From Bored to Board: Age 4 to Blindfold Chess—A Teen's Journey

What starts as a conversation about chess… turns into something much deeper.

In this episode, Morah Tziri sits down with  16-year-old Daniel from Australia who started playing chess at just four years old — and hasn’t really looked back since. From winning tournaments as a little kid to playing full games blindfolded (yes, really), this conversation explores what it actually means to get good at something.

But more than that…

👉 What happens when a hobby becomes your thing
👉 How winning, losing, and pressure shape the way we think
👉 Why being challenged is actually the best gift
👉 And how every child can find something that builds confidence and identity

Even if you don’t know the first thing about chess (same 😅), this episode is for you.

💛 Don’t Miss This

If you haven’t yet watched the Libby video, please, please go watch it.

It’s one of the most powerful things we’ve ever shared.

Libby went through so much this past year, including two strokes, and still showed up with such strength, simcha, and determination. The video includes subtitles so you can really understand her — and trust me, it’s worth it.

👉 Watch it here:
Libby's Dream Interview

People all over the world are davening for her, and it’s been extremely moving to see.

🎧 Sponsored by WePlay by SR

This episode is brought to you by WePlay by SR — where backyards turn into the land of fun and imagination.

If your kids are climbing the walls (literally or not 😄), this is your sign.

These aren’t just swing sets. Think:

• Sturdy, high-end builds
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• Designed for years of real use (not something they outgrow in five minutes)

Basically… the kind of thing kids actually use all day.

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“You dream it. Whee make it.”

🔔 Stay Connected

Make sure you’re part of the InKredible Kids community:

• Join the Tehillim Army (monthly gatherings you don’t want to miss)
• Follow along for new episodes
• Share this with someone who needs it

Everything lives at:
👉 https://www.inkrediblekids.org

Transcript

Welcome And How To Share Ideas

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey kids, welcome back to the next episode of the Incredible Kids Podcast. My name is Lord Furies, and I will be your host through this incredible journey. We are going to meet many incredible kids. We are going to spare us their stories. Some of them super cool and stuff like you've never heard before. And some of these days are just ordinary, but all of them incredible. If you have great ideas, email me today at iKidspodcast at gmail.com. And now it's time for subscribing today. It's time for the joke of the day. Yay! Today's joke is brought to you by Bachava D from Erasel.

SPEAKER_10 0:42

Obviously, the opposite of Lady Fingers are mentors.

SPEAKER_01 0:51

Hello everybody and welcome back to the next episode of the Incredible Kids Podcast. Today, we are going to talk about a very specific hobby. I sat down to interview a 16-year-old boy from Australia who plays chess.

Libby Update And Tehillim Army

SPEAKER_00 1:06

And I walked away thinking about how a hobby could really shape so much of the way you think and the things you do throughout your life. And now, just so you know, I do not play chess. Like, not at all. I don't know any rules. So going into this, I was like, I don't even know how I'm gonna do this interview. But it ended up being really perfect because we got to break everything down in a way that I can understand and you can understand whether you're a chess player or not. This kid started playing chess at age four. He won tournaments. He can literally play chess in the craziest ways. I will not spoil it for you, but it's wild. Before we jump in, I want to quickly share a couple things though. If you haven't yet seen the video that we just released with Libby, this was considered the last episode. Libby had two strokes in the last year. And since then, it's been harder for her to speak. She's trying really hard, but it's still hard for us to understand everything she's saying. So I traveled to Columbia Hospital in Manhattan so that her dream could be fulfilled of being interviewed for Incredible Kids. And you have the video experience with some subtitles so you can really understand everything that's going on. It was fun, it was inspirational. Everybody should watch it. Really, really, really. I've gotten such beautiful, beautiful emails from people all over the world who are now divining for Libby's Refuge Shalema and feeling so inspired that someone going through such a challenging thing could be so basimcha. So go and watch that wherever you can. It's posted on incrediblekids.org, of course. Also, make sure that you are part of the Tehillim Army family. So join the WhatsApp group so you can stay in the loop at all times. It's really important. The link to that is on our website, of course, and click on Tehillim Army to be able to access the link to join for all updates. Now we're doing the Tehillim Army once a month. The last one we did completely maxed out. The TYH boys came on. It was incredible. It was the best energy and so much beautiful Achtos and Tehilim. And we have plans for more. So stay up to date on all of that. I want to say a big thank you to our sponsor, We Play Swing Sets. We'll be hearing more about them later in this episode. All right, everyone. Get ready for this chess conversation. But really, it's about kids finding their thing, what it takes to get good at something, and how far that can take you, and how to stay humble about it, and how to keep challenging yourself to do more. Let's jump in.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

We asked our listeners, do you have any interesting hobbies? Here's what they had to say.

SPEAKER_02 3:35

Hi, my name is Naomi Siegel. I am 10 years old. My talent is that I love to sing and I'm in a choir.

SPEAKER_10 3:41

I'm a reason. Um my name is I am Mushika, and I am five years old, and I love incredible kids. And my favorite hobby is uh painting and coloring.

SPEAKER_03 3:53

Hi, my name is Arizona, and I'm seven years old. My favorite hobby is painting. Hi, my name is Lacheva and I'm 11 years old. And one of my hobbies is to do makeup on people and it's like very relaxing and love incredible kids. Bye.

SPEAKER_11 4:06

Hi, my name is Lacheva and I'm 12 years old. And my interesting hobby is that I love to put makeup on people. Thank you so much for theory and I love incredible kids.

Meet Danielle From Melbourne

SPEAKER_00 4:19

And now please enjoy my conversation with Danielle. Okay, Danielle, we are live. Welcome to the Incredible Kids Podcast. This is the coolest thing that we can have a trans, I don't even know what's I was gonna say transcontinental, but it's probably the wrong word. What would you call it?

