Can Your Biggest Heartbreak Become your Greatest Ministry with Adrienne Story

Join Amber, Lisa, and special guest Adrienne Story in this heartfelt episode of Coffee Chat. Together, they discuss the profound experience of navigating grief, particularly through infant loss. Adrienne shares her touching journey of losing children, dealing with profound grief, and finding ways to honor her losses while still embracing new joys. They also tackle topics such as the unhelpful things people say, the stages of grief, and the importance of faith and support during trying times. Whether you're walking through a season of loss or looking to support a loved one, this episode offers compassionate insight and hope.

00:00 Welcome Back to Coffee Chat
00:47 Celebrating Achievements and Sharing Updates
02:38 Introducing Adrian and Discussing Grief
05:36 Personal Stories of Loss and Grief
09:09 Adrian's Journey Through Grief
16:52 Navigating Pregnancy After Loss
21:34 Coping with Subsequent Losses
36:30 A Mother's Intuition and Reassurance
36:45 Facing Complications and Divine Reassurance
37:30 The Third Pregnancy and God's Reassurance
39:29 Family Expansion and Unexpected Blessings
39:56 Adrian's Journey: Pregnancy Amidst Family Struggles
40:50 Medical Challenges and Support System
43:52 Naming Significance and Family Bonds
45:41 Grief and Joy: A Mother's Dual Experience
46:46 Navigating Grief and Finding Purpose
51:46 The Reality of Grief and Supportive Words
01:06:28 Redeeming Moments and Helping Others
01:12:19 Final Thoughts and Praye

Thank you for taking the time to like, subscribe, share, and comment. Visit leadingladies.life to find out more. Also, follow @leadingladieslife on social. Amber & Lisa are authors of the multi-award-winning book, Leading Ladies: Discover Your God-Grown Strategy for Success, which dives into the power of community and empowering women of faith to rise up and make a difference, using our gifts and faith to shine brightly in the world. Watch the Facebook Live edition on our YouTube Channel @coffeechatladies .

Transcript

coffeechatadriennestory

 [00:00:00] Good morning everyone. It's been a while. This is coffee chat. My name's Amber and my i'm gonna call you my co-hosting crime now. Lisa Burris Burns.

I feel like that's too much. I answer to a lot of things, so I'll probably respond no matter what. And we have Adrienne Story on with us today. And she has great tasting glasses. We already talked about this. Look at this. We even have the same frames from the same place.

Zine. I think it was 30 bucks, wasn't it? Something like that. Yeah. 30. I am not fitting in today, so I'm just gonna take 'em off because you're just gonna need to join the zine club. I know. For your glasses. Right. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. We are on, everything's good here. We encourage all of you that if you are here with us today, and we know nobody likes to do this, but go ahead and just drop a comment down, below the frame and let [00:01:00] us know you're with us.

Yes. We're so happy to be back. Totally understand. You probably are all on vacation and this is not what you wanna do through Saturday morning, but hey, there's always the replay. Right, right, right. It's been a busy few weeks. Some of that has involved vacation, some of that has involved just life of crazy.

And it's been exciting. It's been some exciting things that have happened. And some exciting break. I think we all need a little bit of break sometimes. And and goodness knows, you need a break from us talking.

I wanted to share one exciting thing of my first Evangelical press award. Look at that. I was so happy I got fourth place and that's a good thing. Humorous article. Holiday because you didn't have to get any place. I didn't have to get any place. I tell you what, there's a lot of people, there's a lot of people up for these awards.

And a lot of great people like from Christianity today. But the [00:02:00] article was called A Holiday Hermit's Guide to Enjoying Family Gatherings Without Doubling Up on Your Medication. This was actually a very inspiring one. Oh gosh. So know where was that published? IC you? It was in Leading Leading Hearts magazine.

You know what, I'll put the link in the comments, please. 'Cause somebody needs to have a hol a, a Vacation Hermit Scott,

on your medication. Well, somebody needs it. We haven't, we haven't gotten here. Just because, we're, we're having a great time today. We have some really good conversation to guide us today and we thank you Adrian, for being with us. I just wanted just tell Lisa I wanted to share a little bit about Adrian.

I have to be honest and say I've known Adrian since she was a very young woman. I was just saying [00:03:00] probably, just getting ready to bridge that tween stage into high school. Adrian is a twin. And I had the privilege of watching her kind of grow into this amazing, beautiful woman. And, her husband's very special to me.

He's a great guy. I've got to watch him grow up too, Mr. Corey. They have a beautiful family. And, I just felt like for quite some time I've wanted to talk about grief, something that has touched, inevitably, all of us in our walking through grief. But I do have to say it feels like some people have to walk through, a depth of grief that not all of us experience.

On this side of eternity, we all experience grief, but there are some roads that not all of us have to travel to, to experience grief. [00:04:00] And I've watched Adrian take a journey over the past several years, and I am always in awe of what God does as I watch him lead her. So I felt like she was a good woman to bring to this conversation. You kind of start to have this conversation with god, please help me redeem this moment. Mm-hmm. . I just kind of feel like this conversation, we're probably just gonna barely scratch the surface, even though we're gonna try to go to some really intimate places in this conversation.

This is an ongoing conversation because throughout life. We interact with grief often. Mm-hmm. So I kind of wanna talk about Amber. You said something during pre-show. Mm-hmm. You said grief is the death of vision or things we had hoped for or planned for. Mm-hmm. [00:05:00] And that could be everything from a career change that you were not ready for, you did not want, it wasn't your choice to maybe your health, um Right.

No longer being able to sustain you to the loss of a loved one. There are many forms of grief. Yeah. And we aren't here to say one person's grief is less than another person's grief. What we are here to talk about is maybe how different certain griefs, certain levels of grief affect us. Right. So my question to all of us right now is, basically before that big life-changing grief. For me, yeah. I, I lost many people before my big moment. I lost grandparents, I lost friends. But when I lost a child, [00:06:00] I have to honestly say that I experienced grief in such a way that I have never been the same. Mm-hmm. How I walk and talk is not the same.

Mm-hmm. How I experience life is not the same. And how I watch other people walk through grief and what I choose to do to support them is different than what I did before. So what were some of the ways you viewed grief before you had that? What I call that real storm of grief that literally changed you from the inside out.

Yeah. I would love to know the story behind what spurred you into grief. Well, for me, like I said, it was losing a child. I had three beautiful children and never in my wildest dreams did I think that something would go wrong if I had another one.

My mother had four children, my husband came from a large family. [00:07:00] So yeah. I knew things could go wrong, but I just didn't fathom. It really happened to me. And I lost valuable people, like I said, grandparents, but until I lost a child, my son, a full-term pregnancy, which at the time we thought he was a girl, so it was kind of like when I delivered him, I had two losses. I lost this little girl that I thought I was having and then woo, we had a son, what we can do, boys ? And it was really hard to drift off to sleep. It was the only thing that came to my mind when I would wake to roll over in the night. And that encompassed my life for a long time.

Well, Adrian, I know that your story, probably overlaps with Lisa's story a lot, but has some differences. In fact, yeah, Lisa was definitely like one of the first people I thought about when this happened because I knew [00:08:00] of her loss. 'Cause like Lisa, I had experienced grief before I lost my grandmother and friends and family and they were all older. But I think what happened was losing a child is just not the natural order of things, right? And so things were so outta order. I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute.

