Euphoric Evolution

The Concrete Rose: Redefining Success After Rock Bottom

• Makhosi Hefisah Nejeser

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In this inspiring conversation, Jill Griffin shares her journey from addiction to becoming a heart-centered entrepreneur. She discusses the importance of authenticity, community support, and setting boundaries in both personal and professional life. Jill emphasizes that rock bottom can manifest in various forms and that true fulfillment comes from living authentically. She also highlights the significance of self-care and the role of surrendering to the process of growth. As she looks to the future, Jill aims to empower others through speaking engagements and continue making a positive impact in the mental health field.


Takeaways

  • Jill Griffin is a licensed clinical social worker and entrepreneur.
  • She transitioned from addiction to a successful business owner.
  • Rock bottom can manifest in various forms beyond substance abuse.
  • Authenticity fosters deeper connections with others.
  • Entrepreneurship requires a supportive community and asking for help.
  • Setting boundaries is crucial for personal and professional well-being.
  • Surrendering to the process allows for growth and healing.
  • Future aspirations include speaking engagements and empowering others.
  • Self-care and physical wellness are essential for sustained success.
  • Living authentically can lead to greater fulfillment and freedom.

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Makhosi (00:02.176)
All right, welcome back to Euphoric Evolution. And I'm here with Jill Griffin, who is an absolutely incredible heart centered entrepreneur. Also was a client of mine who I absolutely think is extraordinary and just a really great example of what it looks like to take your pain.

and turn it into purpose. And I feel like our conversation is going to be so inspiring because I think sometimes people are confused about how to find purpose, what they need to do in order to find it and then even build a business that can succeed off of it. So that's what we're going to dive into. Jill, welcome so much. How are you?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (00:55.054)
Good, thank you so much for having me. I've been so excited for this conversation.

Makhosi (00:59.712)
Yes, me too. So I want to dive straight in. Could you share a little bit about what you do? I know a lot of people think like, coaches only coach coaches. And I love that you are not a life coach specifically. So share a little bit about who you are and what you do.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (01:21.997)
Sure. So I am a licensed clinical social worker and licensed alcohol and drug counselor in the state of Connecticut. I am also a business owner and an entrepreneur. So I own a group practice. We have 15 staff right now. So we're all providing mental health substance abuse services to various people.

I also own another business where we do do coaching, but that looks a little bit different than your typical life coach. We are doing more mental health focused coaching, substance use focused coaching, and also family coaching. So helping the family systems support a person who's struggling with their mental health or substance use as it's usually what we consider a family disease. So those have been my primary.

jobs, I guess, over the last few years after I left the nonprofit and agency world. And I also have my hands in a couple other projects right now, but primarily for, you know, insurance -based or private pay programs for people who are struggling with a diagnosable mental health or substance use disorder.

Makhosi (02:36.16)
Yeah, yeah. So you're doing really incredible, impactful, also can be emotionally taxing work, right? Because holding space for people who really are struggling can be a challenge, right? And navigating team. So I'd love for you to share a little bit about your story. Like, did you grow up thinking one day...

One day I'm going to be an entrepreneur and have my own clinics. What was that process for you?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (03:12.906)
So an entrepreneur, no, but a little fun fact about me is I knew that I wanted to be a social worker as young as probably 14, which I don't think that, you know, I didn't grow up interacting with social workers. Although I did have a family member that was a social worker. And I just remember that I just knew that's what I was going to do. It wasn't like a question. So whether that was...

God -given purpose or whatever, but my path took a very, I did not take a straight and linear path to becoming a social worker. In fact, there were a lot of points in my journey I thought that it wasn't gonna be possible. So from around that same age, I really started getting heavy into drugs and alcohol. And I did graduate high school and I went on to college, but things got really rocky once I was in college and I was in,

I was actually in my first drug and alcohol rehab facility as a senior in high school. So I turned 18 in that facility. I did not stay sober when I got out. But I really struggled with wanting to kind of not be present, right? Like struggling with those emotions, struggling with wanting to just be the life of the party until like my...

my addiction, really nobody wanted to be around me anymore. So what that looked like is eventually I ended up dropping, I transferred schools, I ended up dropping out of college. I was offered treatment by my family and I politely refused. And for a long time, I used to say like, you know, my parents kicked me out, but the reality was I chose to be homeless for a couple of years after that, really kind of like,

struggling with the addiction. I think the drugs and the alcohol were the priority for me for a long time. And I think one of those, there's a lot of thoughts on addiction. And I think one of those thoughts is, well, you should be able to just stop, right? And I think sometimes people get to a point where not using is not an option and using becomes less and less of an option as well.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (05:32.071)
So I went through, you know, sleeping on park benches, sleeping in abandoned buildings with or without running water. I went to jail in a couple of different states. I was arrested no less than eight times. At one point, I was considered a convicted felon. I no longer am anymore. But I, you know, I went to jail for six months and I think this is the insanity of addiction is that I remember sitting in a jail cell and being like, all right, like the gigs up.

