Blown for Good: Scientology Exposed
Marc Headley worked at Scientology’s secret desert compound, which houses all Scientology management, for 15 years. The 500-acre property is located deep in the California desert. The local townspeople were told lectures and films were made there. But is that all that was happening? It is the location of a multi-million dollar home for L. Ron Hubbard, built two decades after his death. It is the home of Scientology’s current leader, David Miscavige. So what really happens at the Int Base? Are the stories on the internet true? How does Scientology conduct management of its day-to-day operations? Could stories of armed guards, weapons, staff beatings, and razor wire fences be true? If so, how could a facility like this exist in modern-day America? Hundreds of staff tried to escape over the years. Some succeeded but were never seen or heard of again, and most failed. Why were people kept here? What really went on at the headquarters of Scientology? This is the story of what happened behind the Iron Curtain of Scientology.
Blown for Good: Scientology Exposed
The Aftermath Billboards: How Public Awareness Helps Sea Org Escapees leave Scientology
The Michael J. Rinder Aftermath Foundation's billboard campaign is creating pathways to freedom for those trapped in Scientology, with 10 billboards placed strategically near Scientology buildings throughout Los Angeles.
• Billboards provide a crucial contact method for Sea Org members who have no phones, internet access, or resources
• Board members raised funds to maintain 10 billboards for a full year despite Scientology's attempts to block the campaign
• Over 100 people helped in 2024 through direct grants, mentorship, career counseling, and emergency housing assistance
• Foundation working with families of current members to provide support when loved ones are ready to escape
• Specific focus on elderly members who face exploitation, including fraudulent credit cards opened in their names
• Mental health services now offered in-person in LA with online therapy groups launching in June 2024
• Nearly 2,000 volunteers across 31 countries supporting the Foundation's outreach efforts
• Education grants helping former members access educational opportunities denied to them while in Scientology
Visit aftermathfoundation.org to volunteer, donate to the billboard campaign, or report Scientology abuses anonymously.
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Hey guys, welcome back to the channel. Welcome to another episode on Blown for Good, exposing Scientology since 2006. Today we have a very special episode. We're going to be doing a fundraiser for the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation and we have, of course, we have special guests. We have my wife, Claire Headley.
Speaker 2:Hey, hey, hey, thank you for joining everybody.
Speaker 1:And then we've got Matt and Amy. Hey guys.
Speaker 3:Hey, nice to be here. It's good to see you guys, again it's good to be doing a video again.
Speaker 1:It's been a while.
Speaker 2:Yes, it has A very long time. So good to have everybody here and we are going to be having a very fun-filled hour packed full of news and updates, specifically all about the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation and the work that we volunteer our time as board members, meaning obviously Mark and Amy and Matt and, of course, Phil. We're very grateful for your help and expertise in our second round of the billboards.
Speaker 4:Thank you. Do you want me to talk a little bit about that, please? That would be, awesome, awesome.
Speaker 4:So billboard update here we go. So the billboards we originally put 20 up. For those who don't know, we have three different billboards that are all for the foundation and we've got 20 sites up right now and they've been up for a month slightly over a month, but they're all still up and we have now contracted to maintain an additional. We're going to keep 10 of them. To keep 20 up would be a little much, but we're going to keep 10 of them up for a year. This is huge.
Speaker 4:I've worked on billboards in the past and to have billboards up for a couple of months is big, but to have them up for a year is very exciting. But to have them up for a year is very exciting. This is going to have the message out there that Sea Org members, staff members, scientologists are going to see they're going to bump into it at some point in time With 10 billboards around Los Angeles nearby Scientology buildings. They're going to run into them and the message is very clear. Now we had to make a few slight changes, but that was just on the one billboard. There was some pushback from Scientology, of course.
Speaker 2:Of course, as is always to be expected.
Speaker 4:I've run into this many times in the past Scientology will always push back. But this time I mean it's not that much different than what we ran into years ago with the Call Me campaign. They pushed back. We had to make a few adjustments back then where we had to put like a little message on it, initially, at least for the first month, and then, once things settled down, then they allowed us to take the message off, which was basically paid for by, and this one will say paid for by the Aftermath, which was basically paid for by, and this one will say paid for by the Aftermath Foundation. Now it's only for the one, and this one is the one, the Mike Rinder billboard, and the pushback was specifically on by Scientology on the word cult. Of all the things we had on those billboardsboards, the one thing that just pissed them off the most was the word cult so it did to be fair.
Speaker 1:It didn't even say scientology. It said the main difference between a cult and not a cult is what happens when you leave.
Speaker 4:It doesn't even mention scientology exactly, and we even tried to take all references to scientology off the billboard, like even on the website, at the bottom and everything.
Speaker 4:But there was enough pushback from Scientology that they wouldn't allow us to put the word cult in there. So we just we changed it up slightly, the wording on it, and instead of cult we're going to be using a high control group. So the difference between a religion and a high control group is what happens when you try to leave and Mike's picture is still on there, the website is still on there, everything. And the phone number, the Aftermath phone number, is on there. So the only difference and this message of paid for by the Aftermath Foundation is only on that billboard and I'm assuming that after a month or two they'll allow us to take that off there. That's what happened when we did our original Call Me Billboards. The first month we had the message paid for by on it and then after that they said you know, I guess what happens is once Scientology settles down and their lawyers go away and whatever, then I guess the media company gets a little more comfortable with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's so ironic that they didn't complain about Scientologyabusecom, but they threw a complete fit over the definition of cult, which, by the way, in the English dictionary, as Steve Kent so kindly pointed out to us. He sent us a whole documentation of how they absolutely fit the definition.
Speaker 4:Because they know they're a cult.
Speaker 3:Plus, I'm sure that Mike Rinder's picture being up there is triggering as well.
Speaker 1:That's really at the end of the day.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean, it'd be tough for them to say we don't want that picture up there. So they had to argue something, and so the one thing they locked in on was the word cult. We wanted to not fight too much with the media company, because the more important thing was to get this campaign running for a year.
Speaker 4:Yes, and so if we push back too much, I didn't want to jeopardize the campaign at all, so we kind of bent a little bit for them, which is fine, because the billboards are still up. We're going to have 10 billboards up.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and we're going to call them our cult billboards, anti-cult billboards, but they can say high control group. They fit that bill too Right, I know.
Speaker 4:They do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and when you have Mike Rinder's face, whether it says cult or high control group, everyone is going to think of Scientology. No question about it, the world over.
Speaker 4:Exactly, Exactly and just as a side note, there is a person in LA who walks around the Sea Org buildings a lot almost every day, and I gave him some of these cards with the aftermath message on them and he's been handing them out to Sea Org members.
Speaker 2:Amazing.
Speaker 4:So yeah, and so if anybody else wants any of those that are in LA or near any Sea Org buildings, and if they want some, let us know and we'll send them to you. And if you just hand them out to Sea Org members, it's got the phone number on it. And this friend of mine too. What the other thing he does is he, if they don't take a card, he'll say the phone number out loud and it's a real easy to remember phone number. It's just 888-3002.
Speaker 4:And he's just out there saying that to every Sea Org member that he sees.
Speaker 2:That's awesome, and those cards, by the way, are available on spshopcom. We print them and all that we ask is that you pay the cost of us shipping them to. You print them and we all that we ask is that you pay the cost of us shipping them to you. But we have four different designs of the aftermath card the curious design, the need help leaving all of those, and there's also on the aftermath foundation website a way that you can also just print them off yourself if that's easier for you.
Speaker 4:Yeah. And that is a duplicate of one of the billboards.
Speaker 2:Correct, it's yeah, the only difference is the image of the person in the card is a female and on the billboard it's male. So you know, diversifying.
Speaker 4:I bet you didn't even notice that. No, no, but the ones I have are the male. But I didn't realize. Oh nice, we have both. We have both versions.
Speaker 2:Just to make clear that anyone who wants to leave this organization, we will help them. Yes, Nice.
Speaker 2:Awesome and we have an awesome video that we're going to play displaying these billboards in just a minute here. But first of all, I just would like to give a shout out and a huge thank you to our board member, michelle adair, who you will see featured in this video, and also michelle's wife, rachel hastings adair, who of course, helped with all this filming and put this video together at very short notice so we could share it here today great, awesome.
Speaker 1:And then we'll do a little bit of a Q and a um after this, if people have questions or whatever. And then before I, if just in case I forget, if you make any comments during today's video, we're going to do a giveaway at the end of the video. We're going to do a giveaway at the end of the video and just commenting on today's video we'll enter you in. You don't have to buy anything, it's free. Just make a comment and you'll be automatically entered in to win something at the end of the video.