I'm a very organized person. Well, at least I try to be organized. If I turn my phone around. You would not say that because there's laundry everywhere. But anyway, that's a very organized person. But, and I like to organize things. And so when this happened, this was so out of order, it just was like, this is not possible.

This is not possible. So it shook me to the core. 'cause I was like, how is this even happening? This is not so I think that it's when you lose a child that brings it to a whole different level. Yeah. And not downplaying anybody else's grief or losing anyone [00:09:00] else because it's still very deep.

Yeah. And still hurts just as much, but I guess it just threw me off. 'cause it was just, was not the order of how things should go. So can, Adrian, can you share a little bit about when you, the, how old you were and the accident actually. How far along were you when you lost your baby?

Yes. First one oh, well, junior so I was 28. We were actually just talking about this downstairs before I hopped on. I was 28 when I had Corey. And I just was at a place where, and we were actually planning to have him, through my doctor was like, okay, if you don't get, if you don't, I was very far along.

I was 39 and a half weeks. Oh my gosh. So I was very much planning to have him. And then she said, if you don't have him soon, because I had gestational diabetes and all that. So she was like, he has to come early anyway. She said, if you don't have him soon, we'll have to give you medicine. But then I started going to Labor, [00:10:00] so I was an active labor and was in in labor trying to push him out.

And then all of a sudden I had a fever and they're like, uhoh, that's not a good sign. Oh, and I was okay. And then my doctor checked me and said, there's meconium in a sec. And I was like, she said, we have to do an emergency C-section. I was like, whatever it takes, that's fine.

So I was so under but I didn't really know what was happening and my husband was with me. And they took him out. And of course, I'm like in and out of it, under the anesthesia that I was under, but anyway, I just knew that there was panic in the room,. Because he wasn't breathing.

And so then he still wasn't breathing and they finally revived him and he was breathing a little bit, but it was very, very rough. They were saying, he's not doing well. We need to take him to Children's Mercy because this is a very serious thing.

Your baby's very sick. And our family was around us and I said, well, did you see his eyes? Did he open his eyes? And said, yes. His eyes looked just like [00:11:00] yours. And then my husband, had to go to Children's Mercy with him and I was stuck in the hospital because I had health problems on top of that.

Because. What we didn't know is that we both had sepsis. Oh gosh. So we got sepsis while I was in, in yeah, so basically after two days they weren't able to do anything to help him because the sepsis overwhelmed his system. And so we had a song that we sang to him.

They told us like we needed to let him go. And so we had a song that we sang to him called Every Part by Emily King and Your Sweet Daughter Lisa. Hannah sends it to me and says, my best friend Toya, every now and then they'll send, send it to me and say they listen to that song and they think of him.

And so anyway, so we sang that to him and , then he left. And I literally, I tell people I literally held death in my arms. And it wasn't scary like I thought [00:12:00] it was going to be. Mm-hmm. It wasn't a scary thing. It was very peaceful. Mm-hmm. And so yeah. And after that, then my heart went into basically almost like a shock.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. And they called it tobo. It's a basically condition where your heart is shaped, differently, does something different after grief. And then it manifested into something else. And I had to go to the cardiology wing, and , it was just so much. And so then, yeah, so that's, that was my first baby that I lost.

My first really sense of. Like grief in a innocence that I was just like, this is just way too personal. It's way too close. And it was very close and personal when I lost my grandmother. Wow. Too, because she was very much to me, but this was years ago. And, and also I guess I made reason of it because she was, although very sick and we didn't want her to, pass away from [00:13:00] cancer.

She was in her eighties. And so I, it brought reason to it. But this was like, this is not, this doesn't make any sense. So we always say we expect the elderly to pass. We know at some point in our life, we know we're gonna lose the people that go before us. Right. And so it's not like you're ever prepared.

It's different when it's mm-hmm. Your child. I know that, I, I lost the first baby, but it was like. Moreover, like about 17 weeks. But I remember at 12 weeks standing up in the middle of my kitchen and all of a sudden I felt this warm be come through my body.

It was like a rush. And all of a sudden I was standing in a pool of blood. And I still remember that moment. I still remember standing in a pool and it was like a slasher movie. Yeah. And I was totally in shock. I was like, what's going on here? Right. [00:14:00] And then I went to the bathroom and Philip called and, and we got to the emergency room and then they said, oh, everything's all right.

So I got my hopes up again. Yeah. Yeah. I got my hopes up again. And to only find that, just a few weeks later that his or who. We call him sweet pea. I don't know, but kind of God has always given us a vision of sweet pea and he would've been our little boy. But, I was so quick to wanting to replace that pregnancy

to have a baby, to change my mind. Yeah. Because the first one was unexpected. And I'm like, oh gosh. And I think the most frustrating thing that I encountered was, my husband saying, no, I think we need to wait. I don't think we need to rush into doing this again.

We need to go into a [00:15:00] proper timing. And that made me so mad at him. I was so angry. 'cause. My mind was like I was gonna have a baby. And my mind had programmed toward that even though it was unexpected. And that was hard. That was really hard. And but the same thing is we had three daughters and no matter how many successful pregnancies we had, I still think of the one.

Yeah, of course. And it's funny to me too, the details you remember. There are certain things you can remember Adrian talking about, just wanting to know what his eyes looked like. And that he looked like yours. Amber remembering vividly just all of a sudden the sensation in her body and the very vivid picture of just.

Blood and what that meant and what it immediately puts in your head that's happening, and also remembering, you [00:16:00] and Philip being in such a different place, right? Do we try this again? Do we not? For us? Maybe this says something about me and Randy both, I don't know, but I was like, oh heck, to the, no, this is not our ending place.

I'm not stopping here. Right? I'm not gonna allow my mind, the enemy of my soul to throw up this place forever. I'm going to see God. I'm going to see him and allow him. To bring me through this. And so very differently. We were both in agreement that we were going to try again, and we did try again as quickly as the doctors allowed, but it's like we all go through these different spaces.

Adrian, you tried again? Yeah. Mm-hmm. And that , how much space between that Yeah. It's how [00:17:00] much space was between number one and this mm-hmm. And, and, and how, how was that all spaced out for you? Sure. So my Rainbow baby Charles is our baby number two. And it was, it was three years, uh mm-hmm.

About three years in between because we both decided, and Corey was, gosh, my gosh, he was such my rock during that time, like. There was so much questioning in my head about whether God loved me or not. Mm-hmm. Because I was like you've been taught your whole life. Well, God loves you and if you do this, nothing bad will happen to you if you're obedient, and it's you know what, that's not the way. Mm-hmm. It kind of just broke my whole sense of like how faith was structured in my head. And so I was like, this doesn't make any sense. And he was like, God still loves us. Mm-hmm. Let's take our time. And so we took our time and we waited and we grieved.

And I remember being in the room [00:18:00] where Corey was supposed to be many days after that, and just praying and praying so hard and making that my prayer room and like praying with my sister and like we'd be reading books together. My sister was definitely such like a strong support with me. Like just.

