No Filter in Paradise
Two friends, one's straight one's Gay, with different backgrounds, interest, upbringing & outlook in life come together to have a Fun & honest conversation and discuss their opinions on different topics... with no filter.
No Filter in Paradise
Immigration, Energy, Justice: Arthur Dowers Gets Real | EP 217
We press the Minister of Justice on trust, the secretive LNG contract, and what it takes to rebuild safety, capacity, and fairness in Aruba. He lays out plans for addiction care, a new prison, body cams, DIMAS permits, and an energy reset while promising measurable steps before next year.
• erosion of competence in public institutions and staffing
• restoring law and order through clear rules and presence
• addiction care gaps and a plan for mandatory treatment facilities
• legal boundaries for surveillance and body cam accountability
• prison decay, rehabilitation programs, and new facility timeline
• youth protection, prevention in schools, and road safety
• cybercrime and sextortion awareness and response units
• sentencing balance versus certainty of being caught
• DIMAS temporary permits, criteria, and deadlines
• energy policy focused on local expertise and renewables
• recruiting 40 new officers and boosting visible policing
• public transport reliability, bus lanes, and park-and-ride
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I don't believe none of y none of y'all respectfully. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_00:I just don't as a politician. Listen you say you don't believe politicians, but no, huh?
SPEAKER_02:All I want to know is what's how much we as a community are paying for a deal that nobody's ever seen.
SPEAKER_05:We're paying for it, so like I've heard like for the next 20 years we're gonna have to pay for this.
SPEAKER_00:Listen, I respect anyone who wants to smoke that's their business. I mean, as long as they're not gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, I've always seen it just like from an economical standpoint, like we can do from an economical standpoint. How do we then then? Literally after, like, and during the election time, like listen, like by the paper, cool. You won a deal and your father was a lawyer, and then you couldn't get the person from where, but then you put your cousin as director, he signed the government, and then he steps down and he put somebody else.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, experience matters.
SPEAKER_02:I mean yours. We can get it. I've talked about this before. We want to just go and interview like inmates. No, you want to just inmates go here.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, you're crazy.
SPEAKER_05:I'm gonna build your prison, I'm sorry. I love my freedom respectfully.
SPEAKER_03:Hey yo, what's up? I like how it's there.
SPEAKER_02:Welcome back to the ABC Islands favorite podcast, No Filter in Paradise, a show about literally anything and everything between two friends.
SPEAKER_05:One is straight and the other super duper melanated and homosexual babies.
SPEAKER_02:Alright, guys, we are back. Um it's been a while. Look at his disgusted face. He's so disgusted. Like, dude, what the hell?
SPEAKER_00:I know it, I know it. It used to be different. Yeah, I thought minus babbles, no.
SPEAKER_05:You know, like make it a little cute though.
SPEAKER_02:All right, guys, so we're back. It's been a while since we recorded an episode. Um big shout out to everybody who saw our Bonaire episode and then right after we did a Curaçao season focused on like uh sustainability and yada yada, all the good stuff. Um, so me and Sharp, we were like, how should we end this year? And we were looking back like exactly a year ago, it was election time. Came to the whole election season, and we thought, why not do a recap and ask, what have you done in 2025? So to start off this episode, we got Mr.
SPEAKER_05:Uh-uh, uh-uh.
SPEAKER_02:We're not about to do that. Okay, I'll let you introduce.
SPEAKER_05:Listen, this man has done stuff, okay. What people wanted him back. Allegedly, the the screets have been claiming they were like, listen, y'all gonna bring this man back. Like, even the cops, the cops were like, hey.
SPEAKER_02:Although he's never been on the field of reporting. He's never been on here, but we had him on Vatapaking like six years ago.
SPEAKER_05:We did, we did. Okay, so apparently he is the minister of justice. Apparently, yeah, okay. Like, I'm just saying, I'm gonna be. Like, you see, this is what this is what us be happening. Like, what do you gotta be interfering? Gosh, okay, integration and public transport. Y'all, we have none other than the one and only Mr. Arthur Dawers. Hey, senor. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you for the invitation.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you for coming. The first one, it's my pleasure. First one. When we announced that you were the first one to react, like I'm in. I'm also in charge with energy.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, you got energy as well.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, clock it energy energy, clock it.
SPEAKER_00:I did not notice okay, and uh when we started out, you had more, yeah, the double portion, well it should be sized on he had Mike the Mesa's stuff as well, public um public services and uh infrastructure, I think, as well. Infrastructure also and telecommunication, yeah. So we had a whole mouthful, and now it's uh sized on. We kept energy and um things are moving. That's crazy. That was a lot though, 100%. That's a lot, but I mean experience matters. So I'm idiots.
SPEAKER_02:We're gonna get to that, it's okay. I can't believe that's the first thing. We're gonna get to that. I love that you did that. Now we have the perfect reason why we should bring up fun questions. I'm like, thanks for sending it up for us.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you so much. So, you know, that helps. And when you not only, not only my experience, but we also had a team we worked with side-outs with 15 years ago, and most of them were still yeah, we took them out of uh where they were parked, and uh most of them were even smarter, much developed than 15 years ago, and with the experience of 15 years ago till eight years ago. So um we we started running.
SPEAKER_05:I'm not mad at that. I'm not mad at that. I'm happy with that. So let's jump right on up into it, okay? So this year, y'all got you know sworn in.
SPEAKER_00:So why can't we make alma? Hey, there's a thing. You fake always not everybody can pronounce it. I'm mad at it. I ain't doing it.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I'm not gonna even try it.
SPEAKER_02:The last thing I'm gonna do is look stupid on my own show.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so with this, um, you said that this this time around it was special. What made this this one special?
SPEAKER_00:Well, every time it was special, but this one was um special. I mean, every time it's special, but what what is the speciality this time? We we um so we we sat, we have done a lot for the island. We sat and look at how the ones who took over after us were um gonna continue what we have have started. And what we've seen is that um the projects that they must have finished, so that they were contractually um obligated to finish, that was done. But we've seen a big decay also. We've seen that a lot of things were were not um continued, the the perspective changed, and a lot of things were really, in my opinion, not in the hand of the Arabian government anymore. Because there's a lot of discussion on autonomy in in our country. But when I came back, I've seen there's a lot of influence from outside, and not necessarily that the influence should be bad, but what I've seen is a lot of people have pulled back and other people have taken decisions in our community. Uh one of the other things I saw is that um there were a lot of promises made, and some of us might have believed because you're not into what's really going on in the Ministerat and all the departments. And a lot of promises were made, and when we came back, we saw that a lot of them were empty promises because a lot of the the staff we used to have in the past, the the way we were able to get things done in the past, I didn't see that efficiency present anymore in in our government. It's it's not very easy because I know that there's also competition from the private sector to the government because the the the some of the wages are very good in in the public uh the private sector. So maybe some of the good professions also left uh the public sector. But there's a lack of enough, a lack of well prepared, well-schooled professionals, and that as we say in Dutch takes a toll on um on the functioning of the government. Yeah. That's one of the things. One of the other things I think is very important is that um that we that we're seeing today is that the the ministers were in office, some of them are bragging, you know, we did a very good job and tremendous. And yeah, we see that. Yeah, but but when you really look at what was done, and especially in the field where where I am um working in in justice, total mess. Stop. Total mess. I want you to know how easier to sell BS than to get real stuff done. Because I mean you can go suddenly say that you did a lot of the good things, and when you really look under the cover, then you see that a lot of the stuff was not done.
SPEAKER_05:So that means basically you say Rokha Chong Lai.
SPEAKER_00:Many, many, many, many times I've told him that, and I will continue to tell him that because I mean the proofs are are all there. I mean, when we work in strafrecht and in in in law enforcement, you know, you need to have proof, and the proof is there that a lot of things he did was, I mean, total BS. And some of the things that he did a few things, one of the things he did, and he's bragging a lot with it, is something I started out, he boycotted, and then I came and do it and then finished the project. What was it? Wait, yeah, what was it? Because he's gonna most probably when you look at this program, he's gonna be, you know, getting on bad and maybe calling you guys, say, give me a chance for me to come and oh no, he comes in.
SPEAKER_05:Trust me, if yeah, yeah, yeah. I think tomorrow's stuff we go here. Okay, we're good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no way he can watch this and comment back on it. Oh, and also this is like a a two uh like a little thing that we did this season, okay? So every we had everybody like uh you can leave a question for somebody as well. We're gonna let you do that. But you're the first one. So because you and Rocco had the same thing, we also gave let him ask you a question. So we have a question from Rocco to you as well. So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, lost course. That's good. We reached the ayad. We reached the ayad. Okay, so on a personal level, right? How does this return feel for you?
SPEAKER_00:It's feel it feels like just coming back home. I mean, even my office, I visit the same office complex. Stop! It's just like coming back home. Like you we've never been uh away.
SPEAKER_03:Same office? Same office. That's crazy.
unknown:Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_02:But um, how how long do you because we we've asked the message this last time we spoke to him, like how long do you see yourself being in politics? I'm not Trump or Biden. So clock it.
