The Bridge for Early Career Preachers "Preachercast"
The Bridge for Early Career Preachers "Preachercast"
Season 2, Episode 9: Rev. Hannah Faye Allred
This month we sit down with Rev. Hannah Faye Allred, pastor of the Kitchell Memorial Presbyterian Church in East Hanover, NJ. She was also a member of our inaugural cohort and now serves on the board of advisors for The Bridge.
Hannah Faye is the author of girlpastor.com
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Find out more about The Lilly Endowment's Compelling Preaching Initiative
Welcome everyone to the Bridge for Early Career Preachers Preacher Cast. The mission of the Bridge for Early Career Preachers is to provide resources, continuing education, and a supportive community for those who are moving from aspiring to active preaching ministries. The Preacher Cast is intended to profile preachers, to hear their stories, to reflect with them on their own preaching. We want to engage with preachers as they think about their own identity, their own experiences, and their own experiences. rather than us handing down tips and tricks about preaching from on high. I am your host for today, Rich Volz. I serve as the associate professor of preaching and worship, and I'm the director of the bridge. And I'm flying solo, uh, for this episode of, uh, of the preacher cast. Mandy is out. So you all are stuck with me, um, but continue to listen on. Um, because we are really excited to have our guest with us today, the Reverend Hannah Faye Allred. Hannah Faye serves as the pastor of Kitchell Memorial Presbyterian Church in East Hanover, New Jersey. She's originally from Texas, is married and a mother of two, and holds a master's of divinity from Union Theological Seminary in the city of New York with a concentration in biblical studies. Before coming to Kitchell Memorial, she served as the Staff Associate for Mission and Social Justice at the First Presbyterian Church in New York City, interned as a student minister at the Brick Presbyterian Church on the Upper East Side. She believes that the church's doors should always be wide open with a no strings attached welcome, and believes in preaching that makes the Bible come alive to people of all ages in a rapidly changing world. Her ministry passion is helping others discover the peace of the divine inside of themselves, what it means to be a beloved child of God. She is also a Taylor Swift super fan. Dear God, I hope we don't talk about that. A coffee snob and Anglophile and keeps herself busy with her love of gardening, running, and occasionally writing for her blog, girlpastor. com, which we'll put a link to in the show notes. Hannah Faye is also with us this month because she was a member of our very first cohort in 2023 and has recently agreed to serve on our board of advisors. So, Hannah Faye, welcome. We're really glad that you're here with us, and I can't wait for our conversation today.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah. Thank you for having me. This is fun.
Rich Voelz:Yeah, so let's dive in. Um, tell us about how long you've been preaching, and if you could, tell us a little bit about your preaching context at Kitchell Memorial.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah. Um, I guess, uh, preaching regularly now I've been, uh, this is my third year and that, and that grind of Sunday coming every week, um, before that I, you know, had the privilege of getting to preach about four to six times a year at my previous congregation, um, obviously, you know, very different when you're just one of many associates, but, um, You know, I went from a corporate size congregation in the city to very family sized church in the suburbs of New Jersey. And it was. Talk about preaching to your context. It's a very different, very different context, but really fun and a wonderful group of people here. I feel so blessed and privileged to get to call this church, um, home for a little while and, um, you know, I had to just learn that there's, there's a different pace and, um, and yeah, I think you, you learn about your context or you learn how to preach to your new context by learning who the, who. Your context is right and sitting next to their hospital bed or having snacks in their living room and chatting and coffee hour. You know, I just, I got to know the people of, you know, East Hanover and the history of this town. It's a farming community back in the early 1800s. And so a much different. Speed, you know, a church off fifth Avenue, but it's been, it's been wonderful. I'm so happy to be here.
Rich Voelz:So not only did you shift in that, in that transition from sort of city context, uh, or New York City context to a sort of different demographic context, but you also changed pastoral roles, like coming from a multi staff situation to, to, you know, lead staff person, right? Or are you the only staff person, ministry staff person on it?