That's my ride or die. So yes, we waited for about three years in between, before we tried again. But we did. I know that I'm supposed to be a mom. I'm like, I know I'm supposed to be a mom. And, I say that now and I kind of like laugh at myself. 'cause I was like, you could be a mom in so many different ways.

It doesn't have to be this way, but I just knew that was for me. So we did try again and we were so blessed to have Charles, mm-hmm. Charles came next after that. I remember this very clearly. I looked back over my time of being pregnant and I questioned everything I did and I thought it was my fault.

Did you do that? Was that [00:19:00] part of Yes. Yeah, absolutely. I was like, okay, so was it the gestational diabetes? Did I what did I do? And I remember actually it was my doctor who was like, reassured me over and over again. There was nothing that I did.

There was nothing that you did. She kept on saying it over and over again, and I was like, mm-hmm. There had to be something that I did. I gotta get, I gotta find reason. 'cause you try so hard to grasp when you're in grief. You always try to find reason, so then your mind can make sense of it, so there was always like a questioning there's gotta be something that I could do better. What can I do to improve this? Yeah. Definitely. I, I experienced that. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember being so scared when I got pregnant again. I was terrified. Oh yeah. Very scary. Very, very scary. And luckily enough, I found a really great doctor neonatologist which, I feel like God [00:20:00] brings people in your, the right people in your life at the right time.

And she was definitely just walk with me hand in hand. And yeah, she just said, we have a plan and this is what we're gonna do. And yeah, she reassured me. And although I had fear, I, it's funny though, because I feel like almost I had like premonitions, which sounds weird, but I almost had that because I remember I was a part of this group.

I. Of women. And there was older women and younger women, and my mom hosted, a session at her house and I was pregnant with Cory Junior. And I was like, I just don't know. I feel like I, I'm afraid to lose him. So it was weird because I almost had a thought that something bad was going to happen.

I don't know why it felt that way, but and I felt so, so I felt that way. And so then when I had Charles, I didn't feel that way. So it was weird that even happened. I, I don't know if that was like the spirit, like leading my heart and like putting a [00:21:00] barrier around it. I don't know.

But I definitely felt like uneasy when I was pregnant with my first baby, Cory Junior, wow. Yeah, I think I don't know. I think we all can have those little gut things. And who's to say if it wasn't just. Holy Spirit, being there with you, kind of prepping you, I'm not gonna get into and debate those kinds of things.

Right. Yeah. I feel like, sometimes we are prepared in a way for things. Mm-hmm. But your journey after Charles even continued. What happened after Charles? So I had Charles and I thought, okay, well he is an amazing, good man. He is my little rainbow, like just pocket of sunshine.

He just radiates like sunshine and joy and I just love him so much. And so after Charles, we said, okay, we really wanna give Charles a sibling. We waited I don't know, [00:22:00] almost three years. And so I said, okay, let's do this again.

Luckily enough, we got pregnant again. And we got pregnant with miles. Miles's pregnancy was also very heavily monitored because, on top of having gestational diabetes, I also had the RH factor. My blood is negative. Oh, you, that's me. That's me. We're actually really sisters here.

Are you a negative? Yes, I'm a negative.. Oh my gosh. I'm the odd ball glasses. I'm the odd ball. You guys have glasses and the RH factory. Okay, when were you born? What's your birthday? May. Okay, well then that, okay. That's where it stops folks. So yeah, so I had the RH factor.

Mm-hmm. So it made my pregnancies very risky because I, I don't believe I got the Rogan shot, which is basically what they give you to counter act with your antibodies that build up. Yeah. Right. Yep. You're supposed to get that. Anyway, so my antibodies did build up and so we knew that with Charles I needed to be monitored because of the RH factor.

And then with miles [00:23:00] I needed to be monitored because of the RH factor. So I was monitored the whole time. And there was a point where we were getting further in the pregnancy and I was like, his belly looks really, really round. Of course I'm doing my own research, going to Dr. Google and like trying to figure out what's going on.

And I'm like, I know that's a sign of hydro drops, which is a sign of anemia. So I just thought. I said his, I never had a baby. I had two at the time before that. I said, I never had a baby whose, whose belly was so round during the ultrasound. And they just said, well, it's, we'll keep monitoring it.

And at one point they said, oh, we're gonna have to get, do an utero transfusion. And I thought, oh, okay, okay, that's fine. And it never happened. And then I said, well, he's not moving as much. And this was like, again, like further into the pregnancy and I don't feel like I was listened to [00:24:00] and yeah. Oh my gosh.

Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. And so anyway we have a little Doppler machine and I was at 37 and a half weeks and I was gonna have to deliver him at 38 weeks. So I think it was, I. Monday, I, we checked his little heartbeat in the Doc Doppler machine, and I, I heard it and I thought, okay, he's fine. He's fine.

Next day I went to the doctor's office and they said, okay, well we're just gonna check on him and you're gonna deliver soon. It was at 37 and a half weeks. And she, the nurse checked and checked, and then she was like, I don't see a heartbeat. Mm-hmm. I don't see a heartbeat. And I was like, that couldn't be right.

And I was like, are you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure? I kept on asking over and over again. She was like, I don't see a heartbeat. And so she ran and got the doctor and they told me there was no heartbeat. And I, and of course it was during COVID. Mm-hmm. On top of that, my mother, I just [00:25:00] learned, had gotten diagnosed with cancer. It was the beginning of 2020. And I think that that's when we really learned that she got diagnosed with cancer. It was during COVID, so I was all alone and I'm just like dealing with this grief all by myself and trying to figure out, calling my mom, calling my husband and saying this is what happened.

I can't believe this. And so they took me to and this probably brings memories up for you, Lisa. And they took us to the room and I delivered him and he was beautiful and well-formed and everything seemed just fine. Like he looked perfect, but he wasn't breathing. There was no life in him.

And once again, I held death again. And I was just like, wow. Like I can't believe this happened to me. I can't believe this. And so, and so we, we just were at this place where like we knew it was risky to have a baby. Mm-hmm. But we trusted that [00:26:00] we were in good hands, that nothing would happen. Or at least, at least there'd be medical intervention if something did would, give our child a fighting chance.

And but that wasn't the case with Miles and so we lost miles. And it just, again, the feeling just overwhelmed me. And I was just, at that point though, I feel like I knew God in a different way and I wasn't questioning him as far as like, why would you let this happen to me? You don't love me anymore.

Right. None of that came to me again 'cause I was at a different place and I. I think when you experience grief and you experience death so closely and you hold it. Yeah. It doesn't, it doesn't, it didn't phase me the same way. Yeah. Because I knew where my son was. Exactly. Yeah. Adrian, I, I'm sorry. Randy at one point did a testimony and I think there were a lot of people that hadn't even been aware of what we had gone through.

'cause it had been so many years. Mm-hmm. This [00:27:00] happened in 99 for us. Yeah. And I remember part of his testimony was just very similar to what you said. You held grief and he said, I had to watch my wife deliver you. You held death, you held death in your hands. I had to watch my life. My wife deliver death.

