The Regular Guys Bible Study
The Regular Guys Bible Study podcast -- RGBS -- is a podcast for regular guys by regular guys (not theologians) studying the Bible together. It's brought to you by a couple of goofy guys who just want to study the Bible together and show you that anyone can read and study the Bible. In fact, you SHOULD read and study the Bible yourself. We're here to show you how we do it, and, hopefully, we can have some fun along the way.
The Regular Guys Bible Study
Thessalonians 2:1-16
The guys dive into 1 Thessalonians 2:1-16, exploring Paul's description of his ministry approach and motivations among the Thessalonians. Ken and Steve unpack the historical context of Paul's journey from Philippi to Thessalonica while examining Paul's unique dual approach as both a gentle mother and guiding father figure.
• Paul traveled about 100 miles from Philippi to Thessalonica after being "shamefully treated"
• The apostles approached their ministry with integrity, avoiding flattery or greed
• Paul deliberately uses "the gospel of God" phrasing multiple times throughout this passage
• Discussion of Paul's dual leadership style as both nurturing mother and guiding father
• Exploration of what it means that Scripture is "not the word of men but the word of God"
• Analysis of the persecution faced by Thessalonian believers from their countrymen
• Consideration of what Paul might have meant by "wrath has come upon them at last"
Join us next week as we continue our study with 1 Thessalonians 2:17 through chapter 3, a relatively short but meaningful passage that builds on these themes.
you are listening to the regular guys bible study podcast, the bible study for regular guys by regular guys. We are your host, ken and steve, and we are just regular guys studying the bible together not theologians, all righty. I look over there, steve, and you're like doing jumping jacks. What the heck is that I was pretending to clap over my head ah, it really looked like you were like an old episode of the Brady Bunch and you're exercising as a family doing your little jumping jacks.
Speaker 2:I'm not a big fan of jumping jacks.
Speaker 1:Is there a joke behind this somewhere? I feel like I'm just.
Speaker 2:I just don't like anything that requires me to jump Jumping. I think I have a little bit of back trouble, like in my lower back, and jumping irritates it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's more that you get a busted lip when you jump because your belly hits you in the face.
Speaker 2:You're the one to talk. Talk at least it's not my breast like it is with you.
Speaker 1:I knew that was coming. I saw it coming and I thought oh no, oh no, what can I do? All right, all right dan all right, we're on first.
Speaker 2:Thessalonians 2 we are and we're recording on a sunday. Does this mean we're violating the sabbath? The sabbath is technically on saturday steve yeah, but we celebrated on sunday as christians well, okay, you just told me what all you've done today so far.
Speaker 1:You tell me steve is recording this um more work than you've already done today cutting down those trees was not work.
Speaker 2:That was because they were in the way when I mow and they were interfering with the growth of the oaks is this your front yard or backyard? Front yard front yard okay there are so many wimpy little cedar trees out there. Yeah, I mean, they're tall but they're just scrawny little weird shaped things yeah, okay, um, I think that was more work than this steve, because yeah, you're right depending on the, the definition of work.
Speaker 1:Um, because you know this, this takes some mental effort and some vocal effort. Well, an engineer or physicist would say walking is work.
Speaker 2:Walking Phoenix, yes, walking Phoenix, okay Is work.
Speaker 1:That makes no sense to me, but okay, Whatever, Steve we should just move on. Yeah, let's move on. All right, guys, we are again 1 Thessalonians 2. If you haven't read it, as always, pause this thing right now. Go read it. Don't sit here and don't sit there and listen to it for the first time while we are reading it. So go read it, Come back and finish.
Speaker 2:So I have a question before we start. Yep, do we want to do all of chapter two or do we want to stop where someone inserted a paul's longing to see them again? Title on the esv, because it looks to me like that flows into three and we're just going to end up covering it again anyway in a week.
Speaker 1:All right, I was not planning on that, but that's a good point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but we could cover both.