SPEAKER_06 4:36

Oh, international, other side of the world. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 4:39

I know, but international didn't sound cool enough. I could have said that too. Okay, whatever. An international podcast interview. Danielle, I would love for you to introduce yourself to everybody.

SPEAKER_06 4:48

Okay, I'm Danielle. I live in Melbourne, Australia, down under, like underneath you.

unknown 4:54

Life under the sea is better than anything they got up there.

SPEAKER_00 4:58

Down under.

SPEAKER_06 4:59

Okay, I get that. I started playing chess when I was four years old. I'm pretty good right now. I can play blindfolded. What?

SPEAKER_00 5:08

Okay, we're gonna have to hear more about that. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 5:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

You're 16 years old. What grade are you in in school?

SPEAKER_06 5:15

In M.F.T.A. Right now, because we're in the holidays, we start the year at a different time in this part of the world. So um I'm in between my first and second year in Ms. Ifta.

SPEAKER_00 5:26

So you're in summer now. Like for us, it's winter. And you're in summer. You're in the southern hemisphere, we're in the northern hemisphere. The focus of this interview is not gonna be on geographical things, but it is very cool. To the point that when you signed up for this interview, um I had been in communication with your mom, and she's like, Okay, so at tomorrow's interview, and I'm thinking, tomorrow? What do you mean? I thought it's tonight. Like we weren't even on the same page. I almost thought it was gonna be tomorrow, actual tomorrow for me, but you're already in tomorrow. Whatever. Very confusing for me. But here we are. It's 10 p.m. for me. What time is it in uh Melbourne?

SPEAKER_07 6:03

2.09 p.m.

SPEAKER_00 6:04

2 09 p.m. Normal middle of the day. Yeah. What's the weather outside the window where you are?

SPEAKER_06 6:10

It's quite sunny. It was a bit hot the past few days.

SPEAKER_00 6:14

Like how hot?

SPEAKER_06 6:16

Like 40 degrees Celsius.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

Celsius. I don't do Celsius. I forgot.

SPEAKER_06 6:20

Which is a bit over a hundred.

SPEAKER_00 6:22

Oh, that is hot. Oh my gosh. I wasn't imagining it was that warm, but here it's freezing. We had our biggest snowstorm of the year so far. We have a nice amount of snow outside that they just canceled school for tomorrow. So how crazy Hashem made such a vast world that we could all be experiencing such a different life at the moment. Crazy, right?

SPEAKER_07 6:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Okay. So, Danielle, I'm so excited to host you here. I personally am gonna have a little bit of a hard time with this interview because I don't even know how to play chess.

SPEAKER_06 6:52

Really? You must mean that you don't know how to play well. Obviously, everyone knows how the rules.

SPEAKER_00 6:58

No, I don't know anything. Like, I don't know chess. I'm not a chess player, although my husband does play, my three oldest girls all play. My daughter Ahuva actually takes chess lessons with an instructor online. And she only started about like a few months ago. So I think that this is actually very interesting. I'm prefacing this because first I thought, who am I to do this interview? Like, I don't even know what to ask you because I don't even know how to play chess. But then I was thinking, you know what? Maybe I'm the perfect person for this interview. Because if you're saying something that I don't understand, then I could ask you to clarify it. So if we have listeners who don't know anything about chess, we're all gonna be learning about it for the first time. And for the people who do know about chess. Do you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_06 7:41

Yeah. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 7:42

I'm on behalf of the ignorant.

SPEAKER_06 7:44

So it'll be clear to everyone.

SPEAKER_00 7:46

Yeah. Like if you're like, oh, I don't know chess, this is not gonna apply to me. No, this is gonna be interesting for all the listeners. So it's a challenge for you, Daniel, as well. Are you up for that challenge?

SPEAKER_06 7:55

Yeah, so I have to be very clear and assume that they don't know a lot about chess.

SPEAKER_00 8:00

Very clear. I know enough about it. You don't have to get nervous, but I don't actually know the rules of the game. I wanna ease into it and take us back to the very beginning because you're 16, but I know that your chess story started a long time ago.

SPEAKER_06 8:18

So when I was four years old, my mother taught me how the pieces move, which is not learning how to play chess, that is learning the rules of the game. You still have no idea what you're doing. I was playing a lot. Then when I was in prep, first year of school, I don't know what it what you called it. Yeah. You have prep and then year one.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

So it's like kindergarten.

SPEAKER_06 8:39

Well, not really, because you like start learning how to read then and a bit. So it's not really kindergarten.

SPEAKER_00 8:45

Preschool.

SPEAKER_06 8:45

So we had an interschool tournament for Jewish schools for kids up to primary.

SPEAKER_00 8:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 8:52

And I I won six out of seven games.

SPEAKER_00 8:55

Six seven! Six seven! Okay, stop it.

SPEAKER_06 8:59

And got a trophy by that tournament.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

You were how old? Like five?

SPEAKER_06 9:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Wow, okay.

SPEAKER_06 9:05

And that tournament was for kids up to like twelve, thirteen.

SPEAKER_00 9:09

Wow. Your mother started teaching you chess. What prompted her? Did you ever ask her?

SPEAKER_06 9:13

I think it was just a service, and my mother wanted to teach me a game or something. Um my father and my grandfather, so both my mother's like husband and father are very into chess. And at some point they were better than me for a while. So my mother was just teaching me how, and then my father came home and she was like, Look, I taught Dunny how to play chess. And then I played a lot with them. They taught me some things for a while.

SPEAKER_00 9:36

So you were a young, young kid playing against your father and grandfather. Were they trying to be nice to you, like, oh, we'll play easy, or they were like going hard right away?