Mm mm-hmm. And I do think that it's different because I remember. I had three beautiful children. I, I knew of God's faithfulness. We'd had rough pregnancies with one of them. I'd been hospitalized for several weeks and put to bed with them. So I knew of God's faithfulness and his goodness. And I think when we delivered Noah, I remember being in that room surrounded by people who loved me, and just having this private conversation that was sometimes in my head and sometimes out of my mouth mm-hmm.

Where I was talking to God and saying, but Father, I do trust you. Right. [00:28:00] I don't think there were any funny thoughts in my head that he would be delivered alive. I knew what the outcome was. Right. But I just knew that I trusted God and I think that that was hard for some of the people in the room that did not have a walk of faith.

Yeah. To understand. Mm-hmm. When you were talking Adrian, alls I could think about in my head was, oh, I would be so angry with those doctors. I knew something was wrong and they didn't listen to me. Did you deal with that kind of anger? Anger wasn't the first thing that reached me, honestly, to be honest with you.

'Cause there wasn't even a question about I know you'd be, there was even like somebody said, I, I, I know you'll be mad, or, or, or or I hope you won't be mad mm-hmm. With was said to us and, and I just, I don't know. No, no, no. I'm not mad. I think I just was hurt and I felt like [00:29:00] my trust was just like in, I put my trust in these people and I just was like, you know what?

That's the problem is. I think that's what I try to advocate for too. The problem is, even though doctors are wonderful people, and I definitely believe in science and medicine and everything, and all the, the advancement that has come, you still have to be an advocate for yourself. Right? Yeah.

Right. They say that there are five stages to grief. Mm-hmm. And they also say that these stages don't come in any particular order. Denial. Mm-hmm. Well, this can't really be happening to me. Mm-hmm. Anger, we get angry about something at some point. I know for me, the anger came when there was a misprint in my, my son's obituary.

There was a misprint calling my dad who was named Kay. A maternal grandmother [00:30:00] when he's a grandfather of all things to be mad about. Mm-hmm. Yeah. There's bargaining, you kind of bargain, can we bargain this away? God, is there something I can do to make this better? To make this difference? Right, right, right.

You have depression and you finally come to acceptance. That acceptance thing, I'm not so sure that I really agree with that one. Mm-hmm. I think we learn to walk with a really big limp. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And that limp isn't necessarily physical. I believe it can be emotional. I believe it can be even kind of spiritual for some people.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. I just think that we all go through different stages of grief. We don't all go through them in an order. Yeah. I wanna, I, I wanna. Discuss like even when you were in that second moment and you said you weren't angry when you turned around and walked out of the [00:31:00] situation, what was your mindset about moving forward with your family?

Honestly, I was just like, I'm gonna give my son a, a sibling. Mm-hmm. I was like, I am going to give my son a sibling. Like he deserves that he is not supposed to be an only child. Like this boy was not created to be an only child. No he wasn't. No. And naturally he wasn't. But, that was the situation we were in.

And so I was like, you know what? I'm going to find the doctor whose care I was under when I was pregnant with him because I was not able to be under her care with Miles. I said, I'm going to find this doctor. I'm gonna find her again. She's gonna be my doctor and we're gonna make a plan. So I went to her, I found her because I learned before I couldn't find her for she had to something about an NDA they have to [00:32:00] sign after they leave a hospital.

Anyway, so I found her and I told her, I said, I wanna get pregnant again. This is what happened to us. I wanna get pregnant again. What's the plan? And I already looked up things myself and she said, well, there's a thing called IVIG and you're gonna have to get weekly infusions and you're going to have to do all these things.

But I believe that we can, you can, we can do this again. Yeah. And I said, okay. And I got shortly after we got pregnant, like a very shortly after we got pregnant with Iris. Mm. Wow. I remember feeling the same. This is not, this is not, no. What I'm gonna do is this. Mm-hmm. This is going to happen.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And at the time, it doesn't mean you're not afraid. Oh, you're afraid. Oh yeah. You're fearful. But I tell you what it says. It says something about, it teaches you something about yourself, and it does teach you something about God and your relationship with [00:33:00] God. Mm-hmm. What, what it takes to walk through that kind of fear in spite of being afraid.

Right. In spite of knowing the chances could this could happen again, right? Mm-hmm. And, when it happens to you, it happens to everybody that loves you intimately because they walk with you through it in a way that alters their chemistry as well. Right. Yeah, I think it says a great deal about what you learn about yourself too.

Yeah. I remember. And, and I remember when I, when I, when I got pregnant and then when I had that in the heart, I couldn't pick up the heartbeat at 17 weeks or 18, I think I was rolled into the, well, I was taken to the ultrasound room and they, the, the tech there was so like un, un uncaring, it seems and, and in, in, in doing that, he was like, well, this is just a missed abortion. And I was like, my mouth dropped open. And I'm like, I can't even, I can't [00:34:00] even fathom. He would say it like that and say it out loud like that. And I was just in, in tears. And basically they gave me a little, they gave me a little cup to take home and, is they said if, if, if this, they're like, it'd be better if you lose this yourself.

And I just couldn't take it. I was like trying to do everything I could to to, to get this done by itself and my body wouldn't let it go. Mm-hmm. My body went into a tightness and. And I remember when I, I, I, I tried, I, we were getting pregnant with the second and the I found out I had a deformed uterus.

It's called the Bico uterus. And it's actually some, some women are born with it. It's actually a heart shaped like it was, it was cute. But some women, and it's one in one uterus that acts like two, right? And some women, they're completely divided in half. Some people, they have two [00:35:00] cervixes.

It was just, we didn't know. And they said, there's, there's growth restriction possible. There's all this possible. So I went into my second pregnancy knowing that I could, at any time. Lose this baby. Mm-hmm. And I also went into this pregnancy. I had all my rogram, which was very good. I went into this pro, this pregnancy bleeding for 2020 off and on for 20 weeks.

Oh my. But I also went into this pregnancy being as sick as a dog through 20, 24 weeks. And I said, God, are you just making sure that I, that I know that this is okay because I'm sick as a dog. Right. And and I remember not telling anyone, 'cause I didn't want to get anybody's hopes up. That was hard. That was very hard. And then I remember I remember I said, God, I, I just can't go through this pregnancy like this. I am. And at the end of it, I was like having branson Hicks like crazy and all that. And, and God met me and my husband in my bed, and I know that this seems bizarre to some, and it'll seem like [00:36:00] what in the world.

But in that moment I just felt like a fire come over me and I felt the, the love of God came over me. And, and he said, you've been through the fire, you've passed the test, and she will be a blessing. Wow. And in that moment, I knew it would be okay. It didn't take my fear completely away. Mm-hmm. But in that moment, I knew she would be okay.

And I knew she would be a girl. So I knew my daughter was a girl before. The doctors knew she was a girl. And so when we found out she was a girl oh, well, we should have known. Right? And then with, with the second, I had to have all that stuff that makes you go through menopause and then you get pregnant and then, and there was the same kind of complications.

[00:37:00] And again, God met us in a very personal way and spoke the, and spoke those words to our hearts. You've been through the fire, you've passed the test, and she'll be a blessing. And I think I needed that. I think I needed to have constant reassuring that everything was gonna be okay. Yeah. No matter what I was going through, no matter what I was walking through, no matter what I was experiencing.

