Intuitive Insights: Inspiring Stories and Intuitive Tools for the Creative Soul
Welcome to Intuitive Insights. I’m Meghan—your no-BS woo-woo coach. Every other week, I share practical spiritual tools, creative inspiration, and explore meaningful conversations that show intuition is less crystal ball and more compass. Together, we’ll navigate how intuition shows up in everyday life, how it shapes purpose, and the practices that help us live more connected, creative, and soul-aligned.
Added Bonus: I promise to keep it fun. "Remember to laugh—because you are always on your path."
www.magnetizeyourlight.com
Intuitive Insights: Inspiring Stories and Intuitive Tools for the Creative Soul
Clarity Through Sobriety with America's Social Worker: Kelley Kitley
What happens when we strip away the noise and truly listen to our inner voice? In this deeply personal conversation, licensed clinical social worker Kelly Kittley opens up about her 12-year sobriety journey and how it amplified her connection to intuition.
Kelly defines intuition as "greater knowing that we find within" – something that was often blocked during her drinking years. She shares how journaling revealed a decade-long pattern of wanting to stop drinking before she finally embraced sobriety. The transformation wasn't just about eliminating alcohol; it was about discovering a more authentic way of living and connecting.
Many people exist in what Kelly calls the "gray area" of drinking – not experiencing catastrophic consequences but sensing alcohol isn't serving their highest good. This middle ground often goes unacknowledged in society's binary view of having a problem or not. Kelly challenges this limited perspective, encouraging people to trust their inner knowing about what's right for them, regardless of external validation.
Perhaps most striking is how sobriety simplified Kelly's spiritual connection. Before, she needed dramatic experiences like climbing Machu Picchu to feel deeply connected. After getting sober, she found that same profound connection "sitting on the porch with my kids drinking a cup of coffee." This shift represents the heart of the intuitive journey – recognizing that clarity often emerges not from adding more, but from removing what no longer serves us.
Whether you're questioning your relationship with alcohol or simply interested in enhancing your intuitive abilities, this conversation offers valuable insights on listening to your inner compass, even when it leads you upstream against cultural currents. Have you noticed how external influences might be drowning out your intuition? We'd love to hear your thoughts.
To receive your own personal Intuitive Soul Reading and personalized workbook visit: https://magnetizeyourlight.com/intuition
Hi, welcome to Intuitive Insights. I am your host, Megan McDonough, and I have with me my friend, Kelly Kittley. Hi, Kelly, Hi there. Kelly and I know each other from a film that I did. God, how many years ago is that now?
Speaker 2:It was about four years ago.
Speaker 1:Was it? Oh yeah, that's right, because it was 2020.
Speaker 2:2020.
Speaker 1:And we did it in 2021. It was supposed to be 2020. Kelly is a licensed clinical social worker with over 20 years of experience in the field. She's a sought after national mental health media expert, speaker and author of an award-winning Amazon bestseller, myself. Kelly owns Serendipitous Psychotherapy and specializes in treating adults with anxiety, depression, relationships it sounded like treating them with relationships, trauma and alcohol abuse. She's a wife and mom of four teenagers. Hi, kelly, hi, so yeah. So Kelly and I met doing a film, a short film, which you do. You still use that short film gray area in your speeches. I know you're tough, I do, you know it ebbs and flows.
Speaker 2:We made it what four years ago. You know it's on YouTube and I present a lot to different organizations who treat mental health and alcohol use disorder, so it's good material.
Speaker 1:So, okay, I have lots of questions.
Speaker 2:You didn't just work on a film with me. Megan played me in the film, that's true, yeah, there's that.
Speaker 1:And I do remember one of the comments, like after the first screening, when they were like, did you like study her behaviors? And I was like no, I think we just of the comments like after the first screening, when they were like, did you like study her behaviors? And I was like no, I think we just have the same ones. I think it's just that we're married, we're better and for worse. I was like we kind of just love each other, that's all. So okay, let's start. So okay, so I'll ask you my first two questions. Then I have lots of questions for you, okay, okay, so I'll ask you my first two questions, then I have lots of questions for you, okay, first one being how would you define intuition? How do you define it for yourself, for others, whatever, Sure, I define intuition as greater, knowing that we find within.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, that's it. That's it, that was just like right to it.
