Blown for Good: Scientology Exposed
Marc Headley worked at Scientology’s secret desert compound, which houses all Scientology management, for 15 years. The 500-acre property is located deep in the California desert. The local townspeople were told lectures and films were made there. But is that all that was happening? It is the location of a multi-million dollar home for L. Ron Hubbard, built two decades after his death. It is the home of Scientology’s current leader, David Miscavige. So what really happens at the Int Base? Are the stories on the internet true? How does Scientology conduct management of its day-to-day operations? Could stories of armed guards, weapons, staff beatings, and razor wire fences be true? If so, how could a facility like this exist in modern-day America? Hundreds of staff tried to escape over the years. Some succeeded but were never seen or heard of again, and most failed. Why were people kept here? What really went on at the headquarters of Scientology? This is the story of what happened behind the Iron Curtain of Scientology.
Blown for Good: Scientology Exposed
We Answer Your Big Questions About Xenu, OT Levels, Shelly, And Life After Escaping Scientology - Scientology Secrets #21
What happens when you strip the mystique from Scientology and just answer the hard questions? We open the inbox and go straight at the topics most people tiptoe around: where Shelly Miscavige is likely being held, why so few members ever reach OT 3, what really happens to body thetans, and why OT 9 and 10 never seem to materialize. No hedging, no euphemisms—just clarity from people who lived inside the system for years.
We start by framing how control works at the top: pressure, punishment, and a culture that rewards obedience over truth. That lens makes sense of everything from CST properties and remote placements to the constant delays on new OT levels. If leadership could invent scriptures, why hasn’t it? Because making up higher levels risks exposure if originals surface, which explains the obsessive surveillance of Pat Broeker and the endless “preservation” campaigns that raise money while keeping access scarce. We connect those dots to everyday experiences at Int Base, the few who actually reached OT 3, and why Xenu all but disappears after that—while BT cleanup becomes a life’s work.
We also talk about laughter as a pressure valve: South Park’s “pneumonia” myth, The Simpsons’ broadside, and the futility of gagging a culture built on parody. The point isn’t to dunk; it’s to show how public humor punctures private fear. Along the way, we share humane memories—cruise dinners with Ron Miscavige Sr., a trumpet rendition of Happy Birthday, the quiet rituals of parenting after indoctrination. Rebuilding happens in small, consistent choices: therapy, books, united decisions, and the stubborn act of asking better questions.
If you’re curious about Scientology, or you left and need language for what you saw, this Q&A is built to be useful. You’ll hear how “religious proprietary secrets” function like trade secrets, why digital access threatened the money machine, and how secrecy keeps the illusion alive. Press play, then tell us the question you most want answered next. And if this helped, follow the show, share it with a friend, and leave a review so others can find it.
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YOUTUBE PLAYLISTS:
Spy Files Playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLWtJfniWLwq4cA-e...
Hey guys, welcome back to the channel. Welcome to another episode of Blown for Good, Scientology Exposed. I'm joined today by my lovely wife, Claire.
SPEAKER_01:Hey, hey, hey. Thanks for joining us this very fine Sunday from someplace located deep in the heart of Colorado.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, we had a real busy week this week. Um we have um we have a lot of uh questions from last week's stream that we want to uh answer today. And we'll and once we go through those, if you guys have got questions, uh we can answer those as well.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And um if you put a comment down below, you will automatically be entered in to do a Davy doll giveaway that we're gonna do at the end. Um we were just I was just tell telling Claire I found I was cleaning up, we were cleaning up the house, and I found this little guy here. And uh he is at the exact same size as the Davy dolls.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:But what what is it?
SPEAKER_01:He's um a little dude that we got at the Roll Doll Museum. What one time we were visiting England.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, that's right.
SPEAKER_01:And at the time our middle son was a huge fan of Roll Doll books. Um we did remember we when we were in London, they had that whole um the BFG, not to be confused with Blown for Good. That's right. BFG as in the big friendly giants.
SPEAKER_03:They had all those glasses.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, they had like this whole treasure hunt all through London um with like the the the uh dream bubbles or whatever they're called. Dream jars, yes, exactly. So we went on that whole hunt uh for our son, which he they I mean, all the boys loved it, but he is.
SPEAKER_02:You found a lot of them.
SPEAKER_01:We did, we found a lot of them, and then we went to the museum in the town where Roll Doll was born, and uh we got that little dude.
SPEAKER_03:Nice, yep. Okay, cool. Um, you want to uh jam in where these people are coming from here? I'll I'll uh I'll uh show them and you read them.
SPEAKER_01:Yep, sounds like a plan. Uh Gretsch L966, hi all joining from Philadelphia. Brian, it's a great day to be an SP in rainy Portland, Oregon. Yes, it is a great day. Uh Megan is a cat. Hello from North Dakota. Mary Kay is joining us. Happy Sunday from Albuquerque, New Mexico. Good to see you, Mary Kay. Thanks for joining us on the regular.
SPEAKER_03:I wonder if they could see the northern lights down there in New Mexico. We could see here in Colorado.
SPEAKER_01:Our friends said they they could see them down there too. Uh Carla Green, hi from the UK. Katie D watching from County Galway, Ireland. Hi, everyone. Nice. Wow.
SPEAKER_03:It's Galway gal.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. Uh Queen of the Silver Dollar, hi everyone, checking in from Illinois. Queen of the Silver. Olga Alice, who is Zenu? We all know who he is. He is Mark's homeboy. That's right. Boom.
SPEAKER_03:BDs activate.
SPEAKER_01:Catherine Olson in the house. Hi, people.
SPEAKER_03:Hey, Catherine.
SPEAKER_01:Poodlebone, hello from New York City. Clara is in the house. Happy Sunday, everyone. Appreciate it.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you to Clara and uh Catherine for jamming in the uh keeping track of the chat.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. Valerie Trott, hi from BC, go Chiefs.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, now hold on a second. We when my grand when my dad lived here, when Grandpa Bernie was living with us, we would be okay with the Chiefs, but he's moved on and we're back.
SPEAKER_01:But he's still with us on this day, and he's still rooting for the Chiefs. Let's just call a spade a spade.
SPEAKER_03:But we're back to Bronco. Let's ride. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:We never had a uh, let's shall we say, peaceful day in our house when Grandpa was living with us because he would um retire to his room to watch the Chiefs and root for the Chiefs while we rooted for the Broncos.
SPEAKER_03:They lost every time against the Chiefs. He'd come up during cat halftime in the game. Oh my gosh. Quite the game happened in there.
SPEAKER_01:We would be reading his thought bubbles. We're like, we're not appreciating your negative energy here. Jamie Perks, hi from rainy southern Utah. Good to see you, Jamie. Joseph Brian Stanley, greetings from sunny Speedway, Indiana. Nice. Audi Zebra, hi from Malden, England. Thanks for the Europe-friendly timing. Yes, we try.
SPEAKER_03:We try, yeah. It's really just Broncos game dependent. If they have a late afternoon game or an early afternoon, then we we can do it early. Exactly. They do these early games.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. Jerome PG was up from Chicago. What's up? Sherry, hi everyone from Moorhead, Minnesota.
SPEAKER_02:Hmm.
SPEAKER_01:Sorry. Apostate Alex in the house, BT Busting in Charge, International Association of Suppressive People in the UK reporting for duty.
SPEAKER_03:Alex, hey Alex.
SPEAKER_01:There we go.
SPEAKER_03:He's been a busy, busy boy these last few months. Of course.
SPEAKER_01:We SP is we keep very busy.
SPEAKER_03:Holy moly.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. Terry, hi from a very windy Pittsburgh. Trevanon, good evening from the Netherlands. Hi, Trevenon. Hello from Tuolemy.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, you say.
SPEAKER_01:Magda, hello from Washington. Manon, hi all. Finally catching alive again from the Netherlands. Yay. Good to see you here. Netherlands, folks. Jack Shaw, hello from Rainy Henderson, Nevada. Will, hello from Alpine, Texas. Nice. Thanks for being here. Aline Levin, hello from Philadelphia. Retro Cara, hi from wet and windy West Sussex, UK. Oh, that's my neck of the woods. Yeah. Well, my second neck of the woods after Manchester. Olga from Milwaukee, Oregon. All right.