Mm-hmm. And, and then with the third. They, when the ultrasound happened, they said there was a spa on her brain and that it was like some sort of a crystallization. They said well, usually if this doesn't go away by this time, it means your, your, your baby passes away or mm-hmm. Is born with complete, like all these difficult, all these malformations and she will pass away.[00:38:00] 

And then God had to reassure us again. I said, have I not told you? Have you not heard? You've been through the fire, you've passed the test. She will be a blessing and. That's what I said. I, I, I don't think I, I, I, I think I had to go back. I think God just had to repeat himself three times. Right. To me to know that everything was gonna be okay when circumstances said he wasn't gonna be okay.

And I think that that is, I knew God was, I needed to have reassurance that God was with me. Right. Even when my brain said something could go wrong. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So he had to, he had to verbally express that in the, in the, in his presence. Literally catching, feeling like it was catching my body on fire.

'cause I couldn't have known, known any of that. That was real, I would've thought it was all in my [00:39:00] head. I think it's, I think it's interesting how God gives certain, certain people, certain reassurances, yeah. Mm-hmm. And like you said, you, you, you needed that reassurance from him and, and he, he gave that to you.

I don't remember having those reassurances. I just know that kind of what Adrian was saying, no, this, this is not gonna end on this note. Mm-hmm. This is not gonna be the story to, this is not my story to retell in its entirety. We want more people in this house. We've always planned for four. We're going for four.

And, and the amazing part of the story is, you did have three beautiful girls, Amber, and we went on to have our, Zoe, who we thought we were having when we ended up having a Noah. And after that, God surprise us with, believe it or not, we made another boy after four girls on this side of eternity.

We have Elijah now. He's a grown young man. He's in college and it's funny how God does that. So Adrian, your story, obviously [00:40:00] you wanna have a sibling for Charles. What happened? I was like, I wanna get pregnant again. We're gonna do this. And the doctor made up a plan and said, this is what you're gonna have to do.

And I said, I'll do whatever it takes. And I went through it and it's just, and, and mind you, while I was pregnant with Iris, my mother was battling the hardest battle she's ever had to battle. She ever had to battle, which was cancer. And it was like the most aggressive cancer that you could have and.

So I was getting, I was going to this cancer treatment place to get these infusions. So it was a constant reminder that my mom was struggling and having to do these things too, and then I'm having to do these things. So it was just, it was just such a weird space too. So I got the IVIG every week, which was not easy.

Anybody who has experienced IVIG, it can give you really, really bad migraines. And so it made [00:41:00] me feel like I couldn't walk at times I felt dizzy. It was a lot. And then on top of that, my doctors were like, okay, baby looks fine, but your antibodies are still a problem after all of that. Mm-hmm.

And so then I had to get plasmapheresis, which people who have diabetes and all that, know exactly what that is. So you basically, they basically cleaned my whole bo blood out they take your blood and they, they basically clean the whole thing and it goes through this like machine mm-hmm. That cleans it all out and then

they bring it back into you. Of course they give it a good scrub. So yeah, so they did that and antibodies looked fine and, but then a few weeks later they're like, your antibody's still up. So I was in and outta the hospital. But I, I do wanna point out I'm so grateful for the support that I had around me.

Mm-hmm. My husband, my mom my sister especially were just praying for me. Mm-hmm. And I know there was a lot of other people praying that unspoken. Of course. Like you Amber, we didn't really tell people mm-hmm. That we were [00:42:00] pregnant. We didn't tell, we didn't really announce until later on.

Mm-hmm. Because I just, there was a fear. There was I don't wanna disappoint people again. And I don't wanna have to explain it all over again. And I think that's, yeah.

I just didn't wanna, I, I didn't want to share too much. So anyway, there's always anyway element in your mind that you think people are gonna think I am crazy. They're not gonna get it. Yes. When in actuality you were trapped trying to walk in faith in an unbelievable circumstance. Right. And we still fear what people think still.

Yes. Yeah. Yes, exactly. You're right. And did plasma reset and then they said. And I was going to Children's Mercy at the time. I was talking to Hannah a lot. Your daughter who was a nurse there at the time and asking her like, so what is, what happens when you go there? And she was explaining to me, thank God for Hannah.

Yeah so that was helpful, talking to the doctors and then they [00:43:00] said the baby's gonna need an utero, blood transfusion 'cause your antibodies are still kicking back up. Wow. Mm-hmm. And so I had an utero blood transfusion where she basically got some blood, transfused it into her, threw her umbilical cord and that was risky too.

Yeah. Got that done. There was just so many things to get this little girl here, but I knew that she was supposed to be here and I actually didn't think that I was gonna even have a girl. It was funny because yeah, I thought, oh, my husband just. You probably experienced that. Yeah. With girls.

'cause I was like, my husband just makes me boys. I was like Cory's story, just, that's what he does. So I think my husband just makes girls.

Well, that that's what we thought. Yeah, exactly. And then when was like, Corey was like, no, I feel like this is gonna be a girl. And I was like, you're silly. This is not gonna be a girl. And it was, and I was like, wow. I, I couldn't believe that I had the chance because I, me being so close to my mom mm-hmm.

And knowing that relationship and that [00:44:00] mother daughter bond, I thought in my head, oh my God, I get this bond. And now, now I look back and I'm like, that was on purpose. God did that on purpose because he knew what it was gonna walk through when I, when I lost my mom. Mm. So he brought Iris to me.

And Iris, by the way, it means rainbow. Mm. So in Greek, I think, well, doesn't it like you're Greek. Like I'm Greek, but I dunno all the words Greek, but dunno all the words. I think it means well, it means rainbow. That at least that's what the baby app told me. It's funny how we pick names too, because part of why we named Zoe, Zoe was even more profound after we lost Noah.

Wow. Zoe is a Greek word that means God life or eternal life. Her middle name is praise. So it was even more significant when we held her in, held her in her arms that she was gonna have an eternal life, God, life of praise. That was just like, so it's funny. I like that. I like that you were thoughtful about your name.

That's, [00:45:00] that's the same story like with me as my oldest we named Saffron, which is the most precious spice in the world. More expensive than gold. I love that. And her, her middle name is Ophelia, which means it means wise, but it also means helper. Wow. And my middle was Imogen, it means light. And her middle name is Olathe and it means truth. And then I have my Penelope. Grace it means weaver of grace and Wow.

So I have my flower of wisdom, my light of truth, and my. A weaver of grace and God imparts, I see God has imparted those things into their spirits.

So Adrian, I know that this story kind of takes a turn here where we have this beautiful little baby girl and she is just amazing to behold.

And Charles is the best big brother. Mm-hmm. It is the sweetest thing to see your family, [00:46:00] but you did go from this beautiful moment with this baby girl walking at the same time through your mom's last days. Yeah. Yeah. Which, once again, we started this conversation, this conversation wasn't necessarily about infant loss, although we have this in common.

We belong to a club nobody wants to get into, but we're a club all the same. But grief is around us in many different ways. Mm-hmm. And losing a parent, losing your mom at the same time that you're finally experiencing this joy, this new birth, what, what was that like for you? Well, and I'm gonna go back to the whole like, for lack of a better term, premonition thing is because 10 years before I lost my mom, I had a dream that my stepdad at the time was going to [00:47:00] tell me. He told me my mom was going to pass. He was like, she passed. And I was like, no. And I just remember crying from that dream and waking up and telling mom and she's nothing's gonna happen.

