U of U & Otro Capital Controversy, Does Walker Kessler have "IT", MLB Owners make their proposal

🏈 U OF U & OTRO CAPITAL CONTROVERSY
The University of Utah's groundbreaking private equity partnership with Otro Capital is facing increased scrutiny after concerns were raised about the structure and oversight of the deal. What does this mean for the future of Utah Athletics, NIL, and the changing business of college sports? We'll break down the latest developments and what fans should know.

🏀 DOES WALKER KESSLER HAVE "IT"?
Walker Kessler has become one of the NBA's elite rim protectors and appears headed toward a major payday, but can he be a cornerstone player for the Utah Jazz moving forward? Does he have the "it factor" needed to help lead a winning team, or is he better suited as a complementary piece? We'll debate Kessler's ceiling, his future in Utah, and where he fits in the Jazz rebuild.

⚾ MLB OWNERS MAKE THEIR PROPOSAL
Major League Baseball labor negotiations are heating up. Owners have officially proposed a salary cap and salary floor system for the first time in decades, setting up what could become a major battle with the players' union. Is this good for competitive balance, or are we headed toward another labor war? We'll discuss the proposal, what it means for small-market and big-market teams, and the future of baseball.

💬 Join the conversation live!
Drop your thoughts in the chat, hit that LIKE button, and SUBSCRIBE for more Utah sports coverage, Jazz talk, Utes news, MLB analysis, and everything happening in the world of sports.

#UtahUtes #OtroCapital #WalkerKessler #UtahJazz #MLB #CollegeFootball #Big12 #DNASportsRecap #SportsTalk #LiveStream

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hello, internet. You are looking live here at DNA HQ here in beautiful Salt Lake City, Utah.

SPEAKER_02 0:06

On today's episode of the DNA Sports Recap, we have Let's Talk the University of Utah and their private equity deal. With the Utah Jazz is Walker Kessler, the guy. And MLB owners have made their first counteroffer. Let's break it down.

SPEAKER_03 0:26

All that and more. My name is Darren. That is AJ, and this is the DNA Sports Recap. Roll the intro. How's it going, AJ? I'm doing great, buddy. How are you? Doing well, doing well. We've got a lot to talk about, and this is actually the first time in a couple weeks that we're actually going to be talking about uh the University of Utah football. So before we get into that, folks, we want to remind you that this is a live show. So if you're joining us on the live stream, first of all, appreciate you. Each and every one of you that join us every single week. We appreciate it. Feel free to jump into the chat, let us know where you're watching from. AJ wants to know your favorite color as long as it's red. The rules. You know the rules. Exactly. Again, just chime in on what we're talking about here, guys. Uh, this the point of this being a live stream is that we interact with y'all. So be sure to uh join in the conversation for sure. If you're listening to this on a podcast after the fact, or if you're you know watching this on YouTube on after the fact, again, jump into the comments. Let us know what your thoughts are in regards to what we're talking about. So appreciate y'all. Yep, absolutely. All right. Without further ado, AJ, let's go ahead and jump into it. Let's talk some University of Utah football.

SPEAKER_02 1:52

Let's do it. Before we get into the content, we'd like to encourage you to join the conversation in the comments down below. While you're down there, consider subscribing to Utah Football DNA. Make sure you smash that like button for your boy Darren.

SPEAKER_03 2:10

That's right. AJ, the sky is falling. I know, that's what I keep hearing. It's reported by the media on Friday that the Utah Athletic, Utah Athletics employees are starting to receive notices uh that they will be laid off as of June 30th. Uh, this uh was broken down in several articles locally, uh, one by Joe Coles, who reports on the U of U for the Deseret News, uh, in preparation for the growth of Crimson Brand Partners, CB, CBP, formerly Utah Brand Initiative, CBI, UBI is much easier to say than CBP. So I wish I would have kept it the old way. But anyway, uh, the university has begun uh the process of transitioning select units of some university operations to the new company. The Utah Athletics spokesperson said that this is the first step that in that process it requires discontinuation of individual positions in those units through a reduction in force uh to be allowed for CBP's hiring process. Um, if you spent any amount of time on YouTube, uh, which let's face it, that's probably a lot of you uh out there, you've probably seen V-I hope so. As long as it says DNA somewhere in the video.

SPEAKER_01 3:27

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 3:28

Um you've seen titles like Government officials question Utah's private equity deal. Utah's bold move draws national criticism. Or are there titles like Another Victim of Private Equity? And my most favorite one, AJ, BYU fans laugh at Utah's private equity disaster, athletic department failing. Um, you know, this all comes on the unfortunate state of the state auditor, uh, where they aggressively where they stated that aggressive that University of Utah aggressively burned through 55 million of their reserve funds. One of my favorite lines uh from one of these uh videos where the team down the street is paying cash for everything. Uh, you're doing the opposite. You're on loan with some businessman in New York and you're sending all the profits to Wall Street. AJ, all you know, as our internal optimistic Utah fan that you are. That is my job. That is his job.

SPEAKER_02 4:22

Just if anybody has any questions and you need a little uptick about Utah football, hit me up.

SPEAKER_03 4:28

Exactly. Please tell us why the sky is not falling for the University of Utah. Please give us some optimism, AJ. We need some optimism on the internet.

SPEAKER_02 4:37

Yeah, absolutely. So let's start off with there is only about 18 to 25 athletic departments across nearly 370, 370 NCAA Division I schools that consistently generate a profit. Meaning that the vast majority of these schools, and that's roughly 90% of them, operate at an overall financial loss. Okay. So these deficits are all heavily subsidized by student fees, campus budgets, institutional support. Right. That's how they get there. So there's only a small minority of premier programs in the SEC, the Big Ten, and we're talking the Ohio States, Alabama, Texas, Georgia's of the world, right? Those are the programs that kind of see their football teams as just straight up cash grabs, right? They they bring in enough money that they subsidize all of the all of the programs, um, athletics departments. And those programs generate tens of millions of dollars in profit every single time. So even among some of these high-profile athletic departments in PowerFour conferences, most of them run on large operational deficits. And all of these are unsustainable because what they spend it on is facilities, coach buyouts, travel costs. Now let me ask you, Darren, which of those do you think apply to the University of Utah? Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_03 5:58

The coach buyout would be one of them.

SPEAKER_02 6:00

The answer is all three. Yeah. So when you go isn't something that normally happens for Utah, though. Spending on facilities, the Spence and Cleon Eccles Football Center was $11.89 million dollars. The John M. and Karen Huntsman Basketball Training Center, $17.83 million. The Ken Garf Red Zone at Ricycle Stadium, $61.03 million. That totals $90 million that the university is paying back with interest as of now. Coaching buyouts. Uh, I don't know if anybody remembers a guy named Kyle Whittingham. Rings a bell. Yeah, he didn't just walk away and over head over to Michigan for free. No. Last year, when he left, he received a $13.5 million separation agreement. Yes, it was paid across three years, but just last year, eight million dollars of it was paid to him. Or sorry, eight million, he gets eight million this year. Right. Four million in 2027, and a million and a half in 2028. That is a lot of money to pay somebody just to not coach for you anymore. Right. Right. So all of that is also in that built into that deficit that we're seeing. Right. And then the the last one on that list was travel costs. You remember back in the day when we had like the Pac-12?

SPEAKER_03 7:14

Oh, yeah. Uh, this is a good one. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I know where you're going there.

SPEAKER_02 7:17

Man, those were the days, right? Furthest travel was like six hours. I thought we had a non-conference game, maybe. I think we had a home and home series against Baylor. Or, you know, just any other random Power Force school, you'd have like one home and home series.

SPEAKER_03 7:30

Right.

SPEAKER_02 7:30

You seen the map lately for the Big 12?

SPEAKER_03 7:32

Oh my gosh, dude.

SPEAKER_02 7:33

Yeah, Utah, BYU, ASU, and Arizona are the furthest west teams. Okay, so all those are pretty much in line with each other. You're like a two-hour plane ride. So if we're lucky to play those two teams in the same year, you know, travel those three, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 7:46

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, those three schools.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Travel costs might be drastically down because otherwise you got West Virginia, UCF, Cincinnati. Those teams are on the other side of the country. Yeah. And this comfort realignment is just it's killing travel costs, right? Which it comes directly out of the university's budget. So this isn't just Utah, right? These are things that are happening with Utah that are being spotlighted because of Utah took a private equity deal.

SPEAKER_03 8:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

Every single D1 program is making updates to their facilities. Most of them had to have had coaching turnover. And we all know because of conference realignment, all of them are battling travel costs. So Utah is under the microscope because everyone sees private equity and thinks that Utah is turning strictly to a for-profit model. But realistically, the only way that you become Alabama, Ohio State, Texas, Georgia is by getting cash infused to the program so that you can build it and continue to build successful athletic departments. That's it. That that's that's my whole spiel, right? You have to have money come in so that you can continue to build and bring in players and match all of these Texas techs of the world or whatever. That's what has to happen.

SPEAKER_03 9:00

So do you think that uh University of Utah was just a little over their skis for a couple of years there and it just then the move to the Big 12 kind of put them in a situation where they're like, okay, we're gonna keep up with what we were doing, and then you know, just didn't recognize how far over the balance sheet? Do you my question is do you think that uh other teams are operating at this high of a deficit?

SPEAKER_02 9:21

I I would be very surprised if a lot of them were not.

SPEAKER_03 9:24

Okay. So you're saying like this $50 million deficit is the only reason why the state auditor is throwing up a red flag and why it's press news is simply because of the private equity thing. You're thinking other state institutions are probably operating at somewhere close to the same level of deficit, and it's only making headlines because of the private equity deal.

SPEAKER_02 9:40

And I think, yes, exactly. The private equity has flagged this so that it makes it news. Any other time the school's audited, Utah's been running into their reserves for the last couple of years. That's the only reason that they ever show a positive, is because they pull money out of their ever out of their reserves, cover just enough that they need, and then they show a profit.

SPEAKER_03 10:00

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Right? Last year they had to do more because they had to pay Kyle Whittingham. They have all these loans, right? Like they had to start paying on the Ken Garf Red Zone Echo Center. Like that's a 15-year loan. I I'm not sure on the math there, but 61 million over 15 years is probably it's quite a bit of money, right? You're talking three to four million dollars a year.

SPEAKER_03 10:21

Yeah, which isn't bad. Not a bad loan.

SPEAKER_02 10:24

But but now you do that with the other 17, yeah, you know, 20, what, 28 million. So now you've got 10 million dollars a year that you're losing just paying off or just paying back for the facility upgrades that you've made. So I don't know. I I don't I I do think that a lot of these other D1 programs are operating at the same types of deficits. I don't think it's as big as a as big of a red flag as everyone's making it out to be. All Utah has to do is get the football program back in line, start winning football games. Everything works.

