Of Blood and Fire by Ryan Cahill: Episode One

New series alert! We'll be spending the next few months covering The Bound and The Broken by Ryan Cahill, kicking off with the Fellensír path and Of Blood and Fire. This episode covers Chapters 1-19. 

Get ready for hot chocolate in book form, because Cahill's world of swords, dragons, chosen ones, and elemental magic is a soothing, cozy balm for our eyes. We open with three buddies in a happy little village who will undoubtedly remain there for the rest of their lives. Just kidding -- by the end of part one, we're already wanted by the empire, fighting blood demons, and hatching dragons. 

This book rips, and I hope you join us for our coverage of the full series! Please send us a note at booktwoisbetter@gmail.com or on Reddit @booktwoisbetter with any thoughts, suggestions, or feedback. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:16

Hey, look at the camera.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

We're recording. Wow, that was so quick.

SPEAKER_03 0:23

No, you were looking at your damn phone.

SPEAKER_01 0:25

Well, though you picked the one. Kids these days. Feeling like a boomer. Can't get off my phone. You should have seen the boomers at Cirque du Soleil on their phones. Charge a phone. My guy.

SPEAKER_03 0:36

What were they doing? Filming the entire thing?

SPEAKER_01 0:38

There's a full well, you can't see my face, but yeah, full horizontal film, but then the best is looking at the photo after.

SPEAKER_03 0:47

I two notes. One, I remember I was at a museum one time and someone had an iPad on a selfie stick and was filming the entire art museum. Um punishable by death. Kill them. Two, I do love uh when people catch old people typing nasty shit in public on their phones because they all have size 80 Futura font and they're like texting their fucking mistresses. I want your thighs, whatever weird shit.

SPEAKER_01 1:19

Some nasty shit.

SPEAKER_03 1:20

Yeah. Another great old person bit. I was at the driving range the other day, and two old timers were, you know, middle of the day, because I was unemployed. Um, two old timers were chopping it up on the bench, and one of them dropped the line. Uh, I'll call his I'll call his ex-wife Karen. He's like, Cockroaches and Karen, two things that won't die. It's like, yeah, fuck her. Ex-wife, get out of here. It's so funny to see a 75-year-old man complaining about his ex-wife.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

Yeah. Such the bitterness has seeped in.

SPEAKER_03 1:55

The well-stewed tea. He's hacked off because she didn't change her last name back.

SPEAKER_01 2:00

Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_03 2:01

That interesting.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

I feel like all the fuss to get them to get a lady to change their last name. You'd appreciate it if they kept it. Is it fuss? A lot of times it's fussy. Like a lot of people get really worked up about it. I mean, everybody has like different family traditions. Yeah. Ours is pretty easy. We just didn't. Yeah, are you ever gonna change yours? Or is Kathy ever gonna change hers?

SPEAKER_03 2:24

No, she's she's publishing shit. I feel like it would be Yeah. No. We would either both change it or no one changes it. But it wouldn't be like uh she takes my last name, even though I have a cooler last name, which will not be set on the pod. Thank you very much. Rucks. Edit, edit, edit. Thank you. Thank you, Travis Fox, since you're editing this. Um okay. Of blood and fire by Ryan.

SPEAKER_01 2:55

That's a great opener right there. Why don't you try that one again, big guy? What? Oh blood and fire.

SPEAKER_03 3:02

Draw your swords, motherfuckers. I'm so back. We're done with science. We're done with Rome. We're done with crooks and flails.

SPEAKER_01 3:12

You know what we got in the swords book? We got swords. We have a map at the beginning because it's not on 73 planets that don't have to be.

SPEAKER_03 3:19

Three kids from a small village.

SPEAKER_01 3:20

Ugh. Type shit. A dad who loves you.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

A dad who is secretly a huge badass, and we're gonna find out why. Um a dog. I'd say wolf pine.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Yeah. Wolf pine.

SPEAKER_03 3:38

What's up with that word?

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Because it it's just like a a loopy. You gotta make a a somewhat of a wolf variation.

SPEAKER_03 3:44

Do you prefer Ryan Cahill's wolf pine or John Gwynn's Wolven?

SPEAKER_01 3:50

Wolven, because Storm is always number one in my heart.

SPEAKER_03 3:54

Yeah, at this point, Storm is a better boy.

SPEAKER_01 3:57

So Yeah, yeah, I know Storm very well. I don't know this dog. I don't know this dog for me.

SPEAKER_03 4:02

Um game. Tropes in this book. Do you want to start or you want me to start? I'll start. Okay, hold on. Give me a little ducat die ready. Three, two, one, go. Buildung's Roman. Is that a trope? I win. No, I don't think that's a trope. Okay, start again. Start again. That's like a type of novel. That would be like crime thriller. Trope. I'm sorry. You're gonna define my trope option? Trope, novel. Fiction. Okay, okay, okay. I'm thinking fantasy tropes here. Okay, fine. Okay, you got three, two, one, go. Magic sword. Fantasy novel that starts with the party. Chosen one. Son of a blacksmith. Secret Dad. Pet Wolf. Magic Tower. Stern Mayer.

SPEAKER_01 5:03

Oh fuck, there's like a hundred more.

SPEAKER_03 5:06

Some of those I don't know for tropes. I think I should lose for saying Stern Mayer. Stern Mayer's a little absurd. That kind of threw me. I had to think about it.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

If I have to read one more fucking Stern Mayer book, I'm gonna lose it. Magic. The one I really wanted to talk about is like m classic masculinity test. The build-up drama.

SPEAKER_03 5:26

Yeah, that's a good one. That's a real good one.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Coming of age through a forced contest.

SPEAKER_03 5:31

I thought of a bunch before we started recording, and I guess that's the point of the hesitation game is that it uh it it clears your brain right out. I love a good Hesi. Um okay. We had vowed to talk more about how we're oh I mean fucking classic, we forgot to say what we're covering. Uh chapters one through nineteen, as always, it's in the episode description. So uh uh welcome to any new listeners who might be out there. Um full full spoilers for the sections we're covering. I think that's obvious, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:03

Yeah, we generally, if this is your first time hopping into the pod, we split the book into two or three parts. We do a little how we're feeling about it, we do a plot summary that is hilarious, and this one is then we talk about then we just talk about the book and what we like and what we don't like and the funny bits. Lovely. And tropes. That's pretty great.

SPEAKER_03 6:24

And uh what do we do? We just wrapped up uh we did a little project, Hail Mary Bang Bang. We did the book and the film. Um before that we did Hierarchy with James Islington, and then before that, God damn that we do a lot of Sun Eater by Chris Rocchio. Uh full series, so that's out there. So that's out there if you want it. Um but anyways, um let's rip. Travis, opening salvo, opening thoughts?

SPEAKER_01 6:50

Oh, it rocks, man. I mean, I think we we talked about we're in our comfort zone. This is you know, buddy fantasy, leave the small village, discover a bigger world, fun magic system, we got dragons, we got wolf cub pets, we got elves. It's got everything you need.

SPEAKER_03 7:10

You tell me this book got elves. Hold on. It's actually been a minute since I've encountered an elf in uh in a book. Um true. I feel like inside me there are two wolf pines, and there's the critical wolf pine that's like, god damn, is this wheel of timey? But then there's the fun wolf pine that's like, who cares? You're having a great time. And that wolf pine is dominating my my inner dialogue right now. I'm just having a great time.

SPEAKER_01 7:37

I don't really care.

SPEAKER_03 7:38

I don't really care about the whole trope thing.

SPEAKER_01 7:40

Don't really care too much. I'm enjoying it. Maybe by book two we'll get a little sick of it, but yeah, of course. At some point. Yeah. I feel like Calen in my inner monologue, I give myself one good counter-argument and say, actually, no, this is fine. Let's do it. It's fine, who cares?