Hannah Faye Allred:I'm at the solo pastor here. Um, I have an incredible minister of music who's awesome, but part time, right. He also has a day job and, you know, and, um, I have an amazing office administrator also part time. Um, so, so yeah, it was a huge context and it was very, you know, Uh, I will admit it was very lonely shifting from being one of like six to seven at all times to, you know, sometimes the only one in the office. And I don't want to jump ahead of what you might ask me, but that was part of what I love so much about participating in the bridge program, because I got to meet a lot of other pastors in the same position as me that might've recently shifted into a new role. We're feeling lonely. We're, you know, same stage of life more or less. And it really sort of made me feel like I wasn't just floating out in a pasture somewhere, but that I was a part of a greater cloud of witnesses. So yeah, it was a big, a big adjustment for sure.
Rich Voelz:Yeah. I mean, I think, um, a lot of the folks who come into our cohort or folks who may be on the sort of margins and maybe trying to move in closer to our circle of folks here, um, maybe they come from multi staff situations like you, right? They're associates somewhere and they're making that move into. oftentimes a solo pastor situation, or maybe they're coming from a seminary context. You know, they're graduating from seminary and going directly into a solo pastorate and that community, either from a multi staff situation or a seminary community or both, right? Kind of evaporate from you.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah, it's scary. It's so scary. Yeah, it is. It really, really is. And I think it was just so nice to, to, I don't want to say commiserate because that, that wasn't what it was, but just being able to understand where one another were coming from and share some of the struggles and strategies. And, um, and I still am in touch with a lot of the people that I met. I didn't know anybody, you know, coming in and, um, You know, Rosie and I have become really good friends. She was one of the people in that first cohort and we ended up recruiting another, uh, pastor and we planned all of Advent together and we could, cause I'm in New Jersey, she's in Texas. The other one was in, I, you know, I think outside Philly. And so, um, yeah, the relationships have been invaluable from,
Rich Voelz:cool. Uh, I'm really gratified to hear that. Um, really and truly it's deep in the heart of our mission.
Hannah Faye Allred:yeah.
Rich Voelz:So tell me when, when did you and I've talked before about your story, but, but when did you know you wanted to preach?
Hannah Faye Allred:Um, it was when I was still a student intern at brick, which was. I mean, that's a wonderful church. And the, um, when I was there, they had an interim pastor, Kim, uh, Kim Clayton, and then the pastor who was over our, the internship program, his name is Doug King. And, um, I remember just being totally overwhelmed. I did not grow up Presbyterian. Um, I grew up in more of a Southern Baptist non denominational context and people who are unfamiliar with that context may not know that, um, women are not preachers and. So, you know, getting to seminary and getting into church work was already like such a weird and convoluted journey, but it wasn't until I was sitting there and I got to hear, um, you know, Kim preach weekend, week out, and also here, you know, Doug that I just. It was, it was this weird sort of nudging of like, you know, feeling as if there was something there, but also being a little too afraid and timid to kind of make that leap. And it, and it was after lots of meetings with, you know, Reverend King and others that I realized this is what This is what I'm passionate about. This is what I think about. Um, so, so it took some time and obviously I was, you know, in associate positions and was very grateful for any opportunity I had to preach, but, um, I could just feel this as the ministry that I felt God was, was leading me to, and it was very, it was fun and very intimidating though. So. Those are tall pulpits. Literally, figuratively and literally, very tall. So, yeah.
Rich Voelz:I'm curious if there was a particular aspect of, of preaching really drew you in, or was it kind of a comprehensive whole? What was it about preaching that kind of snagged your attention and drew you in and sort of took hold of us as something that you wanted to proceed with in terms of, of your life's work?