Speaker 1:No, let's just do that. Let's go to 1 Thessalonians chapter.
Speaker 2:Oh, three is super small and three is small, so it works well.
Speaker 1:1 Thessalonians 2, then 1 through 16. So if you actually did pause and you're now back and now you might be cursing our names, because we told you to read the whole thing and now we're saying the last three verses you didn't have to read until next week until next week. I apologize that. That's really steve's fault, though, um, I think it's very clear whose fault. That is all right. All right. Well, let's read this thing all right not it guess it's me. Yep.
Speaker 2:For you yourselves know, brothers that are coming to you was not in vain, but though we had already suffered and been shamefully treated at Philippi, as you know, we had boldness in our God to to declare to you the gospel of God in the midst of much conflict, for our appeal does not spring from error or impurity or any attempt to deceive, but, just as we have been approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel, so we speak not to please man, but to please God, who tests our hearts, for we never came with words of flattery, as you know, nor with a pretext for greed. God is witness. Nor did we seek glory from people, whether from you or from others, though we could have made demands as apostles of Christ. But we were gentle among you, like a nursing mother taking care of her own children. So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God, but also our own selves, because you had become very dear to us.
Speaker 2:For you remember, brothers, our labor and toil. We worked night and day that we might not be a burden to any of you, while we proclaimed to you the gospel of God. You are witnesses, and God also. How holy and righteous and blameless was our conduct toward you believers, and we also thank God constantly for this that when you receive the word of God which you heard from us, accepted it not as the word of men but as what it really is the word of God which is at work in you believers. For you brothers became imitators of the churches of God and Christ Jesus that are in Judea. For you suffered the same things from your own countrymen as they did from the Jews, who killed both the Lord Jesus and the prophets and drove us out and displeased God and opposed all mankind by hindering us from speaking to the Gentiles that they might be saved so as always to fill up the measure of their sins. But wrath has come upon them at last.
Speaker 1:All righty, all righty, steve.
Speaker 2:What do you think, Ken?
Speaker 1:You know, I struggled with this section actually because it's still basic. First of all, it I think there may be two sentences in here. No, there's a lot of sentences. It just feels like just um more intro, more intro. The whole thing is the intro. You know how we came to you and blah, blah, blah. You know how we did this and we didn't do this.
Speaker 2:It's like it's all like set up for what he's going to tell them, the message that he has for them he hasn't really given them yet true, but there is some like historical stuff here that's useful for us to understand pa Paul's journey and compare it to other places in the Bible, such as Acts. And I want to ask you where is Philippi relative to Thessalonica?
Speaker 1:Ah well, when you look at the map, it's in a different location, like if Thessalonica is here. Note I'm pointing my finger at like a spot and the map has units of X. Thessalonica is right here, so please note for our listeners I'm pointing at a random other spot in space.
Speaker 2:And what direction and distance is that?
Speaker 1:This way, this way, I have no idea.
Speaker 2:I have no idea, well, ken.
Speaker 1:Tell me Steve.
Speaker 2:It is approximately 100 miles southwest of philippi by land.
Speaker 1:The thessalonica is southwest southwest 100 and what 100? And?
Speaker 2:about 100 miles about 100 Southwest.
Speaker 1:Okay, so that would mean.
Speaker 2:So that's like what, san Antonio?
Speaker 1:Well, san Antonio is more more South than Southwest, and it's not a hundred miles either. It's more like 60 miles, so maybe further more like Corpus Christi Now I think that's too far.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's way more than 100 miles, yeah you're right, let's see. I don't know it's almost like Cincinnati to Columbus, except that's closer to 150 miles.
Speaker 1:Columbus, texas, that's a long way from Cincinnatiincinnati ohio. Oh, okay, um, so well, at any rate it's about, I don't know, a normal drive. A little less than two hours, a little more than an hour and a half.
Speaker 2:We were to drive by car do you want to know what else AI told me about this when I asked?
Speaker 1:Oh this is an AI response. I thought I only got to do that.