SPEAKER_03 7:57

Um, I mean, it's a thing I like, and I'm getting more of it. I can imagine if you're like, I both don't like Wheel of Time or I don't like fantasy and have read all of Wheel of Time, then this is so not for you. Yeah, but it's those people are out there.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Yeah, if you liked Wheel of Time, if you liked John Gwen, and you're stumbling into the series, I think it's gonna be perfect for you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:22

This is it was making me think so much about how much books are like right time, right place. And just on this show, we hadn't covered like a classic sword and sorcery fantasy novel in a while, and I was so ready for this type of thing. But I could imagine finding this at the complete wrong time and being like, what the fuck is this? Three boys from a small town shit. Come on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:45

If we read this right after John Gwen, all four books, we'd be like, absolutely not. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:51

But we're not, and so here we are heaping praise on this uh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:56

Well, I'm having a great time.

SPEAKER_01 8:57

Um why don't you give them a little rundown? What happens in chapters one through 19 of this book?

SPEAKER_03 9:03

Well, uh, before we do that, um I think I forgot to tell you, but um we did actually uh get a sponsor for the summary segment. Oh, incredible. Yeah, so great work there. Great work there, buddy. Thank you, thank you. So I'm I'm gonna send you the uh the ad copy. Okay, good. And um, if you could just read that and then I'll do the um I'll do the summary. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

Okay, gotcha. This summary is brought to you by Twisted Tea, now available in Mango Havanero, paprika cinnamon. Two new flavors that will have you saying, No, officer, I'm not drunk, I'm just a little twisted.

SPEAKER_03 9:41

Thank you. Thank you to Twisted Tea for sponsoring this. Um it was a one, it was a one summary ad deal. So um we'll see who we have next week. But anyways, summary of chapters one through nineteen of one through nineteen of blood and fire. Of all of Blood and Fire is the debut novel from certified proper Irish lad Ryan Cahill. And the book begs the question: is Ryan Cahill the Greta Van Fleet of fantasy? My mean-spirited co-host Travis says yes, but let's all make up our own minds, shall we? The story begins in the glade, not the Shire, and don't you dare get too confused. Caitlin, Dan, and Riz are our token trio of ambling farm boys, and their epic manosphere do hard shit trial called The Proving is right around the corner. Like all good fantasy novels and chrono trigger, it begins with a festival. Meat is flowing, fights are fighting, and an Elven Bard is telling psychedelic tales that, if I had to guess, will tie directly to the plot later in the book. The morning after the festi, Kaelin, Dan, and Wrist, henceforth known as CDR, are sent off into Fangorn Forest to participate in the proving their task, don't die, and bring back a really big dead animal. Roadkill not expressly prohibited and thus permitted. What follows is an animal killing spree that would be punishable by law in most states. CDR accidentally camp in a bear cave and are forced to kill the beast when it comes home and finds a bunch of hungover teens in its bedroom. On the way out of the forest, they attempt to befriend a cat, and for audiobook listeners, that's cat with a K, but that goes awry when the town bullies show up and try to kill both CDR and the cat. Let's hope word of this doesn't get back to the town mayor. Spoiler, it will. You'd think the parade of frightening beasts would end there, but hold up. I'm consulting my Epic Fantasy checklist, and it says we have to introduce some sort of orc-like creature that hasn't been seen around these parts in years. Cue up the Urak fight. The boys are ambushed by a group of nasty orc thangs, and goddamn, this would have ended badly if one of the creatures hadn't spontaneously combusted. Nothing to do with wrist, obviously, sometimes creatures just explode. It's one of nature's great mysteries. The boys hobble home with a stinky Urak head and toe and are rewarded with the highest honors in the proving, or whatever it's called. The town bullies get latrine duty or some shit for shooting wrist in the leg and stealing CDR's bear trophy, which seems like kinda light punishment for attempted murder. Restorative justice ass fantasy town, lock 'em up. Shortly thereafter, CDR are sent on a fetch quest to a nearby town for Kaylin's blacksmith father, who owns an elven sword for some reason. The boys, all proper Irishmen, are absolutely on the lash post-quest, and they get into a drunken axe throwing contest with a bunch of roughnecks and a mysterious dude named Eric, who's extremely good at axe throwing. I'm not going to try to make sense of what happens next, so here are the facts. Eric, his brother, and his dad are accosted by Imperial soldiers outside the axe throwing bar. Kalen steps in to defend Axe Legend Eric, and somehow Kalen ends up killing a soldier to defend a dude he's known for like an hour tops. And unlike shooting a fellow proving participant in the leg, killing a soldier actually has consequences. CDR are now on the run with Eric and Co., and Imperial soldiers head to the glade to track down Kalen, who is now kind of justifiably wanted for murder. And what will become a theme in this book, communications between the mayor, Kalen, Kalen's parents, and the soldiers immediately break down, and oh my goodness, Mama and Papa Kalen get slimed. Kalen is an orphan now, so thank God he passed his manhood trial a few days ago. He can step in as head of his empty household. Eric and Co. swoop into the glade to save CDR and the gang hits the road. We learn that one, CDR saviors are members of an Imperial Resistance group that wants to overthrow the Empire via dragon power, and two, they're actually making some progress on that front because they are in possession of a dragon egg. And wouldn't you know it, the dragon embryo immediately takes a liking to Top Boy Kalen. The section ends with Kalen becoming a fucking dragon rider, and now he's off to Bisgayath War College to start a messy love triangle with Cadet Violet Sorengale and Shadow Daddy himself Zaydan Ryerson. Oh, and I guess I should mention Kaylin's sister. She's in love with a perfectly nice guy who her dad hates for almost no reason. So they flee the glade to start a new life in Italy. Good timing on that, because they didn't get slimed like Mom and Dad. And that's it. Well played. Well played, Sword. I told you this one was long.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

It was long, but it was it was good. It was comprehensive.

SPEAKER_03 14:12

They're yeah, they are they are uh trending towards the more factual.

SPEAKER_01 14:16

Yes, I feel properly slimed by information.

SPEAKER_03 14:18

Although, you know, I think because this book is so straightforward, and you know, this is this is uh stock fantasy, it's hard to make jokes about it. I think you did a pretty good job. I know, but I didn't want to be like haha, trope, trope, trope, like over and over when our angle isn't even that we don't like that.

SPEAKER_01 14:38

Yeah, that's that's the problem. It's like half of our summaries are the meanest things we've ever come up with for a certain piece of literature. And we can't be that mean because it's actually kind of fun.

SPEAKER_03 14:49

The summaries are pretty mean regardless of whether we like the book, which I'm not sure what that's about. I think we're just mean people inside. No, no, no, no. In this one arena.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

I fight to the fucking death in plot summaries. Yeah. You better not catch me in a dark alley with a pen. Shout out witch had atelier.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Yeah, can we give a quick fuck this book that's fucked?

SPEAKER_03 15:15

Summary out of the way. Uh, witch had atelier. Very good. First two episodes, 10 out of 10. Unbelievable. Love it. Um, nah, I guess we whatever. We'll talk about that next episode.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

Yeah, subscribe to our Patreon for um bonus anime coverage.

SPEAKER_03 15:30

Uh Travis just uh Travis eats bowls of scrambled eggs and watches anime shirt lesson. And you can you can watch that for five dollars a month.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

That is the price of my dignity.

SPEAKER_03 15:49

Take another egg bite, fat boy.

SPEAKER_01 15:51

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 15:53

Uh okay. Now, where do we even start? I don't know. You know what I didn't you know what I didn't mention? The the classic uh fantasy prologue said 3,000 years in the past where everything is fucking epic and then we cut to a farm.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Dude, I loved the prologue so much because I just read it, I read it colds, and then it took like a week before I actually picked up the book.

SPEAKER_02 16:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

I was like, of course they use the magic sigil to restore the knights of Archeon before the blood knew.

SPEAKER_03 16:23

I mean, they swore blood oath. What's the what's not to what's not to understand? It made me so happy. Yeah. I I don't know, like as soon as I started reading that, having read a decent amount of fantasy, I put it into the uh I'm gonna reread this like three books from now, and it's gonna make a whole lot of sense.