Speaker 2:I like it Okay so then, how do you use that in your life? Well, I've had to quiet my internal chatter and anxiety to get space to be able to listen to the intuition. I think oftentimes it was blocked, certainly while I was drinking, and I'd have moments of light and then it would be shut down again when I was drinking. But since I've been sober for 12 years, I use it as my compass, so to speak, in terms of guiding me to decision-making or parenting or relationships, and I find, when I can get quiet I can hear it, but it's hard for me to get quiet sometimes.
Speaker 1:It's hard to take all the jazz hands off and just be like, okay, what are you saying? Just be, just be quiet. Yeah, the jazz hands off and just be like, okay, what are you saying? Just be, just be quiet. Yeah, what was I going to ask you? Okay, so here. So, um, all right, so you have. You wrote your book myself. So I have a question for you on that, like what prompted you to write that? And because you, were you sober when you started writing it or no?
Speaker 2:No, I probably started writing the book 10 years before it was actually published and had gone through. I had always been a journal writer and had gone through 50 journals and was looking for themes. That was throughout the journals and some of it was about growing up above my parents' bar in Chicago and just being in the restaurant and bar business, my own mental health struggles with anxiety and depression, as well as sexual assault and sexual abuse as a young girl. And then drinking was certainly a common thread of something I tried to manage and control my whole life but really healing through some of my past traumas. The writing was so cathartic and therapeutic for me while I was in therapy and I started writing the book and couldn't finish it because I wasn't sober yet and I kept saying, why can't I finish this? And then I got sober and that was the last part of the book.
Speaker 1:Hmm, Do you feel like the journaling led you to the sobriety, or was it like? Or were you like? This is the only way I'm going to be able to finish this book.
Speaker 2:No, it wasn't connected. I think that writing was always something that was a tool for me, that I felt and in some ways speaking to God, I mean, I would even journal, dear God, when I was younger and recognizing the theme of God, please help me stop drinking, god, please remove this obsession. Throughout as young as my early 20s and I got sober at 35., so it was easy to go through and say, oh, you've been trying to quit drinking for a long time. I just didn't know I wanted to give it up completely or how I was going to give it up, but it was something I struggled with most of my life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So, oh, my God, I'm like three and a half years I haven't drank. That's huge, oh my gosh. But I mean it is and it isn't. Do you know what I mean? Like it is in the, if you think about it, like oh yeah, that was a big thing, but at the same time it doesn't feel like in it now doesn't feel like that. Like it doesn't feel. I don't feel any different, do you know, other than I'm just not hating myself as much, or hungover. Well, those are good things.
Speaker 1:But anyway, I wanted to talk about the visual I had that helped me. Well, you just being your awesome self, and at that, for when I stopped drinking, it was we had just finished this film. It had been in my head a lot, the. You know, is this something that I want to keep around? You know? I mean my, I have my kids later in life. I don't know. I just kind of felt like I don't, I don't want to miss them growing up because I was drunk and don't remember them to be like. Why are you so like if, if I'm hungover? Why am I angry? Just like? Why? Why shit on this piece of life that you'd waited so long for? Yeah, and then. So I was battling that.
Speaker 1:And then during the pandemic I had knew of some people and some friends that had passed, some because of alcohol, and you know, it was just it kind of was like what's more important, you know, like I know society puts so much attention on hey girl, you know like that kind of thing, but and the social camaraderie of it, but what's I don't know, just it brought to my attention what's more important. And the visual that I had actually going into one of the screenings that we had was and it just it's like hits me so much. But I, standing, or like looking at a body laying on the like six feet under with dirt slowly getting tossed down their face, and the person is like looking up at the person throwing the dirt on their face and burying them alive but immobile, and then looking up at the person who's throwing the dirt and it's them so like me laying at the bottom of the thing and looking up and it's me throwing the dirt on myself, and it was like that was such a powerful image to me, like for me to go. I don't want to bury myself anymore, I don't want to pretend I'm something, I'm not, I don't want to fit in, you know, like I don't want to dull uh, who, who I am, and you, you were very helpful in that and and and you know, um, just being your awesome self, and you've done that for a lot of people.