Speaker 2:Yes, and also before we play the video, I would like to give a huge shout out to the many people who have donated in support of the Aftermath Foundation. The work that we do would not be possible without your support, so we are just incredibly grateful that we get to continue our work to help people get out.
Speaker 1:Awesome, without any further One.
Speaker 4:Last point on the billboards is for those that don't know. The purpose of the billboards is, to a large degree, it's to give a pathway for people that are in the Sea Org, have no resources. If they want to leave the Sea Org and they walk out the door, are they going to turn left? They're going to turn right. They have no money, they have no phone, they have no internet access, but they might see a phone number up on one of these billboards and if they can get to a phone they can get help and this gives them a chance. I'm sure there's been many people over the years who've wanted to leave but didn't. They ended up staying in the Sea Org just because they had no way, nowhere to go, nobody to help them if they got out. So the billboards offer them that pathway and that's the important thing about keeping them up there.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely. And last comment on that, by the way, we very often work with families of current members of the Sea Organization and guide them and mentor them on what to communicate to their family member who is stuck in the Sea Organization. And you're absolutely right, phil. Many, many times the member of the Sea Organization feels stuck because they've been so isolated from the outside world and they think well, you know, I wouldn't be able to get a job, but my life is over, I have no resources, and so just arming the family members with the knowledge that, as soon as the person is ready to leave, we're here to 10 active cases that we're working on right now. Very often, we work with families over the course of months or even years. In the case of Rosemary Brown, we were working with her family since March of 2021, so an entire year before she actually made her escape. So it's very important that we keep this message up, and just having it out there, as you'll see very visibly in this video we're about to play, is huge.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Ok, we're going to do it Ready. It's going to play right away as soon as I click the button. So here we go.
Speaker 6:I'm Michelle Adair and I'm a board member on the Mike Render Aftermath Foundation, and I'm out here today to bring you some footage of billboards that we were able to get put up here in Los Angeles, close to a lot of the Scientology buildings, in order to help Scientologists escape the cult of Scientology. With these billboards we'll be able to get the word out to as many people as possible, to just plant the seed so they can call the Aftermath Foundation and receive the help that they need. We will be able to unite families back together, save children from abuse, stop human trafficking, stop elder abuse, and the list goes on and on. I'm a little nervous out here today to be filming this, because the last time that we put one of these up, phil Jones and my wife were attacked by an unsheltered man paid by Scientology. So hopefully today we have a little better luck. That was right here.
Speaker 7:That happened with the billboard that was just down there. This is the AB, the Anthony building, which is the birthing where they live, the staff for the International Liaison Office, the HGB they all live in here. At least the majority of them live in this building. Hundreds of Seerig members. There's a van, pool van Picking up some Seerig members. That's a Scientology van, and we are now heading towards another billboard. I think it's down here. I think it's down here by the Starbucks. So this along here is where Sea Org members from the ILO they walk during their CSP. They'll come down here. Sometimes they'll go early in the morning before post, also go to the Starbucks on the corner here, which is where I believe the billboard is. We haven't been to this billboard is. We haven't been to this billboard yet, so we're going to have to find it, but this is definitely there. It is, oh, very close, that's amazing.
Speaker 7:Very close. This is right on the path.
Speaker 1:That's so awesome.
Speaker 7:I'm waiting for them to drive their van, cool van and not that's my little staff member Seahawk members that just went by this sign. There's no air around it. It is so close to the AB. Hundreds of Seahawk members live there. A whole van of them just drove by Because the AB is just down there. No avoiding it. So this is the Starbucks Sea Org members like their Starbucks. There it is. That's the billboard, nice.
Speaker 1:Mike.
Speaker 7:Rinder's face. He's at the Starbucks where the ILO Sea Org members go early in the morning if they can wake up or if they haven't gone to sleep yet and they gotta go back on post on Sunday morning Mocha with Mike At the entrance to the 101.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 6:They're going to highlight that oh.
Speaker 2:Mike oh.
Speaker 6:Fraggle. Mike, you went too far. Here we are at our here we go time, just blocks away from Scientology and right in front of the Starbucks where the Scientologists like to go and drink coffee. So they get to have coffee with Mike every morning. We're excited.
Speaker 7:Not every morning. They're probably not allowed to go every morning. The bus from the ILO it's going to go turn there because the birthing is over there. It's going to come along either right along the street here or it's going to get on the freeway right here. That's really common, but they have to drive by.
Speaker 3:I love that spot, mike Rinder Wow.
Speaker 7:There's no avoiding it Right on the freeway on-ramp.
Speaker 6:Everyone who has done this deserves the badge of honor of being a suppressive person of Scientology. Heroes come in many forms. Being Scientology enemy number one should be a competition. We are also so grateful for our donors. Without their unwavering support, none of this would be possible. I know that 30 seconds after this video goes up, there will be 500 Scientology trolls in action to discredit the Mike Rinder Aftermath Foundation, but one thing always stands strong, and that is the dedication of our donors to help people. Scientology has been infiltrating the Scientology survivor groups for some time now and turning them on each other, and I think it's time to refocus. So I've personally never been in Scientology and I definitely have not escaped Scientology. However, my wife has, and here she is filming me. So what is it to you to have this billboard go up?
Speaker 7:well, I think there are still quite a lot of people who are trapped within scientology. There's people that I know personally who are working right now down the street at the blue buildings. There's people that I know personally who are working a couple blocks away at S&P and I know that they want to leave. I know they're unhappy and they feel that they can't. They feel that they're trapped, they're kept without any financial resources, the threat of losing everyone they know all their family and friends and having a sign up that they're going to drive by, that they have to drive by, that they could walk by during a normal route that they take during CSP. Actually, having 20 signs up in all these different areas is hope. I really hope that you know people know, if they end up seeing this video somehow under the radar, that you really can escape. You really can be free and you know. Call the number, find a way to get online. Go to a library and get on an unfiltered internet line. Go to aftermathhelp. Call 888-FREE-002.
Speaker 7:The Aftermath Foundation exists to help you escape, because I think that it's really important that we have this out there and Scientology has been fighting it, and the reason they're fighting it is because they know they have members that they're trapping and that they're enslaving and that they're not letting go that want to go. If everybody that was in just wanted to stay, like Scientology says, they wouldn't care about these billboards because they wouldn't have any power. The fact that Scientology fought so hard to get the other one removed in 48 hours, that they're fighting so hard right now to get these billboards removed, is a sign of how important they are and how much we need them. So I just hope that this message gets out. If it gets out to one person and we free one life, we're supporting human rights. If it gets out to one person and we free one life, we're supporting human rights, and I think that's really important and I know a lot of people out there have folks still in Scientology that they care about and they want them to see this message.
Speaker 6:So we need to do everything we can to spread the word about this and support them however we can, so these billboards can stay up and go up in more places. And that's Rachel Hastings Adair coming to you live from the Michael Render Aftermath Foundation billboard.
Speaker 1:There you go, amazing.
Speaker 2:Awesome, love it. We lost Phil there. We Phil, there we are.
Speaker 4:One little point. If you noticed on there some of the, it looked like maybe a slight bit of peeling on the billboards. Those original billboards were one material that were short term. We've had new ones printed up with better materials that will last the year. So if you see a little bit of that, don't panic over the little kind of peeling up or blemishes or stuff like that. The billboards going up for the next year are the better materials that will last the entire year.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if you only get a month, they only put up material that lasts a month.
Speaker 5:Exactly.
Speaker 3:They've got to go find science.
Speaker 4:They do.
Speaker 2:That was an amazing and powerful video. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:Oh my.
Speaker 3:God.
Speaker 2:Michelle, oh, my God.
Speaker 1:And I do want to make sure that people understand that these billboards are not free. We have to pay to put them up and because we want to reach these people, we need funds to help the people, but we also need funds to help put up the billboards. So the reason that we're doing this video today is this is a fundraiser. We're trying to raise more funds so we can pay for the year of billboards. We can pay for years of billboards and the only way that we're going to be able to continue to do billboards and not only in Los Angeles but in other places is if we receive donations from people to support the foundation. So we want to do fundraisers more often.
Speaker 1:We want to get the Aftermath page. The Aftermath has a website that you can go to to donate. You can also go to the SP shop and that's where you can buy merch merchandise. That 100% of the proceeds go to support the Aftermath Foundation. And we're also trying to get the Aftermath Foundation channel YouTube channel up over 10,000 subscribers, so the Aftermath channel itself can do fundraisers and we can post. We're going to post that video you just saw. We're going to post that up on the aftermath YouTube page If you guys want to watch it again and yeah, it's exciting. We can't thank you enough, phil, for all the help that you've given us to get through this. You wouldn't think that putting a billboard is such a such a challenge.