SPEAKER_05:Not trying to run like an old man.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, I mean I'm not thinking of sitting here at 80 years. So you're saying this might be your last time being in politics? Yeah. I've not seen it in politics, but I mean I'm not necessarily, I mean, trying to get re-elected. Yeah, but the important thing is that you always be supported from the south. I've always been supporters to my party, A VP, and and and people that want to do good for the community. I will always support them, and I will always do my utmost best to make sure that MEP stays out of power. I think that's this isn't it. I think that's uh that's important. Because these people, um if I'm very honest, and you might be honest, I don't like them, but some of them are really I I find they're wicked. And oh wow. They're really wicked people, they lie a lot, and they go, you know, they go behind people and and persecute people. And I I find that's not done. In a democracy and a in a decent society, you should respect people's um opinions, people's beliefs. You don't have to agree with each other, but you should not just, you know, um going behind someone because they have a different belief than you have. And we've seen that happen. We've seen even the judicial system use to go after people because they had an opinion about certain politicians. And in our days, that was very rare. I mean, they came along, and what you see now, they make all kinds of fake accounts and they create all kind of I mean, AI stuff and crazy stuff, insulting people and demonizing, dehumanizing people. I do not believe in that stuff, I don't do it. But when they do it, I just you know laugh. I don't go, I don't go and use the the the um scarce um capacity of a necessary, it's not needed to be system to go in behind people. But okay, that's what that's what is done.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, it's a bunch of childish shit. Like anybody got time for that. Grow up, y'all. Bosumest this grow up. So okay, so you just mentioned something, and I want to like tackle on that for like a hot second. So you said that you would like to see Avipe to continuously be in office, right?
SPEAKER_00:Well, not necessarily continuously, but continuously should be in the political, uh important position in the political spectrum on the island because it is a party with a history that have demonstrated that they have done important things for the islands, and each and every time that MEP comes and destroys this country, we come back and rebuild the country. So it's necessary. I mean, as long as MEP is there, but we should be there.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, I mean, at some point, like you don't feel like both of them are supposed to just like wash out like Tabasco.
SPEAKER_00:Well, I mean, if if you can create something in the image of AVP, there's no problem. But we've seen that um But wouldn't that just be another AVP? That'll be AVP. So you need AVP, you know, philosophy. So why why why change?
SPEAKER_02:I mean, okay, but let's say maybe maybe because you can adapt to certain things, like in 20 years it won't be the same as today.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it's an evolution. I mean, the we're not the same as our our um uh friends uh in the past, late Henny Eyman, and you can mention some of them. We're not the same, but we have learned from them and we've built off uh on what they have done, and the same, we're not the same as those guys that were in 1942, but we build on that philosophy. And the philosophy is that you should work for the community, not what we're seeing now, that you have a group of people that want to get in power to enrich themselves. And I mean there's only one family that's proven that they have enriched themselves on they were poor, just like many of other people in the community. They were poor? You thought they won rich? I don't know. I from my young people in the office, I don't know. But you can ask also for there before me, because they I have heard from them that they were poor Joseph as us, and then they just built these empires on public um uh money. So that's like proof. That's a fact. That's proven. I mean, but is it like public information or is it just public knowledge? There's history, there's public knowledge. Pull out the receipts. For me to for me to quote, like for instance, speed does always say you have a legal way of stealing. And and um there are ways. And you know, the the sad part of it is that they will go and accuse everyone of you know, you guys have um um taken money from the government and your your family, your wife, this and that. But when you look at the numbers, you look at the books, you will see that those, there's only one family who have really, I mean, they have um make sure that all the family rented all the certain um um buildings. They have even created contracts in which they will go to the bank, um, get a piece of land, build a building, construct a building, and pay it based on the contract, or get a loan based on the contract that was given to them um by the government. I mean, there's all there's proof of that. But it's need a historian uh politicologue, you know, that's that's sadian, go and do the do the math for your own.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, but then let's let's also focus on, and this is not this is just me being a little bit of the devil's advocate and the human person. Pero Avepe also had like their fair shares of criminality.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, what you have is that people that have been accused of doing things that are not right, Bursually. However, if you look at that, because you can do a lot of things in government that are not right, yeah, but not necessary that you have stolen. If you really look, and and those that are really, I mean, took from the public, none were persecuted. Because, as I said, what my friend Speeder says, you can steal legally in the government. You just have to know which way to operate.
SPEAKER_05:That's crazy. That is crazy. That's crazy.
SPEAKER_00:Because if you look at one, there's one politician up to now, and I mean, uh, MEP have spoken about, I mean, if any cruise, you guys remember when we were in a crisis time, and we said all of us have to get together and and and deal with with the the Dutch regarding the loans that we were getting. Um, they she said, No, I don't want to deal with you guys because you guys are university of corruption. But if you really look who is the professor, the main professor, the dean of the university of criminality, that's that's Evelyn Bever Cruz. Oh my god! Look at her part. Oh my god. The most people in her party were persecuted. But that's not necessarily the measure. Important is to realize that almost no one was persecuted because they took money from the government. That's Besaril was the one who was persecuted. I mean, um, for that. Otherwise, it was um acting not in accordance with certain stipulations, legal stipulations, and the rest is history.
SPEAKER_02:That's crazy. I do have a question, and this may be slightly off topic, but still. No, it's okay, go ahead. And I've brought this up to different kinds of politicians regarding the whole is it the LNG contract now that nobody has seen?
SPEAKER_00:The Eagle LNG contract. The Eagle LNG contract, yes.
SPEAKER_02:Is it like, I mean, till this day nobody has seen anything, right? Well, everybody, a lot of people have seen it because No, but I mean like the what's the details in the contract.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. We've seen it, however, uh, we are still in debate if we should public it, because publish it because there is a stipulation that it's the NDA or whatever. Yeah. Publish, and if you do that, then they might you're breaking you're breaking the NEA. And then they might go after you, and we don't want that. So um, but someday it will come out. Do you have to be patient? I mean, people but what I what I what I do understand is this contract has not it has not delivered anything good for us.
SPEAKER_05:So that's that's why I'm asking because what but we're paying for it, so like for the next 20 years.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, no, no, it's it's it's it was not continued. This contract was um, yeah, and we are waiting. We didn't get any reaction from them, so I suppose it's is we're all good now. Um someday that contract will come out. Um we also have a um um But that's crazy.
SPEAKER_05:Sorry, that's crazy. So y'all heard from them, but y'all don't know for sure. But y'all are the ones in charge now. For sure that the contract is. Oh, okay, that it's done and everything is like clean and like that.
SPEAKER_00:But I did not we did not get any reaction from the company, so I suppose that they it's okay because the contract has not been prolonged. Very important is to realize that there is an NDA, and based on that, of course, we cannot just um throw all information information on the street. Makes total sense. However, that does not mean that there will come a point in time in which it will be published. But more important is and more interesting is to know you know why were men um why was men um so eager to um sign this contract. And what we do suspect is that you know certain people maybe you know receive the uh um some money for the signing, you know. So that yeah, I heard like this whole golden handshake thing, I heard like that. I mean that's why I remember Shane. I asked her like the golden handshake was to guarantee that this contract could have been signed.
SPEAKER_02:So they needed to get rid of certain directors and I know open the way for them to have total control over the I literally asked her, like and during the election time, like, listen, like Kai the Papia, who you want a deal, and your father was a lawyer, and then you couldn't get the person from where, but then you put your cousin as a director, he signs the government, and then he steps down, he puts somebody else, and then nobody can see it. That's the reality. All I want to know is what's how much we as a community are paying for a deal that nobody's ever seen. But, anyways, let's move on.
SPEAKER_05:She claimed she said that they did the NDA was for um because Kirasao and them were also gonna have a deal with this company, so in order for them not to see the pricings, that's why it was yada yada yada. Oh, you're not gonna be. I mean, it's not looking at the show. It's only got a record. You believe her? I don't believe none of you, none of y'all respectfully. I'm sorry. I just don't mess with politicians. We just I just talk to y'all and have conversations.
SPEAKER_02:No, okay, okay.
SPEAKER_05:No, I'm sorry, not me.
SPEAKER_02:It's more like we like to we like to have conversations, and then for example, if if you were part of the um interview last year, we would have locked watched the whole episode and like hey, yeah, but like, okay, Delbertas, you said you guys, you get to leave the bat. Everybody else is coming on, they've already done this show. So, like, we're gonna be asking, hey, Babisa, that goes, Copa.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, everybody's gonna. But you can look anything I've said many years ago and ask. I have my answer always ready.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, except that was promised uh change in safety. Yep. Um, where are we like already seen as kind of safety?
SPEAKER_00:Like and the change. Actually, but one of the important things we we said we change in policy, not necessarily change in safety. You you have a responsibility to continuously invest in um public safety. Uh, then there's many ways to do it. One of the things, for instance, that we are seeing is that we have a large presence, as was the case 15 years ago when he came in office. So, this is, I mean, deja vu. Same thing. Okay, in those days, maybe you guys were very young, Boshi Waiver opened the first Cholo Hotel in Ryan Stadt.
SPEAKER_05:I mean, in the back by XFM.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, XFM and that's where the where the lawyer the lawyer building is, and the I think next to it. At a parking lot, yeah, and they've okay the building. Do you have any idea who owned the building they opened the cholo house in? No, no, no, yeah, still own it, but who owned it doing? As one cruise or something like that, right? So you say you don't believe politicians, but that was I was building up, you know. Present family.
SPEAKER_02:You got that question? I got something to throw in.