SPEAKER_06 9:45

They were probably going easy early on. By the way, now like a year or two ago, I was able to beat my grandfather blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

The blindfolded thing, we're not even there yet, because I I'm first just trying to understand how a five-year-old can beat a 12-year-old. That's like unbelievable in itself. I'm curious to know, like, did you show signs in other areas at like age four of like intelligence? Like, were you extra smart at that age? And by the way, when I asked this question, I don't want you to think that you're like showing off by saying this because I think it's just very much like part of somebody's makeup, who they are, their personality, their smarts, you know? Like we're all smart in different areas. I'm curious to know if there was any particular reason why she would be like, oh no, he'll get this.

SPEAKER_06 10:27

Academically, early on, like I was always very good at maths, which is closer to chess. Like early on, I wasn't good at English, but I got better because I read a lot, so now I'm also pretty good at that.

SPEAKER_00 10:39

Mm-hmm. So you think the math brain is also what makes a good chess player sometimes?

SPEAKER_06 10:45

Yeah, chess is a lot about like patterns.

SPEAKER_05 10:48

Make a pattern, make a pattern, let's make a pattern. All right. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 10:57

Memory, especially nowadays that you can memorize moves off a computer.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

Uh, cool. I know that there was some story that when you were really little and you were starting to learn how to play chess. There was a Shiva. Do you want to tell me that story?

SPEAKER_06 11:11

Honestly, I don't really remember that. I know that uh when I was just learning um my great grandfather passed away. Like I was in America then with the family and they were sitting Shiva and I played chess with all the people there, and I was getting better then winning a bunch of games.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

How old are you?

SPEAKER_06 11:28

I think like four or five.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

Wow. The people must have been going crazy. Because really, like when you have a bunch of adults and they see a kid, they're probably like, oh, he's so cute, he thinks he could play. And then when you actually start busting out those moves, they're probably blown away. I would imagine I would be if I was watching.

SPEAKER_06 11:45

Yeah, actually, my first game in that tournament, I was playing against a kid in the oldest year level, and he was like very tall, big, like so our game was taking a while. After his friends finished their game, they came over and they're like, Oh, what's taking you so long? It's just a little kid. And then they see the ball and then they're like, Oh wait, he's getting destroyed.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

That's gotta hurt his pride, you know? Because I'm sure that anyone who's in the tournament is probably good. So, like, imagine you lose to a little kid at that age, it's super embarrassing. As a little kid, how did you deal with all the winnings? Like, were you proud of yourself? What did it feel like to be getting all these, you know, accomplishments, trophies, whatever they gave you?

SPEAKER_06 12:23

Yeah, I like chess a lot. I especially liked winning, which thankfully happened a lot.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

Yeah, it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_06 12:29

By these tournaments, I got really upset every time I lost a game, but that didn't happen too often.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

I mean, you said you won six out of seven games. What happened with game seven?

SPEAKER_06 12:39

I don't know. It was I don't know how it happened.

SPEAKER_00 12:41

You know, it must have been like a slip, you know? Yeah. You glitched over there. In all seriousness, that could be a very big struggle for somebody who's used to winning, and then what happens when they don't win, you know?

SPEAKER_06 12:55

Well, especially when I was like the youngest year level, I knew I wouldn't be the best in the tournament.

SPEAKER_00 12:59

Right. But you kind of were.

SPEAKER_06 13:01

Oh, I wasn't. There were other people who got there was one person who got seven out of seven.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

Oh, okay. But you ranked pretty high.

SPEAKER_06 13:08

Yeah.

Getting Better Through Real Competition

SPEAKER_00 13:08

Yeah. I know that you said that your mom taught you how to play. At what point did you start taking lessons, or were you just playing so much that you got got on your own?

SPEAKER_06 13:17

I mostly got better by playing many games. And there are certain years that I went to a chess club, but I stopped going with it when I was like in year three or four because there was no one who was a challenge there for me.

SPEAKER_00 13:28

No one was good enough to play against you?

SPEAKER_06 13:30

Yeah. That was like just a bit after my cousin stopped coming. He was like almost as good as me. He's like two years older than me. By now, much better than him, but then he could sometimes beat me. And when he stopped coming, there was no one there who was like a challenge, so I just stopped coming.

SPEAKER_00 13:45

Wow, okay. So that was a cousin that lives in Melbourne.

SPEAKER_06 13:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

So it was local. Because I know that you also do some chess online, right?

SPEAKER_06 13:53

Now it's mostly online because that's where you find good players. I haven't lost a game over the board in like over a year.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

You haven't lost a game in over a year.

SPEAKER_06 14:03

Online I've lost games, but not on a chessboard.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

In the last year, you have not lost a game on a chessboard.

SPEAKER_06 14:09

Yeah. Unless I was blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Wow. Sometimes you've lost blindfolded.

SPEAKER_06 14:13

Well, when I w then I wasn't using the chessboard. I was blind I wasn't looking at the board.

SPEAKER_00 14:17

Right, you were exactly. It wasn't a game on the board. Exactly. I mean, listen, you're in Australia, but I would imagine that there's people that even might be listening now who are like chess enthusiasts, and they would be like, I will cream this boy. The thing is that you're in Australia. Like, there's no way for them to play against you.

SPEAKER_06 14:35

Well, online there is. Online, I play on chess.com, which is the biggest online chess website.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 14:42

The way it works is you're playing against real people. Everyone has a rating. Every game you win, you increase your rating. Every game you lose, you lose rating. Depending on your opponent, that's how many points you're going to lose. If you play in the auto match where you're just playing against a random player, you're going to be given an opponent who's around your level.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

An opponent is someone that you're playing against. I'm just translating for anyone who doesn't know what that is. So if you're playing against somebody, they're your opponent.

SPEAKER_06 15:09

So Which is why if you're playing online, you're going to lose games because they're going to keep giving you people around your level. So you're definitely going to lose some of those games.

SPEAKER_00 15:18

Got it. In person, you're playing against your neighbor and you're better than your neighbor, you're probably going to beat your neighbor tomorrow also.