Speaker 4:There's a lot of pieces to it there's you know surprising people don't? I mean, there's a lot of back and forth. You got to get the artwork done, then you got to get this approved. They go back to the art. You know there's a lot of back and forth. But one point too that, uh, if someone does want to donate, they can, on the aftermath foundation site, donate specifically for the billboards. If does want to donate, they can, on the Aftermath Foundation site, donate specifically for the billboards if they want to do that. So just go to where it says donations and then just pull down the little menu from there and it'll say donate to the billboards and you can if you want to. For however you want to do it. But yeah, definitely we want to keep these up because it does give that opening for people who want to leave the Sea Org.
Speaker 3:It is, and it's also for the family members that have people in the Sea Org. They know what line to call you know because maybe, maybe their loved one isn't necessarily seeing the sign, but people on the outside are. So, yeah, there's people know Scientologists or have loved ones in there and they need to see the message too that there is hope and help.
Speaker 2:Yes, through and through. It's a message of help and also to educating anyone that might for one second consider oh, what Scientology about? Let me go in and see. No, that's the other second. You know, secondary purpose. That is equally important. Stop people getting lured in in the first place.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, they can get their information from our website and then all of our videos.
Speaker 2:Yes, completely Awesome. Well, this concludes our billboard section. Phil, thank you so very much for joining us today. I will just end with we have huge news coming on monday, so just remember to subscribe. You know, follow us on all social media. We'll have a page up later in this show today that will show you all the ways you can do that. But stay tuned for big news coming monday awesome.
Speaker 1:Thank you, phil, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2:Phil, Thank you so much. Phil Talk to you soon.
Speaker 4:Happy Easter.
Speaker 1:Happy.
Speaker 3:Easter everybody Bye.
Speaker 1:Okay, awesome, well, that was very exciting. I'm so proud of everybody who helped us do that, and we really, really think that this is going to make a big difference and we're going to be able to reach a lot more people and get a lot more people helped.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, that video was awesome.
Speaker 1:What are we doing next? We're going to do?
Speaker 2:you're going to do a recap of 2024. Next, we're going to talk about news and updates and talk about our program progress in 2024. So we have a slide presentation. So we have a slide presentation and then at the end we'll come back in and talk about what we showed, some examples of people we've helped, without, of course, naming any names. You know, as I mentioned, there are many times that we are working on cases over the course of months, or even a year or more, working with their families, et cetera, reconnecting them, and unfortunately, it's not always, it doesn't always work out as planned. We'll touch on some of that again, without giving away any information, but we keep on doing the work and that's what's really, really important.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. And just so you guys know, this video that we're in right now is playing should be playing on the Aftermath channel.
Speaker 2:I hope it is. Oh, clara says yes, it is. Yay, you can get on over and watch it on the Aftermath channel and everything. But even more so it's great when we can entirely set it up to just support a nonprofit cause, which in this case, of course, is the Michael J Render Aftermath Foundation, and it makes way more sense for us to do and talk about our work in that context as a fundraiser than on our personal YouTube channel, where there's you know whatever Google ad says revenue that's. It's far more important to us that the work we do benefits the foundation. Thus us being here today.
Speaker 1:Somebody said I'm on the aftermath channel and it's working fine.
Speaker 2:Yay, thank you, amy.
Speaker 1:Awesome, there we go Okay good, so um sorry am I um my clicker button is got a little bit of a blitz there, okay, so there you go. There we go, okay, good, so sorry, my clicker button is going a little bit of a blitz there, okay.
Speaker 2:So there you go there we go All right 2024 programs, 100 plus total people helped. This is between not only direct grant recipients our mentorship services, our foundation outreach career counseling. We started the mental health the therapy group, physically in Los Angeles. It was starting in. I believe that started in October of last year and coming in June we will have an online version of that group so that we can reach even more people, which is amazing.
Speaker 2:And let's see what else, oh yeah, we've talked about. We have obviously the crisis line, 888-3002. So that when they run into strange situations with members of the SEER organization and they are very limited in what they can do and say, they have a line to be able to call for support, which is amazing. We also have the education grant which we launched to enable members, former Scientologists, to afford them education opportunities that many of us include myself and Mark included were denied by by by virtue of the fact that many of them were born into and raised in Scientology and and formal education was poo-pooed, to put it lightly, wouldn't you agree, guys?
Speaker 3:I mean, come on, I think I finished eighth grade and that was it.
Speaker 1:Somebody was saying that I was a high school dropout and I was like, take it easy there, I dropped out of middle school folks. I didn't even get to high school, so don't be misidentifying me as a high school dropout.
Speaker 3:I know I never saw a day of high school in my life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, me neither. Yeah, I managed to get my GED two weeks before our oldest son graduated, yay.
Speaker 1:Did you do the last thing?
Speaker 2:Okay, and then 15 people helped, assisted with emergency housing. So very often when someone is just getting out mostly from the SEA organization, but also from staff, and some of those people have had children in tow as well, and so we've enabled them to relocate to other states, away from Scientology. You know, anyway, there's we have Clara, who is our social media person for the Aftermath Foundation. Yay, clara, you're amazing, has been posting testimonials on our social media for the Aftermath Foundation. Yay, clara, you're amazing, has been posting testimonials on our social media for the Aftermath Foundation. So you can read specific examples there. Again, we keep everyone anonymous. We just decided that makes the most sense. You know, the last thing someone getting out of Scientology needs to worry about is Scientology finding out and going to get them back. So there you have it. The funding provided to grant recipients last year 2024, was a 40% increase from 2023. Yay, amazing. Grantees we helped a number of grantees relocate to other states and away from Scientology. We covered that. Did we go the other way? Oh, all of our grantees remain anonymous unless they choose to speak out, in which case wonderful. But that's not a conversation that we have in the work that we do. We focus on helping them feel safe, supported and providing whatever services they need to help them get back on their feet. Stories Remember time is of the essence. If you have family in the Sea Org, we encourage you to stay in touch with them, visit them. We often help families navigate these situations. We've covered on some of that and at the end of this presentation we'll give a few specific examples. Again, no names Testimonial.
Speaker 2:Before I ever came into contact with Scientology in my teenage years, I always knew I wanted to be a filmmaker. Scientology quickly convinced me that my dreams and aspirations were a small game, not worthwhile. I was instead led into believing that joining the Sea Org was the big and important game that I really should be playing. My dreams were crushed and I hardly even realized it. I joined the Sea Org and I thought I was doing something far more important than my own silly, selfish goals. I eventually left the Sea Org, not being able to stand being there any longer. I left on their terms and followed their rules. After months of grueling security checks, manual labor, they finally released me back to my family. Even after leaving the Sea Organization, I still considered myself a Scientologist for years. After thinking once I got back on my own two feet. I would eventually go back, pay off my freeloader debt and continue my way up the bridge to total freedom.
Speaker 2:Luckily for me, before I ever decided I was ready to go back, I found a television series online called Scientology in the Aftermath. To say the least, the show opened up my eyes and soon after watching every episode, I discovered the Aftermath Foundation. At the time, I was struggling to make money. I was pursuing my dream as a filmmaker, but struggling quite a bit because the equipment I was using was all my old equipment from before I joined the Sea Org. It took a while, but I finally decided to put my pride to the side and ask the Aftermath Foundation for help. I asked for new tools for my filmmaking career so that I could provide a higher quality product, have a faster turnaround time, make more videos, land more clients and pick myself up right when I almost just gave up.
Speaker 2:Once I worked up the nerve to ask a stranger for help and apply to the Aftermath Foundation, they quickly let me know that they were there for me Sorry. After they processed my application in short time, they let me know that I was approved. I was granted the tools that I needed to pursue my lifelong dream. My world became a little clearer for the first time in a long time. I felt hopeful.
Speaker 2:This is all thanks to the donors, the kindhearted people who donated to the Aftermath Foundation, and not a day goes by that I don't think about how grateful I am for everyone involved in this foundation, inside and out. Thank you a million times. Thank you. You're changing lives, yay. And we have submitted all of our extensive paperwork for our third year participation in the CFC campaign. This is the combined federal campaign. It's the most rigorously screened workplace giving program in the US and provides both current federal employees and retired federal employees the option to support our work. Not only that, it gives the Aftermath Foundation the presentation opportunities where we can educate multiple government agencies on the work that we do. So there you have it. You can volunteer for the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation by visiting our website, and there's the link so you can sign up to volunteer. The link so you can sign up to volunteer.
Speaker 3:We had 1,963 volunteers in 31 countries around the world as of today.