SPEAKER_03:Wow, I never heard of that.
SPEAKER_01:Mario Von Motz, greets from Greats from Berlin. December Topaz 22. Happy Sunday from West Virginia. Nice. Hello from upstate New York. No one nowhere. Hello from Earth. My BTs are working overtime today. Vicky, hi from Clearwater, Florida.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, we're gonna jam through there. People are jamming in here.
SPEAKER_01:Hello, Peterman. Heather Peterman, hello from Louisiana. Ryan, hello from Rainy, San Dimas, Southern California. Cherry Blossom and Bees, hi, hi from Germany. Allie, hi all from Ali Harvey in England. Nice. Thanks for being here.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Oh, somebody sent somebody was commenting.
SPEAKER_01:Aposte Alex looks like a troll. Perfect to be sitting next to Davy. Trolls live under bridges. Yes, exactly. He is a troll. Or, you know, whatever. Good afternoon from Loveland.
SPEAKER_02:Hey.
SPEAKER_01:Hey, hey. Robert Sandy Beach. Hi from Atlantic City, New Jersey. Queen of the Silver Dollar. Hello from Illinois. Sunny but chilly. Nice.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, we got it. Oh, one last one from Cherry.
SPEAKER_01:All right, Catherine joining from the Will Ammet Valley, Oregon. We got fan mail saying, thank you for pronouncing that right. Will ammet, dammit. They're like, Will am it, damn it. That's how you can remember. I'm like, oh, good one. Nice.
SPEAKER_03:Cool, cool, cool. So I guess is there anything else that was happening that we wanted to talk about? I I thought we had we had sometimes we talk about things like, oh, we should bring this up on the next thing, and then we totally uh sometimes we forget to update our shared note.
SPEAKER_01:It's all but it's okay. We had a busy week. Lots of good things happening. Um after this episode, if you want to pop over to the Michael J. Render Aftermath Foundation YouTube channel, we have Phil and I recorded an episode this week that we'll be premiering after this show. Um and we talk about the first 72 hours after Escape, what's most important? Oh wow. Yeah, it was a great conversation.
SPEAKER_03:That sounds like a good one.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, very, very fun.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, well, I guess we'll get into the comments then from last week.
SPEAKER_01:So um so do we want to reorient for anyone who didn't see last week, maybe?
SPEAKER_03:Um sure, I guess so. So basically, uh we covered uh the secret bases of Scientology, and then last week we covered uh the Xenu story of Scientology.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And um, for those who don't know, um Scientology believed that we're all infested with space aliens, and that that this was all due to this uh galactic overlord Xenu bringing all these people to Earth and dumping them into volcanoes and a whole bunch of fun stuff.
SPEAKER_01:So if you missed the video to resolve an overpopulation issue 76 million years ago.
SPEAKER_03:I thought it was 75.
SPEAKER_01:75, 76. Let's get it straight here. Um we have teenagers, I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_03:Oh gosh. Anyway. Um dear. So there was we could we did cover a lot of questions, and some of these we might have touched on a little, but then basically we went through all the uh questions that we didn't think we answered or we didn't answer a lot, and uh Claire jammed those into a thing here for us.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. Because as we said, our new format is we cover a topic and then the following week we do QA about that.
SPEAKER_03:It's just too hard to do um uh much of any substance if we spend the whole video answering questions and trying to cover the subject. So we'll just do we're trying to split it up a little and if we'll see.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:Who knows? It's it's easier to do two one-hour videos than one two-hour video. For sure. And people don't watch them anyway. Based on the analytics, there's only about half you guys that are subscribed somehow. Anyway.
SPEAKER_01:That's all good. You know what? You do you.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. So science tells you secrets QA.
SPEAKER_01:All right, here we go. SPTV Junkie. Do you know if Bob Ferris is still at Int Base?
SPEAKER_03:I think he is. I mean, we don't have any other indication that he's not, but um yeah, it's hard to figure out who's there currently. Yep. Because we only get um, like there's like a public records thing that shows voter registration and stuff like that. We get those every few years.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, one year we even got uh, and this was a few years ago, somebody sent us um that there was a 5k somewhere in that area.
SPEAKER_02:Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But Bob Ferris is definitely not running a 5K. Um, but the people, it was interesting to see the people that participated in that race because they were some of the people that will always probably participate in those races, like the Pablo, what was his name? Pablo uh Lopez. Pablo, anyway, and uh Chloe Russell and a few other people. You know, they they they do every once in a while, when things are not awful, do things locally to try and you know create public area control. Yes, exactly. CRO. Like, oh yeah, we're great, we run 5Ks.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Uh Becky says, I wonder if Shelly's lodgings are fancy or if she is just in regular Sea Org accommodation now.
SPEAKER_03:Regular.
SPEAKER_01:Regular for sure.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, she didn't. I mean, even it's funny because when you when we were in the Sea Org, I used to think that they had a lot of fancy stuff um in their door, in their birthing, and in their building and all that. Just because we didn't have anything. Right. We it was like very, very and also um I grew up poor. I did too. So we didn't have a lot of furniture and a lot of knick-knacks, and we didn't the our apartment wasn't decorated. There wasn't a lot of stuff up on the walls. It was bare bones.
SPEAKER_00:No.
SPEAKER_03:So they they had okay stuff. Maybe some of it was nice. There was a lot of expensive stuff, but it wasn't always it wasn't when we now I go like, eh, whatever. They it's not it wasn't that great compared to how you know we have a house and we have nice things, but it's sort of like, okay, whatever.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:They had a little tiny apartment in when they lived in the villas.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I mean, Shelly had access to you know, between the gifts that they would receive that she and and Miss and Ms. Govage would receive for Christmas and Miscavage.
SPEAKER_03:Somebody wrote in and said, Let's get back to calling it Miss Cavage.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, they were like, Thank you so much for everything you do. I really like listening to you, but can we please get back to Miscavage? I was like, that's funny.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, I just think it's a it's it's all relative. It is. And so, yes, they do have a lot of expensive stuff, but I don't think that where she is now, she has a lot of expensive stuff. She might have been able to take some of her things with her.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but as we talked about, she wasn't even allowed to take her beagles with her.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So that's true.
SPEAKER_03:We did talk about that in the other video. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Question What was Russ Bellin like? I've heard some horrible stories about things he did in the whole. Was he always like that or was he driven to it by the abuse? I'm wondering if we're doing the wrong slides here.
SPEAKER_03:What do you mean?
SPEAKER_01:Because I thought we already did these from this was from the CST. That's what I said. Yeah, it's all good.
SPEAKER_03:That's what I said.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, I know.
SPEAKER_03:It's guys, I said I thought some of these slides.
SPEAKER_01:I should have looked at them.
SPEAKER_03:We can do. It's fine.
SPEAKER_01:It's fine. Either way. Hold on.
SPEAKER_03:Let's get them.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. All right. Well, while while you do that, we'll talk about I'll answer this question in the interim. Um, Russ Bellin was generally an okay person in the years that we were there, but in the later years when he became part of um David Miscovaj's inner circle, he was under a lot of pressure, and I think the nastier sides of him started coming out. That's generally what happens with the executives um or people close to um the top of Scientology is it becomes a dog eat dog world, and you either comply and do what's demanded of you, or you end up in the rehabilitation project force doing heavy manual labor and intense security checking. So interrogations, blah, blah. Yep, that's my answer to that question.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, here. I'm gonna put you back here and you can um answer some questions in the chat if you want.
SPEAKER_01:I'm gonna I got what we needed. Okay, perfect. We're all good, guys. Sorry about that. It's uh I knew it.
SPEAKER_03:I knew it. I knew I should have just trusted my heart from the start.
SPEAKER_01:Your heart from the start. Um Okay. Uh here we go. Aline says, Where is Shelly? Has anyone seen her lately? Nope. No, there have been no recent sightings. Um to our knowledge, she is still tucked away under guard at any one of a handful of remote properties that are owned and controlled by Church of Spiritual Technology known as CST.
SPEAKER_03:Cool. Um, I'm trying to jam this in here.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's all good. No worries.
SPEAKER_03:Stop playing. Nice with the case.
SPEAKER_01:We had the uh here, I'll keep going on the I can't do it without doing it.
