it's still a great movie though , and like I agree , it could have been a great movie , but I can't unsee that part of it and I also can't even without that . I can't unsee just like that . This main character was a caricature at best , not even just like a really poorly written , unrealistic . It'd be like watching an old Western where they all have toy guns that are bright pink . It ruined it because it was so unrealistic in terms of who this person was and what mattered to her and had no depth at all . Yeah , uh .

Speaker 1 29:34

So sometimes I feel , like on this podcast and in life , that I'm like the debbie downer of any party , because I'm like well , this sucks . But I also feel like it needs to be said and it really meant a lot to me when I read summer c hearts commentary on here , because it is a genre that is primarily cis men who are watching it and enjoying it , and there's obviously some women , there's some people with uteruses , there's trans folks who enjoy it too , people of different races , but it's like the default is to look at women that way in this industry and it sucks to have to constantly bring up the fact that it's not okay . So when someone else does it too , I felt less alone in that moment , and it wasn't because anybody else was saying something that they shouldn't have been saying .

Speaker 2 30:19

Everybody was agreeing , but it was just really nice to feel seen and to feel like there was somebody else who got it , because a lot of the time being a woman is being like gaslit , being told that , like your perspective , your perception of the world is just wrong I think that , um , a lot of male writers , they , they think of the zombie apocalypse as as a way to to tell a story that's brutal and and like it , you strip away all of all of the rules of the society that we live in and think about the worst things that people can do .

Speaker 2 30:59

And I think a lot of people , the first thing that they , that their mind goes to , is sexual assault . Yeah , um , and I I do believe that that would happen , but I'll also like , uh , you know , I'm glad that I'm at a point now where I can think deeper than that and I don't have to go there as a writer to show how brutal and honest my world is . I can show it in different ways , without making people , without reminding women yeah , this is the world that you live in .

Speaker 1 31:29

Yeah , which we don't need to remind ourselves .

Speaker 2 31:30

Did you know about this , Guys ? I just heard about sexual assault . Isn't that wild .

Speaker 1 31:37

Yeah , I think it's a really good example of like . If somebody with a uterus wrote it , I would feel a little bit different about it , and I'm sure it would be approached differently If that same story had been written , if there'd been even one woman involved in writing it , um , I think there was a higher likelihood of it being better . But summer seahard is also right that there are women who have um internalized a lot of this , including myself for years . There's all kinds of things that I'm still unpacking , that I've been indoctrinated with , uh , somebody with a uterus . So it's hard , um , and that's also why it's easy to gaslit , because cis men will also say to me like well , this woman's fine with it .

Speaker 2 32:14

Yeah , so it's okay Not to go , not to go too much further into this topic . I've I've read a book that had a very similar type of scene as the scene in this movie , but it was written by a woman . Um , but it was written by a woman and that scene was so much more important to the storyline because we'd already seen this character in all of their other ways , uh , throughout the story . And this is like near the end of the story and it wasn't necessarily like , oh well , this is going to transform this person into a survivor now , which is how it's often used by male writers , but rather that was the moment that that person had to defend themselves and kill brutally in order to survive , and it wasn't the event that changed her to do that , that was already there , but it was the event that there was . There was no other way to handle that situation than to be brutal to her attacker yeah , I think it's always different when someone writes from their own experience .

Speaker 2 33:27

Yeah , and it's , it's like it's . It's like the same setup , but it's a totally different story , because it had so much more complexity and depth , because it wasn't just like . You know . This is , this is the turning point for this character , which is how this movie treated it is . This is your turning point , this is this .

Speaker 1 33:44

This makes you yeah , we could talk about

Zombie Movies and Listener Voicemails

Speaker 1 33:47

it all day . I think there's a lot to unpack here , but I just , at the end of the day , I want to say like thanks , allies , everybody who also is not okay with this . I want to give a big shout out to sylvester barzy , who I think I've said many times , um , I was so impressed with when we had him on last year and he's coming back in january . He's coming back , yeah , um , to talk about planet dead that you know .

Speaker 1 34:07

He just does not depict sexual assault of women . It's unnecessary to him for a good movie or , sorry , for a good book to be written , and that means a lot when people pick it up and figure it out . But there's also just something really special when you see somebody else who's had some similar life experiences because of the sex that they were assigned , like summer seahart , and I like just say it out right and very clearly that it's not okay , and here's why . And then to be in a space where I can see everybody on our discord who's like receptive to that and in agreement , and I just want to say thanks to all of you as well . I decided not to quote you here because I wanted to center uh , summer seahart's incredible message yeah we watched other movies too , we did .