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah, um, so, I feel like when you first start preaching, right, you sort of can't help but Try to make yourself sound like the people that you love and feel inspired by. Right. And it's, and you know, I think to an extent that's okay. Right. That's how you learn. That's how you figure out your voice and who you are. Um, but I think over time, rather than trying to make myself sound like someone else, what I realized with this draw that you're asking about this, um, hook almost about preaching was the Sort of earnest delivery, this, this, um, sense of earnesty and joy that was coming through these preachers that I was listening to. Um, and Bob Dunham's, another one, he's a dear friend and preaching mentor of mine. And I remember early on I would, I would write my sermons and deliver my sermons like him, right? Because I wanted to have that same. Sort of, um, warm invitation, like come into this story, this story, there's a place for you in the story too. Right. But what I realized was to do that was not to make myself sound like him or make myself sound more scholarly, but it was to allow myself to be eager and earnest and the good news that I was. And I think that's what really hooked me with preaching is that we have this opportunity to make these stories come alive for people, right? We might be separated by language, context, geography, and a few thousand years, right? But there is not a far disconnect between. Human, the human condition, right? Between feelings of grief or jealousy or joy. And I think having the privilege and the opportunity to make that come alive and invite someone into it is just so like endlessly inspiring and exciting to me. And I feel like once you find that and figure out how your voice fits into that and you allow yourself to convey that earnestly, because I think early preachers, and if I may, especially early. Like young female preachers, a lot of times you're earnest, you're eager. Those are kind of terms that we label as being young and naive, but I think that they convey, um, just sort of an unbridled passion and joy about the craft. And that to me is what I tried to, what initially hooked me into preaching and what I tried to convey when I walk into
Rich Voelz:I love that. And you've already made your way into our next question is,
Hannah Faye Allred:the club, sorry,
Rich Voelz:no, no, no, that's fine. So, so tell us about your voice. So when, when I talk about, um, a preacher's unique gifts and their identity, um, I always talk about voice and I know that people are sick of me saying this, but I talk about it with a capital V, um, because I think it's that important.
Hannah Faye Allred:capital V. I like that.
Rich Voelz:And that important to name. So how would you continue to riff on that? How do you describe your voice? I mean, you talked about the initial sense of what, what, what drew you in and what you hope to convey and what characterizes you, but are there things that you would add to that? Maybe in your years of discovery, what makes you the preacher that you are?
Hannah Faye Allred:Um, so I think, well, I mean, I, you know, I am still on the younger side, if you know, or this is like a spectrum. Right. Um, and I think, you know, for a long time I tried to keep my age a secret, like my congregants, you could tell they were like, how old are you really? You know, and it was like, I don't know, you know, but I, I finally just sort of let all that go, right. I, um, I think good preachers. Storytellers and they pay really close attention to, to life and what's going on around them. And everybody can relate to a story about the rush of getting out the door to make the school bus and then getting stopped behind the dumpster or like, you know, like just be who you are and don't try to be something that you're not. And for so many years, In seminary and right out of seminary, I felt like I, I had to prove that I was qualified enough to be there. And so, you know, I try to incorporate these things that you learn in seminary and it's important, right? It's important to know what Kierkegaard said about whatever. But when you hear congregants, they don't really care that much. But they do care about that human component. That they can immediately say, yes, I have felt that in my daily life, or I felt that with my own kid this morning or my spouse or the grief that I'm feeling from whatever, so when I think about my voice, I try to just think about who I am as a person. I'm a little irreverent. Um, I'm, I, I, I like to have a good time. I, and I allow myself to be buoyant and joyful in the pulpit, but I also, um, think and feel deeply. So it's not that I. I try not to be scholarly, but I try to invite the congregation to care about this point also, and I find it's really tricky like when you're preaching and you say, and the Greek, this word means, and you can just kind of feel everybody turned out. But I say, you know, there's like some nuance in here that we should, we should dig around in. This word also could mean. And it's, it's just how you convey what you're trying to illuminate, but doing so in a way that's not this like Ivy tower. Look how smart I am. That's not relatable. And people don't, I don't think like that. Maybe they do. I don't know.