SPEAKER_00:Present family forever. Okay, so the family had a building, they they got a lot of money for rent, and the the public suffered a lot on that. And but now that we are back in office, what you've seen is that they have um they have created new organizations, but there's no facility on Aruba anymore to um do mandatory care for addicts. So that means that uh only if you're willing to go in voluntary you can get care, or if you want to go during the day, you can get care, but the government doesn't have the the power anymore and no instrument to take you from the street and mandatory um um treat you as a measure to uh increase safety and security in in, for instance, the Binestad in in the inner city. Um that is one of the things we're working on very hard now, because we need to make sure that that's possible again. Because you need a certain moment as a government to let people understand that listen, there is an authority in the island. Um we were elected to guarantee that there's law and order. Uh for instance, if you look at the whole parking um um uh stuff, we are pushing back now because everybody does what they want in in in the inner city. The old parking or the whole parking lot. Oh, the whole parking, the whole parking lot. The whole parking stuff. Like the paying pay and and regulation, regulated parking. You cannot just park anywhere you like. And some and many times I explained to the community, if you just decide to park anywhere, and people were doing that for a while now, and and we had a we had an incident in which a bus um was just stopped because the traffic was blocked, someone just decided to park in a in a case. So the bus can get true. I mean there's a whole uh um uh Binestadt in a city was blocked. Backed off traffic, yeah. If the police needed to get somewhere, the fire truck or the ambulance they cannot they cannot reach. And then if it's your family at the receiving end and need service, then you would complain. Because when normally when we start to to to to um reestablish uh law and order, people start to complain. We know a lot of people like when it's a free-for-all. But when you become a victim of the free-for-all, then you come. Then it's a problem. So that's that's important. We and we are we are pushing on those stuff. But we have a lot of other other things, for instance, um the whole um um issue with with um littering in in I mean the whole island is a dump. We're talking about nice, beautiful tourist island. But if you go in the tourist area, you go in the ports where that where the tourists come in, you go uh anywhere. I mean, maybe one big mess. That's part also of I mean security. And um we we are pushing back to you know get got a lot of uh police officers back in, for instance, the tourist areas. We used to have a police oriented um group of um uh officers, and that they're all phased out, we're phased by this government, they're security guards on on bicycles, and yeah, that's nice. Yeah, I saw them, I saw them which is illegal, but okay. Wait, wait, what?
SPEAKER_05:We're gonna get to that, we're gonna get to that. We got some body cam stuff as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, I know it's so much, it's so much to ask this man.
SPEAKER_00:Because the the the gu the that's law I I um passed that law to parliament in the days myself. Clock it. Um yeah, right it on. Um it's the government who has that authority to observe people in public areas, not security companies, not private companies. This is as simple as that. The government have the legal authority to do it, and the government have the obligation to guarantee the privacy, the government have the um legal possibility of storing that material, and the district attorney can always um not always, but I mean if if there is a case and where it's justified, the the district attorney can um uh subpoena the material and use it in a case also.
SPEAKER_05:So I want to say um definitely we'll give you your props because we did see a a difference with um nos addicto non ambulante by XFM in the parking lot. Like they're they really got cleared out for some reason. I don't know what happened, but they're gone.
SPEAKER_00:I don't know where they get where they get, but they're gone. Yeah, well they you see you keep they will keep moving, but we need to have a facility because there must be a moment when the government can, you know, but it's the same Dutch Lat Tandesine, they can show you the tools and you know now it's enough, and now I'm gonna really act against you. And if you can do that as a government, you are not um you you Incompetent. You're not yeah, you're not not only incompetent, but you are not being taken serious. But there's a plan for that. Yeah, we're working on a plan for that. We can work on a facility for that also.
SPEAKER_02:Any idea where or excuse me? Any idea where this facility is going to be?
SPEAKER_00:We have an idea, but we're not we don't want to mention it yet because we have not spoken to the the the ones uh that are working in those facilities.
SPEAKER_02:So background check, make sure it doesn't belong to anybody in government.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, echoe.
SPEAKER_00:No, but it should look very well. We we will use a lot of government facilities, and if we decide to use, I mean sometimes you don't have no choice, but if you if you try if you use that sometimes, all of your yeah, we we negotiate as much as possible to get the best deals for our community. We would not just go and say, okay, you're my friend, and we take this and let me run your building here, 10,000, although it's only six, but I'll give you a little extra.
SPEAKER_05:Is there a law that can be changed where it's like, hey, I understand you have your rights to be doing what you want to do, but by law and by rights now with this new law, you're also inconveniencing other people. So you have to go to the rehab or you have to go to the laws exist.
SPEAKER_00:I don't the problem is now we don't have the facilities. They were phased out of the whole system. But uh we do have laws. We have enough laws that we can implement. I I can think of three laws at the moment. Um and we when I left office, we left a law also in uh in in in um I think it was at uh um the Department of Legislation ready to go to Parliament. Extra law to be able to deal with um under under um uh addicts.
SPEAKER_05:So if you're being just realistic with yourself, like don't try to like make no nothing up for the button. But full realistic to yourself.
SPEAKER_00:By when do you see this facility being able to run? At the moment, as we have the budget. So it's not it doesn't only depend on on justice, it depends on different departments. Actually, it's not even my responsibility, but I have a lot of experience in this extra public health because the department is both of you together. Yeah, but we're gonna work together. We always work together. But um and that's my colleague Marvin Vayatras. She has the the portfolio um drugs rehabilitation and drugs uh care, addiction care. So um she is the one responsible. I think it's also important to realize that there is there was also a change in in um the way we we look at the whole drug problem. Uh, since we had um uh the first map government and they were supported by uh people that believe that we should legalize drugs and that drug is okay and drug is the way to go. If you've seen that uh a certain moment, you forgot that? So at a certain moment, you saw that a lot of people were kind of like afraid to say drug is bad and stuff. I mean, I respect anyone who wants to smoke weed, that's their business. I mean, as long as they're not little kids. Um I think you should protect literature because we have scientific scientific proof that I mean it has an impact on it, medical benefits if you use it. But it also has medical, it also has um um scientific proof. So these are the brain development of the brain. So you should not uh as a young person. Yes, young person. If you're an adult, I mean grown I don't grown, you know what you will say, grown W. Okay, you know, so then it's not a problem. You know, the grown grown A, no problem. If it if by all means has, but not with kids. I mean, no, absolutely not. You have to protect, you know, and and we have seen I mean people using that stuff, giving it to them kids and the kids and pretend they know it's something great we are doing, and the consequences we see them on the street. So I I I mean I've seen a lot of this stuff, and with in in no way I can you know go out and promote the use of drugs and and and pretend and try and fool people that it's something that's good. But I you shed it if you don't believe in it. No, but not even if I even if I believe that it has benefits for certain groups of people, I think you should not be promoting it as a recreational um thing for for young people.
SPEAKER_05:No, absolutely not for young. I I don't think young should be included in any part of this. I think that part should be heavily on prevention. Exactly. That's I feel like what we should be our focus should be on a lot more prevention. And I feel like that's where schools fall in place. I feel schools need to have a lot more of these after school programs and a lot more on skill buildings.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but but but it was even out. I mean, a certain moment it was not sexy. It was not sexy to speak about drug prevention, it was not sexy, it was not done because the government was pro drugs, so everybody had to like, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Go along with that.
SPEAKER_00:I I never did, and I've said it before, and I will always say it, they have contributed to a lot of damage to humanity, or I mean to humans in our society, and I'm happy that I was not part of that.
SPEAKER_02:Clack it. You feel the same way about alcohol?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I do respect people if I don't drink alcohol, but I do believe that you should not give kids alcohol, you should not start in a you should start in a um, you know, late age at a later age. Yeah, yeah. You should not, I mean, and you should be responsible to alcohol. One of the things I've also worked talking about safety and security, a lot of people don't really realize the damage that is caused by alcohol in in societies, and especially in accidents, traffic accidents. There's a lot of damage, economical damage, I mean, uh quality of life damage based on the use of alcohol in in traffic. And we um we should, you know, be very, very aggressive in in preventing the use of drugs in traffic. So what you see that the also we've seen that the police was pushed back in and and not really able to implement their their their their responsibility in controlling and um and um um creating more um increasing the possibility of being caught. Since it's in Dutch we say, and that that was um based on the fact that we don't have enough police officers. But we are trying now to get more offices in in in place to be able to protect the community. I don't want to go back on the weed part.
SPEAKER_02:Um no, because he said drugs, he didn't just say weed. I know, I know. Well I just want to go specifically on weed. Yeah. Because obviously, like around the world it's pretty common. Holland states, it's common. But what about what if this could be something that Aruba could benefit tax-wise? Like it could be a big income for Aruba to pay whatever debt we have. Like maybe I understand maybe you don't believe in it, but if you see from an economical standpoint, like hey, you know, Spohaium, I'm not saying it's an economic pillar, but it's a different because a lot of tourists come here, like I work in tourism for 10 years. Yeah. And the number one question I always get daily, yo, we're gonna get weed.
SPEAKER_00:I understand. I mean, there's an international trend. Have a control for it, you know. This is a trend. What I what I mentioned is that we need to protect uh innocent human beings, yes, kids and uh prevent. I mean, as I said, if you are a adult, I don't control your life. You want to put a wee tree in your house and you want to smoke your weed in your backyard, go for it. You're not molesting anyone. I mean, that's not my responsibility, that's not my problem. But we have to pretend protect kids, young people, innocent people from drugs. That's my point of view.