SPEAKER_03:So here hold on, let's just see. This is like so silly. It won't do it on that screen for some reason. So let me just see if I can jam it in.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, okay, no worries. What are we doing here?
SPEAKER_03:Do your what do whatever you're gonna do.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, okay, there we go. Yay! We got it now. Who is Zenu the QA?
SPEAKER_03:Oh, here we go.
SPEAKER_01:No, you're good. Okay, there we go. Now we're back on track.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, here you go.
SPEAKER_01:All right, Linda Golan says, where do your body thetans go when you leave Scientology? Do they jump on someone else?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, they do.
SPEAKER_01:They do.
SPEAKER_03:Where do your When they get rid of their BTs?
SPEAKER_01:But yeah, but when you leave Scientology.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, then you get to you get to keep as many as you want.
SPEAKER_01:You get But you know what this reminded me of is how David Miskovaj was always completely paranoid about um like other executives who he deemed were non-compliant, yes, that he didn't want their body thetans to jump on him. That's I just this question just randomly reminded me of that.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, David Miscavige. So bizarre.
SPEAKER_01:He was paranoid about getting a bad body thetan on on uh attached to him. Yeah, from SPC org members. Right, exactly. Oh my god.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, what amazing psychopath. Um here, let me get rid of this banner. Um yes, that's right. Yeah, that was a big thing. And he also, um, this is a thing that happened at the very end when we were there where he was putting these copper rods into the ground.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, we've talked about that before.
SPEAKER_03:I never read anything about that, so I don't know if that's on the upper levels and stuff.
SPEAKER_01:But but they had the Scientology has a big thing too about that. Um if you if you succumb to like bad intentions, like you're trying to escape, they call for the upper levels, it's called freewheeling, which is where the body thetans just kind of run out of control and you know you're no longer your case is taken over. Yeah. So for example, when I was in the Las Vegas bus station, yeah, Greg Wilhair tried to tell me, Oh, you're you're freewheeling.
SPEAKER_03:Really?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and I was like, no, I'm not. I'm escaping.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, like your body thetans are controlling you right now.
SPEAKER_01:Get your case under control. Yeah. Get your knock off your case on post, that's what they say, and uh get your butt back to the imp base. And I was like, hello. Are the volcanoes surrounding areas places that current Scientologists avoid? Thanks for the good question, Poodlebone. No, because the majority of Scientologists don't even know about what's on the upper levels. They definitely don't ever talk about it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So I that was just not a thing.
SPEAKER_03:So, like if you're like, hey, I'm heading out to Hawaii, everyone's like, I don't know, there's a lot of BTs over there.
SPEAKER_01:No, because they're not still there.
SPEAKER_03:That's just where the but I'm just saying, that's like a ground zero for BT fucking infestation.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. It wouldn't surprise me if if certain Scientologists believed that they got things stirred up as a result of being in proximity of those if they had reached the upper levels. But um, okay. Next question. If David Muscovaj don't believe in Scientology, how he spends money to reserve it, odd.
SPEAKER_03:Preserve it.
SPEAKER_01:Preserve it, yeah. Yep. Well, it's power, power leverage.
SPEAKER_03:He's gotta play the game.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_03:He's gotta play the game. If he's and also, you guys gotta dig. The they have this thing, this campaign that they run in Scientology called the preservation of the tech campaign. So they they they are spending money on doing all these things, but it's almost a lot of it's coming from donations from people, millions and millions of dollars. These these richie rich Tom Cummins and um what's the uh the ad vie, the drug guy, uh Duggan, Bill uh is it Bill Duggan? Bob Bob Duggan and his wife Trish.
SPEAKER_01:His former wife, Trish.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, his former, his ex-wife, Trish.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:They confirmed in a in a in an interview that they've donated over 400 million dollars to Scientology. 400 million. Just them, just one couple. So it's a lot of dough.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. All right, sorry, let me get back there. Full of questions. Barbara, did he have explanations for fossils of dinosaur dinosaurs, etc.? No.
SPEAKER_03:No, he doesn't even really get into the dinosaurs at all. That's just kind of not really so if there was there's been like four documented extinction events on Earth over, you know, millions and millions of years. The BTs are they don't, they're good. They don't uh they don't care if there's a flood or there's a medium.
SPEAKER_01:They're not part of the physical universe.
SPEAKER_03:I understand, but I mean that's a lot of turmoil for uh you know, if you're just hanging out.
SPEAKER_01:I never asked a lot of questions. Did L. Ron Hubbard believe this crap ever?
SPEAKER_03:I think he really did believe it.
SPEAKER_01:But I think he did because he was psychotic.
SPEAKER_03:But I think it started out. Um it started out like he was kind of going a little wack-a-doodle. Right. No, there's um I don't know if they're still around, but years and years and years ago, somebody sent me a DVD or a CD or something of all of Hubbard's FBI files. A lot of it was the stuff that they raided in the 70s, but a lot of it was all the way back in from when he was in the military and he first started kind of stirring up trouble with Scientology. And there's a whole bunch of crazy stuff in there about his wife. He tried he tried to basically throw Sarah, his second second wife?
SPEAKER_01:Uh I can't remember. Anyway, it was his second one.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it was his second wife that he never had. So when he who was on the tried to throw her under the bus and say she was the one that left his baby in a car, not him, and all these other things. And it it was just like and he was and and she was saying that he was schizophrenic. And he had actually been diagnosed by psychiatrist as schizophrenic. And he was basically uh, you know, a couple sandwiches short of a picnic when he started thinking about Dianetics.
SPEAKER_01:Right. And that's where when you listen, when, you know, during the years that we were in Scientology, listening to all of his lectures, he would drone on and on and on about this happened and this happened, this happened. And then you read his true life history in Bareface Messiah by Russell Miller, and you're like, wait, what? Yeah, he was basically truly believed the stories that he was told.
SPEAKER_03:But he was like, everyone's after me.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_03:And all these plots are happening. Yes. He got beat up a bunch of times. And one of these five with the there's a letter that he wrote. I'll see if I can find it, but there's a letter that he wrote to the FBI.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I saw that.
SPEAKER_03:And it was basic, it was like it's pages and pages long. And it's it's funny if you read it or uh knowing what he says about Scientology and being a victim and all these other things. It's like, dude, you're like the biggest victim of all. Like all he got beat up, he got mugged, he got jumped, he got put in jail, he got arrested for fraud, he all these things happening. He's like, I don't I don't even know what's going on. I didn't do anything. And you're just like, you just listed eight pages of stuff that's happened to you because you didn't do anything. Yeah, that's the most it's kind of crazy when you s when you read this and you're like, there's a string of nonsense that's happening to one person full time for for a decade, but he didn't do anything. He has no idea how all this stuff happened to him. And you're just like, dude, yeah, you're doing up to nonsense.
SPEAKER_01:Completely delusional. Like the biggest thing that I that really hit me was um, so when we worked at the property, we had access to source information retrieval. It was called SIR, which was a computerized library where every like thousands and thousands and thousands of documents, all the lecture transcripts, all this stuff. But very often Hubbard referred to his research.
SPEAKER_03:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:There was no research.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it was him, it was him getting up to some funky stuff with Jack Parsons.
SPEAKER_01:I know what's wrong with this guy. He took LSD. Let's stick him in a sauna for 10 hours, and that's because this. And there's no research, not actual research by the definition of the word.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, you know, they were trying to make a movie on this for a while, a long time. I don't know if it actually got done, but um, I want to say Dave Chappelle and David DeCovney talked about this on in an interview years and years and years ago about this book. It's called Love and Rockets. I'm pretty sure that's what it's called. Yeah, Love and Rockets. And it's about Jack Parsons and all the Alistair Crowley. And it they talk about when Hubbard got in there and he was messing with those guys too, and they were doing weird stuff with that woman, Sarah. She was first Jack Parsons' girl.
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:And hanging out with him when they were doing all this stuff.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And then Hubbard showed showed up and he was like, Oh, hey, we gotta we gotta do our own thing.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Anyway, and that's in that letter, too. That though that file, that FBI file, has a bunch of this Jack Parsons stuff in it, too. Anyway, yeah. Love and Rockets, I think, is the name of the book. We'll have to look that up. We might have to do a whole episode about that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. All right, Matt Denny in the house. What happens when the batteries run out?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Like I said, they ain't using no Amazon Basics. No offense to Amazon Basics batteries, but they ain't lasting 75 million years.
