Unravelling The Surrogacy Journey

Surrogacy is an intricate process with many moving parts. There are many pieces of information to gather and new concepts to understand. In this episode, Frank provides a general overview of Surrogacy and what the average journey entails. Frank and his Executive Assistant, Juan discuss the role of an agency, IVF, and the average length and costs associated with Surrogacy.

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Frank 00:02
Welcome to Surrogacy Talk with meet your fabulous host and family building expert Frank Golden. I'll be talking about surrogacy, IVF, and making babies Welcome back, everyone. And and this segment, we are going to talk about unraveling the surrogacy journey. With me today in the studio, we have Erika Daybook.

Erika 00:25
Hi, everyone.

Frank 00:27
And we have my assistant, Juan Ruiz.

Juan 00:29
Hi, everyone.

Frank 00:30
Thank you to both of you for being in the studio with me today. So I think for this segment, Erika, you're going to really ask me some questions that get asked often by intended parents. So some of the frequently asked questions.

Erika 00:45
I guess the first question is pretty simple, but what is gestational surrogacy?

Frank 00:51
So that is an amazing question. Because that is what we do here at Golden Surrogacy. So in a gestational surrogacy arrangement, intended parents will create embryos through in vitro fertilization. Using their own genetic material or eggs from a donor. Okay. One or more of the embryos is then transferred into the gestational surrogate or also referred to as a gestational carrier who then carries the child or children to full term but has no genetic relationship to them.

Frank 01:21
If that all makes sense.

Erika 01:23
So a surrogate essentially is loaning out her uterus to couples that need to have a baby and aren't able to on their own. Essentially, yeah. But there's no relation to her.

Frank 01:33
No genetic relationship. And then there's also just a few acronyms I'd like to go through and then we'll continue here. So there's a few different ones. There's if you're in the industry or your new intended parents or surrogate, you'll hear things like IP, GS, RE, so what are these things? So the first one you'll hear a lot is IP that stands for Intended Parent.

Frank 01:57
There's also G. S or G. C, which stands for gestational surrogate or gestational carrier, or sometimes you'll see GS being referred to as gestational surrogacy. So there's different acronyms. RE is your reproductive endocrinologist or your fertility specialist.The GSA is the gestational surrogacy agreement, which is or a.k.a. your surrogacy contract between intended parents and the surrogate. And then you'll hear ART and we're not talking about Andy Warhol or a Monet.

Frank 02:30
We're talking about assisted reproductive technology. So those are just a few acronyms that you will hear bounce around a lot.

Erika 02:38
Just to clarify. So assisted reproductive technology is that IVF then? Is that an example?

Frank 02:46
IVF, IUI, it basically is a broad term to the industry. So if you, you're an ART attorney, you're a reproductive law attorney.

Erika 02:57
Got it. And then within that, there are specialties, obviously.

Frank 03:00
Correct. Yup.

Erika 03:01
And so as an agency, it's important to for our intended parents to understand the role of an agency and why you need one. So you can kind of go in to what a surrogacy agency is and what our role is in the process.

Frank 03:15
What the role. So really great question. So a surrogacy agency such as Golden Surrogacy, we work directly with the intended parents, the surrogate and attorneys to create a fair and suitable arrangement between all of the parties involved while protecting everyone's rights, which is crucially important we act as your personal concierge throughout the entire journey, and all parties go through this surrogacy program.

Frank 03:39
Typically we'll have 24/7 access to their assigned coordinator. In the case of Golden Surrogacy that that's me, Frank Golden you'll have 24/7 access to me. So that's really good.

Erika 03:49
He's always checking his phone like literally. So when he says 24/7 he means 24/7. Tell us how surrogates are located a lot of intended parents want to know how we find these wonderful women where they come from.

Frank 04:05
So I get asked this question daily. So our surrogates at Golden Surrogacy are recruited by implementing a very complex multi-channel marketing approach and people are probably like, what the heck is that? So that consists of word of mouth referrals, direct mailers, promotional events that we do in person. And then we utilize the many facets of social media and the World Wide Web. Not only are we fielding qualified candidates that are in surrogate friendly states, but we like those states to also be what we call pre-birth order states.