SPEAKER_03 11:01

Gotcha. So you're saying solution is win games, right? Win games, yeah. So do we think the private equity deal was done out of desperation to steer the ship in the right direction? And that they know that they were operating and that something like this had to happen.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

Yeah, and I'm just I'm not sure desperation is quite the right word for what they did. You know what I mean? Like, I think Utah's positioning themselves with funding to take this program to the next level. Is there some risk? Yeah, absolutely. Anytime, right? Yeah, go ask, go ask Bill Gates, Warren Buffett. Hell, you can ask Ryan Smith. Like, you don't make yourself successful without there being some risk associated with it, right? Nobody does. All of these guys have taken big swings and it either paid off or it didn't. I would feel better about the youths taking the swing with private equity, having the cash, you know, being able to infuse some money into the university and have the ability to like at some point we're gonna have to start paying some of these guys, you know, at least have that option.

SPEAKER_03 12:01

Yeah, no, I I'm I'm right there with you, which is funny because I asked uh in the pre-show meeting, I I didn't I asked you if desperation was the right word and you said yes, and now you're telling me it's not. Yes, that's correct. Okay, I like it. Um second question I have here is uh how will you how will this affect Utah's ability to compete with the Texas Texas of the conference? Are they going to have a check? Are they gonna have to like are they gonna be able to cut a check for these players, or are they gonna have to check with a suit back in New York to sign a player?

SPEAKER_02 12:34

Yeah, I mean, and that's the thing is Utah has to be able to they've got to be able to dish out this $20.5 million in revenue sharing, right? With the current deficit they were at, they were not gonna be able to dish out 20 more 20 and a half million more dollars.

SPEAKER_03 12:47

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:48

And and still be even remotely to where an auditor's like, you guys are good to go. Right. So now that has to cover all of the sports. Typically, college football commands roughly 75% of that budget um for most schools. So that's but that's roughly $15 million a year per team that you're using for NIL funding. So if they can get there and they can keep getting talent and like uh using that money effectively to bring and keep guys that are going to move this, they won't have any issues staying right up there with the Texas Text of the world, right? The whole reason the thing was put in place revenue sharing can be used up to $20.5 million. So yeah, I mean it gives them an option to have that money to spend and be able to use it to make the football program better.

SPEAKER_03 13:36

So to kind of put a cherry on this whole Sunday here is that the do we see that this is kind of like an all eyes on Utah football program type moment here where we see whether or not private equity belongs in college sports?

SPEAKER_02 13:51

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, it is absolutely all eyes on Utah. And I'd be willing to bet that most schools have looked into this exact same model. And if they hadn't done it before, they're probably looking into it now. And since Utah was the first one to commit to it, you better believe that every single university is watching what Utah does and how they use it and if it's effective, and they want to know how this whole thing plays out, which the thing is, is Utah as a university is in national media right now. That is always a good thing, my friend. Right, and and they're in a and they're in national media saying, hey, these guys just took $500 million from a private equity firm. And if if you're a 19, 18, 19-year-old kid looking to commit somewhere and you heard that Utah's got 500 million, you're not thinking they have any issues paying, guys.

SPEAKER_03 14:45

Right, yeah, exactly. Yeah, I just yeah, there was enough on this, so we're not gonna go too much further into it. I just felt it was enough for us to bring up and talk about the story because again, it came up this week, it came over up over the weekend. Pretty big deal. You know, yeah, not as big a deal as you know one would think, but it was enough to generate headlines, and obviously when they generate headlines, we gotta talk about it. So how that works.

SPEAKER_02 15:10

So that's what we're here for, man.

SPEAKER_03 15:12

Oh, yeah. Oh yeah, for sure, for sure. We want to hear from you folks. Let us know what your thoughts are in the comments down below. Please feel free to jump in. Let us know what your thing, what your thoughts are regarding the Otro Capital and uh the University of Utah. That partnership, do you think it's a good idea, bad idea? Is this story a nothing burger? Does it mean something, nothing, everything? We want to hear from you. Let us know what your thoughts are in the comments down below. Um, you know, AJ? You know what I think of when I think of you know private equity, you know what it reminds me of? What's that, buddy? It reminds me of like the first like 15 minutes of a disaster movie. Yeah. You know, everybody, you know, you know what I'm talking about though? That scene, like where everybody's, you know, smiling, shaking hands. They're so proud of the deal they just struck. Consultants are there with their binders, their charts, you know, champagne, enough PowerPoint presentations to crash a terabyte hard drive. You know what I'm talking about? You know, and then you hit the skip forward side of the screen a couple couple times there, and then you're left standing in the rubble of something that was once great that survived over a hundred years, survived multiple wars, inflation, recession, competitors, changes in technology, and whatever the hell that whole NFT thing was, um, just to fall apart by some Wall Street suit with a fucking spreadsheet.

SPEAKER_06 16:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:27

The playbook's always the same. It's always the same. They start by buying a company, they talk about optimizing their capital structure and streamlining their profits, their processes. They borrow money against the company, and then they charge them management fees for the privilege of being owned by them. They sell off all their assets in real estate, and they start the inevitable corporate talk about why the company is struggling and how it's always some regulator's fault. Uh, even in their bankruptcy hearing, they're sitting there talking about unexpected market conditions. When I first heard the news, I thought, okay, maybe this will be okay. Or, more than likely, maybe in five years down the road, we'll see this 134-year-old football program that has entered chapter 11, and probably because we're gonna be blaming it on that new conference realignment shenanigans, right? So, which way will this all play out? I don't know. I know it didn't go so well for Sealer, Sears, Radio Shack, Joanne's Fabric, Party, Party City, Red Lobster, Toys Are Us. The list goes on and on. That was literally just the last 10 years, AJ. So, do I know how this will play out? No, I don't. But one thing I do know is that whenever private equity enters the chat, nobody wins. That was that was great. We wanted to hear from you folks. Let us know where your thoughts are. Get in the comments down below. Please chime in. We got a great comment here from Greg Hawkins, channel legend, Greg Hawkins. We can't afford a football team anymore. That's the harsh truth. Okay. I think I know where he's coming from on that, man. This whole, you know, NIL stuff, and you know, I think they're kind of going the wrong way. I think the NIL thing was originally designed in spirit to let these kids, you know, go to a local dealership and get paid 10 grand to sign autographs for a couple hours. You know, that's absolutely what it was.

SPEAKER_02 18:16

That's what be in a video game, be in a video game and make 40 bucks or whatever it is to have your name and be in the video game the whole time. And yeah. I think it's actually like 300 bucks, and they get a copy of the video game with themselves in it.

SPEAKER_03 18:29

Yeah, with their player stats maxed out, right? Like, yeah, that's what happens with MLB the show. It's pretty cool, actually. Yeah, yeah. So I I follow a few who actually get to play with the players when and then the version of the game they get, their player stats are completely maxed out for them. You know, it's pretty fun. Um, but yeah, man, I just think it's it was in the spirit of the rule, we kind of got in the way of it a little bit, and now it just became a pay-to-play scenario. And I think I kind of know exactly where he's coming from. Just out here, it's we're not the South, man. It's you taught you know, college football is not everything, you know, and it's kind of one of those things where it's gonna be a little tricky to kind of find up, find ways to compete and play in this arena, and this might be this might be the solution. Might not.

SPEAKER_02 19:11

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there's definitely a chance.

SPEAKER_03 19:14

Yeah. But I think you have to take the risk. You definitely do. I definitely think that's like it was either this or what. What are you gonna do? You can't go to the cookie guy, he's down the street. Yeah, who else are you gonna go to? You already have Huntsman, you already have you know, the Eccles. Like, who else are you gonna go to? Yeah, they already loaned you 90 million. Yeah, and you're not going to, yeah, that's a loan. What's what are we talking about, Eccles? Come on, guys. And then, you know, obviously the jazz owner, he's down south too. Like, you gotta, you know, we gotta find a new billionaire.

SPEAKER_02 19:42

What are the mill what are the millers doing? Do they have any college associated like affiliations? Because we could really use the millers right now.

SPEAKER_03 19:52

Given the fact that they did not have a jazz home game on Sunday for like 15, 20 years, I think I know which direction they're leaning on that one.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

Good point.

SPEAKER_03 20:00

We've got another comment here from Greg Hawkins, Channel Legend. Utah is going with Otro Capital because we literally cannot afford to keep the athletic department going. Expenses are going up higher than revenues. We are running in a deficit every year now, and it's unsustainable. So yeah, I think that's definitely not necessarily a skies falling version of it. I think if you take that comment there, you're gonna there's a lot of truth in that, you know. There's a lot of truth in that. And it's either a pack it up and just say, okay, we're now just strictly a academic college, you know, where we're the leaders in medicine in the country, and then just hold your head on that, you know, or you gotta find a solution. And I think this is a great way, great solution to take a risk on and try. Yeah, yeah. We'll see. Yeah, we'll see. Again, folks, we want to hear from you. Let's know where your thoughts are in the comments down below. Oh, we got one more for here from Greg. Greg, love it, dude. Keep it going. Uh, let's see here. Otro is the hatchet man before it goes away.

SPEAKER_02 20:59

Greg, your two sky is fallen, man. Easy.

SPEAKER_03 21:03

Hey, I just think he's aligning with me and my little spiel there.

SPEAKER_02 21:06

Yeah, tone down your spiel, Darren. Utah football we're talking about. Can I give you an example?

SPEAKER_03 21:11

Of an example of how um sky's not falling and how this works out. Yeah. Dodgers are owned by private equity, the Guggenheim Group. They've done nothing but invest and invest and invest and invest in that team to the point where, you know, their uh valuation went from $3 billion to over $11 billion. That company now just bought the Lakers. So sorry for us jazz fans, the Lakers are never gonna be worse than they are now.

SPEAKER_06 21:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:36

So that's not good news. But, you know, there is evidence out there of when private equity buys into a team and actually does things for good and not for bad. So, you know, there's definitely room for optimism there, except for Greg. Greg does not see the optimism of that. Yeah, but Utah is not the Dodgers.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

But we could be, Greg. Okay, we could be the Dodgers. Dodgers.

SPEAKER_03 22:00

You know, before the Dodgers were bought by the Guggenheim group, they owned Vin Scully $300,000.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_03 22:06

Yeah. Their legendary broadcaster was owing $300,000 of back pay. You know, that's how broke the Dodgers were in LA. Storied franchise. And you know, it's just, and now they have the highest payroll in baseball just because we jumped in and helped out. Thanks, Magic Johnson. Appreciate it. Um, but okay, let's go ahead and pivot on over. Uh, since we're talking a little bit about baseball, let's talk some baseball, AJ. Let's do it. But first, before we get into the content, folks, we'd like to encourage you to join the conversation in the comments down below. While you're down there, consider subscribing to Major League DNA and make sure you smash that like button for your boy AJ right over there. Do it. What's up, Darren?

SPEAKER_02 22:51

We're back.

SPEAKER_03 22:52

You ready to talk Major League Baseball? Dude, I'm absolutely so ready to talk baseball.

SPEAKER_02 22:56

So here's my question Major League Baseball, it may be headed towards its biggest labor battle in more than 30 years, right? Yeah. And the opening proposal from the owners has already drawn quite a line in the sand here, right? For the first time since the 1994 strike that canceled the World Series, MLB owners have formally proposed a hard salary cap. And on the surface, the proposal includes both a salary cap and a salary floor. Yeah, a salary cap and a salary floor. And that's, I mean, that's something the fans have have really argued the baseball needs to improve the competitive balance. But I don't know, man, when you dig into the details, this thing gets a little bit more complicated, huh?