SPEAKER_01:And of course, this is in reference to the batteries keeping Xenu locked away.
SPEAKER_03:She's in an electric cage in the side of a mountain. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And perhaps they researched um unlimited battery power, and that's what they and they brought them to Earth on the, what is it, the DC eight?
SPEAKER_03:That's what I'm saying. If they were flying DC eights over here from another planet.
SPEAKER_01:We might be missing some technological context.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I don't think they had battery tech.
SPEAKER_01:Harvey Denton's Toads question: why did Miscavige never just make up OT9 and 10? And did Ray Midoff really forget what Hubbard told? We absolutely were told on multiple occasions by Miscavage that Ray Midoff had forgotten to what what um Hubbard said.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:The part that I find that hard to believe, you know, obviously in retrospect, is that everything was recorded and written down. Um but Ray Midoff was definitely, as Mark likes to say, one sandwich short of a picnic.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, he was just a couple cans short of a six-pack. Um here's the thing, though, that's kind of weird about this is that Pat Broker was the one that was with Hubbard when he was doing all of these upper level, all this upper level research.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:So it's valid that Hubbard could have done something. Yeah, but nobody had it except for Pat.
SPEAKER_01:Pat dug a hole somewhere in the middle of nowhere and just buried it.
SPEAKER_03:David Miscavige spent like 25, 30 million dollars watching Pat Broker after Pat Broker left.
SPEAKER_01:Why would he have done that? Yeah. Pat Broker wasn't speaking out. He presented zero threat. So what other explanation could there possibly be to justify that level of wanting to keep an eye on somebody?
SPEAKER_03:Trevor Burrus, Jr. And we only know about the 25 to 30 million because two people that were hired to watch him spoke out and and basically exposed this whole thing that they're Tony Ortega covered covered that. And it was in the Tampa, they did a thing in Tampa Bay uh Times or St. Pete Times or whatever it's called now.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And so there could have been other operations that were running parallel to that as well, or since that that we don't know about. Correct. But um so that's where it gets a little tricky. If David Miscavige releases OT 9 and 10 that he made up, then it could come out. Well, here's what Hubbard actually wrote. And then he's in a bunch of trouble, especially if it makes more sense that Hubbard wrote the version that he may be possibly wrote.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, exactly.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, this is a little, this is this is a little crazy. And when you and when we were at the AMPase, it was 100% said by David Miscavige on multiple occasions that there is no OT9 and 10 and anything else up above that. Hubbard David Miscavige said that Hubbard never wrote it, they've never found it, and it doesn't exist on multiple occasions.
SPEAKER_01:So this is so yeah, but the question of why didn't he make it up, you're right. If he's still worried that it's somewhere out there, yeah, and he were to make something up, or even, you know, I mean, he was doing uh revision after revision after revision after revision of every single course, writing, everything, even the lectures, you name it. So perhaps he was scouring for something that would fit the bill.
SPEAKER_03:Or or also they're just gonna uncover it.
SPEAKER_01:Right. Yeah. They'll be like, okay, we found it.
SPEAKER_03:We found it. We found it. It was under cook, it was under recipes.
SPEAKER_01:We we we lost it in one of our vaults, but we just uncovered it. Oopsies. All right. Jess says, question what percentage of Scientologists actually reach OT3? I'm guessing very few. Yes, very, very few. Like of let's say five, ten percent. Yeah. Yeah, that's a good, a good estimation. Um even less when when we're talking about members of the C organization.
SPEAKER_03:Well, yeah, because they're not they're not spending any time getting counseling.
SPEAKER_01:Like if if a member of the C organization was OT operating Thetan had reached the upper levels, ninety-five percent of that time was they had reached that before they joined the C organization.
SPEAKER_03:That's right. And even at the Ant Base, I'm gonna say there was like let's say when there was 800 people there, it was probably like 30, 40 people that were OT. If that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Not even. When they had these the OT print shop, they'd have to do an all hands to get all these things printed, and like 10 people would show up.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:It was like, there's not that many people that can do this.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:All right. Mitch Brisker in the house. Hey Mitch. The church claimed that the confidential material was proprietary secrets. How does a religion have proprietary secrets? Yes. Solid question. Exactly. I mean, we literally could do a whole episode of this. They even claim, you know, they um they use corporate arguments to protect, you know, they they literally just pick and choose whatever they want to, you know, and that's where they utilize the several, you know, very high-level law firms that they have to protect themselves. But yeah, that's a solid question and a really good point. Exactly.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. Next one.
SPEAKER_01:And not to mention the fact, if they really did have the technology to save the world, why not just put it out there? Open source.
SPEAKER_03:Well, that was the kind of one of the struggles that I was having when we were there, is that I kept coming up with these ways, like we can just put all of this on an iPad. Right. Like you could just have a course that's just a PDF. Yeah. And then all the lectures are just MP3s. Why are we making cassettes? And why are we making it's this is like we're doing this the slowest way possible. You could just make each course. I had this whole thing laid out. You could make each course in Scientology a PDF.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And you just sell the PDF.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:And then you just get it. And then and then anybody can get it anywhere. And then all the lectures could be MP3s, and all the you could have a library, you could have a subscription service, you could have I was thought of all these different things that are like, no, we're not going to make any money if we make it all. Yeah. You can't charge$1,500 for an MP3 file, but we can charge that for these CDs, this set of CDs and a binder and a pay big paper transcript.
SPEAKER_01:And you're like, And that was the same was true, which which explains so Warren McShane, who is the legal guy in Religious Technology Center, spent did all kind spent th probably millions of dollars on trying to get the upper levels off the internet. Yes. And the same was true. Like, you know, the the storyline was, oh, well, the people are gonna die of pneumonia. Well, we you disproved that all in one night.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um, but it was all about money and control. And yeah, anyway, okay. Harvey Denton's Toads, I was going to say, how did the Simpsons get away with that episode?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think that the Simpsons made fun of everybody. And so when they made fun of Scientology, Nancy Cartwright didn't have real a real good leg to stand on. Like she's gonna say, like, oh, you guys can't make fun of my my c my my little club.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Well, it and it's funny now that you say that, because then you think about um South Park, Isaac Hayes, he wasn't able to shut that down either.
SPEAKER_03:Well, yeah, but and he did the exact same thing. He's like, I don't you can't make fun of Scientology. He's like, dude, we make fun of everybody. Right. You can't you what wait, huh?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_03:You didn't have a problem. You didn't have a problem when it's going the other way, Isaac. Come on.
SPEAKER_01:Uh Matt Danny, that's a really good point. What did Nancy think of that episode? Yeah, she did not share her thoughts about that with and with definitely not that we heard of.
SPEAKER_03:Also, to be fair, she's made tens of millions of dollars from South.
SPEAKER_01:A lot of which she's given to Scientology.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, but still, she was nobody until she got that. And then she started making some some do reme. So it's like, hey, come on, bite the hand that feeds you. Yeah. She also did a robocall for Scientology as Bart Simpson, and she might have gotten in a little bit of trouble for that. She did one of these, like, hey guys, it's Bart. And she was like, You gotta come to flag or you gotta do this or something like that. And it was in Bart Simpson's voice. It was she did it as Nancy, but she did it in Bart Simpson's voice.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, who gives a toot what Nancy thinks?
SPEAKER_01:Becky, big brother fan, South Park Scientology episode was removed from Parap Paramount Plus. Really? Hmm. Yeah, I really, I really would love to do um uh whatever we can do. I know we can't play the whole episode, but going through that together for uh We did that. No, we did not.
SPEAKER_03:I thought we did the video. We did not.
SPEAKER_01:We talked about doing that. If you would like us to do a reaction video to South Park's episode, drop a comment and let me know. Uh and we'll we'll put that in our little shared note and do that one of these weeks.
SPEAKER_03:We did a spy file that was about the documents of Mike recapping the episode and in reports back and forth from Dave to Dave Miscavage.
SPEAKER_01:Miscavage, yes.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, here we go.