I can't keep living my life like this, but I didn't stay sober when I got out. Like you would think that's a rock bottom. You would think, you know, okay, I've lost everything. I've given up everything. Like this is no longer working, but the pull of that, that, that chemical change that happens in our brains, like we lay the foundation, especially since I was using at an early age, our brains aren't fully developed until we're 26. So like my brain.

had pathways to keep using, right? To keep, so I thankfully, you know, had hit my personal rock bottom, which is basically like, I just couldn't do it anymore, right? I had to surrender to like, this life isn't working anymore. And at 24, I got sober. I had some friends that had gotten sober and kind of led me down that path of recovery. And so I've been sober now for 14 and a half years. And so,

Makhosi (06:32.416)
Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (06:58.917)
You know, the journey obviously has gone on and on since then. I think, you know, you talk about this a lot, like that healing happens in layers and there's been a lot of layers. I think becoming a parent definitely highlighted a lot of those layers for me. But, you know, my path to where I am now would not have been possible without like the people supporting me, people encouraging me and me learning that like I'm worth it. Like I can do these things because when you come from that background where you're,

You're controlled by a substance. I mean, literally everything you do is dictated by getting the next fix, so to speak, right? And that does something to your self -esteem and your sense of self.

Makhosi (07:42.912)
Yeah, yeah. I am.

I was so moved the first time that I heard your story, mainly because I always think about, because I'm just surrounded by so many amazing people who have.

Makhosi (08:10.912)
been victim to or perceived themselves as victim to various substances. And my father struggled until his last breath with alcohol. In fact, I remember going to clean out his apartment afterwards and we had a very...

a very tension oriented relationship because of the substances and I even now have family members who struggle and.

I always think about our judgment of, you know,

why people become addicted to substance of any form and even more the way that we limit people based off of their past and how they've shown up to a certain point. And can you share a little bit more about, because we always hear like this term rock bottom and I wanna talk about that because I think,

Any of us can have rock bottom. Some of us are, right, like workaholics is a real thing, right? But that's a socially acceptable and even praised form of.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (09:31.425)
for sure.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (09:38.433)
I would say a lot of recovered alcoholics and addicts tend to be workaholics, in fact.

Makhosi (09:43.712)
Isn't that an interesting correlation?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (09:46.785)
Like there is a there, you know, we just move our isms to something else.

Makhosi (09:52.832)
right and it's like which some it's like is it helpful to me or is it just me swapping one ism for another ism and some of them are just more celebrated yeah

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (10:05.825)
Well, I think it's the dopamine. Yeah, it's the dopamine hits. It's the cortisol spike. It's like we get addicted to that chaos. Honestly, I think a lot of people, a lot of people get addicted to that lifestyle. You're still ripping and running in a sense when you're addicted to your work.

Makhosi (10:24.864)
Yeah, yeah, I had a genetic test of some sort done recently and it was showing all of these markers with like a propensity for dopamine addiction, right? But I was so thankful that it actually broke down all the different ways that that could show up. It's like, hey, this might not show up as just alcohol or just drugs, right? Like it could show up in hustling.

It didn't say it like that, but where was I going with that? I had a question and I forgot it.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (11:04.671)
I'm not sure either.

Makhosi (11:07.104)
I know where I was going with that. The rock bottom, yes. So rock bottom, because for, we talk about that in terms of drugs, but what are some of the other ways that you see like rock bottom show up for people? Because I'll tell you, like, to be honest, I see some people and I'm like, okay, that's gotta be rock bottom. How does someone know when they've hit rock bottom?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (11:09.087)
when you talk about rock bottom. Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (11:33.886)
So I think for me, there's a saying that in the recovery community people say where it's like, you know, you think you've hit rock bottom and then, you know, the floor comes out and there's another level underneath, right? So like rock bottom for me and the way I explain it to families or clients I work with is like, it's when you're at a point where you're able to surrender and say enough's enough. Like you don't have to continue suffering.

Like you can have pain and you can have those things, but if you're continuing to participate in it, then you're kind of just, now you're suffering. You know, there is a way out. And I think what happens is, for me, the rock bottom is like when you're spiritually bankrupt, when you're just unable to connect meaningfully with anybody anymore, like you're kind of like alone. And I frame it that way because I do think, and I see a lot of people,

They might have successful careers. They may have a family. They may have like from the outside looking in, right? They're doing well, but they're suffering. And I think Rock Bottom is the place where you're able to now accept some meaningful help to get somewhere different. Because I think from my point of view, before I get to Rock Bottom, I'm still trying to make this work. I'm still trying to make this way of life work.

whether it's the hustle, whether it's the relationships, whether it's the substance use, like whatever it is, I'm still trying to be in my own. I'm coming from a real ego centered place. I'm not letting any spiritual guidance come in. I'm not letting other people try to help me. I'm trying to do this all on my own. And from my experience, whether you're an alcoholic or an addict or just a person in this life, like if you're trying to do things on your own without some spiritual guidance, like for me,

That hasn't worked out well in my experience.

Makhosi (13:31.584)
Yeah, thank you for sharing it from that lens because I, you know, I don't support people specifically through the depths of, you know, drugs and alcohol recovery and that amazing work that you're doing. However, so many of the people that I've worked with are on the outside successful, right? And have gotten accolades and reached certain achievements.

and still feel hollow, like the work that they're doing isn't from a place of like, this is a calling, or they feel kind of like spiritually bankrupt. And even if the checking account is looking good, they are still suffering. And that's a challenging thing, because I don't see a lot of people talk about it. And also people don't have compassion for that. Like...