SPEAKER_03 23:37

Yeah, man. Yeah. It does a little bit. Does it do you know what the offer is on the I do? Okay. I do, yeah. You're gonna break that down for us, right?

SPEAKER_02 23:45

Absolutely. Yeah. So the league is proposing a $245 million salary cap and a $171 million salary floor. So beginning in 2027, along with a 50-50 revenue split and between owner. Sorry, I read that I read that way wrong though. Along with a 50-50 revenue split between owners and players. So because a player benefits would count against those payroll figures, though, the real cap would be closer to 222 million and the real floor would be around 148 million. So this would create a massive change in the league, right? I mean, teams like the Dodgers would be forced to cut 140 million from their payroll, while you know, probably a dozen other teams would really need to increase spending just to reach that minimum threshold.

SPEAKER_03 24:31

Right.

SPEAKER_02 24:31

So what are your thoughts on this?

SPEAKER_03 24:34

Okay, so let's start with what the players' uh main points were for their argument. Yeah. And then sorry, for their proposal. Then we'll then we'll talk about the main points for the owners' rebuttal. Yeah. And then kind of come see where they match and also what I'm surprised about.

SPEAKER_02 24:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 24:51

So let's go ahead and start. So the the first one was the players wanted a competitive integrity tax of 150 million. Right. So that basically is a let's say that's like a soft floor of 150 million. What was the players, uh, the owner's salary floor? 171 million.

SPEAKER_02 25:12

171, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:13

So the owners want a higher salary floor than the players do.

SPEAKER_02 25:17

Right.

SPEAKER_03 25:17

That's interesting.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:19

Minimum salary. They wanted uh to be raised to 1.5 million. They also wanted to increase the collective bargaining tax threshold from 244 million, which is what it is right now, up to 300 million. Uh, they also wanted more revenue sharing from local TV deal TV deals and not from stadium revenue. Um, free agency for players that are above 30 with 30 with five years of service time, uh, and also remove pre-arbitration years. So right from the first year that you're on, after that first year when you're called up and you're no longer a rookie, your arbitration starts right after that, right? So that's basically what they con what they wanted to go with, right? Now the owner side, like you mentioned, hard cap of 245 million, floor of 171 million. They want a 50-50 revenue split league-wide. And now they also want uh centralized meteor rights, eliminating blackouts, and one of the last things was they want it to be a seven-year deal, not a five-year deal. So both also want a salary floor, so they that's Calvin Ground there. They both want a salary floor. I find it's interesting that the players want a lower salary floor than the owners do.

SPEAKER_02 26:29

But they don't, though. Because the the players want 150 million, right?

SPEAKER_03 26:34

Right, but that also includes their benefits too.

SPEAKER_02 26:36

Oh, they want 150 with the benefits. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 26:38

Oh, okay. So it's the same argument. Oh, okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 26:43

I didn't realize that the players had that same thing in there.

SPEAKER_03 26:45

Yeah, they didn't counter it, they didn't that that's not pulled out. The the salary the players get are the salaries the players get with the benefits, right? So that same number would be counted either way. Okay. So, and even it wasn't, that's a difference of two million, right? So you're there. You're right there. So they agree on that, and it's just a little weird that the owners in this case want more of a payout than the players do, which I think is kind of weird. But I also think that it's great that they both agree they want to end blackouts, which if you live here in Utah and you are a fan of any other team but the Diamondbacks and the Rockies, you're screwed up about 30 to 40 games a year.

SPEAKER_02 27:21

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 27:23

It's a nightmare. Do not live in Vegas, by the way. That absolutely sucks. In Vegas, you're blocked out from like eight different teams if you're in Vegas.

SPEAKER_02 27:30

Yeah, because you're Dodgers, Padres, Diamondbacks, Rockies, A's, A's, Giants. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like it's literally all of those teams, too. Probably the Mariners.

SPEAKER_03 27:42

Yeah, and the Rockies, yeah. Did you say the Rockies?

SPEAKER_02 27:44

I said the Rockies, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:46

So yeah, they're basically like seven teams that you can't uh watch. And I think there's another one up in the east. Uh, that there's someone who told me that there's like they're blocked out of like 15 games, 15 teams. Yeah. Because of the regional sport network. Blockouts are ridiculous, though. It's it's a little nutty, you know. And uh that's why we want to talk about our channel sponsor this week, which is just kidding, we don't have a sponsor for a VPN. That would be dope, though.

SPEAKER_02 28:09

Surfshark, hit us up.

SPEAKER_03 28:11

Yeah, exactly. That's who I use. Hey, dude, me too. Right on.

SPEAKER_02 28:14

Oh, hell yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:14

We gotta talk to him. Yeah, gotta reach out. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so some of the things that I noticed that surprised me is that the owners again want to hire salary forward than the players do. Uh, something else that was kind of surprising is that MLB's proposal has two-thirds of the league out of compliance with their own offer, AJ. Right. You have 12 teams that are under the salary floor. 12 teams, AJ. 12. Okay. 12. How many? There's there's 12 of them, AJ. And this is a united front of all owners. Yeah. Okay. So you're telling me there are 12 teams that aren't paying 171 now that will agree to do it next season. Right. Like, oh, okay, yeah, sure. And there are some teams that are more than 50 million dollars under this, AJ. They're just like, okay, sure, we'll pay, you know, we'll double, almost triple our payroll. Yeah, not a big deal. There's a team last year that was at 72 million in payrolls. I think it was uh Sacramento A's. They're gonna spend $100 million more next year. Like, what they're just gonna overpay the sh out of some people. So you're telling me they could play, they could pay more, but they just decided not to, is basically what you're talking about. They're like, no, we're good. So when the players are talking about their thing where they're saying, oh, we need to end tanking, anybody who says there's tanking in baseball just doesn't watch baseball, there's no tanking. No, there's greedy owners. That's all there is. They want to make money, that's all they care about. Yeah, they'll make the bare minimum, they'll pay the bare minimum they have to before getting in trouble, but other than that, it's just a cash grab for them. They don't care if they get good players, they just want to make money. There's no such thing as tanking in baseball. Um, now the other side of it there is that there are also eight teams, AJ, that are over the cap. So there are eight teams that are over 245 million, which are the Braves, and this is coming from descending order. The Braves, the Padres, Red Sox, Phillies, Blue Jays, Mets, Yankees, and of course the Dodgers, right? So go Braves. Those last three teams are gonna have to share shed their payroll by over a hundred million dollars. At least Braves, Mets, sorry, the Braves are only 266. Yeah. Uh that so I'm saying the Dodgers, Mets, and Yankees, $100 million are gonna have to shave off their payroll. Yeah, you're telling me they agreed to do this?

SPEAKER_06 30:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:26

Like okay, don't worry. We have guaranteed contracts, and we're just gonna eat $100 million and pay it out of our own pocket for you know however long. Like Yeah, but how does that work? Because you can't go over the hard salary cap, right? No, so what are you gonna do?

SPEAKER_02 30:42

Just trade them away.

SPEAKER_03 30:44

What about teams with no trade clause? It's like Shoei Otani. Yeah, I mean, he's only making two million a year, so I guess it's not really that big a deal. Yeah, he's he's definitely not one you're trading away. So that's what I'm saying, man. Like, here's a united front of all the owners. 12 teams agreed to drastically increase their payroll for this. Yeah, they could pay for it, they just haven't. So every single team that's crying, wham, uh every fan that's crying, wham, my teams can't pay with that. Your order just agreed to make a pay $171 million in payroll. Minimum. Minimum. So if they are not paying that now, that means they can and they won't. Yeah. Right? So that should piss you off. Secondly, I don't know how these teams, the Braves, maybe the Braves, they're they're they're like five million dollars off of that. They just don't sign one pitcher and they're fine.

SPEAKER_02 31:29

They're actually $21 million off. Braves payroll is $266.

SPEAKER_03 31:35

Oh, I had it in $254. Oh, according to the spot track.

SPEAKER_02 31:38

Yeah, I just looked it up before. Oh, okay. $266.

SPEAKER_03 31:41

Okay. So, um, yeah, so we got all these teams, right, that are above it. We got all these teams that are below it, but a lot of these teams, they agree just to cut their payroll just to meet this, like, you know, and all the revenue sharing, like they're like, I don't see how the Dodgers and Yankees will agree to share, like pool all their revenue for their TV money, because they're giving more than they're getting out of that.

SPEAKER_02 32:00

Way, way, way more.

SPEAKER_03 32:02

Yeah, yeah. So that doesn't really make a lot of sense, especially with the Dodgers with their cushy TV rights deal, how they're not they don't have to pay as much as everybody else because of the whole McCord era. They're gonna just get it, give that up. Yeah, but this doesn't make any sense to me. And the only reason why I think of it is because the player, the owners, and this is my this is my minutiae of this, right? The owners know that there's no way in God's green earth this deal ever goes through.

SPEAKER_02 32:25

Right.

SPEAKER_03 32:25

So they are starting off as far as they can and just expecting it to go more towards the center. They're gonna start with a lower floor and a higher cap, and to the point where they get rid of one or the other, if not both, and then come to some kind of other agreement elsewhere. But that's kind of what I'm thinking of. This this statement was made in no good faith from the ownership. They know that 90% of this is not gonna get through. And it's only those two things that they actually agree on that we might see some movement on. That's my take on this. So, my question for you is lockout inevitable at this point? Actually, I'm probably one of the others. Uh, everybody's like saying it's like 90% or 100%. I was at 90% before I saw this, but where they're actually meeting in the middle already, I'm down to like 75%. There's a lockout. Okay. I'm actually more optimistic. We're talking like June 1st was exactly six months away from when this thing expires, right? So the current CBA expires. We're already one two pro one proposal from each side, and we already agree on two things, right? So, like common ground can be met as long as they continue to meet in good faith and no one like gets like their feelings hurt, you know, we could see some progression towards the center. So, lockout, I'm down from 90 to 75 percent. I don't know, what do you think?

SPEAKER_02 33:42

Yeah, no, I I think it's probably a lot lower. But speaking of June 1st, that's a great segue into our next segment. Hey Darren, did you know?

SPEAKER_03 33:51

Well, before we get into that, should we hit these should we hit these comments? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So let's go ahead and scroll up here. Uh let's see here. What is this one? Let's see here. Cheese gates like Rickets will totally support the salary cap. I like it. Jed Hoyer will never spend again. Yeah, I I don't know about that, man. I don't. I really, really don't.

SPEAKER_02 34:19

Not like he was spending much before.

SPEAKER_03 34:21

Yeah, that's kind of what I was like, you know, thinking of. And then we also have oh yeah, so this is what I was talking about. Yeah, Iowa has 16, 16 blackouts, cups, white sox, brewers, twins, cardinals, and royals. That is brutal. I think it's Virginia. Virginia is blocked out of Braves, Rays, Pittsburgh, White Sox. There's like, I can't remember somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 34:43

Yeah, like some of these some of these blackout mars markets are like crazy.