SPEAKER_06 15:24

Yeah, but online, you're gonna they're going to keep giving you good players.

SPEAKER_00 15:27

Yeah, right. Which is good for you because you can probably sharpen your skills.

SPEAKER_06 15:31

Yeah, if you don't play against people on your level, you never get better.

SPEAKER_00 15:34

Exactly. I'm feeling a little better to hear that because hopefully you're still human and you lose some games online. How often do you win or lose online?

SPEAKER_06 15:41

It depends on different time controls. There are three different modes. My highest rating is in rapid, which is usually 10 minute games. So I actually just checked before this. I've won 51% of my games. It was a draw 11% of the time.

SPEAKER_00 15:56

Okay, so you win and lose an almost equal amount.

SPEAKER_06 16:00

No, because there's also draws. I'm only losing 30 something percent. Okay. Because it's draws.

SPEAKER_00 16:06

Okay, cool. You've been playing, I guess, almost, what is it, 12 years now? So was there ever a point where you like lost interest in doing this? Because it's a very specific hobby, and I guess if like you're so into it, you could burn out sometimes. Did that happen for you?

SPEAKER_06 16:20

Yeah, there were plenty of times where I didn't play for a while. Actually, two years ago by camp, a lot of people were playing chess, and then I got back into chess, and then for the past like two or three years before that, I hadn't been playing online. I went back online and it immediately increased my rating by like 400 points within a week because I hadn't been playing for so long and I just improved.

SPEAKER_00 16:40

You had like a certain memory of skills, but you had to like get back into it again.

SPEAKER_06 16:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:46

Is there like a certain way to practice to become good at it?

SPEAKER_06 16:48

In the chess club, it was the beginning of the lesson, there was a teacher who would just demonstrate something, which sometimes was something I already knew at that point, and then we would play each other.

Nerves Losing Streaks And Psychology

SPEAKER_00 16:58

They were teaching you like a new strategy, a new way to do something.

SPEAKER_06 17:01

Yes, a strategy or just general rules that are usually useful.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

So they are useful. Like you don't think that's a joke.

SPEAKER_06 17:08

It's useful, but you could be teaching for beginners and you could be teaching for intermediates, for advanced. So if you're teaching rules that are useful for a beginner, someone who's advanced already knows that. So it's not like useful.

SPEAKER_00 17:21

Got it, right. You have to make sure you're in a group of people on the same level as you. Was this a chess club at your school or community center? Where was it?

SPEAKER_06 17:29

It was at it was at my school, but there were also kids from another Jewish school who came.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

Okay, cool. So it wasn't just people from your school. Did you create friendships from people who also played chess?

SPEAKER_06 17:39

Yeah, actually, there was one person who I played a lot with and became good friends with them for a while because I was playing so much with them, but then eventually they didn't like to keep losing, so they stopped playing. And also yikes. Also, in year three, there was someone who who was the second best in my class, and I played a lot with them, and we became good friends over that. We're still like a lot closer than we otherwise would have been because we play chess together.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

Very sweet. When you're playing chess, do you talk to your opponent or are you like quiet, we need to focus? I talk.

SPEAKER_06 18:15

I don't usually need a focus much.

SPEAKER_00 18:17

Huh, interesting.

SPEAKER_06 18:18

I could play very fast, I could do moves, my average move in under two seconds. If I'm playing like just Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

You don't have to like sit there and think about strategies and only if it's a complicated game.

SPEAKER_06 18:29

If I'm playing someone who's not that good, then like you don't need to think much.

SPEAKER_00 18:33

Okay, then you do it in your sleep. Blindfolded, like you said.

SPEAKER_06 18:36

No, blindfolded, you need to think.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

I'm kidding. Do you get nervous when you're playing against someone really good?

SPEAKER_06 18:43

Yes, very nervous.

SPEAKER_00 18:44

Oh, you do?

SPEAKER_06 18:45

Especially over the board. Like, especially if the game matters a lot. Like when I went to tournaments, which costs to enter and there's prizes for. I got like a bit stressed over some of the games. Sometimes you could be playing so well and then you make one little mistake and you lose everything.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

And so how do you deal with that? Like when you're nervous in the middle of the game? Because being nervous often clouds the way you think and it could really interfere.

SPEAKER_06 19:09

I don't think I like deal with it well. I sometimes lose a few games, then I want to win, and I just keep playing and keep losing because I'm just like feeling like I need to win this, I need to win this, and I'm just not thinking clearly.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

You're in a funk.

SPEAKER_06 19:21

On the flip side, I have like long win streaks. Like recently I've been playing a lot, because it's the holidays. I could have like lose five games in a row, win five games in a row. I don't usually have win-lose, win-loss, win-loss.

SPEAKER_00 19:33

I think there's a psychology behind that. I think it's because probably there's so much frustration when you lose, because you're like, I could have done it, I could have done it, and then you're kind of like, if you don't stop and like really stop and think and contemplate like and again, I don't know chess. I told you that. But I'm talking about in life in general. I think of any game that you play, even jump rope, let's just say.

SPEAKER_08 19:57

How many pieces do you one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine.

SPEAKER_00 20:08

Somebody's jump roping and they're like the best jump roper and they could jump rope like five hundred times and beat every contest, but then when they start tripping and get out, like for some reason it's gonna make them trip again the next time. They're just gonna have like a whole series of mess ups, like when you're in that fast state of panic almost or internal distress inside.

SPEAKER_06 20:26

Yeah, it's psychology would apply to all sports.

How Chess Tournaments Actually Work

SPEAKER_00 20:29

Yeah. Tell me how a tournament works. So a tournament is like a lot of people are playing a bunch of games against each other, and we wanna see who's the best, right?