It's fine. And reassuring me. So when that act, that exact moment happened almost like exactly like my dream. I was like, I just collapsed on wow by my wall. I was like, no, I was like, I just couldn't believe it and I knew it was gonna happen. It's, mind you, then after I had Iris, then she was in the NICU because.

They still had to treat her because my antibodies were still in her and she was still right. Mm-hmm. She was man, a little fighter though, because the doctor said, oh, she won't get out until Christmas. And so I had her October 28th and she was in the nicu and my, and, and my mom was like, she was still, my mom was still here.

And she was like, oh, I just, can you just show me a video of her crying? I just wanna hear her voice. And I played that and she was just so reassured and so happy. And I was like, oh, like I, I'm so glad that she [00:48:00] got to see her. And then November 8th is when she passed. My mom passed. And, and so I was like, God, you brought Iris here.

That early son, that my mom could meet her. Mm-hmm. And how, what a good God you are. Even though I was going through all that and I lost my mom, who was my very best friend in the whole world, I was like, you love me enough? And it's oh, well that's is that love. But it was, it was such a gentle reminder and let me know that he was still there and he still loved me and he cared about my needs and he cared about my mom's needs too, because she wanted to see her grandchild.

And yeah, when, when my mother passed it just, it that to me like that was a different kind of grief because she was like so much a part of my foundation and who I was and who I am. And it, [00:49:00] it literally I don't know if you guys, I am a Disney person through and through, and the, the movie Inside Out has a different yeah.

Mm-hmm. Like the things, like the islands, and they all fell apart. It felt like that, like the, my island was being destroyed and, and I was like, this is my whole foundation. She brought me to faith, she brought me to so many things, and I'm losing all of it. What is going on? So that was just unbelievable to me.

It's a different kind of, it's a different kind of I agree. Yeah. It is. It doesn't mean that it doesn't hurt, it doesn't mean that it isn't incapacitating at times. Yeah. It's just a different kind of grief that you walk through. Yeah. Yeah. And I yeah, they tell you all the time you're gonna lose your parents, but that doesn't mean that you are ready when it happens.

Right. I would imagine that walking some of the most joyful moments of your life alongside some of the most difficult was an experience not everybody has at the same time. Yeah. It's [00:50:00] funny what the world calls in this whole process of grief reframing. Yeah. Sometimes people call, call, call it finding the, the silver lining in the cloud.

Mm-hmm. It is a part of grief and I do believe that for people of faith. Mm-hmm. I believe my faith allows me, just like you said, how your mom got to see her. Yeah. Your mom got to hear her little voice, yeah. Before she passed. Sometimes, for people of faith, I think that's part of what they call the reframing in the stages of grief.

And I know for me. One of the things that I did talk about insanity, once again, it says something about my personality. There was a college level course on grief being taught a faith-based college level course on grief. And we were to do a project. Mm-hmm. [00:51:00] And Randy and I decided to take the course together.

Mm-hmm. And I remember part of the course for me was to basically how do you create a memorial, a memory for a life that there was so hope, so much hope and promise was coming that ends too short. Yeah. And I remember kinda it's okay, here's grief. It's this porcupine in the box.

And instead of, putting on the gloves and the tools to get the porcupine back, I took my bare hands and went, girl. Let's get something outta here. I just felt like the importance to, okay, once again, God, you're a good father. How are we gonna redeem these moments? Yeah. So this is where our conversation, I would like to see it turn just a little bit, just simply because I don't know if our zoom meeting has let us gonna go on past the time limit.

We knew this would [00:52:00] be an in-depth conversation, but Okay. So I know that there are silly things that people say and do that maybe we shouldn't. We learn some really hard lessons when we lose about maybe some of the things we said to people before that we shouldn't have. Mm-hmm. And I will bring one thing to the table.

I don't know if you guys can think of anything, and then we probably need to quickly kind of turn to the whole concept of what has gone done with your grief to redeem. So for me, the silly things, I had many well-meaning Christians say things like, well, God has his purpose, he has his reason, he has his plan.

And I remember wanting to just look at them and say, no, part of this plan is from a good God in my opinion. Right. But then also people who had had different kinds of grief, whether that was the loss of a spouse or once again, the loss of a grandparent telling me, I know what you [00:53:00] feel like. Yeah. And I remember.

My biggest takeaway was never tell anyone I know exactly what you're going through. Yeah. Because I think what that does is that you're so desperately trying to gra, at least for me, I was so desperately trying to grasp for some meaning. Right. Some silver lining to the cloud to clinging to this tiny life was so short.

Yeah. I was desperately trying to clinging to it how dare anybody tried to tell me they, part of me making it something to clinging to was that this was our experience, right? Mm-hmm. And how we choose to remember it is ours. Yeah. What are things that maybe people said that they shouldn't have or things that you learned from what people said that you'll take with you for, for now to help other people?

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I, I could tell you. I heard a lot from people. Everything happens for a reason. Mm-hmm. That's everything happens for a [00:54:00] reason, and, must have been God's will things like that. And I was like, this is, this is not like, if this God's will, then I do not wanna be a part of it.

I was like, this is not, yeah. I believe, I, I think that so many times we, so that didn't help at all. But then Corey's brother, PJ actually said something that really actually helped me kind of like pivot that, that saying, and he said, no, I don't, everything doesn't happen for a reason, but everything that happens matters.

Yes. Oh yes. And I thought that I still carry that today. Like everything that happens matters. Yeah. Which is a whole different kind of it, it pivots a thought of everything happens for a reason. Right. 'cause I feel like almost that phrase is somebody's little bow to tie it up, to make it make sense and push it away and say, okay, right.

Done with that. Like everything happens for a reason and it's their way of, of trying to polish it and make it make sense in their head. And, and [00:55:00] I was just like, that, that is probably the, the, the least helpful thing somebody could do. But something that, that to me is just beautiful. Mm-hmm.

Is, like I said, when my best friend, Toya and Hannah, like texts me every part, every now and then they say, I thought I'd listened to this song today. Came across. And they, and they let me know that, or they'll, they'll, Toya talks about how beautiful Corey Jr was. And my sister talks to me about Miles and, and Corey and how like.

How much they meant to her and how much they mean to her. Yeah. And all of those things help. 'cause I think as a grieving somebody who's grieving, you just want to know that that person is remembered. Yeah. That's all you just want people to recognize, especially when you lose a child. Yeah. You want them to recognize your child.

Right. Yeah. And you know what the thing about it is too, and, and this was really hard for me, is I didn't have a face to look at. People told me, it was like nothing. It was almost like this child [00:56:00] wasn't a part of my history. Mm-hmm. And, and I don't necessarily know where that child is. Mm-hmm. What, where, what happens to that baby after they do the DNC because that, that, that traumatized me.

Where is that baby? And Well, I think it's, I think that's a hard thought for any of us. Yeah. Even when we know they are cremated or in the ground. Yeah. Yeah. Those are hard thoughts. Yeah. Or minds. I think it was like, is is is my baby in a trash can somewhere? Mm-hmm. That's one that's, that's that, that was really my terrifying feeling is mm-hmm.