Rich Voelz:Yeah. I love that idea of relatable and just sort of showing up at yourself. I hear you also naming, I mean, real factors that press up against the inclination, not just for you, but I think for many, like, so being a woman, being younger, feeling like you've got to prove yourself and fit within certain kinds of, of molds of preaching.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah.
Rich Voelz:and I also loved that, like, you're not giving up the scholarly, it, so it's there, but it doesn't come at the expense.
Hannah Faye Allred:Right.
Rich Voelz:You saying it in a way that people can hear and in a way that feels authentic to who you are and the way that you show up in the world and in the book.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah. Yeah. Cause it's like, why does it matter that this word could be interpreted in this deeper, more nuanced way? Well, it matters because maybe that there's a feeling that is more compelling to the listener. That connects us on a deeper level of, you know, you know, the human condition, the human emotion, like we can all identify with that. And so, yeah, it's, and I never, I never want to come across as though, you know, the pastor is smarter than the congregation because they're not, and they are capable of going there with you. It's your job to make them want to go there with you,
Rich Voelz:Yeah.
Hannah Faye Allred:right? So you have to make it interesting and compelling. And if you lead with the pre or the. Kierkegaard said, like, nobody cares, but, but show them why they should care and show, because once they get there and they arrive at that point with you, you know, they're in that story and they're invested at that point.
Rich Voelz:Yeah. There's a difference between like telling them and then inviting them in. And I, I hear you saying part of who I am is, sort of the, a homiletic of invitation, right. Of, of inviting people into that journey.
Hannah Faye Allred:And then away, I'm sorry to cut you off, but in a way I am. You know, God got me here, right? God led me into the ministry, into this place. But the only reason I am here is because other people extended that invitation to me, right? That is the only way I fell into the Presbyterian church, you know, seminary professors read, read this book and do, you know, and, you know, pastor done. Um, you know, Hey. This is a, you should listen to this pastor. She's, you know, that invitation of, of being a part of this, um, larger story and larger narrative. So it's that sort of also that idea of passing that baton of giving that invitation to others.
Rich Voelz:I really love that. Um, it's, it's a hospitable kind of. Um, of way of showing up, uh, that invites others to be part of it. So I'm, I'm always, um, curious and want to know more about people who assume that kind of posture of hospitality in the ways that they preach. What may have started to unpack a little bit of this, um, as you talked about coming to voice, but. a lesson you learned early in your preaching career? Maybe something that if you had a time machine, you would love to kind of go back to an earlier version of yourself and whisper in your ear. What, what's something you learned early along the way of your preaching career?
Hannah Faye Allred:Gosh, there's so many things I wish I could go back like, don't girl, don't do that. Don't preach. You know? Um, I don't know. In a way that I think would be helpful for other early career features or someone listening to this. I, and I need to be careful in the way I say this, but I could go back and tell myself anything. I would say it's not that big of a take a breath and I would remind myself that you work hard. Yes. Do your best. Absolutely. Every time. But it is not only up to you.
Rich Voelz:Yeah.
Hannah Faye Allred:There's no such thing as you crafting the perfect sermon, finding the most amazing illustration, right? It is the work of the spirit at the end of the day, you know, and, and when you show up and bring your best. The spirit is going to do, do what needs to be done with or without you. Thanks be to God. But you know, it's just let yourself kind of take a breath and understand that the responsibility is not only yours to shoulder. And I would also tell myself, you're going to preach some really shitty. You're going to have a few, okay, it's going to happen and, and be okay with it, right? Because that too is a part of your journey, but also the spirit, as we know from the Bible, the spirit can do a lot. With a little, so, you know, just take a deep breath. Don't take it so seriously. Always bring your best, but, but it's okay. You're going to be okay. That's what I've told myself.