SPEAKER_01:Harvey Denton's Toads question Do you think there would be more or fewer Scientologists if they were upfront about Xenos?
SPEAKER_03:Fewer.
SPEAKER_01:Way, way, way, way, worse.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, it's one thing to say, oh, we're gonna help you with communication skills, and we're gonna help with you have better relationships.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, what's true for you is what's true for you.
SPEAKER_03:We're gonna help you get all the alien space cooties out of here.
SPEAKER_01:If you if you in the if in the same conversation you're saying, oh, what's true for you is what's true for you, we accept people of all religions, and we believe in Zenu from 76 million years ago. Five. 75. You know, it's a rounding problem, okay. Um it's just true.
SPEAKER_03:It's and he says approximately 75 million years ago. It could be more now.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. So, yes, if they were because a lot of like we over the years of talking to many, many different people currently in, under the radar, getting out, got out, um, a lot of them stayed on with this false hope that what was on the upper levels was going to save them and you know solve all their issues they ever had as a human being and make them a this uh, you know, it's all it's smoke and mirrors.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, they want the money.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Proto-man, but call me blues. Does Elron have an origin for this information? Is it just stuff he remembered from a previous life? Yes, he it's stuff he remembered from a previous life, whether he was on drugs or prescriptions at the time, he did not mention. Uh yeah. Slonomite. What were L Ron Hubbard's views on Star Trek and Star Wars? Oh, this one we did talk about.
SPEAKER_03:We did talk about this, and also um there's a video coming out in a few weeks that Mitch and I, Mitch Brisker and I did. Yeah. Because there's a bunch of um for the cinematography area, there's a bunch of um writings that L. Ron Hubbard did to them, which some of them are just recorded meetings that he had with them or things that he wrote to them on how to do this or how to do that. And um and he talks about he there's Star Wars is kind of like he wanted it his movie to be Star Wars. The what was it called? Battlefield Earth Revolt in the Starship Revolt in the Stars, the screenplay screenplay that he wrote for the movie.
SPEAKER_01:He thought that was gonna outperform Star Wars, which is the Zenus story. It's illusional.
SPEAKER_03:He thought that was he was like ding ding ding.
SPEAKER_01:Oh my goodness. Whitney, question what was Ron Miscavige Sr. like? Did he have a similar personality to David? He did not, actually.
SPEAKER_03:We were just talking about this because we went on a cruise in February one year, and it was our son's birthday party.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, and but backing up for a minute, because this is worth talking about. Ron Ron contacted us pretty much almost very soon after escaping.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, right, Ron Miscavige Sr., David Miscavige, Miscavage's dad.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. And you and Ron always were very close, like he was kind of like a dad to you in at that property.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And um, and you know, we didn't nobody really has a friend relationship at the property because it's such a snitch culture, but we have reconnected with and so many people that have gotten out and become good friends with them.
SPEAKER_03:And in Ron's case, but I was genuinely good friends with him when we were there.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:And um, he was the one who set up all the weights at the exercise building. Yeah. And when I was going able to go to the David Miscavige's little exercise building, Ron was helping me with what weights I should get and all these different things.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And so we did talk a lot over the years. And when we escaped, Ron Miscavige heard an interview that I did on the radio on his iPad. He on coast to coast. He would listen to KFIAM 640 on his iPad, and he heard an interview, and him and his wife listened to it, and then they wrote a report basically saying, hey, we listened to this interview that Mark did, and he ain't lying about what's happening here. And he's right that these things should not be happening here, and they're off policy and they're not per L. Ron Hubbard, but they're happening, and then they got in trouble.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. So fast forward they escape and we reconnected with them, and then their family were going on on annual cruises.
SPEAKER_03:Becky's family.
SPEAKER_01:Becky's family, yes.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, his wife Becky.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Um, her family had been going on cruises for years, and only because Becky and Ron got out, they kind of said, Hey, would you guys like to come on one of these cruises we go on every year? Yeah. And then when they got invited, they invited us, and then we actually went on the cruises with them. I want to say we went on several cruises.
SPEAKER_01:We were cruising with them for eight, nine years.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So we would go on a cruise every year with Ron and Becky's family, and Ron and Becky would go. But the funniest thing was there was a year or two, or one of a few times, where Ron and Becky didn't come, but we did. We went and hung out, and we also invited a lot of our friends to come on the cruises as well. So it wasn't just we were just hanging out with Ron and Becky's family.
SPEAKER_01:Rest in peace to both of them. So sad that they're not with us anymore. But they did introduce our family to cruising, and that just became like our kids love cruising. Kids love it, yeah. Yeah, for sure. It's a no-brainer if you've got kids. But yeah, Ron Miscavige Sr. was nothing like his son, and definitely recommend Ron's book, Ruthless. If you haven't read that, get a copy of that.
SPEAKER_03:The thing I was gonna say is on one of those cruises, Ron and uh there was a several other musician friends that used to be at the international headquarters.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Like four or five people that showed up that were musicians.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:And they brought all their instruments. Yes. So like Carrie brought her upright bass, and Ron brought his trumpet, and they brought all these things.
SPEAKER_01:And Steve Hall would sing sometimes.
SPEAKER_03:And at one of the dinners that we had, it was our son's birthday.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And Ron Miscavige, out of nowhere, just pulled this trumpet out and started playing Happy Birthday in the dining room, and everybody was like, these guys got their own band for the happy birthday kid.
SPEAKER_01:It was the best. Anyway, it was the first time. Our son still talks about it to this day. It was a really special memory. Yeah. All right. M. Brisker, Mitch, I never heard Xenu mentioned after OT3. That's true for you. Um, yes. Just the body thing. But still, yeah, exactly. So the origin story never shifted.
SPEAKER_03:Well, yeah, but but they don't need to cover Xenu anymore because it's just like, yeah, hey, this is where the the space cooties came from. They came from this guy, and now this is all the cleanup that we've got to do. And he's locked up, so we don't have to worry about him anymore.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. And so when you're addressing body thetans and clusters, you run them through incident three, incident one, and all of that. It's it's still all the same origin story, but you're right, Mitch. He's not mentioned newly. It's just still the same problem that we're still working to resolve, even though when you complete OT3, they're all gone. But no, not so much. We're back.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, that was it.
SPEAKER_01:That was all right, awesome.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, this is the fake Navy. We want to remind everybody for if you take your picture with uh a fake Navy Davy, um, you can do whatever you want with it. You can go uh sightseeing with him, you can go um hang out at the local Scientology organization and and see uh if he can get up to any adventures around there, getting pictures, whatever you want, dog toy, cute uh cat toy, pictures, anything. You send them in to Blum for Good. You can go to Blumforgood.com, and if you go to the contact us page, there's a way you can just submit your photos there, or you can email him to Claire at Claire at Blomeforgood.com, and then we will do a drawing at the end of this month, which we gotta figure out how we're gonna do that because I'm gonna be gone.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, logistics just uh kicked in.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so we'll figure it out. Okay, we're not gonna figure it out now. But we have a bunch of other questions to answer, by the way, in the chat.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, but I'm here, I'm doing it. We're good, loving it. There's your fan favorite, Claire's favorite, my favorite. Yeah, there's three winners every month. You can win one of these. Um, do we have one in here? Uh there's a um I was trying to see if there was a uh what do you call that thing? Uh bobblehead. Are there any bobbleheads in here? Oh, yeah, there's uh there's a Leah one and a Mike one.
SPEAKER_01:There we go.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, yeah, there you go.
SPEAKER_01:Here is the Leah bobblehead.
SPEAKER_03:These are special edition bobbleheads that were made um to support the Aftermath Foundation. We have a Leah one and we have a Mike one. And then you can also buy a special edition of those that has you can just buy the bobblehead, or you can buy a special edition. Does it does every edition special edition, or can you buy it by itself and you can buy it by itself.
SPEAKER_01:We have a a small amount left of signed. Uh so we have if you get the Leah and the Mike bobblehead, it comes with a photo of Leah and Mike that's signed by each of them. No auto pen up and this was from September 2024, yeah. That they both did this for us, and we have obviously when they're they're done, they're done.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Goes without saying.
SPEAKER_03:And then you can just get a Leah one, or you can just get a mic one. And the person who wins the contest, the three people that win the contest, can pick either a mic one or a Leah one. Not with the signed photo, but just a bobblehead.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. Standard bobblehead.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, okay, you want to do some questions?
