OneMind Dogs - From the Dog's Perspective
OneMind Dogs - From the Dog's Perspective
Pamela Harju discusses the importance of dogs for our mental health | Episode 3
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Pamela Harju has a remarkably interesting background! First of all, she is very international; she speaks multiple languages and is originally from Finland, and has been living in Ireland for over 20 years.
When Pamela is not busy with her dogs, she enjoys live music and writes fiction – she has published six books. Look at her website for more information on the books.
In this episode, we’ll hear inspiring stories about what Pamela has learned from her dogs and also how important the role of dogs can play in life. Sometimes a dog can be the most important support when someone is feeling lonely and even being bullied at school.
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pamelaharju
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/pamelaharju
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pamelaharju
Website: https://www.pamelaharju.com
Website for our agility club: https://www.runasone.ie
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You are listening to the One Mind Dogs from the Dog's Perspective podcast. Hi, it's your host, Nora Keskevari, and we are here to talk about personal dog journeys and how we can be the best possible dog owners from the dog's perspective, of course. I'm super passionate about understanding the dog's perspective and with that helping others to have a happy and balanced life with their dogs. It is always very inspirational to hear it from others, their journey with their dogs, and learning more about the dog's perspective. Today I'm excited to have an opportunity to talk with someone very international and someone who has very interesting background. When she's not busy with her dogs, she enjoys live music and writes fiction. She has published six books. I bet we will hear more about that later as well. Today we will talk with Pamela Haryu from Ireland and hear more about her fascinating story. Pamela, welcome to the podcast.
SPEAKER_01Thank you very much, Nora. Very pleased to be here.
SPEAKER_00Hey, let's start with something about yourselves. So please introduce yourselves to me and our listeners.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, my name is Pamela, and um yeah, I was born in Finland and moved to Ireland uh nearly 21 years ago. Um, spent half my life actually in Ireland at this point. I've had dogs since I was about eight years old. And um, when I was 11 years old, I started agility with my first dog who was um German Shepherd Cross. Basically, I have been doing agility ever since. So it's um it's a lifelong passion and um basically couldn't imagine my life without it, to be honest. It's such a big part of my life at this stage. Um, having dogs and doing sports, even a big part of my social life, obviously, you know, the friends you make in the sport, it's it's a big part of my life.
SPEAKER_00Oh, how interesting. Did you start actually then back in Finland or in the Ireland?
SPEAKER_01I started agility in Finland, yeah, in my in my hometown, um Pietrasari.
SPEAKER_00So you were young when you got your first dog. Do you remember uh before that time? Like, did you already know really earlier and that you like someday you will get your own dog? Or what's the um background of that?
SPEAKER_01I think I always did, and I think we will have had dog dogs before. Um the fact was that my older sister actually was allergic to dogs, and for a long time my family thought that we couldn't have a dog because of that. Extended family will have had dogs. My my cousin actually had the golden retriever when I was growing up, and I loved that dog. Um, I was just really besotted with that dog, and I think especially my dad recognized early on that I was I was a dog person. So when I was eight years old, um, and my sister then will have been in her early teens, um, we decided we were going to try getting a dog and basically just got the dog on a trial period, and we will see how it went with my sister. Like, will she have a very bad reaction? And we were actually very lucky uh that dog that we got didn't give her any allergy symptoms, so we were able to keep that dog. Um, and then it was just kind of downhill from there. Couldn't imagine um a life without dogs. Then I uh a few years later got my uh first miniature schnauzer, and schnauzers have been what I've stuck with ever since.
SPEAKER_00Oh wow, that's a lovely story, and I can imagine how happy you were at that time with your sister.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it was it was a very exciting time for us both. Very exciting.