Rich Voelz:sort of three things. So one is just a simple matter of perspective, right? So oftentimes I'm somebody who still, I have a doctorate in, in homiletics and I still get nervous when I preach every single time. sometimes,
Hannah Faye Allred:You know what? I had a preacher tell me if you're stuck, when you stop being nervous before a sermon, it's time to stop.
Rich Voelz:right?
Hannah Faye Allred:I think he's right. Sorry. Go ahead.
Rich Voelz:No, no, no, no. That's fine. Sometimes I just sort of, uh, a mantra I whisper to myself is like, this is only 20 minutes. This is only 20 minutes. Right. And thinking about the grand perspective of my entire life, like this is just 20 minutes of my life.
Hannah Faye Allred:I love that.
Rich Voelz:And that, that helps calm me. So I named that to say, like, that's just one, it's just like a sense of perspective.
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah.
Rich Voelz:second is, um, there's a sense of humility here I think is really important. It's not, it's not self deprecating, right? You're not putting yourself down in any way. Cause I don't, I don't hear you not being confident, but what I hear is like an appropriate sense of humility of, you know what, this is not the only thing that's happening in the world or, uh, in the sense of worship that happened,
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah. Yeah.
Rich Voelz:and then, then the third piece of that I hear is like a really robust spirituality that I think we're too often hesitant to name. That yes, we're going to bring our best. He said that. Um, but we're also going to trust that the spirit is greater than us to do far more than we can ask or imagine. I think I've heard or read that somewhere before. Um, that, that, that God is going to show up and that God is going to work with all that we bring to the table. Um, even when it's what, it's not what we would call a home run kind of sermon,
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah.
Rich Voelz:I think it's just so important. So I appreciate that, that perspective. Mandy usually asks, uh, asks this question, uh, when we were together, co hosting, um, and she always frames it in really lovely ways, but I'm just going to ask it out as it's written. every preacher is growing should be that's. And she always says like, that's a fundamental commitment that we have as the bridge. So what's something you're working on in your own preaching right now? Yeah,
Hannah Faye Allred:I can't, I can't hear Mandy in this question. I love that. Um, okay. So I think when you're first starting out, right, you're just trying to make sure it all gets done by Sunday, right? It's. The bulletin is printed and it's, it's written ish by the time you climb in the pulpit. So for me, for a long time, it was just Sunday to Sunday, right? Now what I'm trying to learn and push myself to do is imagine the craft of preaching beyond one Sunday, one 20 minutes, right? Like what is a greater story That I'm trying to tell over a longer stretch of time and, um, how can I work smarter and not harder necessarily? How can I take a cue from my children and what I know they're doing in children's ministry? You know, I'm a solo pastor, so I'm also teaching Sunday school. Right. But like, what are the ways that I can fold these many components together and, and, and tell a larger story than just, I think the in and out snapshot of what, what I'm preparing, you know, from week to week, Mandy would say, you know, isn't every Sunday, a sermon series in a way, like, you know, the story that you're telling from week to week. But I think what I'm trying to learn and figure out is how to be more intentional with that longer. Sort of arc of the, of the story.
Rich Voelz:I love that. I often call that just sort of strategic ministry, right? So you're thinking about what's the long arc of this congregation? What's the work are we trying to do together?
Hannah Faye Allred:Right.
Rich Voelz:that's a helpful reminder for somebody who's more experienced and spend a lot of time in congregations. A kind of mode for me is thinking that way,
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah.
Rich Voelz:helpful for me to harken back to the times where it was like, okay, just got to get it together this week. Um,
Hannah Faye Allred:this week and I have to survive next week. Yeah. I'm just now repeating the lectionary. Like I'm just like, once this year is over, the start of admin will be the first time I get to repeat. And there is sort of like a sigh of relief a little bit of like, okay. I've done this before. Let's see what's new. Let's see. You know what I mean? There is like this, I'm getting into a rhythm now, but that's something that I'm trying to grow into for sure.