Speaker 1:You know, shine the light. You know, just by shining your light, you know, and it helps other people find their way.
Speaker 1:Thank you, and part of that for me was intuition. Like I didn't want to bury that part of myself anymore. I didn't want to be um hide, how weird I was like and how woo woo I was. I was like you know. So what Like? You know what I mean. Like let's just sit down and get weird and so um and it, and it's harder. It was harder for me to be clear and hear that voice that you were speaking of earlier. It's harder for me to hear that voice with other distractions, like alcohol or anxiety or whatever you know. Um, so did you have a similar uh connection to your intuition prior to, or did it just really start coming up as you got sober? Or, like, how did you discover that relationship of intuition with yourself?
Speaker 2:I mean I feel like I was born an old soul and was just born into the world, hyper sensitive and aware and was always so curious. I mean my parents weren't Catholic and I went to a Catholic school just because it was down the street from the bar and we could walk there. And I just remember loving like rituals and spirituality and going to church and praying, and so much so that I would like ask my parents if they would take me to church on Sunday, and so there was always something bigger my parents if they would take me to church on Sunday. And so there was always something bigger. And what I was always craving throughout my life was that connection.
Speaker 2:But with a lot of things in my life it was like good Kelly, bad Kelly, and when I was on track I was connected and had rituals and felt spiritually empowered and connected. And then when I was drinking or working too much or just totally disengaged, I had to do these like really big things to feel connected, like go climb Machu Picchu and see God at the top of the mountain or run a marathon, because that's when I felt really spiritually connected. So it wasn't until I got sober that I was like I can feel spiritually connected sitting on the porch with my kids drinking a cup of coffee. I didn't have to do these grandiose things to feel like that is really spiritual. So that clarity came for me in a lot of the simple interactions in my life once I stopped drinking.
Speaker 1:So it's like it became. Like you were able to like the noise, the static kind of got turned down, you know, yeah, now it's like now it doesn't.
Speaker 2:You know, it's not once a quarter that I am feeling aligned. It's kind of like brushing my teeth. You know, it's part of the daily practice of getting quiet and listening and being and touching base with what's going on inside rather than looking outward for the validation or affirmation.
Speaker 1:Yes, you said it was funny. You said Machu Picchu and I in my head I was just picturing that there's a part in your book where you talk about that, about Machu Picchu, and, by the way, that's like, definitely on my bucket list, like Machu Picchu.
Speaker 2:It's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but there was something about, and I'm just I'm getting like shown like the starts, like there was something about you looking at the start. Do you remember what that section was in the book? If you don't, then I no, I do.
Speaker 2:I remember, you know, we slept in tents on the trail for four days as we were climbing and it was one of the most peaceful feelings I had felt and it was so simple, yeah, and I loved it. And then there was a bar along the Inca Trail and once we got there we started drinking and I was like, well, where did that go? It was amazing, let's ruin it. And seriously it was. I mean, you couldn't be more dichotomous. But you know alcohol is looked at as very celebratory and you know that was great too and it was like we're rewarding ourselves for climbing for four days and we can have beer. And for me it felt like and take away everything you just gained, right, right, right, right, totally. So that's how my whole life felt pretty much with alcohol.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I could see that. I can see that Like it's like the thing I don't know if you had a saying about this or not, but I remember feeling like you know what I'm like, technicolor enough, like I don't need to go neon yeah, do you know what I mean? And like drinking, just put me into the neon zone and there was no. It was. It was like technicolor, technicolor neon. It was like no subtlety of when and you didn't know when you were going to hit neon. You were just there and you could tell, not because you knew you were neon but more so because everyone else was going.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, yeah, too much. I'm too much without alcohol. Add alcohol and it's like real loud it's like next level, yeah.