SPEAKER_06 20:38

Well, usually the way it works is let's say there are seven games in the tournament. So the first game you're randomly matched up with an opponent, and then if you win, then you won one game out of one. So then you're gonna play someone who won the same amount of games as you. And that way you'll be able to see who wins the most games. And also, all of these games, usually they're gonna have stricter rules than when you're just playing casually. Like there's gonna be a timer, let's say you have 10 minutes for the entire game. Or I've played in other tournaments where you have three minutes and they add two seconds to your clock after each move. So then you can't just think forever, which is annoying when I'm just playing casually.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Right. A time game is much more pressurizing.

SPEAKER_06 21:22

If your clock runs out, then you lose the game. Also, there could be touch move, which means if you touch your piece, then you must move it. And touch take if you touch your opponent's piece, then you must take it if you're able to.

SPEAKER_00 21:34

It's the most annoying thing whenever you're playing a game with somebody and they like do oh I didn't mean that. I didn't mean that. I can see why that would be a good rule.

SPEAKER_06 21:42

Yeah. What's more annoying for me is when I'm playing over the board, sometimes people think for a very long time and I just want to move quickly, which is like why I like online games, which are timed and tournaments. I like having a timer. Because then you'd be fair about it. We're gonna both take around the same time.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

It's also an opportunity for All of us to work on our patience, you know. Playing games in general, taking turns is hard for children, for teens, for adults. No one wants to wait for anything. Especially when you have something in mind. Like if you're already eyeballing your next move, then it's like, I gotta do it already. Like, come on, you know.

SPEAKER_06 22:17

Yeah, that's another thing. When I'm playing with someone and they're playing very slow, I can think while they're moving. So by the time they move, I already know what I'm gonna do. So then I instantly do my move, and then they take like 30 seconds for the move, and then I could take each move two seconds. But it's not only because I can do my move in two seconds, it's because they took so long, I don't need to think because I already considered almost everything.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

Right, right. I know it's like that with Rummy. Do you ever play Rummy Cub?

SPEAKER_06 22:43

A little.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

I feel like it's also that type of game where some people take so long and it's like, seriously, like I can't wait for you anymore. And you already like could think of ten different configurations while they're still on the return.

SPEAKER_06 22:54

Thing with Rummy Cub is that there's luck and you don't have that many options.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Oh yeah. Chess definitely has more strategy involved.

SPEAKER_06 23:02

That's why I like chess because there's zero luck, it's all skill. The only luck is are you gonna be the first person to move in the beginning of the game or not?

SPEAKER_00 23:10

How do you determine that? How do you how do you figure that out?

SPEAKER_06 23:13

In what setting?

SPEAKER_00 23:14

If you're sitting with somebody, how do you figure out who goes first?

SPEAKER_06 23:17

You could put a piece in your hand, a white and a black piece, and then they pick one. So a randomizer. Or one of you could just be like, yeah, I don't mind if you what color you go. Which if you're the better pet player, then they're usually like, okay, I want to be white. Like, oh, are you scared if you're gonna be white? If I'm gonna be white, are you gonna are you gonna lose then?

SPEAKER_00 23:35

For the chess pieces, you're saying.

SPEAKER_06 23:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:37

Do you have a preferred color?

SPEAKER_06 23:38

White definitely gets a significant advantage.

SPEAKER_00 23:41

Why?

SPEAKER_06 23:42

Because you start the game, so you get to set the tone of the game. You can choose the open. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:48

Oh well, remember I told you I don't know how to play chess.

SPEAKER_06 23:53

Well, that's the only difference.

SPEAKER_00 23:55

Okay, yeah. It makes sense. You always have an advantage when you could do the first move. I can understand that.

SPEAKER_06 24:00

Yeah, but there are advantages with black that you could counterplay. Like if you learn something for black.

SPEAKER_00 24:06

It's not like tic-tac-toe. You know, like in tic-tac-toe, like it's whoever goes in the middle, like automatically wins.

SPEAKER_06 24:11

No, tic-tac-toe is automatically a draw.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

Right, cat's game we call it.

SPEAKER_06 24:15

How is it automatically wins? It's always a drawing list.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

No, you're right. If you're good, then it's always gonna be that unless you're spaced out. My kids have beat me at tic-tac-toe before because I'm so confident I'm gonna get it, and then I space out.

SPEAKER_06 24:26

Yeah, but there's like three possibilities of how the game could go. I don't get what's more complicated.

SPEAKER_00 24:31

That just shows the difference between your intellect and mine. Barkashama's such a gift.

SPEAKER_06 24:43

Chess is like virtually unlimited possibilities. There are 121 million possibilities of how the board could look. Whoa.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

You could play this your whole life every single day, and there will always be a new game to look forward to.

SPEAKER_06 24:55

Yeah, but most of those possibilities will never happen because they would involve someone doing an obviously stupid move. Got it.

Skill Versus Luck And Why Chess Hooks You

SPEAKER_00 25:02

I mean, not really, but okay. You know, my husband told me that when he worked in a nursing home with people who used to be in jail, like ex-convicts, they were the best at chess because when they were in jail, they were really bored the whole day. The only thing they had was a chess board. So he played against them. He said they were excellent, these old men who used to be in jail. Apparently that's where they got good at chess after hours and hours and hours of perfecting their strategy and their moves.

SPEAKER_06 25:28

Yeah, that's the main way to get better by playing. Yeah. Which is by all things, if you practice, you get better.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

If you have a cafe in Baltimore where people drink coffee and stuff and whatever, and I was there the other day and I saw that they have a like, you know, those tables that have a chess board painted on the table?

SPEAKER_06 25:44

Yeah, I love those tables. Those are my favorite kind of tables.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

And they're so cute. Do you have one in your house?

SPEAKER_06 25:49

No. At least not anymore.

SPEAKER_00 25:51

I never realized until recently that this cafe, there's like a hidden drawer in the table and it has chess pieces. And I was like, oh my gosh, I wish I knew how to play chess. Isn't that cute?

