Pastor to Pastor
This podcast is dedicated to iron sharpening iron, current events, and culture trends. You will hear pastors perspectives on a variety of topics including leadership development, evangelism, outreach and so much more.
Pastor to Pastor
Marriage for Life: Building a Lasting Covenant Ep 1
Imagine safeguarding your marriage against the odds with insights that truly matter. Pastor Jason and Pastor Seth bring you eye-opening discussions on why 43% of first marriages and even more subsequent marriages end in divorce—and what you can do to avoid being part of those statistics. Learn how societal pressures and who you surround yourself with could be silently sabotaging your relationship, and why the idea that children can 'save' a marriage is a dangerous myth. Equip yourself with the wisdom to build a forever partnership, leveraging the power of strong social circles and intentional effort.
We tackle a topic that's often swept under the rug: the impact of pornography on relationships. It may seem like a taboo discussion, but ignoring it can have dire consequences for your marriage. Discover the truth behind the misconception that pornography can spice up your marital intimacy. With alarming statistics and real-life examples, we highlight its potential to harm even the strongest bonds. Pastor Jason and Pastor Seth share personal insights and practical strategies for maintaining purity and resisting digital temptations, reinforcing the sacred bond between spouses.
Marriage isn't a set-it-and-forget-it vow; it's a lifelong commitment that demands effort and adaptation. Explore the transformative power of open communication and spirituality in nurturing a relationship that stands the test of time. Discover why prayer and community support can be your marriage's greatest allies in navigating life's changes. We also delve into practical tools like love language assessments that can help you better understand and meet your partner's needs. Concluding with a heartfelt blessing from Numbers Chapter 6, we offer our best wishes for protection, grace, and peace in your marriage journey.
the enemy is after your marriage. How do you make marriage for life? Coming up on the next Pastor to Pastor? Hey, it is Pastor Jason and Pastor Seth. Here at Pastor to Pastor, the podcast where iron sharpens iron and Pastor, we got a great one to talk about because it's something that I know a lot of people are always seeking information on, so let's talk about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think there's a lot of couples who never evaluate their marriage. They never sit down and just talk. How are we, where are we struggling? Things like that. And so I'm excited to do this series, these episodes on how to make marriage for life, and today we just want to talk about why we should look at our marriage. Why are our marriage failings? Why should we pour into our marriage and make time for each other? And so what we're going to do, we're going to look at some statistics and really just justify if you don't think you need to start working on your marriage, this, right here, will encourage you to make the right steps to build healthy marriages that last. For how long? For life, for life, that's right, for life, yep. So let's look at some statistics and we'll kind of talk about these and break these things down. So, when we look at divorce, 43% of first marriages end in divorce.
Speaker 2:That's crazy, yeah. And it gets worse. Second and third marriages actually fail at a higher rate. So 60% of second marriages fail. 73% of third marriages fail and end up in divorce. That's crazy. So the more you get divorced, the more likely you are to be divorced. Yeah well, the more you get married, the more likely you are to get divorced. That's right, yeah? Yeah, I'm going to be one and done, god willing.
Speaker 1:Hallelujah, yeah, lord willing man, that's something that I definitely said before getting married to my wife, anna, who we've been married almost 20 years now we just hit nine, we're right there at it and so, yeah, when we got married, we were like, hey look, I want to be married one time, that's all I want to do and look things happen. We're not bashing anybody who has to go through that. There are provisions for that in.
Speaker 1:Scripture, which I think we'll get into. But look, it's proven. I mean, 43% is the divorce rate currently, and then for the second marriage to be what is it? 60%.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the third marriage 73%.
Speaker 1:It goes to show that if you don't do it right, if you can't stick it through, you can't make it through the first time, and the chances of you succeeding more and more get less and less.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and what happens is a lot of times we think kids save marriages, go have a kid or go do these things. We don't even consider what what that causes and creates for the family structure and the health of the overall family. Um so, uh, statistics say that the average marriage lasts eight years. Eight years, how long did you think it was before you saw this?