Speaker 1 34:50

I didn't plan on getting into this right away . I shouldn't have put a stains the sands red as the first bullet point yeah , we could .

Speaker 2 34:57

We should have saved that for the end . Uh , we watched apocalypse z , we did . I don't remember anything about it . Um , it was oh , the cat yeah , that's all . There was a cat in it . Yeah , it's about a guy in spain , I think spain . Um , it's a spanish movie and , uh , very good , like zombie apocalypse movie . Like , if you're looking for a very typical like , this is the outbreak , this is the survival after the outbreak , they gotta get somewhere .

Speaker 2 35:27

But there's zombies , that's the kind of movie yeah , and there's a cat and there's a cat , he's gotta bring his cat along and that's really sweet yeah we also watched daryl dixon season two , the book of carol we didn't finish it I keep forgetting that , which I think says are already how we feel about it .

Speaker 1 35:41

It was better than season one because carol was in it it was barely better than season one yeah , um god , I .

Speaker 2 35:49

I have so many things to say about the spinoffs of the walking dead . Much like what was it ? Episode nine , that we talked about . Season 11 of the walking dead , episode nine episode nine I don't remember .

Speaker 2 36:03

I'm pretty sure it was episode nine um , but uh , yeah , we , we talked about season 11 of the walking dead and how disappointing that was . Yeah , and it's just continued on that path . I don't understand , like I don't understand , how the writers of that show can know about the previous seasons and have watched them and then put out what they've been putting out . They're probably being told to make it dumber . Yeah , probably .

Speaker 1 36:31

Literally , make it more universally enjoyable and dumber .

Speaker 2 36:34

Make it more universally fucking stupid . Yeah , you know what this story needs More plot holes , unexplainable plot holes . Yeah . Bad decisions by everyone involved . Needs more tropeses . More stupid ideas . Let's change the rules that we've had for over a decade for how zombies work .

Speaker 1 37:00

Let's just change it , yeah but at least carol had depth , did she ? I mean it was I think they were trying to do an examination of mental health and ptsd in her experiences . I wouldn't say it was the best ever , but it wasn't that bad . But we're not making full episodes with these , we're just telling you what we listened or watched .

Speaker 2 37:17

They weren't doing anything new . We already knew that Carol lost her daughter in season two .

Speaker 1 37:22

One thing happened in it that I thought was interesting , but we won't talk about it right now . Yeah , die Alone . That was a good one . I'd love to talk about which one was die alone again die alone .

Speaker 3 37:35

Well , if I tell you what it is , then it's going to ruin it for everybody else .

Speaker 1 37:37

Um , there's a man and woman survive , whoever that is . Yes .

Speaker 2 37:38

Trinity from the matrix right yes , yeah , so um uh takes place after a zombie outbreak I feel like you can't say anything else ? Yeah , we can't say anything else . Yeah , we can't say anything else . There's a farm , there is a farm .

Speaker 1 37:53

There's different survivors who engage with each other , and it's not quite clear who should be trusted .

Speaker 2 37:58

Yeah , there's a lot of mistrust . Yes , yeah , very interesting movie .

Speaker 1 38:04

Yeah , I enjoyed it . I think there was a point where I could see it coming and got a little predictable .

Speaker 2 38:14

That's true , still fun . And then we also watched the cured . The cured , oh right , the cured takes place long after a zombie apocalypse , and uh has people who have been cured of zombieism and they are now reintegrating into society those are really interesting one .

Speaker 1 38:27

so the question is do you want us to do an episode on any of them ? Do you want us to just keep going all trucking along and interviewing authors and doing casual deads ? What would be interesting to you ? I think we already went way deeper on it Stains the sands red than I anticipated for this part of the podcast .

Speaker 2 38:42

But you know , it evokes emotion .

Speaker 1 38:45

Yes , it upsets me .

Speaker 2 38:46

Yeah .

Speaker 1 38:52

So yeah , I mean mean that'd be something to talk about . You'll get more of this . I don't know if I want to rehash that again me either . I would love . It's the kind of movie that if we can't talk about the spoilers , then it's like I'm not worth talking about because the parts that make that movie redeeming are the spoilers .