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Let's do it.
SPEAKER_01:Start.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, we got a uh a super chat. That's true.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, coffee milk, dude. Great topic, great questions. Thank you for being here. We appreciate you. Uh apostate. Alex, question. We know Scientologists tend to like conspiracy theories. Tend to. Yeah. Uh what do you think is their general take on all the news and Congress hearings on UAPs, UFOs, and the three eye atlas comet?
SPEAKER_03:I think they just think that, yeah, of course. We they already know about all the aliens. Well, the ones that are in the upper levels do.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:That's a good question. It's funny.
SPEAKER_01:Can I just say something though?
SPEAKER_03:No.
SPEAKER_01:Uh I can. And I will. Gosh darn it. When I read um Mission Earth, there's a whole thing in there about aliens coming to Earth and they they would be hovering over and like, you know, uh transparent spaceships and all that. So obviously, this was well before I did the upper levels and had any idea of any of the origin story of Xenu and all that, but I can remember as a teenager like looking up at the sky and going, wait, are there alien ships here?
SPEAKER_03:Right. Um, I see this one started. I have no idea what this is.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Uh, do you guys know a James Peters who was in Camp Verde? No.
unknown:Never.
SPEAKER_03:What's Camp Verde?
SPEAKER_01:I'm not sure. We're missing context. So shoot us an email if you have more information. We'll do our best if we have any information. The journey 2020. A Scientologist has claimed the Xenus story is a parable.
SPEAKER_03:Well, yeah, they claim all kinds of things because they don't want people to think that they believe they're innate.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, they also claim it's not a thing and all that.
SPEAKER_03:So yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_01:They uh whatever's an acceptable truth to make people um enter their doors. Lupita, question, Mr. Mark, please. A QA on your book, off topic. I know. Oh, that's a great idea. Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, if you guys maybe if we put a community post up, and we just say, hey, if you wanna um if you want, if you have a question for Mark about the book, put it in this post and then we'll put we'll when we have enough questions, we'll do a video.
SPEAKER_01:Perfect. I love that idea.
SPEAKER_03:And then also I can just do that on my own if I'm out and about. So then that could be a video that while I'm out, because I got a I got a big project coming up. I'm not gonna be around.
SPEAKER_01:Yep, several. Uh Jerome, question Do you think David Miskovaj actually thought or was nervous that LRH was coming back in 2007? Was the building of his house for show? Yeah, maybe a little bit. Um on the off chance that he showed back up, at least he'd have a good uh a good thing to, you know, some good compliance reports to well, but he was never gonna let him back in.
SPEAKER_03:In addition to telling um Ray Midoff OT nine and ten, he also told Ray Middoff, El Ron Hubbard told Ray Midoff when he was coming back.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:So they had a date because they had that in writing from Hubbard to Ray Midoff saying, Hey, I'm peaceing out, but I'll be back at this time. And that time was in 2007, so the house had to be done by the time that house was. Where's Hubbard? He missed a train, he missed a connection.
SPEAKER_01:Or he, you know, got on the uh the flight going the opposite direction. Aline, where is Shelly? Has anyone seen her lately? Oh yeah, we we did this one.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and we have done a whole series on where is Shelly to give you all of the latest and greatest information, all the way back to her early childhood and all the way forward to what we know now.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:So you can check that out on Blown for Good Uh Scientology Exposed. On the YouTuber, and you can go to our website and we've got lists of all the episodes and stuff there.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. Eastern Ocelot, do they have to fill out census data for the Imp base?
SPEAKER_03:Aaron Ross Powell Um they do actually. And they do voting stuff. They do do stuff because they want to make sure that the politicians know how many people that they have there and how many voters they have there. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So they do try to do that. There are a lot of staff from other countries. So, for example, the whole time I was there, I was a resident alien with a British passport. So I never voted the entire years that we were there. Anyway, yep.
SPEAKER_03:They do have enough voters to sway a local election.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:At least that many.
SPEAKER_01:Yep, for sure. Firebirds, child, how did you two learn how to be parents? Neither of you had good examples, but it seems like you've done okay. Thank you. Well, we're just trying to do the opposite. Read lots of books. Uh, you know, we we just we know what not to do. Let's just put it that way. But you know, also I will say that both of us are, you know, we learn from our mistakes, and so I I don't think there is such a thing as a perfect parent. It's not like when you have a baby, it comes with a a roadmap for the next 18 years.
SPEAKER_03:And they don't all work exactly the same.
SPEAKER_01:You get different makes and models depending on No, but you know, we've we've worked through uh therapy, books, podcasts, you name it. When we run into a problem, we're very much like, okay, United Front, let's let's tackle this head on, right? There you go. All right. Brian, question Did Hubbard write anything about Xenu coming back if they are unsuccessful in clearing the universe? No.
SPEAKER_03:No, they said he Hubbard said they locked him up. He it was basically like this whole thing happened. Don't worry though, it's done and dusted. We got Zenu locked up in a mountain with this electric bars.
SPEAKER_01:The less questions you ask the better. And now we're just as with many things in Scientology.
SPEAKER_03:Just gonna spend the next 10,000 years doing space coody cleanup.
SPEAKER_00:It's like I I researched this and I've got it covered, and we are going to clear the planet. This is our one chance in all the millions of years.
SPEAKER_03:I've spent all my life scanning 75 million years worth of experiences, and I'm not gonna turn over any of the I'm not gonna make a succession plan or or fix any of the craziness or release all these upper levels that that finish all this off. But trust me on this part.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. If he had such insight into life and everything else, then how the heck did he bump off without finishing everything?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Audi zebra, does miscavige worry about ETs? Yeah, we did. We did cover that. Yes, he definitely does, which is weird because I think it has to do with his paranoia and not not so much his belief in Scientology.
SPEAKER_03:I wonder what our cooti count is. And maybe that's why we haven't had a lot of like personal visits from Miscavige, because our cootie count is too high. We've got a cootie count. That's a good one. We need to make some merch for that. We've got to tell Clara cootie count over 9,000.
SPEAKER_01:Cootie count activated. How many cooties do you have active at the moment? Opal Mouse, does anyone know where Pat Broker is today? I think we vaguely know his whereabouts, but he has never spoken out. Maybe one day he will.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I've got some stuff. I've got some stuff coming out this about this soon. We'll see. All right. Not anytime. Like nothing. Don't be holding your breath. But it's coming out.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. All right. Sounds good. Hey Mark, last week you mentioned giving an interview about a Scientology school in Australia. I had no idea they had schools here. Can you share more details about this? Who was the interview with?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think we linked to it in my um there was a if you go in the comments, I'll see if it I think somebody posted a comment in the video that we did last week.
SPEAKER_01:Isn't it behind a paywall? It is behind a paywall, so it's kind of hard for me to But we can you know what we can do is we were going to put up a community post. We can at least link to it there.
SPEAKER_03:They did send me a PDF.
SPEAKER_01:Well, yeah, I don't want to get in trouble.
SPEAKER_03:Um, but we can say where the um Yeah, if you maybe if you're in Australia, you might have a subscription to this thing. I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. So there you go. Monica, Florida. Don't the body thetans want to go to a hospital and go into the body of a newborn? Yes, probably that is um, it's not really something Hubbard talked about, but that is some Scientologists have the theory that them setting their body thetans free is part of the cause of overpopulation on the planet Earth. All right, apostate Alex. Thank you. Feet's activate. Thanks, Alex. We appreciate you. Yeah. Does Miscavige's fear of bad body thetans show he does believe to some extent, or was it all for show? So I think that's my answer to I know, but my answer to that is he's paranoid, period. Like, you know, um yeah, sees aliens, thinks that the Martians are coming to get him and all that. Like, I think it his the um this aspect more speaks to his paranoia than it does speak to his belief in Scientology. Yeah. That's my personal thought. Is your interview with Coast to Coast available online?
SPEAKER_03:Um, last I checked many years ago, it was in the Coast to Coast. If you're like a Coast to Coast subscriber or something like that, you can find it. But um we'll have to look and see. We should see if we could find the John and Ken interview I did, the KFI. Uh I think I've done at least two or three shows on Coast to Coast now. Because I've done some afterwards. Yeah. See if we can find those. And we'll we'll if we can find them, we'll put a link in the description.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. There you go.