SPEAKER_01 16:42

We're reading this at the end of the book, and we're gonna, you know, we're not even gonna talk prologue because neither of us have read it in two weeks, but by the end of this book, we will certainly revisit it for spoiler alerts.

SPEAKER_03 16:51

Yeah, I guess, yeah, I guess the only note is the uh the fucking never dying emperor is there and is still around.

SPEAKER_01 17:01

Yeah, maybe we start, should we start with a quick lore corner on Fein Mortem?

SPEAKER_03 17:08

If you're comfortable, because uh that is the one part of this book that is nagging at me, I'm like, damn, I really should have reread that more.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Well, it's it's real short, but generally, uh the Lorian Empire leader, Fein Mortem, was a very powerful mage who did mind magic and blood magic, which is expressly forbidden, just like Avatar. I don't think you could have a good guy named Fane Mortem. This is some Islington level Latin knowledge here. If your name is Death, you're probably the bad guy.

SPEAKER_03 17:42

Uh, this is my kindergarten teacher, Fane Mortem. He volunteers at homeless shelter and has 10 cats.

SPEAKER_01 17:49

And our boy Fane, he read a little bit too far into the Dune series because he's obsessed with genocide and specifically the power that calls the doom at hater. He betrayed the magical order and their dragons. Now he controls the dragons who are like his secret. He got an bodyguard. He's got an inside man. He got an inside man, and basically now he's Sauron. He has a big old tower, he watches everything, he doesn't go south. And uh yeah, that's about it.

SPEAKER_03 18:17

Ew. Hot.

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Um lower corner.

SPEAKER_03 18:20

Okay. So now fun quiz time. Oh, for new listeners, Travis Travis has got a great memory, but questionable pronunciation skills.

SPEAKER_01 18:30

Well, I'm a I'm reader only.

SPEAKER_03 18:32

He re-dabbles in the audiobooks. I dabble. I do like to dabble. It's usually like an 80-20 split um in favor of reading. Um, so there's a word for a dragon rider in this series. It's D-R-A-L-E-I-D. What are you going with for this word? Dralid. That's basically right. Well, I mean, I don't know if there's a right or wrong, but yeah, they say Dralid. Dralaid in the audio book. But they kind of they kind of put a little Irish stank on that first R. The only R. They go Dralid. Dralid. Yeah. Pretty sick. Pretty sick. I'm into it.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Yeah. Honestly, that's the only kind of unpronounceable name. I'm looking at my list of dramatist personae here, and they're all pretty, pretty simple. We even got straightforward. We even got our boy wrist.

SPEAKER_03 19:21

Yeah. Um, maybe everyone knows this, but I I was on K Kahill's Instagram, and some QA, someone asked him about the name wrist, and he's like, honestly, man, I was writing, I needed a name. I looked down at my arm and was like, oh my goodness. However, the W didn't feel very fantasy, so he uh he got that one. Um lovely. Kyle seems like a great guy. I really like him right now.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

I'm I'm on light research for him right now. I'll get heavier as we read read more, but when you name the boys Dan Penn, Dan Pym and Wrist, and they live in the glade, like you're all right with me.

SPEAKER_03 20:04

We do have a history of looking a little too deeply in the into the authors, and we're like, oh my god, they've donated every penny of their work to uh some libertarian think tank and they hate puppies. Um so maybe we just keep it service level and be like, this is a really nice Irish guy. No, no, I gotta meet my heroes. I hate I'm so tired of meeting my heroes.

SPEAKER_01 20:28

No, because it do you know what it really is? I've thought about this. It's because our first hero was such a good human. John Gwen is an excellent person. Yeah, I will and he was very kind to us over email, and he was very kind to everybody he's ever interacted with, as far as I can tell. And nobody's lived up to him in our reading.

SPEAKER_03 20:47

That's I mean, that's unfair because John Gwen is the best guy I know. Loves his kids, is a blacksmith, yeah, has two beautiful dogs. But what do you want?

SPEAKER_01 20:58

What a champion. But anyway, Ryan G Ryan Cow, whatever your name is. You're probably fine too.

SPEAKER_03 21:04

Yeah, probably fine. Oh man. Uh you know what surprised me about uh Fain Mortem, noted nice guy? That fucker's still alive.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

Slash, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:18

There I wasn't expecting this to be a world where people can be two thousand.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

Yeah, it's an interesting mix. It I think it's always interesting to have like an opener where it feels like magic doesn't exist, but the larger world is so obviously full of magic. It's like you truly live in a world without like social media guys. Like what how are you this isolated?

SPEAKER_03 21:39

He's Amish. That's true. Um although this is not a this is not a stormlight esque magic is gone, but it's gonna be coming back, baby. Magic's out there.

SPEAKER_01 21:53

The spark is alive.

SPEAKER_03 21:55

It's a known thing. People be using it. Unless you live in the glade and you do not know what the fuck's going on. But generally speaking, I think people know magics out there.

SPEAKER_01 22:03

Yeah. And generally the magic system for this feels fairly straightforward from what we can tell in part one here, which is there is a spark, you can be attuned to the spark. The spark controls elements and things. Yeah. And if you're real naughty, blood magic.

SPEAKER_03 22:21

Shout out Avatar. Um, I'm not gonna I'm gonna stop myself from being like, this is exactly like the wheel of time for everything. But yeah, weaving uh from five elements. Okay. That was that was one of the ones that did rub me a little bit. I was like, we can't be just doing fire, air, earth, water, spirit weaving, and it's addictive, and there are witches who fucking run around and scoop up massive.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Yeah, you know. Maybe we just put a little disclaimer here that like, yeah, there are some massive similarities to Wheel of Time. There's also some clear Lord of the Rings draws here between the Urak and the Eye of Sauron secret magic guy.

SPEAKER_03 23:01

But but whatever. Kahil knows that.

SPEAKER_01 23:04

Yeah, you gotta have a good source, man.

SPEAKER_03 23:07

You know, yeah, who yeah, that's yeah, it really hasn't bothered me that much, other than just like the the weaving. I was like, that's a little much, but it's okay. Generally speaking, it feels fine. And it's getting less the wheel of timey the the more it goes on.

SPEAKER_01 23:21

So yeah. Um okay. Let's let's uh let's set the scene. Let's talk proving and our introduction to these these three lovely lads.

SPEAKER_03 23:31

We got three boys. We got wrist, he's the shy, cute one.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

He is real cute.

SPEAKER_03 23:37

It seems like we got Dan. He's he's the uh he's the layabout gambler. Also good with a bow. And good with a bow. Very good with the bow. I do I do love that that it's like so fucking video gamey. It's like we must assemble a party. We have a sword wielder, an arrow shooter, and a guy who sometimes maybe makes things explode. Have you ever picked a ranger class in a video game? Yeah. Um, yeah. So Dan, Dan's the Matt Cawthon of the group, and then Kaylin in true uh main character fashion has uh by far the least personality of the three. But that's what that's what main characters are for.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

Yeah, he's he's malleable as he should be because he's gonna be the protagonist, as far as we can tell. But I I will okay, I'll give it some credit here that I like their buddy buddy relationship between the three of them more than I do in other books. They're genuinely pretty fun.

SPEAKER_03 24:32

Let's talk about an improvement on the wheel of time. These are people who know each other and don't treat each other like complete garbage, they are actually friends. Oh my fucking god. And I've seen I've seen some husband and wife pairs, and it seems like some of them love each other. Unbelievable. And they're not doing bitch-wife humor the whole time.

SPEAKER_01 24:54

Thank God. And he actually has a love it's two loving parents. He has a cool dad who invests in his success.

SPEAKER_02 25:00

Yeah, what's up with that?

SPEAKER_01 25:03

Yeah, unbelievable. But the and the boys love a pint. I thought that was refreshing. The boys love a pint. I could not drink that much mead.

SPEAKER_03 25:12

Yeah, did you ever drink your mead from the Renfair? I didn't get mead from the Renfair. Oh, I went to a Renfair and I bought a drinking horn.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

Yeah. Which you didn't get mead to drink from, like an idiot.