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (14:06.01)
Mm -hmm.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (14:30.586)
I think abundance shows up in many forms, right? Like whatever's in your bank account, like, yeah, that's helpful. It's nice. I like to have money in my bank account that I can spend on what I want. But my, I have been completely abundant and grateful along this path from when I first got sober and had, I don't even, I don't even know if I had a checking account, honestly. Like I know I couldn't get a job. I know I had to like ask somebody to help me.

place me in a position because no one would hire me. Like that's where this journey started. So like, I've been grateful and felt abundant in so many ways, even though like on paper, people probably thought I had nothing because that that's kind of where like I started from, right? Like it was hard for me to to be financially independent, to stand on my own two feet. But for me,

If you have all those things, but you're going home at night and you're in a house full of people or a room full of people are getting those accolades and you feel alone, that's a sign of spiritual bankruptcy to me. Like that's a sign that you're having trouble connecting and with the outside world that you're so stuck in self that you can't see all the blessings around you or that maybe this isn't what you're meant to be doing. And it's a really scary leap to say like,

I'm doing really well on paper, no one's gonna understand this, but I can't keep doing this anymore. And I think just to piggyback that off of substance use, I mean, there's a lot of people in this world that you wouldn't even know struggle with substances because it's such a private thing or their mental health. They keep it to themselves, they keep it private because they think nobody's gonna understand. And there's a lot of like, well, are people gonna like me if I'm not drinking anymore? Are people gonna like me if I tell them I have this problem?

And to me, that's just, you know, you mentioned being heart -centered in the beginning. Like, that's not living in a heart -centered way if you can't show up as your authentic self in rooms with people.

Makhosi (16:32.704)
Yeah, yeah. my gosh. So true. You know, one of the things for me that I realized on this journey, when I was making the transition from I'm gonna go to med school, I'm gonna, I'm going to be the, be what everybody says success means. I started reflecting on this moment back in my pageant days.

where, I know I learned so much from beauty pageants, but this moment really shifted so much for me because I was competing and I was getting ready to go to compete for Miss West Virginia. And I had had a photo shoot and went the next day to pick up my pictures. And the day before when I had shown up to the photo shoot, I had this.

elaborate weave in and I'm not hating on weave. I think weave is beautiful and it's amazing. However, it had fallen out because it was very like I was a college student. I didn't have money for good hair, right? And I showed up to pick up my pictures in my natural state. And my pageant director gasped like audibly was like and taken aback by my hair, by my natural hair.

and said to me, you're a queen now. You need to always look like a queen. And after I sat with that for a little while, I realized, I was like, wait, why am I doing this if I can't be myself? If, yeah, sure, I'm getting accolades and I'm getting attention and visibility and promoting great causes and yada, yada, yada. I was doing all of these things.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (18:27.604)
which gives you that dopamine hit.

Makhosi (18:29.824)
Boom, boom, boom. I love a dopamine hit, right? Might have just been more socially acceptable and praised versions, but that doesn't make them healthy. And I realized, by the way, when I stopped doing those pageants, guess what? None of those people came with me. None of those people.

stayed connected to me. And that's one of the most terrifying pieces of it, right? Because we have people in our life and we have a fear of like, if I go after what is truly me, right? What if I allow myself to be myself and then everyone falls away? But how miserable is it to have a bunch of people around you that...

don't actually love you for you.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (19:30.292)
Well then on the flip side of that, it's like, well, what if you're kind of cheating yourself of all the people that are along your path if you go down that path? Like, we don't always have to leave behind the people that don't believe in our authentic versions of ourselves or the naysayers, right? But you're limiting yourself to what's out there for you to receive. But you're not willing, you know, we allow our fear to get in the way of stepping out into that faith and...

see what's on the other side.

Makhosi (20:01.408)
You know, the other thing that I've noticed too is sure there were people that fell away, but when I stepped into allowing myself to fully be myself, the people who did matter, the people who like really were there for me, our level of connection became so much deeper because I was bringing all of me, right? And...

then they started feeling like they had permission to be all of them instead of us like pretending on the surface level that we are this way, that we are not. And I had such a fear of losing connections, but ultimately what I gained was deeper levels of intimacy and deeper levels of connection with the people that really did matter, but also,

it's been able to magnetize so many amazing people that there's no way that I would have attracted them into my life before. Yeah. I also am very curious because you're coming from a background that you were experiencing homelessness for a period of time. You were essentially living day to day.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (21:08.176)
Absolutely.

Makhosi (21:28.032)
I'm just envisioning. I don't think that you were planning. I don't envision that you were, I have a five year plan when the next hit was like the thing. And then you come out and go through your own process and you get into nonprofit work. I'm just curious about what are some of the shifts that you've made?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (21:30.704)
Minute to minute sometimes.