Speaker 1:Three.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I thought it would be much lower too, based off these statistics. But it looks like certain seasons of life. You know most people. I don't know what the average age is, but I imagine it's in the 20s. It's in the 20s where people start getting married and stuff like that. It could be around that life change cycle where they decide that they want something new, something different, and we live in a breakup society. Yeah for sure. This is why, when you're in relationships, the moment there's something you don't like, you just end it Right and we take that same mentality into our marriages.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like okay, well, don't worry about changing, I'll just change you.
Speaker 2:Start over yeah have another person replace you? Yeah, and so 40% of new marriages include one person who is getting remarried. That's crazy too. Yeah, that's crazy too. 35% of marriages that are with people who live together before getting married ended in divorce. Now, let's just be honest. This is a Christian podcast. Notice it's pastor to pastor, and you know we believe in waiting, Right, Waiting until you get married. For those things and stuff like that Abstinence, yes, and you know it even proves 35% of them fail. Right that you lived, you did not wait. 24% of marriages ended in divorce with a couple who moved in after getting married. This is a crazy one. Why don't you say that last one, right?
Speaker 1:there. Having friends yeah, this was a crazy statistic, right. Having friends who are divorced, being close with people who are divorced, increase your risk of divorce by 75%.
Speaker 2:Wow, wow, you know. Scripture says, you know Bad company corrupts good morals.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely yeah, that blew me away.
Speaker 2:That blew me away, yeah, but it shows a new light on you better put a high value of who you're hanging around.
Speaker 1:Who your circle is.
Speaker 2:And who's speaking in your marriage, who's speaking in your relationships, into your family structure. I mean, usually we don't consider until we look back at it they were probably not good for us. Like I'm pretty sure people that have gotten gotten divorced they've looked back and seen who they've allowed to speak into not life but speak death.
Speaker 1:Right, you know, and so Well it's the same way, you know, you think about when you go to somebody with your problems, if they're encouraging you to move on. Yeah, yeah, that's not what you need to hear. Yeah, you need to hear somebody who's going to give you truth. You need to hear somebody who's going to help you mature in an area of your life, or give you feedback to help you mature, versus pointing you. Well, you know, girl, I love him.
Speaker 1:I love my ex and this and that, and then next thing you know they're out. Maybe that's an option. I've said this before, man I really believe the enemy is after marriages, because the bond of a couple, married together in holy matrimony and serving the Lord, is a threat to the enemy's kingdom. Because, man, it's not just two. You're raising a whole family of people who are sons and daughters, who are chasing down darkness, man, who are against the enemy's kingdom. So if the enemy can split up a marriage and split up a family, he's, statistically he's already. He's crippled you in your abilities to do different things in certain seasons of your life.
Speaker 2:That's right, and it's important, too, that you look at who is pouring into your family and into your marriage, because, because this, like even scripture says in genesis 2, 24, where it says we leave and we cleave even your parents, can be terrible influences on your marriage.
Speaker 2:Um, this is not in our notes, but I think it's wise for us to consider this, this conversation, when we talk about people pouring into our marriages, like people that were divorced, or people who are not Christian or have the same values as us, because even when your parents are overly involved in your marriages like if me and my spouse have a problem, my spouse has a problem we keep it in the house. Why? Because what we don't know that we're doing. If my wife taylor is angry with me but goes to her mom and starts talking negative about me, now she's created a stain in her mother's heart toward me, right, and her mom won't love me the way that she loves me. So when we rekindle our fire and we patch up the issues, her mom will still have something in the back of her head against me. And so it's wise that we keep these things in our marriage and we look at who we're allowing to pour into our marriage and into us individually and on the lines of marriage Right.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about some of the top reasons for having divorce, or for the top reasons people are divorced.