Rich Voelz:I'd love that. So, uh, we'll take a departure perhaps from, uh, the more serious aspects of preaching. So tell us about, your strangest or funniest preaching moment at this point in your, in your youngish career. Uh, what's, what, what, everybody's got a story like this. What's funny or what's strange that's happened when you're in the pulpit?
Hannah Faye Allred:I'm so glad you're asking me this and I'm really afraid even though I'm like barely three years in, I'm afraid that this, I'll never be able to top this. It's that, well, um, so, uh, we have a, a very cute, but tiny little sanctuary, right? And, um, a lot of, um, churches, of course this has to do with my children, um, a lot of churches have those, like, they call them pray grounds where they maybe will take out the first pew and have the kids set up right there. But because of the way our sanctuary is laid out, it really makes it, um, we have this charming little alcove. That's under our bell tower. And it's in the back right corner of the sanctuary. So even though like theologically, I don't want the kids tucked in the back corner, it really does make so much sense. That corner is not theirs and we hang their artwork on the walls and it's like super cute, but they're back. In the corner. So they're pretty far away from the preacher, i. e their mother. And at this point in my preaching career, we didn't have too many kids. Um, you know, the, the only kids I think at this point at the church were, were my own, we now are boasting like anywhere from like seven to nine. So that's exciting. Also at this time, my husband was. the youth minister at the Presbyterian church in Morristown. So, and we didn't have regular nursery care. So it was truly just like a perfect storm of everything not going your way. And I was in the pulpit and I was preaching and you know, I knew the kids were okay. They were being quiet and I'm, you know, saying whatever it is I'm saying. And I just happened to look and I see my daughter and she's got a wad of her hair like this. And she's holding it in front of her face and she tiny little scissors that are made for little hands. Why, why do they make scissors for little hands? So she's holding it and she's got the scissors and she is like, right here. And mid sentence, rich. I go, don't cut your hair. And I, and everybody in the sanctuary, everybody like leapt from their pew. Like if, if anyone was asleep, we were all like high alert. And everything stopped, and everyone looked, and one of my church members who I absolutely love and adore, Emily, she's about my age, she got up and walked to where Jane was and took the scissors away, and took all the other scissors in the corner, oh my god, but it was like, there was no recovering from that, right? The sermon was over. So we all took a beat and then I like, I don't know, what's the name of the guy who, um, the form function guy, Tom, like he's so much more than the form function guy. He's great. But that was the first thing that I thought of. I was like, form function, form function. Like what was I, what was I trying to get them to hear in this sermon? You know, cause I was like, there's no saving this. So I was like, well, You know, I don't remember what we were talking about and everybody laughed. And then I was like, and you obviously don't remember now either. And they laughed even more. And I was like, but at the end of the day, I want you to know. And I just like said. Whatever the function was, I was like, amen. And it was sermon was done. It was over. So
Rich Voelz:And I would bet that a lot of people were remember not just that moment, remember your recovery, right? Which, which, which you are doubting in the moment, but I would bet if we surveyed some of your people, they would be able to tell us exactly what you were talking about.
Hannah Faye Allred:that would be funny. Everybody does remember that that sermon. And it was so close to the scalp too rich. Like there would have been
Rich Voelz:Sometimes
Hannah Faye Allred:recovering from it, but we made it out a lot.
Rich Voelz:we got to thank, thank God for liturgical interruption. So
Hannah Faye Allred:It's true. It's true. Oh, geez.
Rich Voelz:So, and if a, what, what's something that you weren't taught in your preaching education? Yeah. that you've adopted into your preaching practice, something that's become vital to you in your preaching, either in the preparation in the embodiment or delivery of the sermon, or after you finished with the sermon something that nobody taught you, that you have incorporated as something that's really important for your work.