Speaker 2:Wow, fantastic, yes, amazing, amazing. And here are all the links of how you can follow the work of the Michael J Render Aftermath Foundation on social media. Nice, there we go.
Speaker 1:Awesome.
Speaker 2:Yes, yay.
Speaker 1:We did it.
Speaker 2:We did it.
Speaker 3:How much do I love those testimonies you know, and that's just one of several. But boy, I get so emotional about it because I mean, that's what it's all about Also a lot of these people.
Speaker 1:They don't need that much. No, exactly the amount you need to help one person could vary from a few hundred dollars to a few thousand dollars, and then that amount and also some resources, like a place to stay or the hookup, you know, just knowing who we can put them in touch with that can help them with the exact thing that they need help with.
Speaker 2:Sometimes that is worth more than anything, and it's free and our career counseling program also focuses on identifying transferable skills, because it's not necessarily someone who's been in this organization for 25 years, who's been in the C organization for 25 years. You know that their lingo does not even translate into something that an employer would necessarily go oh you're amazing, and yet you know most. We can do it. Every member of the C organization I've ever met is a very capable person with their heart in the right place, and so just having that program to help them identify and create a usable resume that gets them hired is huge.
Speaker 5:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean knowing anything about the outside world. You know when, when you leave the Sea Org, especially if you started as a teenager or younger. You don't know the basic things, like we never did a resume. I mean I didn't even know what a resume was. Yes, I remember writing my first resume. I was like I think I'm just going to work for myself the whole rest of my life. What education you don't want to know.
Speaker 2:Yes, completely. But yeah, I did want to talk about an example. You know we talked in this presentation about how time is of the essence and, as I mentioned, we have many successes elder abuse that goes on in the SEER organization to this day. This was an example of a person. Again, I'm not going to mention name, gender or location, but this person was in their 70s and had been diagnosed with stage four cancer. They were a member of the C organization at this time.
Speaker 2:The Aftermath Foundation worked very hard with multiple members of the family to get them to be able to visit this person and work to get them out of the C organization. With stage four cancer in their 70s, they were put on a shortened schedule of 40 hours per week and we worked with the family over a period of three months and, unfortunately, before our efforts to get the person out and relocated to be living with the family, they collapsed and ended up in the hospital and passed away. And again, you know we wish that it was always successes, but it's important to talk about because time is of the essence with these cases.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that is another thing that really demonstrates how Scientology, the empathy that exists for Sea Org members. A person with stage four cancer, instead of having to work 120 hours a week, they only work a 40 hour a week. So imagine that if you only had to work nine to five now instead of having to work nine to midnight, and's that's that and that person in within the Sea Org I mean anybody correct me if I'm wrong the Sea Org looks down on that person as being a slacker that they are leaving at dinnertime and not working until the end of the night. Like, oh yeah, you know Bill can't be here because he's going to go home now. You know, and and you're just like great, thanks, bill.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and even in this case, the person had been in the C organization for decades and we were working with the family to get them out, which, in the terminology of the C organization, meant they were preparing a fitness board to find this elderly person fighting stage four cancer as unfit. I mean, that's the derogatory approach that Scientology takes in these cases and it's absolutely disgusting and needs to be exposed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look at Catherine, what was the announcement from Debbie Cook.
Speaker 5:Oh, maybe we just point something out. Back in around, I don't know, 2000 or so, debbie Cook at the time was the captain of the Flag Service Organization and she made an announcement at the staff meeting. Which was anybody? Well, basically any special schedules, reduced schedules because of the person's age or the medical situation was canceled. Basically, if a person couldn't do the full schedule then they were going to get fitness boarded, given a couple hundred bucks and put out in the street. And that was announced to the whole crew. And I looked around like do you guys get it? A lot of you guys have been here for 30 years or more and after all the work you did, if you can't do 120 hours a week, you're out of here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they throw you away like trash when they're, when they're, when they can't squeeze any more blood out of the rock, they just throw you out like trash. And that is another thing that Sea Org members are worried about is, if they do get thrown out, then that's a whole nother problem for them. Where are they going to go? So that is another thing. We do sometimes help people who have been thrown out of the organization or kicked out, or they were declared an SP out of no, a suppressive person out of nowhere, and sometimes we end up having to help those people because Scientology, after years of using and abusing them, just throws them out like trash. And then they still need a place to live, they still need a place to go, and sometimes those people still believe in Scientology and we still help them.
Speaker 1:That's right and we still help them find a place and we give them resources to get a job or, you know, whatever it is.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but it takes a little.
Speaker 2:it takes a minute, you know once you leave, yeah, but it takes a little, it takes a minute, you know. Once you like, yeah, it takes a minute, you know. But just taking that first step out the door is so, so critical and life changing, and you know. And then they will figure it out from there on their own. We're not here to change anyone's mind. We're not here to convince anyone of anything. We're just simply providing a landing spot to help people start the next chapter of their lives without feeling coerced and trapped and anything else. That is exactly how you feel when you're in Scientology.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 5:Absolutely. I think I can give some insight about how many people would want to leave if they could.
Speaker 5:I'll give you an example, back in about 1982, I was the security chief up at the international base. We had about 450 to 500 people on the base and Hubbard wanted us to announce at the staff meeting there that if anybody wanted to leave, they could. They wouldn't be interrogated for weeks, they wouldn't be declared a suppressive person and separated from their families. It would just be like you can just walk out the door, we'll take your luggage into Los Angeles and drop you off. So I'm thinking, ok, maybe it's going to be like all you had to do is step off to the side. We're in the big dining area and I'm thinking, oh, there's going to be like three or five people or something's going to step over to the side.
Speaker 5:Over a third of the base walked over there For real. For real, which to me means if the CEO did that right now, if Miscavige stood up and said if you want to leave, you won't be interrogated, you won't be declared and separated from your families, you won't go through all this rigmarole, you can just simply walk out with you know, we'll call it. Even You'd have over a thousand people would walk out of that freaking place immediately 100%, they're being held in there because they're trapped.
Speaker 1:They did a similar thing at the end. Yeah, they did a similar thing at the end. Yeah, they did a similar thing at the base when Marty Rathbun was there and he was the one who was like we. Basically, they called it the Deadwood program Get rid of all the Deadwood Right and so they did the same thing.
Speaker 3:But they didn't really ask all of us.
Speaker 1:Well no they didn't. And anyway, that's what you'd call a loaded question in that circumstance and also they say and this is another thing I want to say, because matt brought up something. He said you're not going to get interrogated, you're not going to do that. Uh, they've said things like that in the past and then you say, okay, sign me up, and then you get interrogated, and then you go, and so you're like I don't know.
Speaker 3:I've seen this wait and see what yeah, you're like.
Speaker 1:I've seen this episode. I know the ending. Yeah, you'll learn not to answer no surveys.
Speaker 5:You know like if you could leave, would you want to leave? You know, we're not going to do anything to you. We're just kind of curious, just kind of feel out the base and anybody who answers it.
Speaker 3:They're toast man yeah, it's a trick question.
Speaker 1:But when they did do that, even with all those factors, I think they got two busloads of people. I remember it was like 80 people that just disappeared the next day and so it was like wow, two busloads just drove off the property, those guys, and we never saw those people ever again. They were just gone. Some of them did end up in Los Angeles and some of them ended up on the Rehabilitation Project Force, but I think a majority of those people skedaddled right on out of there. But you don't know. And also I think they gave them $250 and just see it wouldn't want to be there, so it wasn't like I mean, that's a hard sell if you don't have anywhere to go or you don't have relatives or you don't have family or whatever. With 250 bucks, start your life over. I know it's rough because we did it. It's not the easiest thing to do with no resources.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know $250. But then they use that to buy my ticket. That's right. So I got like $75. And you know, after being in the RPF Rehabilitation Project Force for a couple of years, I look like a concentration camp goon, so I used that to get my hair done before I arrived to my family.
Speaker 5:The money isn't there to help you. The money is there to make sure you move far enough away from the base that you're not going to be a problem or a distraction.
Speaker 1:And it's also there because you're signing documents and if there is a cash exchange when documents are signed, that gives Scientology the upper hand in. If you come back later and say, hey, I didn't have anywhere to go. I didn't want to be there, but I didn't have anywhere to go, so I just signed whatever they said. And they said, well, no hold on a second. You received a compensation for signing that, so you knew there was a deal being made and it's like it was 250 bucks.
Speaker 5:And it's video. The whole thing is videoed and what you're signing is like you are a totally piece of crap, Never did anything good for you 30 years there Right. And they helped you, despite you being such a pain in the ass.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 5:And you know that's what you're assigning to get your little couple hundred bucks so you can catch a bus out of town.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, completely.