Makhosi (21:56.832)
in order to create the level of success that you have created.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (22:05.712)
So I guess the answer to that question is going back to that. I mean, to me, I felt like a little girl when I was 24. I guess I'm a little older now. 24 is young. When you're 24, you think, my god, I'm missing out on everything. I haven't graduated college yet. I'm so behind the ball. And I meet with clients now. I'm like, 24, you have your whole life ahead of you. You're so young. But I remember feeling really ashamed having to have somebody help me.

place me in a job and I really, I think, and I heard somebody speak recently on this where they were saying how like, you have to believe wholeheartedly that no matter what is in your past, no matter what barriers in the way that you're going to figure out a way to be successful anyway. And I don't think I thought of it that clearly like that, but I just went after it. Like,

I got a job in a nursing home. I was like, there's these CNAs here. I'm going to go to CNA school. I got my CNA license. They put me on overnight. And along the way, there would be people that would say, you know, but you have a record. They're not going to let you do this. You have to pass a background check. Well, I'm going to do it anyway. You know, they know who I am. They see me working in this facility. Like, I'm going to prove them. I'm going to be the exception to the rule. You know, I think you hear it all the time, especially for people who have a felony background.

that there's no opportunities out there for you. You're not going to be able to get a job. Your life's ruined. And the reality is, if you find the right people and you get in the right circles and you go after it, you stay on the right path, and you are determined to change your life, your life's going to change. It's not just me that I've seen that happen for. I've seen that happen for other people as well. We are able to change. I'm not that person I was when I was arrested. I'm just not that person anymore.

And so I think like little by little, as I kept healing and figuring out like, okay, like sobriety, recovery and sobriety are a real central piece of my life now. And I just went after it. I went on to get my associate's degree. Then I went and finished my bachelor's degree. Then I went on to get my master's degree. And, you know, I think little by little, my sense of self, my identity changed along the way. Like there was a part where I was

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (24:28.684)
really closely identified to that sobriety part and it's not a part that I hide now. It's certainly a core piece of my identity but that's not all I am now. I think for a long time I was trying to prove to myself like that I wasn't that person whereas like now today I know I'm not that person. Like I've lived two separate lives now.

Makhosi (24:48.032)
Yeah, yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (24:49.451)
So now I think what shaped me the most to go after and to like allow me to expand to where I am now success wise. I had a job right before COVID where I was in a pretty, you know, a pretty big position. I'm in leadership. And I got to the place where I couldn't be my authentic self anymore. Right. I couldn't show up in those spaces the way I wanted to. My ideas weren't really being.

honored or heard. And I remember getting to this point, like, I had young children at the time, I had a young, I had two young children at home. And I remember thinking, do I really want to be on call 24 seven? Do I want to be answering calls in the middle of the night when I'm still waking up with babies and nursing them? Do I want to be like, do I want to be hustling like this? Like, is this really what the goal is?

And I said, no, so I quit my job. I had not really a plan to follow. I had six private practice clients at the time. Like I had already started my business, but I didn't start the business to quit my job. I just started to start seeing clients on the side. So like there was no parachute. It was just like, all right, I'm done with this. Thankfully, I have a supportive husband. And so I left and.

you know, people that know me now and running this business and how many clients we serve. And, you know, we serve over 500 clients now. And it's like, no, this started with just me in a little room with six clients. And, you know, I built it. But even when I did that, that was before COVID. That was, you know, obviously the healthcare landscape changed dramatically, you know, after that. But there was no intention to like build a group practice. There was no intention to be a business owner. I was just...

going to figure it out. But this was not the plan to figure it out. So I guess like, for me, it's like you make plans and God laughs. I the five year plan, I may have an idea now of what I'm going to do in five years. But one thing that you've taught me, Makosia is like, you may be limiting yourself of what like the universe has for you in five years, right? Like, I can't really, if I look back five years from today,

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (27:12.041)
I couldn't have imagined I would be in the position I am today. So what I can envision is self -limiting because I can't imagine what that's gonna be. So I think the biggest evolution that I've experienced is over the past few years where I'm like, all right, what do I need to do to show up to like have the most meaningful connections, show up as the mother that my children need for me?

while also having an income so that we can have the things we need. Travel is super important to me. I like traveling multiple times a year. So like, that's kind of what I try to make my money for so I can go away when I want to go away. You know, but ultimately it's like, I have to show up and have, for me, it's all about how my nervous system is, right? Like, and how, you know, you talk about having the capacity, right?

If I cannot be in a good place with myself, if I'm not living authentically, if I'm not able to show up wherever I need to show up and not feel like I'm almost imprisoned by my business or if I'm limited by my business or I don't want to feel like that. I want to feel like I have options and I get to, you know, do what I want to do when I want to do it. Like that's to me, the freedom of owning a business.

But again, like I had to really get out of that agency mentality, the employee mentality of like, well, no, you clock in at this time, you leave it this time, you do whatever they say. And it's like, I really had to break myself out of that mold, which I feel like your program really helped me with. Like, no, how do I want this to look? Like, why don't I create how I want it to look versus what it's supposed to look like?

Makhosi (29:04.992)
Yeah, I think the biggest opportunity that I see right now is we have to reinvent how things look, right? Because it's not, most of us left companies of some sort because we were so limited and not able to be ourselves, not able to prioritize things that really do.

matter in the grand scheme, right? Like our children, our marriages, our mental health, our wellbeing, like those sorts of things really do matter. And I get so lit up about this work because number one, this is why you go into business, right? You don't go into business to build a golden cage for yourself. But I see so many entrepreneurs.

thinking like, I have to do things this way because that's how it was always done, or that's how I've seen it done, or that's how this coach told me it has to be. And instead looking at, no, who are you? What are your values? What matters to you? How does your energy work? And how can you structure your business to be in alignment and allow for you to take the trips?

for you to, you know, pick your kids up from school when they're sick and not have to worry about everything just falling apart because you're not there, right? Those sorts of considerations, but it takes actually pulling back and working on the business, meaning visioning and feeling into like, like you said, five -year plans I never create.

a five year. Honestly, I don't even have a one year.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (31:05.155)
I have some plans, but it's like, we'll see. Like, that's what I think I want to do. Yeah.