SPEAKER_06 26:00

Yeah, I'm sure you would like to know how to play chess. Everyone would.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

I know. I'm gonna learn, Mercedes. I'm really thinking that I should. So it sounds like you're very good at fast thinking. I'm learning a lot because I thought it was all about staying calm and thinking it through, but I think you probably are good at doing both to become such a good chess player.

SPEAKER_06 26:17

Yeah, I actually don't usually think it through. I just rely on instinct. And also on that, what you mentioned earlier in the cafe, in my bedroom I actually have a chess set built into my wall. Really? What does that mean? The board is painted onto the wall, and then there are cut-out pieces which are connected by Velcro so you can move them along the board.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

Oh, so you could play on the wall because they stick with Velcro. I was thinking, how in the world would it, you know, defy gravity like that? That's so cool. Do you actually play with it or just there for I play with it a few games?

SPEAKER_06 26:46

I actually haven't lost a game on that board.

SPEAKER_00 26:48

You play against yourself?

SPEAKER_06 26:50

No, I've played against plenty of people on that board. But it's not such a good board because it's hard to see the like the whole board. Also for outdoor big sets, they look nice, but you don't play as well on them because it's hard to look at the entire board at once.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

You mean like those like life-size pieces?

SPEAKER_06 27:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Yeah, I've seen those before. They're cool, but like you need to be able to look at the whole vision of it.

SPEAKER_06 27:11

If you go back too far, then you can't reach the pieces. It's just annoying to use. So they look nice, but they're not practical.

SPEAKER_00 27:18

You get a good workout running around. I feel like it's like a mushroom for life. Kind of like zoom out sometimes to like see everything to evaluate your next move. You know?

SPEAKER_07 27:27

Yeah.

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Wall Chess Set And Seeing The Whole Board

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Spectating Chess And Social Reactions

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Fair enough. I'm actually on the website right now, and it's so cool what you guys can do. Customize everything. You dream it, we make it. And now back to Danielle. I just want to ask you something about the tournament because I forgot. I've watched like tennis tournaments and basketball tournaments, and they're very exciting and there's cheering. When you have like the down to the wire of a chess tournament, like what are the fans doing? There's people watching.

SPEAKER_06 29:42

By the ones that I went to, there was barely any spectators. Like most of the spectators were just family. But by like bigger chess tournaments where there's spectators. I don't get it. I don't get why anyone will want to spectate that. Because you have a the better view online than you do in person. Especially when they're playing classical chess, which could be very long games, two, three, four hour games, or even longer. I don't get why anyone would spectate that in person.

SPEAKER_00 30:09

It would be hilarious. I'm like imagining diehard chess players being like, let's go, go, go, no, oh. Like, you know, like they're freaking out.

SPEAKER_06 30:16

Because you're not even allowed to chair there, because then the players need to focus.

SPEAKER_00 30:20

Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 30:21

That's why I don't get it at all.

SPEAKER_00 30:23

Yeah. Okay. Interesting.

SPEAKER_06 30:24

If I were what if I would watch any professional games, it would be online after the game happened, so I could go through it.

SPEAKER_00 30:31

Correct. And they probably would also give you a good view of the board. You would see like the whole board and you would understand the moves.

SPEAKER_06 30:37

You wouldn't be seeing the actual chess board. They'd just make another representation online of it. Right.

SPEAKER_00 30:44

That was just something I was wondering about because it was funny.

SPEAKER_05 30:46

We're gonna have to see Bishop takes a three here in just a moment. Wait, what? What? I I literally thought it was a DGQ. I was refreshing the board.

SPEAKER_04 30:56

Queen to D? And he leaves again. What are you doing? Down a pawn. Okay, this is this is just tilt.

SPEAKER_05 31:04

Because B3 is one of those where I mean you just it's impossible not to talk about.

SPEAKER_00 31:10

I'm just Have you ever been made fun of for being into chess?

SPEAKER_06 31:14

Yes, but usually I've like seen the opposite. People are usually like, wow, that's so cool. And it's a lot less common for people to be like, oh, you're so into chess, like don't you have anything else to do?

SPEAKER_00 31:25

Yeah. I mean, you should definitely be proud of it, but I'm just like wondering because I know that kids could be so mean sometimes. That would also be a big demonstration of maybe they feel like inadequate, like I'm not good enough. Not that they're jealous that you could play chess, but like jealous that you can excel at something, and then that would make somebody do that.

SPEAKER_06 31:43

But just curious to know if you've ever had that experience, because I could imagine that being one thing that I have experienced is let's say there are other people playing and I sit down to spectate, they'll be like, go away, because they don't want me to like say anything that they didn't realize. Like I could just be quiet and I'm like, I'm not saying anything, and they'll just be like, Go away, like no one needs your ideas or whatever, just go away and even if I'm just there.

SPEAKER_00 32:06

Because they think like you're gonna judge them, like you're too good for them. Like, not you. Like, we don't want you here.

SPEAKER_06 32:12

If I say like your move isn't good, which recently instead of like saying oh that your move is stupid, I've like always been like, Oh, these moves are Lama Metam Vidas, I don't like get them.

SPEAKER_00 32:21

What do you say? These moves are what?

SPEAKER_06 32:22

Lamila Metamidas. I just always be like, Oh, this move is Lamila Mitamidas, I don't understand what you're doing, and like, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:30

Well, that's not very nice. Well, I don't it's a challenge, you know, when you you're so good at it that like you're like, come on, you know, but it doesn't always come naturally to most people, right?

SPEAKER_06 32:39

I don't really like watching so much. I I much prefer playing. But sometimes also there are a few boards, but people don't want to play with me because they will there's some people who don't like losing games, like me, but so they don't want to play.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

Right. So you can understand why they wouldn't want to play with you.