Speaker 2:Nope, I learned from you, ken. I learned it from you In the time of Paul the first century. The Via Ignatia and Major Roman Road connected the two cities. This would have made travel between them relatively straightforward for the time, likely taking three to five days on foot, depending on conditions and pace.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's not that long really, for back then. No.
Speaker 2:Three to five days travel.
Speaker 1:I wonder if those roads were prone to bandits or if they patrolled them we're pretty close to rome at that particular area.
Speaker 2:I would think it's patrolled.
Speaker 1:It's probably pretty safe I would think rome, I mean they were very sophisticated city. I mean country or empire, let's say I'll bet they had some patrols. That's cool. Good info, steve.
Speaker 2:And why do?
Speaker 1:I care about that.
Speaker 2:You tell me, why do you care about that?
Speaker 1:The distance between Philippi and thessalonica. Why do?
Speaker 2:I care because he starts with uh, let's see where is it. Uh, verse two uh, they were shamefully treated.
Speaker 1:Oh right, right, as you know you know, yes, and that was talked about in Acts right. Acts 16.2, as a matter of fact yes and so they fled Philippi to Thessalonica. So that's how they met the Thessalonicans, and I guess that's how the church of Thessalonica was started by them being chased out of Philippi, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I might have wrote down the wrong verse. It's somewhere in Acts 16. I don't see mention of Philippi there.
Speaker 1:Hmm, all right. At any rate, I remember them being chased out of a lot of places in Acts, so it makes sense. Hey, steve, I do want to point out something. Um, in chapter one you made a comment that paul said um, our gospel and here it says the gospel of God.
Speaker 1:Yes, it says we had boldness, let me see in our God to declare you the gospel of God. So it also in NIV. It says in his gospel. So there it's just. And I noticed he uses the word gospel again, I think in this section oh, yeah, okay, look in verse 8. So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves, because we had become very dear to us. You had become very dear to us. So again, gospel of God, sharing the gospel of God and sharing ourselves with you. And then down in verse 9, again he calls it the gospel of God.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I don't know. I think if you were to ask Paul, he'd go like well, it's the same gospel. I mean, it's the gospel we say is the gospel of God. I think that's what he would say.
Speaker 2:So you kind of jumped ahead of where. I have a few more notes.
Speaker 1:I just wanted to point out the gospel of God thing. Okay, go ahead and see, let me hear your notes. So in verse five it says for we never came with your notes.
Speaker 2:So in verse 5, it says For we never came with words of flattery, as you know, nor with a pretext for greed. They didn't have any pretext, which means they didn't hide their greed, right.
Speaker 1:I don't think that's what that means, Steve.
Speaker 2:I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1:When I did read that in the ESv, let me uh, I did not like that translation. Uh, for the niv, I mean the esv this is the esv. I know in the niv it says you know, we never use flattery, nor did we put on a mask. Oh well, actually here we go that.
Speaker 2:That's where I, that's what I read when I made the note.
Speaker 1:It was the niv you know, we never used flattery, nor did we put on a mask to cover up greed. God is our witness.
Speaker 2:So they were very openly greedy yes, that's how it reads in the niv it could mean that, but I don't think it means that.
Speaker 1:I think it just means we did not deceive you um trying to get your money. Um, that is funny, though. Um, let's see, I'm going to look at a different translation. What does nlt?
Speaker 2:say I did most of my reading in the niv actually oh really, oh really Great, all right.
Speaker 1:The NLT says never once did we try to win you with flattery, as you well know, and God is our witness, that we were not pretending to be your friends just to get your money there.
Speaker 2:So this is verse 5, right? I'm going to read a translation. I want to see if you can guess what it is. Oh gosh, for neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloak of covetousness. God is witness. Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome as the apostles of Christ.
Speaker 1:I'm going to guess that's the King James Version.
Speaker 2:You're right. What gave it away?