Speaker 2 39:03

There's the things that happen yeah , there's a second half where I said edit , it gets better yeah , there is a pretty big spoiler and it's very interesting . Yeah , um , I don't know if I'd recommend it to everyone just for that spoiler , but I guess I guess , if you can make it through the really gross parts of the movie , uh , then then yeah I think , like anything , it's about informed consent .

Speaker 1 39:28

like again , if I had just known that was coming Would have been nice . What was the look on my face ? I'm pretty sure I just immediately turned away and was like please don't Like . It's so upsetting every time that happens on television .

Speaker 2 39:39

We're still talking about it .

Speaker 1 39:40

See , I'm still upset about it Days later .

Speaker 2 39:44

Leah do we have some groans from the horde .

Speaker 1 39:52

We have so many that'll cheer me up . Yeah , yeah , we need to pick me up . So we said folks , we're at risk of losing our voicemail number from google because nobody's been using it for a while since we had our evil magic chicken zombie club competition and you all came through . So are you ready to listen to the first voicemail , dan'm ?

Speaker 2 40:06

ready .

Speaker 1 40:07

Okay , this is from our longtime listener , cheryl in Long Island .

Speaker 3 40:11

Hey , this is Cheryl up in Long Island . Hi , cheryl , I was calling because I had a story to tell you . I tell you , the story is as true as the blood of my Italian ancestors . Listen , I was told that Jimmy Poppich , a town who lives near Cherry Oak , found who lives near Cherry Oak , has seen a zombie walking through the blades of grass back from the water late last night . Now , listen , I don't know if it's true , but I also heard that Peggy Collins was downtown and she was necking with a zombie and that's why her under eyes have been looking so weird . I just had to share with you . I just had to let you know . I was told this was an unpolitical . Thank you .

Speaker 1 41:01

Thank you , cheryl , we needed that .

Speaker 2 41:04

Cheryl .

Speaker 1 41:04

Also I want to say this was sent to us on Wednesday , november 27th , when there was still grass on the ground . It took us a little bit to actually a month later to air it . So our apologies , cheryl , we do really appreciate your message .

Speaker 2 41:15

Cheryl . Still got grass on the ground , you think in Long Island , long Island yeah .

Speaker 1 41:20

I gotta see what's going on with Peggy Collins . Yeah , she was neckin' Naked . She was naked with a zombie .

Speaker 2 41:28

Oh , naked with a , I thought . Cheryl said she was naked Naked with a zombie . Naked Because naked .

Speaker 1 41:33

Oh , you think , is it ? We have to re-listen . Hold on Would be a different thing entirely . We need to re-listen to make sure .

Speaker 3 41:37

I don't know if it's true , but I also heard that Peggy Collins was downtown and she was naked with a zombie , and that's why her under eyes have been looking so weird .

Speaker 2 41:53

I think it's necking .

Speaker 1 41:54

I think you're right . I misheard it . Well , Cheryl , you're going to have to call us back and let us know .

Speaker 2 41:59

Yeah , Also give us some updates about this necking .

Speaker 1 42:02

And has Jimmy seen any more zombies walking on the way back from the water at night ?

Speaker 2 42:08

Yeah , are they under the boardwalk possibly ?

Speaker 1 42:13

do jimmy and peggy know each other ? Oh , that's something we need to know it is because is this a situation where peggy might have been necking someone else when she should have been necking jimmy ? She's been necking the wrong zombie well , is jimmy's not a zombie zombie ? Jimmy just saw a zombie .

Speaker 2 42:28

Oh , we have questions Cheryl , but is it the same zombie ? Oh , Did Jimmy see the zombie walking down by the water ? But unwittingly the zombie was going to see .

Speaker 1 42:42

You know what I think happened . Tell me if this is right . Cheryl , I think what you're trying to say is that Peggy was getting naked with the zombie and they were making out necking , right , but I'm , and that's why her eyes are weird . Does that mean peggy's also a zombie ? I mean she says her under eyes have been so weird lately you know what we got .

Speaker 2 43:03

We need to know these things .

Speaker 1 43:04

There's an outbreak happening in long island . Yeah , stay away from long . I wonder what your italian ancestors think about this , cheryl ? Yeah , let us know let us know .

Speaker 2 43:12

Maybe your italian ancestors can call it .

Speaker 1 43:16

Yeah , that would be really wonderful . We could have like an ancestors ghost line . Yeah , uh , thanks for thanks for the call , cheryl . We're going to listen to the next one now well , oh , can somebody help me please ?