Is, is is the memory of my baby somewhere in a trash can. Wow. And but when you said that, well, can I be the honest, those thoughts are real thoughts that you have when you're in those moments. Yeah. Tho those, they sound, morbid. Yeah. And like, why are we saying them out loud? Right. But those are the real thoughts you have in your head.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. I remember saying in the, in the room before, like I said, we were surrounded by. Pastors and family and friends. And [00:57:00] I remember I told you I was having this conversation that was sometimes inside and sometimes I let it out. And I remember at one moment I said something like, oh, dear God, I pray he hasn't been hurting.

Did he hurt? Oh my goodness. Did he feel pain? And I remember my dad, who's a, bless his heart, I love my daddy. But very scientific minded. Oh, Lisa don't think like that. He didn't feel anything. Oh gosh. And I'm, and, and I love my daddy to pieces and to tell that story to him today, he would probably feel awful forever letting those words come outta his mouth.

But he, at the same time was watching me suffer. Mm-hmm. And just wanted me out of the suffering. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I think we all can say things and we have very vivid things that happen that we don't necessarily feel like we can speak out loud. Yeah. Right. That's a very vivid picture you have Amber.

Yeah. And another thing that I was, I was, I, when, when you were talking Adrian, I was thinking about the whole idea of everything happens for a reason and [00:58:00] my idea changed of what, what, sorry. My dogs are going crazy right now. But my,

they, they, they hear something moving. But everything happens for a reason. I don't think everything happens for a reason. I think we need to rephrase that as well. Every, everything happens because we have broken bodies. We're meant to go. We, we have things we go through. This is a world in which we deal with our humanity, and that's very fragile.

Second thing, creation. Creation is broken, period. The creation is broken. We do, we, we digress. The moment we are born, we start dying. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And secondly, we, we get to choose what to do with that. Exactly. That is, that is the seed that the, the seed that we can, we can choose to be bitter or we can choose to look to the light.

Mm-hmm. We can choose to say, okay, God, this is a [00:59:00] very hard circumstances that I, I have been through. But I'm not, we're gonna, we're gonna have our moment in the, in the cave. We're gonna have a moment in the stronghold, and sometimes we have to return to our cave. Oh yeah. We walk in and out of it often when it comes to grief and, and, but at the, at the end of the day, even with.

Everything that you deal with on a daily basis. Losses of jobs, losses of, of, of homes, losses, of whatever it is. You, the only thing that gets me through is looking to the light. That is the only thing that happens. And if I don't look to the light, I can't move forward. Mm-hmm. And that's everything.

Everything works for good. Right. I've walked through this and I've still pushed into the light that God's given me. And he's seen me, he has shown me there is life after death, man. Yeah. There's life after death here on this earth. There [01:00:00] is 'cause dreams die. You think that they're, but they No. No. They go into a different direction, maybe.

Mm-hmm. Every moment there is a grief. There is a resurrection of something. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. There is a resurrection of purpose. There's a resurrection of ministry. There's a resurrection of, of relationships that I've seen come through grief. There's a resurrection of there's a resurrection of the sun coming up tomorrow mm-hmm.

That eventually comes, whether you want it to or not. It does. It does. And, and sometimes you don't want the sun to come and don't want tomorrow because you don't wanna have to feel what you're feeling. Yeah. Right. But you avoid it. There is, there is for, especially for those who follow Christ, there is a resurrection.

There's something in there that resurrects whether it's to help someone else, and [01:01:00] that may be one person, there's a resurrection. Of whatever has died, whatever has gone to the ground. And I don't think anything that has gone to the ground as our seeds do, doesn't have a resurrection. Mm-hmm. To something.

It's kind of that whole mentality of, once again, the reframe. When you get through it, I described it as, it's like you're in that boat that we read about in scripture. The storm is tossing all around you, but I found myself alone in that boat and the wave's just rocking me up against the sides of the boat from side to side.

At some point in the process, God does bring peace and stillness in our walk with grief, and we are not hitting up against the side of the boat alone. All of a sudden the waves become calmer [01:02:00] for seasons. And we find there are people in the boat with us. Mm-hmm. And as well, we get to the point where we can actually step out of the boat on very weak knees.

But we connect with land again. Right. Whatever the timeframe is in our journey to get from that point of sheer storm mm-hmm. Just being, just racked by that storm to being able to stand surefooted on the ground. It doesn't mean the seasons don't come and go. And we didn't even talk about what can trigger grief.

Yeah. Like I told you earlier on my body mm-hmm. Because of seasons goes right back to certain feelings and moments. Yeah. But there does come a point Yeah. Where we stand on our feet again. And for me, one of those points was. I have three little girls at home. Mm-hmm. That need a mommy with a sound [01:03:00] mind.

Yeah. Right? Mm-hmm. And I have a husband who has been gutted just as deeply as I, even though I carried our son. So what do we do from this point forward? And I do wanna talk about that because I feel like we're doing a huge injustice to the story, but time is not on our side. To not talk about that process because there needs to be transparency and maybe we should talk about that at another time.

But I want to be able to let people know that are listening who might be walking in this very moment. Maybe they are still, where you're at right now, Adrian, in your grief. And being pulled back to it seasonally is different from where I am. I. Had a striking conversation with Randy just yesterday when I told him we were gonna talk about grief.

Mm-hmm. He's one of the few people that I can talk to, who knows where I'm at. [01:04:00] Right. We had the realization that during the week of Noah's passing, which for me is a double whammy. Mm-hmm. I noticed he wasn't moving on one day, but the fear was he was gone before that day. And then of course there's the days up to actually putting that little body on the ground.

It's a week. And during that week, Randy and I usually go to the cemetery, even if it's just the two of us. I just wanna see the sunset. I wanna sit there on the grass. I wanna feel the grass. Mm-hmm. I wanna hear the birds. Mm-hmm. I wanna just be in that moment even it's just me and him. Mm-hmm.

Because I don't get to have those moments where. I can put my hands on my son and hug him or worry about where he is when he comes home late. Those are my only moments left short of what we get to on the other side of eternity before now, in [01:05:00] this moment. That's those moments. And what's really funny is this year this, we had kids in our house the week proceeding and I got really sick and I was thinking about the days up to it and then all of a sudden we lost our mind until yesterday.

And I said we didn't go to the cemetery the first year since 1999. So for me, where I'm at now that I've been outside of the boat, and those waves come and go, the things that trigger them are different. The waves don't come as frequently as they did before. Part of me. Regrets that because you feel horrible.

Does it mean I'm forgetting? I could never forget. But you're in a different space than that. And yet I have watched you in the past year do some things that I'm so proud of you for and that [01:06:00] you have begun to take this story that is really, really hard and you've begun to do some things to support other people who walk through this by being a part of an organization or a board.

Mm-hmm. You tell your story like this and I know it's been hard. I know that you don't do this a lot, a lot. So we're very thankful. I am thankful my sweet friend that you chose to do this with us today. Oh, thank you. But what are some things that God is doing with you to redeem those moments? Yeah. Thank you for, thank you both for just letting me be here and sharing my story and giving me the opportunity to do that. So thank you so much and thank you for sharing your hearts. And just, it just means the world, it really does to just share these things and I think it's what makes us human, what's make, makes us, all, all realized that we're connected.