SPEAKER_02:I agree. I mean, I've always seen it just like from an economical standpoint.
SPEAKER_00:Like, I mean, there are a lot of things we can do from an economical standpoint. But why are we not doing them then? Yeah, because not all everything is morally right. But I mean, you can tell other things.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, we're gonna like to sell it. Because like honestly to God, like people out here we die of it.
SPEAKER_00:It's like if you say, for instance, you're gonna have a farm where you uh you produce um medical marijuana and you sell it to the industry, the pharmaceutical industry, or you you sell it through the land for the far for the farming. The government can facilitate those stuff, but that's not the responsibility uh at of the Minister of Justice. The Minister of Justice. The Minister of Justice complies with control and stuff like that. Not with farming. Farming is a different department. You brought it up. I just went on it.
SPEAKER_02:I'm just I've always said like it's more like have like five dispensaries, like two like in a north area, one in downtown, and two in San Nicolas, and they have and just tax the fuck out of it. Sorry. Tax it. And what do you do? It's like you take care of all the drug people that sell on the street. Now you have a control substance. Like, you know, it's not healthy, but you know it's it's it's good stuff. It's not some stuff laced with other materials that you're saying.
SPEAKER_05:Them dealers may still exist. You have to remember your hand in this, they're gonna jack up the prices all the way up.
SPEAKER_00:That's not only that's not only um, I mean, I'm just saying.
SPEAKER_02:I know what you're saying. It becomes a service experience. Like, oh, you walk into a shop, everything's rolled up, that's how it's supposed to be. I'm just saying more money for the Aruga.
SPEAKER_05:I think it should at least be tolerated. And I think it should be maybe not legalized all the way, but at least tolerate like Holland. That's your opinion. Yeah, that's mine. Because I think it's crazy. You can get locked up for having Poochie JS flooding, and then somebody else out here killing people, and then ng. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:No, well, well, you can. I mean, you can get locked up for a lot of stuff, but most normally you don't get lock up for if you have two cigarettes that you're smoking yourself. But the cigarette cigarettes legal and then scale you. No, it's not. No, I'm talking about cigarettes. I'm talking about this, the the cigarette. But I mean, everyone has their specialty. I mean, that's not my speciality, it's prevention and um awareness because I come from the public health sector and legal sector. But I can imagine that someone who comes from the farming sector or from the economic sector, they will give you a different presentation. Yeah, that's okay.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, what's crazy? That's a political answer. I love that. What is one crazy like um crime trend that you see in a rubber that like you kind of want to take care of that nobody really sees?
SPEAKER_00:I don't think it's crazy. I mean, what we've seen all over the world, one of the I mean, emerging uh threats is cybercrime. So um we need to invest and more in in creating units that are very capable of dealing with these these new forms of crime because they can be um very uh damaging. They can, you know, you someone can just sit somewhere in the world and um rob you. But they can also damage, do a lot of damage to economies and to um innocent uh citizens through, for instance, sex tortion and all kinds of stuff like that. These days you have all these new um possibilities of even creating fake um content. So sometimes you can get away and say, you know, that's not me. So maybe that's where the care is either. But it is an emergent threat throughout the world, and it can be used for for um, I mean, not only threats to um humans, but also threats to uh democracies and society. So that's one of the new things we are seeing. But uh the the classical um crimes, um, for instance, uh domestic violence, human trafficking, human training, um, that's stuff like that, um, smuggling, those are also crimes against uh humanity that uh we should have a lot of attention for.
SPEAKER_05:So you being Mr. Prevention himself, what is the prevention method for if we know that this problem is one that's arising, like what are we doing about that to make sure that he knows the answer because that's what you do.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, information, huh? Information, information, education. That's one basic, basic information, um, uh education at a very young age. We we you know make people savvy on certain areas, but um education. That's but how are you doing this?
SPEAKER_02:Like in schools or in like cybercrime, if we it's not really I mean, yeah, I'm 36, but I know what they teach you nowadays. But uh in school, like hey, government's a lot of people. How do you put a weird thing?
SPEAKER_05:Because I feel like it would happen. I don't feel like it's it's more common to happen to younger people. I feel like it's more older people are more susceptible to it. No, but you I feel like you'd be surprised. Young and old, young and old.
SPEAKER_04:Understandable.
SPEAKER_02:I believe I believe that very young is captured, needs one million dollars. But they they they say different things, but older people are like, well, help your family with this thing. But for instance, grandma, look, your son's your grandson getting captured and it's fully AI.
SPEAKER_00:Uh cyberbullying, extortion. I mean, uh you can also I mean rob people through through cyber, and you can you can motivate people to give you money. But okay, I mean if you look, for instance, at extortion, it's it's a a horrific crime because not only it's I mean it it it's uh it it it's uh it it puts a lot of pressure on on the victims. Um some of them even it uh become so desperate that it leads to suicide. So it it is something that that's that's because they don't most of them don't even come out and be like it is happening. Yeah, because they they're shame. So if once um you've been you've been you've been um um a threatened, you're not you the your first thought would not be to you know tell the police or tell someone that might be able to help you. First you're uh in shame and shame, then you're in pain, and then you it might lead to even in the worst case scenario. So it's important, and that's why I mentioned that um um information is important because many times people don't realize that when you post something or when you share something, that you can't retract it. You can't take it back. So that is important for people to understand that kind of stuff.
SPEAKER_05:I like that message. Y'all heard that my mom always tell me that. I mess with that. Yeah, no, for real. I messed with that.
SPEAKER_02:I wanna I want to switch up and talk about um jail and stuff. Kia, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, it's like it's it's already been I was looking at the clock, wow, it's been 40 minutes.
SPEAKER_05:Like it's oh my god, already? Yeah, we're not even halfway through our questions. God damn. Okay, let me wrap this up. Let me wrap this up a little bit. Okay, not wrap the like you know, come like put it the motion and lotion. Motion and lotion? What is the Kia? Yeah, let's do faster. Come on, you need you need you def you can see you can go to block. No, no, no, blackness, god damn. Okay, so what are the plans for inmates for let's talk about prevention and also post how you put them back in the community? I this I did not mean to do this to y'all. Okay, I'm so sorry, y'all.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, no. Um I mean we we have I I believe in in uh rehabilitation, but for you to be able to rehabilitate people, you need to have them in an adequate facility. If the facility doesn't give you any possibility of of um creating a next to normal um human of next humane um condition, then it will be very difficult to speak about a process of uh Kia um correct or of rehabilitation. So I think now we are not just uh locking people up, we have different programs in which we are trying to you know give them a um yeah some kind of education, some kind of um uh skills that they can use when they come out of prison. But I don't think that the facility itself is adequate, you know, to to to have a full scale um rehabilitation uh program. However, with with the with the lack of facilities, the inadequate uh facilities we have, the lack of personnel, because there's a lot of uh um a lot of people leave um the the the Kia. Um why because the conditions are very poor, the the physical conditions and the working conditions. Can you give us an example of like what's really bad about it right now? If you look at whom it's infrastructure falling apart, iron bars are rotten, parts of the building. It's salpated. Yeah, I mean everything gets heated out.
SPEAKER_05:You need maintenance for sure, for sure.
SPEAKER_00:For sure, but I mean the condition in which it is at the moment is um uh that bad that we need to create to to construct a new prison. I mean that process now of you know the the first phase of um documentation on how and what's necessary to come to a plan for a new prison. That's that's that's in in motion at the moment.
SPEAKER_02:Is it something that Rocka also mentioned last time that he started doing something like that? Or I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, we started doing that 15 years ago and it's it's it's kind of actually kind of yeah, but they had a plan to build a new prisoner.
SPEAKER_02:Correct, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So and now they when I came back in office, there was another plan because first the plan of the map was to build a prison, and then four years later there was a plan to talk about now eight years, uh almost eight years later. Now we're gonna talk about how we're gonna build a prison. But now they left, so now we are talking about the table, but never.
SPEAKER_05:It's just everybody's talking, talking, talking and moving plans. Like, okay, like push that button, push it up.
SPEAKER_00:And the Dutch city all the Dutch gave some money, I understood, at the at the end of my of the last government term. And so we're using that now part of that to do the new plan.
SPEAKER_02:Nice. And I think when are they gonna start building or is it still in talking about it?
SPEAKER_00:Well, I do hope not as uh as uh as soon as possible because uh the really the prison is certain areas of this prison is gonna collapse sooner than later.
SPEAKER_02:Would you give us access to go in one day and just you know we took in there? Yeah, I mean I do speed elections.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, getting into prison is not a difference. That's crazy. You can arrange it to get into prison anytime you like. It's not that difficult.
SPEAKER_02:We've talked about this before. You want to just go and interview like that. Inmates or no, you want to use inmates.
SPEAKER_03:But you can rearrange that yourself. Are you crazy?
SPEAKER_05:No, I'm not built for prison. I'm sorry. I love my freedom respectfully.
SPEAKER_00:You know, when you go into that prison, if you go inside there maybe a few hours, you will you will realize how important it is. Yeah, I love freedom. I'm good. However, you will be surprised that the people that are previously in prison, care up care, are back in prison.