Speaker 1:The these, these, and thou's the ye's, ye's, ye, thee, thee, thou's um, yes, all right, um. So what is your comment about that?
Speaker 2:it was just it was just a goofy kind of an ironic or a uh didn't mask, put on a mask to cover up their greed?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's. You just found a humorous anecdote that you could say about a verse. Very good, steve, very good and humorous anecdote, thank.
Speaker 2:In 7 and 11. Ah yes, he jumps from being children to being a parent.
Speaker 1:No. Being a mother and being a father.
Speaker 2:No and 7 says and this is NIV. Instead, we were like young children among you.
Speaker 1:See, that's what I said. That's what I told you before we started this. I didn't like NIV. It doesn't make sense to the rest of the context of that verse.
Speaker 2:So seven in ESV. But we were gentle among you, like a nursing mother taking care of her own children. You're right.
Speaker 1:That is so much. That makes so much more sense than what the NIV says.
Speaker 2:But then he switches to being a father in verse 11.
Speaker 1:Yeah, which I appreciate. So they're saying they're both gentle, like a mother and providing. And this is I'm not saying mothers always need to be gentle and fathers always need to have the discipline, but it's like you know, they're gentle, like a caring mother and providing. Is it discipline in 11 or encouragement?
Speaker 2:And walk in a manner worthy of God. I mean, that seems like.
Speaker 1:I would call it encouragement and discipline, or yeah. Not necessarily harsh discipline, but just encouragement to walk like in the manner, setting them right when they're wrong. Exactly, and encouraging when they do well and keeping encouraging them to do that.
Speaker 2:Okay, so unfortunately, that's the end of my notes.
Speaker 1:Well, that was the other thing I was going to talk about, the mother and father aspect of how he treated them. I really there isn't a lot to say in this section, unfortunately, you know. I will say, like, let me read this last paragraph again. He says and we also thank God constantly for this that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but as what it really is the word of God which is at work in you believers. All right, I want to stop. Right, that's what we, as believers, believe that the Bible is. I know you and I we talk about. You know Paul having these long run-on sentences, or you know he does things a certain way, but these are not Paul's words. They are God's words, written down by Paul in this case.
Speaker 2:In Paul's style.
Speaker 1:Yes, and then, you know, there's other letters by other people Matthew there's Mark, there's Luke, there's Peter, there's James, there's John. I already said John there's Paul, of course.
Speaker 2:There's Isaiah Daniel Moses.
Speaker 1:Yes, I was listing New Testament writers, but you're right.
Speaker 2:Did you mention Luke?
Speaker 1:I think I did.
Speaker 2:Jude, oh hey.
Speaker 1:Hey Jude, Did Jude write that or was that a letter to Jude?
Speaker 2:Oh, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I don't remember. Maybe after the Thessalonians we should go to Jude. I don't know.
Speaker 2:That'll be one day I think it's one chapter.
Speaker 1:Is that right? It is one chapter, okay, so it's one brief thing, um, anyway no, it was written by jude it was written by jude okay servant of jesus christ and brother of james all right.
Speaker 1:Um, my point is um you, he's telling them they came not with their own words, they came speaking the words of God, and that's what the Bible is to us. It is the words of God to us, and to treat it as we treat it sometimes I think a little too much. Personally, I guess I can't say we. I'll say me, sometimes I treat it too much as the words of the author that wrote it. Steve is making goofy faces. I'm sorry we don't have this, but it almost looks weirder than his normal face. Anyway, I just wanted to bring that up. Let's see.
Speaker 1:Then he says For you, brothers, became imitators of the churches of God and Christ Jesus that are in Judea, for you suffered the same things from our own countrymen, from your own countrymen, as they did from the Jews, who killed both the Lord Jesus and the prophets and drove us out and displeased God and opposed all mankind by hindering us from speaking to the Gentiles that they might be saved, so as always to fill up the treasure of their sins. And what two things. First of all, in the intro to Thessalonians. Is this written to a primarily Gentile church or?