Makhosi (31:09.824)
They're kind of, yeah, it's kind of loose. It's like a direction, right? I use the term scaffolding all the time and in lots of ways. People get tired of hearing me say that, but scaffolding is such a powerful visual. But I look at like, what is this season of life? What is the season of life that I'm in? And I think it's really important for mothers. I'm going to just say this right now because I've been an entrepreneur since my son.

was one. As a mother, and you were a young mom when you, you know, you had two littles when you went on this adventure,

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (31:47.714)
Mm -hmm.

Makhosi (31:52.32)
The seasons change so fast with little ones. And my first business I essentially built on the toilet. Like I literally was on the toilet.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (32:07.809)
Yeah, we do it when we can.

Makhosi (32:09.824)
messaging and like, it's nap time, I'm going to connect with some potential clients, right? Like that's how I built my business then. It looks different now. Now I'm in like a homeschooling season and that requires something different, but also.

Having kids teaches you so much about your plans. You're not gonna get the kid you think that you're gonna get. They're not gonna be doing the things that you think that they're gonna be doing at certain stages. Their personality might need something different than what you thought that they were going to need. And you've gotta be able to surrender. I'm curious.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (32:44.841)
yeah.

Makhosi (32:57.376)
I'm curious about what do you feel like some of the things are that you've been able to like deepen into surrender more.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (33:07.712)
I actually just, I actually was just talking about this today because I'm in a pretty critical point with one of my businesses in terms of launching soon. And, and, I had this moat, like I've been all spun up, all spun up. I get on this like, all right, we're in task mode. This is my anxiety coming out. What are the lists? Got to make the list. Got to do lists. And then it's like, hold on. It's like, I had to have an epiphany moment with myself and it's like, you need to chill out. Like,

Everything is going to get done, right? But like, I at least have the awareness net. Like I still go through the process, but now it's like deepening into the relationship with myself. Like, okay, this is just about you being triggered by fear. There's some fear here. What's the fear? Let's go deeper into that. Let's uncover what that is. Let's talk about it out loud. And thankfully, like I have relationships with the partners I work with or my staff where I can say like, sorry, I...

sorry I was acting like that, like this is actually the crazy going on in my mind right now, like I'm just freaking out about this, that and the other. And even saying it out loud, it's like embarrassing sometimes, but it's like, again, I'm then modeling for my staff or my partners, like it's okay. You have to just kind of dump that out sometimes because I think, again, going back to that authentic self, if you're not able to say those things, then you're stuffing it, then you're carrying it, then you're.

you're exploding in some other way when you get home or projecting it onto your spouse or your kids or because you can't say it at work. So I've really gotten deep into like, okay, what's happening right now that we're having this reaction because it's not just things need to get done. There's always things to do. I have a running list of things on my to -do list that some of them have been there for six to eight months.

and they might stay there for another six to eight. And what eventually happens if they've been there that long, it's not that important and I don't need to do it. And I just take it off. So that's how my to -do lists work. I think the other way that I've gotten really deep is like, you know, children are a really good mirror.

Makhosi (35:03.392)
I love it.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (35:12.413)
of things you need to focus on or work on or do differently. And then when you get to having a tween, who is your mini -me, they start telling you those things. So it's not just, it's a talking mirror. So I think like becoming a mother was one of those huge identity shifts for me and like becoming deeper into like,

Makhosi (35:30.624)
Hahaha!

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (35:40.444)
nurturing, which like for me, I am a very intense personality, I think like I, I'm more of an alpha personality. I own the room whenever I walk into one. It's just who I was born natural leader. Like if you go back in my report cards from when I was in elementary school, that's what it would say, you know, which really meant I talked too much, or boss the teacher around, which again, my daughter is now doing so, you know, so like,

Makhosi (36:01.184)
No.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (36:10.94)
I've had to really like hone some of those natural abilities while also not like, I think going deeper into just who I am, right? Like I have all these hats now. When do I pull this hat out? When do I put it down and don't pick it up again until next week? When I wasn't really able to do that. And I think when you're an employee, when you're an agency work and you're being told what to do, when to do it, how to do it, it's like.

Now I can be like, listen, I'm off the clock. Like don't need me unless it's an emergency. Like I have really deepened my relationship with my boundaries over the last few years. And I think having kids really allowed me to do that because I'm like, listen, I'm not trying to answer this phone if I don't want to. I got a crying kid. My husband's traveling. They need to eat. Like I'm not trying to have a phone call about work and you not even caring that I have a crying kid in the back. Like.

I want to be in business and be in partnership and work with people who are going to say, sounds like you're busy right now, why don't you call me back? Not just like go on and talk to me about your problem. I'm having some problems here, okay? I can't talk right now. And now, I just don't answer the phone, like, I'll call you back when I can, you know? So that's like the evolution of my boundaries because before it's like, no, if I don't pick up the phone, like, that's going to be a bad mark on me, they're going to think I can't do the work and like,

Makhosi (37:18.176)
Hahaha!

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (37:33.946)
always worried about how my actions were going to be perceived by others when it's like, I don't need to explain my boundaries to people. Like there are certain times when I'm off the clock, there are certain times I'm not available. I'm not going to explain why I'm traveling again because I get a, you're going away again. Yes, I am. That's my energy flow. I go hard for, for six to eight weeks and then I got to pull it back and take a break. That's my energy cycle.