SPEAKER_05:But that's where I wanted to get to. So we were we're talking about this thing for building a prison. Great. Lake and Alice, but that's not happening for now. In the meantime, what is happening to the people that are coming out? Because clearly prison life is not that bad that we don't not only have like first-time offenders, it's like people convince the people who are not.
SPEAKER_00:You have to understand why people commit crime. Some people commit crime because they are in an environment that stimulates and motivates crime, have people that uh don't have um enough um intellectual capacity to to you know um protect themselves from others who might drive them to commit crime. And certain people have also certain uh limitations that they cannot control themselves. And you have certain people that I mean they just uh can do better. So you have different and and not everyone who was in prison goes back, but you have a large group of people who commit crime and sometimes even continue committing crime, not necessarily um get going back to prison. So, what's the prevention matrix for prevention is you it starts um as a very young kid. I I believe that you can start preventing someone of um getting into crime uh the day the day after they are born. And there is a way of working together with different organizations to monitor um risks and we saw that early detection that you can um uh if you look at um how if if you look at the the history of crime, if you look at the um history of uh the criminals, you can see that many of these criminals, not all criminal, um not everyone who is uh live in a very bad condition becomes a criminal. However, you see that most criminals, and I'm talking about white-collar crime, but most um criminals have gone through certain things in life that contributed heavily to them um going into crime or sudden a criminal career. And you can take away certain of these um aspects and therefore influence or reduce the risk of um becoming a criminal. But yeah, you need to be willing to work together and um invest in uh these time these type of preventive measures.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so then what does this look like outside because clearly I feel like we're kind of tackling based on that this is not in predominantly very nice neighborhoods. Most of the problems are in the world.
SPEAKER_00:There's a culture. So there's a culture, there's a lot of um uh examples, there's a lot of uh uh attractions in these areas that will stimulate people in doing certain uh do certain activities. However, if you're able to get into these communities and influence what's going on inside there, you can be in competition with those who are willing to pull people into crime. So the government, in fact, need to compete with uh the bad guys and and and instead of them recruiting these these young people to go into the criminal world, we can recruit them to go, you know, do sports and uh other time, other kind of activities. So you can do that in the education system, the public health system, but at the end of the day, you need to work together to um, as we say sometimes in the certain um uh family or certain systems, you need to break and vicious circle. The vicious circle needs to be broken, and you can do that through interventions um uh subsidized by the government. The government really, and I've said it before, really needs to hold organizations that work for the government based on subsidies. Damn right, hold them accountable. Repeat our heavy again for them to get in the back for the for the production.
SPEAKER_05:Yep, hold them accountable because that needs to be done, especially after school programs for barrios. Nothing is going on. These kids are legit just there after school, they're just there in this neighborhood, just doing narra, bored as hell committing crimes, just because I don't care for fun and whatever. And now they're locked up some.
SPEAKER_00:And here, most of the time you don't get lock up just for your pain.
SPEAKER_05:I don't know, I just think. You know, maybe they get locked up for the weed, then I don't know, whatever. Pero we need to have, if we're talking prevention, in my opinion, I feel like prevention starts from having active things to do from that that's one thing of boredom.
SPEAKER_02:Not just that's one, two, uh, at a young age, three, household, parents too, because like, yes, you can teach them at after school, but then they're gonna go back to their old environment.
SPEAKER_05:But that's what I'm talking about, like the rehabilitation for like the inmates.
SPEAKER_00:Because once you're out, yeah, but but realize but you have to realize when it's rehabilitation, you need to be able to influence the the environment. So if you even go, for instance, for drugs rehab or you go for criminal rehabilitation in a facility, and then you're taken your release and then you go back into the same environment. I mean, if you were a drug addict and you sit in an environment at home or in the neighborhood under the tree where everybody's puffing drugs in your face or using drugs, I mean the the temptation is very, very big. If you um go back to a system in which you do not have any help, you cannot get a job, you cannot uh everybody you know um not willing to support you to move forward in life, then you will say what choice do you have then to do the wrong stuff?
SPEAKER_05:Mr. Minister Arturus, that is the case for majority. Exactly. So they they leave out of jail, they ain't got no money to buy get their own apartment, they ain't got no job, they ain't got nothing. How do I make money? That's it.
SPEAKER_00:That's what I just said. You did it, you repeated it, but it's fundamental. But but rehabilitation takes more than just you know, maybe giving you sets of skills in prison. We need to be able to facilitate. So, but we have done it in the past. So it is possible. We have done it. When I was in office in the past, we have had um contracts with certain companies, we even had a a program after um uh school program, we had um special education programs. I was in these those days, Minister of Education and Justice. We had um trainings in prison, and and we also um uh had um contracts, we had companies that were willing to um take these people, yeah, yeah, these guys, and let them work in their companies. And some of them were very successful, so they are success success stories.
SPEAKER_05:Good. I feel like these need to be a little bit more publication, but uh go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead. Okay, because I wanted to ask, I read somewhere that you were talking about ankle monitors. Yeah, what is the case for this? How is this going to be how do you make sure that these same people in the community don't be like, oh wow, not talaka criminal nangafu a woo? And based on what cases do you say, okay, you know what? These types of cases, these people could get ankle monitors.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, how is this working? And in our law, it's a possibility now that the judge can um if if he when you're sentenced, he can give you an additional measure that he just yeah, how far you go from the premises. Yeah, no, no, the the judge decides, you know, that you can also receive an ankle um ankle band, a uh bracelet. Um but we are thinking uh in the in youth um uh uh criminality and um the reclassering is the one who should be involved in uh creating you know the the policies to be able to implement it in jeugd strafrecht, youth, youth, uh youth crime. Um it's in it's in we're now doing the the preparation to start this process, and the moment that we go out when we really start implementing it, we'll go out in the community and give more information. But it's absolutely not the case that um you will have like you know very big criminals walking around with bracelets in the community. That's absolutely not the case. However, there are countries in which you can with a bracelet get house arrest, but most of the time you will see that's not for violent crimes and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, that's good.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Just wanted to make sure of that. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_02:So we've been talking a lot about justice and crime and stuff. I do want to switch up a little bit. Go crazy. We can talk about um Dimas and I want to talk about energy and maybe we're gonna come back to the whole crime part because there is some stuff we do want to talk about. But I just want to switch up just a little bit if you're okay with that. How about Dimas? Yeah, hop on DMAS. So, like um talking about immigration, there's currently right now an opportunity uh for non-documented people to get permits.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So how exactly does that work? How long are the permits for? Like, what will happen after the year gone? Somebody else is is there a way to protect it? Yeah, you know what I mean? You can leave and somebody be like, hey, let's reverse that. Is the department even functioning?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, the department's functioning tremendously. I heard the doors are closed. Tremendously. No, those are open now. No, those are open. Yeah, I mean it's tremendous. You should go one of these days, just take a pay visit, five o'clock in the evening to eight. I'm on the radio show. Okay, but I mean you should put your radio on five o'clock. Okay, but you can do the show from Demas one of these days. Okay. Go live, go live. Five o'clock, five to eight, and then you'll see how we are um offering uh a different kind of service now. Um, I mean, really um um human-to-human approach, um, giving information, supporting people, and the clients are very pleased at Dimas. Yes. Very pleased about that. And we worked during the whole day, but at night we have this special program. What we are doing is is temporary. So when I mean if I leave.
SPEAKER_02:How many products have been given away so far?
SPEAKER_00:Um we are we we um started this project um for around 5,000. That's what we calculated, and now we are at 5,000.
SPEAKER_02:So you maxed out what you wanted to do.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, we maxed out what we thought. All the undocumented people? No, we don't believe that. However, what we are seeing is that there is a group of um undocumented uh um citizens that are, or at least uh people that are present in our community that are not willing, are not um interested in making use of this this uh opportunity. Why not? You'll be surprised. I have no idea. I know why you're sorry.
SPEAKER_01:They're collecting Zwar because because that's one thing. Could be that can be other things.
SPEAKER_00:But but we but it's important and I don't know when you're gonna um when this is gonna be um published. I hope great. So I hope that a lot of them also watch the program and understand that this is your last chance. Once the December 31st hit, we are not gonna be lenient anymore if you're caught illegal. So there is a work permit, right? Yeah, you can we have now the possibility for you to get a work permit. My friends, that was the first phase, work permit, and now we're in a phase in which you're gonna give people a year permit and they don't have a job, so they don't have what we call a carant style, and they don't have a um employer, however, they can get a permit, and with a year within a year, we are gonna support them in getting a um match them with a where with a um with an employee.
SPEAKER_02:But all these all these um permits that were given out, is it basically like a free for or is it not here is one, here is one, here is one, here is one. Or did you do a background check or this? I mean not Oprah. I mean this is serious.
SPEAKER_00:You get a permit, you get a permit. This is this is a good idea.