SPEAKER_00Uh, it's a lot of emotions that you can actually get from dogs, and for children when they uh start doing something together with the dogs, I think that's also a very educational from the emotional side as well.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely it is. Like being being a child, being a teenager, then um I spent basically all of my time with that dog. Um, he was my best friend, absolutely. I spent so much time then um in training, going for walks, uh competitions. Um it's it's I think it's just a different bond. And I was I was actually bullied in school. I didn't have very many friends. So having that that dog was just everything to me. And then making friends then outside of school was it was a really big uh big thing for me.
SPEAKER_00What is the one thing that actually inspires you and motivates you in dogs?
SPEAKER_01Um, I think it's just they are the most honest creatures on this earth, like and nobody loves you like your dog, and they are so so open about their affection. And I think that's something we could really learn from our dogs. They are honest, they're loving, and they are not ashamed to show that. Like they they are very open about it. And I think that's it's just that love and affection, and it goes both ways. It's um it's it's like anything else. Um there's nothing else like that on this on this earth.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's well said. Um yeah, I'm already thinking about like um we should maybe uh even write a blog post about what you just said.
SPEAKER_01That's the writer in me, I imagine.
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's correct. Uh, I almost forgot about that. Uh, so that's something I will then ask from you. Oh, um, one my dogs is all about the dogs' point of view and about learning how dogs learn, and and everything we teach is about seeing the world from the dog's uh perspective and especially having fun together so that both of them, uh like the people and the dogs are having fun together. And in this podcast, we want to share real life stories about how learning more about the dog's perspective has actually impacted the life with dogs, especially. And Pamela, you have joined One of My Dogs community soon 10 years ago. Um, can you share us a little bit like how did you get started with One My Dogs?
SPEAKER_01I was actually really surprised when you said 10 years ago. I didn't realize it was that long. Um I actually I don't remember when I first signed up. I didn't go premium until um maybe a few years ago, but it was always there. Um, I suppose I will have looked up some of the free content, but I don't I don't remember how I joined first. I suppose um the Finnish connection probably was what brought brought me to it first, knowing that it was a Finnish-started company and then having that connection. And I guess I will have known some of the names because I used to do agility in Finland, and I will have known some of the people, people behind it. And it's like, oh wow, those were some of the top handlers. These are the people I want to learn from. Um, but I think it's just for me, because I mostly trained by myself, it's been really amazing having that support um just from someone else, rather than always just looking at your own videos and going, well, what did I do wrong? It's just amazing having somebody else's opinion. Um it's it's really life-changing, actually.
SPEAKER_00Right. Well, that's um that's a good um good good story. And it's true that um when the internet became a little bit bigger and bigger all the time, it's it's easy to then um spread the word. And that's why we have actually founded the company in the first place. Um, so um, so that's great to hear. Um, when you if you think about like uh learning, training dogs and and learning more about the dog's perspective, what do you think is like your biggest light bulb moment or eye-opener uh when you think of it?
SPEAKER_01I think for me, the biggest thing I have learned is about the connection on an agility course. And even maybe thinking back to past failures, you know, where things have gone wrong on a course, maybe it could have been a big competition, or you know, you're on your second to last obstacle, and then your dog took an off-course obstacle or something, and you kind of realize, oh, it was a dropped connection. Um so that's been a real life life changer for me, it's been okay, I need to keep that connection. It's not really something that I I was aware of before, and now it does make perfect sense once once I'm aware of it, and it's something that I I definitely focus on a lot more.
SPEAKER_00Is there something that you could say that um other than the connection part, um maybe outside even agility, uh, is there something that you have changed, your own behavior, when you started to learn more about the dog's perspective?
SPEAKER_01I don't know if I've really changed anything, but I think what I have really um started focusing more on is that they are dogs and they will never be anything else. Like I said, they're very honest creatures, they are dogs, and they always will be. And it's so important to remember that they're not furry humans, they are dogs. So you need to, whatever you do with your dog, you need to remember that this is a dog, moves like a dog, looks like a dog, sounds like a dog, and thinks like a dog, and most importantly, thinks like a dog. Um, so I think that's that's really important. And it's say if you have like a behavioral problem with your dog, you can't start solving it as a human being. You need to think about how you're going to solve it from the dog's point of view, how it's going to make sense for the dog, not what makes sense for me. And it's not necessarily the same thing, and it's quite rarely probably is the same thing because we think differently.