SPEAKER_03:Gosp.
SPEAKER_01:Brian, question Can body thatans attach themselves to anything aside from humans? If so, do Scientologists worry about their pets and body thatans? That's a funny uh I don't think so. But you know what's what this reminds me of is that in How to Live Though an Executive, the book by L. Ron Hubbard, he talks about that sometimes executives should take a uh a cycle away from a human body and and pick up a dog body as a you know like as a palate cleanser?
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Cootie cleanser. I need a cootie cleanse. I don't know about this one. This is above my pay grade. Okay. I only know what I've read from Hubbard online.
SPEAKER_01:But yeah, no, they they can. Um Paige Silver, question How long after leaving did you read Bareface Messiah? So for me, I read it like 2007. So it was like a year and a half after leaving. I also read Mad Men or Messiah by Bent Card. And um yeah. In the first it uh the first six months, I think, I was still pretty terrified to even look at anything.
SPEAKER_03:This is a great one.
SPEAKER_01:Callan Coop, wasn't Midoff on the bridge? What happened to his perfect memory? Same with Broker. Yes. Great Midoff was OT eight.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, and also Pat Broker. Um Pat Broker remembered everything. That's the problem. And that's why Miscavige spent so much money going after Broker and keeping an eye on him, is because he knew what was up. And I don't remember um bro Pat Broker never worked at the base when we were there. Right. The only time I ever saw him or or knew was when he when Elrin Hubbard died and he went to the palladium. I was at the palladium and I saw him there talking or whatever. Um when we weren't just running around the lobby like kids because we were like, who cares about any of this? Let's just play tag in the palladium lobby and running up and down the stairs and balconies. And um anyway, but um yeah, this broker thing is a weird thing that nobody's really gotten to the bottom of.
SPEAKER_01:No, the only person who can answer those questions is Pat Broker, and he's not answering any questions currently.
SPEAKER_03:So there you have it. Coming down the final few.
SPEAKER_01:All right, Code Monkey. Question to Mark. Before knowing about OT3 from South Park, did you know of Thetans or have any interest in up the bridge materials? You knew about Thetan, but not body thetans.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, there was no I and the funniest thing was I actually had a contractor that I had brought into the property and he was selling me computers and audiovisual stuff. And we were out in the parking lot one day at the base. He would come to the base and bring equipment there. And we were out in the parking lot. He's like, So what's up with all the alien stuff, dude? And I was like, what are you talking about? And he was like, I heard you guys believe in like space aliens and stuff. And I was just like, dude, I had I don't know anything about that. I ain't heard nothing about space aliens.
SPEAKER_01:No, I think I think it's fair to say that given that both of us were in I mean, I was born into Scientology, you got in pretty young. We were always just um drilled to answer those questions like, do you always believe what you read in the newspaper? Yeah, or on the internet. People say wacko things about Scientology that's oh oh, Dr. X in the house. Hi folks, Mark's homeboy Xenu is out jamming with his body thaintons on his world tour. Mark has merch. There is a Mexico City band called Xenu and the Thantans. What? Do you think Xenu has tech that's not touch us for diseases, illnesses?
SPEAKER_03:Is there really a Mexico City band called Xenu and the Thaitans?
SPEAKER_01:Wow. Yeah, maybe we'll have to check that out. That is amazing. We'll have to look at their start date and see if it but yes, Dr. X, you're right. Mark has Xenu and the Body Thetans tour merch and concert schedule and all kinds of things on the BFG merch store because as we always say, why not have fun here and there while we're talking about such a dark subject?
SPEAKER_03:Yes, thank you for the super chat, Dr. X. It's very generous.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you.
SPEAKER_03:Um COS episode of South Park is on Paramount Plus, I just checked. Yeah, I was gonna say they tried to get it off of the streaming platforms, and that was covered. We covered, we did this in a spy files episode. We covered all of this, and um, they have not been able to get it taken off of Paramount Plus. I think when they transitioned, I think Paramount got bought by somebody, and I think there was a lot of stuff transitioning, so it it might have taken a bit for everything to to move over or what however they did it, but it's up.
SPEAKER_01:Coffee milk, dude. Didn't you guys feel like if anyone else did what miscavige has done, Davey would have RPF'd or expelled them or whatever? But because miscavage did it, it is somehow not suppressive. Oh yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_03:100%. That's and that would come up at the base all the time. Like, yeah, how can I get in trouble for this when Dave is doing that? And you're just like, what's going on? There's no remote.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, I remember the time when it was like anyone who even wrote a knowledge report on David Miscavige or who in um an auditing session, a counseling session, or um an interview to find out who your potential trouble source to, like who is the suppressive person influencing you? Anyone that named David Miscavige in any of those was gotten rid of.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. This I think this might have been what her um Dr. X is publishing.
SPEAKER_01:So, Kara, can we have a Xeno in the Body Thaitans 2025 tour shirt?
SPEAKER_03:Is it a 2024, the one I have?
SPEAKER_01:Oh, maybe it is. That's a great question. We'll have to. He's Mark's gonna go check his actual shirt that he has here in the studio so we can check and answer that question. Uh what year is it? Let's see. Here you go, folks. The moment we've been waiting for. He is re-entering the studio chair.
SPEAKER_03:Ask and you shall receive. We have a 2025 Zenium Nobody Tatans. Concert tea. Here, I'll put it on the There we go. Okay, I see.
SPEAKER_01:See? There you go. Pretty snazzy. March 13th, Clearwater, Florida. May 9th, Los Angeles, California. June 6th, Aruba.
SPEAKER_03:I got it going on. We did it. There you go. Gotcha. Done.
SPEAKER_01:Xenu is a little bit more. I'll put a link.
SPEAKER_03:I'll put a link in the um video, the products. I'll make I'll add the Xenu, the Body Thaitants t-shirt. If it's not already there, I might have already done it.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. Very possibly. Olga, question. How do Scientology followers put to write that LRH and little David Miscavge had most of their family leave Scientology and declared and not see that those two are the PTS, potential trouble source, the actual problem. Cognitive dissonance? Oh, completely. That's saying it is a disqualification for an executive in Scientology to be related to a suppressive person. So David Miscavage, by Hubbard policy, does not qualify to run Scientology.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:It is kind of crazy.
SPEAKER_01:It is. Yeah. But you know, it's all convenience. Northern Shrew. Question. Oddly, I get the feeling that David Miscavage wanted to like Mark, that he had a low key respect and admiration for him. Am I way off? You're not way off. Mark was always either doing really, really well and like all the meetings, or he was out shoveling poop from the aeration ponds. I mean, it was literally there were no there was no in-between. And at one point, even in the early 90s, Shelley Miscavige had picked you to um groom to become a deputy for David Miscavige. Well, that that didn't go well, but he's I wasn't in the cards.
SPEAKER_03:I had other points.
SPEAKER_01:Mark is way too much of a rebel for that.
SPEAKER_03:I was like, I ain't doing that. I need to be doing the the audiovisual stuff. I ain't. No way I'm coming at coming to hang out with you.
SPEAKER_01:Not that you not that you could or did say that. No, but I it didn't pan out. Let's just say that.
SPEAKER_03:I made that path veer it another way.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. Question: What do you think of that LRH 2.0 who's in prison? Yeah, you know what? Don't follow by Well, no, listen.
SPEAKER_03:This is the best thing, this guy. Okay. He comes back. I can't remember actually.
SPEAKER_01:He alleges that he comes back. Didn't he change his name to laughing at Ronald Hubbard?
SPEAKER_03:You know, he is his legal name is.
SPEAKER_01:Clearly, it's going really well.
SPEAKER_03:He's following in L. Ron Hubbard's footsteps. It's the natural progression of L. Ron Hubbard. He would have ended up in jail. So the new guy is doing what he was gonna end up doing, going to jail. No, but this is the best thing because this guy came back. He's this is his story. I came back as L. Ron Hubbard. Okay. Or he was L. Ron Hubbard. He came back, got this other body, and he's like, hey, I'm here. And they're like, no, you're not. That's the if another hundred people did that, they would say the same thing. Right. There's no one who's coming back going, I'm Elron Hubbard. They're gonna they're gonna be like, nope.