Speaker 2:Okay, awesome, and I just wanted to give a shout out to everyone joining us today. Thank you so very much. It is our pleasure to be here talking today about the important work of the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation. And again, a shout out to our many donors, supporters, volunteers and everything else. You make our work possible. So, thank you. And with that, yes, we'll do some Q&A and we'll do some giveaways and, yeah, we'll see. I would like to be able to do these quarterly and I'm thinking you know, hey, if there's something you'd like us to talk about, I'm thinking we'll do. Meet the board. News and updates, new programs, all of these kinds of things Awesome, that's an awesome idea.
Speaker 3:One of the first things I want to say is I am seeing the chat and I'm seeing all the love guys. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I love you too. It's been a minute but we've you know, even though we haven't been on the YouTube scene, that doesn't change our dedication and everything like that, but it's really nice to see everybody too.
Speaker 1:Yes, we have lots of stuff happening in the background.
Speaker 2:Yes, so much, and we are just so grateful to have you, amy and Matt, on the board helping us do the work that we do. And, by the way, the billboards was Amy's idea originally.
Speaker 3:Billboards- billboards billboards In your face, in your face. Yes, completely.
Speaker 2:So I just wanted to acknowledge you for that brilliant idea. Boy, has it been an adventure.
Speaker 3:Yes, it has, oh gosh.
Speaker 2:And thank you for.
Speaker 3:Phil, who's been pioneering this thing, helping us too. It's fantastic, yes, and apostate Alex and Kathy and everybody involved.
Speaker 2:It has been very much a team effort, such a team effort, such a team effort, such a team effort and hey, it just goes to show when we work together we can accomplish amazing things to expose Scientology and get people out and give hope and all of that good stuff.
Speaker 3:Yes, agreed, 100%, okay, good.
Speaker 1:Should we put up some questions? Let's do it.
Speaker 2:I'm going to read them and you guys answer them. Yeah, that's how we'll do it.
Speaker 5:Perfect.
Speaker 2:Okay. Okay Now, shay Jones them. Unless it, yeah, we'll do.
Speaker 5:that's how we'll do it, perfect, okay now, shea jones what if someone in the c org is badly injured and becomes disabled? See, you wouldn't want to be you. Yeah, well to be fair um.
Speaker 1:There was a gentleman who was he actually was the security chief at the end base for a little while too, and his name was uve and uve um hewe. He was in international management for a while. He got in trouble and then he was assigned to Golden Era Productions and then, I think, after a short stint in electrical or the estates division, he became the security chief of the base and over the years he developed MS. And once he developed MS he was offloaded, which that means you basically transferred from the international headquarters to Los Angeles and he went to the Rehabilitation Project Force with a terminal disease and he was in a wheelchair. And the entire time that he was in the wheelchair in Los Angeles he was on the rehabilitation project force, even though he had a terminal disease, and he had worked at the international base for years and years.
Speaker 2:And he was married to Larisse Stuckenbrock.
Speaker 1:Yes, his name was Uwe Stuckenbrock. He was the husband of Larisse Stuckenbrock, who was the assistant or the communicator, the secretary for David Miscavige the leader and still is to this day.
Speaker 2:She divorced Uwe the moment he became ill, and you know that's Scient's, that's.
Speaker 1:I mean he might have been very well have might have been the most most privileged and connected person to have that happen to, and that's how they treated him.
Speaker 3:And that's how they treat him. Yeah, and did he have family even? I mean, he was from Germany, so where, where was his family even?
Speaker 1:You know well you know it's funny is that his brother, marcus, was looking for him for many, many years to find out what had happened to him. And Marcus actually flew to the United States with a film team and we did a whole program for German TV. I participated in this and I talked with Marcus and I got to tell Marcus stories about Uwe and some of the things that happened and some of the good times that Uwe was involved in and then. But then Marcus was like but I want to know about what the other things as well. And it was heartbreaking to have to tell the person's family, like how this person was treated when he was so ill and all these other things happened.
Speaker 1:And I want to say that they never informed his family before he passed away. If I remember correctly I think this all they basically were notified after he had passed. That's right, hey, your brother's gone or your son or whatever it was. And then his brother was like well, what happened? Like how could he go from where he was? All the way to this? Nobody did anything, yeah.
Speaker 3:The other person that was exactly the situation was Engelbert Wagner. He had multiple sclerosis, he was on the Ent base, he was married to Gertie Wagner and they got a divorce and he was scooted off into, I think, the ranch at first and then maybe LA or something like that.
Speaker 2:But he was from Germany, had no family Now his wife has divorced him and he was just left. Yeah, and that again. These are examples of why we encourage everybody if you have family in the SEED organization, reach out to them, reconnect, and that will very often plant that first seed that is necessary to give them hope for life outside that very isolating world.
Speaker 5:Yeah, if they. If they can at least tell their family member who's in the CO that they're always going to be there for the person. If they ever need help, that the family's there for them, just to put that seed there. That's enough A lot of times to give the guy enough confidence to walk out the door and have a place to go.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely, Apostate Alex in the house. Hey guys, just on my way home from work. Hope the live stream is going well. So good to see Amy and Matt. Big love to you all. Awesome, We'll be talking with Alex very soon. Melanie Johnson question Did you do anything special for Easter when you were in Scientology?
Speaker 1:No, I don't even think we had ham on.
Speaker 3:Easter. I literally think it was a no event. Not even a chocolate bunny.
Speaker 1:Not even one plastic Easter egg Percy, remember, not a one, I don't actually even remember Easter, even registering as a day when we were in the civilization, unfortunately, you know, I think at one time we had, when we first were at the international headquarters, we lived in these apartments that were in town in Hemet, and we would get bused to and from the apartments each day. And I remember one Sunday when we were leaving to get on the bus and there were some people that lived in the apartments that weren't part of Scientology or part of the Sea Org and there was some kids coloring eggs or something and it was sort of like oh yeah, I remember that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you remind me of something too. So there were certain holidays like July 4th is an example that comes to mind where we would be working the whole day but we would be told to come in wearing civilian clothing instead of our uniforms. Oh, that's right, but Easter was not one of those days. Easter Sunday we never were told to wear civilian, not even wear civilian clothing, which was a little bit of a treat for us in the mundane repetition of the life of a Seargift member.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think even in July 4th it was like we're going to have burgers for lunch.
Speaker 3:Right, that's the celebration. That's right. Sometimes it was the galley that did anything. You know nothing was happening but the galley that did anything. You know nothing was happening but the galley.
Speaker 4:Sometimes you would come down for a meal and there would be, you know like flags, yeah, like a little colored napkins they'd have.
Speaker 5:They'd literally have flag napkins and be like the galley's, really going all out oh my goodness, me and and Amy were in the Scientology prison camp before we left and it was Thanksgiving and we had 20 minute meals where we got to eat the leftover food from the staff and I gave them an extra 10 minutes to eat. I was like the person in the RPF that was kind of running it.
Speaker 3:He was running it.
Speaker 5:Internally I got in so much trouble for giving that extra 10 minutes, giving them 30 minutes to eat instead of 20 minutes.
Speaker 2:On Thanksgiving. Let me guess I told you you were worker oriented.
Speaker 5:Oh yeah, Big time. What the heck was I thinking?
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness, let's keep going. We got to burn through some questions here and then we'll do our giveaways, love it.
Speaker 2:Question how hard is it for people coming out escaping Scientology to shake off Scientology lingo? Yeah, that's a great question. It's something that once you as someone coming out and again, it really depends. I think it can be accelerated by getting far away from Scientology, but it is something you have to work on because you don't necessarily. It's like peeling layers of an onion learning to unspeak the language of Scientology, especially depending, like in my case. I started learning that Scientology language when I was four years old, so it can be quite the process. But once you set your mind to it any person coming out it kind of accelerates very quickly.
Speaker 3:I just want to say one thing about that. I mean it is hard, especially when you're married to somebody else who knows the lingo too, and it just kind of like happens. But like yesterday I told somebody you know that I was going to get something done before I secure.
Speaker 1:Secure isn't said in the real world the way we used to say it yeah, secure is when you go to bed for the night, when you wrap everything and secure and it's meant I think it's borrowed from the ship days when you would secure everything because you're going to be rocking around and you don't want the stuff to get, you know know, fall over. So you secure everything before you go to bed.
Speaker 2:But I think this one's for Matt and Amy. Question from KB. Understand you've been devoted to important things, but can we look forward to a few more cameo appearances in 2025? Love you dear, yes absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 3:We have some good things. We have some good things in the works. Plus, you know, claire, I'm missing our all things. Scientology.