SPEAKER_00Um, that's nice to hear. Uh, that's what that's what I love about, for example, these podcast episodes that we are able to also share this fact uh from these different angles and different uh perspectives from each because everyone is experiencing it a little bit different way. Well, dog training, and especially like when you compete in in dog sports, there are lots of challenges, but the challenges are the ones that actually teach us the most and educate us. What do you think are your biggest kind of hurdles you have faced during your training journey with with your dogs or like biggest challenges? And how did you overcome them?
SPEAKER_01Um, there's always challenges with dogs, and I don't think you ever really get the perfect dog. There's always going to be something about the dog's behavior that's annoying. Um biggest challenges. Um, I don't know anything in um in general. I'm having a bit of an issue with my younger dog at the moment. We have two cats, primarily outdoor cats, and he's very obsessed with those two cats. Um, and I think obsessions in dogs are usually the hardest to deal with. Actually, I had a Jack Russell who was who was very easily obsessed with anything, and it's just trying to divert them away away from um those obsessions because it's so consuming, both for the dog, like you can see how stressed they are, and also they become quite distracting for us because you know you see the dog is stressed and they can't focus on anything else. So I think those are the the hardest challenges for me. And I think certain dogs just they they can be quite obsessive. Um, usually the livelier dogs. My my younger dog is very full of energy, so I think now in the winter time maybe he doesn't get to do as much exercise, doesn't get to do as much agility, and he just needs to need something else to let his energy on. So then it becomes the obsession. So it's just trying to keep them busy with something else. Um, I think is is the key. But yeah, those are the hardest ones, I think.
SPEAKER_00Right. And it's always like when we are having like um several dogs in our lives, um, they are all different, and you always learn new things, and then you um it's not like you never know what the new dog is like, and then you have to restart everything, and then you will do new mistakes, and you have to yeah, absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I think that's one of the best things about dogs is that every dog will teach you something different. Like Hector, my younger one, is two years old, and in the two years that I've had him, he's taught me so much about dogs and not just about dogs, but also about life. Does he have a different life perspective from any of my previous dogs? It's just they're so different, even if you have the same breed, they are also different.
SPEAKER_00Tell me more about him. Like, how is the life uh perspective of his? He he loves life.
SPEAKER_01That's the that's the main thing I can say about Hector is that he loves life, he is just so full of energy, and everything is so exciting. Whether we're going for a walk or we're going to do agility or we're going somewhere in the car or seeing the cats through the window, everything is just so exciting. Or if you know, if if I mention the T-word for treat, that's very exciting. Anything, he's just he's just so enthusiastic, and I wish I could have a bit more of that sometimes rather than going, oh no, do I have to do this? He's always just so enthusiastic. Um, but he's also um he's very smart, he's possibly the smartest dog I've ever had, and he really keeps me on on my toes because he's actually a great problem solver. Um, so um, if he say wants to figure out a way to get out of the garden, he will get out of the garden, and it doesn't matter how high the fence is, he'll figure it out. So he is um yeah, he's he's teaching me a lot about um about that and how how smart they actually can be. Like dogs can be so smart, it's actually incredible, and they can totally out outsmart us when they want to. And I think sometimes our dogs train us as much as we train them, you know. They figure out, oh, if I do this, I'll get a treat, and then they will keep keep doing that.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. Well, uh Hector sounds um great fun, to be honest.
SPEAKER_01Yes, he's definitely that. I'm I'm having a lot of fun with him.
SPEAKER_00That's great. Uh when you look at your um like the whole journey with dogs, um, what would be if you want if you would mention like one or two things, like the real top highlights of of that journey?