SPEAKER_03 25:25

I don't think they were selling mead, man. They were selling um white claws and uh Lagonitas IPA. Well, you texted me and you said you were gonna pick me up some mead, so I thought we were gonna record in person and drink mead together, and instead we're recording apart, and I'm drinking electrolyte water.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

I'm drinking water because I'm on antibiotics.

SPEAKER_03 25:47

So anyways, you can't be drinking that much mead. It's too sweet. Those guys Dan and Dan Calen Riz have to be breaking out like crazy.

SPEAKER_01 25:58

Disgusting. They're so hungover all the time.

SPEAKER_03 26:01

Hung over terrible acne, no bitches. These guys don't have they don't but they have killed hundreds of animals. Um okay. So there's a festie. I guess we could talk about that briefly. Yeah. And and a wise old elf shows up. And I guess he just tells us all the lore corner shit that Travis told us about Feynmortem.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

It's true, but we found out they're elves and they're they're pretty cool.

SPEAKER_03 26:26

Yeah, big fan of elves. Again, haven't seen them in a minute. Um, and he's doing that, he appears to be doing some Hoyd-esque uh storytelling magic that Kaylin is just like, man, this meat is fucking on another level right now. I'm seeing things. Um I can hear the colors, brother. Fane is in my ass. Um, okay, so what better time to send these fuckers out into the woods 7 a.m. next day? I love that. I I love that. Yeah, it's the best. Put them in alpha camp in the woods. Yeah, yeah. Um, so one of them has a lead on a cave. And that's where they gon' sleep. Um it's a bear cave, folks.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

As I learned from Golden Kamui episode 23. If if you're in the bear cave, the bear doesn't attack you, and that's actually true. Really? When they're like, oh, their stall is full. It's from an anime. You think it's real?

SPEAKER_02 27:33

Oh, you said that's true.

SPEAKER_01 27:35

Yeah. I felt it with my heart. I actually don't know if it's true.

SPEAKER_03 27:39

In the world of golden kamoe, it's undoubtedly true.

SPEAKER_01 27:43

I don't imagine there's a lot of people that go sleep in bear caves with bears in them and make it out to tell a tale.

SPEAKER_03 27:49

Are bears living in caves? Yeah, they hibernate. How are there enough caves for all the bears?

SPEAKER_01 27:57

I don't know, man.

SPEAKER_03 27:58

What I'm imagining is like a video game like Skyrim cave that has a circular mount and stalactites. I don't think you need that much room, man. To be a bear? It's a hole under a rock. Yeah, that's probably right. They've got like a little burrow. They got a dugout. So they're in the dugout. Bear corner.

SPEAKER_01 28:17

And uh, yeah, oops. Oops, there's a there's a bear.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

You know where there are a lot of bears? Palm Springs. Oh man. I was attacked by a bear in Palm Springs. Had to kill it. Him. Um okay. They kill the they kill the bear. Awesome. I thought this was gonna be a bigger deal.

SPEAKER_01 28:43

Didn't you think this was gonna be like an actual plot point? Like somebody gets mauled by a bear or they come together. No, they just take care of the bear.

SPEAKER_03 28:51

I mean, I just didn't consider that this would be the first in a series of ten animals they had to fight.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

This was this wasn't even close to the climax of the proving.

SPEAKER_03 28:59

I thought this is a one animal killing scene. Uh but no. So you get they get the do they sleep in the cave after the bear they killed?

SPEAKER_01 29:07

No, they're like, we're getting out of here. And they they like skin it and they they hang it up to dry the pellet.

SPEAKER_03 29:13

That's nice.

SPEAKER_01 29:14

And then what they're is this when they're first attacked by a wear cat or whatever?

SPEAKER_03 29:19

There's a really so they catch a fish, which is always I feel like easier to do in books than it is in real life, because you have to touch the fish. Um so they have the fish, the the uh cat with K shows up, and I believe its wrist is like, Hey little guy, would you like some fish? And question is this guy just does he have like a speak to animal spell kind of thing? Is he can is he gonna be like a ranger who can summon a you know, he's got a familiar?

SPEAKER_01 29:51

I could see that maybe you have to be in touch with like nature and the earth to touch the spark initially or something like that, you know?

SPEAKER_03 29:57

I wonder if he's gonna have a little special sauce where he's good with animals because the idea of going to basically a mountain lion with the fish in hand is wild. Anyway, that is what he does. Yeah, no, it seemed like everything was going well until um insert bully name here. What is it, Fritz? Fritz get gat. Motherfucker. He seems flopping. He's rotten, my friend.

SPEAKER_01 30:23

He just fucking shoots wrist right in the leg with an arrow, is what he does.

SPEAKER_03 30:26

That's so tough. And then they take the bear, which is so questionable in a town of twelve. Yeah, did they not think this was gonna get back to them? And it's like, I don't know, I haven't known Fritz that long. That boy's a shithead. And I imagine Stern uh the uh tropey Stern Mayer is gonna know Fritz is a shithead and probably shot wrist in the leg. Like, I don't know, man.

SPEAKER_01 30:52

The one the one comforting thing about this bully trope character, schoolyard bully kid, is that his dad's not also a bully. You know how that's always like the dad who's just kind of like a dick, you know, and then his son's. The dad's just like your disappointment.

SPEAKER_03 31:10

It's like a Tom and Chet Hanks situation. Exactly. Chet Hanks is higher in my book than he used to be. It's crazy that there's a Chet Assance going on right now. So he's got that bombou clat. Stop that. Stop that right now. Um no, I guess he's like doing a a Kanye-esque media tour to be like, I'm no longer Jamaican, I'm just Chet now.

SPEAKER_01 31:31

I kind of liked his Jamaican.

SPEAKER_03 31:35

Sorry for all the bombaclats. I'm just Chet.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

But anyway, they they patch themselves up, they start walking back to go. They're ready to come home in shame, you know.

SPEAKER_03 31:46

And uh they run into like what a fucking busting out of the woods. Eight foot tall painted troll boy. Do any of these buckers? Um, yeah, bad news. So they kill one straight up. Yeah, I remember having a kind of nasty situation with them. But uh they chop they chop its head off, I think. They're like eight feet tall, right?

SPEAKER_01 32:07

These are so the the big one's eight feet tall that has the big axe or whatever. Yeah, the little one seemed there was like the one they killed first seemed a little bit more manageable.

SPEAKER_03 32:16

Yeah. Um so fortunately it explodes.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Rapima Green. Uh this is this is the first part of the book where I was like, oh come on. There's like three in this this section. And it was when Rist blows up an orc, and they're all like, wow, crazy how nature do that, though. That's interesting.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

It's crazy that it just went kaboom kablau out of nowhere. Um yeah, it feels like there should have been more questions.

SPEAKER_02 32:53

Like that was that felt weird, right?

SPEAKER_01 32:56

I'm pretty sure Dan was knocked out. Kalen's laying there. Maybe Kalen's just bleeding at, you know, he's he's a they might have been concussed. They didn't believe in concussions back then, so yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:07

I don't know. Just seems like there should regardless, there should have been follow-up questions. Well, because then they all they all saw the body, which had been exploded. And then they they chop its head off. Yeah, that's tough. I like that they included the uh like how uncomfortable it would be to chop the head off of a dead thing and carry it. I did I did appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 33:27

I like everyone's just really grossed out by it. Like it's not a common occurrence, just have a head in a burlap sack back in town. And we're like, oh my god, what the fuck do you bring us?

SPEAKER_03 33:36

It was funny that Kyle's sort of tried to make it like a point of suspense, like, oh, but who's gonna win the proving? The guys who stole a bear or the guys who killed two giant trolls? Two legendary demonic creatures. Yeah, I think we've given it to CDR on this one.

SPEAKER_01 33:55

Yeah, what a what a fail by the yeah, it's just uh such a bad bully because you're like you're not quite a serial killer. Like they didn't like kill the boys and leave them in the woods. And you're and it's not like a you ever watch New Girl and Winston's really bad at pranks? Like it's either too small or too big. This is what's cut on pod, yeah. I know.