Speaker 2:Without looking. What did you think it was Money, Money.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I grew up hearing, that money was the biggest issue. And, uh, I know with generations things change as well. I would even say that, uh, and it's not on this list. But if we did an updated list in the next two or three years, I believe social media would be a huge um issue in marriages, which it is now people not being able to control themselves and what they do through there. I think if we eliminated social media there would be a lot happier people too. But let's look at number one is lack of commitment. Seventy-five percent of marriages divorce in lack of commitment, whether that's commitment on bettering yourself or commitment in actual marriage and working together. And what I thought would be first is infidelity, but it is. Second, it's at 60% divorces. Reasons for divorces is that infidelity? Then you've got arguing and excessive conflict. At 58% of marriages divorce in because of this. Married too young 45%. What age were you when you got married? 23, 24.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 23, 24.
Speaker 2:23, 24. I am 32 right now. Taylor and I have been married for nine years, so 23, 23. So, yep, how old do you think is too young to be married? 16. Let me tell you, well, legally 23.
Speaker 1:So, yep, how old do you think is too young to be married 16. Let me tell you, well, legally, yeah.
Speaker 2:Listen, my brother. This is what's crazy, my brother. We talk about getting married too young ends in divorce, my brother, he's still happily married, but um, I will never forget. He proposed to his wife the day she graduated high school.
Speaker 1:Yeah, wow.
Speaker 2:That night she busts up in my room at like 12 am, wakes me up showing me this little, tiny little ring that she got. But yeah, married too young is. 45% of marriages end in divorce because of married too young. And then there's the financial issues, Right.
Speaker 1:Which is actually further down on the list than I thought it would be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, right, that's fifth out of the seven we got. And then domestic abuse, and I'm pretty sure that that number will be higher. If the husband or wife was not scared for their life to leave, scared that something worse would happen, I'm pretty sure that number would be higher as well. And then the last one is religious difference.
Speaker 1:And this is one that I want to hold on take them back to Bible.
Speaker 2:That's right, let them have it. Let them have it.
Speaker 1:Because here's the thing, man as a pastor, you come across people with situations and things that are going on, and a lot of times people will be like, well, pastor, my husband or my wife doesn't believe. What should I do? And I'm like be the example. There's no provision for you to leave your spouse because they don't believe. There's provision for them, if they leave you, to allow them to leave. But I want to take us to 1 Corinthians, 7, 13 through 16, because this is important for people, for Christians, who will live in marriage.
Speaker 1:It says and a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him, for the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband. Otherwise, your children will be unclean, but now they are holy. But if the unbeliever departs, let them depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases, but god has called us to peace. For how do you know, oh wife, whether you will save your husband, or how do you know, oh husband, whether you will save your? You will be the shining example, the shining light in that relationship and you should continue in that relationship until they get tired of hearing about Jesus and they decide that that's it, I've had enough, I'm not whatever, and they leave. But yeah, scripture is clear in 1 Corinthians 7, 13 through 16, that we should not be the ones to depart the marriage.
Speaker 2:We should stay, we should fight for peace and we should try to share the gospel and the good news with our spouses Right, and what the Scripture is not telling you is, if you're in the dating scene, to go find somebody who is unequally yoked with you and go try to change them.
Speaker 1:Yes, don't do that.
Speaker 2:That's not what the Scripture is. It's talking about those who are married. Maybe a husband or your wife has backslid, or they've ran away from God, or whatever that is. This is not a card to just take, and so you know what that means. I can go be with anybody, because I can win them back to the Lord. I can be, you know. So it's marriage. It's not dating. It's not a dating prerequisite that you can take Well. It's not a dating prerequisite that you can take Well. We're going to talk about a big one. A big one.
Speaker 1:It's a big one for a lot of people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, pornography, pornography, the statistics of pornography and they're all over the place. I didn't throw them on here because they're pretty high. I mean based off if you did it before you're married. After you're married, like these statistics, they're pretty up and down, but it's between the 40% and 60% of marriages struggle with pornography of a spouse or doing it together, and so it proves that there are a lot of people that are listening right now, based off these statistics, that are currently struggling with pornography, whether you're married or not, and it's extremely unhealthy for your marriage, especially if it's done in a long-term manner.