Speaker 1:And then I was like, oh okay, well then maybe I don't have to be so crazy, just be a little.
Speaker 2:You can dilute it a little bit by removing the substance. Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know what was I going to say. Okay, so you were always pretty spiritual, right. So do you have like a spiritual connection practice now, or is it just like kind of a meditative, going internal to discuss with self what's going on?
Speaker 2:Well, it's still both. I mean, I journal still very frequently. It helps clear my mind and helps me feel grounded. You know, I look at a drive I had yesterday to Milwaukee and like had amazing music on. Some of it was like churchy music, you know, and then some was like pink and it just it awakens my soul and just, you know, I'm singing and like open road, like to me it just feels like a connection, you know, whether it's with myself or other spirits or whatever it might be, it is just a calming effect that happens I guess that's the best way to describe it Are moments of calm, and that was something I was always looking for. And now I'm like, oh, I don't have to go, you know, 3,000 miles away or 10,000 miles away to feel that it's right here. I can tap into that anytime. So, yeah, lighting a candle, writing, praying you know, I still like the ritual of some church, even though I don't prescribe necessarily to any denomination, but like picking and choosing kind of things that I like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you just made me think of. So I take well, next to you, not too far from you, I take the kids to this Buddhist meditation class. I call it temple, but it's not really. It's like it's a class, right. So it's not really religious but more learning.
Speaker 1:And one of the things that we talked about one day is is that when you kind of peel off the layers and you calm down, you know or settle in, you know to yourself that you, what's left is that calm that you were talking about. What's left is that tranquil feeling, you know, and so the assumption is and that, like that, that is our natural state and so when we're always trying to find that, we're looking for ways to get back to that. But we have it the whole time and this feels like the root of all religion. But we went to my in-laws were in town for easter and so we went to church. You know, I love, I'm singing my heart out Like I was for sure I was going to have not have a voice the next day. You know, and and there were a lot of a lot has changed in church, so it would be like I'd be like peace be with. No, we changed the words yeah.
Speaker 2:Are you talking about a Catholic church?
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, there have been some. I was like, and then I was like I got this one and I'd say it. Then I'd be like nope, nope, wrong, my son. And I was like to my son. He was being very good because he knew he could play iPad after if he was. And so he was like you know, he's like oh, thank you God.
Speaker 1:I was like, all right, you know, I'll take it down a notch, but he was like you know he was when I was like, don't worry about it, we're going to shake hands and then it's going to be over. So he's like is this when we shake hands? And I was like, yeah, so I turn around and it's time. And I was like and peace be with, and everyone's like doing something like this, or I don't know what they're doing with their hands. And I was like nope, we're not doing the handshake. No one's doing the handshake now I don't know what we do, but it was like this whole like. I was like I don't know what to do with my body anymore Cause we changed things, but point being the priest was great and it was. I was the first time in forever that I've been to a Catholic church where I really liked the priest. Like the priest was positive and progressive and empathetic. Yes, you know, like the priest was positive and progressive and empathetic.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know shaming and rule following and every time I've gone let's be honest, it's been on Easter and my grandma used to call it a buffet Catholic. Oh yeah, cafeteria Like to have, and so. But I was like, so what, anyway? So he was, it was packed so they had to open up, like the balcony or whatever, and instead of him saying you know where are you guys the rest of the year, you know, he was saying how lovely it is to see you all being in the dark and discovering that Jesus has risen, or whatever. It was like very practical, beautiful, applicable to everyday life, and I was like I might come back to church Next Easter. Next Easter, yeah, most likely, but yeah, it was lovely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that for you. Yeah, I love that for you. I think you know religion and spirituality are so different. Yes, and oftentimes when I'm doing an assessment with my clients and I'll ask if they have any spiritual connection or any rituals, they're like I grew up Catholic but I don't practice anymore. And then being able to use that opportunity to educate, so you were saying that it's like, yeah, we know what church used to look like.
Speaker 2:And it looks different in some churches today and I think that that, you know, helps ignite people's spirituality.
Speaker 1:Truth, one thing that hasn't changed what?