SPEAKER_06 32:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:55

Don't think it personally, but I'm happy to hear that most people are actually pro and they think it's cool that you're doing it and they look up to it and it's something that they congratulate you for. Like cool, cool hobby, cool activity. That's great. It's really important that everybody feels like they can have something, something to do when they're bored, first of all, or when they want to feel good about themselves and have fun.

What Chess Teaches And Advice To Improve

SPEAKER_06 33:18

Yeah, chess is amazing. I like playing a lot. I need chess.

SPEAKER_08 33:21

So amazing.

SPEAKER_00 33:24

What has chess taught you? If you can tell me what you think you gain the most in your life from chess?

SPEAKER_06 33:30

Interesting question. Do you mean like in what ways has it improved your thinking?

SPEAKER_00 33:34

I mean, yeah. You know, about patience, about making decisions, you know, life.

SPEAKER_06 33:39

What would improve my memory maybe? Or it could be the other way around.

SPEAKER_00 33:43

That your good memory makes you good at chess.

SPEAKER_06 33:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:46

If someone thinks like chess is like boring, uh, why would I want to do that? What would you tell them?

SPEAKER_06 33:51

That you're just not good at it. Which isn't very nice, but it's true. I'm in general, like more like just brutally honest, like, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:01

Alright. What's one thing that you would tell a young chess player? You know, probably not a four-year-old, but you know, somebody who's seven, eight, nine, or whatever, however old they are. What would you want to tell them as a how how they're gonna get better? Whatever, whatever you feel you want to tell them.

SPEAKER_06 34:17

Review your games to see when you mess up and to work on those things specifically, especially in the opening stages where it's a lot easier to correct any mistakes.

SPEAKER_00 34:28

You mean in the beginning of the game?

SPEAKER_06 34:30

Yeah. It's called the opening. Like they're different openings. I usually play the King's Point opening, which is the most common with a lot of variations.

SPEAKER_08 34:39

Try, try, try again. Don't give up. I can, I can, I can.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

What's your dream with chess? Like, where do you go from here? What do you hope to accomplish?

SPEAKER_06 34:49

Maybe become a title player and get a lot better at blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 34:54

What's a title player?

SPEAKER_06 34:55

It's if you get a title from the the chess organization Thie Day. I've beaten some title players.

SPEAKER_00 35:02

Basically, like you become like a category in itself. Like you're the top tier.

SPEAKER_06 35:06

Yeah, and they're different titles. In order to get them, you have to play in thie Day tournaments, which I haven't done really.

SPEAKER_00 35:12

Mm-mm. Okay. Well, you have your work cut out for you. So tell me about this blindfolding business. What, how?

Titles Dreams And Blindfold Chess Explained

SPEAKER_06 35:18

So do you want to know how it works what blindfold Yeah. Well, firstly, what is blindfolding?

SPEAKER_00 35:24

Well, blindfolded means seeing the pieces.

SPEAKER_06 35:27

Blindfolded means that you you're not necessarily wearing a blindfold. It could be you're just looking away. You don't see the board and pieces. So you just have to memorize everything. The chessboard is eight by eight. There's coordinates on the pizza side is A, B, C, D until H, and then one, two, three until eight. So each square has a coordinate. So if you're looking away from the board, someone could tell you, let's say, for the first move, I move my pawn to E4, which is moving the king's pawn up two squares, and then I could be like, okay, I move my pawn to C5, and then they look at the board and see where that square is, and then they move it on the board. So the other players looking at a board and moving both set pieces, and they just tell me their move and I have to remember it.

SPEAKER_00 36:14

Wow. Do you have like a photographic memory then? You must.

SPEAKER_06 36:17

No, but when you remember what each piece is doing, it's a lot easier to remember what happened. Sometimes I forget and make big mistakes because of that.

SPEAKER_00 36:27

Wow. So you're basically playing a game of memory in your head. Do you close your eyes when you're doing it? Does that help you?

SPEAKER_06 36:34

One big difference by blindfolded is that in a normal game, I don't really care if there's distractions and spectators. In a blindfold game, I play a lot better when there's no spectators or anyone talking.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

No one watching, yeah, or talking. I mean, you're holding on to so much in your head. I would love to watch a game like that.

SPEAKER_06 36:51

The harder part about blindfolded isn't remembering where everything is. The harder part is remembering where all the pieces are aiming and trying to strategize without a visual.

SPEAKER_00 37:04

Wow, it's really hard. Especially for people who are visual learners. Like I'm a visual learner. I like to see things, you know what I'm saying? Like to be able to do that is really an unbelievable gift. It's so cool. But I'm sure you're also working hard at it. But like you said, sometimes you lose games like that because it's not perfect.

SPEAKER_06 37:19

You have to really try. Yeah, that's why I want to get better at that. But right now, I'm not that good at it. I didn't just like practice it a lot in order to get better. Once I I realized that I could play a game, a few hours later I could go through the game and remember the entire game. So then I'm like, wait, if I could do this, then I could do blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 37:36

I love how you're finding ways to challenge yourself. You're not just like, oh, best at chess in my family and in my class, and you're finding ways to become sharper and better.

SPEAKER_07 37:45

I could do better.

SPEAKER_00 37:52

You look like you have something you want to say.

SPEAKER_06 37:54

I was just thinking about blindfolded, about some of my blindfold games.

SPEAKER_00 37:59

You're remembering the moves?

SPEAKER_06 38:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:01

That was a good one. Remember when the D4 beat the F eight? I don't even know if that's a valuable.

SPEAKER_06 38:07

Yeah, sometimes people like to pretend certain things, like someone's like, can play blindfolded. So I'm like, okay, where's this square? And they have no idea. Or like other people. Then they make an illegal move on their second move or something.

SPEAKER_00 38:23

Oh gosh. Or for us. That's no fun. That's no fun. They're not good competition for you.

SPEAKER_06 38:27

But also sometimes in blindfolded, when I don't really remember things, I do a move which I'm not sure if it's illegal in order to see where were my pieces.