SPEAKER_02:Do you give it to the person who's like, oh, he's been here for like eight years and he actually do something for the community? Or some person just comes down, a Canadian comes down for the weekend, like, hey, I like it. I'm gonna stay for three months and get my own.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but sometimes that happens, but however, you you you you must have been on the island before the first of July. Um, illegal. And then um what you see is that many of them were here like for eight years, three years, two years, some some even ten years. Come get your permit. Gotcha, gotcha money, oh my god, in the beginning. Some people thought that some some people this is not ice stuff. This is real, I mean serious, serious uh Dutch Kingdom uh legal stuff. No, um, this is a whole different yeah, no, this is a whole different uh you you have to meet certain criteria. If you can meet them, so you you can't have a criminal record. Yeah, um, so it's also possible, as you mentioned, maybe someone who has a criminal record. Yeah, yeah, you you and you have to have a um employer. That's one of the important things. Now we are in the phase in which we're saying, okay, those that do not have employer, however, they were here for a long time, we're going to give them the possibility to be legal for a year, and in that year we expect you to do your utmost best, and we're going to support you in getting um into the normal legal uh what happens to them at that as well. There will be a moment where we have to tell each other goodbye. But I mean we do it in a decent way.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So at least we're giving them a chance, like, hey, here's the parent for a year, go find a job, find somebody to hire you, and then you're in exactly as long as that's treating people nice, showing a lot of love, but also we we also know that they mean even And this is happening without like promises, like, okay, well vote upon me and like you know the nice thing is that none of these people can vote.
SPEAKER_00:No? If you're illegal, you can vote. But once you document it, you have to have a Dutch nationality to be able to vote. So look at the fine princess. If you find you need to vote for it, I do that worse on it. But if you're sending a if you really want to run your campaign in debt, you get one vote. You don't get one vote. That's crazy. None of these people can vote. Okay. But it's about humanity, it's about treating people in a decent way, it's about creating law reestablishing law and order in your community, it's about uh creating uh economic opportunities for people, but it's also creating the possibility that the government can, you know, get his fair share of taxes and stuff like that, protecting the community because if you have a lot of illegal people in your community, they don't go to the doctor, sometimes they come in, they have uh certain contagious diseases, they spread in the community. So there's a lot of uh important reasons to do something like this. We have seen um all kinds of um new systems um uh created in our community, for instance, on the ground banking systems in which people just uh borrow money like loan sharks. Yeah, loan money. That's crazy. Yeah, these illegals borrow money from loan sharks, and then they they you know they have their way of threatening them. And and in a decent society and a small society is ours, we we we can do much better than we have done the last seven years. Before that, we did good, and then came seven years.
SPEAKER_05:He's just throwing the jab. And it's so so smooth smooth. Oh my god.
SPEAKER_02:All right, so I want to jump in energy, and then we're gonna revert back to the whole justice part. You cool with that? Okay, yeah. Okay, so because there's some some questions. So go go go go. What's happening with uh, you know, Elma, the waste man water management, are they uh what are the plans regarding energy policy?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, there is an energy policy, it's uh it's um written. We have some very good experts, all locals, Arubian guys, who left because of the way they were treated the last seven years, and they're back, and a lot of them are back and real professionals. I mean, I've spoken to these guys, it's unbelievable. If you see the plans, you see the the the capacity, I mean it's it's really sad that uh the human capital that was um uh I mean ill-treated and uh send away or um went to exile like yeah, because what was happening was you've seen it that we were just putting in Avina, they were putting in uh Primo, Prima, Suegro, Suegro, friends and family. And the no skills and the criteria were leasting the Hindi kupu has it about. Exactly. The criteria was not if you have skills, the criteria was which clan did you belong to? And it's sad because if you look at um IWSS, when we came into office, we had to um take some drastic measures to stop um IWSS of taking a loan of 250 million.
SPEAKER_02:From where?
SPEAKER_00:This year. I mean they just go and get it from the banks. From the banks, yeah, they'll have just money would have gone into friends and family and uh um uh contracts and and also in certain investment that were necessary, but it was not necessary to to loan 250 million this year, and we stopped that. Uh we had people in office, and I mean even the director of the IOSS was um had no idea, absolutely no idea at all what IOSS is all about. I'm not gonna pretend I know anything about IWSS, I'm not stupid.
SPEAKER_02:But but you can hire experts. You but you need to hire experts, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's a necessity.
SPEAKER_00:If you want to have someone on a plant, then you're gonna get an engineer to do that. You have to be honest. I mean, if you can be in the board, you can be in the holding, but you're not gonna, I mean, if you are if you own a bank, you're not gonna take someone who sells I don't know what for kind of uh I I understand what you're saying and let them direct.
SPEAKER_03:I agree.
SPEAKER_00:Because most of them would not do what they have done with these public entities. If they were their private companies, they would not put these lunatics to run them. That should be the criteria. Would you put that person to run your mother's, your father, your own company? And if the answer is no, then why Aruba deserve that? Why Aruba deserve that?
SPEAKER_05:I agree with you. Clock it.
SPEAKER_00:We agree. I agree with you. Came a long way, but we're getting somewhere.
SPEAKER_02:But what about um I know years ago there used to be the whole solar panel in St. Nicolas, right? The whole solar panel.
SPEAKER_00:It's still there to maintain. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:What about maintenance? But it's, I think it's the one.
SPEAKER_00:We have different solar parts and they are there, and we want to create more solar parks. The wind farms are there. They're now. Remember Richard Branson came here with Duran Mike's own government? Our government 15 years ago. I remember that. When things were going good. Yeah. 15 years ago. We're not mad about it. We did a lot of investment in the community, but also in renewable energy and um the green agenda. And we are now running behind Curso. We were the front runner, not only in, I think, in the Caribbean, but now we are not the front road anymore. However, we have enough capacity. Take it back. We're gonna build it up back eventually.
SPEAKER_05:Alright, let's jump back in Justin Justin Crime Track.
SPEAKER_04:Alright.
SPEAKER_05:So let's talk about this. What are we doing to prevent an we gotta say his name, Mr. Aiden Lanoy, but that was a very horrible tragedy. So what are we doing right now to make sure that something like this never happens again?
SPEAKER_00:I think what we have been doing forever is um um guaranteeing that we recruit the right police officers and um have the the the good set with the good set of sets of skills and we have the right procedures in our um um academy, police academy, to guarantee that we develop a culture in our police um force that guarantees that these things uh do not happen. However, as you've seen, um we do not have it uh 100% in the hand. So we have to a certain moment uh revisit uh what we've done. However, we need to have this case take place in court and um get all the documentation for us to really learn and understand what happened and what went wrong, and based on that for us to take decisions for the future. We cannot anticipate uh on the result of the case. That's in the hand of the public uh district attorney's office and the public prosecutors, and at the end of the day, in in a court, um the judges will decide what uh the fate of everyone involved in this case, and when that is concluded, we will um uh take our responsibility also as um as a government.
SPEAKER_05:So do you feel like uh in this case uh body cams would be a plus or a negative?
SPEAKER_00:I think that body cams is an instrument that contributes to accountability. So it's always a plus.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, I think body cams are a plus. What you said earlier, just uh you can only use it if you really need it. Not that you get like, hey, come up, upload a video about social media.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, but absolutely you cannot do that. So exactly no police officer has the authority um to do anything like that. Is that their content, basically? It is it is by law stipulated the government content, and that govern the government, the ministry, the minister of justice gives the authority to the chief of police to um collect and store that material. So no one can just get to that material. The district attorney's office is entitled. The district attorney can subpoena material if necessary for investigation, and that's yeah, that that should be very clear. So it it it is something that's very serious.
SPEAKER_05:So we're also seeing um shout out to Kafia. That's not if you've seen it. I love making some cafe. Overworked. What is a long term the long-term and short-term goal that like for this?
SPEAKER_00:Well, when I was in office the last time I counted, we recruited uh I think like three 200 officers to the force. And um but we need to recruit more officers. But what's that's that's mean the main thing. You need to and we have also introduced technology and different other forms of of uh um supporting for the forces. We have enough people that are interested, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But yeah, because my question was gonna be like what what are some added benefits, like incentives for them, like oh, I I really want to be a cop, you know? Because I mean I don't know how much of the officer makes, but yeah, I mean the officers are well paid.
SPEAKER_00:I mean I don't say that they are not properly paid, however. Over times, though, that's uh also but but I but I do believe that that um the government has uh a responsibility to guarantee safety and security in a country, that means that you need to to recruit uh people to join your force. And what we have seen in the years that I was there is that we have a lot of interest. A lot of people are interested in being part of uh you know, guaranteeing safety and security in the country. And you have different other government departments where people are willing to work. Even in the prison system where you will think, you know, wow, that's not uh the most uh attractive place, you still have a lot of people who have the passion to um to apply to work in the in the system. So and the salaries in the government are not bad, the working condition not necessary at the best at the moment, especially for instance uh especially in the prison system.
SPEAKER_02:So so you're saying that right now, like it's getting better as in recruitment-wise, like what's the number what's the number? Like, we need this many police hours on the streets for things to be like, okay, we're we're in a good spot. What's your goal? And where are we right now?
SPEAKER_05:And where are we now?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Well, we have different numbers and we have different calculations based on certain presumptions. But I do believe if we can add in the the period, if you cannot 40 officers in the coming year to the force, because we are we have a plan in which we can add that, that will contribute uh in a in a in a great way to reduce um certain crimes and to um increase the presence of police officers, what we call blue blue blau upstrad, blue on the street. So um I will say this year, if you can do 40, I mean next year, 26. If you can do 40, that will be a very good idea.
SPEAKER_05:And I I know now there's like a new tag of kids in in school right now, like school police. How long do they stay in school before they can become official officer?