Frank 04:40
And that means that both intended parents names can go on the birth certificate. So that is very, very important.

Erika 04:47
I think it would be really stressful going into a hospital when your surrogates giving birth to your baby and you then have to go to court and, you know, deal with that. It doesn't feel like safe or comfortable. You can go home with your baby, you know?

Frank 05:02
Right. It shouldn't just be a state. We shouldn't just be operating in states where surrogacy can work. At the end of the day. But we really want the legal process to be as smooth as possible for the intended parents. So that's very, very important.

Erika 05:15
So tell us how surrogates are screened for the process I know it's a huge concern for intended parents that they're getting a mentally stable, physically healthy, you know, surrogate, how do, how does Golden Surrogacy do that?

Frank 05:32
Perfect. So Golden Surrogacy conducts a very, very stringent screening process. And approval process for all surrogates to be considered, surrogates must or I should say surrogate applicants must complete a detailed application, which includes their medical history, personality questionnaire, educational background and pregnancy history. After we receive all of the prospective surrogates application, our staff then reviews all of that information and examines their medical records, which includes all previous pregnancy and delivery history.

Frank 06:05
All candidates also submit are submitted to a scrutinous and thorough background check and criminal history, which includes a seven year address verification to assess their lifestyle and reliability. And that's very, very important. And then upon matching, all surrogate candidates must also be medically screened. So that's very, very important.

Erika 06:24
So it's multi-tiered.

Erika 06:25
There's

Frank 06:26
multi-tiered.

Erika 06:26
Several steps.

Frank 06:27
Many different steps.

Erika 06:28
So, yeah, I mean, intended parents, I don't blame them for being really concerned about their surrogate. Like, who is she?

Juan 06:36
I think the thing that intended parents need to actually focus on the most that it's not a Lifetime movie.

Erika 06:42
We actually have a blog on that we literally do is so look it up.

Juan 06:46
These surrogates go through some really strict requirements in order to actually even get accepted into

Frank 06:49
And I'm proud of our surrogates. We have some really amazing women that go through it.

Erika 06:54
They genuinely, like, want to be surrogates. They do it for the right reasons. And I got, Juan, you got to go to to the hospital one time. And just watching that.

Juan 07:05
I got to hold a baby.

Erika 07:06
Yeah. That was the first newborn I've ever held like that new. It was. Yeah.

Juan 07:12
And the surrogate was amazing. The surrogate was so happy she had a full face of makeup on.

Erika 07:15
The realtionship

Erika 07:16
like that is such a unique. Yeah, she, she looked great.

Juan 07:21
She looked amazing.She was so happy. Her husband was there, and they were really excited.

Erika 07:25
Oh, yeah. This new baby. And then you have the intended father who was just overjoyed and overwhelmed. And it was just a really cool experience. Really unique family unit. Is how saw it.

Frank 07:37
And then for me, seeing Juan hold the baby was surreal.

Juan 07:40
It was terrifying.

Erika 07:40
He was very scared. So moving on, we're talking about surrogates and eventually you get a surrogate, right? I never intended parents going to have a surrogate, but how does that happen? How are surrogates and intended parents matched?

Frank 07:57
So another really great question. So Golden Surrogacy has a very specific matching process. Once a surrogate goes through and completes all of the prerequisite requirements, she has all of her records prevented and screened. We basically we have a match meeting and we look at all of the different things in surrogate's profile. And then we look at the roster of intended parents we have and we really try to line up pregnancy values and personality.

Frank 08:23
And we spend so much time on the phone with these women communicating on a daily basis and the intended parents that we really have a great idea in terms of who would match well with who. So we want the match to be based on a foundation of trust and to really be something that can blossom into a really great relationship.

Frank 08:44
And that all starts with a phone call, which is a little bit like a first date. We have the intended parents and the surrogate and the phone call we're on the call the entire time. We basically put our phones on mute and we let both parties kind of take it away and form an organic conversation. And then if that call goes well, things can move towards a Skype call where they can see each other in person or oftentimes intended parents will fly in or go visit the surrogate for for a coffee date.