SPEAKER_03 34:48

Yeah. Friend of the channel, Tommy Price, blackouts are ridiculous. And then we have there's no taking in baseball, just bad teams. I'd argue that there's just bad ownership. Like, that's what I would say.

SPEAKER_02 34:59

Yeah, bad ownership that makes bad teams.

SPEAKER_03 35:01

They're just like, yeah, we'll just make money. There's like five teams that have been bottom faders for like over a decade that spent a little bit of money, not a lot. They signed like two mid-level players, yeah. And those teams are leading, and one of those teams are leading their division. Like, it's kind of like, okay, you can say like you, oh, you can never catch the Dodgers, but you don't have to spend 400 million. No, just spend a little bit, just a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 35:25

Like cut into that. Maybe like 171 million.

SPEAKER_03 35:28

Yeah, maybe like 171. I like this comment. Dodgers are in favor of it because they can spread spend less uh and meet the team cap saves the Guggenheim money. Yeah, but what are they gonna do with it? Like, what are they gonna do? Trade half their team to get into that number? Like, they're not gonna do that. Right now, there's gotta be a loophole in there somewhere. Like, there's but it's like there's no no way around it. A hard cap is a hard cap, right? So yeah, uh, by the way, did you count how many times that um I thought this was interesting in the players and the owners, you know how many times that they mention the Dodgers by name? No, eighteen times.

SPEAKER_02 36:08

Dodgers are ruining everything, man. We did a video on that. Make sure you guys check that out.

SPEAKER_03 36:13

Yeah. And we got another comment here from Greg Hawkins. Let's see here. Uh, they can buy Disneyland or something with it. Pretty sure that was the Angels that did that, right? Uh oh, it was Disney that bought the Angels. Yeah. Um, all right, but let's go ahead and jump into our next segment there. Uh we talked about we're six months away from the CBA, but what's also most important about this?

SPEAKER_02 36:36

June 1st, man. June 1st. I don't know if you guys are aware, but June 1st serves as a highly reliable indicator of who will ultimately make the postseason. Since the advent of the wild card era in 1996, nearly 60% of teams holding at least a share of their division lead on June 1st have gone on to win their division. So, well, it's early enough for teams to kind of make you know a comeback. It's not saying that they're all of them are too far gone, but you know, the first two months are usually a pretty good um kind of indicator of what the season could be. And you know, players have had enough at bats, teams have had enough, you know, uh their pitchers in enough rotations. Kind of gives you an idea. So I don't know, man. Uh that that's kind of crazy. How do you feel about the current leaders in both of these different in both leagues?

SPEAKER_03 37:31

Yeah, so um this is what this is a subject we actually did a video on on the main channel, DA Sports Recap. If you're not check it out, subscribe. Um, it's one of our earlier videos. Yeah. Uh so hopefully this one's a little bit more polished. Um, but let's go ahead and talk about the current leaders on the American lead side, right? So on the AL East, we got the Tampa Bay race. Yep. Uh they're at 36 and 23. They lead the Yankees by a game. Uh in the Central, we have the Cleveland Guardians. Um, they're 35 and 27. They leave the White Sox by a game and a half. Uh, and then in the AL East, we have the Seattle Mariners who lead the Rangers by uh a game and a half as well. Um, on the National League side, we have the Atlanta Braves, uh, who are 40. They are 41 and 20. They have a nine and a half game lead on the Phillies. Nine and a half game lead. Um, then in the MLB Central, uh, we have the Milwaukee Brewers who lead the Pittsburgh Pirates by three and a half games. And then in the uh West, we have the Dodgers, 39 and 22. They lead the San Diego Padres by four and a half games. Um, so that's where all the that's where the standings are. So 60% of those teams are going to have their division by the end of the year. Yeah. And I so who do you think are gonna be the teams that fall out of the AL? Is there a team in the AL that you think is gonna fall out?

SPEAKER_02 38:50

Yes, I think that the Yankees could pass the Rays. Um the Yankees have just kind of they've they've gone a little bit more of a tear lately, you know. I mean, they're I could see them excelling as the weather kind of warms up, ball flies a little further in warm weather, win a few more games, you know, past the rays to kind of get to take that division. I think the Rays will definitely make the playoffs. Yeah. But I could see the I could see the Yankees passing the Rays um for the division lead.

SPEAKER_03 39:19

Yeah, I concur. As far as as far as my 40%, I think spot on one of those teams is definitely going to be the Yankees. Uh just a few other things. Their rotation is better. They got uh Cole back, you have uh Max Fried, and not to mention um Schlitler and some of the other pitchers they have on that team, uh, that it just you know continue to shove. Judge, you can never count him out. And you know, you got um gosh, who's the kid I'm thinking of? That I can't remember off the top of my head. Anyway, uh their first baseman uh that uh for some reason uh their coach did not want to play. He's like, Oh, I like having him come in in those spot choices when I get to put him in the lineup. I'm like, you know, this guy's batting over 500 for you as a D as a as a bench roll, like just let him play, you know. And ever since then they kind of took off and went on a couple runs and they scale back a little bit, but you're right, they're a hot team right now, and I agree with you on that one. Um, who's your other team?

SPEAKER_02 40:14

I would say the Guardians probably have the next best chance of losing, and I think they could lose it to the White Sox. Yes, Darren, you heard that right. The White Sox.

SPEAKER_03 40:25

Okay, run your line on this one. I want to hear it.

SPEAKER_02 40:27

I just think that um Munataka Murakumi has just been great for the White Sox this year. Um, they've had some great pitching from Davis Martin, Eric Freddie, or Fetty, and uh, you know, they got Dominguez coming out of the bullpen in safe situations. They've just they've looked like a team that's kind of on a mission after a lot of really tough baseballs for baseball years for the White Sox. All of a sudden I feel like they've got a little bit of momentum. Um I I I don't know how the Guardians keep winning. They do. Um, but they're not on a tear of any sort. They're like, you know, they'll lose a series here and lose a series there and then like eight straight. And then they'll win eight straight. Yeah, exactly. They'll you know, lose two out of three, lose two out of three, and then win eight straight. So it's like I don't know if that's super sustainable for the for the Guardians. I could see the White Sox taking them and and winning the division, which would be really cool for a team that was the bottom feeder of the league for three years.

SPEAKER_03 41:24

Yeah, it'd be really cool to see a team that has back-to-back hunter loss seasons to win their division in a few years. Absolutely, yeah. That'd be awesome. And I am fully a believer in the magic of Murakami, man. Right now, he's third in MLB in home runs with 20. Dude is just smashing the baseball dude. It's insane. Guy is fun to watch, right? Like people are like, oh, what's your favorite part about about your game? He's like, uh, power. Power. I have power. I'm just like, dude, yeah, that guy's got it, man.

SPEAKER_02 41:50

He's got it, he's got it figured out.

SPEAKER_03 41:51

Yeah, he knows what he's good for, man, for sure. Um, but yeah, I just think it's pretty funny, man. Uh, yeah, there's a lot to uh a lot to go into with that. But I think yeah, June 1st is always a good indication. And you and I are actually spot on both of those. Um, I definitely think out, you know, as far as the AL West, I think the Mariners are actually going to win this one. I agree. They the the Mariners got better at the end of last year.

SPEAKER_02 42:14

They played better, yeah. Yeah, like as the season got further in, the Mariners got better and better. Or it was like, this team's actually looking scary. And they did. I mean, they made a they made a great run. So I I don't know if I I feel like they'll continue to get better throughout the rest of this year. And uh I think we're we're kind of yet to see the Mariners' best baseball. You know, game and a half lead over the Rangers. I think they could they could probably put a little bit of fluff on that by the end of the season.

SPEAKER_03 42:38

Speaking of which, I think both of our uh bolt predictions are in danger right now. What was no, my bolt prediction was the Phillies missed the playoffs. Yeah, but they're on a tear, dude. I know they're an eight and a half game back. On a tear, but come on. They are they are like two games out of a wild card position right now. Oh, is that it? Yeah, oh damn. Okay, maybe you're right. You're like, I don't know how close they are. Correct me if the comments are wrong, but I think they're like two and a half, three games out of a out of a wild card spot. Okay. And then mine was the athletics were gonna win their division, so not looking good so far. Not looking great. It's fine. It's good. It's a bold prediction for a reason, guys. Yeah, absolutely. But yeah. So let's go ahead and mine still got a chance.

unknown 43:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:15

I hate autocorrect, dude. I hate autocorrect. Uh, because it um changed mine from scu ball to skull. It does it so much. I hate it. I'm like, why am I talking about a skull? Anyway, so last week AJ brought up a subject that I felt deserved a deeper dive into it. I mean, we talked about the rumors around the Tigers potentially trading Turk Scuball if the Detroit Tigers don't turn things around. Timmy, a friend of the channel, Tammy Price, uh mentioned that uh it's either going to be the Braves or the Dodgers. So we thought it would be kind of fun if we each made a pitch for why we think our team is going to win the Turk Scuball. Sweepstakes.

SPEAKER_02 44:02

Yeah. So um why not the Braves, man? It's always a good argument we start with. Why not? Why why why not the Braves? Okay. The Braves have a they've they've got a pretty good um pipeline of prospects that they could trade. I don't know if it's worth it for trading that many prospects to get scoo ball. Okay, I will say that. But they're one of the best teams in baseball. The offense has been great for the better part of the year. You're going to join a pitching staff that has had great success with Sale, Strider, Bryce Elder, Grant Holmes. I mean, they still got Spencer Schwellenbach. You've got you've got the ability to give one of these guys, um, you know, run five, six guys. You got Derek Scuball to that. Nightmare pitching staff. Um and and and the the biggest thing is he could come to Atlanta and win, right? You could you could be on a team that is that's built for the long haul. They've got all these guys on long-term contracts. Um, they've got a bunch of guys on the roster right now that that provide a ton of depth. They're able to rotate guys in and out. I mean, we've got guys like Mauricio Dubon that can come in and play shortstop one game and play left field the next and plays fantastic in both positions. Um, they got a great bullpen. Uh uh Rassiel Iglesias has 11 saves. He is a 11 for 11 on saves so far this season. So you've got great support coming out of the bullpen. You know, if if you can keep it close and the Braves' offense sputters in late innings, you've got you know a good bullpen behind you. I don't know, man. I I think that the Braves is a great choice for Sku Ball because you can come here. I I don't know if they sign him long term, but I think if you want to come and have a chance to compete for a world champ, uh, you know, a world series this year, join the Braves.

SPEAKER_03 45:47

Yeah. Well, I don't think he really has a say in it.

SPEAKER_02 45:49

No, and I understand that. It's a it's a trade. Yeah, yeah, I get that. But but I'm saying it's it's one of those things that I think that I think the Braves have enough.

SPEAKER_03 45:57

Yeah, what I think is super nasty is you think about like in the playoffs you only really need four starters.