SPEAKER_00 38:37

Is that what you call it in test? Illegal? Like you're not allowed to do it, so it's illegal.

SPEAKER_06 38:41

If the move is illegal, then it's yeah, I illegal Is that like an Australia thing or everyone says that? Everywhere.

Playing Worldwide Staying Humble And Closing Challenge

SPEAKER_00 38:47

I'll have to ask the folks upstairs. Do you have family not in Australia that you've played against?

SPEAKER_06 38:51

Yeah. Saying people are good in my family.

SPEAKER_00 38:53

No, no, no. I'm saying, like, have you ever played with non-Australians in real life, not on the computer?

SPEAKER_06 38:59

Yeah, a year ago, actually. This was the last time I lost a game over the board. There was an Israeli soldier who was in Australia. He like spoke and he mentioned that he was a chess coach. So like I wanted to play with him, so I invited him over. And we were playing, and I won around a quarter of the games.

SPEAKER_00 39:17

But you did lose to him.

SPEAKER_06 39:19

Yeah, a quarter means you lost three quarters.

SPEAKER_00 39:22

Hmm. Well, well, given that, good for him. An Israeli soldier who's a good chess teacher. That's impressive. We'll let him have that win. But you have to get together, you have to do a rematch with him. I'd like to see you do a little better next time.

SPEAKER_06 39:34

Yeah, by now I'd probably be doing better because I got better. Also, more recently, I've played with uh the Schliach, who was by uh Chabad House for Israelis. I beat him every time. Also, and by Tishra, I went to Crown Heights.

SPEAKER_08 39:49

Mashedetto Crown Heights is calling your name.

SPEAKER_06 39:53

And I played here, so I wasn't playing against Australians.

SPEAKER_00 39:57

Okay, so you've got a lot of exposure and a lot of different opportunities.

SPEAKER_06 40:01

I actually beat some people, some bottom there, blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 40:04

I'd love to see videos of that. Do you have any?

SPEAKER_06 40:07

I have pictures. I don't think I have any videos of entire games.

SPEAKER_00 40:11

You should ask someone to do that because it would be really interesting to watch. For the listener, not because I'm saying about you, but you know, sometimes when we have these super talents that are so cool and so unbelievable and make us, you know, smarter and sharpen our minds. We have to like remember that like, you know, that we're all just human. We can sometimes fail at things. And sometimes when we're really good at it, we have to remember like we're not all that great. We're great, but we have to keep that humility balance, you know, like being humble and then also like feeling I got this and I'm so capable. It's really hard, especially when there's always people better than you. Yeah. Keep it in perspective. Yeah. Well, Danielle, this has been so interesting. And I know it sounds weird, but you're getting me in the mood of playing chess.

SPEAKER_06 40:55

Do you want to play a game blindfolded? I'll be blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 40:58

So I'm not ready for blindfolded. I'm not ready for it.

SPEAKER_06 41:01

If you want to be blindfolded, I'll be blindfolded.

SPEAKER_00 41:03

Yeah, but I would need somebody who's gonna like help me. Like, I need someone to play easy on me and like actually show me what to do. And I don't even know, like, I don't know the names of the pieces. Like, I don't know anything. Really? I know there's a rook and they're called pawns, and there's a king and a queen. Do you know the rest of the pieces? No. A bishop.

SPEAKER_06 41:21

Yeah, one more. There's one more.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

What did I not say? The horse.

SPEAKER_06 41:25

Yeah, you got all of them.

SPEAKER_00 41:27

Yay, barhasham. I'll have to let you know if I actually learn how. But I've learned a lot from you. So thank you for this conversation and keep following your dreams. You're incredible.

SPEAKER_06 41:37

Yeah, thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_00 41:39

It was my pleasure, and I'm fascinated to meet people from around the world. It's always, always fun. Cheerio. How do you say goodbye in Australian?

SPEAKER_06 41:47

Goodbye, and as we say in Aussie land, good day, mate.

SPEAKER_00 41:51

Good night, Might.

SPEAKER_06 41:52

No, it's good day.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

Good day, like me.

SPEAKER_06 41:56

Just with the accent, it's like good day.

SPEAKER_00 42:01

Okay, good night, mate.

SPEAKER_06 42:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:03

I didn't do it right. Good day, Might.

SPEAKER_06 42:05

I don't know how to do it properly either.

SPEAKER_00 42:07

Alright. Well, it sounded good. Well, good day, mate. Bye.

SPEAKER_06 42:10

Yeah, good eye. Bye.

SPEAKER_00 42:18

Okay, everybody. Let's think about this. What could be your thing? Maybe you already have a thing. Maybe you have a lot of things. Doesn't have to be chess, but it could be. It could be anything. Every kid deserves something that's yours, that's your own. Something that you could enjoy, something you could grow in, something that's building your confidence. And that thing could change. But how cool is it when it's something that you can continuously get better and better at? So your homework is this. Try something new this week. Or if you already have something that you love, spend a little extra time on it. Pay attention to what you enjoy, what challenges you, what makes you feel proud, what makes you feel more of you. Like if you're a creative person, choose something in that realm because you never know where one small hobby will take you.

SPEAKER_01 43:04

And if you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to follow, like, subscribe, all the things. It helps more people find this podcast, be part of the incredible kids community. And a big thank you again to every single one of you for being here. And of course, to We Play playsets.

SPEAKER_00 43:18

If you're looking to get your kids outside active, loving playtime, check them out at WHEESR.com, we sr.com for all of their incredible options. Thanks so much, everyone, for listening. And I look forward to schmoozing with you next time on Incredible Kids Podcast. Bye.

SPEAKER_09 43:36

Are you an incredible kid? Send your story too. I kidspodcast at gmail.com. Subscribe to the Incredible Kids Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 43:49

Thanks for listening. And remember, you are all incredible kids.