Frank 09:15
So we really like that relationship to flourish and blossom in a organic way where everyone's comfortable, mutually moving forward together with that one vision of of matching, you'll never have a situation at Golden Surrogacy where we look at intended parents and say, here's your surrogate. You must match with them or surrogate A, here's your intended parents. You have to match with them.

Frank 09:37
It really must be a mutual matching decision on the side of both parties.

Erika 09:42
And so then the match call we've been I've been on a couple of them. It's really cool to hear, obviously a little bit nervous tension at first, but then once it gets going, gets going. And what I love the most is when the calls over and we're back to work and we start getting the calls that they are so excited to move forward, either the surrogate called and I love these parents, I can't wait to work with them.

Erika 10:03
And same with the intended parents. That's my favorite part. So usually the match calls go well. Sometimes they want a second one just to be sure because it's kind of like a really big decision like buying a car. You might go to more than one dealership. That's a big decision. Much bigger than that, obviously. So that's my favorite part of Match Call is when.

Juan 10:22
We plan for that, though, that's as an agency. That's something that I know I take a lot of pride in. I'm sure Frank does as well. And our coordinators, we make sure that our coordinators, our surrogate coordinators are so fantastic and they really find out who these women are to the core. And same thing as Frank and I. When we find out who these intended parents are, we find out kind of some of their similarities.

Juan 10:39
We sit down and we have these really great meetings and we say we have this great couple or this great intended parent, and then we say like, well, I have this really great surrogate. We talk about some of their common interests. So, you know, if you have someone who a surrogate who loves going camping with a family and we have an intended parent or couple who loves the outdoors, like, hey, this couple might work really well with the surrogate.

Juan 10:58
And the match meetings are really like a first date they're like a blind date. And we are kind of the matchmakers. And we were never going to set up a couple and a surrogate who aren't going to be a good match. So Frank does a really good has a really good sixth sense of who is going to match really well.

Frank 11:13
It's like the TV show Millionaire Matchmaker.

Juan 11:16
You're Patti.

Frank 11:17
I remember watching that show like way back in the day thinking to myself, Yeah, yeah, this lady's blowing smoke, she's hocus pocus or whatever. And then I started doing these matches with surrogates and intended parents, and I like you said, I have a really good instinct of the match is going to work out. And if you look at all the matches we've done over the years, like we've put together some really great surrogates and intended parents, like, I'm really proud of the work that we've all done.

Frank 11:42
And it's not just me, it's the surrogate coordinators building that relationship with the surrogates over the phone, really gaining their trust and educating them about the surrogacy process. So it's it's not just me. I, you know, I think I do a pretty good job, but it's the whole team that makes everything happen. And we're we're like doing the Millionaire Matchmaker in, in the surrogacy

Frank 12:01
world, which is really kind of fun and cool at the same time.

Erika 12:05
It's really cool. We kind of touched on this let's say the match call goes great and that's enough for both parties. When do the intended parents and the surrogate typically meet?

Frank 12:17
Sure. The first would be obviously just post-match or during that matching process if they would like to meet and go out to coffee or breakfast or sometimes it's a Skype meeting, quote, unquote. So and then the second time would be at the fertility clinic for the team day or the one day workup where the surrogate and the intended parents will meet at the fertility clinic and have all of their testing done.

Frank 12:42
They'll meet with the psychological counselor to make sure that it's a really good and cohesive match. That would be the second time. The third time would be at the embryo transfer. Very, very crucial surrogates especially find it very important to have their intended parents there because this is the day of insemination. Essentially, it's the day that where everything that you've worked so hard to you know, build up where, you know, comes together and you're at that embryo transfer.

Frank 13:12
So those would be the three required times outside of those required times. It's really up to the intended parents and the surrogates to build on that relationship so that you come up with a regular communication rhythm. And then aside from the communication, you have a really great relationship with your surrogate. You may decide to, you know, if she's not local, fly in once or twice or three times throughout the pregnancy or go to all the milestone ultrasound appointments.

Frank 13:38
So that's really up to the parties to build that communication rhythm and also that in-person meeting rhythm, if you will.

Erika 13:46
And so this is a, you know, obviously very important question and very frequently asked is what's the typical cost of a surrogacy journey with our agency?