Makhosi (37:49.66)
Yes.

Makhosi (37:58.016)
Yeah, yeah, I love the conversation around boundaries and really like cranking those up. One that was really challenging for me was leaving texts on read because I used to be like, when cell phones came out, now I'm aging myself, when cell phones, not just when they came out, but when they were kind of like,

normalized for everyone and everyone had unlimited text plans, right? Because I remember a time where you had to pay per text, right? And people were sending them and you could only call them after 7 PM or 9 PM depending on what carrier you had. That was a long time ago. But I remember when the idea of a text message came out and it was just kind of normalized for everyone, there became this really weird expectation.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (38:32.152)
Pay per text.

Makhosi (38:54.367)
of people of like, well, you can even text from the toilet, right? Like you, you don't have to pick up the call, but now you should be even more accessible. And I think that when you have already a pattern of constantly trying to prove yourself, constantly over giving and showing up when you probably, like all of that, right?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (39:18.584)
People pleasing.

Makhosi (39:23.648)
me allowing myself to look at a text and read it and then pause for two seconds and think, is this the most important thing for me to be doing at this exact moment? And if it's not, I do not respond to you. And I don't care if you're my mom, I don't care if you're my husband, I don't care if you're my son, I will leave my son, because he's got a phone now, you know, that tween age. He will sometimes text me and I will leave it on read.

And just because that tool is there, where I could be accessible, doesn't mean I have to be. And it also goes two ways, like both ways, right? Because I experience, because I support so many people, I see people who have people -pleasing patterns sometimes coming with expectations that I should be available all the time, because they are being available.

the time and so I get to show up and embody that no actually You don't you can communicate This is when I'm available. This is what to expect from me and That can be it Period period how do you how have you allowed yourself to? Receive deeper levels of support you mentioned a little bit about that in

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (40:36.182)
Yeah.

Makhosi (40:51.904)
you know, your journey to becoming sober. But how did that translate when you shifted from being the employee to the entrepreneur who is now, you know, who now has a team and partners?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (41:03.893)
So I would say that when I embarked on the entrepreneur, unbeknownst to me, I'm like, I just hung my shingle. I'm thinking I'm just seeing a couple clients. But unbeknownst to me, I'm running a business now. And so I called on a lot of people for support. I mean, I've really, I've deepened a lot of relationships with some of them, but I think...

Being humble and knowing that you don't have all the answers is like a really great gift to have if you're going to be an entrepreneur because in the entrepreneurial space, there are so many connections between us all who like we're giving out advice, we're giving out support, we're checking in with people because we know like in different phases of growing or growing, starting, keeping a business like...

it requires different levels of support. And I think if you get into the right crowds of people who are willing to give that support, but I had to get out of the mindset of like, I'm bothering somebody. It's like, listen, I need to ask the questions or I need to reach out to these people. If they want to help me, they will. If they don't, they won't. Like I can't, I got to leave the ball in their court, but I can't stop myself from asking the question. And I frankly wouldn't be where I am today if I didn't have those people like,

pointing me in the right direction, giving me the answers, connecting me with a consultant that I could use. You know, a lot of the professional relationships I have now and the people that support me, whether it's accountants, financial advisors, like you're neat, the more money you make, the more people you need. That's just, sometimes I meet with people who have businesses and I'm like, wait, you don't have this? No, you need this person now. You can't be doing all this. You need another person. And so I think...

Makhosi (42:52.0)
Yes, you do.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (42:54.642)
I think I learned that a lot from going through your program, right? Like I can't continue to scale and work on the business. If I'm doing all these tasks that I can, I need to trust that my staff can handle it and I need to train them to do it. And, you know, I met with some people on my team over the past couple of weeks and we were just kind of like amazed with how much, how far we've come with like handing off some of these responsibilities. I honestly don't have to do much in my business.

I can do as much or as little as I want now because my team takes care of it. You know, I still show up and I'm participating in certain things, but when I go away, I'm away. And it's just like clockwork here. Nobody blinks an eye because they're holding me up. But on the flip side of that, I modeled that support in -house so that if you have stuff with your family, if you need to move your schedule around, if you, you know, you have that flexibility, I want people to take care of their...

themselves, right? The other way I think, and you talk a lot about like your relationship with your husband sometimes, I think like I've had to get really clear on asking my husband for certain support and what's and tell him what's not supportive sometimes like, hey, this, you know, this feels like you're offering me support, but not really receiving this as support. Like, this is maybe a different way that would be more helpful.

You know, and also the support, I have to say, like, I have a very intense routine of taking care of my body and my soul. Sleep is really important. I exercise five times a week. I'm very disciplined with moving my body. I take, you know, my supplement regimen. Like, I have an autoimmune disorder. Like, I...

I cannot be stressed out, high cortisol levels, burnt out, stressed out, tired. That's not gonna work well for me. So if I'm not utilizing those supports for my physical wellness too, the wheels will fall off really quickly. Yeah, yes. And the older you get, the more that...

Makhosi (44:59.176)
Yeah, and they're hard to put back on once they fall off.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (45:06.575)
If you're not optimized physically, like you're not going to show up in a good way mentally and you're not. So that's a big way. So like I have other support people, whether it's physical therapists, craniosacral therapists, you know, spiritual advice. Like there's like a whole mind, body and soul outside of business, right? That keeps you in the right head space to want to get up and do this every day. Because I have to tell you, I...