Speaker 2:Cantors yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean there was a hot second where I was like I'm going to come back to church, I'm going to start singing, because this woman sucks, and I was like, no, I'm not going to do that. But there was a hot second when I considered that that was going to be my new career.
Speaker 1:And then they changed the song on me.
Speaker 1:But it's funny because my grandma, when we were this is my grandma, who could not carry a tune Like we always had a joke when it was happy birthday, she would be like I boosted to you, you know, and it wasn't until years later that she said you know, megan, I think they she was telling me a story about when she was in chorus and she was like and this is, by the way, story about when she was in chorus and she was like and this is, by the way, a horrid Irish accent but she was like, you know, I think you know, she put me in the back in chorus and she's like, you know, I think I might be torn deaf, and I was like, oh, you think so, but every time we'd be at church she'd have her thing and she would be like she'd hear the song and she'd be like and she'd start humming and sing and then she'd get it out and she'd be like, like every single time they changed the words on her, every like she knew this song, perfect.
Speaker 1:And then, oh, oh, you know, but that's 100 how I felt at that mass. You know, I was like, yeah, I'm gonna get into this I'm gonna put on a show for my in-laws. Yeah, you know I've completely gotten off topic.
Speaker 2:Church, church Spirituality.
Speaker 1:Rituals. Okay, what? Let's talk about this. So when you use it as a tool to talk about spirituality and religion, what do you do?
Speaker 2:Tell me Well that you know spirituality can just be how you connect with something bigger than yourself, yes, yes, and what you perceive as God or nature or a higher power or whatever it might be. That is outside of yourself, where I describe religion as something that was maybe taught to you and something that you practice in terms of, maybe the way your family. You grew up in your family of origin and it was a religion that was passed down to you and you didn't really think about it. You just did what you were told. And some people religion works great for and they continue that historical family generation of passing on Catholicism or whatever it might be. But oftentimes I hear, from clients especially, that they felt a disconnect in their religion. Most oftentimes it is Catholicism that can be punishing and shaming and blaming and it's like God that is keeping a scorecard of how you're doing in life, like an authoritarian versus like a team player.
Speaker 1:you know, yeah, I think religion to me is just like structure around, a concept where a spirituality is heart motivated, like a heart motivated journey towards something higher than self that you have to humble self to.
Speaker 2:That's why you're an intuitive, because that's beautiful, and so right on, yeah, I mean you can find it in both.
Speaker 1:You can have. There are people rare, yeah, it's can have. There are people rare, yeah, it's rare. But there are people who use the tenets of the structure of religion to free themselves up to a heart, forward place and be humble. But that's not always how it's taught, Right, Unfortunately, and I think that's why I was excited about the way that mass because I was, you know it's like that priest got it. You know he was, he was progressive and this is again off topic, but whatever, my son and this is, I don't know, this is sort of related, but not but has been getting in trouble. He said something terrible about someone at school and that's not acceptable, whatever, and he usually loves school. But he started saying, because he got in trouble, he started saying that he hated school and I said I said why do you hate school? And he goes, because there's too many rules and too many snitches. I was like, when did you join the mafia? But I don't know why, but I feel like that to me, is religion.
Speaker 2:Sure, yeah, yeah, you have to show up in a way that is anything off. Kilter is wrong, you know. I mean, obviously every institution needs some kind of rules, but I'm like, is the priest keeping track or like what it didn't feel to me very fluid where spirituality feels very fluid to me, yes, Agreed.
Speaker 1:These are hard hitting questions I'm giving you.