Frank 13:56
I'll paint this in very broad strokes here because surrogacy journey is very

Erika 14:01
This is a whole other podcast topic.

Frank 14:02
Yeah, it's a whole other podcast. And a surrogate journey has so many different variable costs. But I'm just going to go through some of the breakdowns here. So the average surrogacy journey in the United States can cost anywhere from about $100,000 to $150,000, with the average being around $130,000. The categories that break that up would be agency fee typically ranges in the twenties, so about $25,000.

Frank 14:31
The fertility clinic fees that are around $40,000 surrogate compensation is around $30,000. Egg donor compensation and fees associated with your egg donor will be around $20,000 and then your legal fees will be around $10,000. So if you add all that up, you're in, you're about $130,000. So those would be the costs that make up, you know, a surrogacy journey on average and that's with a singleton delivery.

Erika 14:59
And then how is that broken down? So where does that money go? Is it paid in installments?

Frank 15:07
Hmm, that's a great question. So all of the different categories that I listed, like agency fee, IVF clinics, surrogate comp, we like all of those fees to be paid to the individuals separately so that there's a very great sense of transparency for the intended parents. All of the fees associated with the surrogate will go into an escrow account.

Frank 15:28
Your escrow account is funded at different milestones of the pregnancy. So it's not all paid out to your surrogate at once that are milestones that are broken down in monthly payments. The agency fee is paid half when you retain us half once you're matched with your surrogate. Legal is due once your attorneys bill you and the retainer has been signed.

Frank 15:49
So everything is paid separately. Some agencies like to take all of the money at once, so they'll say pay us the $100,00 or $130,000 and we'll pay all the vendors. I'm not saying that's the wrong way to do it. I just don't like to do it that way because I like everyone to know where their money is going and have the whole process be, like I said, as transparent as possible.

Juan 16:08
I think also a lot of intended parents, when they hear that everything is managed separately, they can sometimes tend to panic and they're like, well, now I have to do all of this on my own. And that's not necessarily the case. We help manage absolutely everything we, we tell you exactly our suggestion and who's going, the escrow company is going to be handling it, and then you pay them separately.

Juan 16:30
But we're still very much on the journey with you holding your hand and walking you through everything so you're not alone, even though everything is categorized separately.

Frank 16:37
Who to pay and when. Someone asked me the other day, they said, So how much work do we have to do if we're using your agency and I said, well, we still have to sign papers and show up at places. Other than that, we're recruiting the surrogate. We're pairing you with the attorneys. We're telling you when to pay things and when to sign things.

Frank 16:57
And that's basically, you know, what you do aside from building the relationship with your surrogate, which is very important.

Erika 17:04
And that was actually my next question was why shouldn't people do this on their own? Why should you find an agency, whether it be ours or

Juan 17:13
This connection we have here

Erika 17:15
Well, you're thinking the same thing. You know why you shouldn't we call independent or indie journeys why should you go to an agency like Golden Surrogacy when you're doing a surrogacy journey and you just answered part of it was that it's super complex, but maybe you can go into that a lot more.

Frank 17:33
It is. It's super complex. There are a wide range of varying laws and statutes in different states. So that's one component but I would say the most important thing is that when you're going through a surrogacy journey, whether you be a heterosexual couple or a gay couple, you are already filled with a lot of anxiety and stress starting the process.

Frank 17:55
And think of about think of how much more stress you will have if you don't know what you don't know. And you're essentially having to write a thesis on something that you haven't had time to do the research on. Whereas when you hire an agency, we already know what all of the pieces of the puzzle are going to be and where they fit.

Frank 18:14
And basically, all you have to do is sit back and watch the puzzle get put together. And that's what we want for your surrogacy journey. We want you to sit back and relax, focus on the relationship with your surrogate, and enjoy the pregnancy, enjoy the process, and enjoy the milestones that is really important and very crucial. And I think that would be the key takeaway as to why you should have an agency.

Erika 18:38
Yeah, I mean, if you didn't know any of it, I mean, now I feel like oh, I could do it because I've been training under Frank. I know this now, but it is it's so much like just finding an IVF clinic and is it the right one? And what does that mean? And making embryos. And so speaking of IVF clinics, you can get into that a little bit.