There are not many days in my life where I wake up and I'm like, I don't want to work today because it's not really work. Like I don't I'm just doing what I'm supposed to be doing. I'm waking up. I'm showing up. That's that's what's going on. I don't I.

Makhosi (45:42.592)
Yes.

Makhosi (45:48.064)
Yes, so good, so good. That's the thing. I'm having to reorient certain conversations that I've had because I feel like what got lost in translation in a lot of spaces and what you're speaking to, which is so important, is I've taught a lot about the concept of doing less.

And what a lot of people perceived that to mean was like, because you hate what you're doing, you try and get out of it as much as possible, right? But no, what I really, what I think is so important is that we quote unquote do less, meaning we take things off of our plate that either don't matter, because so many people are just.

Like your to -do list, they're just trying to get as much done off the to -do list that doesn't necessarily matter. Doesn't necessarily move the needle forward. Doesn't really have an impact. Isn't even necessarily what they want, right? But really focusing on what are the things that matter so that you can be lit up. And I mean, I get pulled from my bed in the mornings to do what I do. And yes, do I...

Am I blessed in not having to work 60 hours a week? For sure. But part of that is because I don't try and do all of the things. It's like, what are the things that really matter? And those are like, that's, we want to be lit up from within to go and create and have an impact and do amazing things in the world. Create.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (47:31.565)
Mm -hmm.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (47:45.196)
Yeah, people have asked me lately, especially with like the addition of this new business coming online. And I've had a couple of conversations where people are like, man, you must be like really tired and working all the time. And like, how are you doing all these things? How do you have so much time? And it's like, I don't think you under, like, I'm really not working that much. Like you have to remember, like I'm coming from an agency setting where I was salaried.

I'm probably working 50 hours at least, then I'm on call, then I'm being pulled into the facility sometimes off hours. Like it was never a 40 hour week. I'm working at least 60 hours altogether. Plus I've always had a second job. I've, even now, I mean, technically I'm having my hand in several businesses. So it's like, I, I never just worked one job. So I tell people now, I'm like, I work less now than I think I ever have.

Makhosi (48:32.416)
Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (48:41.387)
And that's not to say that I'm not working hard, but it's more focused work. I'm more intentional with the way I spend my time, partly because I have to be. My kids get off the bus or they have sports to be at. I'm going to be present. I'm going to be coaching. I'm going to be where they need me to be. So I'm not working through dinner. I'm not working. I'm certainly not working after 9 p because that's my bedtime. And...

Makhosi (49:05.184)
I'm sorry.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (49:08.491)
If it didn't get done, tomorrow's a new day. That's just kind of like my mentality. Nothing is really that urgent. There are very few things I've learned over the past couple of years that are so urgent that you can pull me away from my family to do it. If I ask myself, can this wait till tomorrow and it can, then that's what it's gonna do. And my team knows that. There are times where I'm like, hey, haven't gotten to that yet. No big deal. Get to it when I get to it.

Makhosi (49:30.08)
Yeah.

Makhosi (49:35.328)
I'll get to it when I get to it. Right? I will never, the thing that like really shifted all of this for me was being in the bush in West Africa. Because up until that point, it was like, we need to try and cram as much as we can in a day, right? We need to do all of the things and make sure that stuff gets done and everything needs to have a specific time and yada, yada, yada. And then I had this experience of being there and just being in awe.

of all of the things that were getting done. And like nobody had a timer, no one had, like there weren't clocks around, but so many things were happening and also so much rest was also happening. Like it was just like built in to the day and it wasn't a, we have to make ourselves take 10 minute break here. It was just.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (50:14.696)
Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (50:24.68)
Yeah.

Makhosi (50:35.04)
Like, okay, if it matters, we will do it. And if it doesn't, then it wasn't that important for us to do and maybe tomorrow, right? And then I came home and realized like, hey, that's part of why so many of us are just really dysfunctional in the way that we approach life.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (50:55.591)
yeah. The concept of rest. When I when I throw that out there, like, well, why don't you just take a I can't possibly take a break. That's not I have this to do and I have this to do. And I was like, well, you seem pretty stressed out doing all these things. Like, I think maybe taking some stuff off your plate, you know, like this is one of the most common. But unfortunately, what happens and this is where I think, you know, coaching is great. But obviously, I'm a therapist. So I'm always like, listen, like.

Makhosi (51:14.336)
Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (51:24.038)
Maybe a lot of people, it's a trauma response. A lot of these people pleasing behaviors, a lot of these, you know, being addicted to chaos and wanting to always be, also the stress, like being in this like hyper vigilant state all the time, always, you know, heightened state. You know, a lot of it is like, you haven't dealt with some stuff. There's some stuff that you need to deal with because you're,

you're being led and you're embodying this version of yourself that's like putting so much pressure on yourself. But really, it's not that's how we are meant to be doing. I know you think you need to be doing this, but you don't need to be. But somehow we have to unwind. I call them protectors. So when somebody goes through some trauma or some childhood chaos or all these pick up all these isms, you pick up these protectors, right? That workaholism, all these things that we...

protect ourselves because you know maybe we feel insecure, we feel inferior, we feel like we're going to be hurt, we don't trust other people. So we put up these protectors of like I'm successful, I'm good, I got this, I can, I'm worthy, I'm all these things but you don't really believe it, you just want other people to see that you do. So that's where like that inner healing really needs to take place so like you can give yourself permission to rest. For some people sitting down to rest is like

they're suffering because they can't get this to turn off. They can't, they cannot relax. That's like my favorite thing to do, honestly. But there's also an energy flow to that. I'm a generator and there are times where, yes, I have the ability to rest right now and relax in space, but like there's something that I'm...