Speaker 2:Hard. We're just, we're just going with the flow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean. Well, I do believe that intuition or spirit or spirituality. Somehow I feel weird about the word spirit. I don't know why. I don't know why it hits me weird, but it does. Maybe because it reminds me of like I hear it used a lot by what I'm going to. I coin is not a technical term, but like passive, aggressive yogis, you know what I'm saying I hear the word spirit used a lot in that vein and so it's like using spirituality like another. Because as a kid this was a bragging point I had. As a kid I was kicked out of every religion class except for one in high school Because I was like well, if you don't know the answer, why are you testing me? So I want to run my kid as ADHD, Anyway. So, um, the oh God, oh God, I mean I'm telling you perimenopause and ADHD didn't go well with me. What was I saying? I don't know, no one knows. No one knows the problem Kicked out of every religion class, your son getting in trouble at school.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, my God, that's okay. What's going on? Nope, it almost came back, something about supportive energy and wanting to like, not feel the shame, and it is circling back to ADHD and it is circling back to adhd and it is circling back to sobriety. There we go. I found it done.
Speaker 1:So the it's like with the external from religion and for someone who has adhd, who's already, naturally and in a capricorn, very gifted at self-flagellation. Religion never spoke to me in that way, because I was like you're using a shield to protect your shitty behavior, the shield of religion to say I'm a Christian, I'm a Catholic, I'm a whatever, but you have this shitty behavior behind it and that's how you're protecting your crappy deeds. And so I saw through that as a kid. That's where I was going with this and it never felt supportive to me. And so with, or I believe, the energy of quote unquote spirit is and lives, and I do believe that it's playful and fun and joyous and fluid and forgiving, and forgiving Also, like I have the saying remember to laugh. You're always on your path, because even a bruised knee is part of the bigger, you know, trajectory of learning and growing and it's all perfect and it's a perfection you know, yeah, and if we're going to root of religion, I mean we're all imperfect, we all make mistakes, we're all sinners, you know.
Speaker 2:So it was. It was like mixed messaging. If that's true, then why is my behavior so shamed? I thought I'm allowed to, or supposed to, make mistakes. I guess it depends on who's teaching it too, because I can't categorize as all bad or all good, right, like there were some good teachers I had along the way that took a different approach. I mean, I taught religion at a Catholic school. I'd like to think that, yeah, when we lived in Santa Monica, stop it, yeah, but I took a very spiritual approach that was also teaching them about meditation and creative writing, but then also prayer and some of the doctrine and things like that, leaving it up to interpretation rather than you have to follow this and memorize this.
Speaker 1:Yes, do this. Yeah, because it's not math, right? You know, or, or you know language. It's, it's a language in a sense, but it's not. It's, it's more divinatory, it's more, you know, connecting to your spirit, which is not your brain center, it's your heart center and um, and taking that out of the mix clears you up. You know back, for circling back to the, you know um, the sobriety is that clearing clearing the people, places things out of the way so that you can hear better. You know um to that intuition is to me, is a choice that I make. I feel like. And now for you know, now there's more opportunities for you to enjoy the social atmosphere and camaraderie with a fake drink. You know that tastes okay and you can still perform in the ritual of. You know socializing, how people socialize, now, without having to feel shitty about yourself, right, right.
Speaker 2:You know, and as you mentioned, I mean so much of it was the aftermath, like it wasn't that I was drinking every day and I was drunk and blacked out, that I don't remember anything it was. I mean, that happened too, but it was more of the for me with young kids, like you were talking about not wanting to get up, not wanting to do things with them, because I was so hungover and it would, and my anxiety would be through the roof, and it was days of that until I started to feel better, and then I'd start to feel better and then I'd start to drink again and then it would start the cycle all over again. So it wasn't just the drinking, it was the entire ritual around it and what happened after.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely Absolutely, and so you. So Gray Area the film based on your book Myself is about gray area drinking, which you've spoken to a lot. Do you want to just kind of define that real quick? Yeah, sure, that's kind of where I feel I landed too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I think you know, growing up in the bar industry and certainly in my clinical training as a social worker, it was like you either had a problem or you didn't. So you could either drink with not a whole lot of consequences, or and you could drink as much as you wanted if there weren't negative consequences. But you better stop drinking if you get a DUI or lose your job or your spouse leaves you. You know these kind of grandiose consequences of drinking behavior and the way that I look at it today and try to educate people is that alcohol use is along a spectrum and so you don't have to have all these qualifiers of negative things happening to make a decision to stop drinking. You could recognize that maybe alcohol isn't working in your life so well and you might be in the middle. You might not even qualify for alcohol abuse disorder or alcohol use disorder.