SPEAKER_03 34:15

I'm bringing it up. Way too big. Wait. For my trophy, I brought the heads of Kaelin, Dan, and Wrist. They're predators. Trust me, they were being really mean to me.

SPEAKER_01 34:28

Oh my god. But yeah, obviously they win the contest, and he gets to dance with his Kalen gets drunk, gets to dance with his hottie crushed. No kiss though. No, because he gets cock blocked. I know. Terrible. Which I loved. I'm glad they included that. That was classic boy shit. Yeah, Cahill writes really good bar scenes, for from in my opinion.

SPEAKER_03 34:50

They're pretty good, pretty believable. These are also like uh you know how like Rob Stark's supposed to be 14. You're like, no, absolutely not. I think these are pretty believable, like 18-year-olds. Oh, for sure. Yeah, they do feel like mid-to-late high school.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

But like if instead of going to school, you just hunted and trapped and blacksmithed, you know?

SPEAKER_03 35:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

Pretty believable.

SPEAKER_03 35:16

I like it. We like an age-appropriate protagonist. Um, so I'm sure you can draw this together for the proving obviously is very, very connected to the um remainder of the book. It's a super important plot point. Can you just tease out those connections for us?

SPEAKER_01 35:33

Yeah, actually, we really get to learn about the geopolitical implications of the glade and the environmental impact of the Uruk's uh incursion into their woodlands.

SPEAKER_03 35:42

And so obviously, they ruined all their pumpkins.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

Yeah, and so since we're gonna spend the rest of the book here, we clearly just leave the next page and never come back.

SPEAKER_03 35:52

Yeah. Yeah, after setting up the Uruk thing, um, I feel like we all know where it's going.

SPEAKER_04 35:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:58

And there's no point in discussing the inevitable raid on the glade from the Uruk. If those people are fucked, let's move on. Um, time to go deliver the mail or some shit. What are they doing? They're picking something up. No, they're delivering they're delivering metal works.

SPEAKER_01 36:16

It couldn't matter less. It is. It has nothing to do with the story.

SPEAKER_03 36:20

Yeah. Caitlin, I need you to go piss in another town. Yeah. Just get out of the glade so I can advance the plot. Um yeah, that's pretty that's pretty funny. Man, that is funny that the you know what? The proving has, I think, one purpose. It's Fritz is gonna be our fucking annoying Draco for the rest of the series, right? Like maybe.

SPEAKER_01 36:47

If you I guess we don't quite know in part one here, but it feels like it's set up for him to be a bit of a nemesis, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:55

He comes up enough.

SPEAKER_03 36:56

I hope not much because their whole beef stems from they just don't really like each other.

SPEAKER_01 37:04

Yeah, there's not even like a good reason.

SPEAKER_03 37:07

Because they fight like right at the start of the book, and it's just because they're teenagers and they're dumb. Yeah. Um, I don't know. Hopefully there's more to it than that. We'll see. Um do we even want to spare a word for the sister, or should we do a sister addendum?

SPEAKER_01 37:22

We'll do a sister addendum. There's like a one clear plot line there, but yeah, let's let's skip straight to the next one. See Schedule One, sister addendum.

SPEAKER_03 37:30

Okay. Um so he participates in a classic corporate bonding event, Axe the Ring Bar.

SPEAKER_01 37:38

Wait. Before we move on from the glade.

SPEAKER_03 37:42

I want to go to the I want to stay in the glade.

SPEAKER_01 37:45

Do you remember who your favorite character was from the entire village? No. Erdhart Hammersmith.

SPEAKER_03 37:56

Oh. Hey, what's up with that pornography ass name? Oh my god, it got me rock soft.

SPEAKER_01 38:02

That was unbelievable. So I don't know why they call him Hammersmith. They're like, he he had he had two chests. He was like barrels, two barrels in his chest. I fucking love that guy. Yeah, that guy is the anti-me. Do you ever watch um MST3K?

SPEAKER_03 38:22

Never even heard of MST3K.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

It's it was a a very uh I would say probably niche. It was like two guys who'd watch really bad old movies and just like make silly ad libs over them. It was very like 90s grainy.

SPEAKER_02 38:36

Is that called like Mystery Science Theater or something?

SPEAKER_01 38:38

Yeah, Mystery Science Theater 3000. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

Oh, the oh, that's where oh wow. Okay, yes, I do know what that is.

SPEAKER_01 38:43

Yes, yeah. So so much fun. But there the one that's stuck in my head, this is like since childhood that's stuck in my head. They watch one, like some spaceship movie, and the main character is Dave Ryder. He's always like barrel chested shirtless running around looking hot, so they just call him different names the whole time. And so that's all I was thinking with Erdhart Hammersmith is fridge large meat, butch, butch deadlift, bolt van der Huge, just such good names. That's funny.

SPEAKER_03 39:17

Somewhat related. I I picked up like an old say file of Persona 4 and have been playing through it. And uh the uh character name I chose in a past life is Fred Ducati. So I really love everyone calling me uh Ducati Chan.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

Oh, Ducati Chan.

SPEAKER_03 39:35

And uh Fred Ducati is a uh gay porn star I learned about. Uh he was uh big picture of him on a truck in Las Vegas. Wow. Perfect Fred Ducati. But he's also a high school student in Japan. I was also thinking uh I wanted to pull up the name of the protagonist of Left Behind. Uh we need to do a whole series on Left Behind.

SPEAKER_01 40:02

Is it Splint Chest Hair?

SPEAKER_03 40:06

It is not. Hold on.

SPEAKER_01 40:09

Is it punt speed chunk?

SPEAKER_03 40:11

Are these just MST names? Yeah, this is all for Dave Ryder. I have a whole list here. Oh, okay. Hold on. Rayford Steel. Oh, that's so good. Yeah, played by Nicolas Cage in the movie. I love that. Rayford. Don't call me Ray. Okay. Can you do the names of Eric and everyone written down?

SPEAKER_01 40:34

Speaking of laughs, we get to the bar, a new bar scene. We have a actually really fun actor and contest. I very much enjoyed it. A little drinking game with the boys. And our we have a little group in the corner that's looking a little suspicious, uh, which we find out is a father-son-son trio made up of Eric, cool son, Dalin, not that cool son, and angry son, who's like too stoic for his own good as a papa.

SPEAKER_03 41:04

Stoic, mysterious dad.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:06

Fan of these guys.

SPEAKER_01 41:07

Big fan, because the the boys hear a little rustle and a commotion outside after their bar night, and they go out to investigate. Kalen does, and he finds a little standoff between the Imperial Guard and his favorite drunk homie.

SPEAKER_03 41:24

Yeah. And we get I feel like this guy's gonna be a recurring villain, right? Guy's name starts with an F.

SPEAKER_01 41:32

Farda. Yeah, he's the Farda, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:34

He's like the Javert of this world. He's the you know, he will not rest until they capture uh Asen.

SPEAKER_01 41:40

And he does have like a cool shtick, which is like he flips a coin to decide if he's gonna kill people or not, which is always cool.

SPEAKER_03 41:48

Fantastic. Really well done, Cyho.

SPEAKER_01 41:50

I love it made me happy. This is a this is a spoiler for the second part, but he's like, I the only god I believe in is fate or something like that. Chapter 21.

SPEAKER_02 42:01

Oh, could we have a god corner?

SPEAKER_03 42:03

Yeah. There are gods out there. Yes. Or people believe in them, and I'm assuming that they are real.

SPEAKER_01 42:11

Yeah, I think that there is some sort of higher either demon power or like hero power out there.

SPEAKER_03 42:21

Yeah, because we get um Farday and the Fade both mention that they're just you know some sort of god that they're interested in, and presumably Theron and everyone else are not so into that god. So F Faltier is the not so good god. Sounds bad. Sounds kind of fine more to me. Yes. Um I don't know, that's like that's beyond the scope of book one, I think.