Speaker 2:I know, I know, I know that was so much fun and it was like weekly I would get to just have fun with you, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we'll probably do that again. We'll probably do that again. I was going to talk to you this week about that. Oh my gosh, I'm so excited, yes, about that. Oh my gosh, I'm so excited, yes, and you know he's got a book and we're trying to get that completed. And of course, we had other matters this past year that you know been taken care of, but we're keeping the flag flying.
Speaker 2:So amazing, amazing. That is awesome news. Ashley Campsy question Was there any holidays you celebrated in Scientology?
Speaker 3:I mean we kind of Christmas a little bit, but not as a thing. We would just do like you know, pick a name out of a hat and then give that person, like you know, some candy.
Speaker 1:That's right, you would do like a gift exchange.
Speaker 5:Yeah, a gift exchange, like keep it under 20 bucks or something. It was only for one person.
Speaker 1:A few years yeah, kk kris kringle, that's what we would do. It, yeah, but at the base there was a few years it wasn't all of the years, but there were a few years early on where we'd get our christmas bonus and if we were doing well, it might be as much as a hundred dollars and we'd get our Christmas bonus, and it would be the week before Christmas when you'd get your Christmas bonus. Sometimes, sometimes, sometimes, it would be three days before You'd get your Christmas bonus and then you were supposed to go out and if you had family members that you wanted to send gifts to, you'd have to go. They would take a bus and you'd go to this place. It was called Cabazon. Was that the place?
Speaker 2:Yes, cabazon.
Speaker 1:Cabazon. It's like an outlet mall that's off the 10. I think it's off the 10 freeway in like in the desert near where the Scientology and base was.
Speaker 2:And I never drove there, so I have no idea what city it was in.
Speaker 1:No, it was, it was, it was in it. It was right near an Indian reservation that had a casino and hotel and a whole bunch of stuff. But it was so funny because you'd get $100 and you'd think like I'm going to get so many goodies. And then you'd just walk into one place like J Crew or one place, and you'd be like, oh, I like this sweater and it's like that sweater's $140 million, and you're just like what. And so you would, because you never, you're not out buying stuff at a mall.
Speaker 1:You don't know how much anything costs when you do go out. I think I'm getting cards for my family. I think I'm getting married Christmas cards for the people that I'm going to send something to.
Speaker 3:Also, when you get your bonus, the hand is out for you to give it back so that they can get gifts for Miscavige.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's right.
Speaker 5:I was in Treasury, we had to give the staff pay them in cash, because people don't have bank accounts and all that kind of stuff right. So it's all cash and as they receive the envelope with the cash, there's a person there with the crew list and you got to give your half of it back over to go to Miscavige as a gift for Christmas and your name gets scratched up.
Speaker 5:You're not going to miss it. He's going to pick up 3,000 Sea Org members times $30, which is like $9,000 is going to go over to David Miscavige to go.
Speaker 1:And they're going to buy him a scuba diving camera or a motorcycle, a motorcycle, a heart for his motorcycle. Not a motorcycle, just a heart.
Speaker 5:Or a special leather jacket and all kinds of stupid stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like he needs all of those things more than I need the honey blocks or walking around with holes in our elbows and knees.
Speaker 5:Cardboard in the bottom of our shoes, so the water's not coming up to the bottom of your shoe.
Speaker 1:We're eating must-go stew. That's all the stuff in the galley that must go Must-go stew. Okay we've got another one here.
Speaker 2:All right, Scientology Up North. Comment Just had conversation with someone who was in EPF, together with someone who had Down syndrome. I cannot believe the cruelty these people have gone through. I know 100%. It's absolutely devastating.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're not, they don't really. Yeah, that's not even a thing there.
Speaker 2:Dr X in the house. So if now they say that family is important, will they allow kids to spend time with their parents during holidays?
Speaker 1:No, Now if you don't work at the same place as your family, then the likelihood that you're going to see them is almost 0% chance, especially if you work in LA and they work in Florida. You're 100% chance, especially if you work in LA and they work in Florida. You're 100%. Not Even if you work at the base and they work in Los Angeles. It's also a very good chance. You're not going to be able, even though it's only two hours away, unless you can sneak off during that two hours. You're supposed to do your laundry in the morning. If you can go the night sometimes.
Speaker 1:What people would do and this was a very real thing for many years and then they outlawed it People would go when they got off work at midnight on Saturday. They would. If they had a car, or if they had somebody who had was going and that person had a car, you could maybe hitch a ride with them. So if you both left at midnight, you get in their car to go home, but instead of going home you would drive to Los Angeles and then that person would go see their spouse or go see their kids or whatever. You get to see your kids from midnight until morning.
Speaker 1:And then first thing in the morning you'd have to drive back to the property, so you would basically be seeing them or visiting with them during your sleep time, and that was how it was sort of justified or allowed for many, many years. But then what ended up happening is sometimes people would go see their family and then they'd never, ever come back, and so it got outlawed, and then you couldn't even go to LA to see your kids or your wife or your husband or whatever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my example, Sorry, my example of that was when I was six years old. My mother was in the C organization. She was a single mom and about a month before Christmas she got was told oh, you're going to go to Europe on a project to recruit new people and yeah, you're going to be gone for about three months and that was that. So I was given to another family. I didn't even know, and my mom cried about it. She's like I'm so sorry. I tried to query it. They disapproved it. Bummer, I can't spend Christmas with you.
Speaker 1:And how old were you then? Six, she was six. It's like here this is johnny and molly. This is going to be your family for christmas and you know what's funny?
Speaker 2:the sad part is that I have it frozen in time. They said here's your family, and I walked in and the dad uh, he had all fake teeth and so his dentures were removed. So he was about the scariest looking human I'd ever run into at six years old and I was just like wait, wait, what is happening?
Speaker 3:Oh, that's terrible.
Speaker 1:Neshea had another question Holes in your clothes. Do you have time to mend them? Are you expected to do so? In the Sea Org for a long time we wore polyester blend shirts long sleeve, even though we were in the desert and it was 110 degrees out With ties. We're in long sleeve shirts, which that also became a public relations flap after a while, because people would be like I get everything you guys are doing, I get everything at this. Why are you making these people wear poly polyester long sleeve shirts desert black in color with wool pants, in leather shoes, in the desert, at 120 degrees, anyway.
Speaker 1:but we have people would if you wear a shirt every day, if you wear a shirt every single day for a year, 120 hours a week. Some people only had one shirt, some people had two shirts. If you were lucky, you had three shirts. If you weren't.
Speaker 5:Hardly anybody had three.
Speaker 1:All out baller. You had three shirts, most people had had one or two, but what you'd get is you get this would just be permanently stained this area right here, and you would blow out the elbows in your shirt, just from just it's.
Speaker 2:it's impossible because no shirt is built, even to to be worn. What 120 hours a week every single week.
Speaker 1:And also this is another thing which I don't know it's a false economy. I think the more you wash a shirt, the more wet worn it gets so because you're wearing it and stinking it all up.
Speaker 1:You got to wash it at least three or four times a week so that this thing's you're just not chasing people out of the room when you show up, you know. But yeah, there was a lot. I bet you, if you did a survey, if you put, made all CR numbers go like this, blown out. Just all the elbows are blown out.
Speaker 3:And then I mean we could do a whole thing on this but hold on. So when you wash them, you have to like hand wash them, you know. And then you dry them by ironing.
Speaker 1:With your iron. Yes, super dry. That's. The only way you can get dried in time is to iron them dry.
Speaker 2:And you had to have your uniform. Yeah, go ahead, don't worry, you had to have your uniform.
Speaker 5:You have different colors at that time, like each division had a different color.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 5:And what would happen is you'd be down to like one shirt and when you want to do your laundry, you know they have all the machines lined up which you're paying the church to use their machines. You know, give them back them oh yeah not free laundry no, it's not free. I mean, they're giving you 10 bucks and they're taking back five to do your laundry and the other five they're getting in the canteen.
Speaker 5:That's right that's right, but the deal is people wouldn't be afraid to leave their laundry like like you couldn't put it in the machine, then go off someplace. Think you could come back in 30 minutes your shirt would be gone. Your shirt would be gone.
Speaker 1:So you have to stand there and watch to make sure your stuff didn't get stolen yes, because people are so desperate to get another shirt yeah, and even if they didn't get stolen, it would 100% be on the floor or in a pile Like somebody else is like oh, this person's laundry's done and they didn't take it out. There you go, it's out, now my stuff's going in. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2:Completely.
Speaker 1:Okay, should we do a giveaway here?
Speaker 2:Yes, let's do it.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's see if I've got this worked out.
Speaker 2:Look at that we have 147 entries.