SPEAKER_00:Well, first they do the the basic training, then they go, they start working. So it's that four years before you complete your studies, but they go to work after um two years, um one and a half years, they are they are out working. And we have also a group of police officers that go that can go into the working field after six months. Are you already are you already getting paid while you're going to school?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I mean, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. They get paid to go.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, because you do different um um uplightings and different things. Practical uh and training and tra training and training and training and training and I like that training and training and training during their um during their um um uplining. Okay.
SPEAKER_05:Alright, now I know you had a question about like over the years and stuff. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, because I'm curious too, does he think argument about people talk about this on social media is like how many like going to jail like for certain stuff? Like, for example, somebody molests a child by prisoning those iron. Like people are like, you what? Or somebody kills someone. It makes you feel like I just shoot this person, I'll be back in the street in eight years anyways. I'll just chill in prison, family comes and visits, no problem.
SPEAKER_01:So like there is master pizza.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. There's science, uh thing ting, ting scientific, kung bota determina kika siota or it needs to be in misung balance, of course. Uh however, uh balance. Yeah, then I mean in in the in the punishment. So what do I mean? Yeah, yeah. So if you kill someone and you get 25 years, you cannot give someone who I mean steal a purse 25 years. You know what I'm saying? They lose their life.
SPEAKER_05:Like how do you get in 25 years? What is it?
SPEAKER_00:You can get 25 uh to life. So if you get life, if preditated murder, you can get life, for instance, but it's the judge decides, not the minister. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And um, but you still have to have just an gradazi. You cannot give someone the same punishment for murder or nothing like that. Make sense, makes sense. So um um, but very important thing to realize is that um castigo, because a lot of even if you ask a a um a seasoned district attorney, most probably they will not be able to tell you the punishments that are on the different um It's based on a case case. But because it's not so the criminals also do not know that. What deter people from committing crime is the possibility of being caught getting caught. The pack guns. See a chance, most probably you will not do it. And then I'm not talking about people that you know are not um uh um psychologic in order or um crimes of um uh impulsive crimes and stuff like that. But most of the time, what you see is that people who commit crime, if they the chance of being caught is very high, that deters people from committing crime, not the height of the punishment. Okay, that's one thing important to realize. So sometimes we want to uh um to to make sure we have a have higher um punishments, but not necessarily that's the only uh factor that determines or prevents people from committing crime.
SPEAKER_05:I mess with that. I mess with that. Um I have a question which is not on this. Go for it. Sorry, it's on public transportation. Okay, okay, okay. That's a different thing.
SPEAKER_02:Nervous, okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, because it's not like in a bad thing, but no, but the public transportation is a meaning, man.
SPEAKER_05:Like in in my okay, first of all, traffic in this island. Fees. You would think that the what he was fixed something, it may be why is that.
SPEAKER_02:Imagine if we didn't have what I was, huh? Imagine if we didn't have what he was. No, but like no, no, no. Actually, I'm saying the opposite. That it's great. That's great, but uh see like the dunes, all the other ones.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I mean no, but but imagine if you didn't have what I was how it would have been. Imagine if we built a bridge.
SPEAKER_05:Or if we had the festival Imagine if public transportation was reliable. Yeah, we can work on it. Like, like I'm talking satellite reliable, like in Holland, you could just stand up like at the top and you could be waiting and they'd be like, okay, oh, your thing is coming in three minutes.
SPEAKER_00:That is that is a challenge, and we're gonna work on that. So I mean if the bus, if I can if I can count to your support, we're gonna 100%.
SPEAKER_05:I don't want to drive, I hate driving. If I could take the bus, you know how much work I could get done sitting in the bus? Okay, but I have to drive.
SPEAKER_00:Let's promote it. Yeah, I do agree. I mean, we in the coming coming period, we're gonna we're gonna try and get some experts on um public transportation and mobility and have them design a plan in which we can kind of build like a make this thing, side road just for the bus. Please we have we have no infrastructure.
SPEAKER_05:I think people don't even want to drive, like people just drive. It's crazy, it's crazy. Everybody needs a car, but like, yeah, if you don't need it, I will park that shit kumil amor. I will take the bus.
SPEAKER_02:To be honest, that makes sense because if you had more, let's say more buses that move like in coordination, that means less cars on the street, that means less traffic, and you know exactly when the bus is coming, so you know okay, let me run because the bus is coming, or don't even bottle because the bus already left.
SPEAKER_05:I have to wait for the other one.
SPEAKER_02:What if yours what if maybe there should be a place where you can park your okay, but the bus halter, but like maybe there are different stops.
SPEAKER_00:Do we have a place behind DOV? You can park your car there and take the bus and go to the hotels, for instance, or okay, or take the tram and go into the main street.
SPEAKER_02:Because I I live in people selected.
SPEAKER_05:Bring you to the day. That bus, the bus ain't running on time. No, the bus drivers don't have time, they're watching you with like an attitude. It's like eight point pump bang pura. Yeah, that bang. I mean, they're probably also not happy because I don't know what's going on with them as well, pero like public transportation needs attention and it has a way.
SPEAKER_00:Good. Gonna work on it.
SPEAKER_05:Thanks.
SPEAKER_00:Continue your support for that.
SPEAKER_05:You have mine. I continue yours. You have mine. You have mine.
SPEAKER_00:I got your I got your back.
SPEAKER_05:All right, let's get it. Okay. So now rumors. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's look that up. Okay, so Island rumors claimed Okay, you and Mike DeMesa were one of them that was not really too happy about Balter Coast. Okay, it happened, it popped off. Allegedly, there was something going on in Consecutive of a fair. Y'all, y'all went up that night. Next day, bam, Mikey man called, they was like, okay, let's make Balter Coast. When does the number? This one, the number be the thing, maybe I don't want the money ones. But, anyways, yeah, that was it.
SPEAKER_00:That's Balter Coast.
SPEAKER_05:That was Balter Coast. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, there was a result of Baltic. Baltic coast was a lemma, but okay. Let me get this. It was a lame lemma, uh, lemma, and it's a friend of mine from my district, Dakota, who came with Balter Coast. So it had nothing to do with uh the list. But actually, when when the list was um flipped the way it was flipped, people said, Yeah, that's sorry, that's said the Baltic coast, which is okay.
SPEAKER_02:But to go back to what you said earlier in the podcast, yeah, bam.
SPEAKER_05:Then all of a sudden we heard all the rumors y'all were not happy with. I I don't know if if it was maybe about the youngsters because I had like Stephanie Zivinger, you have Wendrick, you had all these coming up above both of y'all that been there, done that, and then all of a sudden we saw boom experiencia contact. Yeah, but you know what I think experiencia contact.
SPEAKER_03:Let me get this. Let me get this. Now we're not looking at the political answer. Let me get it.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but you could have called me and asked me. I said, you know what the nice thing was the nice thing was I said experiencia conta many, um, many, many weeks before, and then I understood when the list was presented away at which they took that and said, No, I said that had nothing to do with that because I do believe experiencia contact and I see it in practice. You guys are doing a much better job than when you started up. Damn right, I agree with you. So eventually everybody realized, you know, that the guy is right. Experiencia ta contact. However, when the list was presented, there was no discussion. I had no discussion with anybody because I was, I think I was number three on the list, right? And I was, uh I don't even remember what number I was, I was number three. And when the last list was presented, I was number three. So I didn't have no reason to discuss with anybody. So no, no, it. I have never since I came into politics, never asked for nominalists, never fought for nominalists, and never really cared about nominalists because any number I had on the list, I always just work very hard. And all this what have done have uh paid off.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so let me get to Rafa's question.
SPEAKER_02:That question, two more questions, and then we'll we've been doing this shit. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so this was Rafa's question to you. He said, Let me think.
SPEAKER_00:Oh the initiative? Yeah, yeah, because actually I don't know how they determine initiative, no, because if you look at initiative, for instance, I mean, I don't know any project they really initiate. But if they if they say, for instance, that they initia um talking about Bela New Prison, which was initiated 15 years ago, I will continue with that. Any project that they come that they initiate was good, I will continue. I have no problem dealing with no project that they came with. I only problem I have is that they pretend that certain projects that were done under my responsibility, that is they did it. I mean, everybody happy. If they're happy, I'm happy for them. But any project that comes that's good, I will I will continue on. So you would if if okay, so if you had to kiss based off like your question, it would be Erekia. I mean, anyone that they initiate. I don't know which one they're talking about, but I didn't see really anything that is wrong.
SPEAKER_04:Wait, so y'all don't get like a handover like that.
SPEAKER_00:But let's let's be honest. Can you tell me anything that the map government initiated? I don't I didn't see nothing really initiated by them. I'm being very honest.
SPEAKER_02:I'm trying to think right now.
SPEAKER_00:Because for instance, we did initiate the whole um green corridor thing that they said. You remember the the lady? She said, I'm not gonna go on the drive over the bridge because it's been the same. You remember that? But so proud that we have a bridge that she didn't want to even drive off because we initiated it. I mean, we're not like that. We are um if something is good for the community, I don't care who initiated, it's done. We're gonna push if it's good. But I didn't see really any project they initiated. If there is, I will uh continue if they're good. Okay, no problem.
SPEAKER_02:So what's one thing, and then we don't have to go deep into it. Just mention one thing that you feel like you've done. Um they don't see it.