SPEAKER_01Oh, um there are so many, and I think with a different dog, um, the highlights might be might be different. With my older dog, um Dexter, who's my miniature schnellster, we recently, actually in the last competition of 2022, we went up to the highest um competitive grade in Ireland, which was which had been my goal for a long time. So I was very, very pleased with that. So that will say be my highlight um with him. But I think in in general, you know, it mightn't be even like winning awards or certificates or winning up the grades or anything like that. Like sometimes it's just that you know when things click, like you feel like you're really understanding each other, or it could be things like say on an agility course, maybe your dog was really struggling with the weave, and when you see that moment when they go, Oh, now I understand. So I think with different dogs, it's always been different, different things. But I think for me it's just I think it's just been having the chance to have all these different dogs and learn different um things from them. And I um say Hector now is my is the seventh dog I train in agility. And I think just being able to learn from these dogs, it's um it's just um I feel very privileged. I feel very, very lucky to have had all these dogs in my life. They're just they're I think they just make life worth living, really.
SPEAKER_00Right, that sounds really um inspiring. Um, and we are I think we and and the listeners uh with me are uh looking forward to see some of your videos. So I will link also some of your um videos um in this uh description so that everyone can go and have a look how what type of dogs you are actually running with and training with. Um when we think about like in uh uh in in the way that uh like maybe in a bigger picture, uh not necessarily people who are um into dog sports or dog training. Um if your neighbor, for example, or your friend would be getting their first ever dog, what tips would you tell them? Like what are the top tips to tell to first-time dog owner?
SPEAKER_01Uh first of all, do your research. I think, and it was really uh clear during COVID, you know, when there were lockdowns and people took dogs, they did not do their research. They don't, they just didn't understand how big a commitment it is to have a dog and how how long dogs live and what it takes to actually have dogs. They need exercise and care, and they're quite expensive to keep. You need to feed them. There's the vet pills and and everything. So just do your research and think it through. Uh, that will be the main thing. And make sure that you're taking the right type of dog. You know, if you have a small apartment, then you probably don't want a border collie that's not going to have you know the space to move and room to run around. And so research the breed or whatever dog you're getting, even if it's a rescue dog, and to take the time to train the dog. Um, and if you're a first-time owner, maybe you don't know how to do it. So, you know, sign up for classes or um or get a dog trainer, or even you know, go online and and um to the places like one mind dogs that have great poppy classes, just get that help because I think in in Ireland it's actually a big issue that um people just don't train their dogs and then they end up abandoned because they have behavioral problems. So it's just important to give the dog the I suppose the chance to succeed at being a good pet and being a good family dog, like um anybody else, you know, they need to be shown how to do things. Like we go to school for a reason, we go there to learn things, and likewise dogs need to have that chance to to learn as well.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's that's really good. And that made me think also like, uh, what do you think are the biggest differences in dog ownership in general in in Finland and in Ireland?
SPEAKER_01Oh, huge, huge differences, actually. Um, I think in Finland um mostly people value their dogs um and they take good care of them. I'm not saying that that's always the case. Unfortunately, it is not, but in Ireland, and I actually it it annoys me as a dog owner when I'm out walking my dogs. A lot of the time dogs are just let to you know roam freely in the garden and then they get out onto the road and you're walking by with your dogs on the lead, and a complete strange, completely strange dog comes at your dogs, and it's really scary, both for me as an owner, because I don't know what those dogs are like. And obviously for my dogs as well, they don't there's a total stranger coming towards them, and you know, that could attack them. Um, people don't really go for walks with their dogs, um at least in a countryside, so they're just let to do that. Um and unfortunately, there is a lot of dogs abandoned and a lot of stray dogs. Um, I think it's um especially in the countryside, it's just it's just kind of a dumb thing you have like the farm farm dog that just does what it wants, and then dogs aren't neutered, so obviously then there's a lot of unwanted puppies, which I know a lot of people in Finland don't neuter their dogs, and still it it's not really an issue. Like there's not really um shelters full of unwanted dogs or puppies. So yeah, I think it's just uh the the fundamentally it's um it's about understanding the value of the animal. Um, and I don't really know where that comes from. I would it's probably just a different lifestyle. Um, like I said, with the with the farms in Ireland always have a dog, and it's people don't really think about it anymore. It's just a dog, whereas maybe in Finland it's actually a valued family member.