Speaker 2:So we think that it's just a quick little habit we have, but psychologically it has some overwhelming effects for how you view your spouse, how you see your spouse, how you see your marriage on the intimate level. So let's talk about it. Break it down a little bit. Married couples that encourage porn in their marriage are twice as likely to divorce as a couple that doesn't. Wow, that's crazy, that is bananas, and you think you're just spicing up your marriage. You just think you're just trying to add to it. You're actually taking away from it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and here's the thing too, especially when it comes to dealing with pornography is it plagues about 50% of men, and it's not different in the church. There was a recent study done that we were doing some breaking addiction classes a while back and it's disheartening. It's scary to think this, but there are 50 percent of pastors in the pulpit are also struggling with pornography.
Speaker 1:yeah, so it's not something that you're saved and say no, this is a plague for everybody yeah and it's something the enemy's done since the beginning of time when it comes to, when it comes to trying to make something god, god, created for good, tries to make it more about flesh and desire and lust than about love, yeah, and the society that we're in and the generations that are coming up.
Speaker 2:They have no idea of what purity is Right, and so they think if it makes us feel good, then it's good for us and we can take this into our marriage and feel good about ourselves because it feels good. And we don't realize that we are really poisoning our marriages. A statistic says that women who watch porn are three times likely to end in divorce.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and porn doesn't belong in marriage, right yeah?
Speaker 2:I heard a guy tell me that he was talking to his wife about how they needed to be intimate, like it had been a while, and she just encouraged him to go watch porn and take care of himself. Wow, and you know that is you don't realize, you think that you're just letting him take care of himself, but you don't realize the things that you were embedding in the mind of your spouse and how it changes the way he sees you, sees you in the bed, sees you on an intimate level. It has a lot of effects, changes, expectation, never positive effects. It's never good. Yeah, right, expectations, because what you see you think you can bring into your home, but it defiles the bedroom. Yeah, scripture talks about it. And so to encourage porn is to encourage infidelity into your marriage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're encouraging. I mean even Jesus says if you look on a woman with lust to pop your eye out right.
Speaker 2:You've committed adultery in your heart, in your heart right.
Speaker 1:So you are encouraging your husband or your significant other to go and commit adultery.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like to say it like this you are putting the bullet in the gun that kills your marriage. That's crazy man. Your marriage, that's crazy man by agreeing and openly allowing it to happen, um, in your marriage, uh. So spicing up your marriage, uh, spicing up your sexual appetite in your marriage will cost you your marriage if it's done in very impure outlets. Listen, you can spice up your marriage and still be pure and make it still right. Uh, and what happens is if you use pornography to spice up your marriage or your sexual appetite, what you don't realize you're doing is you are poisoning your marriage. You're not growing it right. You're poisoning it from within and it's very important that we we take these things out. They are ungodly, they are not meant to be in your marriage, which is supposed to be holy, supposed to be pure, it's supposed to be intimate with just you and your spouse. Any more thoughts about pornography?
Speaker 1:It's a plague. Yeah, and the moments you open up, open it up like you. He tells us to run from temptation right run from the enemy run from, run from those things.
Speaker 1:And I think there are times where on your phone you've got to delete tiktok yeah, there are times on your phone when you've got to delete instagram, where you've got to delete whatever is causing you to want to lust after or chase after something that you know that the holy spirit's dealt with you in your, in your life and told you that it's not right. You need to abstain, you need to run to flee from those things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, it's, it's worth it in the long run that you you turn down that temptation yeah, because so in the in the past, you know, uh, in my younger days, something I really struggled with was pornography. And as I've married him, I matured and you know, um years ago it still would try to tiptoe into my life and stuff. What I realized is social media is such an easy way to fall back into that addiction to fall back into, because it only takes just one photo or or one video that it may not even be in that moment.
Speaker 1:it may be something that plants a seed and you're on your way to work, or you're on your way home, or you're having an argument with your spouse, or whatever the case is, and then, all of a sudden, that seed that you allowed to be planted is now popped up into a tree.