SPEAKER_00:Like maybe went under the table, nobody like you did it, but nobody knew you did it. I think recruit 200 police in the force.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:When I look into the history of Aruba, is uh I recruited I've admitted more police officers in the force than any other minister of justice in the history. And then in the second place is my um uh one of our FP, um Vielin Watifos, that we loved very much. He is the one who recruited after myself more police officers in the force than any other any other minister of justice. So that's one of the things I but I mean a lot more. For instance, the camera camera project for the island is one of the projects I initiated, created a law, implemented a project. Now it's revamped in a new in a new facility. That's one of the projects also that I'm very, very proud of. Um the the the the dog units at the the police uh uh departments. I love animals, but that's one of the I'm very proud of that project, and so many different other things, but I mean these are things that I can just you know like that remember.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. I messed with that. I messed with that. So what are three promises that you can make today that you will have completed by you know next year, 2026, like November. The end of your term, basically. Once the your term.
SPEAKER_05:End of the year?
SPEAKER_00:That's the question. But you can invite me next time first to follow up. No, no, no, of course. But it's just months.
SPEAKER_05:The purpose of the question is what is three things that you feel like you would sink present, be proud of, and you will be able to complete by the end of your term. And of course, each year we'll be like, okay, so where are we at with the status of this thing? Yeah, because it's just like since now is our first time doing this, we would like to know. So then you know next year, November, you gotta come back. Yeah, and then we're like, okay, so last year you said that these are the two things.
SPEAKER_00:I think the most important thing is to create a department department of justice. Department of Justice write it on and stone that create a department of justice. So what you we we do not have an under Aranuba, a department of justice. We do have different um uh departments. Fair. No, no, I'm not talking about fair, I'm talking about a department. You don't understand it's a minister, a a department. That means that you have a a um top layer that governs all the departments of justice. So you have um policy developed to this. You have, for instance, department for on the raise. No, it's not internal affairs. It's part of the police uh department. It is a what we call an indosion minister. So, like you have a department where policy is developed, where the where the minister is supported, where you have continuity in in policy development and policy implementation. That's one of the things that 15 years ago I wrote it in my in my um policy um document, and that's one of the things I think we in the coming year we need to um implement. And um Carlos Gaimo. He's part of the team, yeah. Yeah, yeah. He can he he he can do some job. But like for instance, he's working with me now, and um we have different other um um experts, but then I hope in the future that they will be working for the ministry, and then when I when you come in as a minister, you just be part of the ministry and you know have continuous. The work continues, nothing stops. I think that's very important. That's one of the nice things. I think that we should I mean you benefit.
SPEAKER_02:We're our own entity, like we just make sure everything is.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and we support you know the departments guarantee that things are uh are moving smooth, the right way, continuity, etc.
SPEAKER_02:I think the people who are hired for that are people that you know it doesn't matter if government changes, it's it's like people who are good in their field. Yeah, but it needs to be but they need to be good. Okay, so that's kind of good. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, and um master's degrees or something, yeah, and then we put you in there.
SPEAKER_00:I think that's for me the most important one. You need more? Three? It was three angels, pero you can live with this one. Yeah, we could we could do this, we could do this, we could do this. We could the 40 cops. Yeah, the 40 cops, I mean, but that's so that's easy. Yeah, that's easy. And and and and we have the the implementation plan for the prison ready. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:To to I hope by next year when we what location would you do the prison?
SPEAKER_00:The same same one or like no no the government, as I told you, seven um they've this map government had a location to build a prison, and then eight years later they're going and decide how they're gonna design the prison that they were gonna build four years before.
SPEAKER_05:So they're gonna build something with no plan.
SPEAKER_00:No location in Barcadera. On a location in Barcadera, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That that's that that was their plan.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, or it was not a plan, it was a yeah, it was uh embarcadera area. Yeah, there was a uh uh um there was a um and who said this? Um that was I think in the days of uh map, I think Baker was uh most probably and that's uh there was a location um uh I think in Barcadeira. Um and and yeah, if that location is good, then go for it. I'm gonna go for it there, no problem. Although people in St. Nicholas are not very happy that we've taken away the prison because what? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You'll be surprised. You still do people still feel that it brings, I mean, not much, but it still brings a little bit of you know traffic and a little bit to the economy. If somebody stops by Rom, I'm not rum, shop, sorry. I can see that. I can see that. And I was surprised, you know, when I spoke to them, they said no, it's a little bit, no, it's it's still it still brings people to so Nicholas.
SPEAKER_05:It's always busy. I'm not gonna I live right around.
SPEAKER_00:Certain restaurants will sell because they will buy food, they will buy a drink and stuff. I mean, it's not that it is I mean, it's not the hotel area, but it's you you you will be surprised when you come.
SPEAKER_03:No, when they go back stepping bullshit, like why we can have it something else.
SPEAKER_00:It's an industry. It's an industry, but I mean we can redevelop it to something nice, yeah. It's something else. Come on, that's pretty good.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe that maybe that can be a lot of the place.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, no. We call it Jail In Five Star Resort. What do you think? I'm not mad. Be a big boy.
SPEAKER_02:There's a politician in there.
SPEAKER_00:No, but that's I mean it's prime land, so we can use that for for beautiful developments, I think, in the future. But uh, we need we need something different in that location.
SPEAKER_02:All right, well, Mr. Dowers. I think uh thank you for your time. Yeah, first of all, it was my pleasure.
SPEAKER_00:It was my pleasure.
SPEAKER_05:Next year again?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, next week again.
SPEAKER_05:I don't mind next week.
SPEAKER_00:Well, we we have a lot of stuff to share with our community. We have a young people that listen to you guys, and we need to get a message out. 100% interesting, stay away from drugs, guys. But what you have if you you have enough time to I agree with that. Stay away from drugs, don't do drugs. Drugs is not good. When you're small, stay away from those things, do sports and uh good. Facilitate that, you know, have like fix all the the oh my god, I think like a a valdi football and yeah, but we start we need to start to love ourselves and our community also because I mean it's crazy that we are willing to just litter everywhere and break stuff that is not ours, and yeah, I mean we need to. We don't care no more.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that's that's like I don't know if this will come off the wrong way. It's not so much sometimes if you say like people just litter everywhere, could this be people that are not from here? They just move to Aruba, like I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:No, this is not saying I they're also because you have people that come from certain cultures in which that's maybe normal.
SPEAKER_02:You just throw it out the window, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:But that's not necessarily people that come from away. You will see people that, for instance, are visitors to the island and they are very particular about maintaining the island clean. You will see if they have some some stuff that uh they they use and they will not leave it on the beach, they will leave it. You see tourists do that. So there are people that come from other places that really love, I mean, um tourists for sure. Public most tourists. Yeah, no, no, no, not all, not all. Some of them do that. Some of them, but so it's not something that's only from for people to don't belong. It's a mix, and we have too many people in our own society that uh, and as I said, if you feel you can do as you like and you you're not sanctioned, uh the capital cut of the puck counts, the possibility, the chances of getting caught, you will just continue doing what you've been doing for longer. We have a lot of problems, guys. We're gonna deal with them. We're gonna follow up next year or six months, who knows? Yeah, next year is like two months. Yeah, so I mean, like basically our goal.
SPEAKER_02:The new year edition every November.
SPEAKER_00:And I usually should do it more often because you have a you have a special group of people to listen to you, and we need you know more of that. So I mean, I can go to speed and be the patro, and I love them. However, you know, the guys who listen to you guys and not the ones who listen to you.
SPEAKER_02:Just like have a conversation and and not like Farandula, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, speed ruspes.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, this is very random, but everybody anybody ever say you look like like Martin Luther King? Like light light? Nah, no. Okay, low-key giving.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_05:Five from five. Like, just say I have a dream. I'm gonna make a thumbnail. Like, haven't you?
SPEAKER_02:I have a lot of dreams, yes. Yeah, let's go. All right, so guys, I hope you guys enjoyed this episode. Um, make sure to subscribe and have yeah, guys, if you guys have questions, please write down below. And next time when we see Mr. Dowers, we'll ask again.
SPEAKER_05:Real quick, where can people get information about what you what's going on with your ministry and like updates from you and all this good stuff if they want to follow? Like, just let them know like what's your social plugs or whatever? Where can they find this information?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, well, what we we are on B the Quatterora many times. Uh that's where that's a news outlet in the local media. We have our own um um uh Instagram page and uh Facebook. I have my my Facebook page, I have two, and um we share a lot of information on our pages also. Okay, maybe not enough content, but we're doing our utmost best. Let's work on that. Let's work on that.
SPEAKER_02:Like you you need to like really pick up.
SPEAKER_05:Because if our people are gonna go follow and listen to this, they're gonna wanna see what okay. Let me buy waking to dollars, and then okay, good. Well, you know, it goes hand in hand.
SPEAKER_00:That's the diverse you need to invest in the social media team because that's a message to my um content creators then they need to do a better job, okay?
SPEAKER_05:You gotta help them do a better job because they can't they can't afford you to be like, hey, look, I mean, we get content for the phone to be. You know, so it it goes hand in hand. You have to work with them so they can work with you.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, there's a really good company you should look out. It's called Content Projects. They do really good social media work. We're gonna look out to it. Give them a call. All right, guys. Uh we'll see you guys next time and uh peace. Ayo. Thank you.