Erika 18:56
This is kind of like the pre before you sign sometimes you know, so what's the role of an IVF clinic for either heterosexual or gay couples? What is that, you know, look like the IVF process?

Frank 19:09
Great. So the fertility clinic, the IVF clinic is essentially who does all of the medical procedures in your surrogacy journey. So all parties have to converge at the fertility clinic to have all of their their FDA blood panel that are there, pre-testing prescreening, all of that takes place at the fertility clinic. Your egg retrievals conducted there your embryos are created there and your embryo transfer is created there.

Frank 19:33
So the fertility clinic is a very large component to your surrogacy journey. And so when I, you know, intended parents will often ask me, well, what is a good fertility clinic? And we do have a list, right, Juan, we have, we have a list. But what I always urge intended parents to do is to do some of the vetting on their own.

Frank 19:55
So, you know, when they call the fertility clinic, what's the service like from the very first phone call, the very first interaction, if you don't get a hold of someone right away, do they respond back to you, you know, instantly via email do they treat your case like, you know, they have a sense of urgency around helping you create your family?

Frank 20:13
Do or do they seem like they care? Are they genuine? So we work with a lot of the top fertility clinics in the country. So we know that they'll do a great job, but we want them at the end of the day to be a team that you feel as though you can trust, build rapport with, and then a team that you feel has your best interests at heart.

Erika 20:32
Online reviews just aren't really enough then it's really a personality thing. Are you looking for big, small? I mean, there's all different kinds of IVF clinics. So from the time somebody let's say there are no let's just say the entire journey how long is that typically from beginning to end? I mean, you could start when people get matched, whatever, whenever most intended parents want to know is like how long this journey is going to take.

Frank 20:57
And that's a really great question. The average journey length is anywhere from 16 to 18 months. It really depends on how quickly we can find a surrogate. And then does pregnancy is pregnancy achieved on the first embryo transfer? But I would say the average journey length from the time you retain an agency until the time you're holding a baby's averaged at 16 to 18 months.

Erika 21:21
Which is well worth it. Like it probably seems really daunting at first, but you know, you're starting a family and it's like a lifelong dream, you know.

Frank 21:29
Yeah, and everyone wants to rush, you know, they hear that 16 to 18 months and they're like, Oh my goodness, is going to be you know, almost two years before I'm holding my baby. But to your point, it's well worth it. You want to take your time, you know, it's kind of like making a wedding cake you can't just rush it and then slap something on a tray, right?

Frank 21:49
It has to be done very delicately with all of the trimmings. And you're making a baby so you want your baby to be as perfect as possible, as healthy as possible. So every piece of of the surrogacy journey needs to come together in a very methodical way.

Erika 22:04
Definitely so I think that really sums up the overall surrogacy journey. You know, most frequently asked questions from our intended parents. There is a lot more a lot of things we talked about. We have specific blogs and podcasts on. That's how intricate this the process is, is that a lot of these topics do require more than just an overview.

Erika 22:27
Anything else you guys wanted to add.

Frank 22:29
No, to your point, a lot of these are really great, frequently asked questions that intended parents and surrogates always posed to us in their might. There might seem like some redundancy in some of the blogs and podcasts, but it's because some of them are overviews and some of them are more in-depth and they get asked so many times that this is really good because then if you click on a podcast, we want it to be as informational and educational as is possible.

Erika 22:55
So yeah, when we had Dr. Beltsos and for example, the entire segment was about the IVF process and we didn't even get into it as much as we probably could, you know.

Frank 23:04
Right, we need to have her back or. So with that said, I would just like to thank everyone out there who's listening. Again, if you have specific topics or things that you'd like us to discuss on our podcast, send us an email at info@goldensurrogacy.com and you can follow us at @GoldenSurrogacy to see we're on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter.

Frank 23:26
Thank you so much. And thank you, Erika. And thank you Juan for being with me today.

Erika 23:30
Thanks for having us.

Frank 23:32
Thank you, everyone, for tuning in to this podcast segment. This is Frank Golden reminding you that Everyone Deserves a Family.