SPEAKER_02 46:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:03

So you're gonna be using Chris Sale, you know, you've got uh Spencer Strider, Spencer Strider, and then uh Terek Scuball. You're starting with Scuball, Snell, two Cy Young award winners on top of your rotation, and then you add um uh Strider, who if he stayed healthy, would be a frontline contender for Cy Young every year.

SPEAKER_02 46:26

Yep. Spencer Schwenbach had a fantastic season last year. Yeah, is he back from the aisle? He's not quite yet. I think he's got another 30 days.

SPEAKER_03 46:33

Okay, well, I'll wait until like just let him get informed by then, you know, by the end of it. Yep. Yeah, that can be scary, man. Yeah, it can be scary. Um, all right, so I love it, man. Love the pitch for for the Braves there. Um, all right, so let me let me say my part about how I think the Dodgers are gonna do this, right? Okay. And why the Dodgers should win the Tarek Scuball sweepstakes. Um, so we need to be honest for ourselves as fans. Okay. The team that trades for Scuball is going to be getting him for less than half a season. So maybe like eight starts before the playoffs.

SPEAKER_01 47:05

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 47:05

The Tigers are rumored to want something that's pretty impressive for this guy. Uh now the longer they wait, the less that package actually gets. And you go again, he still has to ramp up. He still has to show something that he's still the guy he was, you know, before any team agrees to trade for him. And the team has to not get back on it to be willing to trade him in the first place. All that said, let's say health and everything is perfectly fine, right? You want to have that, right? Um, they want what it's rumored that the Tigers want back for him is a uh frontline capable starter and a top outfield prospect that is MLB ready, possibly multiples of either or. Um, so can the Dodgers make the best offer uh between the two teams that we're talking about? Absolutely. Uh the reason why is there's only two teams that are above the Dodgers in um farm system, strength of strength of their farm system. Uh one of those I don't want getting it, which is the Brewers, and the other one is the Pirates. Um according this is according to Jim Bowden, uh the Dodgers could trade Justin Robleski or Emmett Sheehan, uh, which is the Dodgers' fifth and sixth starter, which would be number two starter on pretty much any other rotation out there.

SPEAKER_02 48:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:15

Um and the outfield prospects are gonna be Zire Hope, uh, Joseway DePala or uh Eduardo uh Quintero, right? Um not to mention even their best pitching prospect, River Ryan, right? So these are like all the names that have been floating around that the Tigers could possibly be interested in to get Scuball. Again, like you said, you're paying for a rental here. And what you said, one of the things that you don't think the Braves would do is you don't think they would trade their best uh minor league capital for the way they do business because that's their next 10 years. They probably are gonna trade that away for a rental of Scuball because they're probably not gonna sign Tarek Scuball to a $400 million contract. Right. That'd be like doubling their biggest contract they've ever had. So it's they are basically they would basically just be doing a rental here.

SPEAKER_02 49:03

Yeah, they're just hoping to go all in this year.

SPEAKER_03 49:05

Who knows when you even have baseball next year? Just full scene.

SPEAKER_02 49:08

Maybe maybe you maybe you trade Spencer Schwellenbach and J.R. Richie. J.R. Richie's one of their top, I mean, he's pitched three, four games, looked really good in a couple of them. Schwellenbach, Richie.

SPEAKER_03 49:19

They've got some good outfield prospects. Yeah, take those, bundle them in, send them over there. Yep, you know, and you know, just write them out for you.

SPEAKER_02 49:25

And now you're running sales strider, elder, homes, scuball.

SPEAKER_03 49:30

Yeah, you're probably going scuba, sale, strider.

SPEAKER_02 49:32

Right.

SPEAKER_03 49:33

In the playoffs, yeah. But like I would say, like, that's what you'd have to hope that they would do. Yeah. Let's just go for it.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 49:43

Right. The Dodgers would definitely do that. For several reasons. One, again, they're gonna have to shed a hundred million dollars in payroll next year, probably. Potentially, if that deal gets happened. And if there's a strike, you know, it doesn't matter, right? There's something on the Dodgers ledger that's not on any ledger and has not been on any ledger in professional sports since uh Kobe Bryant, which is a three-peat. Nobody has done that since Kobe Bryant three-peat with the Lakers, way back in the day with you know, was it Kobe or was that with uh um Casal? Can't remember which one the three-peat was with. Anyway, um, it's been that long, right? And it definitely has not happened in baseball. Late 90s, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:23

Yeah, it definitely hasn't no, that's actually early 2000s.

SPEAKER_03 50:25

Yeah, and that definitely hasn't happened in baseball since 1998, 2001, 2000, and that for with the with the Yankees, right? So um the the Dodgers are going for that, right? Would they be willing to trade all their prospects, some of their top prospects? Honestly, this isn't even really scratching their top of their prospect list. Yeah, they're third, they're at best, at worst, third best in baseball in farm system. Would they do this for a short term? Yeah, wouldn't mean anything to them. Definitely would do this, wouldn't even be a drop in the bucket. And then on top of that, I think if I am a fan and I am being honest, there's one reason and one reason only why the Dodgers do this. It keeps him off of a few teams that you do not want to have him on their team in the playoffs. Yep. That's it. Like the Braves. No, not the Braves. Um, but again, there are two teams that they could see like, do you really want to face the Brewers in a seven-game series when you have to face Scuball and uh the Miz twice? I think that's the same thing for the Braves. Okay, just for the record. They they dunked on Chris Cell pretty easily, the Dodgers did. But they did lose to Strider and they did lose to Felder. Right. So, you know, like I'm saying, I'm saying like the that that team last year was very potent against the Dodgers in the regular season. The Dodgers swept them in the playoffs, yeah. Right? You add Tarek Scuball to that team in the playoffs in the national championship series, it's scary. It's scary, and we'll probably run into them on a shorter game series. Imagine three out of five. Yeah, right? Let's hope they get that top spot for the buys, like the Braves and the Dodgers get the buys, right? Yeah. Nationally. You want to like that's just something you don't want to see in a short series, right? So, you know, that would be pretty dangerous. And then also there's some other teams that um, you know, I want to get into, but yeah, there's absolutely that I don't want to get into, but absolutely the Dodgers would seriously trade away a good chunk of their draft of their prospect capital simply just to keep this guy off of some other teams to secure a three-peat. Like they would do this 100%. Yeah. Now I could see that happening. Yeah. Will the Dodgers do that? Um, for those two reasons, yeah. I think they would. Now, all the other teams that would want him, would they be able to give as much as the Dodgers could give? The Brewers could. That's why I mentioned the Brewers specifically, because they have a better farm system than the Dodgers do.

SPEAKER_06 52:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 52:52

So honestly, AJ, if we break it all down to one thing, one thing both you and I can agree on, is we just really hope he doesn't end up on the Phillies.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

That is correct. Don't be on the Phillies, go anywhere but Philadelphia.

SPEAKER_03 53:06

Sanchez, Wheeler, and Scuba.

SPEAKER_02 53:08

Yeah, that's oh yeah, don't end up on the Phillies.

SPEAKER_03 53:13

Yeah. He like the Delta for the Dodgers, he doesn't improve the Dodgers that much.

SPEAKER_02 53:18

Right.

SPEAKER_03 53:19

You know, you got Yamamoto who pitched the whole World Series by himself last year. Shoe Otani, who's leading the league in ER area.

SPEAKER_02 53:25

It's more like making sure he's not somewhere else.

SPEAKER_03 53:28

Yes, that the Dodgers have to worry about, and that's why they want to have him. So anyway, we just thought that'd be a fun little experiment. We chat back and forth about that, yeah. Uh, which is fun. Uh, let's see here. We've got a comment from uh friend of the channel, Tommy Price. The only one thing against the Dodgers is he already had surgery. Seems like a lot of our pitching acquisitions need surgery. Okay, so you're following the old uh, what was that? The old uh who is that? Was that Tommy Lassoda that said that? There are two types of pitchers, those who had Tommy John and those who are going to have Tommy John. Like is that who yeah, I think so. It's either Tommy Lassoda or Billy being one of the two. I can't remember. Um, but sure, absolutely. All right, uh, you got a random baseball uh something?

SPEAKER_02 54:08

I do, and it's actually a bait, it's a random baseball question this year. Or this this year. This year. Okay, see next year, guys. This is the only one. Sorry, we're out. Lock out. We're we're locking out early. Um, I got a question on the A on the American. There's not really a race for the NL MVP. That's that's kind of set in stone. Shohei's got that pretty much. I mean, betting odds are like minus 150 on him.

SPEAKER_03 54:32

So do you know who's second?

SPEAKER_02 54:35

No. Isn't it still Matt Olson?

SPEAKER_03 54:37

No.

SPEAKER_01 54:38

Oh dang. It's definitely not Matt Olson.

SPEAKER_03 54:40

By the way, did you see what he did though?

SPEAKER_01 54:42

Which one? He's done a lot of things.

SPEAKER_03 54:45

More importantly, what he did yesterday. Uh so he's the current Iron Man, by the way. If you ever if you ever call him that, I'm gonna punch you in the face. Because there is only one Iron Man in baseball is Cal Ripkin Jr. Correct, right?

SPEAKER_02 54:57

Yeah so when people put that in an article, I'm just like 3,000 career games in a row or some shit.

SPEAKER_03 55:02

I know he's got the current longest streak right now. Yeah, but it's like 600 games. Yeah, but he hit a home run on Tuesday, which is the day we honor Lou Garrick, right? Which I think is awesome. Anyway, sorry, back to where you did.

SPEAKER_02 55:13

I did watch the home run. Um, I didn't realize that though. But anyways, so AL MVP race. I want to know if you think that Bobby Whitt Jr. can pass Aaron Judge and break through to win the the MVP. And what what do you think he needs? So I'll I'll give you some of their stats. Okay, so right now, um Bobby Witt Jr. is hitting 282, nine home runs, 26 RBIs, 19 stolen bases, SB equals MVP. That's right. If you know, you know. Um and current Aaron Judge is currently hitting 248 with 17 home runs, 38 RBIs, and five stolen bases. What do you think Aaron or what do you think Bobby Wood Jr. needs to pass Aaron Judge to really kind of take a step up in that AL MVP race?

SPEAKER_03 55:58

I hate to say this because Judge is on my fantasy team. Yeah. And he's missing the second day in a row with a bone bruise.

SPEAKER_06 56:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 56:06

I say that the only thing Bobby Wood Jr. has to do is stay healthy. Yeah. Because I think that at some point Judge is going to hit the IL and it's going to be for, you know, whatever reason. Uh it's going to be longer than two games. I just think his health, he's been relatively healthy most of this year. You know, every year he has a sit where he falls down, and he's just not nearly as far at this point of the season as he normally is when it comes to like home run and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_06 56:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 56:29

His batting average is a little low. I don't know what his war is at this year. Honestly, he's still a top three player in baseball. It's still gonna go down as the greatest, you know, right-handed hitter of all time, in my opinion. Uh, Aaron Judge will be. But I think Bobby Witt Jr. is putting up a I think he's leading the league uh with with the exception, leading the American League in war right now. Yeah. You know, who's leading an all baseball shohe? No, Paz.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

Pieses?