Speaker 3 43:30

I am stuck . Oh , no , I'm stuck in a ditch surrounded by zombies . Help me Stuck in dishes . Where can I get some help around here ? Have we become the zombie hotline ? I think so . I tried to do the zombie clocks to scare them away , but they never went away .

Speaker 2 43:50

Oh , no , that brings them in . Can you please help ?

Speaker 3 43:53

me God , I'm so sorry .

Speaker 2 43:58

The clocks just riled them up .

Speaker 3 44:01

Oh my God , ollie , yeah , leah , oh no , we're being called by names , help , help .

Speaker 1 44:11

Just don't move or say anything , and maybe , oh no , I think they're getting uh , oh , I think we need to go and listen to Zompocalypse as a podcast to make sure he's okay , because I think that that was Brian calling in with an emergency . Oh , was that Brian ? I think so , but I'm not sure if he's stuck with the dishes or in the ditches .

Speaker 2 44:31

I think it's the dishes , yeah , stuck in the dishes , surrounded by zombies , surrounded by zombies . You know you ever be doing the dishes and , like you , will just get stuck in the dishes . I mean , you have to have a lot of them for it to happen , but it's happened to me a few times I can see that I I that is not a thing I've experienced , but thank you for sharing .

Speaker 1 44:52

We also have text messages , dan .

Speaker 2 44:54

Oh do we , we do we got a couple oh , who's who's been texting us I don't know .

Speaker 1 45:00

It says brackets , qds , bracket zombie book comma . Get your wikipedia profile page today . Holiday flash sale that's very helpful wiki and presscom . Slash lp-wiki . Slash question mark s equals fb .

Speaker 2 45:15

I'm not clicking on that I think we'd be a fool not to and then we got the exact same one four hours ago .

Speaker 1 45:21

Should I click on it ?

Speaker 2 45:22

you know what this is . I'm clicking on what we call aggressive marketing and uh , and I think , I think we just got to give in to it well , apparently it's still black friday and the deal ends in exactly 23 hours 59 minutes and 47 seconds .

Speaker 1 45:38

Wow . And jacob brown is asking how I'm doing and if I'm looking for wikipedia page for myself for my business . But then there's a woman yeah , a very american looking woman in a red dress , smiling while shopping , with an American flag behind her . So I'm confused .

Speaker 2 45:52

Well , you should talk , is it Jacob ?

Speaker 1 45:55

I don't think it's Jacob , and it's definitely not .

Speaker 2 45:56

Peggy , no , I mean the person talking to you .

Speaker 1 45:59

Oh , you want me to talk to Jacob .

Speaker 2 46:00

Yeah , okay , see what Jacob says .

Speaker 1 46:03

Are you looking for a wiki page , are we ? What should I say ? You should say sell us on it . Sell us on it . Will we need this in the apocalypse ? Oh , that's a good question . No search results . Please try again . Jacob's a bot , oh boy .

Speaker 2 46:20

Jacob oh .

Speaker 1 46:22

In fact , this website's still unprofessional . At the bottom of the chat bar it says add free live chat to your site .

Speaker 2 46:36

They professional . At the bottom of the chat bar it says add free live chat to your site . They're using the free version . They are . Yeah , you gotta get at least get the paid chat pot , jacob . Yeah , all right , well , thank you . Thanks , jacob , for texting us .

Speaker 1 46:41

We appreciate it oh , I do have some fun . You know what ? Let's read some fun quotes about sex in the apocalypse just to round it out . Yeah , yeah , because both summer seahart and myself we agreed , so we were talking generally about sex in the apocalypse as well , back and forth because of this movie . And um land of the undead zombies , which is another great podcast by peter says first thing , getting laid is the last thing I'd be thinking about when there's zombies and stuff all around . Second , it it's like nobody ever heard of an STD , for that matter . Personal hygiene . And third , I don't know about you but doesn't really get me in the mood with flesh hungry , monstrous zombie cannibals out there trying to eat everyone in the disaster , trying to find food , shelter and water , and that's really not what I'm thinking of when I'm prepared to survive .

Speaker 2 47:23

Yeah , well , you know , this is something that I think about a lot and whenever I'm writing , I think like I have

Survival, Sex, and Cultural Appropriation

Speaker 2 47:31

. I have permanently downloaded into my downloads folder an image of Maslow's hierarchy of needs . Cause , if I'm writing something and I'm thinking about what people need , in a moment , I got to think about , like that hierarchy , what's happening do they ? What needs do they have met ? And if they don't have shelter , if they don't have food or water , if they're being chased by zombies ?