SPEAKER_01 42:50

I think so. I mean, we're we're not even a magic yet, man. We're in bar town. We're in bar sides. Brother, have you ever made a one-night drunk friend so good and so close to your heart that you you murdered an Imperial Guard for him?

SPEAKER_03 43:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 43:08

Oh, was it that same time in Vegas?

SPEAKER_03 43:11

I was staying at a hostel in France, and speak of Cahill, I met the most wonderful boys from Northern Ireland, and we had a big night in France, we were all in college, and I knew that I was going to Ireland the next summer with a pit stop in Northern Ireland. I was like, let's add me on Facebook, man. We love each other. And guess what? I reached out when I went to Northern Ireland, we had a big night on the town. Yes. I actually made a bar friend, and I love that I got in a drinking contest in a Northern Irish bar. Some random, kind of tough dude at a bar. The place we were there, like it was not a tourist place, there weren't a ton of Americans. And he challenged me to a full pint. Chug. Wow. I know. It was kind of unbelievable. And his northern Irish accent was so thick, I truly could not understand a word he was saying. It was very loud in there. But I knew enough that we absolutely had to had to chug bites together. And so we did. And you held your own. I'm proud of you. I won.

SPEAKER_01 44:19

I mean no, that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_03 44:22

My weird college was really into chugging full beers. Um I was somehow kind of practiced up on that. Not a lot to do in the middle of nowhere. No, yeah. Minnesota, you make your own fun man. Okay. Yeah, so they're they're off. Kaelin Kills is probably uh his first and I imagine not his last man.

SPEAKER_01 44:42

Not not his last in like the next 20 pages.

SPEAKER_03 44:45

Yeah, yeah, I guess so.

SPEAKER_01 44:47

He turns into a little killing machine. Yeah. But uh turns out the the new family that he's now on the side of is pretty good at fighting because they all whip out like double, you know, those cool double cross swords that are like on your back. I'm pretty sure that's what they had. And they whip them out.

SPEAKER_03 45:05

Oh, yeah. It doesn't actually I feel like that's a thing that's like in media, but like historically it's not a thing. And I'm pretty sure there's a line that Kyle's like, how the fuck do they even get it back in the in the sheath?

SPEAKER_01 45:17

He does talk about actually it's because Calen goes outside to return the like sword vest or whatever of one of the guys, or like he drops something behind whatever it is. But yeah, it turns out, yeah, you fight, you fight the Imperial Guard, now you're a criminal. So now they gotta run away.

SPEAKER_03 45:33

Yeah, what's what's up with this fucking big brother ass government? Everyone kills at least one cop.

SPEAKER_01 45:39

Unbelievable.

SPEAKER_03 45:40

Just let the boys be. Let them be. So those those, whatever. Their coworkers are headed to the glade to find Galen. I guess they know that he's from there.

SPEAKER_01 45:53

No, wait, before before we can we talk about the tunnel scene of them getting out of the town.

SPEAKER_03 45:59

Wait, is that I thought that was after.

SPEAKER_01 46:02

No, that's here.

SPEAKER_03 46:03

I thought that's like when they go to the other town post-glade.

SPEAKER_01 46:06

Oh, you're right. I got the two towns. All right, Cahill, to his detriment, is not very good at writing towns. They all have nothing interesting about them so far. So all the towns seem the same to me. And I can't tell you.

SPEAKER_03 46:23

Okay, nice. Yeah, sorry, we're not there yet. We're not quite there. Um, okay. So those guys are going to the glade. So where does Kalen go? Also to the Glade. He's got to save his family. Yeah, he's gonna. And uh spoiler, he does not. Facts.

SPEAKER_01 46:45

No.

SPEAKER_03 46:46

He gets some.

SPEAKER_01 46:48

It was pretty sad.

SPEAKER_03 46:49

That was a bummer. Wasn't expecting it.

SPEAKER_01 46:52

I wasn't expecting it. I thought he'd be more drawn out, if anything, like a little hostage scene or something. Like no. He just the Imperial guy just kills his dad, kills his mom.

SPEAKER_03 47:03

Pretty fucking unceremoniously, yeah. A little magic use there. People being bound up with air. Very interesting. Um that's tough, but uh thank goodness Eric and everybody are are around. I know they get whisked away. Yeah. There's a whole misinformation thing going on with Calon where he does not know that his sister has left the glade with the love of her life, so he thinks that she was killed along with the rest of his family when their house was burnt. Um I imagine the the truth will out at some point.

SPEAKER_01 47:38

Yes. I think we just pause Sister Plot entirely because that's all of it. She runs away with a lover, she escapes her family's death, she doesn't know where Kaelin is, he doesn't know where she is.

SPEAKER_03 47:48

Her dad hates Rhett because he didn't die in battle.

SPEAKER_01 47:51

He didn't save his son from like 800 orcs.

SPEAKER_03 47:56

That's a fucking lose-lose. Either you die in battle or you come home and your girlfriend's dad hates you.

SPEAKER_01 48:05

Yeah, it's it's not a what doesn't kill you makes you stronger situation.

SPEAKER_03 48:10

You should have died is such a tough position to have proof to a soldier.

SPEAKER_01 48:16

Is that is that the therapy that someone with survivor's guilt really needs?

SPEAKER_03 48:22

I know you feel guilty about surviving, but like you should. You should feel worse. You should kill yourself. Oh god. Okay. Yeah, tough one for Kalen's death, but we all have our problems. So I think now we are like fully in the travelog section of this novel. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:42

And the boys are true homies, they've now fled their village, even though their families didn't get killed. But now they're on the lamb and they've committed to their boy Kalen. Yeah. And I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 48:56

I this is a little bit of a uh type of plot I haven't always tended to love. Um just because I don't know, like this is the complaint about the first couple books of Wheel of Time, is it's like the boys on horseback or in a wagon, and then they visit a new town, they meet some people, and then oh shit, they get kind of found, and then they fight, and they're on to the next one. Um we'll see how long that this pattern repeats, but at least at the start, that is the pattern.

SPEAKER_01 49:28

Yeah, they're on the run. The father-son trio has a secret artifact of some kind that they're trying to smuggle away from the empire. They run into Urox again, but this time a giant warrior mage pops in and what it he creates a massive axe out of like fire magic and yeets it at or soul blade, baby. Soul blade. That was tight.

SPEAKER_03 49:53

Um a shard blade.

SPEAKER_01 49:54

So it turns out, of course, now we have like a roving band of like giant warriors, secret, secret dual wielding sword trios. We're assembling the troops.

SPEAKER_03 50:05

Big daddy Theron's out here too.

SPEAKER_01 50:07

We got an elf, we have a giant.

SPEAKER_03 50:12

Uh I think Theron's 10 million years old. He's 400. Give or give or take. They give his actual age? Pretty sure. I don't think that's right. Might be Jack's.

SPEAKER_02 50:25

Wait, so was all the Faye Mortem stuff?

SPEAKER_03 50:28

How long ago was that? I don't know. But we'll listeners, we're gonna do a little timeline research before the next episode. I was gonna say we'll pull that on the next one. Yeah. Uh we'll figure it out. Yeah, Theron's around uh him more than more than just a humble bard, I think it's safe to say.

SPEAKER_01 50:45

Yeah, and the little package that they're carrying starts whispering to our boy Kaylin in the night. It's a chicken. It's a chicken. It's a fucking oh my god, is that a chicken? Can we please have a magic chicken?

SPEAKER_03 51:04

It's fun to have those.

SPEAKER_01 51:05

Actually, to be fair, um Sanderson pulled out the magic chickens. So good for him.

SPEAKER_03 51:10

Right. But isn't it like not a chicken?

SPEAKER_01 51:12

No, it's like a yeah, soul sucking creature or whatever.

SPEAKER_03 51:15

Yeah, I guess they don't have birds, so they just call everything a chicken. That's a good bit. Good bit, Sando.