Speaker 2:a Jewish church.
Speaker 1:So you believe it's mainly a Gentile church?
Speaker 2:I think that also because of verse oh shoot, where is it? Okay, verse 2. But though we had already suffered and been shamefully treated at Philippi, as you know, we had boldness in our God to declare to you the gospel of God in the midst of much conflict, for our appeal does not spring from error or impurity or an attempt to deceive, but, just as we have been approved by God, where is it? There was some place where they had gone through similar treatment.
Speaker 1:I know, but that could be the Jews right, Because the Jews are really upset.
Speaker 2:But it said from their countrymen, though I guess you could still have, it could still be.
Speaker 1:In all likelihood, Paul started his message in the synagogue in Thessalonica.
Speaker 2:Here it is 14. For you, brothers, became imitators of the churches of God and Christ Jesus that are in Judea, for you suffered the same things from your own countrymen as they did from the Jews. That sounds to me like.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:They're contrasting Jews with their own country which to me means Gentile.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that could be. Let me see what does another translation there say New living For some of the Jews killed the prophet. The prophet, what? What verse is this 15 right?
Speaker 1:14 and 15. All right, um. In this way, in this way, you imitated the believers in god's churches in ja who, because of their belief in Christ Jesus, suffered from their own people the Jews Okay, from their own people, the Jews, okay, I see. And then, dear brothers and sisters, you suffered persecution from your own countrymen. In this way, you imitated the believers, I see, countrymen. In this way, you imitated the believers I see. Um, yeah, that kind of sounds like they're not the jews who they're being tormented by although it points to acts 17, 5, which says but other jews were jealous.
Speaker 2:So they rounded up some bad characters from the market marketplace, formed a mob and started a riot in the city. They rushed to Jason's house in search of Paul and Silas in order to bring them out to the crowd.
Speaker 1:Ah, this is where they went to Jason's house, which was right next to the synagogue, and that's where they were meeting.
Speaker 2:So maybe these other people that the Jews were riling up were Gentiles?
Speaker 1:I think there might be a mix here. I think it sounds like it A mix of Jews and Gentiles. The only way they could get the two together is in hatred to the believers.
Speaker 2:I think you're right. I think we're mixed up.
Speaker 1:Yeah, uh-huh, uh-huh, all right, and in the very end, I don't understand the very last sentence. But wrath has come upon them at last.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had trouble when I was reading it and I've. Are you reading on ev right now or?
Speaker 1:that's esv. But but every translation I look at says virtually the same thing the wrath of god has come upon them at last. That's niv. The first one I read was esv, and then even New Living, which typically has, you know, a little different. It says but the anger of God has caught up with them at last.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't quite follow that.
Speaker 1:So that could be something happening in Thessalonica that we are not privy of at the moment. I don't know if something bad happened. Maybe, I don't know, maybe there was a bad earthquake there that shook the place, or I don't know. I just don't know what it means. So that's all I have to say about that that's all I've got to say about that, and I don't have any more chocolates left, so all right.
Speaker 1:Well, that's all I got yeah, I think we're done all right. Sorry guys. Um, I wish we, I really wish I had some explanation for that last sentence, and it really bothers me that I don't, but I don't, so you could bring it next week. Um, yeah, you could also look it up yourselves, see if you can find it. That's a. That's a. You know what that's homework for our listeners maybe steve and I actually know, we maybe we actually know the answer, and we just want you to find it for yourself that could be hey that you know.
Speaker 1:That's that's in the realm of possibility, but regardless if it's true or not, it could be true. That's the important part. So all right, that's all I got steve, all right, all right. So next week, guys, we're gonna read um. First thessalonians, chapter 2, 17, followed by all of chapter 3.
Speaker 2:So make sure you read it. It's really short.
Speaker 1:Yeah, three is short, make sure you read it, understand it as best you can, study it. Actually, four and five are short too, all right, the Regular Guys Bible Study is a Chasm LLC production. All rights reserved.