Hannah Faye Allred:You started asking that question, what were you not taught? And I wanted to be like, what a boiler is, but that's not where you were going. We need to teach that in seminary. Um, it was touched on a little bit, um, in seminary, but I wish that, I wish that we had kind of been given more space to flesh this out for ourselves, but just exactly how much of yourself you're willing to put out there and the sermon and what you, what you Want to hold for yourself. Right. And, um, professor Lisa Thompson was my preaching professor at union. And she, she asked that I, she was the one that asked this and made me think about it, but it wasn't until I was really like in a preaching context that I realized like, Oh, you could really lay it all out there. Or not and trying to figure out where that line is and how to incorporate that. So, you know, we've already talked about my voice and how I really do try to pride myself on being authentic and being who I am, but something that I try to ask myself and think about when I'm preaching and the stories that I'm telling, especially when I am telling stories about maybe my family or my children or myself is where is that line of, this is just for me. And this is. This is for a greater purpose to tell a bigger story. And, um, and I'm still figuring that out, but, um, but that's been something that was, I don't, I don't recall being given a lot of time to think that out probably cause we're just like trying to figure out how to write a sermon at that point. You know, but, um, that's something that I've run into where it's like, you know, me, I may, I might not have told that story if I could do it over again, you know, things like that. But, but there's also something to be sad for being your authentic self and also. Telling stories of which you are not the hero, right? Fairly recently, I told a story about a relationship that I lost and really kind of threw away back in 2016 around the presidential election. Um, and I had never told the story publicly before and, um, kind of caught me because I could sort of feel it in my throat a little bit, like, Ooh, I still feel this quite a bit and I have regret with how I left this relationship. But I, but I asked myself. Is this something you want to keep for yourself, or is this part of a greater story that you feel God has meekly qualified you to tell? And you know election season again. And I thought, I know I'm not the only person that has thrown a relationship away that was built on so much more than politics, but still let it go. And I told the story and I got a little emotional, but I was able to hold it together and tell the story. And it felt almost like it was too personal. But I was astounded at the amount of people that came up to me, you know, in the receiving line. With tears in their eyes, talking about their own relationships or friendships or, you know, familial relationships that have just been so strained. And this felt like this invitation, right? Like the door is always open for us to go back and try again. Um, I'm sorry. I talked too long on that question, but
Rich Voelz:Not at all. I think that's really helpful because Sometimes you, I mean, there are no guidelines, uh, like no hard and fast rules for these things, right? Um, I want, I love a line that, um, comes from Alice McKenzie's book, What Not to Say. and she talks about that. She's got some like one liners, uh, about how much you should share in the pulpit. And she's, uh, one of them is, Um, don't share about yourself. If you're, if you can't afford to go, like if this is your therapy, right, the pulpit is not the place for therapy.
Hannah Faye Allred:yeah.
Rich Voelz:so I love the way that you, um, you, you sort of have the balancing scales here. Like, am I, am I sharing the story to talk about myself am I sharing it? Because I think it points to a larger sense of what God is up to or what God is inviting to, uh, uh,
Hannah Faye Allred:Yeah. I'm
Rich Voelz:us into. And so I'd like that, that sort of balancing, um, uh, or the scales that you've offered yourself to kind of judge between, if you should share something like this. And I think it's important for preachers to, to come up with their own sense of what that looks like for them themselves.
Hannah Faye Allred:not sure.