SPEAKER_00Right, yeah. Um, that might be also the case. Um, like it's the the case is every uh different in every country, I would say, as well. And it depends like in the urban area and in the countryside, it's it's different, and that's why I I feel personally that's it's very important to raise the awareness of of this topic and also the the awareness of how to teach dogs and educate them and and uh what works best. And it's obviously the dog's perspective and understanding that it's the it's a best start. Yes, it is. Um, okay. What um now I want to hear more about your other passion, the writing passion. You mentioned me that you have published six fiction books, is that right?
SPEAKER_01That's correct. Yeah, five novels, and then my last one was a collection of uh short stories.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Hey, tell us more. How do you combine everything in your life? Like what like the things that you are doing, and tell me tell us more about um the writing as a hobby or work.
SPEAKER_01I'm not sure which is yeah, it's it's somewhere between a hobby and and a work. I suppose I would love to be a full-time writer one day, but um, I just don't make enough money from it as of yet. Uh so I have a have a daytime job, full-time job. Um, yeah, I suppose it's it's another thing that I got into when I was very, very young. Um, as a child, I just started making up stories and and I still haven't stopped and I still have loads of ideas. Um, it's just it is finding the time because I have two dogs and I, you know, have a full-time job, and like everybody, I have a house to look after and all that, um, other other life. But um, yeah, I think um like writing is a bit more like my daytime job as well, sitting in front of a computer and it's quite a lonely, isolated um thing to do, um, which is I think why I like having dogs then and doing the agility so I get out and uh I can then go and be active and um and that rather than sit and stare at the uh at the screen all the time. Um, but yeah, it is definitely a passion, um passion of mine, and I can't um can't really imagine not writing it. The reason I write is that I keep getting these ideas and they won't leave me alone until I write them.
SPEAKER_00Um that's so inspiring as well. Uh like currently product producing content is is very like top, top, top currently, and it's required. In many places, but also it's a really efficient tool to impact uh in topics that you want to do. Like, what are your tips for people who would like to write, but they are not writers, but they have something to say. For example, in Dog World, now we might have a lot of people that have a lot of things that they would like to do, but how would you get them started uh in a way that they don't feel overwhelmed from the beginning?
SPEAKER_01Well, the first thing um I will say, you just need to get started. Just start writing. It's like anything else, the more you do it, the more natural it feels. And start start small, like say if you wanted to become a fiction writer, you probably don't want to start writing a thousand-page novel first. You maybe start with a two-page short story, and the same will go with anything, even if it's fact-based writing. So maybe you don't want to write a full uh book on dog training. Maybe you you just start the blog where you know there are two three-minute reads um or whatever. And the other thing that's really, really important is um just read, read, read, read, read anything, magazines, newspapers, blogs, um, books, whatever. And the more you read, the more natural again it feels to form sentences and you'll understand the structure. And um, yeah, the the more you do it, the more natural it will feel again.
SPEAKER_00That's great. Great. Uh, there are great tips. And I think uh with dog training and writing, uh, what's like from my perspective, it's the ability to stay consistent. And even it's a small thing that you would do only five minutes with dogs and five minutes of writing something, it's just keeping that like as a routine, so it's it's always like same struggle, struggle when you build new routines.
SPEAKER_01So, yeah, it is, yeah. And likewise, again, with dog training, you need to get started too. It you know, if you have a behavioral problem, you're like, I need to fix that, I need to fix that. It's not going to get fixed unless you go out and start doing it.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. Um, hey, from again, like uh from the big perspective, um, now the world has been changing quite a bit in terms of dog ownership, and um we maybe mentioned that already a little bit, but now that I think the change during the past I think five years has been really dramatic, and the whole pet care industry is kind of, in my opinion, in a mess. So there are lots of players from different aspects, and like, and I think it's very good because in five years I would estimate that we can see that what the pet care ecosystem will be. Um, if there is like if you would mention one thing that you would change in the world to make the world a better place for dogs, what would that be?