SPEAKER_01 51:20

Good for him. Okay. Um, but yeah, they start thinking that Kalen might in fact be the chosen one.

SPEAKER_03 51:27

Should we talk about the fade?

SPEAKER_01 51:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:30

Let's talk about the fade. Uh can you say some stuff while I Google and figure out if fade is just a wheel of time creation or if it's like a larger fantasy thing.

SPEAKER_01 51:41

Yeah. Um fades are kind of scary. He creeps out of the shadows, seems somewhat immune to magic, and uh turns out really hard to fight. So they run into him in the woods, or Theron runs into him in the woods, is like, oh shit, if the fade is here, our boys that are saying at the end down the street are probably in some danger. Um but he pulls some magic out of his ass and sprints his way back to town and gets away from the fade for now. But the fade comes back, as we will see. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 52:18

Did some real, real quick and dirty research.

SPEAKER_02 52:22

I think a fade might have been a Robert Jordan original.

SPEAKER_01 52:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 52:28

But here's the question.

SPEAKER_03 52:32

Why would it be bad to include a fade? But not bad to include an elf. Yeah, there's not. Because I know that it the inclusion of a fade has has garnered some negative responses online. Oh, really? People don't like that there's a fade. They're like, that is literally the wheel of time beast. Don't do that.

SPEAKER_01 52:55

I actually had more issue with the Urak than I did with the fade. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 53:06

That didn't bother me. I was just like, whatever, it's an orc. It is what it is. And you know, orcs have the same history as elves. Like we you know, because it's a well-known fantasy creature. I don't know. Yeah, it's just fade feels wrong, but like if I if I were writing a book, I wouldn't put like the parsendi in it. Yeah. Right? I don't know. Maybe it's just a time thing. It's just like elves are now public domain, but fades are still trademarked. I didn't have a problem with it. That's because I've only read two books of a wheel of time. You probably didn't even clock that as a wheel of time thing. You're the ideal reader. Yeah. Yeah, this is great. I mean, they are a little different than fades.

SPEAKER_01 53:46

Oh, it'd come with some slag. It's his first book, man. We had a great, yeah. I guess. Let him let him loose. Let him live.

SPEAKER_03 53:53

Thing is, fades are sick as hell, so you know, if I get to read more of them, I'm into it.

SPEAKER_01 53:58

And we get a couple good scenes with the fade. Um the fade, so plot here. The fade triggers Theron to run back to town where the boys are under attack by the Imperial Guard. They try fighting them pretty successfully. They kill a lot of folks. Kalen's now killed like five guys at this point. Yeah, body count high.

SPEAKER_03 54:18

Still never kissed a girl.

SPEAKER_01 54:20

No, but they do get split up. Uh, who is it? Uh, Dan and Kalen and Eric run to a tunnel, which is conveniently there because Eric flipped a coin to see if it was going to be the right door. That's a good bit. He's like, You flipped a fucking coin. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 54:37

The audiobook narrator had a field day with that line delivery. So good.

SPEAKER_02 54:41

You flipped a fucking coin.

SPEAKER_03 54:44

That was about his exact delivery. It was great.

SPEAKER_01 54:47

And then those boys, they get my favorite scene in this entire section, which is where A son lights basically lights a lamp with magic in the tunnel, and Dan fucking flings himself against a wall. Yeah. There's magic in the world.

SPEAKER_03 55:02

It was a Looney Tunes ass, someone jumping out of their own skin reaction to a magical lamp.

SPEAKER_01 55:09

It's like, brother, you've seen some shit already. You've seen a unicorn. Did you catch the part where Dan nobody believes that Dan has seen a unicorn? That's that's good.

SPEAKER_03 55:19

That's good. Yeah. Man, talk about shit I don't see in fantasy anymore. No. Unicorn. Um yeah, that was great response by Dan. Very funny. Uh maybe he's a little slow on the uptake. That would make sense for kind of his character.

SPEAKER_01 55:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:35

He's the charmer. He's not the uh actually, is he a charmer? Maybe his personality is just annoying. I think he's like class count class clown. Class clown. Gotcha. Yeah. He's is he a pleasure to have in class? No, not as a teacher. Wrist is a pleasure to have in class. That boy's reading all the time.

SPEAKER_01 55:54

Yeah, wrist studies. He does the homework. Dan, Dan's the kind of kid though that like secretly the teacher loves and is sad to see go by the end of the year. Yeah. They have banter.

SPEAKER_03 56:04

He just the teacher just wants him to try like 10% harder. You scallywag. You're not living up to your potential. On the other side of the city, um, is it Eric who's with him or is his brother?

SPEAKER_01 56:16

It's it's Dalin and Wrist who are separated.

SPEAKER_03 56:18

Yeah. So Dalin um absolutely fucks it. Yeah. Doesn't try to protect Wrist at all, just gets basically lets the fade take him, and Kalen is pissed.

SPEAKER_01 56:32

I mean, as he should be. Do you really okay? No, no, this is one of those like everyone's right and nobody's wrong situations, or everybody's right and everybody's wrong, where Dalin's not gonna fight a fade. He's seen some shit in the world. He tried to fight the fade. He got knocked unconscious. Well, yeah, that's what I'm saying. Well, he's not gonna like what he's doing. This is a classic, this is a classic uh Vars and Haim situation.

SPEAKER_03 56:57

Is that something I've read?

SPEAKER_01 56:59

That is Kalen's dad and brother, dead brother.

SPEAKER_03 57:02

Oh, oh, okay, okay, yeah, sorry. Classic.

SPEAKER_01 57:08

How dare you not defeat this evil creature of legend alone? You let him take my boy.

SPEAKER_03 57:15

I guess it's not a rational reaction by Kalen. Has his friend got taken.

SPEAKER_01 57:21

It's a mother's. Side note, do you think Kalen's brother is actually dead? Because I don't.

SPEAKER_02 57:32

You know, I have remarked on that before.

SPEAKER_03 57:37

We talked about this a lot in the Will of the Many.

SPEAKER_01 57:43

He went off to fight the orcs. He just kind of died off screen. Rhett came back. Rhett said everybody got killed. Rhett could have just fled.

SPEAKER_02 57:55

That's interesting.

SPEAKER_03 57:58

Alright. Putting the doctors. Yeah. I got some feelers out there. We'll send some field agents out to see. Um yeah, good shout. Okay, is there that much? Because basically, wrist is it's sort of a weird set of affairs where he gets taken by the fade, but um he's just being taken to magic school.

SPEAKER_01 58:21

Just like, oh, you're you're going to magic camp with the Empire.

SPEAKER_03 58:24

Yeah. And they do have a funny chat where they're like, yes, it's not ideal that he got taken by a fade. However, pretty low priority, he's actually going to be treated great.

SPEAKER_01 58:33

And they're like, and also we're not going to charge the magic tower full of very strong people.

SPEAKER_03 58:41

And, dude, talk about a not wheel of time thing. Kalen and Dan hear this and they say, that makes a lot of sense, my friend. Maybe let's not go try to charge the magic tower.

SPEAKER_01 58:53

Yeah, this was a really interesting change of pace for me reading Kalen's like very quick rationalization in the face of like new evidence. He's he is very quick to be like, Oh, you know what? You're what you're saying has some merit.

SPEAKER_03 59:08

Like it's really sad that that's like a good thing in a book that people fabricate so much tension by having people act irrationally that when people behave like actual humans, it's like, oh, what a relief.