Rich Voelz:All right. I'm going to skip our last question for now, and I'm gonna come back to it at the end. Um, so. Um, obviously, as I said at the beginning of the episode, um, you're a part of our first, uh, cohort and, um, I'll not, I'll say that you have absolutely been a cheerleader for us along the way. Um, and somebody who is instrumental in our success and the first cohort. So tell us about your experience. Like, uh, what did you find valuable about it? Um, how did it sort of propel you forward in your preaching ministry? We're getting ready to open applications in the next couple of months for our third cohort, our 2025 cohort. So what would you say to those who are listening in and thinking about whether this might be something that we have
Hannah Faye Allred:Um, I would say apply, apply, apply. My experience was so great and not only because you invited me onto this podcast to say how great it was. It was truly so great. Um, you said something in your little intro about like practical resources, not like tips and tricks from on high. And I think that perfectly encapsulates it because when you're, if you're just fresh into your call. A lot of it is this, you know, wisdom from descending greats of the long lavish preaching ministry. And there's like a time for place in that. And it's very valuable. But what I find more helpful than anything is like, oof, I just need help crafting a compelling sermon in a practical manner while also figuring out how to figure out what's wrong with the boiler and write the other pieces of the liturgy and everything else. Like, I needed practical, um, instruction so badly. Not that I didn't get it in seminary, but once you are thrust into a call, it's just, it's a different animal, right? And so what I appreciated about every workshop or, um, lecture, I don't know what you guys call it. It was a workshop time.
Rich Voelz:Yes.
Hannah Faye Allred:towards. That practical nature. What are the, what are the tools that we can give you that you can walk away with and then apply to your unique context? Um, and I just felt, and this is going to sound like I'm exaggerating, but I really mean this. I just felt like I walked away from that conference and my whole, um, like the, the craft of preaching had been demystified for me a little bit. Like it's no longer this. unattainable thing, but like, no, I can do this. And I think a lot of it had to do with Alice McKenzie, right? She was great. And I'm, I know you guys had Kim Wagner this past year. Also great. I love her, but the way that these women are able to, um, Talk about this divinely mysterious thing that we do, but in very practical, um, that help if you are, you know, a 20 year preacher or like a year three preacher like me, where you are able to understand that, that hinge moment in a sermon where you're talking about a Bible story. And the next thing, you know, you're talking about what's going on in Israel, Gaza, and how these two fit together and the way we respond as humans. To the brokenness of our world. Right. And I think that's what I appreciated about the bridge. It was, it was also a good time. You know, you guys are fun. You guys aren't like snooty. Everybody was fun. Every, we all had a good time. We really like friendships, you know, bond and you give space for, for rest and sort of like independent processing time, but you made the most of every minute and every workshop. Um, and he also sent us free swag. I don't know if you've helped like. Announce that, but like they give you a lot of cool free stuff for
Rich Voelz:Swag.
Hannah Faye Allred:the free stuff, a
Rich Voelz:Swag is always good. Hannah Faye, thank you for your time. We're going to start to close this out, but one of the last questions we always ask the guests on the preacher cast is. We serve preachers who are early in their career. Obviously you're still early in your career. word would you like to leave for who are like you?
Hannah Faye Allred:Keep, keep going. That's the word I would like to leave. Um, be true to who you are and keep going. And if you bring your best and do your best, every time you step into the pulpit, the spirit of God is going to take care of the rest. So just believe in the good news that, that God has told you to share and just keep going
Rich Voelz:I
Hannah Faye Allred:and
Rich Voelz:All
Hannah Faye Allred:don't sweat the bad sermons. Sorry, that's more than a word, but you know, you can't expect any preacher to just give a word.
Rich Voelz:We kind of expect that in this question. Absolutely. Hannah Faye, thank you so much for spending time with me this afternoon. Um, I can't wait for this episode to get into our listeners ears. So thank you so much.
Hannah Faye Allred:Thank you. And thanks to Mandy too. You guys are doing great work.
Rich Voelz:Thank you. I would send you to our website, upsim. edu slash bridge. If you want to find out more about us, about our programming, you can also catch us on social media through Instagram and Facebook. The bridge is funded by a very generous grant from the Lilly Endowment's Compelling Preaching Initiative. You can find out about that initiative and other grant programs like us at compellingpreaching. org. We will be back next month with another episode. So until next time, we encourage you to preach faithfully, to preach boldly, to keep going, and to know that we here at the bridge are here for you in these early years of preaching.