SPEAKER_01I would like people to understand dogs, and I would like people to understand again that they are dogs. Um I don't want to offend anybody by saying this, but it does annoy me when I see, say, people taking their dogs out of town in a bag. If the dog is healthy, has four legs, let your dog walk. It's a dog, it will enjoy walking. Um, and likewise, dogs don't need like they don't need clothes and all these things to be happy. Like most dogs will be at their happiest when they can go outside, run, maybe get a little bit dirty. But that's what dogs do. They just like their freedom, they like, you know, going exploring, sniffing, maybe tasting disgusting things. That's that's what dogs do. Um, just just let them be dogs. I think that that is really the main thing, and and um and understanding that they are dogs and they they are not not humans, they're not our our babies, although we might refer to them as our babies, they are not literally human babies, they are dogs. And I think if people understood that and that they are dogs and how valuable dogs are, when you think of all the amazing things that dogs can do, like therapy dogs, and they can sniff cancer, they can sniff COVID. I know in Finland we had the COVID um sniffer dogs. Um, I remember being sniffed by one when I was coming coming home one one time during COVID, and like they they can do so much, and I think if we if we really um take stock of everything that they can do and understand that, you know, it will be so much better for for dogs. Even our pet dogs, they do so much for us that we don't even think about on a daily basis, just uh love and the cuddles and everything that they give, you know, it's it's the best uh stress relief, really, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00Well, that's true. Well said. Um now we are getting to the end of this uh lovely chat. Um, but is there anything that I didn't ask and you would like to share with with me and the listeners?
SPEAKER_01Um nothing, nothing specific. No, I think just um I want people to be good to their dogs and just um appreciate them for the wonderful creatures that they are. Like my dogs are just everything to me. And I think um some non-dog people sometimes when I talk about my dogs, they don't understand it. They're like, this woman is just crazy, but they they are like they're family members, and um yeah, they I I treat them as family members, but as canine family members, so they um they get their runs, they get their walks, they get their uh good food, and um they get their cuddles and they're happy with that.
SPEAKER_00That's great. Uh actually that reminded me because you are really multi-language speaker. Uh by the way, how many languages do you speak?
SPEAKER_01Um three languages comfortably Finnish and Swedish and then English, and I have some others that I understand but don't really want to speak.
SPEAKER_00But what language do you use with your dogs? That's the most interesting part.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I actually uh speak English with them, and some people find that quite uh quite strange, but it's it's practical. Um, my partner is Irish and his Finnish is not very good, so it would be hard for him to then obviously be able to use the same verbal cues for the dogs um if they were in in a foreign language to him. Um but dogs are also really good for learning, um learning um languages. Um my mum um growing up uh was a Swedish uh speaker and she was kind of struggling to learn Finnish in school, but they had a family dog, so what she did then, she started speaking uh Finnish to the dog because the dog will not judge her. So that actually really, really helped her master the language, and she actually had really perfect Finnish then as a grown-up. So clearly it did help. So that's a tip. If you're trying to learn a language, talk to your dog.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's a great one. Um, and also for the listeners, so to just to inform everyone. So in Finland, we have two official languages, so we have Swedish and Finnish. Finnish is the major language. Um, and Pamela is from area that they speak um Swedish as their primary language. So that's why uh this was really interesting topic as well. Um, hey Pamela, thank you so much for being here today. Thank you. Thank you very much for having me. It was a pleasure. And thank you everyone for listening. The One Mind Dogs from the Dogs Perspective podcast. Make sure you follow One Mind Dogs in social media and also tag us and share your moments with your dog. See you in the next episode.
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