SPEAKER_01 59:21

And it was so nice to have Dan like actually be on the side of it. Like, you know what? Yeah, he's our friend, but this seems like the better bet. Like, we didn't have this weird side plot where Dan went off solo because he felt Kaylin betrayed his buddy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 59:36

I wonder. Yeah, I so I'm wondering like what Rist's plot is gonna look like. I am does he go through with Magic School? Does he stay and he's like an inside agent? He's like, teach me everything you know so I can blow you fuckers up later. Or does the propaganda get to him? Does he drink a little Kool-Aid Caitlin and Dan be wrist later?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:00

I mean, he could be pretty mad that his friends abandoned him and never tried to save him. I'm actually super intrigued. Like it could go truly any direction. But I'm extremely.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:12

I'd also just be pretty into a small wrist in school arc, and we learn more about the magic and all of the uh how the mages are like involved in the empire shit.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:25

You mean after the hierarchy series, you're ready for another academy?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:29

Okay, but it would be the first in this series, not him going to a series of schools within one series.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:36

Well, Calen's about to go to Dragon Academy, so I mean.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:41

Yeah. It's all fourth wing at the end of the day. Everyone's just rewriting Fourth Wing, even if it came out before Fourth Wing. Is Fourth Wing peak? Is it peak? I'll put that to I'll put that one to you. Charles, is Fourth Wing peak?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:57

Peak. There you have it, folks. Um, but yeah, pretty much that's the end of it. I mean, we we figure out that what they have been smuggling, I think they called it like the Velacian or something early in the book, it's really a dragon egg, perhaps the last dragon egg available to from the icy lands beyond the sea or whatever. And the dragon likes Kalen and it decides to hatch itself and be its baby.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:25

And it speaks to him in his brain. It calls to him. Drawlade. It says like blood and then dragon rider in French. Yeah. Pretty cool. Um they got like a little mind melt thing going on.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:39

Yeah, so he's gonna be a dragon rider. And it's uh, I think they explain it's a symbol also for the rebellion because the last Dragon Riders got wiped out and they haven't seen one in hundreds of years. Yada yada. Yeah. Kalen is now a symbol.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:53

Yeah, that's a pretty good setup for a fucking monstrous war at some point in this series. Hell yeah. Yeah. Oh, also a little note. Um, Kalen has Theron's sword. Oh, yes. What's up with that?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:08

Yeah, so apparently Theron and Vars, who is Kalen's papa, who is a blacksmith in the glade.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:15

Was a blacksmith in the glade.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:17

They go way back, and very uh silver heron of his papa. Uh, he gives him the sword that he used back in the world.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:26

Don't act like you know about the wheel of time.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:28

Okay, you gotta give me some credit. That was a good reference off the cuff.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:31

Heronmark Blade, man. Yeah. Where do you get that? Um, yeah, no, it's very like that. I am excited to learn more about uh what the deal is with his dad. We know he went off and like fought elsewhere, but it seems like he there's more to it than that. He wasn't just a soldier. And Theron says like he knew his dad.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:52

Yeah, I mean he gave him a sword. He was a good guy.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:54

Yeah, yeah, I'm excited to learn a little bit more. Is Kalen's dad secretly 400 years old? Think about that. I don't think so. And if so, really problematic age gap between uh his dad and his mom.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:07

Helpfully, I will say Kahel does a good job of like not making this totally unbelievable that like Kalen's dad was like the best swordsman in the village by far, and like trained him. Like it was he wasn't like a far long hammercock who fights with two giant anvils and buff big chest. Coming in swimming. Put an anvil on the end of a tree trunk as my he's wearing the bear pelt from the woods from the proving. I have ten wives.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:40

My arms are the size of a house. Yeah. I hope he comes back.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:44

I hope he comes back.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:46

Yeah. Yeah, he should have had 10 wives. What's going on with that? Um I don't even want to. You know what? We always do predictions, and it feels just like a token thing we do because we don't know how to end the episode.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:00

I've already thrown my prediction out there. Should we just the brother thing? I think we just but there's brothers still secretly alive somewhere.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:08

Oh, okay. Um, I'll lodge one. Um we watched a little sword art online when you were in town, uh, which by the way is is it peak?

SPEAKER_01 1:04:17

Oh, it's peak. It's peak.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:21

In many ways, it's not peak at all, but in other ways it's pretty peak.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:27

Talk about a protagonist we could not figure out in our four episodes of watching this on the couch.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:33

Okay. I have no outlet. There's no one on earth who would want to hear about Sword Art Online, which maybe suggests I shouldn't talk about it on the pod, but I actually do want to give like two minutes of this show. One of the I've never been so flow mixed by a show. The the gist of it is that there's there's an MMO, like a virtual reality MMO, a Warcraft style game for those for for the non-nerds out there. Um and there people are playing this, and you have to like fucking put on a helmet and it like puts you in a coma and you can really play this game. And turns out the game is run by uh evil crazy guy, and he says, You can't leave the game, you live here now. Only way to get out is to beat it. Kind of a fun, you know. I mean it's a fun premise. Yeah, it's a fun premise. It's a fun premise. That for two episodes, the protagonist is like a kind of shy boy who plays the game alone. And at some point in the third episode, he becomes a completely different man. And it's so hard to give a sense of how fucking quick this this heel turn is. But at some point, like a group of people are talking, and our our once shy, mild mannered protagonist is in the back of the group and he starts cackling evilly. Just like full sinister villain laugh, and then everyone's like, What is this fucking crazy? Person doing in the back laughing, and it cuts to him, and he's like, I'm actually the greatest player of all time, and I play alone because no one can fucking hang with me, and you're all a bunch of pussies, and I'm gonna win. I'm not locked in here with you, you're locked in here with me. And we'd just seen an hour of this just being a shy, nice boy. It was the weirdest, I just could not believe what I was seeing. No one told me this was gonna be a good show, but I just have never seen someone like in episode three be like, you know what? I kind of wasn't fucking with this character in the first two episodes. I'm gonna make him a totally different guy.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:39

It was very jarring. I mean, we came in very cold and we watched what, I think, four episodes of the show, and he is a completely different person every 20 minutes. I I I'm not gonna watch any more of it, but I'd like I'd like an explanation.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:54

I mean, it was tell me, don't get me wrong, it was peak, but I will never watch another minute of that show. Um and maybe that's where we leave it with a little sort out online. Um yeah, that's it. We'll be back in a week with the remainder of this book. We're only doing two apps because I think it's 200 pages is like a sweet spot for us. Pretty quick. This is about a 400-page book. You do the math, folks. And you know what's funny? Did you look at the suggested reading orders at the start of the book?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:30

No, but I didn't.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:32

Or does your edition not have that?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:34

I don't well, I'm just on the Kindle, so I don't think it had it, but we did get a couple notes from very kind listeners who asked us which order we were reading the series in. And um I had no idea there was a non-chronological order.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:49

So I unwittingly bought the special edition broken binding uh edition of the book, which is signed by Kyle, which I love. And now I have to buy all the special editions because what am I gonna have? An unmatching set? Ew. So he has a a little note on reading order, and he's he's he's created two paths through the series, uh, each named after a sword form in the world. There's the Svidaria path or the Palencyer Path. The only difference between these two paths is that you either read the fall novella first or second. Well, we're gonna read it second, that's the only difference in reading order. Yeah, yeah, we're on the felonseer path, of course, which you know makes sense because we are the kind of reader who prefers a slower burn immersing ourselves completely in a world learning the intricacies and terminology as we go. But hypothetically, if you prefer to jump headfirst into a world letting the action high stakes consume you, then the Svidaria is the path for you.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:53

I don't understand why we wouldn't. How about that? This path feels very normal.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:00

This feels normal. Yeah. I'm really excited to read The Fall. Um it's only 90 pages. But I just think it's so funny that he had a whole note about whether you should read the prequel first or second. Yeah. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:12

Just fucking do whatever.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:14

Yeah. It doesn't justify separate names for the reading order. I there's not like a maybe it will, though. Maybe I'll read the fall and it'll just like Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:24

Do I get like a special prize for reading the Silmarillion or whatever? I don't know. The Felon Sear Path? No, the I was saying the Tolkien, like actually reading the hobby.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:36

I don't know. It doesn't Oh, I thought I thought you were making a joke and calling calling it the Silmarillion path. Okay, we've completely run out of juice. We have to stop. But we did a good job, and please come back next week. Yeah. Please clap. Yeah, I mean, please clap. Honestly, we gave this our all, and I hope that you recognize that. Um Travis, uh, parting word, just one word. Erhard Hammersmith.