So the things, so when I lost, Corey and when I lost [01:07:00] miles I had, so the church that we went to the pastor's wife at the time she was she just, she just has this quiet way of doing things that are just so beautiful and personal. And she told my story to a friend of hers who's an artist and, this lady has blessed us in so many different ways. Probably in many unspoken ways, I don't even know. And she's connected me with so many different people. So she connected me with, Brianna Gray, who is, the founder, one of the founders of Solace photography, which is, an organization who basically, gives the opportunity for families to have professional photographs of their children who are at the end of their life or who have been born still.

And so when bringing a presented me as saying, oh, do you wanna be a part of the board? I didn't hesitate. Mm-hmm. Because I was like, this is what I want. This [01:08:00] is, again, I think it's just so important for your child to be remembered. And what better way to remember them with photography as hard it is as it is, and.

You capture probably the deepest grief in those pictures. Mm-hmm. I don't take the pictures myself, but I, I, I, Brianna has that talent and so do her friends. But like she, she said, I just want you to be a part of this because you were there mm-hmm. And you could tell a story to these women. You can help these women.

And she's also has a a, she has a podcast as well, and she's given me a platform to, to speak about, about my grief on that podcast. So yeah, so I just, I guess I just want people to know how real it is that unfortunately we live in this world and suffering is a part of, of how we get through it is just part of life.

It's just, it just is. And I think it's silly. I. As someone with faith and as a Christian, it's silly to think that if we do [01:09:00] everything right, then nothing bad will happen because we forget about Jesus. Yeah. Wow. He did everything right. Yeah. He did everything right and still suffered. Yes. Yeah. And so, and I just think that we forget that suffering is a part of this life.

That's part of the human experience. It's part of the human experience. And Jesus would've rather not suffered. He would rather not. Yeah. He, he didn't want to. Yeah. He didn't wanna suffer and, and, and just as much as we don't wanna suffer, absolutely. But he dealt with, and I think because he knew the purpose behind it, maybe it was a little bit, I don't know if it was easier or not, sweat and blood doesn't seem, doesn't seem, it doesn't seem like he was, at some point.

All down with his purpose, but he knew something. Yeah. Was he's gonna have to walk through this. Yeah. He, he, he knew there was purpose. Whereas sometimes when we walk, we don't see the purpose. Right. And I think that's what part of the process of this [01:10:00] conversation is that I don't wanna miss. And that is that we do have a choice about how we walk through this.

A lot of times we're just so hoodwinked by the emotion of grief. Mm-hmm. We feel no sense of control. Like I said, just tossed about on the waves in that boat. And the reality is there does come a point where you do wake up at night and it's not the only thing that hits your mind. It's not the first thing you think of in the morning.

Mm-hmm. It's not the last thing that's in your brain before you sleep. Mm-hmm. You mourn that. Yeah. Because then once again, how dare I forget? Mm-hmm. But at the same time, you learn to embrace Right. Part of healing and it is part of God's grace, his kindness towards us. Yeah. My God is still kind. Yeah.

He is still gracious. Yeah. In spite of the difficulties of [01:11:00] this life. And I, I often would remind myself in the midst of grief, many women have gone through what I've gone through. Mm-hmm. Many women who don't know Christ and they still get up every day and have to work through this just like me.

And I think it's part of that reconciling yourself, allowing God to redeem those moments. I love that you're doing this. Yeah. For families and Adrian, I've been telling you for a long time, a sweet girl, you've got a lot to tell people. You have a beautiful way of communicating your heart. And I believe there are gifts in you that haven't even begun to be revealed and that God is going to use them for his glory.

, Speaking of that can you mention what, what the podcast is? 'cause I'm assuming it's on platforms too, like our coffee chat. Oh, sure. Yeah. It's, it called Echoes of Impact . Everybody who's, who's watching today, I'm sure we all have been touched by losing [01:12:00] children, at some point.

Or losing a spouse, a spouse, Jo Limb. Yeah. So echo far reaching. Yeah. So we'll put the link to that in the, in the comments below. And man, I think we've made up for at least three episodes of Coffee Chat in this time together. It's been an amazing conversation. Before we close, Adrian, would you just, say a prayer for the, those who are in the midst of grief right now?

Of course. We appreciate it. Yeah, of course. Lord, we come to you right now, Lord, and knowing that you know what it means to suffer, you know what it means to lose Lord. And we're so gracious. We're so grateful that we have a gracious God who has. Walk down this path of losing a child. God, right now, Lord, we pray that you would just resonate within our stories, Lord, that you would just be evident and that you would just comfort the hearts, Lord, that are listening to us right now, Lord, that you would just [01:13:00] surround them Lord, with your love and your peace beyond any understanding that we have.

We pray that you would just guide them Lord, to the right people, to the right things Lord, that would help them learn and have the right tools to get through their grief, Lord, and to live with their grief. Because we know, Lord, that it is something we live with, but with you, there's always hope God with you Lord, there's always a rainbow God.

So we thank you so much, Lord, for your promises that you turn heartbreak Lord to heartbeats Lord. That you keep on going, Lord. And we thank you so much that we would collect that resilience from you Jesus, through this time, Lord, but also know that you are there and walking with us, Lord, when we are in our deep grief and we're in the deepest of the valley, Lord, that you are right there, right beside us, that you're walking ahead of us, that you know how it feels.

Lord, we thank you so much for your [01:14:00] mercy and your grace, Jesus. And we pray, Lord, that you would just be lifted up, Lord, through our situations, God, and that we would just send your presence, Lord. And even if we don't sense your presence, Lord, that there would be something, Lord, to remind us, Lord, that you haven't left us Lord, and you've not not forsaken us, Lord, that you love us Lord.

And we thank you so much for that love. In Jesus name we pray. Amen. Amen. Adrian, I just wanna thank you. So yeah, thank you so much. And I just wanna just this came to my mind as you were praying, Adrian. There might be someone here that does not resonate with this whole Jesus thing that's going through grief.

And I just wanna challenge you one, at this time, even if you don't believe, call out to Jesus and see what happens. Amen. See how he shows up in this situation, because even if you don't believe, he shows up and [01:15:00] the peace you'll feel will better, will be like a balm you've never felt. Amen. Over your spirit.

Amen. But so excited that you've joined us. As I said, we have a, we have a huge podcast right here. We've made up for a few weeks of being apart. Apart from you. We're gonna put it over on your, our YouTube. Please subscribe to our YouTube channel, coffee chat ladies, you'll find it over there.

And we're gonna put this video up. I'm sure you guys will have a friend to send it to as well. It'll be on the coffee chat with Amber and Lisa podcast over wherever you get your podcast. Please subscribe and echoes and impact you guys. Whoever has experienced this kind of loss, you need to, you need to go over there and subscribe too.

Thank you so much for being with us today, and we just love you guys. And we love you. I see you come back. Thank you, Adrian. Thank you. Thank you, Adrian. Take care everyone. Bye-bye. [01:16:00] Bye-bye.