Speaker 1:Okay, Awesome, I'm going to hit the button. Here we go. This is we do this, guys, Matt and Amy. A few weeks ago I won because I commented. You got a comment to get in the video and I won.
Speaker 2:It was up you know I saw Bruce Hines.
Speaker 1:Wow Barbara.
Speaker 2:Bornhold. Congratulations, barbara. Thank you for joining us today for this hour full of fun, filled news and activity. Please send me an email with whatever you would like from the SP shop dot com and I will send you a giveaway link. So congratulations.
Speaker 1:Nice, are you guys cool to hang out a little bit more? I know it's over an hour, but we like to. Sometimes people are. People are here watching Right now. We have 500 people between Twitter and Blown for Good and the Aftermath page and everything we got about. A little over 500 people watching us live here. So we figured we'd keep going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we'll do. And then a giveaway yes, go ahead.
Speaker 5:You know, to get the leather shoes would be like 125 bucks. So the organization's not going to pay 125 bucks to give you a pair of shoes and what you would get is a plastic shoes from Payless. And now you're in them in Florida, you know, 20 hours a day. I'm telling you, people got stuff grown on their feet.
Speaker 1:You know I will say this that in the, in the uniform series and when you're learning to be a Sea Org member, one thing that they tell you and you've got to pay attention, is they want you to wear flip flops or some kind of sandals when you go into the showers, because the showers in Los Angeles it's group. You go into the showers because the showers in the in los angeles it's group. It's like a room with 20 showers in it and there's people lined up. It's like a. It's like, um, if you've ever seen one of those places where they process chickens, it's like that, but with people taking showers and there's people lined up going in and out of these showers. And when you see some of your fellow Sea Org members' funky feet, you're going to get to wearing sandals all the time.
Speaker 1:That's awful you don't want to get any of that on your feet. So, yeah, we could do an entire episode on just uniforms and it could be a series. It could be 10 videos. We would be able to tell so many insane stories. It could be 10 videos we would be able to tell so many insane stories.
Speaker 3:I mean, matt went to Columbia to get all those you know canary yellow, pink and purple and green, and you know lime green. Like all those uniforms for the Flag Service Organization. You know, and they apologized.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I was supposed to like check them out before the money gets released. You know, yeah, the guy right away was apologizing. He said, just so you know, this is what they wanted. I mean, he didn't even show me the clothes.
Speaker 1:Yet, oh my God, they asked for this.
Speaker 2:We're not playing a joke on you. Awesome, oh goodness.
Speaker 1:Okay, here we go. This is a good one. I don't know how much exactly we can say, but go ahead and read it.
Speaker 2:Okay, one love 51,000 question how much does it cost to keep the billboards up? I know it's expensive, so nice to see everyone together. Yeah, so basically it varies, because the first month they gave us we did 10 billboards and they give us 10 free, but ballpark is around $2,000 to $3,000 a month. Really is what we're talking about.
Speaker 2:So yeah, it's not nothing, they're giving us a really good price as a nonprofit, and it is not nothing. It's a significant investment to give a message of hope to the members of the Sea Organization who don't have access to the Internet and everything else. So it's essentially a calculated effort on the part of the foundation to get that message out there and get it to where to the people that need to see it the most.
Speaker 1:This is a great one. This is another one. I love highlighting this any chance I get.
Speaker 2:Okay, love Maddie. Plastic shoes from Payless, while David Miscavige has all his clothes tailored and shoes probably no, definitely made and brought and bought in from Italy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, no he 100% was having his clothes tailored, produced and made in Italy. Correct. That's not a, this is a real thing, Correct. And with one of his pairs of shoes you could probably buy a hundred Sea Org members actual quality shoes for the price that he's just getting one pair and he's not paying for his If you were. That is another point, Matt, I mean. Correct me if I'm wrong, but usually when you sign up and you become a Sea Org member, you're basically told the Sea Org member is going to give you clothes. That's like a deal you make we're going to give you food, we're going to give you a place to sleep and we're going to give you uniforms. If you need anything medically, we're going to take care of all that.
Speaker 3:In reality.
Speaker 1:they give you a shirt. They give you maybe a pair of pants, not some socks. They will give you a pair of shoes, and sometimes you don't get new shoes. If somebody blew last week and they left their shoes, you'll get their shoes.
Speaker 5:If you're the same size, you're not going to get new shirts and pants either when you come in. That's right. You don't have to get new shirts and pants either when you come in, that's right, you can get whatever can be rounded up.
Speaker 1:I won't. I'm not embarrassed to say this, but I did wear. There was an executive at the base. His name was Guillaume Lassev and Guillaume got all new uniforms because he was the executive director international. Okay, well, guillaume and I were the exact same size and his pants were nice. They were almost like. They were almost silk. I don't remember what kind of material, I just remember they were the softest. They weren't that really that worn, they weren't that beat up. I wore the shit out of those pants. You know, I had those pants. That was what might have been the best pair of pants I had in the sea, or it was a hand-me-down from Executive Director International.
Speaker 5:I can tell you the average like amount of money per week to go to staff uniforms at the FSO, the Flag Service Organization, which brings in like $2 million a week On an average over a year. I figured it out we had $500 for uniforms for 1,000 staff A year, no a week $500 a week over a year.
Speaker 1:For all of them. All of them, not each. It was 500 split amongst all those people.
Speaker 5:Yes, it's like almost no money.
Speaker 1:That math ain't math and folks.
Speaker 2:No, it is not. May as well, wear paper bags at that point.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness, I love people are commenting from watching the video, from. They're not all watching it with us. Some people were watching from the beginning and catching up. Somebody said there's Jennifer.
Speaker 2:I'm going to cry Mike, right at Starbucks. Awesome. Yes, we were crying the entire time watching that video.
Speaker 2:We will absolutely put it up on the Aftermath Foundation channel. Again, thank you to Michelle Adair, our board member, and her wife, rachel Hastings Adair, for putting that together. Awesome job, rtv. Thanks for all you do. So good to see the gang together again. Yes, thank you everybody for joining us Such an awesome day today. Thanks, clara, for the recommendation that we do this today. You know we've been doing lives every Sunday, but of course, tomorrow is Easter Sunday, so we wish everyone a happy Easter. Casey is Easter Sunday, so we wish everyone a happy Easter Casey. Hey, you guys, great to see you. Thanks for joining us. She did it again.
Speaker 1:She said Casey. I said Cassie. I don't know if we were doing this when you guys were on with us but we've been pronouncing Casey and Cassie differently for every single video.
Speaker 2:You are the one who started the Casey thing, like two years ago, so just saying she makes, she gives you a clue there, Mark.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know 100%. I said it right, she said it wrong.
Speaker 2:Jack Shaw 809. Love Matt's stories? Yes, we always love.
Speaker 1:You know, matt and I work together outside of the Scientology nonsense and whenever Matt gets into telling stories, I just always am like we've got to get Matt back on there telling some of these stories. Yes, he has. I don't think he could. I literally think, matt, you could. We were saying this the other night. We were there for decades in this place and there wasn't a lot of downtime where nonsense wasn't happening. It's nonstop nonsense.
Speaker 2:And then you have to double the amount of years to factor in the length of hours we were working Right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not just a normal day so like at least double it Right. Yeah, it's not just a normal day so like at least a double Exactly.
Speaker 1:So there could have been five crazy things that happened every single day, and you don't even think about them until you start talking with somebody like Matt, or with Amy or me. It triggers, that's right. And then you remember like, oh yeah, what about that one time that dude did body ball? And you're like, oh, I totally forgot about that because it was just a Tuesday. It wasn't anything special when it happened. Okay. Let's do a few more questions, and then should we do one more giveaway.
Speaker 2:Yes, we should.
Speaker 1:We're over a thousand bucks on the fundraiser and also replays and when people watch it we'll get more.
Speaker 2:So and by the way I did also want to mention so the YouTube fundraiser feature makes it so that you can enable any YouTube channel to collaborate with a fundraiser to support the cause. So for any YouTube channels out there who would like to support this billboard campaign, you are able to do so. We're going to leave this up. You can just point to this in YouTube Studio to support this billboard campaign. You are able to do so. We're going to leave this up. You can just point to this in YouTube Studio to support the billboards and boom. There you go. We would love any and all support we can get to keep this program going.
Speaker 1:Yes, okay, I don't know what to go.
Speaker 2:Shakedology, snake oh, snake. Sorry, is the Orange County location a spot for Sea Org? Would they be shuttled to Los Angeles or do they stay around Santa Ana? Thank you.