Makhosi (53:05.023)
Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (53:15.428)
grinding on right now that I have to acknowledge and I have to just get out some in some form or fashion. That's why I have a lot of notes on my phone and a lot of documents on my phone of just purging what's in there so I can get it somewhere.

Makhosi (53:21.792)
Yeah.

Makhosi (53:31.648)
I can relate. I can relate to that. I think the nuance in the conversation that so many of us aren't having is knowing what is the right medicine at the right time. Knowing when something has become such a pattern that you cannot deviate from it. That deviating from it feels so uncomfortable.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (53:32.544)
You

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (53:45.956)
Absolutely.

Makhosi (54:00.544)
that you just can't do it. That is when, okay, you know what your medicine is. If you struggle with taking five minutes to literally just be, there's your medicine, right? That's really what you need to do. And if you've been someone who's been really unmotivated, right? Then where is the medicine in that? Well, no, it doesn't. In fact,

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (54:25.124)
and medicine doesn't always taste good.

Makhosi (54:29.664)
Like when does it taste good, right? We have to add all sorts of artificial flavors to make medicine palatable. It's usually not good, but it's like good for you, right? So being aware of that. Before we wrap up, I'm super curious. I'd love to, I wanna know like what's coming? What's next from Jill? Not five -year plan, but in the near future.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (54:34.213)
Yeah. Yeah.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (54:58.785)
So in the near future, well, I have the new business Waterview Behavioral Health is set to open next month, which it's been a long journey getting this program. But I'm really proud of my partners and I for getting this to this point, because in healthcare, you have to jump through licensing hoops and accreditation and insurance and on and on and on. So we got it. We got here. You know, I'm really looking to.

to kind of doing some more of this, like doing some more educational stuff. I've done some trainings on a smaller level, but I really like to be out there speaking a little bit more, sharing my story, empowering, you know, other people that have been in my place. And it doesn't need to be a, you know, you were an addict or you were in jail or, but if you felt like you couldn't be somebody, right? Like if you look at my past on paper, I shouldn't be where I am today, according to society, right? But.

You know, we don't have to live by other people's expectations of us. You know, eventually I'd like to write a book, but that time will come when it's supposed to come. I will say that I had this woman speak over me. I think I was, I'll never forget this. I was like, maybe a year sober. So I was like 25. And it was this.

Makhosi (56:10.752)
It will. It will.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (56:24.287)
this person who was prophesying over all these people and he picked me out of this crowd of probably like maybe like 100 people and he called me the concrete rose and he said, you are meant to speak in front of large crowds of people. And I'll never forget that because it was one of those moments where like you get chills and it's like, I don't have a really good memory but the memories I do have are like very pivotal moments that I'm supposed to feel like.

later on in life at some points, like those moments make sense. And I always hang on to that because it's like, huh, because I speak a lot. I speak to people. I lead crowds, but it's like that. To me, I'm just like you said, I'm following a direction. I'm keeping myself open to opportunities. I'm continuing to meet people. And ultimately, my goal is to help people raise to pull people off when they can't pull themselves up. That looks different from day to day. Sometimes it's.

an addict or an alcoholic. You know, sometimes it's somebody, it's, you know, a housewife who's struggling at home with parenting and they can't get out of the house and, you know, they don't believe in themselves anymore because they lost their identity along the role of being a parent, right? So, and anywhere in between. So that's, that's my goal. I just want to show up. I want to travel a lot. I want to continue to have the freedom I have in my life right now.

Makhosi (57:47.808)
Yeah, I see that for you a thousand percent. Of course, I'm beating a dead horse at this point because you heard me say it multiple times. I really see you as a thought leader in your industry, really being an embodiment. Part of what I think is so crucial is that we start to see examples of professions that

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (57:54.941)
the

Makhosi (58:18.208)
in the past have not been well compensated, have not been well taken care of, and that you can embody that not only through the success you've created for yourself, but also in the environment that you create with your team that also allows for them to be well taken care of and live a lifestyle that is...

more human basically and I do I see you you know really stepping into speaking like traveling and speaking they just go well together you might as well get paid to travel and take your family like I love getting to bring my son with me when I get to go various places and my husband my

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (58:58.461)
Yeah, sign me up.

Makhosi (59:10.24)
My son especially, he loves a hotel room. Put him in a hotel room and he's living his best life. He's definitely that way. Well, before we go, I do want to just allow people to connect with you. Where can they find you in the interwebs if they're curious about you?

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (59:19.613)
St.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (59:33.595)
And the interwebs, I am at Instagram, Jill Griffin, LCSW. I also have a website, jillgriffinlcsw .com. That's probably the best way to reach me.

Makhosi (59:48.256)
All right, well thank you so much for sharing all of your amazing story with us and your insights. I know that this is gonna be really helpful and inspiring and expansive for someone.

Jill Griffin, LCSW, LADC (01:00:01.722)
Thank you so much. This was so much fun.