Speaker 2:With, you know, dependence or abuse it's hey, there's reason to say that. Again I was saying this isn't serving me. Now, yeah, it's not serving me well, it doesn't make me feel good. I'm not the best version of myself. It's not making. It's not good for my mental health. Oh, I don't exercise or eat right when I'm drinking like and using it as a whole health perspective.
Speaker 1:Totally, Totally. Yeah, Like I thought about it, like I would have a glass of wine. There's two things I'd have a glass of wine to like unwind. You know cause I was so stressed out.
Speaker 1:And and I would just like, and then also like going through perimenopause, not knowing that I was. You know it's like all of this, you know there's all this stuff happening. And and then you know it's like all this, you know there's all this stuff happening. And then so I would have one to relax, and then I'd find myself more tense, you know, and I was like, well, this isn't doing what I set out for it to do. And there was one time when I was sitting down with my kids and I had a glass of wine with dinner and I wasn't like you said. I wasn't drinking every day or wasn't drinking all the time, or a ton even.
Speaker 1:But my daughter, who was like the sweetest thing in the world, was like I think the wine had spilled and I snapped, I kind of got angry and she said in the most sweet gentle way she was like you really like your wine? Huh, I was like you really like your wine? Huh, I was like ouch. And that was also part of so. When, like, anyone asks me why I quit, it's always like there's no one reason. It doesn't have to be like you're saying Right, I mean it's, there's a million reasons, you know.
Speaker 2:And I hope the why is becoming less of a curiosity for people. Yeah Than I just choose not to.
Speaker 1:See, that's what I'm saying. I choose not to. You know what I mean, and I know some people who. There are some systems of support for people who decide to be sober but focus on the drinking period part. But to me that's always and I'm sure you have an opinion on this but it's always like a symptom, not the cause. And so if I talk about it, it's not that I had to, it's that I chose to. I'm choosing the better version of myself. I'm choosing to be clear and to deal with stuff head on and not hide from it. Even if it's gnarly, I mean, I can still Netflix and binge.
Speaker 2:Yeah. You know, Well, and it's brave too, because I mean, societally we live in. Like you said, you didn't mind being not in the cool club. Those weren't your words, exactly right. But you were okay being different at the end of the day and embracing that, and it's like that's really hard to do when everybody around us is always drinking.
Speaker 1:It is hard to do and I'm sure you had this and I know I have, because there are times in the past where I had stopped drinking and then I went back and then I stopped. You know, I mean we all. You know what I'm saying and even now I'll I'm not going to say I've stopped forever, I'm just choosing not to, because I like this version of myself. So I don't know what tomorrow brings, but I just know that this is the version I like of myself and I like the way I'm making decisions now better. But when you do that, you become a mirror for other people's lack of courage.
Speaker 2:Or their own assessment of well, if she stopped drinking, what does she think of me? Or did I drink as bad as her? Or as much.
Speaker 1:Yes, and then you find yourself in the corner of a room where someone's like you know, I don't drink as much because, like my mom and she had a real problem and then you're just like I didn't ask for all that you know like they start telling you about how much they drink and when and how it becomes a confessional.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely.
Speaker 1:And, but I think it's more. I think it's less about the alcohol and more about the choosing to swim upstream. You know that that people are feel they need to come to confessional for because I don't know why we're and maybe it goes back to religion again that we're all kind of taught to swim upstream together or not, swim upstream together, swim downstream and not challenge and swim up. You know, and part of that is listening to your intuition- Right, right, right.
Speaker 2:Because if I didn't, everybody around me was telling me you don't have a problem, you don't have to stop drinking. You're too hard on yourself, you're so extreme, you're so dramatic, but like something was telling me we're done.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't want this anymore. Yeah, yeah, I don't want this anymore, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And so for that first year I got caught up in like the am I, am I not Right? Was it bad? Like. And then it grew with that and feeling less that I had to educate people about my decision as to why I didn't drink or have people. I was looking for people to say, oh, it's okay, yeah, you should have stopped drinking.