Speaker 2:Yep that's it. That's absolutely so. I remember I downloaded TikTok. You know the story. I downloaded TikTok for 10 minutes and I went to sports. I kept sliding. There was somebody reading the scripture. All of a sudden I saw cheats clapping on the screen and because I know the past, I wasn't willing to risk anything coming into my heart, anything hindering my marriage, for the sake of having an app on my phone. And some of you Christians got to realize put more value on your salvation, put more value on your marriage. Delete the app. If it draws you further away from God and further away from your spouse, you've got to delete it.
Speaker 2:I'm okay with being vulnerable, because I think it is in our vulnerability that we can really help people. See the power of temptation. In our vulnerability we can see where we can really help people. I remember a time my wife and I were intimate for a while and then Mother Nature came and then we had all these plans and all of a sudden it was probably a headache or something. I don't know. You know how it happens and I was mad. At this point. It's like two, three weeks. I'm like okay, something's not right. So in my mind I'm like, okay, I'm going to handle it by myself. You know what? I don't even need her. You just talked about.
Speaker 2:Having an argument with your wife can easily plant a seed in your mind, and this is no lie, pastor Jay. I went on Instagram and as soon as I hit the search button, the Holy Spirit said no, there is no way you're doing this. But what happened is and we're going to talk about this later on in this series about communication I went to my wife and said listen, this is why we have to have it, because last night the enemy almost got me, but thank God, I had a relationship with the Holy Spirit and he stopped me, and so you've got to be able to eliminate the things that create opportunities for you to follow this and pornography can be in any outlet. Here's a crazy statistic. You can find this out and see if this is true. Go research top searches in the World Wide Web. Pornography searches are at the top by over a million searches versus Amazon, google. So what I'm saying is people use pornography sites by the million views versus how often they use Google or they use Amazon. That's crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if they don't tell you, I mean that's crazy.
Speaker 2:I'm telling you, people are struggling with this and we just kick it under the rug. Nobody wants to talk about it, nobody brings it to their pulpit, nobody talks about the vulnerability of this stuff. But we realize this is what's killing marriages right here. This stuff, amen, Amen, amen. Let's move on really quick. We like to say this phrase, taylor and I. When we do marriage counseling, premarital counseling and we just did a for life circle and we talk about marriage is work, we use that slogan Marriage is work. It's not this thing where you just get married and life is just cupcakes and rainbows. Yeah, you run off into the sunset.
Speaker 1:Yeah right, it's not a movie, it's not the Notebook.
Speaker 2:It's not this beautiful movie, but it is kind of like the movie, like what do you want when you're trying to figure?
Speaker 1:out what to eat. When you're trying to figure out what to eat, what do you want? What do you want?
Speaker 2:Listen to me For marriage to work, it requires those are not the two things that make your marriage right now. Prayer can change your marriage forever, especially if you do it together.
Speaker 1:I think you you talked about that gallup poll. Uh, to, the did a study, um, not too too long ago and they said that couples that earnestly, that really pray together every day, that that only one out of 1153 marriages end in divorce. Man, so if that doesn't tell you something about the power of prayer in your marriage, in your relationship with each other, then that should speak volumes for you. One listen one in 1,153 ended up in divorce. You should be holding hands and praying. You should be praying together, right?
Speaker 2:That's right. All the time, as often as you can, yes, yep. So the misconception that I can just pray my way through and have sex after arguments my marriage will survive is why half of christian marriages don't survive. I mean and here's the problem is, in the churches today, all we do is say wait till you get married before you have sex, and then after marriage, we don't do nothing with these couples. Yeah, we just get them to marriage and then we don't pour into them.