SPEAKER_03 56:55

Yeah, the Dodgers center fielder.

SPEAKER_02 56:57

No way.

SPEAKER_03 56:57

Yeah, leading all baseball with in war so far this year, which is interesting.

SPEAKER_02 57:01

That is very interesting.

SPEAKER_03 57:02

Yeah, but I think he leads the league in defensive runs above saved, and yeah, I think he's I think he's doing everything he needs to do. He's having an MVP caliber season, and as long as he stays healthy, stays on the field, keeps producing the way he is. I think it's gonna be a tough choice for someone not to choose him over just.

SPEAKER_02 57:16

I am such a big fan of Bobby Wood Jr. He is such a good player, man.

SPEAKER_03 57:20

He really is defensively.

SPEAKER_02 57:22

He is lights out, dude.

SPEAKER_03 57:23

And there might be some voter fatigue on on that too. On on the Aaron Judge, yeah, just like just like Shohei, but you know, when he's pitching below a one ERA.

SPEAKER_02 57:33

He just dominates in a different way every single year. And I I'm not a Dodgers fan, but how can you not love what Shohei does every single year?

SPEAKER_03 57:40

Yeah, it's pretty disgusting, to be honest with you. It's kind of nice to watch. Even when you watch him strike out in the important at bats, you know, he's still like you're like you're just like, oh geez, dude. He says, I want to win in Sun Young, and all of a sudden he's got the best ERA in baseball. So uh by the way, uh uh Tat our tap uh DNA sports recap hat to a um Christopher Sanchez of the Phillies. Uh-huh. His run of scoreless innings came to an end. Oh, it finally did? Yeah. So he did not pass a loser. He did not pass the bulldog. Uh, but hey, good show, old chap.

SPEAKER_02 58:15

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 58:16

Um, and screw the Phillies. Yeah. I've got a very I got an interesting one. Um, Greg, you're gonna like this one. Uh, did you see what uh happens when with the uh what uh Pico Anshron did uh when he faced getting booed and heckled?

SPEAKER_02 58:33

I did not see this.

SPEAKER_03 58:34

Okay, this is great. I think it was against the Cubs, not I think it was against the no the Cardinals. The Cubs are playing the Cardinals, right? And they have that whole tarps off section going on in a lot of baseball games right now. Yeah, which is where they they take it over an entire section, take their shirts off.

SPEAKER_02 58:46

They started in college football last season, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:49

Yeah, but you know, baseball's really kind of taking up it. They're doing it, they're having fun with it, right? And um, every time Peter Peter Armstrong came up to the plate, they chanted, overrated, overrated, right? And just constantly taunting the guy. And you know, he shut him up, he hit a ball, he got a hit, right? And they just next a bat he comes up, you know, he gets another single, right? And they just keep taunting, keep taunting him, and like overrated, just keeps chirping at him, right? And what he does then, which is something that just any major league baseball player that ever gets taunted would ever do. Um, he hits a bomb, not only a home run, but a home run directly into the tarps off section that is standing there chanting overrated at him. He hits a home run right at him.

SPEAKER_00 59:37

That is awesome.

SPEAKER_03 59:39

It's really funny because they overrate this. Boom! Because they were kind of talking about how he had his own little PCA curse. Like every time ever since he told uh that lady to go do to do something nice for him. Um he actually was like three for like 35 since then, and the cuts were on a downside.

SPEAKER_02 59:57

Yeah, he was struggling ever since then.

SPEAKER_03 59:58

So they think that lady might have cursed him. Maybe she was like a you know form of witchcraft or something. It happens, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:05

So that's real life in Chicago.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:06

But hey, that kind of that kind of uh karma would definitely go a long way. You gotta love it. Yeah, you gotta love it. I got I you know, as a P Crow hater, hater, I guess. Uh I love you know entertaining players in baseball, but uh, you gotta tip your capture that, dude. That's awesome. Be able to hit a bomb directly at a heck, actually a whole section of hecklers. You gotta love it, dude. Yeah, you gotta love it.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:26

Um legendary.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:28

All right, man. Uh well again, we want to hear from you folks. Let us know where your thoughts are in the comments down below when it comes to baseball. What are your thoughts regarding this CBA uh negotiations with the owner side, player side? Um do you think lockouts coming? Um, you know, is your team currently in first place? If not, you know, let's hope they make the wild card, I guess. Wild card. You want to hear from you, let us know. And if your team is in the running for school ball, let us know. Argue your case in the comments down below. We want to hear it.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:53

Yep, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:54

All right, let's go ahead and pivot on over and talk some Utah Jazz basketball. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:05

Before we get into the content, we'd like to encourage you to join the conversation in the comments down below. While you're down there, consider subscribing to Utah Jazz DNA. Smash that like button for your boy Darren.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:15

That's right. All right, AJ. Dude, let's first start off by continuing to thank everybody for can their continued subscribing to this channel, Utah Jazz DNA.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:28

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:28

Is at what last time we chat checked?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:31

It was It's high.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:33

Uh we're I mean, high for relatively for us, right? Like it we went from 300 subscribers on this channel, like not even two weeks ago, to 1,365. Yeah, 1365 at the time of recording, which so again that's a thousand in a month. Again, really appreciate it. Really appreciate all the effort you guys are going into and subscribing to the channel, watching the videos, jumping in the comments. I think this is all of out of all of our sub channels getting the most comments and the most interaction, which we love. Uh, we try to respond to most tough to keep up with. Yeah, we try to respond to every single one of them. Keep in mind that is us, that is not just like the auto-commenter. That's not somebody else doing it. That's me and AJ jumping in there and actually making an educated statement. Some of them educated, sometimes maybe not.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:14

Sometimes it might be a smart ass statement.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:16

It depends on what you say. It is what it's the fun of it, right? Yeah. So again, we greatly appreciate it. Thank you guys for joining us. We absolutely love you guys watching it and joining us, and to all the OGs that have been around for since we started this channel. Uh, again, love you guys, appreciate it, keep it going. Thank you. All right, let's get into the cut subjects we want to talk about. Uh, which first is uh AJ, the time is now.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:36

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:37

So, you know, um, this was a fact that we talked about a little bit with the Drassville Autore and um, you know, how things went down for the Utah Jazz this week. I mean for the Utah Jazz this year. Uh, we know we now know that this was probably the last time we're gonna see it that way, because the way the league is flat in the odds starting next year, right? Um, so they're flat in the odds, which is gonna make uh the three worst teams in basketball not have the best odds to win the number on overall pick, right? Yep. Mark Cuban uh tweeted uh out on on the X. Uh why is it called still a tweet if it's on X? You can't say he X did. That's a great point. He still says he tweeted on X. He tweeted on X. You still call it a tweet. He posted on X? Posted, I guess. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. Um he basically said on Twitter, sorry, on X. I'm still never gonna call it that. Uh when you flatten the odds, the number of trades will explode. It is impossible to know who is gonna win the tank-a-thon in the offseason, and leading up to leading tankers are not going to trade those picks at the deadline. Um, basically saying that uh him is basically what he's saying there is basically echoing amongst other owners as well, is that the way to build through the draft is nigh, right? The end of the end of it is nigh. Yeah. Um, and that is the backbone of the Utah Jazz team builds, is through the draft. Free agents do not want to come to Utah in the NBA. Uh, if you need me to point to evidence on that, just look it up. There's plenty of evidence out there.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:05

If you we've done multiple videos on it as well.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:08

If you're denial on why that is, I can't help you. It's just it's a fact, okay? Um, we don't come to comments, you know. I don't want to hear any of the comments we're saying, actually, Darren, we know the free agents that signed uh was these guys that we overpaid, or these guys that were way past their prime, you know. We don't want to hear that, right? Uh, and also in this age of LeBron's player empowerment era, players now have that are good enough, uh now have the ability to block trades. So the only players we actually want to trade for to get over here, you know, have the power to block the trade. They just say no. Drew Holiday, Kevin Love, ironically. Um, you know, there's also, you know, uh Bradley. Couldn't block it twice. Yeah, couldn't block it twice. It wasn't good enough anymore. Um, but the fact that that's happening all over, play trades players are blocking trades and they're refusing to show up if they you don't if they don't go where they want to go. Um, so that's also trades are not possible for the Jazz either. So the only way they could rebuild this team is through the draft. Um, so while we don't see a rebuild coming anytime soon, just keep in mind that that is what I'm telling you. There is no next rebuild, AJ. The time is now. This team has to find a way to make it happen with this core. If we win a championship and and this team looks like it can be sustained uh with a level of success over several years, then maybe we can change the narrative going forward. But as but there is no tomorrow for this team right now, AJ. They need to win with this core.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:36

Yeah, no, I totally agree. Uh, the best part about it is the Jazz have all the pieces you could ask for. I mean, when you're building an NBA roster, you've got a defensive big man, you've got a seven footer that can score from absolutely anywhere on the on the court, you've got a previous defensive player of the year, you've got a super talented butting star in a shooting guard, and then you've got lottery picks in the starting rotation and on the bench. There, you got talent everywhere. You've also got a bunch of veterans on a bench that are these guys are just willing to play and do whatever you need of them. Right? You've got the use of nurkitches, you've got you've got these players that are that have been really key to the little bit of success that we've seen over the last couple of years. And if I told you four years ago that that's what this roster was going to look like at this point, I don't know if you'd have believed me.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:24

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:24

Think about that. Defensive big man, seven-footer, defensive player of the year. You're like, oh, we didn't trade Rudy Gobert. You know what I mean? Like we didn't trade Donovan Mitchell in a super talented budding star shooting guard. Right? Like, so we've got the pieces right this minute. And the the big question is winning. You know what I mean? Winning. And you you you you have you have the talent. Can it translate onto the floor? Because that's everything, right? This team has to gel fast enough so that when they get out there, you can see it immediately. And that's that's really the concern is can they turn it into the success during an 82 game season? Because that that's a long season. That is a you know, you're going to deal with injuries at some point. And if they don't, how quickly do they pivot? You know what I mean? What what where do you go with it? And I mean I mean, I would think with you know the upcoming payroll, which you know, we broke that down in last week's video. Um, I'll put it up there.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:30

Um, but thanks to everybody who watched that video, by the way.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:32

Yeah, um, but that that was you know, it kind of went into payroll and what what what we can expect. But the Jazz are gonna give this team this season and they're gonna see how it looks. And and if this team has any bit of success, which I sincerely think they do, um, just to make the playoffs, um this team looks great on paper, man. They they they look great. Um, you you add a top two pick to this, and it looks even better. You're in one of the most talented drafts that we've ever seen. This team has the ability to come together now, and man, am I so ready for it. I'm so ready to see the Jazz win basketball games again.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:09

I'm so ready for them to try and win a basketball game again.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:12

Just try to win a basketball game.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:13

Like that's gonna just be such a relief. Yeah, right? It's gonna be so nice, even if they don't win, like the fact that they're gonna try the whole game is just gonna be so awesome, so refreshing. It's gonna be great.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:25