Speaker 1 47:57

no , they're not gonna , they're not gonna want to bang I think we should do an episode on maslow's hierarchy of needs and how it's cultural appropriation from the inuit . Fun fact , dan mas , hierarchy of Needs is actually a whitewashing of a Blackfoot First Nation worldview about what we need as a people to survive . Okay , yeah , we should talk about . I think that's . If we go down that road we will have a much longer episode than I've got .

Speaker 2 48:21

Yeah , I mean , I use that hierarchy as a tool . So I'm not friends with maslow or anything but , um , I'd love to learn the origins of it and and and learn where it came from . And you know , if that's , if that's a better tool for me while I'm writing , then I'd use that yeah , it's just a completely .

Speaker 1 48:39

It like turns the pyramid literally on its head , and for very good reason I also use the wheel of emotions .

Speaker 2 48:46

Oh , I like that . Yeah , that one's fun this .

Speaker 1 48:48

Yeah , your book is like therapy , yeah , um , but anyways , that that was what one person said . And then I said I for one think there is not enough sex depicted in the apocalypse , but I'd prefer to be consensual , and definitely when they've had the chance to wash , yeah , and are at least temporarily safe . The scene of lori and shane and the walking dead in the tent annoyed the F out of me , because tents are the least safe thing you could be in .

Speaker 2 49:10

Yeah , I think at that stage of the apocalypse they're in a place where they think that they're safe because of their location and that's why they're in tents . They're not thinking about walls or barriers .

Speaker 1 49:24

You should be pausing before you have sex in the tent anyways , if there's people around you .

Speaker 2 49:28

It doesn't block any noise at all .

Speaker 1 49:30

You might as well be right beside people doing things . Where was carl ? I'm pretty sure he was in the other part of the tent .

Speaker 2 49:38

It was terrible yeah , and like he , and like they don't have any music to turn on but I've got to read my favorite quote from this conversation .

Speaker 1 49:46

This is why you need to join Ollie Eats Brain's zombie collective discord , which you can find in our show notes . Ollie says flesh hungry , angry cannabis gets me in the mood for restrictive blood pressure check machines .

Speaker 2 49:59

What you know . Ollie has been working very hard over the holidays and is putting out a lot of typos .

Speaker 1 50:13

Well , I've got a new little section for our casual dead before we wrap up today Dan yeah , quotes for our survival . Oh yeah , I got a couple of good quotes because I think this is a time as we discussed a few weeks ago when we were in shock after the us presidential election results , that we need , uh , some people with wisdom and experience surviving really difficult things and protesting against them and fighting for change , to guide us . So I've got , first of all , a quote from zombiever , because that definitely fits in that category . Okay , and this is the survival , this is a survival tip from zombie verse . It's just those kids scissoring each other to lady gaga . I think the survival tip there is that if you're in a tent and the person beside you in their tent is doing things , just say to yourself it's just those kids scissoring the lady dog okay and move on .

Speaker 1 51:11

more seriously , though I did me I did mention grace lee boggs in our last episode , so or two episodes ago , so I'm gonna read a quote from her , because she's an amazing activist and this one really stuck with me because it's been , uh , felt very true for our times , grace says . I'm often asked what keeps me going after all these years . I think it is the realization that there is no final struggle . Whether you win or lose , each struggle brings forth new contradictions , new and more challenging questions . As Alice Walker put it in one of my favorite poems , I must love the questions themselves , as Rilke said , like locked rooms full of treasures to which my blind and groping key does not yet fit . Wow , yeah , what does that mean for you , dan ?

Speaker 2 51:52

Oh boy , so is she waiting for the lock to get bigger or the key to get smaller ? Maybe the key doesn't go into that door .

Speaker 1 52:02

Maybe I think the bigger point that I took away from it is just that the idea of progress is you kind of have to let it go and realize that the purpose is the struggle . That it's not . We're not going to reach perfect perfection , we're not going to reach nirvana .

Speaker 1 52:15

We just have to , uh , fight for better in the context we have available to us at any given time I see , that's what I took from it , and it made me feel better , because I'm , you know , I'm always thinking like it's going to get better . It's better than it was in the 1950s , it was better than it was in 1892 and I think in some ways , yes , in other ways probably not true , yeah , like you know , capitalism is worse now than it's ever been um really you know , I read it somewhere , yeah , yeah definitely not our own experience .