Speaker 2:We don't talk about the templates of marriage and all this kind of stuff. We, as leaders, we've got to do a lot better on talking about topics that are extremely relevant in the in the family. You talked about the enemy's high on attacking families. Why don't we talk about this stuff enough? Why don't we make this priorities in our churches? So when I say marriage is work it's consistently working on yourself and each other you ask questions like how can I be a better spouse? How can I meet my spouse's needs? How can I serve them? How can I communicate better? It's consistently working on yourself and working on each other. So when you look at your marriage and think about your marriage, ask yourself am I pointing more fingers than I'm looking inward at myself. Am I blaming it or am I actually working on myself? Marriage is work.
Speaker 1:Right, it is, and you need to be the example that you want to see in the other one. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I tell people when we talk about submission is the men need to be somebody that's worth submitting to.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Be the example of what submission looks like Serve your wife, submit to her in certain areas. We say this and this this is true statistically that every five to ten years you change. So the person that you married five years later, in the future, they're going to be a different completely person, because seasons happen, things come and go. A kid shows up in the in the life, a jobs change all things. So marriages work because we are consistently being molded, we're growing, we're developing, things are changing. The person you married is different than the person that you started dating back in the day. So in another five years they'll be a different person. You've got to continue to learn and grow and work through those things, right, right. So any other thing you want to add to that?
Speaker 1:Something I love doing with couples when we premarital counseling is I love for them to sit down and do the love language test. Yeah, yeah, to find out, because you know I'm a physical touch kind of person, right? So I know you love me by.
Speaker 2:Is that why you keep hugging me all the time? Easy now. Easy now.
Speaker 1:You know, I know love me. Is that why you keep hugging me all the time? Easy, now, I know, because of a touch or a kiss or a hug or something like that. But my spouse, my wife, she is an act of service. So if I do things for her around the house, that's speaking her love language. I think a lot of times, especially for young people, they go into a relationship thinking everybody's touchy-feely, but that's not the right language you're speaking. You're that might be the last thing on their list and it might be your first. That's the truth. So you're speaking the wrong language, but you, you're wanting this, yep, a different result, right?
Speaker 2:yep, yep and that, and we're going to talk about that, we're going to, we're going to break that down with a little language. So I'm telling you, when I, when I got in the marriage, I was like we were have sex all the time yes, sir, that's what's gonna happen no no because it's a lot more deeper than that yeah, it is a lot more deeper yeah, that's surface level stuff, that, and we'll break it down.
Speaker 2:What true intimacy is man? That's just a little small, small thing to it. Listen, we're gonna. We're gonna continue this, this topic, over the next few episodes and hopefully help and create marriages that laugh for for life and somewhat last for life what you're not going to do is pick on me on this.
Speaker 1:Let's just go ahead and bless him so we can get you out of here, my goodness listen, we're not problem solvers okay this is.
Speaker 2:there's no cookie cutter marriage, and so, as you're listening and watching, consider the work that you need to do. We see people all the time, pastor Jay, who go through premarital counseling or marriage counseling and we tell them all the right things they need to do, but if they don't do it, they fail and they end up wasting everybody's time. And so you've got to start applying these things to your marriage for your marriage to work, and you'll see a great change in the health of your overall marriage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's it, brother. Well, are you good to go? I am good to go. Look, we encourage you if you have any questions. We decided today for the first time I'm sorry the second time to go live on TikTok.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right. First time did not work.
Speaker 1:The first time didn't work.
Speaker 2:My bad.
Speaker 1:Second time. Look if there's something we can do, if we can pray for you. Make sure you reach out. If there's a question you have, make sure you reach out. We're here to serve and to hear that. We're here to help you and your relationships.
Speaker 2:And so if there's anything we can do, pray for't, throw in here that maybe you you're interested in or want to hear something about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we would love to help, so just make sure, absolutely yeah, well, let's bless them, jay.
Speaker 2:Go ahead, brother numbers. Chapter six says may the lord bless you and protect you. May the lord smile on you and be gracious to you. May the lord show you his favor and give you peace. We thank you so much for listening and watching. Share with a friend, share with your married, uh, friends and uh, let's get this word out and let's make some healthy marriages that last for life, for life we'll see you next.
Speaker 1:God bless you. See you next time.