SPEAKER_00:Nope.
SPEAKER_03:So it's kind of crazy that they built this house for him.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Somebody said that they were Elrond Hubbard, and they're like, no, you're done.
SPEAKER_01:And by the way, that is where I do believe David Miscavige built that house for show rather than the belief that L. Ron Hubbard was coming back.
SPEAKER_03:That's what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_01:I'm saying that it's a good way to utilize lots of money and tie it up in real estate. And so, you know, hey, make everybody think that David Miscavige thinks Hubbard is coming back. But even if Hubbard did or did not come back, there's no way he's gonna take back over. David Miscavige is not gonna like do his hat ride up and go, here, sir, I had you covered while while you were gone and everything's great. Uh that ain't never gonna happen.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, here's another great one.
SPEAKER_01:All right, question. Has there been credibility given to any of the numerous people who have claimed to be Hubbard returning? Nope. Zip, no, that's what I'm saying. It's not gonna happen.
SPEAKER_03:It's a perfect scenario, an example of what happens when somebody does come back and says I'm Hubbard. Yeah, there's no way for anybody to say yes or no. Right. And that's and actually the funny thing is that is the entire um premise of the South Park episode. Yeah. The kid comes back and they say, Yes, yes, yes, yes, you are, da-da-da-da-da. Yeah, which is a joke in the show. His thetan levels are off the charts. But but the fact that they then go on to to say, you're not the guy, the real guy would never do this. Right. And then they just kick him out. Right.
SPEAKER_01:So But don't you think that if there's a piece of me that goes that has to be if Hubbard and Miscavige both believed that Scientology gave you full and complete recall of all your lifetimes, everything you'd ever done, don't you think they would have set up a code word?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Hey, when I come back, I'm gonna give you this um authentication code, and that's gonna that's gonna trigger the turn everything over. But that we know that was it's just all bonkers.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's silliness.
SPEAKER_01:All right. How can Tom Cruise and John Travolta believe in Xenum? And why don't they help Shelly from her Me Too captivity? Yeah, completely. So again, we've talked about that anyone we've ever talked to that had studied the upper levels uh never believed it. So, you know, they got they get along to play along, whatever you want to say.
SPEAKER_03:I think that's not the case with Tom Cruise.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I think He he absolutely believes it?
SPEAKER_03:I think he's been he's basically got the movie studios subsidizing Scientology's RD on how to get rid of aliens. Okay? Edge of Tomorrow, World of the Worlds.
SPEAKER_01:He's got the best minds in Hollywood trying to figure out so you're saying that he too is has a little bit of a Zenu obsession?
SPEAKER_03:Of course he does, because he's been game, he's been game planning how are we gonna get rid of the the a aliens if they come and they don't and they haven't been their bodies, their souls haven't been taken out of their bodies.
SPEAKER_01:Oh my god. I know we're gonna have a problem. I'm just like, you know what? I'm so over all the Xenu and alien nonsense. I'm like, I love be the good. I love be the good be the good. Your life that you are have control over is right in front of you. Uh anyway, whatever. I won't get off, I'll clam off my soapbox now.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I want to show this one just because I want to see if it makes you uncomfortable.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Question Did either of you get the vibe that Miscavige liked Claire a little too much? And you're trying to make me uncomfortable? Wow, honey. And that's why the rules about marriage and RTC change. So it's funny that you should say that. This thought is honestly repulsive to me. Um, it really is, like grossly repulsive. However, when we had started interviewing with the producers uh for season one of Leah Remini Scientology in the Aftermath, the producer was like, I I'm just saying it sounds like he had uh something going on there. And I was like, ooh, that's gross. But uh yeah, it wouldn't it in retrospect, as creepy and vile and disgusting as that is, um I think he did have a thing for young women, especially if they were remotely pretty.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, but I don't think I didn't get that. I didn't get that vibe from him. That he was not not not not the other girls, but not to you. Like yeah, there were definitely other girls that you got you did get that vibe.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, but the one the the problem is Jenny Linson was always kind of like Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, no, I'm I'm not um putting out that, you know, I'm anyway, whatever. But I will say that the thing that always drove me absolutely nuts is being that I'm English and was especially younger, I was shy and you know, whatever, and I tended to blush very easily. And he would stomp on that. Like he would sometimes just walk in to a meeting and he would literally come over to me and go like this. And I would turn completely purple. It was like something that I was trying to fix with Scientology, and I never could. It was awful anyway.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, we're coming to the truly disgusting. We're gonna pick well, we should do the winner now, actually. Okay. I just realized we should do that. Okay, look at this. Double Clares. Um Okay, if you've commented, oh look at that. 101. Does it say 101? I think it does. Oh, it's 123 now. Oh, nice.
SPEAKER_01:There you go.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, here we go. We're gonna do this.
SPEAKER_01:I've Are you gonna play your sound?
SPEAKER_03:I almost forgot.
SPEAKER_01:So Tell us if you hear the sounds. Mark, you know how Mark tell us if you hear the sounds. Oh, musical mark is in the house.
SPEAKER_03:Do you hear the sounds? You've gotta hear the sound. The timing was a little off. Matt Henderson. What? Matt Henderson? Is that Matt Henderson? The Matt Henderson we know Matt Henderson.
SPEAKER_01:Well, we won't say anything.
SPEAKER_03:Holy money.
SPEAKER_01:Send us an email, Claire at blownforgood.com. Congratulations. Um, and hey, folks, let us know if you heard Mark's Super Duper sound effects there. Of course they heard it. Clara, did you hear it?
SPEAKER_03:Of course they heard it.
SPEAKER_01:She heard it. Yay!
SPEAKER_03:Of course they heard it. Congratulations, Matt.
SPEAKER_01:Nice.
SPEAKER_03:Now, we knew a Matt Henderson.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:So I don't know if this is Matt.
SPEAKER_01:I'm sure there's lots of Matt Hendersons in the world.
SPEAKER_03:I know, but it's kind of a coincidence that we'd have a Matthew.
SPEAKER_01:Quinky dink.
SPEAKER_03:Anyway, um, yes, they heard it. We heard it.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, we did it. Congrats, Matt.
SPEAKER_03:We heard the sound. We heard the sound of the men.
SPEAKER_01:There you go.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. Um, we had a good video today, don't you think?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that was great. And now we're off to go watch the Broncos. Go Broncos.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and we're also going to be watching the aftermath video. We'll be in the comments on that as well. Yes, we will.
SPEAKER_01:We'll join the chat there so you can ask any questions as it premieres. And uh thank you to everyone who joined us this fine Sunday.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, we're having um we're we we you know, for a long time we were going full-time on work, and then for a little bit we were like full-time doing YouTube stuff, and we figured out a kind of a happy medium between the two of them. So we try to do at least something once a week. If we don't do it on Blum for Good, the aftermath has a video. We've been actually doing one video on each for many, many months now, pretty much. So we've got a good happy medium. I do have some big projects coming up, so Claire might be rolling solo for a few weeks here and there. We'll see.
SPEAKER_01:Maybe I'll do a solo AMA episode.
SPEAKER_03:Something, whatever. Claire's gonna have to figure something out because I ain't gonna.
SPEAKER_01:Or Clara and I will do something.
SPEAKER_03:That's a great idea.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, Clara was gonna put together a bunch of questions and like That's a great idea. It is, I know. I just had it.
SPEAKER_03:I love that.
SPEAKER_01:I love I love it when you love my ideas.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, guys. Till next time.
SPEAKER_01:She's real. Bye.
SPEAKER_03:Thanks for watching. If you'd like to help support the channel, feel free to check out the merch store link in the description. We have Hail Xenu, Xenu is my homeboy and BFG branded mouse pads, shirts, mugs, all sorts of other stuff in there that helps us to bring you new content on a regular basis. You can also pick up a copy of my book, Blown for Good, Behind the Iron Curtain of Scientology, in hardback, Kindle, and Audible versions as well. There's also a link to our podcast, and you can get that on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. And if you'd like to watch another video, you can click on this link right here, or you can click on this one here, or you can click on the subscribe button right here. Thanks a lot, until next time.
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