Speaker 1 52:44

Capitals has been great for us jk I .

Speaker 2 52:47

I read it in the liberal newspaper . Yeah , I would have to think about that more , because I don't know if my brain can process words anymore . And that's where I'm at .

Speaker 1 52:56

That's when we know it's time to go .

Speaker 2 52:58

Yeah , that's how we know . Yeah , you know what else is on my mind ?

Speaker 1 53:03

Leah what my darling dearest Dan .

Speaker 2 53:05

It's all the ways that people can find us on the internet . I think about it so much , like Instagram , for example , zombie Book Club podcast on Instagram . That's where they can find us .

Speaker 1 53:19

Yeah , we've been taking a little bit of hiatus from more frequent posting just because it's the holiday season , but we'll be back at it and we're there . We're sharing stories . We're laughing at memes . Yeah , I've got a couple of fun things you can get up in our holidays . Please dm us . Yeah , we love dms . It's going down the dms ?

Speaker 2 53:36

oh it is , that's the most millennial joke I could think of um , but yeah , also we've got a link tree down in the description where you can just find all kinds of links to things like our spreadsheet store , which I promised to put new designs on and haven't yet .

Speaker 3 53:58

Yeah .

Speaker 2 53:58

We're professionals . Yeah , because I've been fucking with a snowblower .

Speaker 1 54:04

But you did get to work , bravo .

Speaker 2 54:06

I did yeah .

Speaker 1 54:07

And you should join us on brain munchers zombie collective on discord . It's a bunch of different podcasts focused on zombies or the apocalypse and a lot of great people , a lot of great writers apocalyptic and zombie writers so come hang out with us there and you too could enjoy talking about the weather or sex , yeah , or something in between .

Speaker 2 54:25

There's very many things in between those two topics .

Speaker 1 54:28

Yes .

Speaker 2 54:29

And we cover a lot of those .

Speaker 1 54:31

But that was the main discussion the last two days , for whatever reason .

Speaker 2 54:35

Or you can just post a picture of an otter .

Speaker 1 54:38

Yeah , I posted a picture of our friend Rod Zombie at our front door . Oh yeah .

Speaker 2 54:42

Rod Zombie . In his winter suit . It's pretty cool , yeah . But also , if you wanted to leave us a message , like the things that we talked about in this episode you know our messages you can give us a call at 614-699-0006 . That way , google won't turn off our phone as long as you keep calling .

Speaker 1 55:02

Yep , and you can also send us an email at zombiebookclubpodcast at gmailcom .

Speaker 2 55:06

Yeah , and if you're a writer , you send us an email at zombie book club podcast at gmailcom . Yeah , and if you're a writer , you can also , uh , send us a , an elevator pitch , just call . Just call the number , leave us a voicemail , tell us about your book and you might find yourself on an episode of pitching your book .

Speaker 1 55:19

Yeah , and , on that note , we actually have somebody who pitched their book the first person who pitched their book , or no ? The second person to pitch their book and be on the pod ? Nope , the first person I had to think about that .

Zombies, Pirates, and Powerful Books

Speaker 1 55:31

Uh z martin brown is coming to talk with us about the non-essentials in january , and we also have sylvester barzy back . Yeah , he's coming back for the dead soil , which is such a powerful book . Yeah , pirates , pirates , it's so much more though . Zombies and pirates , it's so much more , so much more . Yeah , but I think it hooks though . Zombies and pirates , it's so much more , so much more . Yeah , but I think it hooks you in with zombies and pirates and it's like I'm going to tear your fucking heart out with this story , yeah , and make you re-examine and think about the origins of this country and the world system we have today . That's what that book does Love it Can't wait . Dan hasn't read it yet . I've read it .

Speaker 2 56:06

I've , uh , you've read a little bit to me while we were doing stuff , yeah anyways , uh , thanks everybody for listening .

Speaker 1 56:17

The end is nigh might sound crazy , but the end is nigh , baby , bye , bye , bye , don't die change and new people Don't die . Change and new people . Yikes , spending a small fortune on hotels . Yikes , eating snack food from convenience stores , ugh , and preparing myself for everyone asking me about our next dead president . Oh , that was a Shit . That was a Freudian slip .

Speaker 2 56:46

Maybe take that one from the top .

Speaker 1 56:53

Shit , that was a Freudian slip . Maybe take that one from the top . Oh boy , I think you should keep it .

Speaker 2 56:56

I think that'll be a good outtake , yeah .