So much better content when Jazz are trying to win. But yeah, that's what's crazy is since we've done this show, the Jazz have not been trying to win basketball games, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:08:35

And how many times do we like say they're pushing the chips in the middle with this trade? This is it, they're pushing them in, they're going for it. And every time, you know, internal gem documents over there, vigilant me. And I'm just like, the rebuild's over, Darren. This is it. We signed Triple J. They're gonna go for it. I'm like, no, they're not. Yeah, he was correct. I can't. Yeah, well, it's all right. You can always hope for the best, and you know, make it manifest it, you know, make it happen. Yeah, you know. Um, I like this comment here from Greg Hawkins. He says that uh the people who think NBA free agents want to be here uh in Utah are the same who think that you Salt Lake City has a great nightlife.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:08

Um I actually like nightlift, and I picture like a car at night going onto a lift. That'd be better. That'd be super cool. But they don't have a great nightlift either.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:16

Yeah, I think a lot of uh jazz free agents would love to see that. Yeah. You know, a car going on a lift. That'd be great. Um, we also got another comment here from Craig Shepherd, B5H. Uh, agree with me. Jazz have the talent, but they don't have the But do they have the talent? But do they have the toughness uh to play Hurt and go deep into the playoffs? That's a great question.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:38

That is a great question. And and I think that they do. I think that they are deep enough to make a run into the playoffs. I think they have the ability to sustain some injuries. Um, I I'll be really curious to see what guys like Bryce Sensabaugh do this. Uh Bryce Sensabah, Cody Williams, Flip. How are these guys going to adjust their roles uh, you know, through some of these injuries and still keep the team productive, right? Go out there and get make the most out of the minutes that you get. We know injuries are gonna happen. They always do. None of these guys are are bulletproof, right? But if they can adjust their role and keep themselves ready to go in and make a difference when they're out there, man, this team could be dangerous.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:20

Yeah, I I think you're uh you predicted that they're gonna win 50 games next year. So I did. I did that. Is on the internet. Yeah, that is on the internet. That is a true thing. We set that bar. He thinks they're gonna get 50. I think they're gonna be lower around 45 to 47, but still pretty optimistic, I'd say. Yeah. Um, I have a team based up, you know, that won like what, 27 games? Yeah, you know, last year. So it's gonna be quite a jump.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:40

Yeah, but yeah, again, they're gonna have Jazz might win 50 in a row, they might start the season 50 and oh, Darren, and then what are you gonna say?

SPEAKER_03 1:10:48

That'd be great. Uh, this is one of the things where I'm absolutely happy to be wrong, AJ. Absolutely happy to be wrong. But yeah, to to to Craig's comment there, uh, I definitely think this team, there's a lot of last year where they were hurt. Absolutely, you know, absolutely, and there's a lot of and you know and we've had a ton of discussion about it too. Yeah, and I think that with Walker Kessler, his injuries, those are not like injury-prone injuries. These are like, you know, that stupid player for the soccer meadow team hyperextended his elbow that one year, you know, and then he dislocated his shoulder that one time. These are fluke injuries, these aren't like chronic knee, ankle, back issues, right? So yeah, you know, these are just all fluke things.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:28

I think he's gonna be able to have triple J looks like I still think in a regular season Walker Kessler's back last year. Oh, yeah. I mean, they they stretched it out. They're like, Yep, nope, this one's season ending, Walker. You're done. You're shut down this year. Yeah, he's like, guys, I could be ready by All Star. Nope, shut it down. No, no, no, you're down, trust me. Season ending.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:44

And I think Triple J looks like a stud, dude. He looks pretty uh, he looks, you know, for the time that we got to see him out there, he looks pretty solid. Um, you know, Lar Larry Marketin is definitely a player who would jump in there and you know, he'll throw his back out at just trying to make a play.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:56

Yeah, you know, so maximum effort every single day.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:00

That dude's a brain. Stud. Yeah. That guy will run through anybody.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:04

Yeah, and didn't have any, I mean, very minimal health issues last year. I think the only time he was sitting down were health issues.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:09

Yeah. Yeah. You got a toe, hang now, let's uh let's set you down for five days. Yeah. So there's all there was a whole lot of that uh happening last year that I just don't see happening this year. And really the only risk to that is there's a story of the whole AJ, uh not AJ Devonza, but uh Darren Peterson, if we get him a two, that he's got injury issues that we both kind of covered, not really.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:28

I did see that the Jazz have done all of their medical clearances and are fully on board with drafting Darren Peterson.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:35

Yeah, I heard that they are okay with the medicals. I I read that too. And so that just basically decides on whether or not Washington is gonna be okay with it.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:44

Oh no, we get AJ Dabanta instead of Darren Peterson. Yeah, I'm just like either way.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:48

Like, I just I love all the conversations we had about it. Yeah, because it made for great content and everything, but I think a lot of people are overthinking this way too much. Some of the some of the comments had great trade options, though. Did you read those? Those were pretty cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:01

There's so many. Thank you guys so much.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:03

Those we should do a video just on that, like re talking about some of those. That'd be fun. That'd be fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:07

Um, well, speaking of which, man, um, I do want to talk about that. Like you said, they're gonna let them run this year, right? Yep. And see what happens, and then you know, make roster changes if anything does happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:16

But tell me if this story sounds familiar to you, AJ. So the Utah Jazz have a tall white player from another country, right? Yeah, Finland. He has a breakout year with the Utah Jazz, becomes an all-star with the team for the Jazz, though it's predicted to be nothing special and probably had the lowest win toll that they've had in over a decade. Yep. He's the team number one option and then signs a max extension. Um, and then the team starts to build around him. And then in a couple of years, uh, they get a great center, they draft an all-star caliber point guard, they trade for a top five power forward in the NBA, and suddenly that tall white guy suffers some injuries, some injuries along the way, but he's no longer the number one option. Everyone who is watching this, including probably what you just said there, probably thinks I'm talking about Laurie Marketing. But what if I told you I wasn't? What if I described what I described was the chat GPT summary or the TD, uh TDLR, uh too long, did not read a TLDR, sorry, on Andre Carolinko. Um, before he signed a contract with the Jazz AJ, Andre Carolinko's starting rotation uh was anchored by Carlos Arroyo, Raja Bell, Matt Harpering. Greg Ostertag was on that team too. Um, but I don't even know if he even bothered to show up half the time. But uh, so yeah, that's who he had headlining, and that's who they're like, oh, the Jazz aren't gonna win anything. Do you remember Carlos Arroyo? I do. Those are some good times. Yeah. Um, but yeah, then after then after uh they they he signed that max contract, let's give it about two seasons later. Uh the team is now headlined by Darren Williams, Carlos Boozer, Memetacor, and oh, by the way, Paul Milsap was on that team as well. Suddenly, uh, that six-year $85 million contract uh for a fourth team option, fourth player on the team option offensively starts to weigh on the team a little bit, right? Um if you remember that contract was haunting this team in the late uh 2010s. Um they couldn't improve a team that kept running into Tim Duncan and Tony Parker Spurs. Um so gosh, even the same team they're running into is gonna be the same, AJ. Like it's just they're like the there's just the questions are there. It's too much. So, AJ, is Larry going to be the new AK 47? Meaning, does this max contract that we gave him going to hurt this team for being able to make those improvements when they run into the Castle and Wemby Spurs?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:50

Yeah. And this is it's it's kind of a wild comparison, and it's really funny to think that um in the the second year of AK's contract, he made like $15 million, was not even a top 10 player um in pay in the league, right? Funny enough, Laurie Markinen making $46 million next year is not a top 10 paid player in the league. So you see, they just keep the comparisons keep stacking up. It's wild, dude. And then yeah, and it's funny because the NBA has like the projected salaries, um, and you know, Laurie makes $49 million, then $53 million. Each of those years, he is not a top 10 player in pay in the league. Um, but I mean Laurie earned his contract after the 22-23 season, right? He averaged 25.6 points, 8.6 rebounds, 1.9 assists, shot 39% from three, went on to win the NBA's most valuable or most improved player of the award that year. So I think I think the stat that sticks out most to me. And to answer your question simply, no, I do not think that's gonna be the case. I think that Laurie will continue to provide value for this team. Um, I think he's the number one option, and I think he will still be the number one option next year. Um his stats hit the year after they signed their contracts. Um Laurie's went, you know, his career stats are 18.9. AK's career stats ended at 11.8 um points per game.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:12

Well, that's not where AK's value was, but that's okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:14

I know his value was in assists, rebounds, you know what I mean? He was he was a he did it all, right? He was the five by five guy. Yeah. But he he still only averaged 2.7 assists for his career. Not as impressive as you'd think him always being a five by five player. No, you know, that that was like, you know, when I think AK, it's like, oh, five by five. But um to say that the you know, value is declining with his age, that's that's kind of always a standard thing, right? Lori's 29 years old and and on a very close two-max contract. Um, but when his contract expires, he'll be 32. Funny enough, AK was 25 when he signed a seven-year contract or a six-year contract, his contract will end when he was 31. So there's all these weird it is it is so funny.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:04

But yeah, um I the biggest part about this, man, and the reason why I agree with you there, that it's a little different, is first of all, there's too many comparisons to ignore. Uh that this contract could have potentially been that way. Also, keep in mind that the Jazz, like when the Jazz got him, we get you remember that our starting rotation that was a good rotation, but was no longer on the team, and we weren't trying to win games the next two years. Correct. So three years. Yeah. Well, exactly. So very similar to AK, he was dealing with a bunch. We drafted Darren Williams, right? And yeah, you know, we got Memodocore, you know, like it's so like these, these the ways the players they got were the exact same way that the Jazz are getting players now around him, exactly two years after, right? Is how this team is starting to be formed. The thing about it is is that the Laurie Marketing contract only has two more seasons on it. The Andre Carolinko contract had four years left on it.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:54

Exactly. That is exactly where I was going, though. Okay. The biggest thing is Laurie's contract is only a four-year deal. And yes, it is mucho more money. You know, I mean paying somebody 50 million versus and I understand it at the time. Yeah. At the time, yeah, it's uh it's all in relation to the cap, but Laurie will still be the number one option on this team next year, in my opinion. I I I I don't who's gonna be the number one option. Oh gosh, I would think Keontae George would be. I I think he'll be the number two option. I don't think I don't think I don't know if you pass up Larry. I mean, he's still the best player on the team.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:32

I think in this, I I think in this, well, I think this team is going to be using him different than previous teams did. Yes. I think they're gonna use him more for his um his spot up shooting.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:46

Absolutely. And I totally agree. And I think they do use Larry more as a spot-up shooter. You have more weapons around him, especially if you know, going back to Walker Kessler, or you know, if Walker Kessler can shoot that three ball this year, you've got a ton of space on the floor, almost too much. You know, if you've got five guys spread out, you're like you Walker Kessler is is kind of the key, and that's you know, actually our next segment. But um, yeah, Laura, I I do think Laurie's still gonna be the number one option on this team, and this is gonna be a team that's gonna be trying to win, a team that's gonna win 50 games next year.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:19