Speaker 1:I don't have any current intel on Orange County. When we were there it was not Sea Org members. They did have some Sea Org members kind of stationed there to keep an eye on things. Because Orange County notoriously over over the years there's been a lot of nonsense that's gone on in orange county. There was a period of time, I mean, they were trendsetters, they were stealing money on credit cards before anybody was stealing money on credit cards right, maybe not before hamburg no, no, no, orange county
Speaker 1:no no, no, they 100. It was in the 80s when they did and they were the best they, oh they.
Speaker 2:They wasn't Orange County that triggered the whole, or they were featured in the Time magazine article.
Speaker 1:I'm pretty sure it was yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think also they might have been part of when Amex, american Express, the credit card American Express, yes Banned all of Scientology from having to from from processing American Express because they were they were just overcharging.
Speaker 1:They do in Scientology they have a thing that's called crush reging and it, the registrar, is the person who gets money from Scientologists for the organization, for counseling or courses or whatever it is, and they would tell the person you have to pay for your entire bridge all the way up before you leave today, and that could be $100,000 more, it could be $200,000.
Speaker 1:And they would just beat that person up. This person has $8,000 total in their bank account and before that person leaves they'd get $50,000 out of them. The person would buckle and say I can't give you $200,000, but I could give you $50,000. And 42 of it would be on credit cards and the rest would be their entire bank account, and then that person would default and then they wouldn't. Then they get in trouble and they would do 30 people like that a week and so that caught up to them. And then also this makes disgruntled Scientologists when they can't pay their own bills because they gave it all to these guys, and then they find out, these guys are just giving it all to David Miscavige for his Italian shoes and it's like wow.
Speaker 2:Which, by the way you reminded me, in 2024, there were numerous civilian Scientologists that the Aftermath Foundation helped with who had been cross-reged for credit card charges and we worked with them to get those charges reversed, reported those to multiple law enforcement agencies as credit card fraud and we were keeping a tally and it was in excess of $100,000 that we helped people get reversed in 2024. So just another example of the work the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation does.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I also want to. This is a perfect comment to put that up, because Rachel says how many credits this is in relation to the testimony, the testimonial that you read.
Speaker 2:How many credit cards were taken out in his name once he got that diagnosis?
Speaker 1:Or the guy that you were talking about that passed away oh yes.
Speaker 2:Yes, no, absolutely. It was in excess of $30,000.
Speaker 1:That they really did.
Speaker 2:Correct.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so this person that was in the Sea Org that was diagnosed they had taken out credit cards, and now I don't know that.
Speaker 2:Rachel Including the one we knew about from Rosemary's case.
Speaker 1:That was like 80-.
Speaker 2:Navy Federal Credit Union.
Speaker 1:But how much was that?
Speaker 2:it was a lot it was no. The total and in rosemary's case I believe was ballpark 200 000 yeah, so another person when the the?
Speaker 1:this is a real thing. So when they the the people that are elderly in the seawork, they know that they're going to pass away. So racking up all these credit cards is a no brainer for the sea org. It's a victimless crime for them because the person's going to pass away and there's nothing they can do with that debt because the person's gone and they were in the sea org, they don't have any of the family or anything, so they just Scientology can just take all that money free. So this is a very, very common occurrence where they they get the person to open as many credit cards as they possibly can, max them all out, give all the money to Scientology, then the person passes away and then Scientology walks away with all that credit card fraud in the Rosemary's case, they did this because of course, she's going to pass away.
Speaker 1:She didn't. She got they told her to they told her you need to pass away and they have a thing.
Speaker 2:They said drop your body.
Speaker 1:That's what it is, but she didn't she reached out we ended up getting a hold of her, and she's still alive to this day. This happened years and years ago.
Speaker 2:She just texted me last week she was she was like I saw your live about the billboards. Yay, I'm like yay, yeah.
Speaker 1:So if you think about that for a second, not only did they condemn her that, oh, she's a write-off, let's just rack up $200K worth of credit card debt. She then does not pass away, she gets out.
Speaker 1:And when they found out that we knew about the credit cards, oh, they started writing some checks and that's another thing, even if you don't like us and you don't care about us and you're like, oh, those guys are not really helping. If you were in Scientology and you got some credit card debt, as soon as you mention us, they start writing you checks Because they don't want us to get involved with knowing about the crimes. So they try to erase.
Speaker 2:And this is the Because they know we have many law enforcement agencies on speed dial and put them on the regular.
Speaker 3:And the people who are doing it should be in jail Like you know, let's see some people go to jail.
Speaker 1:It's the craziest thing that they're doing this to elderly people.
Speaker 2:It's so wild. Oh and, by the way, so for anyone watching, if you weren't aware, we put out a newsletter jam-packed full of detailed information. It is also available on the website on the aftermathfoundationorg, and there you can also sign up for notifications to receive those. But my point being that we also set up a platform on the website to enable any current or former Scientologists to submit information of crimes that Scientology has perpetrated, completely anonymously, so that we can connect them with law enforcement agencies at their request and as necessary. But it enables, like you don't even have to have an email address to be able to report crimes there. Okay, as an Everett, I can't believe some of these stories. It's just mind-boggling. Yes, absolutely, and this is why we continue to do the work that we do and volunteer for the foundation to get people out of there.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Okay, should we do another giveaway?
Speaker 2:And then we'll wrap it up.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's go back to. We got Barbara. She was the winner.
Speaker 2:We're going to draw again.
Speaker 1:We've got it's got another 169 people it's going to draw from.
Speaker 2:Nice.
Speaker 1:Here we go, draw again. Hey, I hit the button up there.
Speaker 2:There we go.
Speaker 1:Okay, here we go, folks, here we go. Ooh, rachel, almost got see anybody who comments. Is what RTV?
Speaker 2:Congratulations. Look at that.
Speaker 1:He just made a comment too. I want to see it now. I'm going to put it up now that we read one of our TV's comments yes, we did.
Speaker 2:Congratulations our TV. Send me an email, claire, at blown for goodcom, with a link to what you would like and we will get that taken care of. And thank you again so much to everybody who joined us. We, if you enjoyed our content here today in support of the Michael J Rinder Aftermath Foundation, feel free to drop in the comments what you'd like us to cover in future fundraisers. Again, we'll do we'll. We'll get to planning more of these in the future with more special guests. Thank you so much, amy and Matt, for joining us.
Speaker 5:Anytime, anytime.
Speaker 1:Watch this, go like this, Look see, look at, I have magic.
Speaker 1:I can make her turn like twice to claire in order to because we have, because we have it doesn't work. Now I'll hook you up, I'll show you how to do it. Because we have multiple people and the way our studio is, I had to set up Claire with her own feed and everything so that she could be in this, and it was a lot of work because this is our normal camera and we both are on, and then we have singles and so now that Claire has her own camera, she can be me or she can be her.
Speaker 2:Where is?
Speaker 1:that what.
Speaker 2:It's in our basement, in our basement.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, here, this is what it looks like here.
Speaker 3:Let's see, that's what it looks like oh fantastic, yeah, job on getting that set up, wow it's.
Speaker 1:It is pretty cool. Even you know what's funny? My, our kids don't really care about any of this stuff. They're just like whatever you guys are going to do a live, okay, fine. But when they have friends over, they bring their friends and like check this out oh yeah, they're like. They're like what, do your parents have a youtube studio? I bet the other day when I came in here and there was a bunch of kids in here, I was like what's going on and my kid, my son, was like you're showing them your studio?
Speaker 2:We're like okay.
Speaker 1:Anyway, another thing we do is when we do the end outro, when it's like, you know, do this and do that and all this other stuff, we put up everybody's comments over me yapping at the end, but yeah, For future.
Speaker 2:We'll do a dedicated aftermath intro and outro for these in the future. Again, we're just, we were just kind of figuring this out and, you know, taking advantage of it, and it makes so much more sense to do it this way in support of the foundation and keeping it separate from personal YouTube channel. So, yay, fantastic.
Speaker 1:Yes, absolutely. Thank you for joining us, Matt and Amy. It's it's, it's, even though there's only two of you. It's at least four times the fun when you go okay, we love you.
Speaker 3:Guys, love you so much awesome thanks for joining us, everybody until next time okay, bye-bye thanks for watching.
Speaker 1:If you'd like to help support the channel, feel free to check out the merch store link in the description. We have hail Zinu Zinu is my homeboy and BFG branded mouse pads, shirts, mugs, all sorts of other stuff in there that helps us to bring you new content on a regular basis. You can also pick up a copy of my book Blown for Good Behind the Iron Curtain of Scientology in hardback, kindle and audible versions as well. There's also a link to our podcast and you can get that on Apple, spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. And if you'd like to watch another video, you can click on this link right here, or you can click on this one here, or you can click on the subscribe button right here. Thanks a lot, until next time.