Speaker 1:That would have made it easier. That would have made it easier. Right, you were a hot, fucking mess.
Speaker 2:Yeah Right, well, thank goodness you don't drink anymore.
Speaker 1:I know, but they don't. And then you're like, wait, what's? Who's crazy? Me, or? But it's, yeah, it's like we're not. We're not trained to make those decisions for ourselves. We're not trained to listen to our intuitive navigational source. And when you're born with a very strong one, as you are, there comes a point when you just can't not listen to it anymore. Like it becomes more challenging in life to not listen to your navigational system than it is to listen to it. Yeah Right.
Speaker 2:You know yeah, Then to listen, you gotta yeah. You have to listen. You have to yeah, Cause it's too hard to pretend it's not there and appease what the norm is. Yeah, that's really brave to say, yeah, that spirit that's guiding me.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That are in things I'm even weirder.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but yes, good, you know, although ironically I've been telling my dad I'm like oh honey, you're being so weird, stop being so weird. But then I was like I can't tell her something weird. I'm giving her a wonderful example. I want to be just like you mom, mom, you're so weird, I need to be like you, yeah, so talk to me. Goose. Besides, all over our television sets, where can we find you and how can people work with you?
Speaker 2:if they want to or find your book or learn more about you, just tell me, yeah, so my website is the easiest place that has, you know, updated TV segments on mental health and wellness. You can buy my book off Amazon on my website. You can work with me privately. I'm a psychotherapist so I would say majority of my caseload right now is women who are looking at how alcohol plays a role in their life and trying to make adjustments. And my website is Kelly and I spell my name K-E-K-I-T-L-E-Ycom.
Speaker 1:Thank you, I love you.
Speaker 2:I love you too.
Speaker 1:We need to play, we need to go have like a cup oh my God, I'm off. Coffee too.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to be the most. I don't trust people who give up the coffee. Okay, that is like my one vice. Well, I don't know if we can be friends anymore.
Speaker 1:I'm doing decaf Good for you. Oh, I had to Because I started the ADHD medicine which, by the way, I don't know what difference it's making.
Speaker 1:You don't Pretty hard ADHD, mm-hmm, except for the fact and I'm going off on a tangent again, obviously, but don't have as much trouble getting things done Like those voices in my head, that kind of stop me, that are attached to emotions that bring me down and then I can't move forward. That has seemed to subside it, because I thought I was going to be like you know, all of a sudden I was going to be like a professor who had a very linear conversation with people and never strayed, you know, and I'm like that is not happening.
Speaker 2:You're still you, it'm still me, it's just a little quieter.
Speaker 1:It's just I could just get stuff done while juggling all the conversation, but anyway, and it was too much with the coffee and perimenopause.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, there are a lot of things going on at this age.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know I miss coffee, I miss, I still have like a coffee-esque ritual.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's kind of like a mocktail, you know it is. It is the ritual of holding something warm and sipping and, yeah, yes, doing mushroom coffee oh yes, tried that and some decaf, you know, instant, which is awful, honestly.
Speaker 1:All right, I love you, love you, love you too, and let's have a coffee and uncoffee soon.
Speaker 2:Or a Buddha practice down the street. When do you do that? Sunday.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sunday, what time? 10 to 11.15. It's great. And you bring your kids? Yes, because they go and they love it.
Speaker 2:I brought my kids when they were really little yeah, they go and they do like a little.
Speaker 1:They do a little meditation and a little learning and then they make a craft based on whatever they were learning. I love it. I know and they have this jar of sand and water in the middle of the table that at the beginning of the class they shake it up so it gets all muddy and mucky and then by the end of the class it they shake it up so it gets all muddy and mucky and then by the end of the class it is separated into clear water and sand. How beautiful is that as a representation of the mind? Yeah, like when you calm down and your mind becomes clear.
Speaker 2:Yeah, very cool.
Speaker 1:Are we not pulling things together here, just stringing it up right at the end? Big red bow, big red bow, and scene and scene.
Speaker 2:Okay.