That's right. It's all on the internet.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:20

He said it. And uh I I I think, yeah, if if Laurie just absolutely fell apart next year, does the contract look horrible? Yes, but you've only got it for two more, you know, three more seasons. Right next year and two more.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:33

Yeah, next year, two more after that. Yeah, so I agree with you, man. I think that the likelihood of it being as bad as as the Carolin contract, I don't think it's gonna be. Do I think that there's potential for him? Because some of his injuries were actual injuries, you know, that he's some of them, yeah. And some of them can come back because of the back issues and stuff that he had, even when he was with Chicago. I think there is a chance that that could hurt them. Uh, but again, it's not to the extent so because of the length of the contract. And honestly, like he's still gonna, he's not gonna be the fourth option on this team. Never. I don't think he's gonna be the I think by the end of the end of this year, going into the next season, I could potentially see him being the third option on this team.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:11

I and I would be very surprised by that.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:12

And I would be okay with it because that means we got two players that are playing above all-star status.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:17

Absolutely. That's that means we're probably pushing deep into the Western Conference Finals at that point.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:21

Well, I want to go that far. But yeah, like Keontae George would be there, and then obviously Agent Peterson or uh AJ or um D A P or DP, right? Either one of those guys could be in there in that mix, and honestly, we gotta forget about Triple J. We can't forget about Ace Bailey. Like, there's a good chance that he's simply just not the cornerstone of this team two, three years from now because of the amount of talent that is on this team.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:44

But that's okay because in three years, his contract's expiring.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:47

Yeah, exactly. Um, but yeah, I just thought it'd be interesting to kind of compare the two. I I started thinking about it. I'm like, oh man, they started they both came in on bad teams. Yeah. Both tall white guys coming from overseas, you know, and then just kind of the they're like, wow, these preparations just keep hitting. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:02

Yeah, it was and it was crazy too, because as you started watching them, it's like, wow, everything. Yeah, like it was it was really fun.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:08

Yeah, so uh something that's been all the buzz around uh Utah lately, uh, which is something we want to get into, uh, has been the offseason with Walker Kessler. Uh something that was said uh last week is something that uh I feel that you said last week, I think deserves a little bit more airtime, uh perhaps uh a little bit more another day. But the team, I think that you the core thing of what you said there was that the team was really built around Walker Kessler, which I don't think most people would um agree with or even say. But when if you look, if you break down the numbers and you break down how this team's built, it's kind of quite obvious that that's what they did, right? Whether it's on purpose or not, you know, basically everything they've done is around whether or not we have a defensive-minded, old school big guy, top five rim defender, under center, right? Like in the in the not under center, because that's more of a football term, but like in the paint, right?

SPEAKER_06 1:22:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:00

Um, so rumor has it over the weekend that they already had a handshake deal in place, that we were going to just wait until after the draft, and Kessler wasn't gonna go into restricted free agency, and the Jazz were just gonna sign him, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:23:10

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:11

Uh well reports came out uh last night uh during a Spence Check its ESPN 700 show where he had which called the drive, he had uh Tim uh McMahon on the on the line. He said the two parties still aren't close to an agreement. Uh they are far apart on agreeing on his value. He says, and I quote, I think it's a systemical decision. Um the Jazz the Jazz value him somewhere around 25 to 30 million range, and Walker Kessler's representation uh believes that his value is significantly higher. So there are conversations that need to be had, uh there are negotiations that need to happen. Basically, what he's saying is that um this isn't anything that's you know not gonna happen, but um either way, we believe that even if he does go to free agency, the Jazz are gonna match, right?

SPEAKER_06 1:23:57

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:58

So what we're looking at is we're looking at a $30 million AAV, probably at minimum for this player, is what we're probably looking at for this guy. And what we just saw, AJ, in the Western Conference finals, shows us which way this can go.

SPEAKER_06 1:24:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:11

Chet Holmgren makes over 40 million a year, and he had a great season, even a great postseason. When it came down to playing, going up against Wemby, he turned into Ben Simmons. He was afraid to Wow. Wow. He was afraid to go in the post, he was passing open wide open shots. Uh you know, Wemby got passed over for the MVP this year, and you can see him fuming on the bench when SGA got his trophy. And if and he actually had had it in for Chet ever since that Chet Holmgren won the UA MVP over him back when they were like 16, 17 years old. Yeah. Right. Wemby takes this stuff seriously, and when he gets paid 40 or 50 million dollars, there's no way he's gonna cower uh in any playoff scenario, right? He's just not a chance. He's just that type of player who's who's got it. He's he's got that mambo mentality, as some like to say, right? Yep. So the question is which way is Kessler gonna go when he has a similar paycheck?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:11

Yeah, I mean, I I think you're absolutely right. Wemby and Holgren Wemby and Holmgren are very different players, right? And I think it speaks volumes to the levels of NBA play that there are, right? Holmgren plays on a great Oklahoma City team that is anchored by an MVP. He's the big guy that's that's relied on to kind of make shots when you kind of need them, but we saw in the playoffs he kind of fell apart. I think the best part about Walker Kessler is you you have these two guys and then you have Walker Kessler. And I'm not saying he's above them, I'm just saying however you want, a triangle, right? Right, different type of player, basically. Yeah, very different player. Um, you know, Wemby blocks shots in multiple ways. Holmgren's not really a shot blocking guy, not necessarily as defensive. And and Walker's more of a traditional kind of under the basket, big on defense. Um and and I think that he takes his defensive role so seriously, his job is to make it difficult for anybody to score at the basket. And neither Wemby or Holmgren are necessarily that player. Wemby gets a lot of blocks guarding in space, right? You know what I mean? You'll he's he's blocking 15 footers and and and Walker takes that role at the basket and and his close defense to a different level. And I think he could be as good or better of a defender when it comes to limiting uh easy shots of the basket than Wemby is because Wemby does play out a lot more than than Kessler does. So um I think what I I think really what what I love about uh Walker and I reason that and and the reason that I think that he might have kind of the it factor is when he came out of college, he wasn't known as a guy that would that would stretch out and make threes. Not that he didn't take them, because I mean he was taking he took 50 attempts his senior year, made 10 of them, so that's like a solid 20% shooting. But I think that Walker saw where the NBA's going. He saw how players like Rudy Gobert essentially became ineffective in late games because he couldn't guard at the three-point line and he couldn't shoot good enough to help his team. That right there is a completely different mindset. What do I have to do to help my team be successful? Is it guarding at the three-point line? Is it shooting the three? Walker saw that early, early in his career. In his first season, he came out and said, I think I need to be able to shoot threes if I'm going to help this team win. I think that I need to be able to defend out of the three point line if I can help this team win. Now we haven't had a ton of Walker Kessler, right? There's been a lot of injuries, whether you want to call them quote unquote injuries, whatever that may be. It is something special. Special. It just is. This guy, I think it's it's something that he's still refining. And I think to have him take some of those shots, get the jazz, allow them to create space on the floor. I think Walker is passionate. I think he's ready to be back on the floor to show this fan base that he can compete, show this fan, show this whole franchise that he's the type of player that you need to build around. That's who we want. I think Walker Kessler is absolutely has the factor. I've said it before this team was built around him. Um you add triple J, and I mean triple J is just a guy that's always in the right play, always in the right place at the right time. Walker Kessler is that guy that's always there, just always in your business. This team could be locked down on defense. And if Walker Kessler shows up and has the it factor like I think you will, man, this could be a really, really fun season to be a Jazz fan.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:57

Absolutely, absolutely. And keep in mind, we're not saying that Walker Kessler is going to be the perennial MVP candidate that Wemby is. No. That's not what we're saying. No, no, not at all. We were just taking the Western Conference uh finals as kind of like a barometer. Who are we gonna get, right? Yeah. Are we gonna get the guy who's really excited to play on a winning team and just do his thing? And then the second he gets any pushback, he falls apart. Uh or are we gonna get somebody who constantly is trying to earn his paycheck, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:26

And elevate this team to the next level. Do everything he can to elevate the team. Yeah, that's who I think Walker Kessler is.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:33

Exactly. And we got kind of the both sides of that with Triple J and Walker Kessler. Like we have Walker who's a traditional shot blocker around the rim, and then we got Triple J who's a shot blocker in space, right? Like he's always that help helper. They you know, that's what he was known for as a power.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:48

And he's just such a tough defensive player, yeah. You know what I mean? Like, and it takes so much pressure off of Walker to just be in his zone, be out there blocking shots, be out there applying pressure. Like it's gonna be so nice to have two big guys who understand how to play defense in the you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:03

Could you even imagine?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:05

Um we've never had that before.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:06

Yeah, it's definitely been a while. Yeah, been a while. We got a comment here from Greg Hawkins here. Channel legend Greg Hawkins, watching AJ get all excited about Walker Kessler, puts a smile on my face. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:18

I'm glad, buddy. Yeah, I'm excited about Walker Kessler.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:22

So yeah, I'm excited about him. We know. I mean, either way, he's we're matching him, right? Like it's it's not really a debate. Like, if there's somebody that goes and pays way more for Walker than the Jazz want to pay for him, who do you think it's gonna be? I know I have my who I think it's gonna be.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:37

Um I could almost see like the Chicago Bulls. Okay. As crazy as that is, I feel like that is one of their lacks is real low defense. I could see the Bulls overpaying.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:55

I mean, they do have two picks in the lottery this year, so they could go and draft.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:59

And they could, but you there's a big difference between somebody that has seen NBA time and drafting somebody that you think could be a defensive asset.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:07

That's very true. Do you know who I think is gonna be?

SPEAKER_02 1:31:09

Who?

SPEAKER_03 1:31:10

The Lakers.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:12

The Lakers have been rumored to go after him really hard. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:15

Yeah, I think because you know, um, what's his name? He needs a pick and roll uh big. Yeah. Um Luca, he he wanted one, they had one lined up, but he didn't make the physicals for the Lakers, so they they canceled it. And he needs uh somebody who can pick and roll and dive to the basket, and you know, that's like Larry, like that's Walker Kessler's best offensive game is the diving to the basket on the pick and roll after the high school. Yeah, he's nails at that. So, you know, that's what that's what Luca wants. That's scary too, because the Lakers got that money. Well, depends. I mean, they got the Guggenheim money now for sure. Uh, but like if they if they depends on what happens with LeBron and stuff like that, whether or not they're gonna risk going into the second apron. Yeah, so we'll see. Anyway, uh, we want to hear from you folks. Let us know where your thoughts are in the comments down below. Uh, if you're watching this on YouTube after the fact, uh again, as a reminder, folks, if um, you know, we just want to say thank you to everybody who has subscribed to this channel, Utah Jazz DNA. We've had the fastest growth on this channel that we could even expect. Absolutely love it. So deeply appreciate it. Can't say enough. Very, very cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:17

Yes, absolutely. And if you guys are watching on YouTube on one of our short videos, just know this is available as a podcast on DNA Sports Recap wherever or wherever you get your audio.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:27

With all that said, my name is Darren. That is AJ, and this has been an episode of the DNA sports recap. Till next time.